Latinos ask Sandstrom to halt enforcement bill

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  • Bobo Magna, UT
    Nov. 13, 2010 7:09 p.m.

    Are Latinos, because they are Latinos, supposed to be in favor of no immigration restrictions? If immigration is not in the best interests of our nation, are they supposed to blindly side with those who see no legitimate limits in immigration? While millions have lost their jobs in the U.S., we have kept immigration at all time record highs. It is clear at this point that most immigrants are in direct competition for jobs with other immigrants! Is this a good policy or a bad one? I get just a little bit suspicious when Latinos, or any groups, are backgounded while spokespeople declaring to represent them all sound the same tune. It is time to end all immigration - legal and illegal. It is time to close the borders. Immigration at this point does nothing but massively increase the population, which is already over 300 million.

  • maidenwings
    Aug. 16, 2010 3:15 p.m.

    Most of LaRaza)
    Dont Bite the lime just Yet..
    Many UsA Court judges as well
    were Born here in UnitedStates

  • Pipes
    Aug. 16, 2010 1:32 p.m.

    Tony Yapias needs to follow his heart and go back to his homeland. He has no loyalties to the USA. Be happy Tony and go home.

  • patriot
    Aug. 15, 2010 12:47 a.m.

    re:Words and Actions

    Do me a favor smart guy, go down to the county jail and take a look at the manifest list. I'll bet even you will notice that the majority of inmates are Hispanic and many of those are illegal. NExt take a trip to the Arizona border and follow the action for a week .. you know the kid napping, the gun fights, the murder, the drugs and all the things you fantasize don't exist. Do me a favor and pop out of your rabbit hole once and a while because although Wonderland can be fun... it really is just fantasy!!!

  • Voice
    Aug. 13, 2010 7:11 p.m.

    Just compared photos of Sanstrom's news conference and Yapias. Why does the photographer include a whole bunch of protestors in Sanstrom's photo and none in Yapaias? Take pictures of protestors with Yapias or take a photo without for Sanstrom. Why the unbalanced photos and inaccurate representation, according to pollsters, of public opinion on this topic? What's up with is DNews?

  • Voice
    Aug. 13, 2010 6:48 p.m.

    Protestors, rebel rousers, and illegal backers, please go to a courthouse somewhere and picket and plead for all those on trial that day to go free. Carry signs and chant how laws don't matter. Those on trial need compassion. They need to be set free. Sounds rediculous? Yep.

  • tenx
    Aug. 13, 2010 5:35 p.m.

    Right on pieere123 2:05pm. I agree completely. I call on the advocacy groups to stop illegal immigration and only do legal immigration. Problem solved. Also to stop their demostrations while waving the flag of Mexico. This is the USA. We welcome legal immigrants.

  • Words and Actions
    Aug. 13, 2010 4:33 p.m.

    Oh, the morons on these boards. Looks like a white supremacist motorcycle bar in here. 'Just ship em out boys!' is not good public policy. Most Utahns love family, love Latinos and know that immigrants don't cause more crime nor are the eligible for public services. Saying otherwise just proves you don't know what you are talking about.

  • trapdinutah
    Aug. 13, 2010 3:53 p.m.

    Go for it, Rep. Sandstrom. If the legal latinos in Utah would do a little self-enforcement, instead of trying to make us ignore all of their hermanos y hermanas who are breaking federal and state law by being here and working without proper authorization, then we citizens wouldn't need to do it. But, they don't, so we have to. They leave us no choice. Even though they can't breath without ticking me off, I'm sure that my representative, Newbold, and my "Senator," Buttars, will both approve your bill.

  • RichardB
    Aug. 13, 2010 3:25 p.m.

    All of our laws should show compassion. But it does not mean we should not enforce them.

    Mr. Willes has been an open border advocate for many years in LA. He has his opinion.

  • protect
    Aug. 13, 2010 3:10 p.m.

    I was just in Calif. and saw all the illegal immigrants in the fields. I think this situation needs reform and support for legalization. I also think that many legal Americans might find they don't appreciate the work force of ellegal immigrants. Both need support but legalization is the American way.

  • LuVePacifica
    Aug. 13, 2010 2:53 p.m.

    I have just this and this only!
    Stop fighting with each other and Find more ways to voice comments to Resolve Solutions this message.

  • pburt
    Aug. 13, 2010 2:43 p.m.

    Hunt--Your are very harsh and offensive in your charges against LDS. How can you say that Willes, a top official in the organization, has no standing as a spokesperson for the church. But if you won't accept what he and the only general authorities I know to have spoken on this topic have to say, which is that it is a very minor infraction, how about the official pronouncement through the official spokespeople who have said we should deal with the subject of immigration with compassion. They never side with those motivated by racism or greed that like to call undocumented immigrants by dehumanizing words like "illegals" or "criminals."

    By the standard the anti-immigrant ranters use, speeding should be a jailing offense, and trespassing would get you prison time. I love the banner showing behind Sandstrom in the article photo that says, "Who would Jesus deport?" The much larger portion of the gospel would have us love and help others, and the article of faith says we believe in honoring and obeying the law, not we believe in hammering others who ignore a law we pick out of prejudice.

  • pburt
    Aug. 13, 2010 2:30 p.m.

    Hunt--I think you are harsh and offensive in your charges against LDS, but you are ignoring even the most official statements of the LDS church on this topic, which is to deal with it with compassion. The church does not side with the racists who jump on the "stop-the-law-breaking" bandwagon, because those who preach the gospel know that laws are made for man, not man made to fit laws.

    To imply that Willes does not have great credibility when speaking as such a high official in the organization is ludicrous. You discount what he says because he does not agree with your racial bias.

    Why choose undocumented immigration as a law to pound so hard on? I can see only racism and greed as the factors. With fewer workers, wages for those left will go up a little, in theory. More likely, businesses will pressure the government to let more workers in anyway.

  • Hunt
    Aug. 13, 2010 1:51 p.m.

    LDS | 11:17 a.m. Aug. 13, 2010

    I see you're still perpetuating the lie that Mark Willes is a spokesperson for the church.

    What is it like to mislead and misrepresent in an attempt to defend an indefensible position?

  • patriot
    Aug. 13, 2010 1:44 p.m.

    The vast majority of Utah residents support the Sandstrom bill and that is all that matters. It's called democracy. But I guess that is what the majority of California residents thought when they voted for Prop 8 only to have their vote censored by one gay activist judge. I have the feeling that the people in this country are at war with more than foreign terrorists - we have our own democracy hating crowd right in within our state borders.

  • donburi
    Aug. 13, 2010 1:20 p.m.


    You keep saying that this week the Church has spoken clearly. And I'll say again- Mark Willes, President and CEO of Deseret Management Corporation, is not a spokesman for the church. He is giving his opinion only.

  • Tami
    Aug. 13, 2010 1:08 p.m.

    Indeed, if we are members of a church, lets just ignore the law so the illegals won't be offended by our christianity! Give me a break. When will the Hispanics who are here legally see that the only ones creating racial tensions are themselves for not upholding the laws of the country they claim to be a part of? That is what makes the rest of us question whether or not there is any such thing as an American Hispanic.

  • MetricWrench
    Aug. 13, 2010 12:58 p.m.

    The article says "Latino leaders" when it should say "some Latino leaders". Most Latinos are regular law abiding citizens and prefer that we seal the border.

  • Carson
    Aug. 13, 2010 12:46 p.m.

    Why don't we pass a law that requires all the bleeding hearts that support the Illegals, to give a part of their income each month to pay for all the costs involved with Illegals... of course they won't like that, because they only want to spend other people's money to pay for what they think is right.

  • Elcapitan
    Aug. 13, 2010 12:30 p.m.

    Church and State are s separate thing. The church saves souls, the state regulates and enforces our laws. The immigration thing is controlled by the laws of our state and nation so let it be. It has nothing to do with Mormons, Catholics, Jews, or even heathens. Law enforcement must be expected to do their jobs. The vote seeking politicians and the illegals have made an unholy alliance. Get on with enforcing the laws controlling our borders. Mexico does this too.

  • Fitness Freak
    Aug. 13, 2010 12:17 p.m.

    The old analogy comparing "driving 5 miles over the speed limit to illegal immigration" is false and bogus!

    If I get a speeding ticket for 5 miles over, and as soon as the cop gets through writing the ticket I take off and go back up to 5 miles over, - I get another ticket, and another, until I STOP.

    Illegals perpetuate the illegality of their actions EVERY DAY, just by being here.

    Those who aid and abet criminal conduct have tried EVERY SORT OF goofy logic they can think of to TRY TO JUSTIFY illegal actions.

    I just hope Sandstroms' bill goes far enough!!

    As far as the LDS church position - I don't know how/where people get the idea that THEY condone illegal behavior! Besides MY CHURCH tells me to do what is right, and THAT MEANS obeying the law or pay the consequences.

    I learned that in 4th grade, and yes, when I get a speeding ticket I don't try to justify my actions by trying to get people to "feel sorry for my plight"!

  • C. Darwin
    Aug. 13, 2010 12:08 p.m.

    Again comments in favor of illegal deportation are approx. 75%-80%. Those who oppose deportation total approx. 20% Majority rules in a democratic republic. If this bill is not passed you can thank special interest groups and behind the scenes deal making among the power eliet.

  • tiger1
    Aug. 13, 2010 11:49 a.m.

    To patriot:
    Obviously we cannot deport 12 million people! So let's bring the undocumented to light. Temporary visas, biometric cards as many suggested, pay fees, and penalties if they asked for welfare assistance, learn the language and all the conditions you want. Finish the border wall and increase the border patrol. What is difficult is making everybody to agree on it. They have their own prejudices and sadly are very bias. But our politicians follow their own agenda and everything remains up in the air. Our problem is the economy, jobs, the recession, foreclosures, etc. Let's focus on the real problem at hand.

  • Geneina
    Aug. 13, 2010 11:46 a.m.

    tiger1 asks, "What is Romney saying? He was a Stake President."

    As governor of Massachusetts, Romney vetoed in-state tuition for illegal aliens in 2004 and then helped defeat it when it came up again in 2006.

    In 2006 he said, "Those individuals who are not here legally, in my view, should not receive a special benefit. There's not a bottomless pit in terms of money."

    In 2005 he said:

    National Review: "I'm against an amnesty and against anything that provides an incentive for people to come here illegally.”

    Boston Globe: "Giving children of illegal immigrants a tuition break would act as an incentive to draw in more illegal immigrants to Massachusetts."

    Heritage Foundation: "But I didn’t want to create any incentives to have people move to our country illegally."

    Also in 2006, Romney signed Massachusetts up for the 287(g) program that Chief Burbank so strongly opposes and asked for a federal investigation of a cleaning company accused of hiring illegal aliens.

    Finally, he consistently opposed granting drivers licenses to illegal aliens.

    URLs are available for all statements but not permitted here.

  • Ajax
    Aug. 13, 2010 11:25 a.m.

    Questions for Representative Sandstrom:

    What is it exactly that you find so threatening about Utah's illegal Hispanic population?

    Is the legality issue your main concern?

    Have you considered the affect on Utah's economy if you were to have your way in expelling all illegal Hispanic immigrants?

    What if we were to adopt a law whereby illegal Hispanic immigrants could obtain Utah work permits clearly stipulating enforceable rights and responsibilities?

    Is it an issue for you that Hispanic culture lay rightful claim to a place within the cultural fabric that is our Utah heritage?

    You visited the Arizona-Mexico border in the company of Russell Pearce, but did you take the time to talk with other Arizona officials such as Phoenix Mayor Phil Gordon for a contrary view? What is more important to you in formulating state policy: pragmatism, reason and consensus or more of the Pearce model of personal ideology and implacable will at any cost?

    What if in your drive to regulate illegal immigration in Utah you became aware that many if not most citizens consider your approach to be downright thuggish and inconsistent with the direction best suited to Utah's future?

  • RRB
    Aug. 13, 2010 11:25 a.m.

    Tom, our government decides how many guest worker passes we give out. Not individuals or organizations.

    You can't break the law, just because you don't get your own way.

  • emp1
    Aug. 13, 2010 11:21 a.m.

    I am hispanic and legal.

    For my illegal friends:
    I understand that you come here to have a better life and my heart goes for those illegal families that are truly trying.

    But also understand that when I got in an accident, the illegal person that hit me didn't have a DL or insurance. I was left to pay for repairments and medical bills because this person took off never to be found again.

    You come into good neighborhoods and gain a reputation of being loud and disrespectful. The last TWO times my neighbor rented his house to illegals, they dissapear after literally destroying his house. He won't rent to any hispanic family (legal or illegal)

    So you claim this law is wrong, but I don't think it is. We need to be responsible, honest and abide the law. Don't make it more difficult for us that are here the right way.

    Mr Yapias, stop making excuses and leave the LDS Church out of this!

  • Speak English - USA
    Aug. 13, 2010 11:20 a.m.

    I agree with "casual observer":

    All of these Latino leaders are fighting the bill, yet what is their proposal? Do they even have an idea? Or are they too lazy to sit down and put one together?

    I am 100% behind Sandstrom!

    Get the buses ready, time for the deportation process to begin.... yesterday!

  • donburi
    Aug. 13, 2010 11:20 a.m.

    Still Jim

    Not everyone lives in the Mountain time zone. DN has readers around the world. I'm not sure of the point of your accusation towards people who are commenting at a time when you think they should be sleeping anyway. What's your point? You seem to be insinuating that those people are some distinct class of people. Please expound - I would love to know.

  • LDS
    Aug. 13, 2010 11:17 a.m.

    For several years the LDS church leadership and brethren have been subtly urging members to accept and integrate undocumented immigrants into our society. This is because they are refugees from a land of little promise fleeing to a promised land.

    This week the Church has spoken clearly. Their chief director of communications, Mark Willes, President and CEO of Deseret Management Corporation, said: “Some argue it is a simple matter of obeying the law. Those who are here "illegally" should be sent "home." Legally, living here without proper documents is an infraction on a par with driving five miles over the speed limit.”

    The argument that undocumented immigrants are criminals is false. They are a lot like you and me, and just like our forefathers.

    The Brethren are not demanding or commanding, but rather encouraging us to be Christian in our dealings with these good people. All LDS members should read and follow the Brethren's counsel in this and all matters.

  • lovethe8
    Aug. 13, 2010 11:13 a.m.

    If you are undecided about this bill look at your paper, listen to the news and see why your crime rate is gone way up including violent crime, why hospitals and schools are taxed beyond their means and failing,why roads are crowded and traffic getting worse. Listen for the names of people who are now causing the state harm. Simple test, factual not hateful. Here in California we are beyond repair but you have a chance to change things. Take control, tell your representative you are for the bill. If people of all colors are legal whats the big deal there is nothing to hide, I will tell you its because as a state Utah is swimming in illegal aliens. As a former border officer I was shocked when I visited Utah last week. You guys are in trouble.

  • Adver
    Aug. 13, 2010 11:12 a.m.

    Make the bill as strong as possible. We need to get rid of these leeches that are here and stop new illegals from coming in.

    Does anyone have a remote idea what the illegal's are costing us with their baby birthing? I can tell you it is one of the reasons we can't afford healthcare.

  • patriot
    Aug. 13, 2010 11:02 a.m.

    re:Dale C

    Not sure what final solution is - I assume some Hollywood B movie but my point is to simply understand and obey the law. I do it - you do it - why are Hispanics somehow exempt??? Explain that to me.

  • Hunt
    Aug. 13, 2010 10:58 a.m.

    Legal | 8:45 a.m. Aug. 13, 2010

    "Soy orgulloso de poder llamarme Estadounidense."

    You are a Great American Legal. I look forward to hearing more from you.

  • Say No to BO
    Aug. 13, 2010 10:53 a.m.

    Ajax, I disagree.
    I have a particular distaste for a Romanian named Sergiu Popa, an enterprising illegal alien serving time for ID theft.
    Then there's Hezekiah Hamilton, a Jamaican who murdered his girlfriend when he should have been deported.
    Truth be told, I'm indifferent when it comes to the illegal aliens themselves. My beef is with the politicians and other institutions who are apologists for illegals instead of backing existing law.
    I'd try to leave the third world myself if I lived there.
    And this is exactly why I'm standing up for the law and efforts to enforce it. We need to support politicians who are doing the right thing rather than kowtow to special interest groups.
    I don't care if they are Mexican, Canadian or Polish.

  • Hunt
    Aug. 13, 2010 10:52 a.m.

    Still Jim | 7:39 a.m. Aug. 13, 2010

    By knee Jerk reaction, do you mean reacting after months of study on the subject and a desire to see our laws honored and respected?

    "The truth is that most people who apply legally are rejected or the US consulate charges exhorbitant fees."

    Are you trying to say it is OK to break our laws if you think they are unfair?

    "Of course with the comments on this page what can you expect from people who are still up at hours when normal people are sleeping."

    Wow, thats one of the more bigoted comments I've read in this forum. Thanks for letting us know where you stand Jim. I'm glad I'm not a "normal" person like you.

  • Tom
    Aug. 13, 2010 10:49 a.m.

    JBrady | 9:36 a.m. Aug. 13, 2010

    We must not offer enough guest worker permits otherwise they would not need to come here "illegally." love you though.

  • ouisc
    Aug. 13, 2010 10:47 a.m.

    Is becoming a citizen time consuming and expensive? If you take a second and think about it, it's really not. Divorce takes a year and thousands of dollars to process. Switching allegience to a new country IS A BIG DEAL, kind of like divorce! Immigrants who are productive and have a reason to be here ARE allowed to divorce their country and marry the U.S., usually for less money than a divorce.

  • ouisc
    Aug. 13, 2010 10:39 a.m.

    Ajax, you have a good point. Illegal is a pretext. It's a pretext for "those who cheated their way into my country and have taken advantage of me several different ways." And now illegals, and their accomplices, want more from me.

    There is so much more important things going on in the world that demand my time, my money, my attention, than providing sovereignty to a group of people who have intentionally taken advantage of me and my family.

  • tiger1
    Aug. 13, 2010 10:29 a.m.

    Friday the 13th Latino slash bill!!!
    Rep Sandstrom was inspired to get the bill today? Clearly an attack on Latinos on a not so glorious day. I hope he does not propose giving a ride to an undocumented member to the food storage is a crime!
    Like Huckabee said we need to be more christianlike.
    What is Romney saying? He was a Stake President.

  • Ajax
    Aug. 13, 2010 10:26 a.m.

    Some Utahs target our undocumented Hispanic minority as a scapegoat for our ills, vilify them as a scourge on our society, and threaten them with systematic purging. When I and others question the wisdom of these sentiments, I repeatedly hear, "What is it about the law that you don't understand?" Isn't that clever?

    But do you really believe that their undocumented status alone is reason for the level of opprobrium they endure? My impression in this case is that the mantra of "illegal...illegal...illegal" is mostly a convenient pretext (call it a code word) for what is really at heart just a disguised form of you know what.

  • Hunt
    Aug. 13, 2010 10:23 a.m.

    Tom | 9:15 a.m. Aug. 13, 2010

    "I love all of you, including our good brethren who have been enticed to come to our country with out proper documentation to pick cherry's and clean up blood and urine in our hospitals because we don't have enough 'legal' individuals willing to do these jobs."

    Could you please cite even one study that supports this claim?

    wesw | 9:37 a.m. Aug. 13, 2010

    It is good to know that you think our current immigration law is on equal footing with Nazism, and slavery.

    None of the laws you vaguely reference make any mention of race or nationality, you are the one that is doing that.
    You're real problem appears to be that you think the people who will enforce the law are racist.
    If you really think that any law is going to prevent you from helping someone who is suffering a heart attack then "God help us all" is a very accurate statement.

    Fear mongering, shame tactics, and misrepresentation of the truth only work on those who have not informed themselves on the subject.

  • RRB
    Aug. 13, 2010 10:19 a.m.

    Once again the cries of racism spring forward anytime enforcement is mentioned. And once again the words of Latino political consultant Alfredo Gutierrez, in a 1994 interview, come to mind.

    "We call things racism just to get attention. We reduce complicated problems to racism, not because it is racism, but because it works."

  • Ajax
    Aug. 13, 2010 10:14 a.m.

    Some Utahs target our undocumented Hispanic minority as a scapegoat for our ills, vilify them as a scourge on our society, and threaten them with systematic purging. When I and others question the wisdom of these sentiments, I repeatedly hear, "What is it about the law that you don't understand?" Isn't that clever?

    But do you really believe that their undocumented status alone is reason for the level of opprobrium they endure? My impression in this case is that the mantra of "illegal...illegal...illegal" is mostly a convenient pretext (call it a code word) for what is really at heart just a disguised form of you know what.

  • DaleC
    Aug. 13, 2010 10:11 a.m.

    Patriot, Why didn't you use the words "final solution".

  • Third try screen name
    Aug. 13, 2010 9:52 a.m.

    America is not being stingy with immigration here. We've issued an average of over one million green cards a year over the last decade, even AFTER the recesssion hit.
    We have donated shoes, coats, backpacks, school supplies, fast offerings, furniture, physicals...
    We have accommodated their different languages and taught free English classes.
    We have welcomed them into our schools, even making sacrifices in programs and class ratios.
    And WE are chided for being heartless and unwilling to wink at those who entered illegally.
    The real problem is a form of compassion fatigue. We are tired of the tail wagging the dog, especially since ONE THIRD of the foreign-born were not invited.

  • Say No to BO
    Aug. 13, 2010 9:45 a.m.

    The old law school dictum applies here:

    “If you have the facts, argue the facts. If you have the law, argue the law. If you have neither, just argue.”

    Surely the advocacy groups understand that the law is NOT on their side. Their very position is flawed.

  • wesw
    Aug. 13, 2010 9:37 a.m.

    Conservatives in this state are being led by nose-hook to support a proposed law that discriminates based on the color of skin. People keep saying that Mormons are to "follow the law of the land." Does that mean that LDS missionaries in Germany were required to turn over those they knew to be Jewish simply because it was the law? What if the law is wrong? Were Mormons to support slavery because it was the law? Is there a point where Mormons with a consciouse are supposed to do the right thing, as opposed to the legal thing? And, this legislation isn't law yet. So Mormons who see the value of a soul over the color of skin are somehow less patriotic because they place the law of God over the law of hateful, bigoted Utah legislators? In Arizona it is now illegal for anyone to drive an illegal person with brown skin to the hospital if they've suffered a heart attack (transport of undocumnted persons). By law they are to stand and watch the person die. Is that what your Book of Mormon says is the highest calling of your faith? God help us all.

  • JBrady
    Aug. 13, 2010 9:36 a.m.

    Tom, we have guest worker visas H-2A and H-2b.

    We have legal ways to come here. Some feel they are above the law.

  • Tom
    Aug. 13, 2010 9:15 a.m.

    I love all of you, including our good brethren who have been enticed to come to our country with out proper documentation to pick cherry's and clean up blood and urine in our hospitals because we don't have enough "legal" individuals willing to do these jobs. Then we refuse to give them the dignity to provide these services "legally"

  • maidenwings
    Aug. 13, 2010 9:07 a.m.

    listen to KSL radio station..the meaning to the bill

  • dumbo123
    Aug. 13, 2010 8:49 a.m.

    If Utah appears as though they have become soft on Illegal Immigration the message will quickly spread to newly arriving Illegal Immigrants and those already residing Illegally in other states. It is evident that talk is being frequently heard in Arizona that many Illegal Immigrants have decided to move to Utah to escape the new Arizona law. There would be little to stop tens of thousands of Illegal Immigrants looking for greener pastures from making Utah their choice destination for residence. The guarantee for Utah is if you are weak on Illegal Immigration you will likely be a recipient of mass Illegal Immigration like you have never seen. Choose wisely...It will change your state and it will change your future and not necessarily for the good.

  • Travo
    Aug. 13, 2010 8:47 a.m.

    Good work Sandstrom, keep it up. Yapias said illegals are our brothers and sisters but until they learn english we won't be able to speak. And that Carrot and stick comment that alleges it is used for burros and slaves is stupid. The more they try to concvince me how good illegals are for this state and country the more I am opposed to them.

  • Legal
    Aug. 13, 2010 8:45 a.m.

    For yomero and anyone else that agrees with:
    "a@ legal just because you sold your body and soul for a green card when you got married ,means you are different from illegals ? shame on you"
    I'm different from illegals becuse I'm grateful for a country that allows me to achieve my potential. A country where freedom is real, where the justice system can actually work, where you usually don't need to fear the police that are supposed to protect you. The list goes on and on. I'm different because I try to OBEY the laws that help make this country what it is. Soy orgulloso de poder llamarme Estadounidense. God bless the USA hermanos!!

  • Ajax
    Aug. 13, 2010 8:43 a.m.

    Once again in Utah politics we see in the example of Sandstrom and friends that arrogance and incompetence are a dangerous combination.

  • casual observer
    Aug. 13, 2010 8:32 a.m.

    Then make a suggestion that will solve the issue, but don't just oppose every bill that addresses the crisis.

  • JBrady
    Aug. 13, 2010 8:11 a.m.

    Enforcing the law is the only way to ease tension in the community. Continually stopping any effort will only turn push to shove.

    This law is about people here illegally, and their illegal status. It's not about Hispanic's.

    As far as the militant Hispanic groups, La Raza receives millions each year from the Federal government to help find housing for Latino immigrants, both legal and illegal.

    Helping a person here illegally is against Federal law, yet your tax money does it.

    They are afraid of losing funding and having to work with the rest of us.

  • Still Jim
    Aug. 13, 2010 7:39 a.m.

    It is too bad people run on about costs and other issues without really knowing what the issue really is. There seems to be a knee jerk reaction to this immigration and legality. The truth is that most people who apply legally are rejected or the US consulate charges exhorbitant fees. In Utah there is an extremely racist attitude among many that shows a problem to exist. Of course with the comments on this page what can you expect from people who are still up at hours when normal people are sleeping.

  • VF
    Aug. 13, 2010 7:39 a.m.

    I am in 100% agreement with Hunt because the 12th Article of Faith which is:

    "We Believe in being subject to kings, presidents, rulers, and magistrates, in obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law."

  • peter
    Aug. 13, 2010 7:31 a.m.

    Being a citizen and legal part of this country is a privilege by law, and not by some whimsical sense of entitlement. I support this bill!

  • The Independent
    Aug. 13, 2010 7:22 a.m.

    Immigration has been co-opted as an umbrella or wedge issue for demagogues on both sides of the issue to conveniently promote veiled agendas.

    Russell Pearce in Arizona as well as Sen. Sandstrom in Utah are the wrong individuals to be speaking to the issue just as much as the Hispanic leaders who purport to speak for the community.

    We need balanced and reasoned discourse on this issue that is pragmatic and solution driven; not the reactionary measures that State legislatures are trying to take to gain votes and appease ideologues.

    I do agree that there are people who truly are concerned with law and order that are not motiviated by racism or bigotry in their support of SB1070. But there are likewise many that do hide behind immigration to advance racist views, particularly of Hispanics.

    It is disappointing as a member of the LDS Church to see elected public officials who are LDS exercising what they view as their duty as well as LDS memebers that support them fail to balance equally important priciples and counsel of LDS leadership that is leading to unrighteous dominion. If viewed with an objective lens,there are many wolves in sheep's clothing.

  • One American
    Aug. 13, 2010 7:16 a.m.

    "Archuleta said Sandstrom's bill is one in a long string of legislation that targeted illegal immigrants by making it harder to find jobs, impossible to get drivers' licenses and welfare and tougher to enter schools."

    Ya think? That is the point exactly! If you are in this country illegally, you have no right to a job, a drivers license, welfare (paid for with my tax dollars!) or our schools (also paid for with my tax dollars!).

    What part if ILLEGAL does Mr. Archuleta NOT understand? Apparently the entire word and it's meaning. Same goes for Mr. Yapias.

  • Dektol
    Aug. 13, 2010 7:15 a.m.

    So, Latino community, turn in and help prosecut and deport the illegal criminals and you won't need another bill. What??? You aren't willing to do that. Surprise, Surprise, Surprise!

  • patriotandmore
    Aug. 13, 2010 7:14 a.m.

    So the solution to the problem is for all illegal aliens to leave. We shouldn't have to introduce laws that will punish law breakers. They already exist. Mr. Yapias should do the right thing is he's an honorable citizen of the U. s. and tell illegal's to return to where they came from and then apply to come back legally. Sandstrom's bill will pass!

  • Tvillecomment
    Aug. 13, 2010 6:29 a.m.

    Mr. Yapias must accept that Rep Sandstrom's bill is necessary and supported by a larger U.S. Citizen segment than those to do not support it. States must be able to legislate rather than allowing the feds to. Go Rep Sandstrom. Utah must move forward with immigration law...

  • SLars
    Aug. 13, 2010 3:36 a.m.

    I think Latino leaders need to stop trying to run our immigration in this country.

    No one fans the flames higher than they do. Tell your people to obey the law, we don't have this problem.

  • My2Cents
    Aug. 13, 2010 2:59 a.m.

    By Latino's we all know who Tony Yapais is talking about, all the illegal aliens from Mexico so why doesn't he get it right for once. He does not represent any americans, except the anchor babies criminal foreign nationals use as a crutch to break our laws and pilfer this country.

    The Mexican illegals are in America for one reason, break the laws and pilfer. The states have been backed in to the corner and being financially bled to death because the federal government chooses not to enforce immigration laws. It has gotten so bad that its not only Utah and the Western states battling illegal alien invasions, all the other states East of the Western half have also enacted stricter illegal alien laws that are even better.

    The eastern states laws punish the employers and will revoke their license if they hire or employ illegal aliens. That is where Utah laws should target enforcement, at the employers and business. And revoke any business license held by an illegal alien.

    These turncoat activist have stalled immigration enforcement long enough, its time to get legal and stop your sympathetic whining.

  • reeder
    Aug. 13, 2010 2:46 a.m.

    yo utah and arizona band together on this we just might have the other states jump in that are to chicken to face up to them which part of illegal do they not understand united states residents that pay taxes cant break the law and get away with it they nail us to the wall over a speeding ticket or our dog barking into the night so just maybe if we wine and cry enough we can get off too like the illegals and get our way, wrong its not going to happen we pay the taxes.

  • Hunt
    Aug. 13, 2010 12:17 a.m.

    Sara.F. | 10:11 p.m. Aug. 12, 2010

    "Arizonas law was rebuked by the federal courts..."

    This is factually incorrect. Portions of Arizona's law were stayed pending a trial on the issue. In fact, the main portion that was stayed dealt with requiring Officers of the law to check citizenship status when stopping someone. Officers still have the ability to ask for this status and many do, they just are not required to.

    K.Y | 10:57 p.m. Aug. 12, 2010

    We already have programs in place that allow workers into our country to pick crops. If you feel any part of the immigration law is unfair, you should fight for it to be changed. Irregardless of the fairness of the law, it is no justification for the breaking of it.

    Saying that people who are against illegal immigrants are ignorant is a bigoted statement and only serves to show your own ignorance.

    Lastly, could you please explain what hidden political agenda conservative talk shows have?

  • Ajax
    Aug. 13, 2010 12:07 a.m.

    Let's be frank in recognizing Sandstrom for what he is: an all too typical self-serving Utah yahoo whose mindless pretensions far outstrip his ability.

    And now is a make or break moment for the L.D.S. Church. Is the Church really a world church or is it a Utah church? Will the Church hierarchy acquiesce under a banner of political neutrality and allow people like Sandstrom and Pearce stamp their claim on what it means to be a Mormon? I sincerely hope not.

  • jammer2324
    Aug. 12, 2010 11:49 p.m.

    The funny thing is, this is nothing more than the goverment doing a pretty good job of sliding the blame of the economic problems off on the "new problem of to many illegal immigrants." Thats not the problem with the economy people seriously come on. There really aren't that many more here than were several years ago when the economy was booming. There needs to be reform in the immigration system, but deporting all of them does nothing but tear apart families, destroy what is already an economy in shambles in mexico, leave thousands homeless, jobless, and with no chance, and still we have the base problems with our economy. There needs to be a better solution. Not only from an economic stand point but from an ethical stand point. Could they have gone about coming here in a better way, Obviously. But there are better ways to go about things than a selfish attitude of only worrying about myself. Find a solution that helps both sides. Taking a couple extra months to find a better solution isn't going to totally destroy one side.

  • terra nova
    Aug. 12, 2010 11:41 p.m.

    Reps Sandstrom and Wimmer are pandering to what they "think" will get them elected again.

    The bill they are considering is ill-advised, and if it is based on the Arizona law, poorly written and doubtless, illegal. They will only serve to hurt their cause.

    I'm legal, I vote and when my turn comes to cast a ballot, I'll do all I can to get Wimmer/Sandstrom and their ilk kicked out of government.

  • gbo
    Aug. 12, 2010 11:39 p.m.

    Why is it Latino leaders always fight these issues? How about an organized effort to get people who are already here to be here legally, and help people who want to come here to do it legally?

    Then this quote from the article:

    "Archuleta said Sandstrom's bill is one in a long string that targets illegal immigrants by making it harder to find jobs, impossible to get drivers' licenses and welfare, and tougher to enter schools."

    Isn't that the point? Why should illegal immigrants be able to get any of those things? Why should legal, tax paying citizens be forced to bear the burden of people being here illegally?

  • K.Y
    Aug. 12, 2010 11:10 p.m.

    If Utah passes a simmilar bill as the Arizona's, the Church's immage will be negatively affected especially in Latin America, I think Utah should be a leader in finding a reasonable and inteligent solution to the problem.

  • K.Y
    Aug. 12, 2010 10:57 p.m.

    This is so hypocrite, To be in the USA legally or illegally is only a matter of status, to condemm, judge and even persecute not to mention antagonize and discriminate against a ethinic group just because of their legal status is absurd. The main reason many of them are unable to gain legal status is because the current immigration laws favors those who are wealthy, if you are in Mexico or Argentina for example and want to immigrate to the USA the Consulate will issue a visa only if you can prove that you have enough money to spend in the USA, be it in school or tourism, now if you want to come to work it is only possible if you have unique skills, see the pattern, the regular guy that cleans buildings or picks crops at minimum wage cannot even dream of getting a visa. Most people who are against these same immigrants are very ignorant of the matter have their opinions based on conservative talk shows whose main purpose is to promote their hidden political agenda.

  • Third try screen name
    Aug. 12, 2010 10:32 p.m.

    I'm assuming from the photo gallery that there wasn't a crowd. I saw three people.

  • Say No to BO
    Aug. 12, 2010 10:31 p.m.

    Whatever happened to the doctrines of honesty and being law-abiding citizens.
    A bit of situational ethics here?

  • Sara.F.
    Aug. 12, 2010 10:11 p.m.

    I am a legal immigrant, a registered voter and I'm againt this bill. If Sanndstrom has any Hispanics backing his bill, the numbers are very scarse. Arizonas law was rebuked by the federal courts, why is anyone thinking the outcome for Utah would be any different. Why not concentrate on solutions that would legalize illegal immigrants already here that have in fact contributed to this country for 5,10,15+ years and stayed out of trouble, than deporting them by the thousands and then bringing other ones legally To replace them that don't already know the culture, the language etc. Wouldn't that just make things easier? Families would stay together too. Of course there's those of you who will bring out the argument of "illegal is illegal and you have to abide by the law!" Well make them pay a penalty and make money while at it. That would be be a lot of money! In short, stop the hatred, come up
    with win/win solutions now!

  • carman
    Aug. 12, 2010 10:09 p.m.

    To Dave4197:

    The US is a land of opporutnity precisely because, in general, we have respect for the laws of the land. The more corruption in a country, the less efficient the economic system will be. Failing to enforce the immigration laws is a huge step towards lawlessness. Those who don't respect the immigration laws should not have citizenship granted to their children, and should not be considered for any kind of amnesty. If they want to come to this country, they should show their desire to support the laws of the land by following the law in coming here. If they don't, they should not be here in the first place.

    Unforetunately we cannot have 500 million addiotional people flood this country. But that is precisely what would happen if we opened our borders to any "poor" who want to come here. We need a rational immigration policy, and a willingness to help other countries build their local economies and legal systems to improve opportunity around the globe. Realistically, every can't live here.

  • Hunt
    Aug. 12, 2010 10:08 p.m.

    dave4197 | 8:30 p.m. Aug. 12, 2010

    Selfish? Taking personal shots now? In what way am I selfish? you again make a claim and fail to back it up with any reasonable argument, stat or fact.

    "I'm for more opportunity for our poor neighbors from the south."

    So am I dave.

    The United States is the most Charitable country in the world bar none.

    The Mormon people through the Tithing program are some of the most giving and charitable people in the United States.

    What more do you want?

    Should I give up my small home, my car and my ability to barely make it paycheck to paycheck so that illegals can take my good paying job and make it a bad paying one, live in a bigger house, and drive a nicer car, while making more money than me by paying no income tax and collecting on government benefits at my tax paying expense?

    Your ideals are just that, ideals. Ideals typically fail to take into account real world consequences.

    I've responded directly to your points, do me a favor and respond directly to mine.

  • Speak English - USA
    Aug. 12, 2010 9:43 p.m.

    I am required to have my driver's license with me if I get pulled over. If I do not have it, then I can be cited for not having a license.

    I am required to carry proof of insurance. If I cannot prove it, I can be cited.

    I keep both of them with me at all times.

    It is because of this very thing that I don't buy the whole "profiling" argument. When you show your license, you prove to the police officer that you are in the country legally. When you cannot provide him with that, then you should be carrying the necessary proof to prevent the next step.

    Illegals, get out of our state and country!

  • carman
    Aug. 12, 2010 9:40 p.m.

    Mr. Yapias uses racist arguments to shout-down those who want our borders secured. This is NOT an issue that has anything to do with one's country or culture of origin. Halting illegal immigration is about enforcing the law, providing for the common defense and preserving our very way of life. If we need more workers, we should revise our guest worker laws, have the illegals enter the legal economy, have them and those who hire them bear the burden of costs they impose on society, and bring them out of the shadows. My guess - Illegals would see their wages rise, their freedoms expanded, their rights protected, and we would all be safer and economically better off.

  • donburi
    Aug. 12, 2010 9:32 p.m.


    You clearly don't understand the parable of the good Samaritan. Please pay more attention in Sunday School.

  • Hunt
    Aug. 12, 2010 9:29 p.m.

    dave4197 | 6:33 p.m. Aug. 12, 2010

    Your argument that Mexicans somehow have the right to work on U.S. soil because their forefathers were here at some point in time in the past is a ridiculous one once you know the history of how the U.S acquired the land.

    When your not arguing against the sovereignty of the United States, look up the Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo. Mexico fully agreed to the United States purchase of the land as well as the current layout of the southern border.
    To put your faulty reasoning on a more personal level. Lets say you are farming land you own when one day you wake up to find someone else farming it and taking the crop for themselves. Are you telling me that is fair. Your compassion seams to be one sided and serves only to benefit those who take what is not given to them.

  • Littlebit
    Aug. 12, 2010 8:57 p.m.

    I hope this bill is introduced, passed, & enforced. Re: DaleC -- how is it hounding, kicking around, and oppressing other people to insist that they obey the law & come here legally? How can the legal US citizens be of any help to anyone if we are taxed to death to support all the illegals who are able to sneak in through the back door, have anchor babies, & then demand welfare benefits? Where does it end? Are we expected to finance the entire world if they were somehow able to get here?

  • peter
    Aug. 12, 2010 8:56 p.m.

    The Constitution was established to allow State sovereignty under Constitutional laws, not for Federal control. The Feds purpose was to hold States accountable to this order. The Feds are our problem with most issues because they have usurped State and individual rights, which goes against our Framers intent in establishing a free nation.

  • dave4197
    Aug. 12, 2010 8:30 p.m.

    hunt = selfish
    hunt, you've made my point about opulent economies vs poor economies. But I go a step beyond your comparison (I see you don't want to compare), and say that 1st world economies cannot sit idly by while 3rd world economies perform slave labor for us.

    I'm for more opportunity for our poor neighbors from the south. They are our neighbors. In many ways we can help raise their living standard. In the long run, it's better for us to sacrifice some now, and help our neighbors (they're special ouisc said), than to exclude them by blunt gov't force until they rise up and lift your boot off their neck. I'm for true equality of opportunity, and for all being able to seek prosperity. I'm not for the gov't using its power to force this wave of poor people out of our comfortable, even opulent, neighborhood / workplace / state / nation.

    You are still in a cave, hunt. Come out, see the light, think outside the box. Find the root problem, poverty, then how to fix this real problem. Not about ranting with the tea partiers.

  • LuVePacifica
    Aug. 12, 2010 8:27 p.m.

    this is not going no where..will continue for many more years..the Kettle is Boiling always will be..

  • DaleC
    Aug. 12, 2010 7:50 p.m.

    All the smug, hypocrisy makes me sick. So, you are nice and legal and rich and doing fine? So, that gives you the right to hound, kick around, and otherwise oppress other people! Now that you are up a few rungs on the ladder, why not reach down and help someone else up?

  • Joe Smith
    Aug. 12, 2010 7:40 p.m.

    Title of the article "Latinos ask Sandstrom to halt enforcement bill" clearly implies that all "Latinos" want the bill halted. Strangely similar to Harry Reid's comment that you can't be a Latino and a republican.

    All of this is clearly insulting and offensive to those Latinos who are proponents of this bill AND those Latinos who are not Democrats.

  • attentive
    Aug. 12, 2010 7:39 p.m.

    The most important thing any of us can do is to make our voices heard by those who represent us. Contact your political leaders and representatives. Make sure that you are registered to vote. Attend meetings concerning illegal immigrants and upholding federal, state, and local laws. Don't just spout off here because you are aggravated and tired of it.

  • bigv56
    Aug. 12, 2010 7:34 p.m.

    What do latinos have against secure borders? Check out Mexico's immigration laws. They are cruel to the people who come up from Central America. Calderon believes in enforcing his laws, why not us, we have a severe illegal immigrant problem and the vast vast majority come from the south. If you are an American first, enforce the borders. We are being looted by those who come in illegally. This law is not different from federal law, but those losers won't do their job.

  • Hunt
    Aug. 12, 2010 7:31 p.m.

    dave4197 | 6:16 p.m. Aug. 12, 2010

    "invoking the LDS church's 12th article of faith, about obeying the law of the land, into this debate is a debacle."

    A debacle? In what way? Because other than the fact you call it a debacle you give no evidence as to why.
    Do you believe in the 12th Article of Faith? Because if you do I'm not sure how you could justify any statement to the contrary. I don't see anywhere the words "sometimes" or "except for" in the 12th Article of Faith.
    I know what I'm going to say next is going to be difficult for some to wrap their brains around but it is possible to be a "Good Samaritan" and still want to see your laws followed and your sovereignty as a collective nation respected.

  • oh ye confederacy of dunces
    Aug. 12, 2010 7:17 p.m.

    I'm tired of the Left wing and the Latino culture hijacking this issue. This is not an issue about immigration. This is not an issue about race. Stop playing the victim card. This is an issue about ILLEGAL entry into the United States of America. We abide by laws in order to protect our wonderful way of life. Every time an uneducated, unskilled individual--from any country on the face of the planet--decides to sneak into the U.S., the economic stability of our wonderful nation becomes that much more unstable. The costs of educating and caring for this population--who pay next to nothing in taxes--is staggering. What has made our country great is our willingness to abide by her laws and participate the right way. Our laws are not to be trampled on, and when they are, there are real consequences. Pass the bill, and pass many more like them until this problem is controlled.

  • Emophiliac
    Aug. 12, 2010 6:58 p.m.

    Why do Hispanic groups want to be tied as closely as possible to law breaking? (It might be connect to the statistic that over 80% of the illegals being deported come from South of our border, according to another DN story, but that is just a guess)

  • ouisc
    Aug. 12, 2010 6:45 p.m.

    Do you know why the United States has established annual limits on immigration? A lot of good people in our Federal Government has done a lot of good work, and has realized we simply can not open our borders up to whomever wants to come squat in our country. Countries like China and India would start shipping their people here, like they have before. The INS/ICE exists for a reason. The INS/ICE is not an optional agency.
    Our relationship with Mexico is not so special that we should help those out who defy our laws and take advantage of U.S. citizens generosity. My generosity does not go to people who lie and deceive me on a daily basis. My expectations are higher than that.

  • dferg
    Aug. 12, 2010 6:39 p.m.

    @dave4197 | 5:17 p.m. Aug. 12, 2010:
    Unless you'r calling South Salt Lake a cave, I don't live in one. You're comparing apples to oranges here, Dave (for some reason the Cheech and Chong bit "Dave's not here..." comes to mind; I don't think Dave's here at all); or more appropriately, bananas (as in republic) to oranges or apples.

    You can't make a valid comparison of second- or third-world countries and a first-world one. Mexico is a third-world country (I'd provide the URL for proof, but then this wouldn't get published), and therefore cn only be compared to other third-world countries. The U.S. is a first-world country, and can only be compared to other first-world countries.

    And right now, our economy - compared to other first-world countries, is dismal. Massive amounts of U.S. citizens and LEGAL immigrants are unemployed or under-employed, families going hungry, losing their houses, etc., whilst illegal immigrants take jobs because they're willing to work for less (and no, not just farm labor jobs - hotel, food service, etc., too).

    We're. Not. Opulent. We're. Broke.

  • R0B
    Aug. 12, 2010 6:35 p.m.

    @md are you really that insecure and racist? Tell me exactly where are these newborn babies going to go? How can their families provide for them in mexico? You can't treat human beings like baggage. We need to stop illegals from coming but the ones that are here working trying to make it just like the founding fathers of this country deserve to stay. Stay civil people

  • dave4197
    Aug. 12, 2010 6:33 p.m.

    I'm speaking for opportunity and for more humane treatment for our poor neighbors from our own continent, who chose to walk across a political line in the sand to go to a place where their forefathers lived before we gringos came here. That's fair, I believe. May be some negative consequences for some of us, but ultimately a good result for all of us when we try to achieve peace and prosperity by working together. Not by working on exclusion of opportunity.
    you want to nit pick? look at any sector of our economy, there's high unemployment. look at the stats about jobs that are predominantly held by latinos whether documented or not, they work the farm fields, and when there's an invitation from the latinos to the gringos to apply and take those farm field jobs, guess what, no takers. What's fair, hunt? I say it's fair to extend a hand to our less fortunate friends and neighbors, an opportunity.

  • dave4197
    Aug. 12, 2010 6:16 p.m.

    invoking the LDS church's 12th article of faith, about obeying the law of the land, into this debate is a debacle. rather you immigrant haters should read the parable of the good samaritan, follow that advice and admonition. And there are plenty of other teachings that contradict Sandstrom's (and others') claims that we should blindly follow even a bad law. a past president of BYU challenged the US Education Dept once to sue him in court, in the meantime, BYU refused to adhere to a bad federal law.

    Sandstrom, your bill is headed in the opposite direction from civility, the opposite direction from working on a real solution to poverty in America. please get off your toadstool touting the 12th article of faith, and your tea party like rant about the rule of law in this case. Instead, look at how you can open the door to the great opportunities in this country, like the Statue of Liberty entices us to.
    Stand up to the feds by making a Utah law that facilitates immigration, and don't be the closed door.

  • Cactus
    Aug. 12, 2010 6:07 p.m.

    "Archuleta said Sandstrom's bill is one in a long string that targets illegal immigrants by making it harder to find jobs, impossible to get drivers' licenses and welfare, and tougher to enter schools."

    Now wait a minute. I am a small business owner and have been told by the federal government that if I give an illegal immigrant a job I could go to jail. Does Mr. Archuleta mean that Sandstrom's bill making it harder for an illegal to find a job is a bad thing? That's what the federal government says we are supposed to do.

  • Cactus
    Aug. 12, 2010 6:03 p.m.

    "Archuleta said Sandstrom's bill is one in a long string that targets illegal immigrants by making it harder to find jobs, impossible to get drivers' licenses and welfare, and tougher to enter schools."

    Now wait a minute, Archuleta! I am a small business owner and I have been told by the federal government that if I give a job to an illegal immigrant I could go to jail. So what am I supposed to do? If I give an illegal a job, I go to jail. If I don't give him a job, I am a racist bigot.

  • patriot
    Aug. 12, 2010 5:57 p.m.

    If you are Hispanic perhaps you could explain something to me. Why are you sooooo afraid of being checked for your green card? IF YOU ARE LEGAL you have nothing to worry about. Carry your green card with you just like your drivers license and no sweat.. right ?? Am I missing something here? No one is going to profile you - if PROHIBITS racial profiling in all of the bills - Arizona and Utah. IF you are stopped for speeding the officer could ask you for your green card which would take all of .. say... 10 seconds? Now if you are trying to protect your illegal family members then I can see where the problem is but if you are doing that then you are breaking the law and you should be caught. JUST OBEY THE LAW and all will be well. Holy cow this in insane. It is like saying that no police officer should ever ask for proof of car insurance. They do it all the time to all races of people!!!! Just obey the law and have car insurance!!

  • yomero
    Aug. 12, 2010 5:45 p.m.

    @ legal .just because you sold your body and soul for a green card when you got married ,means you are different from illegals ? shame on you.

  • sally
    Aug. 12, 2010 5:43 p.m.

    There is a way to solve this issue without any legislation. The illegals can pack up and move back to the country they came from. We're not stopping them from returning. So called leaders like Yapias are protecting their own position in the community. They are not protecting the illegals. This is a job for them.

  • ouisc
    Aug. 12, 2010 5:40 p.m.

    Illegal immigration is like cheating on your spouse. Seemed like a good idea at the time, but you will get caught, and your family suffers the consequences of your poor choices.

  • Hunt
    Aug. 12, 2010 5:33 p.m.

    @dave4197 | 3:16 p.m. Aug. 12, 2010

    I'm sure you are willing to concede that many illegals are working in the construction industry.

    With that in mind, did you know that the construction industry is currently suffering from a rate of 17.3% unemployment?
    Do you think that it is fair under these conditions for an illegal to keep his job over a U.S. Citizen?

  • Carson
    Aug. 12, 2010 5:31 p.m.

    "Archuleta said Sandstrom's bill is one in a long string that targets illegal immigrants by making it harder to find jobs, impossible to get drivers' licenses and welfare, and tougher to enter schools."

    We the people of Utah need to stand up to these activists and let them know that we are not going to allow Illegals to over run and bankrupt our state. We need to vote any legislators who don't support these Immigration bills out of office.

  • Hunt
    Aug. 12, 2010 5:25 p.m.

    @Utah Dem | 4:35 p.m. Aug. 12, 2010

    "Hunt - are you implying that Tony Yapias is LDS?"

    Yes. I am implying that Yapias is LDS because he is.

  • fed up
    Aug. 12, 2010 5:22 p.m.

    Latino leaders The easiest way to stop the tension would be for you to take the lead in sending illegals home. Turn in those with false ID. Turn in anyone renting to illegals. It is against the law to rent to illegals. Turn in the employers who do. Let us once again feel good about each other. If you are truly leaders, clean up the mess. That would be the compassionate way to solve things.

    We would all like to work hard to have things for our family. Stand up and do the right thing.

  • dave4197
    Aug. 12, 2010 5:17 p.m.

    dferg. Get out of your cave. Go to Mexico, or any other central or south american country. When you've lived there for a few months, perhaps by working in their economy, return to the US and tell me we're not opulent. I do read the papers, dferg, and I do live and work in the usa, and I've lived south of the border and visited south asia in a green uniform. I've been around. You must live in a protected enclave. We are opulent by any conparison.

    As to my point, in case you missed, which opulent was just one word, we're opulent enough to help our poor neighbors from the south by allowing them a simple opportunity to try to work here. I think we can easily afford that gesture.
    So take down your hot temper, dferg, and your defensive selfishness. And try to help.

  • Evets
    Aug. 12, 2010 5:15 p.m.

    Archie and Tony are wrong as usual. They just don't represent legal Latinos. Until recently I worked in the Latino community for years often as the token white guy and many, many of my Latino friends and family members support immigration reform. As a matter of fact nearly all the emails I get supporting reform here and in Arizona are from Latinos. So please don't judge Latinos by the actions of a few activist like Tony and Archie who for some reason want to protect illegals.

  • TOO
    Aug. 12, 2010 5:13 p.m.

    Ha ha, let's get started.

  • dave4197
    Aug. 12, 2010 5:03 p.m.

    ute dem, if you cannot see why this is a bad bill, you need glasses. And I already have trifocals, you must be blinder than a bat.
    The hate and hostility, your words, that drives this bill, and Sandstrom, and his supporters, is founded in pure selfishness, no mas. This bill is bad because it doesn't relate to the root problem. Any logical thinking person, like me, sees that these undocumented immigrants are one thing, poor, and they want one thing, opportunity in our opulent economy.
    We in the usa cannot and must not close the door to our poor neighbors from the south while we luxuriate in such relative wealth. Any political try at a solution to the problem must include recognizing certain inalienable rights (per our Declaration of Independence) and recognizing what we've told the rest of the world for centuries, hands off the Americas. Now we need to help our own which includes our own continent and our own hemisphere.
    Got other reasons, too, ute dem, first I'll see if you're too blind to read this, and understand these simple truths.
    See ya at the capitol tomorrow.

  • dumprake
    Aug. 12, 2010 4:53 p.m.

    Illegals have no say in the policy of this state, none. Come legally, become a citizen, then you have a say. Until then, be quiet and please leave, and stop this silly pretense that someone this country (or state) is mistreating you. Be grateful you aren't in jail.

  • md
    Aug. 12, 2010 4:53 p.m.

    Introduce the bill and make it stronger. 1 in 8 babies in this country are born to illegals! Get them out of here!!

  • Hunt
    Aug. 12, 2010 4:53 p.m.

    @LDS | 4:07 p.m.

    First, Mark Willes does not represent the Church. Due to the 12th Article of Faith, you will NEVER hear the church come out in favor of illegal immigration.

    Second, every single person desiring to work in the United States of America must provide a Social Security number.

    Illegals do not have Social Security numbers, therefore they must either steal one (identity theft) or make one up (fraud), both a felony.
    Because a felony does not equate to a speeding ticket Mark Willes conveniently left that point out.

    Mark Willes editorial is just another example of purposefully misrepresenting the very serious and costly issues involved with illegals being here.

  • dferg
    Aug. 12, 2010 4:46 p.m.

    @dave4197 | 3:16 p.m. Aug. 12, 2010:
    "...these neighbors from our own continent should be more easily able to participate in our opulent economy". Our "OPULENT" economy?! Have you not been watching or reading the news for the past couple of years, Dave? Do you live in a cave, completely self-sustaining and haven't had to come out in quite some time? Our economy is a SHAMBLES, sir; it is nowhere even remotely CLOSE to being "opulent".

    Unemployment is the highest it's been since the Carter years (and climbing), with no relief in sight through 2011 - even in the (reluctant) opinion of our current administration; the same applies to this recession we're in - again, no relief in sight; Congress spending like drunken sailors (except drunken sailors are spending their OWN money); etc., etc., etc.

    So again, I ask you to elucidate if you would please, as to what opulence you are referring to.

  • Morgan Duel
    Aug. 12, 2010 4:43 p.m.

    "Congress, not the Utah Legislature, should address immigration reform if long-lasting solutions are to be found."

    Problem, we have a Congress and Executive Branch that are looking the other way. They do not want to offend. But the Public is offended every day by the misuse of Tax Money

    I am tired of this argument if the Fed would enforce the States would not have to.

  • Chris B
    Aug. 12, 2010 4:41 p.m.


    Besides get some of the criminal illegal aliens out of this country. Just that one little thing though

  • eenymeenymyneechic
    Aug. 12, 2010 4:38 p.m.

    "The only tensions being stirred in Utah are being created by the actions of law breaking illegals who have no right to be here at all."

    Mr. Yapias needs to get a clue and stop stirring up the tension. The legals are welcomed but the immigration issue is politically based.

    Since when do the "illegals" have the right to stir up trouble for those of us who honor and obey the laws? Those who are illegal and LDS are in conflict with the 12th article of faith.

    Yapias has no business trying to strong arm and make the Church the bad guys. Where does it state that the Church supports the kind of thing he is doing? Saying it will cause the Church problems is out of line.
    Sandstrom's proposal is what UTAH needs to correct the problems that Arizona has. If someone is illegal, they need to fess up and do their attempt to be in the U.S. legally.

    Halting the bill only prolongs what needs to be addressed and now.

  • Utah Dem
    Aug. 12, 2010 4:35 p.m.

    Hunt - are you implying that Tony Yapias is LDS?

    dave4197 - why is this a bad bill?

    I believe the hate and hostility is because some people that support illegal immigrants are fighting for some imaginary rights they think these people have. Why does Archuleta and Yapias believe that laws of the US should not be obeyed?

  • Humm??
    Aug. 12, 2010 4:25 p.m.

    Sorry. I got the wrong Archie.

  • TJ Banks
    Aug. 12, 2010 4:21 p.m.

    Just to clarify, Joseph Smith was talking about legal citizens of his time, not illegal ones. Archuleta should have stayed out of this one. La Raza finished it's work in Calif. and look at Calif. Definitely on the downslide. La Raza has done a lot of work in Arizona and is now working it in Utah. These laws do work..but this trend of illegals is probably going to continue. If politicians weren't so worried about getting re-elected and had some backbone, some solutions might be able to be worked out. It's happening and there is no stopping it.

  • LDS
    Aug. 12, 2010 4:07 p.m.

    Our church has spoken clearly:Mark Willes, President and CEO of Deseret Management Corporation 8/8/10: “Some argue it is a simple matter of obeying the law. Those who are here "illegally" should be sent "home." Legally, living here without proper documents is an infraction on a par with driving five miles over the speed limit.”

    The argument that undocumented immigrants are criminals is false. They are a lot like you and me. Except they are refugees from a land of little promise fleeing to a promised land. Just like our forefathers.

    All LDS members should read and follow the Brethren's counsel in this and all matters.

  • Wendyusa
    Aug. 12, 2010 4:01 p.m.

    I'm not racist against anyone, or any race. I took 4 years of Spanish to learn how to live with the latinos in my neighborhood/school/church/city etc.

    I am an American. I abide by the law to the best of my ability. If I were to go live in another country with my family we would do so with honor: get visa, or citizenship and honor the laws of the new country I lived in at the time.

    Why are so many illegals from Mexico leaving their country? Don't they need to stay there and fix what is wrong there before coming here and making our lives harder. What about making Mexico the 51st state of the Union. Wouldn't that solve a lot of problems. They all seem to want to be Americans by coming here and yet they themselves chose to hide in the attics of the "modern day Underground Railroad". They were not forced there by "White Man" or the LDS Church. Leaders of Latino groups should teach their followers what needs to be done to be legal--not what needs to be done to be illegal. -Es Bien? No?

  • CWEB
    Aug. 12, 2010 3:57 p.m.

    The "problem" is that our Federal Government, and our State Government has welcomed and encouraged these people to come for many years. The Feds handed out Tax numbers like candy.

    Now, we are going to turn on people that have been our neighbors and friends for years, and leave them with no home, no job and no family.

    All of you nay-sayers would do the same thing had God placed you in their homes instead of yours...

    What are you all afraid of? Force the Fed Government to Repair our immigration system! Don't take it out on businesses that needed the employees, or the people that followed the enticements to come here...illegally (wink and nod by our elected officials)

    Sandstrom is another rich guy who has no feeling or knowledge of what these people have been through.

    All he wants is to have them he can go back to his AFRICAN hunting and his golf club. No compassion from this man!

  • Be Practical
    Aug. 12, 2010 3:47 p.m.

    "We support a federal approach to immigration because that's the constitutional way," Archuleta said.

    And what approach would that be; do nothing and allow unfettered access to our health care and educational systems at taxpayers' expense? Sit idly by as hundreds of illegals cross our borders each day? I think most illegals would agree with you-the federal approach is a great approach!

  • LuVePacifica
    Aug. 12, 2010 3:46 p.m.

    I love how this is working out..
    For Im half mexican born American citizen-

    plain and simple-Learn English- Dont abuse United states currency or foodstamps stop using welfare $$
    please Use a real ID none of that fake insurance

  • JayTee
    Aug. 12, 2010 3:43 p.m.

    And this is NEWS? What in the world did you think the Mexicans were going to say . . . that they love the bill that restricts invaders? That will happen about as soon as you see them turning down Medicaid, food stamps, housing subsidies, demands for English-2nd-Language instuction, multi-lingual public documents, free school lunches, and all the rest. In other words, don't hold your breath for actual NEWS in this arena.

  • Hunt
    Aug. 12, 2010 3:41 p.m.

    Archuleta's group La Raza (The Race) is a racist group and within the article they claim to represent the Brown Berets, another racist group.

    Since Mr. Yapias likes to drag the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints name into the controversy every chance he gets, we need to make sure he is forced to answer why he continue's to aid and abet illegals in circumventing and breaking the law when taking into account the 12th Article of Faith.
    Mr. Yapias should be encouraging illegals to stop stealing the identity of innocent citizens, in many cases children, and to go back from where they came so that they can become legal residents.

    I have heard him asked by radio talk show hosts how he justifies not adhering to the 12th article of faith in dealing with the illegal community. He does a good job of stumbling all over himself in an attempt to not answer the question.

  • ouisc
    Aug. 12, 2010 3:20 p.m.

    Wow. Yapias throws in the LDS reputation into the mix, while Jose Gutierrez implies we are talking about ALL immigrants. Who exactly is fueling this fire?

  • One American
    Aug. 12, 2010 3:17 p.m.

    "Archuleta said Sandstrom's bill is one in a long string that targets illegal immigrants by making it harder to find jobs, impossible to get drivers' licenses and welfare, and tougher to enter schools."

    YES! That is the point! If you are here illegally you don't deserve a job, or a drivers license and you and your children do not belong in our schools. This is no "hate crime". It is the way it is. It is the law.

    "What else is left?" he asked. "Are we going to be hiding undocumented men, women and children in our attics and in our cellars? Is this reminiscent and does it remind you of something?"

    What else is left??? Go home to your own country!

    This is not about race. This is about being in the United States illegally. It just doesn't get any simpler than that.

  • dave4197
    Aug. 12, 2010 3:16 p.m.

    It's a very bad bill, dump it.
    Bottom line, these neighbors from our own continent should be more easily able to participate in our opulent economy. Utah's legislature should be more mature, challenge the feds to allow easier immigration, and stand up to the rowdy tea partiers who hate people who look and talk different than they do.
    If Sandstrom is LDS, like I've read that the AZ perpetrator of 1070 is, they've certainly missed the message. Anybody who dwells on enforcing this bad law so blindly has failed to listen to many other teachings about how to treat your fellowmen.

  • ouisc
    Aug. 12, 2010 3:14 p.m.

    Sandstrom has nailed it! As long as leaders like Archuleta and Yapias continue to condone illegal immigration and continue to help illegal immigrants survive in this country with illegal identification, any opinion of Archuleta and Yapias is MEANINGLESS. They are very much part of the problem. Once they condemn illegal immigration, I'd be interested to hear what ideas they may have.

  • LuVePacifica
    Aug. 12, 2010 3:13 p.m.

    Its all about the Family Heritage of-my Ancestors

    Yes For those that just use Americans Health and welfare they need to go back to thier own Country and have thier own family living..yes learn to speak more english)

  • mammalou
    Aug. 12, 2010 3:12 p.m.

    I agree with Hoosier.....sounds like the statements againts the church are a threat.

    Thank you Mr. Sandstrom for representing me -- and those who vote for you (yup -- that is a citizens privilege)by not giving in to the wishes of lawbreakers. Hope the rest of the elected can follow in your footsteps!

    And thanks also for remember that there is a seperation of church and state -- you are representing you state, not the church (although I'm not sure that the church has come out and taken a side).

  • One American
    Aug. 12, 2010 3:10 p.m.

    "Archuleta said Sandstrom's bill is one in a long string that targets illegal immigrants by making it harder to find jobs, impossible to get drivers' licenses and welfare, and tougher to enter schools."

    YES! That is the point! If you are here illegally you don't deserve a job, or a drivers license and you and your children do not belong in our schools. This is no "hate crime". It is the way it is. It is the law.

    "What else is left?" he asked. "Are we going to be hiding undocumented men, women and children in our attics and in our cellars? Is this reminiscent and does it remind you of something?"

    What else is left??? GO HOME to your own country!

    This is NOT about race. This is about being in the United States illegally. It just doesn't get any simpler than that.

  • Legal
    Aug. 12, 2010 3:09 p.m.

    I am of Mexican origin. I lived and went to school in Mexico as a child. But I am a legal U.S. citizen. I fly the U.S. flag at my house and NEVER fly the Mexican flag. I cheer for the U.S. soccer team when they play Mexico. I am not the only one of my kind ... perhaps the difference is that I am legal. Most of us that are here legally are SICK of the illegals. Based on statistics, I don't blame anyone for feeling the way they do about illegals. I'd be more than happy to carry my ID and show it 10 times a day if that would help curtail the influx of illegals. Yapias doesn't speak for me.

  • Not_Scared
    Aug. 12, 2010 3:06 p.m.

    I live in California and I haven't see La Raza since the early seventies. Did they move to Utah?

    "In a May 2006 Lou Dobbs Tonight report on then Mexican President Vicente Fox's visit to Salt Lake City. In that report, correspondent Casey Wian characterized Fox's trip as a "Mexican military incursion," and claimed that "[y]ou could call" Fox's trip to the United States "the Vicente Fox Aztlan tour." During the report, CNN featured a graphic of "Aztlan" that was sourced to the Council of Conservative Citizens (CCC) -- an organization linked to white supremacists.."

    We know racism has nothing to do with this.

  • 3grandslams
    Aug. 12, 2010 3:03 p.m.

    I would think the Latino community, the sincere side, would recognize the importance of law and be willing to come to the table to help work this problem out. So far it seems to be they are ignoring the laws of the country they live in and want an unmolested free ride.

    It would go a long way if the Latino community would help police themselves rather than be defiant.

  • lifeOnEarth
    Aug. 12, 2010 2:56 p.m.

    can of worms

  • donburi
    Aug. 12, 2010 2:47 p.m.

    "Archuleta said Sandstrom's bill is one in a long string that targets illegal immigrants by making it harder to find jobs, impossible to get drivers' licenses and welfare, and tougher to enter schools."

    Um well yeah, that's the point - illegal immigrants should not have jobs, drivers' licenses, welfare, or schools here.

    I can't read people's minds, but it's comments like this that make it pretty clear to me that those who oppose the bill are really pro-illegal. All complaints about profiling and community problems are just a smoke screen.

  • WinSum
    Aug. 12, 2010 2:45 p.m.

    Am I missing something....? If you are here "legally", then what's the fuss????

    If you are not here legally, then why not get yourself legal status by "exposing yourself" to the process?
    Is this really a difficult concept???

    Good grief, I travel in Mexico and guess what....? I have to have the appropriate papers......gee golly oh land a mighty.....and I can choose....from the following difficult, but politically correct, options:
    #1. Stop traveling in Mexico
    #2. Obey the laws
    33. Consider complaining to the Federalies and see if that helps.......

    Why is this so tough.....?

  • donburi
    Aug. 12, 2010 2:41 p.m.


    Funny. Just because a bill's author happens to be a certain religion does not mean that religion is fully invested. It's just states trying to protect themselves.

  • CJ
    Aug. 12, 2010 2:39 p.m.


    So you think that anyone who wants the law enforced is a "political extremist"? Next time your house is being robbed you can call 911 and say "this is a political extremist requesting help". Unbelievable.
    You also "want the church to take a stand now"? Does that mean they want us to start obeying the 12th article of faith or is the stand going to be that there are now only 12 articles of faith? You can't have it both ways.If church members in East Germany were required to obey a communist government then the members from Mexico should be required to obey the laws of the U.S.

  • Richie
    Aug. 12, 2010 2:37 p.m.

    Learn the ENGLISH language, use it at all times, stay off welfare or go home.

  • jimhale
    Aug. 12, 2010 2:30 p.m.

    Rolly is right. Joseph Smith was right then. The Fourteenth amendment was right later.

    Sandstrom (sounds like Strom Thurmond) may please his constituents in the short run.

    But his bill will ultimately embarrass the LDS Church in much of the nation, throughout the U.S. Latino community, and all over Latin America.

    Please tell me the man is not LDS. He is embarrassing me already.

  • Flaming Liberal
    Aug. 12, 2010 2:27 p.m.

    Um, no.

  • lifeOnEarth
    Aug. 12, 2010 2:25 p.m.

    They do pay taxes and buy houses nit all are crimnals not all are illegal.Cant wait to hear the end of this can of string beans

  • CJ
    Aug. 12, 2010 2:23 p.m.

    Rep Sandstrom is absolutely right, his bill is doing what the majority of Utahns want, strong enforcement and no amnesty of any type. I have a lot of legal Hispanic friends and they all tell me that Tony Yapias in no way represents them and they are as tired of him and his nonsense as all the rest of us are.
    The only tensions being stirred in Utah are being created by the actions of law breaking illegals who have no right to be here at all. Legal Hispanics and the rest of the community have a great relationship, I count many of them as friends.
    Race baiting on the part of Yapias, et al, is the problem, not the desire of the people of Utah to rightfully ask that the laws of the state be enforced. His assertion that the church needs to cave into the demands of such groups and go against the its own 12th article of faith are outrageous and off the wall.
    The church has asked for civility but that should not be viewed as a request for a blanket for every drug dealing criminal from Mexico who shows up here.

  • jsf
    Aug. 12, 2010 2:18 p.m.

    Besides Proyecto Latino and La Raza, Archuleta said he and Yapias were speaking on behalf of several other groups such as Centro Civico Mexicano, the Utah Hispanic Coalition, the Mexican Federation of Clubs, Casa del Pueblo, the Brown Berets and others. Why would these two men claim to speak for the Brown Berets who are as racist as the Aryan Nations. I hope this is a missprint by the DN.

  • Hellooo
    Aug. 12, 2010 2:16 p.m.

    Mr. Sandstrom is right to present the bill. Lets see if it ever gets to a vote in the legislature. Certainly, Mr. Yapais and Mr. Archuleta are to be commended for their efforts to voice the opinions of their groups. Mr. Archuleta's association with LaRaza. And, I am sorry to hear the religion card being played as it is an effort to stop discussion as opposed to finding a viable solution.

  • Hallsy
    Aug. 12, 2010 2:16 p.m.

    I bet if we asked Latinos to halt illegal immigration it would fall on deaf ears. Push the bill through Sandstrom. These complainers have no interest in what is best for America.

  • manateeshirt
    Aug. 12, 2010 2:15 p.m.

    Illegal is illegal.

    If I do something illegal, such as intentionally burn down my neighbors house because his dog keeps restrooming on my lawn, I am punished.

    BECAUSE it is the law. The law is what protects us and KEEPS us free.

    Cracks me up that he busted out the "brother/sister" card. Its got to go both ways. If these illegals viewed me as their brother/sister they wouldn't sneak into my country illegally and break the law.

  • Fitness Freak
    Aug. 12, 2010 2:11 p.m.

    Not surprised!

    Illegal alien trespassers PROBABLY ARE hopeful that they won't get caught, just like any other criminal holds out hope that he won't get caught!

  • CaseyA
    Aug. 12, 2010 2:06 p.m.

    A couple of thoughts:

    The response to the use of a "carrot and stick" metaphor seems contrived. Stop looking for other reasons to become angry. If it is not contrived, there is a serious cultural gap and someone from the dominant culture should be helping those representatives from La Raza etc. to communicate to those of the dominant culture.

    The connection between the LDS Church and the two "immigration bills" (the one in Utah and the one in Arizona) is troubling. The Mormon Church is clearly not taking this stance, why are the members so fully invested in these measures? I think the membership of the Mormon Church is being co-opted and led away by political extremists. The brethren need to take a stand now to protect the membership from these wolves in sheeps clothing.

  • pierre123
    Aug. 12, 2010 2:05 p.m.

    First off, i will never take anyone from La Raza seriously. They are a racist organization. Second, why is that states cant protect themselves from illegal immigration? They want immigration reform to come from the federal government because they know nothing will happen. The reason states are touching the immigration issue is because of the failure of the federal government to enforce the LAW. Why is it that illegal immigrants have more rights then american citizens? get used to it illegal's because the majority of america is sick of paying for you to leach of the tax paying, legal residents of this country. Virgina, Florida, Arizon, Utah and soon many more states will be passing the same style immigration reform.

  • Hoosier in Utah
    Aug. 12, 2010 2:00 p.m.

    "We are opposed to state, chaotic laws that try to usurp the strength of the federal government."

    It's the weakness of the federal government--and the cowardice of the party in power due to their debt to a large constituency--that has the states taking the matter into their own hands.

    "Are we going to be hiding undocumented men, women and children in our attics and in our cellars?"

    If you are, the you are breaking the law also. We aren't sending them to concentration camps, just back to where they belong (admittedly not much better in some cases).

    The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints has suffered image damage among some Hispanics nationally because the author of the Arizona bill, state Sen. Russell Pearce, is a Mormon. Yapias said if Sandstrom, who also is a member of the LDS Church, pushes his bill, it will cause even more harm for the church among Latinos.

    That sounds like a threat.

    Bottom line, don't be here illegally when the unemployment rate is so high. Lawmakers have a responsibility to protect the interests of law-abiding citizens.

  • LuVePacifica
    Aug. 12, 2010 1:52 p.m.

    Problems for the state..
    Stiring the Kettle for Mexican/Americans
    And those who were Born Here..

  • fire_rooster
    Aug. 12, 2010 1:52 p.m.

    "A little LDS history here It appears LDS Church founder Joseph Smith was against states making immigration policy instead of the federal government.

    Smith wrote in a letter to J.C. Calhoun in 1844: “Oh ye people who groan under the oppression of tyrants ... ye poor and unfortunate among all nations, come to the ‘asylum of the oppressed’ ... but remember a ‘sovereign state!’ is so much more powerful than the United States, the parent government, that it can exile you at pleasure, mob you with impunity... and have the legislature sanction it”

    He was lamenting the ability of states to do anything they wanted to an unwanted group of people – at that time the Mormons – and the federal government was too impotent to prevent such discrimination.

    Smith, at the time, was pushing Congress to pass a law that would overturn the 1833 U.S. Supreme Court decision, Barron v. Baltimore, which held that the protections to citizens provided by the U.S. Constitution’s Bill of Rights did not apply to state governments. That was changed by the Equal Protection Clause of the 14th Amendment in 1868."


  • Oh Please
    Aug. 12, 2010 1:46 p.m.

    "Hey, Boy. Stop where you are. Your pants are a little low there. Show me your papers. Don't have em with you, eh?"