It is like a single princess, rejecting to many frogs and winding up rutting
with a Non Member. Complainingb that there aren't any good men.The
idea is to love and accept people as they are. What you think needs
fixed may not be always broken.The Church has Standards and Rules,
people will accept them or not. That is up to them.Sometimes the
price of a Relationship is very, very high.Would you rather your
daughter/son merry a black man/women that can go to the Temple, or a white
person who can't go, and want to take them away from all this. When
you come up with that answer, (please don't put it on Prayer, Change and Hope.
Because you have little hope and chump change). you will know a lot about
yourself and your love of people with differences. With whom you may share the
Gospel.The spokeman was right on the Money. Love One Another. First,
Last and Always.Some Hetrosexual Singles never Merry any number of
reasons. Sex for them is Wrong also. Some keep the Standards some do Not. A few
Great Statement, Right On The Money. I 100% agree and support the Churches stand
on this issue.The action of some members towards people who are
somehow different then them is wrong.We are brought togeather by
that which we have in Common "the Gospel" not by our differences although we
sometimes know them and ackknowledge them.The Church welcomes all
people or I would Not be a member.That said not every member follows
all that the Church Says. Sometimes that makes it hard to fellowship
and stand in circle with some members. Sometimes I will withdraw, when that
happens. Go to the Temple some other time other then Ward Temple Night.Sometimes I will not raise my hand to sustain, I won't object either and will
support the person in action once called and sustaiined.Any behavior
other then that is a devider and division is not the work of God.United we stand, devided we fall, inactive we rot.
try getting married in the LDS church with a license from the State of Utah.
NOT going to happen.Gays do not want to get married in the LDS
church they just want to get a license from the state and get married where they
are allowed to. Separate Church and StateI will back
the LDS church and any other church that doesnt want to marry gay couples 110%
they have the right to marry who the want in their church. But they dont have
the right to tell gay people they cant get married at city hall or in a church
that will marry them.
Pagan: Your same theme after a while does get old. The LDS Church
stopped the practice of Pologamy but if it was warranted would start again if
necessary. The practice was revoked not the doctrine.Interracial
marriage was discouraged not forbidden.Blacks were not allowed to
hold the priesthood because the Lord had not given clear revelation as to if
they could hold that priesthood. Today they all do.If you read the
Bible you will know that Jehovah (Jesus Christ) called homosexuality an
abomination before him. In fact any sexual sin other than marriage between man
and woman is wrong. All sexual sins are grievous before the Lord. Why does it
matter so much to you how the LDS Church stands on this issue when it is plain
you have a grudge and hatred against anything and anyone that is LDS.I don't hate nor do I begrudge any one who is gay. I stand by the teachings
of the Church and I also stand by the law of our Heavenly Father and his son,
Jesus Christ. However, I will not condone the gay lifestyle. It is wrong. It
is a choice not genetic at all.
'The LDS have taken the word of G-d for there position in the matter, and they
can not go wrong there by any sense of the word. Amen!' - Y'shua friend. | 7:28
p.m. Oct. 13, 2010 This was also the case for...
Support for polygamy, which changed in 1890. Against Intracial marriage,
which changed in 1967. Against Blacks holding the priesthood, which
changed in 1978.
"The best-articulated statement from the church on this matter that I have seen.
The leaders are clearly trying hard to listen and respond respectfully while
clarifying church doctrine and holding to revealed doctrine. A big thanks for
that. If everyone communicated this way, our society would be much better for
it."This is the general doctrinal view of the Christian Church as a
whole, and it is every bit scripturally supported. The LDS have taken the word
of G-d for there position in the matter, and they can not go wrong there by any
sense of the word. Amen!
re - Zion's Youth | 12:32 p.m"1 Corinthians 10:13... To a bible
believing religious mind, this is evidence that one is not born to homosexuality
and does in fact have a choice. It is not impossible to remain chaste or to deny
the natural man. The thousands of chaste youths of this church are proof of
it."so what does that have to do with the other 12,400,000
other gays and lesbians in the US who aren't LDS? How would you feel if the
Vaitcan put out regular press releases stating your religion is a hoax and is
immoral? because that is what you are doing. You are demeaning and putting
down over 12 milion US citizens every time you come out with your "we are
against same sex marriage" and "homosexuality is a sin" speeches.how
would you feel if a large organization regularly stated your religion was an
abomination? wouldn't you ask them to stop?well, that's all the
LGBT community is doing - they are asking you to stop spouting hateful
speech.so why can't you do that? (and no, I'm not gay.)
Re: Grundle, Doctor, Etc. With all due respect, I never meant to
imply the LDS Church called the shots. But you said yourselves the
influence is a big factor here. Over 80% of Utah lawmakers, including Gov.
Herbert, are LDS. Attempting to minimize the Church's influence in
Utah politics is simply untrue and disingenuous. It is true that
the Church does not make laws and has a political neutrality general policy,
but no one can deny the Church's heavy political and financial involvement in
Proposition 8 in California.Were a similar need to arise in Utah, no
one can doubt the Church would be involved in that. No one can
dispute the Church's significant influence in the anti-discrimination ban in SLC
regarding housing, employment, and health care. No one can dispute
the Church can and will have signifcant influence in an eventual statewide
anti-discrimination ban towards LGBT's regarding in an upcoming Utah
legislative session. The Church needs to do better educating its
members to properly fellowship the LGBT community. If suicides/bullying weren't
happening, this would not be an issue. Increasing the reach of
the LDS 12-step program is an excellent start.
Doc, that was a good response you posted as it did clarify your stance. I agree
with you to a certain extent.If the church had come out and drafted
up a law and passed it and then moved on to enforce it, I would see a problem.
But the church didn't make any law.Politicians with all different
religious affiliations drew up the laws. The church merely supports the
potential laws that they agree with just as other groups (LGBT included) do. The
church doesn't enforce any law anywhere. They abide by the law, not make it.The government is in the process right now of defining marriage. The
church has already made their decision that they believe marriage is between a
man and a woman so they support that side. Others believe otherwise and
therefore support their side.Freedom is afforded to all. The church
has never infringed on anyone's rights.
Beautifully said. That is a firm, clear, short and true statement. We could
all learn a lot from how the church communicates. I support thier position
"There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man but God is
faithful who will not suffer you to be tempted above what yet are able but will
with a temptation also make a way to escape that ye may be able to bear it." 1
Corinthians 10:13To a bible believing religious mind, this is
evidence that one is not born to homosexuality and does in fact have a choice.
It is not impossible to remain chaste or to deny the natural man. The thousands
of chaste youths of this church are proof of it. Truth is always truth. It
is the same yesterday, today, and forever. If a principle is malleable, it is
not truth. My testimony is that the church will not digress from that which has
been declared truth perviously.As a youth of the Church of Jesus Christ of
Latter Day Saints, I claim my right to believe in and fight for the respect of
worthy and eternal marriage.A child of God is not defined by sexual
attraction or bodily desire. They are defined by the divine potential they
choose to fulfill.
Bethanymom:You are arguing two separate cases. The first is a
religious ceremony performed by a private organization. How many Catholics have
you seen the LDS Church forced to marry in the temple? Vice versa, how many LDS
have you seen force the Catholic Church to marry them in the cathedral? Have
there been gay marriages performed in the Massachusetts Temple? No!The matters of refusing services by a business are a separate matter. Replace
the word “lesbian” or “gay” to “Hispanic”,
“woman”, “native American” etc. You would be violating
the law. In other words, say I am a small businessman in downtown
SLC. You come in and want to purchase something I sell. I notice your CTR ring
and refuse to sell to you because you are LDS. Is that discrimination?
KJB1: You stated: "The Church has the right to refuse to marry anybody they
like." However that statement will not be correct IF "gay marriage" is
legalized. We have already seen people being sued, and charged for refusing to
allow a "gay marriage". For example, A Christian photographer in New
Mexico was found guilty last week of breaking state law for refusing to take
pictures of a lesbian ceremony. Sources: The Associated Press, Alliance Defense
Fund, American Family News Network Tuesday, April 15, 2008ORGroup
Loses Tax Break Over Gay Union Issue By JILL P. CAPUZZO Published:
September 18, 2007ORA psychologist in Mississippi who refused to
counsel a lesbian couple lost her case, and legal experts believe that a doctor
who refused to provide IVF services to a lesbian woman is about to lose his
pending case before the California Supreme Court.by Barbara Bradley
Hagerty (reported on NPR)There were even calls during the lead up to
Prop 8 for the LDS Church to lose their tax-exempt status. So please don't
insult my intelligence by saying that "gay marriage" will have no effect on MY
life except to offend me.
As far as a reference to "Our History" is concerned, the leadership has buried
and accurate and complete accounting of the church's history so soundly that
there are very few people alive that know what that history really is. In my
stake instead of teaching Church History in seminary it is replace by a second
offering in Book of Mormon. Secondly, there is a difference between the
doctrines of God and the Doctrine of Man. God is the same yesterday, today and
forever... if the Doctrine is correct in God's Word, why all the waffling? Did
Nephi or Abinidi go back and re-write their speeches? The present Quorum of the
Twelve are not the U.S. Congress... tell it right, say it correctly, and let it
stand--petition or no petition. No Apostle needs to apologize if it is God's
When I was first married I had a friend who had same sex attraction feelings.
When he left his wife and two young sons the LDS Ward stepped in and helped
mentor and raise them. Years later we met again as we both taught at the same
school. We became friends again. We would meet for lunch and he would ask me
about his boys and how they were doing. His sadness never left him. Because of
him I made sure that no one was ever harassed in my classroom for any reason.
Love the person but not the sin is the best answer, and that's what the Church's
statement is all about.
As I said this is a nuanced subject. My comment on passing laws based on your
belief is very nuanced. Obviously someone deeply immeshed in the LDS church and
culture is going to have core values reflected in the way they vote. But any
political action, enforcing WoW, etc, that infringes on others rights is wrong.
Purely moral issues should not be voted on. If an action is harmful,
cigarettes/alcohol/prostitution, the government will regulate it based on the
harm. As soon as you start shout "God says its bad" you lost credibility in the
political arena. No one can state why SSM is harmful to society. Specifics
HCW:You won't have to wait 50 years to look back. It'll be a lot
sooner than that.
re:Gracious George | 5:56 p.m. Oct. 12, 2010 You post shows that you
are not aware of the efforts of the LDS church."Creating a statewide
ban in Utah of discrimination against LGBTs in housing, health care, etc."The LDS church is NOT the governing body in Utah. They have supported
descrimination bans that have been inacted.Increasing the reach of
the LDS 12-step Addiction Recovery program through LDS Family Services through
working with government and private agencies..."The church currently
does this at great expense to the church"Educating members, youth,
and children regarding proper treatment of and compassion for others who
struggle with this and their families by discussing it in religious
meetings--along with punishing members who violate these policies through
excommunication and disfellowship." They currently do this...Every
Sunday...For three hours. The punishment part is a little extreme but we are
constantly encouraged to treat others as Christ would treat them. "If the
Saviour stood beside me...""Promoting harsher penalties in the
justice system for anti-gay crimes."Amoung the body of the church opinions
vary greatly. I personally do not believe in hate-crime enhanced penalties.
This should be read in every Sacrament Meeting and each Priesthood Q, R.S.,
Youth should have a lesson on this!
This is something that should be the subject of a general conference talk,
especially given the problem many in the church have of being bigoted towards
gays and lesbians. This is the statement that reflects my beliefs
and am glad it was so well stated. I do expect the bigots who dont believe in
freedom of religion to try and pick it apart because they have an agenda and
dont really care about justice and freedom, but rather forcing everyone to agree
with them, exalt them, etc. Very well stated, and thank you for
issuing the statement.
The report was a good one and well said. I was impressed and satisfied. It gave
more insight to what the church policy really is and removes any doubts as a
whole towards the gay population. Bottom line is the church asks all people to
stop bullying the gay population and treat them with respect. People do respond
favorably when treated with respect than people who don't and I believe that's a
fact. And we will be judged by how we treat our neighbors and whether we have
"charity" or not in our hearts will be one of them. Hate-mongers will have no
place in heaven according to the meaning of charity. It's said, one must have
charity to make it to highest heaven. Without it, you lose and will go to the
other heavens, but not the highest one.
Thank you Michael Ottersen. Your statement perfectly reflects the religion I
I agree with the statement but it doesn't adress the fact that the church has
excercized it's right to oppose gay marriage and the gay community has the right
to be upset about it and oppose the church in return. The christian community
isn't going to budge on gay marriage and there are just consequences sometimes
for that.BUT, there is a very fine line here concerning
constitutional rights, equality and free will. Much more needs to be done (not
said) to deal with that divide. This is not a theocracy for a reason and you
can't have it both ways.
As with abortion, homosexual marriage and "rights" has to be done through
judicial fiat. There is no other way to pass the agenda.Using teen
suicide as a battering ram is disengenuous at best. Teens commit suicide all
the time, for many reasons, homosexuality is just one small reason. There are
many others ranging from being fat, to music, to religion in general, to being
bullied, to having the wrong hair color, to drugs/alcohol abuse, sexual abuse,
need I go on. I personally don't know any homosexual teen that has
committed suicide. I have however known several that have done it because of
music, drugs, getting their cell phone taken away, being bullied at school. All
are a tragedy.
What do you say to parents who have fasted and prayed for the children not to be
gay? It is a cruel hoax that prayer will cure homosexuality. If it did, there
would be world wide acceptance of this principal.
Sexual immorality is wrong, whether homeosexual or heterosexual. Love the person
but not the sin. No one was comparing SSA to drug use. It is an analogy. Get a
life. My gosh, it seems that no matter how well a statement is drafted and this
one was very well done, it is taken out of context and used for personal
purposes. Doing wrong and accepting wrong doing does not promote rational
thought it seems. This statement is the best and if taken out of context there
is no way to appease someone who chooses to do wrong, whether homo or hetero, I
I have to say that this is a good example of response. This is
practicing what you preach. Others say "it is all talk". Well, that may be so,
and so may the Salt Lake City non-discrimination laws. But so are cruel remarks
from bullies. True, some bullies go to the level of physical
attacks, but many do verbal attacks. What President Packer said
was talk as well. Clearly people accept that talk has power. People who claim
of President Packer "your actions speak louader than words', actually attack him
for words he spoke, and not actions he did. President Packer
performed the first baptism of a Japanese person in Japan after World War II.
President Packer ordained the first man of African descent as a high priest
after the 1978 revelation, and possibly in this dispensation. President Packer
got the barefoot boy who had been shooed away when he first wandered into the
chapel to come join him on the stand. My original point though is
when confronted with a petition it is tempting to complain about antagonists or
something. Instead Brother Otterson issued a calm, reasoned, principaled but
Wow, there are so many angry comments... I thought this was a thoughtful and
fair statement by the LDS Church.I honestly don't understand why the
HRC has decided to target the LDS Church in this way--the Church is simply doing
what all churches have the right to do in this country: persuade men to do good.
Some LGTB groups act as if the LDS Church is meddling directly with the
government and its laws, but in reality the Church is simply utilizing its right
to persuade men to do good, knowing full well that citizens will ultimately use
their own free will to make decisions regarding the law. That's how separation
of church and state is supposed to work. Unfortunately, many people these days
seem to think separation of church and state means that churches and their
leaders are not allowed to have a voice in the public arena at all... How
misguided and sad.I don't know what the HRC is trying to accomplish
with this petition. The Church will not change its stance because the Church
doesn't answer to random groups of people... It answers to God.
I had a next door neighbor who was gay. He had left the LDS religion. He was a
nice guy. We were sad to see him go. No once did my husband or I, say nasty
things about him. We hoped that he would come back to the church, but we never
spoke of it to him. We respected his agency in this matter. It is wrong to imply
that all Mormons are cruel and hateful to homosexuals. I greatly resent it. Did
I disapprove of his behavior? Probably, but as I never knew about what was going
on in his personal life, it didn't matter. Someone on this board mentioned the
fact that churches need to change as society changes. I cannot support this
statement. Either something is true in a religion or it is not. You can edit the
Bible to make it say what you want it to say, but that doesn't really change the
original. Yes, I believe in modern revelation, but I know that somethings will
never change. Actions are what we are judged on. The real problem is bullying.
Bullying in any matter is unacceptable and I've always made this clear.
RE: BummyI know what part of the statement you're referring too but
it did not say 'thoughts' or 'lustful sins'... it said 'feelings'. It's not 'PR
talk' it seems like appropriate talk to me. When Christ was to pay for our sins,
he asked that the cup pass. He had 'feelings' that made him not want to
continue. Was this a sin? No. In this moment he couldn't control how he felt but
he could control how he thought and acted, and so the atonement was fulfilled.
This is just my opinion but I feel like it was well said, and 'feelings' was the
appropriate word to use.
@Robert from St. George. I agree with you completely.
To KJB1 at 6:57pm, the Church was targeted in many places, in and out of
California, before and after the Proposition 8 issue, including the burning of a
Book of Mormon on the steps of a Colorado meetinghouse. On Nov. 9,
2008, the DN reported: "The Sacramento (Calif.) Bee reports that three days
after voters approved a proposition to ban same-sex marriage in California,
vandals targeted a Mormon church in Orangevale. Vandals spray-painted the
words "No on Prop 8" at the church's property on Hazel Avenue sometime between
late Thursday and early Friday."And on November 3, 2009, the DN
reported: "Gay-rights activist Joe Solmonese of the Human Rights Campaign was
asked on the TV show "Dr. Phil" by a Mormon audience member why the LDS Church
was being targeted.Said Solmonese: "We are going to go after your church
every day for the next two years unless and until Prop. 8 is overturned."In a paper called "Mormons in the Crosshairs" it listed...examples where
members of the LDS Church were "particularly and systematically targeted."Small sampling of the occurrences. This statement by the
Church is very good, and I support it.
Great statement from the Church. The problem is it is just that, a statement.
You read the statement and then you read the comments below from the members out
in the world and you feel like its a losing battle. There is still the feeling
that there is a complete disgust towards gays generally and gay members in
specifics. The tone is ugly and as long as that continues to exist the
statement will be meaningless and gay members will continue to leave to
friendlier shores, which I guess to many is what is wanted anyway. If we do not
head the words from the Church to its fullest hurt, divide, and pain will
continue to split families and cause sadness where it doesn't belong. To tell
people to "get over it" is not that easy when you have to live with it. Judge
@KJB1 | 6:57 p.m. Oct. 12, 2010Again, feel however you like about
gay marriage, but I guarantee you that in fifty years people will look back at
this and wonder what the big deal was. ---------------------I
will take you up on that bet but I will guarantee you in fifty years people will
look back at this and wonder how they could have been so foolish and deceived
that they embraced a practice that eventually destroyed America.
"This people draw near to me with their mouth...but have removed their heart far
marineveteran:Meetinghouses were destroyed by protesters? Really?
Any evidence of that?JPL:In what way are religious
freedoms under threat? The Church has the right to refuse to marry anybody they
like. The only "freedom" that could likely be threatened by gay marriage is the
freedom not to be offended. No one is saying that you have to like gay
marriage. Feel however you like, and teach your family/loved ones the same.
However, using the law to force your beliefs on consenting adults is where the
Church has crossed the line. Judge Walker is absolutely correct:
we-don't-like-it is not a valid reasons for denying others equal rights. The
anti-gay marriage side has had ample time to make their case, and they failed.
All they have to offer are scare tactics and hypothetical what-ifs that have
been throughly debunked by multiple legal scholars (including one from BYU.)
Again, feel however you like about gay marriage, but I guarantee you
that in fifty years people will look back at this and wonder what the big deal
was. It's unfortunate that people like you have so little faith in America and
It is evident that the petition was signed by 150,000 individuals that: a) did
not read B. K. Packer's address and/or b) lacked the reading comprehension to
understand the message contained therein.
Doctor, There are many flaws in your reasoning. One major problem is
that the limits of marriage are not about "forcing our religion on others". The
state recognizing a marriage is an act that forces others to recognize it as
well. Your claim that others do not care what our religion teaches,
and it is only a matter of entering political discourses is provably false.
Judge Walker already said "religious teachings that homosexual relationships are
sinful or unequal to heterosexual relationships are harmful to gays and
lesbians" as a statement of fact in a ruling. If Judge Walker's ruling
is allowed to stand it could be used to disadvantage believers that marriage
should only be between a man and a woman in many ways. The becket Fund
has argued that some of the religious freedom problems of same-gender marriage
emerge as a result of it being imposed by judicial fiat. In the wake of courts
enacting such measures by judicial fiat, which threaten the freedoms of
churches, they have a direct stake in the law as well as their basic right to
intervene in moral matters.
Kudos to the LDS Church for speaking out--this is a significant and
consequential. I stand by what I said about your faith needing to
not just say it, but mean it with swift and meaningful action. I do
not condemn youth for showing love to a leader...I condemn your whole faith for
contributing to the problem and doing nothing but just talking about it. I feel the following things would begin to convince me, HRC and other
groups the LDS Church is serious about this:1) Creating a statewide
ban in Utah of discrimination against LGBTs in housing, health care, etc.2) Increasing the reach of the LDS 12-step Addiction Recovery program
through LDS Family Services through working with government and private agencies
to help as many as possible with their struggles in an atmosphere of love and
safety. 3) Educating members, youth, and children regarding proper
treatment of and compassion for others who struggle with this and their families
by discussing it in religious meetings--along with punishing members who violate
these policies through excommunication and disfellowship. 4)
Promoting harsher penalties in the justice system for anti-gay crimes. This would be a really good start.
Nice try!On one hard we have the LDS Church and its members
preaching in this article and in life--love, kindness, tolerance, and fair
treatment for all people no matter what their lifestyle and on the other hand we
have them using words like immoral, abomination, sin, evil, impure, and
unnatural....just to name a few, and actively working in the political arena to
pass laws based on their belief that gays should be denied equal rights as
citizens. This has the appearance of being logically true on one hand, but which
in fact seems absurd that it cannot possibly be true on the other. Paradoxes are
effective tools for demonstrating that some commonly assumed idea or action does
not necessarily deserve our unquestioning belief and confidence.Certain religious sects even within Christianity no longer carry the
traditional religious view of homosexuality. They believe that Biblical
references have been taken out of context and thereby misunderstood. If any
religion survives in the future it will have to progress, learn, and grow with
society instead of living in the past where knowledge was limited and often
wrong.No single religion can speak for all the other religions or
In reference to the LDS church's official statement:it was short,
clear, and, most importantly, true.Yes, that's right, true.
"actively working in the political realm to pass laws based on your belief is
not right"Doctor, that is what politics is. It consists entirely of
people and groups who actively work to pass laws based on their belief.The LGBT community tries to pass laws based on their belief. Why is that okay
in your mind but it's not okay for the church to pursue their beliefs?The church is just one of thousands of groups who actively work to pass laws
all across the country based on their beliefs.That's what makes
America great, here we have the right to pursue our beliefs no matter what they
@Question. Dont completely blame the left. Mike Huckabee has shown hatred toward
both Mormons and gays. He is a man of the right. It is on both sides. I get
frustrated when many people in Utah think the Republican Party is the word of
God. I wont register in either party because of it. Politics and religion dont
mix. Dont anyone make the Democrat or Republican your God and always blame the
other party for everything. We should show love to all and support our church
leaders and not agree with corrupt ideas of political parties and mingle it with
scripture like so many people do. Peace!
Very well said statement and one that cannot be argued back. Excellent. Thank
you for the clarification. It should be canonized (added to the standard works)
behind the Proclamation on the Family Amazing, and it should be put into the
ENSIGN. Thank you again.
Is it possible for the church and the Gay/lezbian/tans-gender community to
disagree and still get along and go about their lives without the other giving
in?Does the church demand that the GLBT leaders only say things they
agree with and never say anything they can twist into looking like it was
offensive?I think LDS members and leaders know that the GLBT
community won't agree on everything... but they don't go protesting at the
GLBT's doorstep insisting they change their stand and agree with the Church's
stand on this topic.The left is supposed to be
uber-tolerant... but they are the ones who can't seem to handle a difference of
opinion/position and move on. You MUST agree with them or at least say the
words they want you to say... OR ELSE!Can't we all just
get along? President Packer never said it was OK to hate anybody
for their sexual orientation. He said the opposite. But it seems many on the
left think it's OK to hate somebody for being Mormon... What's up with that?
Thank you for this statement. This is a good example of how, while differing
with others, we can look for common ground with civility. All will benefit if
both Mormons and the LGBT community share a fundamental desire to eliminate the
abuse and condescension that so many LGBT individuals experience on a very
personal basis and which has hitherto been so tacitly accepted by much of our
@Pagan. Do you ever have anything good to say about the LDS church? Have you
been waiting like a sniper all day just to get in the first word? I just want
you to know I believe you are a child of God and so are all gay people. The
church leaders love you a ton. Please give them a little respect and don't be
blind in your own hate. We are taught to love all people. President Packers
comments were filled with love if you did actually listen to them. Hate and
truth are opposites. Hate cannot exist in truth. We love you Pagan. Nothing is
being forced down your throat. Give peace a chance and All You Need is Love
dude. Rock on my friend Pagan!
All of the P R offered will not change the facts. Jesus Christ taught that we
WILL be held accountable for our very thoughts of lustful sins, so stop the P R
talk. Teach the TRUTH as He taught it. Thank you.
"but actively working in the political realm to pass laws based on your belief
is not right."Funny how that only applies to Mormons.You
do not see the similarities between drug addiction and homosexuality (and other
sexual sin), only because you choose to ignore God's laws. When somebody
chooses to smoke cigarettes, you can also say that does not affect me or my
children. But, society readily accepts laws that discourage tobacco use, and
campaigns against tobacco are not only considered acceptable, but noble. Why
The gay community like other minority groups are much too sensitive and easily
offended. I'm a short person, and have had that brought to my attention on many
occasions. WOW, I did'nt know I'm short. I have a friend born with multiple
birth defects and is constantly stared at when in public. I've never seem him
offended by that and is a very successful person. Let's just get on with life
and quit nursing hurt feelings.
Good statement. Very respectable and respectful.
I think this is a superbly crafted position statement. It articulates the
common ground that we share with all people of good will, regardless of our
differences. It also declares clearly and unequivocally our doctrines and
beliefs, in spite of our differences with those same people of good will.
Belgie-When you equate sexual orientation to drug addicts you are belittling
folks who are SSA. I think I can honestly say no one cares how you police your
own membership, but actively working in the political realm to pass laws based
on your belief is not right. I know there are nuances to this subject. But
gay marriage does not affect you. At worst you can claim theat allowing SSM
will make your children tolerant of gays. Sort of what this statement is
telling you to do.
Nice but a small step on the right direction.
I think every Mormon should be required to read this statement.So
many of the comments I have seen on the DNews boards are in open conflict with
these positions. Standing for principles is only appropriate when you know what
the principles are.
I think this is as clear and true as it comes, and I appluad the church for the
way they have handled it. This is truly the way the Savior would have handles
the circumstance: establishing their position as to God's law, while asking all
to love and support those who are involved.
"I will never understand the 'we don't hate gay people, but work to stop gay
marriage'"I don't think it's hard to understand. It's the same as
saying "We don't hate drug addicts, but work to stop drug use."
The official statement from the Church is very much well-said. I hope that
Mormons everywhere will read it, study it, and highlight areas that emphasize
kindness and love toward one another.And I'm looking for KM from
Cedar Hills to try and accuse of me of apostacy again. Where are you?
The best-articulated statement from the church on this matter that I have seen.
The leaders are clearly trying hard to listen and respond respectfully while
clarifying church doctrine and holding to revealed doctrine. A big thanks for
that. If everyone communicated this way, our society would be much better for
Re: PaganYou'd be better off to keep handy this statement: "We hope that any disagreement will be based on a full understanding of our
position, and not on distortion or selective interpretation."Too
many that try to tear down the church and consistently claim hypocrisy by church
leaders and church positions on issues are certainly guilty of "distortion" and
Please excuse me. I hit enter too quick and my last post was not completed. This
was very well said. What I'm wondering about if the situation were reversed and
over 100,000 signatures were gathered, would the Human Rights Commission have
acted as quickly. Where are they when people have been verbally abused on temple
square??? Where were they when LDS meeting houses were being destroyed after
Proposition 8 was passed. I seem to remember them being absent. Oh well, it
looks like human rights for a select few. I'm glad this Apostle of the Lord has
stood up for my rights to value traditional marriage between a man and a woman.
Regarding this entire official statement:Very, very well said!!
Well said and Amen. The church took a stand for traditional marriage.
'Such appalling events (teen suicides) simply have no place in our society, and
we join our voice with others in unreserved condemnation of acts of cruelty, or
attempts to belittle or mock any group or individual that is different –
whether those differences arise from race, religion, mental challenges, social
status, sexual orientation, or for any other reason.' - Article Nice statement. While I will never understand the 'we don't hate gay people,
but work to stop gay marriage', I will keep this line handy.