Utahns respond to SI, CBS News investigation of college football, crime

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  • WestGranger West Valley City, Utah
    March 4, 2011 10:19 a.m.

    The ugly side of sports is coming to light. The end does not justify the means.
    As an avid fan of local sports it hurts when a team loses.We put athlestes on to much of a pedestal.We are much to hard on them when they lose.Sportsmanship is what it should be all about. What real value is there in teaching our children that nothing matters but winning or doing well in sports?

  • Silent Lurker Cottonwood Heights, UT
    March 4, 2011 8:48 a.m.

    This just proves the saying "in the eye of the beholder". I doubt that anyone here has all the information to be truly fair and place judgement any better than the court system.

  • JLFuller Boise, ID
    March 4, 2011 7:53 a.m.

    In short, the boy needs a plan. He must understand it, participate in its creation and be committed to it. Those around him must monitor the plan and provide direction and support. Waver and the kid lapses into old thinking and old ways and old friends and falls off the cliff. Will it happen this way? It depends on the kid and those around him - especially the father.

  • JLFuller Boise, ID
    March 4, 2011 7:53 a.m.

    So, how does a kid with all the life drama and dead weight around his neck get from the doorstep of prison to the new start he says he wants? First, he has to be clean and sober and stay away from those who use and abuse. There are no ifs ands or buts about that one. In the gang-banger world that likely means no contact with old friends, their play grounds or their play things. If someone's daddy is a gang banger, that includes him too. This could be a very hard slog up a very muddy road and excess baggage must be left behind. To change behavior one must change thinking. To change thinking one must rid himself of adverse influences and replace them with positive ones. We are what we think we are. In this case, the kid has to find his affirmations in doing the right thing.

  • JasonH84 Salt Lake City, UT
    March 4, 2011 7:11 a.m.

    It would be useful to know how many of these kids with so-called criminal records go on to commit crimes while in college. Or another way of looking at it would be, what percentage of college athletes who commit crimes while on scholarship had criminal records before college? If it's a high percentage then it might be worthwhile for colleges to include looking up criminal records of recruits, knowing there's a good chance they'll mess up while representing their institution.

  • thelogicalone salt lake city, UT
    March 3, 2011 11:13 p.m.

    One of the best stories I've read, one of the best I watched on CBS news.

  • Marrion Barry provo, Ut
    March 3, 2011 6:22 p.m.

    It's all about the booty. If they think they can get more of the booty, they'll always try. When the sports programs stop offering so much booty, there might be an incentive to look more closely at backgrounds. But the way it stands now, there's just too much booty to go around: for the fans, for the players, and especially the programs themselves. Cut out the payolla, and the booty and let the players actually play!

  • CougarBlue Heber City, UT
    March 3, 2011 5:06 p.m.

    A step in the right direction would be for any kid who is invited to come on campus for a visit, he and his parents, must declare in writing that the kid has never been arrested for any class one, class two or class three demeanor, regardless of age. If they have then they must give the university the case number and contact person. The university would then be required to follow through and investigate, and then make a decision. Failure to reveal this information once a scholarship is offered would be grounds to revoke the scholarship immediately. If the kid has been arrested for DUI the university should have a program for the kid if they offer a scholarship. IF he has been arrested for shoplifting, etc, again a warning light, not necessarily a reason to deny. Assault and battery and threatening others lives would be a big huge warning light.

    Kids do stupid things, but after dealing with hundreds of thousands over 34 years of working in the school system, it is very few who do this type of stupid thing.

    I would have no problem requiring this of anyone being offered any kind of scholarship.

  • thpslc Holladay, UT
    March 3, 2011 4:54 p.m.

    I believe the point isn't punishment. It's rewarding these kids once we are aware of criminal behavior. Mind you, I said CRIMINAL not even INAPPROPRIATE. The NCAA academic requirements are clear and difficult. Many athletes work very hard to get into and play for their dream college. To watch these thugs break the law, then 'steal' scholarships to those who are more deserving is just wrong. It's called Winning At All Cost and Coach Peck, you don't teach a good lesson when you reward bad behavior. A player uses armed robbery as a way to get over a family death isn't just blowing off steam, it's CRIMINAL. And your job as an 'adult' is to get him therapy. Real therapy...not found on the football field. It's called character building and you won't find it in a play book!!!

  • carman Alpine, UT
    March 3, 2011 3:39 p.m.

    This is exactly why BYU's recent actions are so admirable. Many of these athletes don't feel the consequneces of their actions until they have done something really stupid that hurts lots of people around them. BYU holding to its Honor Code is a great way to emphasize the need for student athletes to keep their commitments to thier team and community.

  • Braxton ogden, ut
    March 3, 2011 3:18 p.m.

    I have lost a tremendous amount of respect for the Coaching Staff at the University of Utah. This kid should not be playing football on a scholarship. He should have been removed off the list and the opportunity given to a kid who possess better character. Peck should have also done the right thing. Same on you Kyle and Dave.

  • KVC Sahuarita, az
    March 3, 2011 2:48 p.m.

    Thie truth of the matter is this: If a large 17 y/0 male pulled a gun on you demanding drugs and money, would you consider 125 hours of community service as adequate punishment, with no actual time spent in detention? I would suspect most that think he served his time are either U ofU football fans who want him to play, or individuals who think all people under 18 should be let off with a slap on the wrist. I bet if was not a highly prized recruit, he would have been sentenced more harshly, or processed through the adult system.
    In college and later in life, he is going to believe he can do this kind of stuff and get away with it because he is a star athlete. And he may be right. That is why so many college athletes commit crimes as well.
    Read the SI article, it is enlightening. It anazes me that football players who have committed numerous violent crimes are still getting scholarships. I would have a hard, if not impossible time getting a medical license if I did the stuff some of these kids did.

  • pat1 Taylorsville, UT
    March 3, 2011 12:11 p.m.

    Pretty sad day when high school students must be investigated for criminal activities before they are allowed to play ball. What have we come to?

  • Y4LYFE Lubbock, TX
    March 3, 2011 11:29 a.m.

    In all fairness Utah recruited him before he was arrested. Every team has dumb teens who mess up anyways. Some crimes are very serious, but in general minor offenses.

  • LDS Cedar City, UT
    March 3, 2011 11:11 a.m.

    I'm missing something here!...This young man committed a crime, went to court and has settled the matter.

    To my knowledge, there are no laws or rules that prohibit a minor convicted of a crime from attending high school or college (except BYU). So why can't this young man attend high school, participate in choir, band and debate club. And if he can do those things, why not sports? And when he gets to college, he's going to go to classes and participate in clubs. Why not sports.

    So why the big investigative scenario. Sounds like a way to sell SI and newspapers.

  • Barack Obama Phoenix, AZ
    March 3, 2011 11:07 a.m.

    I'm not really certain of the point of this whole investigation. Should colleges and high schools look into the backgrounds of their players? Sure. They shouldn't be blindsided by bad behavior off the field.

    Next question....

  • John Pack Lambert of Michigan Ypsilanti, MI
    March 3, 2011 11:07 a.m.

    The D-News is largely prohibited from publishing the substance of the cases. SI and CBS want you to have to go to their reports to learn the fuller details. They will let DN know their general conclusions, and the DN can go talk to the coaches involved, but SI and CBS are going to gaurd their copyright on the body of the work.

  • John Pack Lambert of Michigan Ypsilanti, MI
    March 3, 2011 11:03 a.m.

    I think I do agree with the general conclusion that universities should seek more information. Whther or not a university should admit a student who is accused of violent assault to play on a hockey team where you intentionally give him a weapon or a football team where you will put him under streess and make him a weapon, is debatable. However I think we all could agree that the universities should seek this information out.

    However, do these schools ever ask players about past criminal records? A good start if they do to make sure it is relevant is saying "we will do a background check, so you want to write anything that is there down. This way you can give your side of the story and show honesty. Most past criminal records will not disqualify you from play. Lieing on this form might."

    One problem is the live and let live attitude so prevalent on college campuses. On the other hand a draw back to this study is focus on where people got accused, not where people actually committed crimes.

  • no fit in SG St.George, Utah
    March 3, 2011 10:54 a.m.

    Football is a tough sport. Many successful football players are tough people.
    We can wish for this, wish for that.
    Reality rules,it seems.

  • Spoxjox Redmond, WA
    March 3, 2011 10:53 a.m.

    True statement:

    We all make mistakes.

    False statement:

    We all rob teenagers at gunpoint and threaten to kill them if they squeal.

    The fact that no one is perfect is no justification at all for closing our eyes to the crimes committed by some. Using bad language or jaywalking or even shoplifting a candy bar simply doesn't compare with armed robbery and threatening to kill someone.

  • John Pack Lambert of Michigan Ypsilanti, MI
    March 3, 2011 10:50 a.m.

    How long is Fauonuku's probation? Did this case involve a plea bargain? the whole point of probation is that we do not believe that one crime should lead to life in prison, and in some cases sending someone to prison may be the worst choice. Should we punish a kid for the rest of their life for one stupid act? Fanuonuku was suspended from two games, he is on probation with reporting costs, and he has to do 125-hours of community service. He has been punished for his actions. It would not make sense to re-punish him.

    If he had been involved in armed robbery and then had all charged dropped that would be one thing. However I am uncomfortable with the notion of societal institutions stepping in and placing additional punishments beyond those mandated by the courts.

  • John Pack Lambert of Michigan Ypsilanti, MI
    March 3, 2011 10:43 a.m.

    The article claims these althletes had "criminal histor[ies] that ranged from drug possession to violent assault". Maybe I over-react to drug possession, but these are all felonies. Does this mean things like non-felonious assult or petty larceny as a 13-year-old were not in the stats, or is someone reporting the more glitzy crimes to hide the fact that some of these are Joe Muitalo got mad at a classmate in 9th grade and punched him in the arm type of crimes? What type of crime when should exclude potential college athletes? Also, are these accusations or convictions. If they include plea deals maybe the lawyer said to another hypothetical case JuWan Jones, I believe you did not steal Henry Milton-Standford's rolex, but out here in Andover there is a view that the scholarshipped prep school athletes cause the crime, so the jury will convict. take the plea deal, with just 10 hours community service and six months probation, and no college is going to say "oh, we do not want Jones on our basketball team because of a theft he did when you were in 8th grade.

  • Mormon Ute Kaysville, UT
    March 3, 2011 9:34 a.m.

    One point many of you don't understand is the juvenile records are confidential and not easy to get your hands on. Even if Universities wanted to, they may not be able to access the criminal records of juvniles they are considering offering scholarships to.

    My wife and I were in a car accident where we were hit from behind by a juvenile without a drivers license driving a stolen car. The copy of the accident report we got from the police didn't have her name on it or any contact information for her or her parents. When we asked about it we were told that because she was a juvenile we were not entitled to that information unless we filed a court action against her. We never did find out her name or any information about her.

    I think that is one reason the Universties don't know about these kids. Until they become adults, the information is not readily available. I think the NCAA should work with the court systems across the country to make juvenile records available to coaches and background checks should be mandatory before a scholarship is offered.

  • DUBBLEDUB Scottsdale, AZ
    March 3, 2011 1:12 a.m.

    Wow, there are a lot of dippy comments here. "Paying you debt to society" does not give you carte blanche to pursue any endeavor you wish. Having a criminal record will prevent you from being hired by many employers, being elected for Congress - heck, the military won't even touch you for that. Behavior has consequences, and becoming the rockstar, football god of all time may not be possible if you're going to act like a punk. It shouldn't be, anyway. If you have big dreams and aspirations of achieving greatness in life, it is incumbent upon you to behave like a good, law abiding citizen. It's just not that much to ask.

  • JSB Sugar City, ID
    March 2, 2011 8:58 p.m.

    I keep being told that football and other sports builds character. I've rarely seen it. Yes, research shows that participation in HS sports has positive benefits if the participants are compared to students who have absolutely no extracurricular activity at all. But, there are a lot of negatives to athletics that we don't see in students who are involved in debate, drama, music, student government, school newspaper and yearbook. Research shows that participation in these activities is a much better predictor of long term successs than participation in athletics. Lets drop expensive sports programs and focus our attention on those activities that do the most good for the participants. And, we won't have to worry about compliance with title IX either.

  • Football881 South Jordan, UT
    March 2, 2011 8:24 p.m.

    High school coaches are paid 2k a year to coach football not to investigate crimes and get to the bottom of every off the field issue. 99% of you don't even know the full situation. To come on here and start telling what you would have done or what should be done from a article that doesn't give all the details makes you look like idiots. Im sure Coach Peck tried to make the best decisions with the info that he had, and do whats best for the kids involved. Im pretty sure that they weren't playing him to win the state championship, cause his back up is just as good and has a full ride to the U as well.

  • Duh west jordan, ut
    March 2, 2011 6:51 p.m.

    @EgbertThrockmorton | 12:16 p.m

    You say "Part of the Utah culture is to not have consequences for one's actions, whether a student-athlete in high school or as a state legislator. Its the same idiotic cultural behavior that so infects Utah; and that is the real shame of it all"

    What world do you live in? I have lived all around the world and it is the same. Society as in general is that way. Athletes are the worse. Because they are talented and gifted in their sport they generally have less consequences because of the money they generate. You really think that Utah is the only state or Country that does not hold people accountable? Then you are naive and you need to open your eyes. I have seen many held accountable in this state. The only problem is society is becoming too lenient with the younger generation and always state that they are just students and should be given breaks or whatever.

  • Big Hapa Kaysville, UT
    March 2, 2011 6:18 p.m.

    re:} slcmom

    To your point about other athletes that may have missed out on a scholarship. I stand with you on this point. It is not doing anyone any favors by doing the slc county two-step around the law, delaying accountability or in this case ignoring the full accountability for armed robbery. The clear message hear is if you are an all state athlete you get a pass, you have hit the proverbial nail right square on the head.

    re: Poqui

    I do not know that your stated comments are true or not? So I will take you at your word. I believe you are speaking about BYU yes? I think your story would have more validity if you simply spoke openly. Come on, 20 years ago and you are still haunted ?

    I can see how people can be sickened by this whole story and the slippery slope of ignoring the consequences and in this case, the full wait of the consequences leading a person on to believe that there is always a bail out or some way around facing up to the full weight of responsibility for there actions.

    Only time will tell.

  • Dugger Clearfield, UT
    March 2, 2011 5:47 p.m.

    Talk about no remorse! These guys are defiantly flashing gang signs. There is definately a long history of double standards in this situation. It makes me sick! The U better get ready to hand out some disciplinary action with these two (or three). These guys also need some help breaking out of the gang-banger stuff, (if they are really interested in doing that.) Based on my experience, and what I see in the photo, these guys have not turned the corner, yet. I want them to succeed but, they will need the right kind of help; the kind that shows mercy, after their actions show they want to change and have restored what they have taken (not just money). Does Coach Whittingham and his crew care about what attitude these guys are displaying. good luck!

  • David B. Cedar City, UT
    March 2, 2011 3:36 p.m.

    Rewarding kids with scholarships when they don't deserve them sends a real bad message! Look how it has affected sports on the pro level.When I played ball (dual sport myself) If your grades weren't up to snuff you didn't play and if you were involved in a crime you either got cut or you never made the team.Where has this gone? Are universities so desperate to put a winning team out there they're willing to cut corners and put other players at risk just to have the team.I don't think it is worth it on so many levels and what SI has done is a good thing to expose it.

  • Trickeration Cedar Hills, UT
    March 2, 2011 3:31 p.m.

    Wow. Coaches not wanting to know if one of their players was/is in trouble with the law and if they are, don't want to know the details? How shocking. SI could have saved their money and instead printed something like, "the sky is blue." Give me a break!

  • Poqui Murray, UT
    March 2, 2011 3:07 p.m.

    I attended a local private university 20+ years ago and a couple of my roommates played on the football team. They both had criminal records before coming to college, received full scholarships, and continued their criminal activity while attending this prestigious private university. The coaching staff was well aware of it, I told them on multiple occasions, but refused to act on it until after the end-of year bowl game when they were both quietly dismissed from the university.

    This problem is everywhere, even schools with high moral standards.

  • JDL Magna, UT
    March 2, 2011 3:04 p.m.

    Great cover article about SI's investigation. This is the type of investigative journalism we need more of.

    To the point of the Bingham/Utah athlete. This should not be about him but about justice for those he terrorized and their families. What justice do they feel now? Actually, according to the article, they don't feel justice but rather fear.

    A choice made affected far more then the perp.

  • TheHailstorm South Weber, UT
    March 2, 2011 2:53 p.m.

    I am happy for SLC mom that no one in her family ever had a run in with the law or did something that was regrettable. Fortunately she has led a perfect life and has lived in a environment where no one in her family was held accountable for their actions as a youth under voting age. It is a good thing that there was never a need for forgiveness, reconciliation to individuals harmed, or to the society seeking accountability.
    As for Whittingham ? It should be noted that he DID revoke a scholarship to a projected starter on his team for not following the standards of the athletic departments stand on disobedience to the laws of the land. This was done swiftly after the player had been given a chance to reform his rough and rowdy ways.

  • the_beav SLC, UT
    March 2, 2011 2:39 p.m.

    From the Article - "I think it was clear that the U of U didn't know a lot of the details about his case" ... "Again, (this story) isn't to place blame on Kyle Whittingham or his staff"

    Okay - So now that they know, what are they going to do about it?

    Some of the blame should be on the coaches and administrators of the universities. Why are they not asking these questions, and doing their own research. Kyle Whittingham knew this kid had a run in with the law... He didn't ask for a police report, or for details about the arrest? If they U of U didn't know, its because they didn't want to, and that is just as incriminating. I would feel better if they knew the details and then made their decision.

  • the_beav SLC, UT
    March 2, 2011 2:31 p.m.

    @ Dutchman | 11:12 a.m. March 2, 2011
    Murray, UT

    True... Most (All) of us make mistakes while in our youth, however how many of us have held-up multiple people at GUN POINT while they were robbed? This is not a typical youthful "mistake" that we should just sweep under the rug.

  • Silence Dogood Caliente, NV
    March 2, 2011 2:30 p.m.

    In my opinion, the NBA, NFL, and MLB shouldn't allow anyone to play that has criminal record.

    The message that is sent to our youth is that if you are a superstar you can get away with stuff the rest of us can't. You can still get rich.

    Michael Vick should have been banned from professional sports. So should any drug abuser, wife beater, and other criminals.

  • SLCMom Salt Lake City, UT
    March 2, 2011 1:49 p.m.

    Kids who have a criminal history, and who perpetrate violent criminal acts do NOT DESERVE a free pass into college along with the potential multi-million-dollar career path attached! Think of all the outstanding law-abiding athletes out there who were waiting and praying for their chance at one of these scholarships, fully deserving, but lost out to one of these hoodlums! That is Disgusting! Every University in this nation should be fully ashamed of themselves for encouraging this delinquent reward system. Hopefully this article will motivate change in recruiting and scholarship policies! The bottom line: If your athletic program is not built on integrity from the ground up, then I don't care how many trophies or awards you've got on your mantle, or bucks in your pocket - you have lost the game and failed your community.

  • Particulars of no Consequence Cottonwood Heights, UT
    March 2, 2011 1:40 p.m.

    I find it depressing to see that there are so many people in my community (particularly in the administration at a local high school) who are more concerned about the quality of their football program than the well-being of their student population. For safety concerns alone I would consider withdrawing my children from Bingham HS. The school has no business allowing a public high school to be used as a rehabilitation program for admitted felons. In addition their leniency with their football players (not just this time), in my opinion, is bound to attract more of the same caliber of "students."

  • SoCalUte Trabuco Canyon, CA
    March 2, 2011 1:30 p.m.

    Not sure why this article focuses on Utah and Bingham High School... Urben Meyer, in his 4 years at Florida, had 16 of his players arrested and put in jail.

    As far as this article goes,.. it's hard to say if the punishment fit's the crime if you don't know all of the circumstances. Example; A 16 year old boy might have participated, just to receive acceptance from his cousin and not for the money. But, when he is 18 he wouldn't need that acceptance. Or....maybe the gun was not loaded. This obviously doesn't make it right, but it does reduce the severity of the crime.
    The point is, that all of the above opinions that say he should be serving jail time, should take the time to know ALL of the facts before they spout off.

  • sherlock holmes Roosevelt, UT
    March 2, 2011 1:09 p.m.

    Sports does not build character. It tends to reveal it. Davies would probably have not got any kind of disciplinary action at most other institutions. But, BYU has the honor code, and it is correct in holding students to the bar.

    Sports has saved many an at-risk kid from going south. Will continue to do so. But can't save them all. If only 10% of college athletes have criminal records, I'm impressed. I'm surprised it isn't higher. It certainly is at some schools, though that's not all bad. Better to see a kid playing sports at a high school or in college than on the streets and unemployed.

  • HomerSimpson South Jordan, UT
    March 2, 2011 12:51 p.m.

    If this student had been offered an academic scholarship to the UofU no one would have blinked. But because he is a good athlete, different rules seem to apply. Jealousy? Maybe.

    The issue is that it was not the same as "adult" criminal activity. The case was moved back to be a juvenile courts, which is a distinct category that comes shrouded in secrecy and privacy due to how we treat young offenders and juveniles in the court system. Until the student is 18 years old there is no way of holding the student to adult standards.

    And without criminal convictions, Coach Peck, Jordan School District, Utah HS Athletics - none of them were concerned. Why would they be? No criminal record.

    If the coach had have refused to play him due to his background, he would have simply transferred to another school and played somewhere. He would have gotten the scholarship regardless.

    BYU is in the news for dealing with Davies in an honor code violation. Like it or not, they stand firm. In the past they were criticized for looking the other way on obvious rule breaking by McMahon & others in the past. You get criticized either way.

  • XelaDave Salem, UT
    March 2, 2011 12:40 p.m.

    Lots of interesting issues being lobbed around but the real issue is money- these kids are worth cash to these programs and so what is a little gun charge when we can make big bucks here- nothing new here- this has been one of the dirty little secrets of big time college athletics for years and as long as the NCAA is around and its conception of what athletics is all about- this will be around- these kids are a commodity plain and simple- whether it is in Utah, Texas, Florida, or Outter Mongolia- get them in- use them up- go get some more

  • Me, Myself and I Blanding, UT
    March 2, 2011 12:29 p.m.

    I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that you would find similar numbers among non-athletes with criminal records in high school/pre college. I think this problem is more a "dumb teenager" problem than any specific sub-group in the same demographic. I can only speak from my personal experience but at my high school the kids who participated in athletics weren't the ones out getting in trouble because their free time was used up at practices and film study and such. It was the kids who didn't have anything to do after school that were always breaking the law and in trouble with the police.

  • EgbertThrockmorton Layton, UT
    March 2, 2011 12:16 p.m.

    Part of the Utah culture is to not have consequences for one's actions, whether a student-athlete in high school or as a state legislator. Its the same idiotic cultural behavior that so infects Utah; and that is the real shame of it all.

  • bikeboy Boise, ID
    March 2, 2011 12:00 p.m.

    I'm just curious: how does that 1-in-14 statistic for college football players compare with college kids in general? And does the 1-in-14 number include ALL police records, including "youthful indiscretions" like underage drinking, tobacco violations, curfew, etc. ... or are 1 in 14 former armed robbers?

    (I'm all in favor of giving kids a second chance, but maybe not so much for violent or potentially-violent crimes.)

  • Barack Obama Phoenix, AZ
    March 2, 2011 11:50 a.m.

    If a high school player has paid his debt then what difference does it make to the University? Certainly the University and the coaches should do their due diligence so that they know who they are inviting to represent the school but other than that, its the player's past and he shouldn't have to wear the scarlett letter for the rest of his life.

  • BYU Grad Alpine, Utah
    March 2, 2011 11:38 a.m.

    My congratulations to SI and CBS for some meaningful investigative reporting. Issues that needed to be identified were, and hopefully they will now be addressed in a reasonable manner.

  • Dutchman Murray, UT
    March 2, 2011 11:37 a.m.

    Mount Olympus,

    The point is did the kid holding other kids at gun point pay his debt to society or not? Maybe he is paying that price by doing juvenile detention or jail time right now. I don't know the particulars. Once that time is served then he should be allowed to go about his business and if that means getting a college education and playing college football then so be it. People change as they get older, most of the time for the better.

  • Simple Man Riverton, UT
    March 2, 2011 11:37 a.m.

    @Dutchman "Remember, kids brains are not fully wired until age 21 or older".

    Too many kids' brains are wired...with the knowledge that the system will let them get away with just about anything.

    There are some kids that make mistakes in the heat of the moment that truly need as much leniency as can be given.

    However, the kids out looking to do mischief know that the system will give them a pass. The system seems incapable of adequately discriminating between the two.

  • TruthBTold SLC, UT
    March 2, 2011 11:37 a.m.

    You know what they say about "Glass Houses" Chris B.... (see his previous unflattering comments yesterday on BYU's dismissal of Brandon Davies).

    I am deeply saddened for ALL of the young men involved in both circustances. It places an uncomfortable spotlight on everyone involved... at Utah and BYU; and an unfortunate black eye on the state and it's athletes.

    I truly do not believe that Utah is any different than any other state (even per capita), in this area. Nor do I believe that ANY of these kids are "BAD"--they simply made stupid mistakes that they should have the chance to correct and move on.

    I will say that there is a huge, fundamental difference in how each University handles such issues though. Neither of them is right or wrong, just different, based upon the Motto, Structure and Purpose of each University.

    I say, STOP THROWING ROCKS at each others Glass Houses, because you never know when one of them is going to ricochet back and hit you in the head!

  • BeRoby South Jordan, utah
    March 2, 2011 11:35 a.m.

    It is not a great day to be a Miner.

  • Cadillac Man Salt Lake City, Utah
    March 2, 2011 11:31 a.m.

    There is nothing wrong with anyone, regardless of their history, moving forward in positive directions. Why do people want to hold someone down because they make mistakes or even choose to violate law? The courts will punish them. This is sufficent. Others do not need to continue and expand their punishment. These people should be allowed to take advantage of whatever society offers them. Any discrimination against someone beyond their court punishment is akin to branding persons with a "yellow ticket of leave".

  • Hanksboy Cottonwood Heights, UT
    March 2, 2011 11:28 a.m.

    Why is most of this report nothing more than congratulatory pablum about how great the reporters and the media are? Was the D News probibited from publishing much of substance? After wading through all the professional back slapping we finally find out on the second page that one young Utah player has a record. And then we read more about how great the reporting is. One percent substance, 99% ad for SI and CBS.

  • Kyle loves BYU/Jazz Provo, UT
    March 2, 2011 11:23 a.m.

    The point Dutchman is that Michael Vick was involves with a lot of illegal activity for years while being a college star and NFL athlete. If people paid more attention or if things were different he might have got some help before he hurt all the dogs and got thrown in prison.

    I'll have to read this article. Sounds like a very worthwhile piece of journalism unlike a lot of what is written today.

  • Mount Olympus Holladay, UT
    March 2, 2011 11:21 a.m.

    Re: Dutchman

    How can you compare a guy who holds people up at gunpoint with Michael Vick? Everyone knows that holding someone at gunpoint is a serious crime.
    Have you ever been to the south? In certain areas people are raised around dog fighting. I'm not saying it is right, but they view it as a sport.

    I think vick did his time and should be allowed to play in the NFL. However holding several people at gunpoint should require a lot more jail time than being involved in dog fighting.

  • Dutchman Murray, UT
    March 2, 2011 11:12 a.m.

    Remember, kids brains are not fully wired until age 21 or older. They are going to make stupid decisions. How long do we black ball them? If they go through the justice system and pay their debt to society then let it go. Look at Michael Vick. He did a very stupid thing and has paid his debt with prison time. Should he have been banned from the NFL forever? I don't think so.

  • We the People Sandy, UT
    March 2, 2011 11:08 a.m.

    Okay. This student held five people at gun point and orchestrated a robbery. His punishment was community service? Yet we sentence people who possess marijuana to prison? I disagree with both activities, but come on, man! The punishment must fit the crime. This student should be in jail until he is at least 21.

  • mkSdd3 Ogden, UT
    March 2, 2011 10:59 a.m.

    Special treatment for athletes, who would have guessed.

    It is bad at Bingham, but it is even worse at schools in Texas and Florida. These kids learn young to take advantage of the system. We are certainly raising them correctly. NOT