At least 2 state employees compiled immigrant list, Gov. Gary Herbert says

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  • Klaxton
    July 21, 2010 11:59 p.m.

    I have a suggestion to smooth out this debate. All of those who support illegal immigration and their integration into society will you please publish your social security number and birthday so the immigrants can use and abuse your information and credit. I think this will help calm the fears of those of us that would NOT like our personal information stolen and used illegally.

    And then, when that problem is solved, we can all calmly discuss how to handle the current 11 million illegals and the millions more that are coming.

    (That is of course, unless you're simply saying it's ok for illegals to steal long as it's not yours :)

  • A Guy With A Brain
    July 20, 2010 6:04 p.m.


    I dunno, but with all the illegal immigration problems we have today, seems like the chant should be "Give them a medal! Give them a medal! Give them a medal!"....

  • Pagan
    July 20, 2010 3:24 p.m.

    If you break the law, to enforce the law, you became what you fight against.

  • Pagan
    July 20, 2010 3:24 p.m.

    If you break the law, to enforce the law, you became what you fight against.

  • MapleDon
    July 20, 2010 8:45 a.m.

    These employees need our compassion. They're fellow citizens. They have families. They serve in our communities, take jobs most of us don't want, pay taxes, attend church with us.

    Compassion, brothers and sisters. Compassion.

  • JBrady
    July 19, 2010 2:19 a.m.

    Why should people here illegally get to be the only ones who break our laws?

    If we prosecute criminals the majority want, we would not have this problem.

    Do we have a secret society among us that attempts to circumvent our constitution through non enforcement of certain laws?

  • Bubble
    July 19, 2010 12:21 a.m.

    @ SLars: Are you suggesting we should only prosecute criminals if the majority wants them prosecuted?

    Those of us who are truly tired of dishonesty are tired of it all forms - including from those who compiled the list.

    Why is one form of dishonesty okay but not another form? Who gets to decide?

    Those of you who support what these state employees did, have no moral ground to stand on in the debate against illegality.

    Why should immigrants respect our laws when we don't?

  • SLars
    July 18, 2010 11:54 p.m.

    From KUTV, 66% of people polled do not want them prosecuted.

    Are people tired of the dishonesty of some of our leaders?

  • Carson
    July 18, 2010 7:11 p.m.

    Let's unite and stand up for these State Employees. Just how much longer are we going to let our elected officials give Illegals the key to this state, while honest Americans continue to pay their bills. Study those in, or running for the state legislature. Vote out anyone who favors the Illegals over Americans. A Revolution is brewing just under the surface, nationwide!

  • Carson
    July 18, 2010 7:05 p.m.

    Let's unite and stand up for these State Employees. Just how much longer are we going to let our elected officials give Illegals the key to this state, while honest Americans continue to pay their bills. Study those in, or running for the state legislature. Vote out anyone who favors the Illegals over Americans. A Revolution is brewing just under the surface, nationwide!

  • Say No to BO
    July 18, 2010 7:28 a.m.

    The newspaper needs to do some digging here.
    In 1987 the feds established a program for verifying eligibility called Systematic Alien Verification for Entitlements (SAVE).
    Is Utah using that database?
    Have the clerks been properly trained?

    There is some evidence, based on news stories in the past few weeks that illegal aliens were receiving benefits from state agencies.

    Methinks Herbert is playing politics here rather than tending to the business of the state.

  • wrz
    July 17, 2010 11:11 p.m.

    "The governor said releasing information from the databases is a violation of federal law..."

    I that case, governor, why are you concerning yourself? Have you not been listening to Obama and his AG, Eric Holder? They tell us that investigating federal law-breaking is the responsibility of the federal government. And that states should not be enacting piece-meal laws on issues that duplicate and infringe on federal law.
    So, get with the program, governor. Stop harassing state employees, lest they sue you for such conduct.

  • wrz
    July 17, 2010 10:54 p.m.

    @Gary 11:59 a.m.:

    "The illegals are only working at jobs that no one else wants to do."

    The reason no one else wants those jobs that illegals are taking is becasue illegals will do the jobs for less wages. They bid wages down so low that no American can afford it. Then they live five families in a house so they can subsist on the low wages they've created.

  • wrz
    July 17, 2010 10:36 p.m.

    @patriotandmore 11:32 a.m.:

    "Throw out all the spineless politicians..."

    Herbert has seen my last vote for him.

  • wrz
    July 17, 2010 10:29 p.m.

    I couldn't believe my eyes when I read this article. People being prosecuted because they identified potential illegal action?

    That's like suing a cop for exceeding the speed limits while trying to catch a speeding law breaker on the freeway.

  • wrz
    July 17, 2010 10:22 p.m.

    @chris8484 10:56 a.m.:

    "Why does the state have a list of illegal aliens who are using food stamps and do nothing about this information?"

    Apparently because illegal immigrants are now running our country.

    "The problem seems to lie with Gov. Herbert and state officials who protect illegals, not with the whistle-blowers."

    Correct, The governor should be sued for failing to examine the data base and take legal action against illegals. But alas, illegals seem to be untouchable.

  • SLars
    July 17, 2010 8:28 p.m.

    It's unfair and dishonest to prosecute one side and not the other. We have been told by our attorney general that those illegally on the list will not be prosecuted. Therefore both sides should not be. Both committed misdemeanors and felonies. (being in the country illegally and working is a felony).

    Contact your state leaders, the governor, state representatives, senators, Federal congressmen and tell them exactly how you feel. If they are not going to enforce the immigration laws on the books, then be fair and not enforce the laws for anyone. Even the whistle blowers that turn them in.

  • barbwyre
    July 17, 2010 8:02 p.m.

    At least 99.5% of you have confidential information in a state, federal, or private database. (Your social security number, credit card numbers, driver license number, criminal history, medical history, etc.) How would you feel if someone with access to that information made it public?

    Will deporting everyone on the list solve all our problems? Will this pointless arguing solve anything?

    To those of you of the Christian faith; show me the part in the Bible where it says you don't have to have compassion on people who are not legally in a country's borders. I'll sit here and idly drum my fingers while you try and find it.

  • Moderate
    July 17, 2010 6:12 p.m.

    This is good news. I have a couple of friends looking for work, and it sounds like at least two positions are going to open up at DWS soon.

  • ST
    July 17, 2010 5:00 p.m.

    Give them a promotion and a raise for trying to get the state government and police to do their jobs!!!!

  • Moderate
    July 17, 2010 4:18 p.m.

    This is good news. I have a couple of friends looking for work, and it sounds like at least two positions are going to open up at DWS soon.

  • CJ
    July 17, 2010 3:35 p.m.

    As a Republican I was going to support Herbert and even put up a sign in my yard for him. That was until I realized that he is full blown amnesty hack just like his opponent. If I can't find a better alternative I will just avoid that race, I can no longer support Herbert and hope other Republicans feel the same way. He is another Bob Bennett/Chris Cannon. This ridiculous panel of his is nothing more that a bunch of his fellow amnesty hacks getting together to give him a green light to aid and abet illegals.

  • patriotandmore
    July 17, 2010 3:10 p.m.

    In a land where justice is outlawed, the just must become outlaws. -Zorro

  • CB
    July 17, 2010 12:26 p.m.

    Anyone notice how adamant the Pres. of Mexico was about maintaining the status quo for the borders. While many are here working, a great deal of the money they are making is going back into Mexico. With access to food banks, free medical care, food stamps, etc., etc., they can live just fine as long as our government allows them to. Cut benefits, that will cut the flow of money to Mexico, putting pressure on the corrupt Mexican government to provide for their own.

  • WakeUp
    July 17, 2010 11:39 a.m.

    Give me a break, people come into this country illegally and recieve benifits illegally and the people who identified many of them are in trouble....seems like a case of whistle blowing to me and they should be protected under the law as such. If you are illegal no state or federal money should be wasted on you or your relatives born here.

  • JayTee
    July 17, 2010 11:32 a.m.

    As a comparison, instead of wondering if Mel Gibson beat up his girlfriend and threatened her life, let's get all hung up on who released the tapes of his telephone rants.

    Better yet, let's fire some politicians and elect some independents or some people who understand that we're going to have to make some drastic changes if we're going to keep what we have in our nation and our society. Running a campaign and getting elected to public office OBVIOUSLY doesn't make someone either a hero or a genius. Someday maybe we'll wake up and realize we need people with some backbone and some functional intelligence to make the crucial decisions that affect us all.

  • facts_r_stubborn
    July 17, 2010 10:49 a.m.


    We also still have drugs, organized and white collar criminals. We have many people who are not illegal immigrants who do not pay their taxes, costing all of us who do pay taxes much more. We have people who do not have health insurance who cost the rest of us much more in premiums to cover the free care they get in hospital emergency rooms. We have energy problems and a shrinking middle class, partly due to the exponentially rising costs of health care. We have people who do not care for their health, who do not exercise and do not eat healthy. We have national defense, education and energy problems. And yes, we have a significant problem in illegal immigration, primarily from countries that lack political and economic freedom. They export their problems to us, but fail to take care of them at home.

    Having said all that, what are we doing about it? Don't be a single issue person. We have many problems, and they all take knowledge, wisdom and hard work to solve. None of them may be completely eliminated in our lifetimes, including illegal immigration. Let's do our best.

  • TLJ
    July 17, 2010 10:21 a.m.

    I really do not understand, with our economy the way it is nobody can find work, people who belong in this country (legal citizens) are loosing their homes, yet we continue to pay for people who are NOT legal US citizens, who do NOT contribute to our community who continue to "use" us and our system which was designed to help the US citizens of our country. Take away all the freebes we are giving to illigals and I bet the problem will resolve itself!
    So frustrating...

  • CJ
    July 17, 2010 9:47 a.m.

    To Gella:

    The KKK? really??? What does La Raza ( the race ) remind you of?

  • Dektol
    July 17, 2010 9:40 a.m.

    Give these employees a BONUS CHECK for having the guts to do what needs to be done. Knowledge of possible illegal activity should be reported. Prosecute all in the chain of "law enforcement" who have failed to go after these illegals. They are criminals.
    Why are the agencies not sharing all the information they have about every illegal alien in the State and Country?

  • dumbo123
    July 17, 2010 9:29 a.m.

    The employees who released the list of lawbreaking Illegal immigrants were both breve and patriotic. If their actions would cause the government to do their job and enforce our Immigration laws then their courage and sacrifice will have benefited all the citizens of Utah. Illegal immigrants damage our country. Remember Illegal Immigration = Identity Theft! You could well be one of the millions of victims. Identity theft by Illegal immigrants is a rampant and on going epidemic of massive proportions in America. Also remember that the open border promoting drug cartels use Illegal Immigrants by the thousands to cultivate, smuggle, transport and distribute huge amounts of life destroying drugs to Americas unfortunate victims. It could be your son or your daughter who is the next target of the open border drug pushers. This a serious problem. Don't end up the victim. Stop Illegal immigration before it is too late.

  • facts_r_stubborn
    July 17, 2010 9:24 a.m.

    Clearly the vast majority of Utahns should now see fringe groups like the minutemen for what they are. They do not support honoring and obeying the law. They are mean and vile people who have only one focus in life, and to whom the their own ends always justify any means.

    They spread false information, demagoguery and ungrounded assertions like it was air, and now we know they also support breaking the law to achieve their ends.

    The true minutemen are our men and women in uniform, the armed services, national guard and both state and federal law enforcement personnel. They are the ones who as a group deserve our appreciation and support.

    The cowardly individuals who broke the law to produce this list are no patriots and should receive the harshest penalty allowed by the law. Those who support this illegal activity, should have no place in civic discussion. They should be marginalized an shunned as the angry irrational voices they truly are. They add absolutely nothing to our nation and our people, and poison the waters of political discourse. Much worse, they now support criminal activity to achieve their selfish ends.

  • Be fair
    July 17, 2010 9:24 a.m.

    There seems to be confusion about the definition of a "whistle blower". If a person thinks a government agency is doing things illegally, then that person can become a whistle blower by reporting his/her concerns to appropriate people above that organization. The people who leaked the database information ARE NOT whistle blowers. They did not report their concerns to managers above their department, perhaps to the Governor's office.

    They broke laws to leak information. They broke laws to leak information about others who broke laws. They should be prosecuted for their actions! They are vigilantes who feel the current enforcement of law is inadequate, and they took the law into their own hands and tried to intimidate people into doing what they, the vigilantes, want them to do.

    I agree that emigration laws should be enforced or changed, but I don't think breaking laws to leak information is a proper way for citizens to act. I don't think that using that leaked information to harass and intimidate and threaten others is acceptable in our country! Let our legislators act to improve our laws. Let our police force act to arrest those who leaked the information.

  • Black & White
    July 17, 2010 9:14 a.m.

    ANYONE who defends an illegal act, in the name of Nationalism or Patriotism, is only supporting the premises of Treason.

    There is a legal and systematic way to make changes to laws and ordinances, and stealing information, making up false accusations, and acting as a Vigilante is NOT the way. Although you may believe your methods are just, you are only subscribing to the same methods that you despise.

    While I may not like the fact that there are illegal aliens in our country, it is a fact that I live with everyday, and I will not break a law to show my contempt. Instead, I will support (aka vote for) and defend those who lawfully and legally protest and do something about it.

    In the end, these 2 or 5, and whomever knew about the formation of this list and were in a position to stop it, but did nothing about it, should be fired first, then prosecuted to the full extent of the law.

    "We belive in being subject to kings, presidents, rulers, and magistrates, in obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law". Sounds familiar right? You can't claim to be a honorable citizen, without obeying its laws.

  • thelogicalone
    July 17, 2010 9:02 a.m.

    While I do not support illegal immigration, the fact that people working for the state, took it upon themselves to compile this list sickens me. Those who are old enough to remember McCarthyism should shudder. Those who have been to school need only substitute the word "Mexican" or "illegal" with the word "Jew" or, go back 170 years in your heritage and use the word "Mormon". How do you feel now? It is interesting that those who put together this list want everyone to know who is on it but do so anonymously. Their names should be published along with their addresses and phone numbers, they should lose their jobs and they should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law. Their crimes will number more and have a higher penalty than those who are living here, working here and providing for their families while undocumented.

  • UtahnativeinliberalCA
    July 17, 2010 8:52 a.m.

    Give both of those employees raises. The outpouring of opinions in the comments just illustrate that a problem exists and the exposure touched a lot of nerves.

  • UtahnativeinliberalCA
    July 17, 2010 8:48 a.m.


  • Just Ed
    July 17, 2010 8:16 a.m.

    When we identify ourselves primarily as taxpayers, rather than as American citizens or (gasp) Christians, we begin to see others as simply people who cost us money. Not good.

  • Gregory Johnson
    July 17, 2010 8:10 a.m.

    I guess it depends on who you are if you can violate the laws or not, the illegals violated the law, Wall Street violated the laws, etc. Apparently,these guys are not allowed to.

  • Mike12345
    July 17, 2010 8:07 a.m.

    Deport the Illegals who are on the list. Simple and does not violate the existing Federal Laws.

  • Mike12345
    July 17, 2010 8:04 a.m.

    There are one out of 15 Illegal kids in our schools paid for by tax payer preoperty tax and income taxes. Why are we NOT charging for the Illegal enrollment? The 65,000 Illegal kids cost about $4000 to $11,000 each to educate each year. Wonder why your taxes are so high? There is no other country, that educates foreign nationals at the expense of the taxpayers in that country. Why do we? Want lower taxes, charge for the Illegal kids enrollment like the rest of the world.

  • Mike12345
    July 17, 2010 8:04 a.m.

    There are one out of 15 Illegal kids in our schools paid for by tax payer preoperty tax and income taxes. Why are we NOT charging for the Illegal enrollment? The 65,000 Illegal kids cost about $4000 to $11,000 each to educate each year. Wonder why your taxes are so high? There is no other country, that educates foreign nationals at the expense of the taxpayers in that country. Why do we? Want lower taxes, charge for the Illegal kids enrollment like the rest of the world.

  • Mike12345
    July 17, 2010 8:00 a.m.

    Cudos to those who took the risk to expose the Illegal Aliens Undocumented Immigrants. They send the list in April to the Federal Government. Like the previous 30 years, with the Support of the US Chamber of Commerce (cheap labor), The ACLU (Treating Illegals with US Citizen Civil Rights), and Hispanic Law Firms (sue in Federal Court to force schools to teach English as a Second Language), nothing was done or being done. The Federal Government is NOT doing its job. These people are bleeding us dry (10,200 Households previously receiving Food Stamps before rule change - about 50,000 people, Illegals receiving tax payer supported social services), one out of 15 kids in our school systems receiving a tax payer supported education at the cost of $4000 to $11000 a year. Why are we tolerating 65,000 Illegal kids an education paid for with tax dollars? No other country in the world permits that. Just go there and find out, if you are in a foreign country and enroll your kid in a foreign school, it costs you $8000 a year. Want lower taxes, charge Illegals.

  • cjb
    July 17, 2010 7:53 a.m.

    Some quotes from this article.

    The governor said releasing information from the databases is a violation of federal law, which prohibits the state from turning over the list or any other information in the databases to U.S. immigration authorities. "That's the federal law, and we have to honor it," he said.

    Shurtleff said because the list included the due dates of several pregnant women, those responsible may have violated federal health privacy laws, which would be a felony, not just a misdemeanor, as some violations of state databases could be.

    U.S. Secretary of Labor Hilda Solis said that the dissemination of confidential information contained in the list was "highly disturbing." She also said the U.S. Department of Labor would assist the state in the investigation, if necessary.

    The Most Rev. John C. Wester, bishop of the Catholic Diocese of Utah, said, "The people of Utah are a gracious people and a good people and a moral people. This certainly does not reflect at all what the people of Utah are about."

  • alternate
    July 17, 2010 7:47 a.m.

    I feel bad that Peter tried to make this a political issue. That is frankly disgusting. The Governor handled this very well. Waited until he had some solid facts and then made a very imformative announcement. He didn't go off half cocked finger pointing and throwing mud. Hopefully Peter will take a lesson here.

  • Snack Pack
    July 17, 2010 6:06 a.m.

    Shertliff is a clown. How about you do your job and find out if they are illegal?!

  • Bob Pomeroy
    July 17, 2010 5:59 a.m.

    Prosecutoral discretion is an inviolate part of the power to prosecute.

  • SLars
    July 17, 2010 5:38 a.m.

    It's unfair and dishonest to prosecute one side and not the other. We have been told by our attorney general that those illegally on the list will not be prosecuted. Therefore both sides should not be. Both committed misdemeanors and felonies. (being in the country illegally and working is a felony).

    Contact your state leaders, the governor, state representatives, senators, Federal congressmen and tell them exactly how you feel. If they are not going to enforce the immigration laws on the books, then be fair and not enforce the laws for anyone. Even the whistle blowers that turn them in.

  • My2Cents
    July 17, 2010 4:28 a.m.

    This is totally illegal action by the governor and the prosecutor. By law whistle blowers cannot be prosecuted or revealed. And by the same law the prosecutor and governor have to investigate these names and the list and prosecute those on the list for identity theft. The cover up is illegal and these reported illegal aliens are not exempt from identity theft laws.

    The employee's acted appropriately and with fact and the list cannot be ignored or called a hoax. The employee's should be given a reward and praise for their efforts in exposing this fraud in the DWS. The list is real and true, otherwise all those on it would not be scared in their being revealed. With this kind of accurate information the list has made it very easy to investigate and deport all the illegal aliens on the list. The only compromise of information is that 1300 americans have had their identity stolen and the state is not doing anything about it.

    This list is most likely accurate and I have a right to know if an illegal alien is using my SSN.

  • Truth and Light
    July 17, 2010 4:25 a.m.

    Prior to Orange County being built, the "illegal" members had to go to LA. They couldn't go on the regular trip to San Diego because of the risk of being caught at the road blocks. Why won't they just respect the law?

    They are not "immigrants". They don't want to stay here permanently. They just want to take advanatage of a bad situation and ultimately return to the village as heros.

  • JBrady
    July 17, 2010 3:20 a.m.

    It's interesting to see the actions of those who are against our enforcing criminal activity dealing with our immigration laws, when they become the victims.

    "Herbert said there are only two databases where information could be accessed about illegal immigrants"

    So we know the list was mostly correct.

    "But Shurtleff said his office does not plan to do anything with the supposed "illegal immigrants" on the list."

    And the resentment builds, the lack of trust increases, and we lose any transparency about immigration. Our leaders in my opinion are beyond dishonest. We can't call the Federal government, we can't call the state. Who do we call?

  • BostonTerry
    July 17, 2010 2:31 a.m.

    WWJD- pay for the illegals out of your own pocket then. We cannot afford everyone. In SO CAL teens cannot get jobs to save for college because the illegals have them. When I was laid off I couldn't get a low paying job to make ends meet in MA- because of illegals. My sister applies to every job she can in AZ, even though the pay is so low because of illegals, and she still doesn't get the job because there are so many illegals in the system. Why don't the unions stand up against illegals because they bring the price of labor so cheap?

  • BostonTerry
    July 17, 2010 1:59 a.m.

    Deport the illegals and change the federal/state laws. It's okay for us to know who's in our country illegally. The privacy laws on the illegals is just wrong. Whistle blowers are protected by many laws in our land. The citizens will be heard eventually- even if it has to be at the ballot box.

  • fairfield
    July 16, 2010 10:28 p.m.

    The illegal actions of the government workers was so so so much worse than that of the undocumented residences in our community.

    The reason the system is broken is that we need the cheap labor to enjoy our cheap food and life-style. We are all being so hypocritical in blaming the immigrants. We -- all of us who buy food and services -- need the cheap labor that they are willing to do. They, like our ancestors, are willing to start at the bottom and work up.

    In the process, our laws create loopholes that immigrant workers who take a chance can get through. Most illegal immigrants CAME HERE LEGALLY, but overstayed visas because they have citizen children -- take a chance for a few years, and then you are a citizen.

    The undocumented are working hard for all of us -- their crime is a misdemeanor. The government workers committed numerous felonies. There's a difference

  • Solomon
    July 16, 2010 10:02 p.m.


    "You say the list could never be used in any prosecution. So... throw the list away and then have an authorized employee run the same query. Now you have a list you could use."

    Except it is against federal law. People have the right to know that their information is private and not be used for such purposes. American citizens shouldn't have to afraid that they will end up on a list and have to prove citizenship or risk deportation since Americans have been deported in the past.

    People who can barely afford to buy food for their family shouldn't have to pay attorney's to obtain copies of their birth certificates and prove citizenship when they are citizens. Its called due process

    "If these numb-skulls could write a query to find them, I would guess any IT person at the state could reproduce the same list at will."

    That's not what they did. They went in multiple times and went through information and manually compiled the list and I can guarantee you that those whose information they accessed included American citizens whose information they didn't have authorization or a purpose accessing.

  • Esquire
    July 16, 2010 9:08 p.m.

    The actions of these employees is reprehensible and reminiscent of the old Soviet Union. Prosecute these state employees who violated their trust, fire them and show that America is not a totalitarian state where we secretly spies on each other. If this is what conservatism represents, I'll fight it with all my might, because I believe in a higher law, not totalitarian principles. And, everyone attacks the aliens. How about a look at all the Utah employers who are giving them jobs? They are creating the demand for cheap labor. People want the law enforced. Prosecute the business community. Prosecute the state employees who violated the law. Do we have a double standard? This whole affair is embarrassing for Utah and disgusting.

  • Solomon
    July 16, 2010 9:08 p.m.


    "This group did what they were suppose to do. They turned the list into ICE as "possible" illegally here. All within Federal law."

    It's against federal law to release information of this nature in these databases to immigration authorities. These people shouldn't be accessing the information except when their job requires it and they should only be accessing it for purpose of their job and nothing else.

    My information is private and not to be looked through by individual voters looking to advance their personal political agenda.

    "When the Federal government refused to follow there own laws, they followed the whistle blower laws and resubmitted them to multiple agencies and media."

    Which is AGAINST THE LAW. It's a crime to access information containing personal information for a personal purpose.

    "Do you think it's possible they ran this through lawyers first?"

    As an attorney I would have told them that they were breaking the law.

    "Do your job Shurtleff. Your office is in the spotlight now. There is no way out of this one."

    Which is to prosecute those who access government databases illegally for their own use including advancing their own votes.

  • SLars
    July 16, 2010 8:22 p.m.

    This group did what they were suppose to do. They turned the list into ICE as "possible" illegally here. All within Federal law.

    When the Federal government refused to follow there own laws, they followed the whistle blower laws and resubmitted them to multiple agencies and media.

    If they are able to use the whistle blower offense, it's not amnesty. It's a Federal law to prevent prosecution for reporting illegal activity. Do you think it's possible they ran this through lawyers first?

    There is no sidetracking the issue of the 1300 people possibly in the state illegally, and their being turned over to ICE once they are checked out.

    Do your job Shurtleff. Your office is in the spotlight now. There is no way out of this one.

  • patriotandmore
    July 16, 2010 8:06 p.m.

    In a land where justice is outlawed, the just must become outlaws. -Zorro

    These state employees are patriots. We must take back our country now!

  • sagacity
    July 16, 2010 7:47 p.m.


    You are on the wrong side of history.

    You would have been on the wrong side of the civil rights movement.

    You would have been on the wrong side of the holocaust.

    And you are mistaken when you assume that 'most Americans' feel the way you feel, thank God for that.

  • Voice from the wilderness
    July 16, 2010 7:25 p.m.

    The people who generated this list are the worst kind of cowards and racists. Their egregious actions are deserving of the most severe legal consequences. They obviously do not have the courage or decency to reveal their identity and to work through the regular political channels express their oppinions.

    Gov. Herbert should be commended for taking the right, immediate and appropriate action in this matter.

  • C. Darwin
    July 16, 2010 7:18 p.m.

    PATRIOTS and TRUE AMERICANS. Any other explantion is un-American . Rewards and raises to any American who turns in law breakers and illegal aliens. The moral right of this action exceeds the petty desires of corrupt politicians. It is readily apparent that most Americans feel this way. Elected officials had better take notice. It is time for the citizens to take back their rights and stop the PC nonsence.

  • SAS
    July 16, 2010 6:56 p.m.

    Note that all these comments assume the list is 100% accurate. If these two vigilantes did anything improper with data belonging to legal residents, they deserve felony-level punishment.

    If you're going to break the law and claim it's for the greater good, do it right!

    July 16, 2010 6:54 p.m.

    illegal activity on the part of citizens of the USA is Illegal in Utah, when it comes to handling Illegal Aliens.....Hertbert hasn't a clue how to handle this situation, so he decided to a take a page from bullheaded Obama counter to the majority of what utahns want to see happen on this issue....

    Who cares who compiled the list?

    I want to see answersthat do not include amnesty as a solution.....fine/areest/deport....get to work!

    Herbert, Shurtless and KSL's Doug Wrong are looking very Bob Bennett right now!!

  • cjb
    July 16, 2010 6:41 p.m.

    I can't see how whistle blowing law would apply to releasing social security numbers of hispanics who are citizens, which apparently what happened. These people were illegally profiled and their rights illegally violated.

    Nor can I see how this law would apply to the rest of the names and numbers released. It is no secret that families with citizen children are getting assistance. Even if it was a secret, there is no excuse for releasing this information g to the world. They could have merely told the news media they had such a list. There really is no justifiable defense for what was done.

    Releasing social security numbers is no doubt a federal crime too, so if Utah were to let them off, they may still be prosecuted in federal court.

    Were it my social security number that was released, I would take these people to small claims court and ask they pay for identity protection for life, anyone during my lifetime could steal my identity as a result of my number being released to the world.

  • SLars
    July 16, 2010 6:39 p.m.

    The cat is out of the bag Mr. Herbert. If you go after the employees without going after the individuals that are here illegal, then you sir are not being fair.

  • 1Observer
    July 16, 2010 6:36 p.m.

    The real criminals in all of this are the members of Congress who have ignored this issue for the last two decades and refuse to fix our screwed up immigration laws. The only people dumber than them are those of us who keep re-electing these same people and sending them back to continue to abdicate their responsibility. We are getting exactly what we deserve because we sit on our hands and do nothing but carp about a broken system. Breaking the law and creating lists will not solve this problem. We need to bring good minds together to fix this mess that Congress has made.

  • JayTee
    July 16, 2010 5:52 p.m.

    I really wish we had some decent INDEPENDENT candidates to vote for in Utah. The major party people are falling all over each other trying to be politically-correct and avoid offending people (and doing their jobs), so we really need some people who can see the real problems instead of just the side shows relative to the real problems.

  • nanniehu
    July 16, 2010 5:49 p.m.

    @Gary - Having worked for Head Start for a short stint, I can say you're wrong. There's a "don't ask don't tell" policy at Head Start. If someone comes in and wants to sign up their children for HS all they need is proof of residency in the community such as a utility bill and a pay stub or W-2. They'll lie about living with the other parent of the child being signed up for HS so their income appears lower. They'll list family members who may not live in the home. No proof of citizenship is needed & the number of family members living in the home is not checked out. Every effort is made to get these people signed up for welfare services, including help with heating bills in the winter. When we had a surplus of funds we were told to send the people to the Salt Lake CAP office and they would do all they could to get them qualified for assistance. Yet we had one family driving a BMW, one a Cadillac Escalade.

  • My View
    July 16, 2010 5:23 p.m.

    If government officials had pursued the INVADERS as vigorously as they are pursuing THE LIST PEOPLE we wouldn't have this problem in the first place!!

  • Utah Dem
    July 16, 2010 5:18 p.m.

    Too many posts to read but my first thought is that these DWS employees truly went about this wrong. First they should have ensured their list only contained names of those individuals here illegally. Second, they should have ensure they were following the defenses laid out in the whistle blower protection act or whatever its official title is.

    But to all posters - have you ever seen the government of the state of Utah react so quickly to ANYTHING? I sure haven't and this speed of action is very curious to me.

  • Is there no end to Greed?
    July 16, 2010 5:02 p.m.

    Mr. Governor sir, I'd like to report a very serious crime. Someone has taken all our patriots, tied them up, somehow gotten their desnews and sltrib passwords from them, is pretending to be them and is making them look like fools by asking for amnsety for none other than 2 fellow patrotit, this after the true patriots made it very clear, that under no condition imagionable are they ever going to be for amnesty.

    This band of criminals are making our Utah patriots look like none other than a bunch of hypocrits and fools.

    Please sir, Mr. Governor sir, can you help?

  • BYU Alum
    July 16, 2010 4:56 p.m.

    The information is THERE in state databases. Why are we giving our hard earned tax money to alien invaders? The data collectors should be given a raise. Now THAT is where I want my tax dollars going!

  • Mitch
    July 16, 2010 4:56 p.m.

    This issue will not fix itself. I agree with the Governor on this issue. We need to sit down and work out the issues. A lot of you are saying these people are heroes but they are no different than any illegal in this state. People get frustrated (these 2 individuals are frustrated at the illegal issue and the illegals are frustrated about their lack of opportunity in their country) and they make a judgment call that is not correct but they feel is right. We need to work the issues and find a solution. Stop polarizing the issue. It won't fix itself until we let our extreme thoughts (both sides of the issue) go.

  • formerUT
    July 16, 2010 4:52 p.m.

    Why don't people in UT realize how wrong this is? This list is as bad as McCarthy going after possible "communists" in the 1950's or the Gestapo making "lists" and trying to get rid of anyone on them!!!!

    This list MAY or MAY not have been of people who were illegal. If these people were receiving food stamps or Medicaid--it was ONLY for their children who are LEGAL citizens of the US! Anyone who just assumes all illegal aliens are "moochers" DO NOT GET THE REALITY OF THE US ECONOMY!!! If it wasn't for the hands and legs of the illegal aliens we would be paying $10 a pound for onions! I'm not justifying the illegal alien problem--just pointing out that we have set up an economy that is DEPENDENT upon those willing to work hard jobs for VERY little money!!!

    To the citizens of UT: Get over yourselves and your prejudices! Realize that every bitter unkind word you breath out of your mouth about those on these lists will only come back to haunt you! As the AG said, this is NOT the way to deal with the illegal immigration issue!

  • freewaymaster
    July 16, 2010 4:49 p.m.

    Where is the fund account set up to defend these HEROS !!!! they should be given the presdiential medal of freedom !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! get out of my country illegals!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • Be Practical
    July 16, 2010 4:40 p.m.

    Isn't it interesting the zeal with which the State goes after employees who blow the whistle compared to the effort they undertake to enforce immigration laws, even when they seem to have information readily available to them concerning illegals.

  • David B.
    July 16, 2010 4:24 p.m.

    The 2 in question should be given medals for their actions! It's the people who were compiling the ilegal info and not reporting it to the Feds who should be prosecuted! But isn't it funny thou! You can always tell who the guilty is by how loud they get when their being outed for and in this case compiling this list!

  • On the other hand
    July 16, 2010 4:23 p.m.

    @Question, I get the impression that federal law prohibits state employees from (re-)creating such a list.

  • Leopard
    July 16, 2010 4:18 p.m.

    So when will the defense fund be put up for these whistle blowers? And that is what they are. They saw a miscarriage of justice and theft of taxpayer's assets and they revealed it. Why are illegals getting welfare benefits? Why are the children of illegals being declared citizens because they were dropped across the border? So how fast can they get another one out of the bun and get more welfare benefits? So how long before our trillions of dollar in the hole country is irretrievably lost because of these outrageous activities of our government, state and federal? When that happens is there going to be anything left to help American citizens who will be out on the streets with barrels full of worthless dollars? Not a good thing to happen. I'll contribute to the whistle blowers defense fund.

  • sagacity
    July 16, 2010 4:08 p.m.

    To the Getapo sympathizers:

    No human being is illegal.

    Immigrants are the lifeblood of this country, and always have been, whether they have the right paperwork or not.

    It's not a matter of being politically correct, it's a matter of being KIND and decent. Not that anyone who'd call another human being "illegal" would understand that.

    If this vigilante group is truly concerned about food stamps and welfare, they should support amnesty so the Hispanics who are here illegally would be paying into the system they benefit from. It would cost a lot more to investigate, capture, and deport 1,300 people than the cost of welfare and food stamp benefits for their children who are CITIZENS of this country.

    Also, no employers/exploiters were on the list? Even though they are breaking the law and are subject to severe financial penalties and up to 5 years in prison? Was that information too hard to find? Or is it that the employers/exploiters have white skin?

  • Question
    July 16, 2010 4:06 p.m.

    Not_Scared | 3:30 p.m.

    You say the list could never be used in any prosecution. So... throw the list away and then have an authorized employee run the same query. Now you have a list you could use.

    If these numb-skulls could write a query to find them, I would guess any IT person at the state could reproduce the same list at will.

  • Big_Ben
    July 16, 2010 4:05 p.m.

    well, I was pretty sure that Chris B was behind this list, but since it looks like it was workers with the state, Chris B has been eliminated. Working as a janitor at the DI is not working for the state.

  • unwholly taciturn
    July 16, 2010 4:02 p.m.

    @ Mike Richards
    The article reads: Herbert said there are only two areas where people can access information about undocumented people: those who are receiving prenatal care through Medicaid, and those whose children are U.S. citizens and qualify for food stamps, health care and other assistance.

    If that is where the list came from then they are not receiving inappropriate funds from the state. The 14th Amendment gives citizenship to all those born in the U.S. As such those children are entitled to all the rights and privileges that you are as anyone born in the United States.

  • taking5
    July 16, 2010 4:00 p.m.

    I am sick that our Government has so miserably failed its citizens. The very people who are trying to make an honest living and support our families. The very people who have paid in to Social Security our entire lives and are told what in taxes will be taken from our paychecks, only to hire more government employees to provide financial benefits to people who are not citizens and are breaking the laws by being in our country illegally. Our Country if failing and the people we have elected to lead us refuse to do anything about it. We need people in office that will enforce the laws and its not Herbert or Shurtliff. What a Joke!

  • Sentinel
    July 16, 2010 3:55 p.m.

    We deserve to know the names of the people who compiled the list. Theytook it upon themselves to disclose hundreds of names- what's good for the goose is good for the gander. Turn around is fair play.

  • Say No to BO
    July 16, 2010 3:51 p.m.

    I'm amazed at how quickly they dispatched the situation.
    Now, if they were only so efficient when it came to withholding benefits to illegals and prosecuting them to the full extent of the law.
    But that wouldn't be PC.

  • On the other hand
    July 16, 2010 3:47 p.m.


    On the contrary. The State is legally obligated not to act on that information.

  • Hispanic in St George
    July 16, 2010 3:40 p.m.

    So Shurtleff will be the one prosecuting (or shall I say "persecuting") the people that put "the list" together... how is that for justice! We all know how fair he is. Let the fox guard the chicken coop again!

  • M. Butler
    July 16, 2010 3:35 p.m.

    Gee, next thing you know someone will start claiming that he has lists of Communists working for the State Department.

    Face it folks--this anti-immigrant blather is the new McCarthyism. Cheap entertainment for the mentally challenged. How easy it is to blame others, especially others who are different, for everything wrong with society.

    The whole anti-immigrant rabble is despicable, and the state employees who pulled this stunt are the most despicable of the lot.

  • jplant
    July 16, 2010 3:33 p.m.

    I can't stand when people say "enforce the law" with respect to immigration. Of course that is what they are trying to do and there are many laws in place that protect a person individual rights. Hence the reason the federal government is filing a lawsuit against Arizona to have the law interpret if what they are doing is legal.
    Utah you are so quick to remove a persons rights with the idea that every illegal immigrant is the root to all of our misfortunes, i.e. unemployment. If that is the case why is there higher unemployment in states without an illegal alien problem? Why are the states without an illegal alien problem also have crime? Stop looking at illegal immigrants as the scape goat for your own shortcomings.

  • ut1013
    July 16, 2010 3:32 p.m.

    "Eli Cawley, chairman of the Utah Minutemen Project said they are patriots and whistle-blowers who deserve praise and not criminal charges.
    "Those who take their obligation to protect Utah citizens seriously and want to repel the invaders are great patriots," Cawley said."

    Please tell me he's kidding. Of everything this man has said over the past few days, this is one of the most sickening. It's never all right for a state employee to misuse their position and put the privacy and safety of hundreds of lives in jeopardy. Again, I understand everyone has a different view on immigration- but this list should never have been complied the way it was. No one should use their job status as a tool for vigilante justice. You can protect yourself from whatever threats you think exist on your own terms in your own life. You should not misuse your title or your resources in this way.

    Mr. Cawley- I ask you the same thing I've asked many people these past couple of days. How would you feel if this happened to you? Welcome to a 21st century witch hunt.

  • jose larsoni
    July 16, 2010 3:31 p.m.

    OK, hang the dastardly people who put this list together. To think they should compile a list of people breaking the law for someone- anyone- to do something about prosecution and/or deportation. Shame on them!!!!

    And, pray tell, Mr. Governor, what will be done with the list of 1500+ illegals? Nothing? I love to see government (in-)action.

    Would someone please step forward with some common sense? Would all others please step backward?

  • Not_Scared
    July 16, 2010 3:30 p.m.

    The law prohibits using evidence that was obtained illegal to prosecute a crime. Any case brought to court risks being thrown out. :-) Crime doesn't pay.

  • Chief
    July 16, 2010 3:29 p.m.

    Just because the process by which the information was obtained does not change the fact that the State now is in possession of the information and is legally obligated to act on it. Is there a State sanctioned "special" class being established. Please do not act, as it may show us where your heart truly is Mr. Governor.

  • june
    July 16, 2010 3:26 p.m.

    Thank you so-what.

  • On the other hand
    July 16, 2010 3:18 p.m.

    @mkSdd3, give me access to the state driver's license database and I'll compile you a list of thousands of residents, many of whom are guilty of speeding.

  • Marie12
    July 16, 2010 3:16 p.m.

    Utah has a lot of good people AND I'm one of them. It is too bad we're getting a bad reputation. First, we created these circumstances. We want cheap food and accommodations. We, Yes, we created this unfortunate problem. We hate to work hard cheap labor. Companies hire undocumented individuals so we can benefit from commercialism and competition with China. If we don't want undocumented individuals then we need to work in those fields. Honestly, I will work for $ 20 to $ 30.00 dollars an hour. Let's take Hispanics and Latinos from these arguments because I know many Hispanics legally in the USA, pay a lot of taxes and abide by the law. When we pick after a racial group, people begin to make generalizations, which are false! Hispanics are lawyers, doctors, Supreme court, NASA astronauts, military soldiers and so on. We don't have the right to pass on a list with Latino's last name. IT IS WRONG! If we abide the law; we must abide by the Federal law as well. We should pass stricter law to businesses. Innocent souls "children" of Heavenly Father, born in the USA of undocumented have rights.

  • so-what
    July 16, 2010 3:15 p.m.

    RobertBennett wrote:
    "Looks like the state got caught with it's hands in the cookie jar. The state KNEW about the illegals and REWARDED them. HONEST state employees knew the wrong taking place and addressed it since the state WOULD NOT. What say ye Herbert? Affraid [sic] to enforce the law?"

    Robert, very succinct and to the point -well said - comment.

    I am anxious to see how all this unfolds in the coming weeks. Thank God for Arizona finally showing guts to confront the illegal alien crisis....maybe some of this spirit will wash over here to embolden the weak kneed and fence sitters to take action in support of the whistle blowers and against the official forces and agents the profit from illegal aliens.

    How many shootings, gang-bangers, drugs, ruined schools, anti-Americans, and sundry criminals will you tolerate before we start deporting?

    I am Mexican-American familiar with what they did to destroy California... a state I "fled" from to seek a "better life" in Utah.

  • so-what
    July 16, 2010 2:58 p.m.

    The "illegals" on the "LIST" should have been identified, prosecuted and deported by the agencies charged to protect America and the State. Failure to take appropriate legal actions by the State and Feds obviously led to frustration and enough of this led to the formation of "whistle blowers".

    I am sure that the "whistle blower" situation is going to blow up in the State's face. These whistle blowers are heroes in my eyes.

    Something is wrong in this age of Obama (racist Eric Holder and New Black Panther Party, Rev. Wright, Van Jones, etc.)when American Patriots become the bad guys and illegal alien criminals become victims.

    Boo hoo hoo. No sympathy from me for illegals! I know many who are not nice people, like liberal like to suggest. How do you explain away gangs, murders, drugs, rapes, DUIs, domestic violence, etc. by illegals? Answer: Its what they do!

    I am Mexican-American and love this great Nation.

  • Big_Ben
    July 16, 2010 2:55 p.m.

    ok, someone removed my post. But, what I was saying to Mike Richards was this:

    What is the percentage of those who are deported who are back in the Country within a month? I am not pro-illegal immigration, its just that merely deporting them is not enough.

  • RobertBennett
    July 16, 2010 2:26 p.m.

    Looks like the state got caught with it's hands in the cookie jar. The state KNEW about the illegals and REWARDED them. HONEST state employees knew the wrong taking place and addressed it since the state WOULD NOT. What say ye Herbert? Affraid to enforce the law?

  • Big_Ben
    July 16, 2010 2:25 p.m.


    Mike Richards was talking to me.

  • JohnJacobJingleHeimerSchmidt
    July 16, 2010 2:24 p.m.

    Conservatives, do as we say, not as we do.

  • AlexGomez2
    July 16, 2010 2:22 p.m.

    I'm surprised of the HUGE level of IGNORANCE widely displayed here! NOBODY disputes the need to do something about inmigration reform, but to think that it's OK to publish confidential information of illegal AND LEGAL residents is the manifestation not of frustration but of ignorance. Some say they don't understand WHY such a big deal. When the Gay establishment published the names, addresses and information of those who supported Prop 8 it was very different and everybody was up in arms. Who is more criminal, the people in the list or those who have signed a contract with the State of Utah to safeguard the integrity of data. Give me a break people!!! There are LEGAL residents in that list!!! If the illegal dissemination of those people's information then this is not about inmigration, this is about profiling and pure racism and bigotry. As a Latino Citizen to me is totally unacceptable.
    In April 10, 2008 this same newspaper reported that Joshua Smith, 32, of Murray; Michelle Chapman, 29, of Murray; John Johnstun, 44, of Midvale and Laura Bustamante, 34, of Midvale, all former DWS employees stole clients information. Is that legal???

  • ds7
    July 16, 2010 2:18 p.m.

    the current argument of gov't officials when it comes to illegal immigration is that their right to ignore the law trumps the citizen's right to protection from having our social safety net raided, our hospital emergency rooms over-run, our schools filled with illegals, anchor-babies treated as if they were naturalized citizens, etc.

    illegals immigrant = unregistered democrat

  • No One Of Consequence
    July 16, 2010 2:18 p.m.

    There is no excuse for criminal vigilantism. Anarchy brings nothing good.

    But can someone please explain what this means?

    "I'm concerned about doing something here in Utah that's a comprehensive solution, not just enforcement only," [Utah Attorney General Mark Shurtleff] said.

    There is nothing comprehensive that the state can do. Immigration laws are set by the Federal government.

    But we, as voters, can comprehensively replace our representatives we send to Washington....

  • Cats
    July 16, 2010 2:18 p.m.

    I wish you people would tone down the rhetoric. Gestapo? Stasi?

    Look, some people at Work Force Services accessed some information they shouldn't have. They're probably going to get canned. They may have broken the law. These people probably got sick and tired of watching illegals come in and access state services. It's understandable. But, they shouldn't have done it.

    The Gestapo and the Stasi were state operated secret police. These people are renegate state employees who will pay the consequences. It's completely different.

    I wish the emotionalism here would just calm down.

  • Hey It's Me
    July 16, 2010 2:17 p.m.

    to: Gary @11:59 YOU should get your facts straight before making such ridiculous statements. I had a family next door to me that have moved BUT when they lived here I was friends with them. The wife and kids were U.S. citizens but the husband was not. He earned a living doing landscape. They were on food stamps and got free medical treatment quite often! They went out to eat Sushi and other delicacies that I can't afford to do at least once a week. Because he got paid under the table cash (NO TAXES) and she went in as a single mother to get these benefits of free medical and food. So Illegals do earn their money but if any of their family is a citizens they benefit from the government handouts! I'm sure my neighbors husband was eating the free food they recived! I took them dinners when they said they had no money or food, but They should have saved some of his work tax free money instead of going out on the govt. money.

  • donburi
    July 16, 2010 2:16 p.m.


    "Most illegals are in America because they over stayed their visa."

    Please quote source.

  • Brer Rabbit
    July 16, 2010 2:14 p.m.

    "Shurtleff said his office does not plan to do anything with the supposed "illegal immigrants" on the list." Nothing new in this statement. In fact the Utah Attorney General never does anything that would upset the ethnic illegal alien groups.

    The Utah AG and Governor are doing nothing but providing sanctuary for illegal aliens. They attack with every resource available against the messengers (whistle blowers) but do nothing to enforce even Utah laws.

    For example, Utah Code: 63G-11-103 requiring public employers and their contractors to use E-Verify. This law has been in effect since July 1, 2009 and neither the governor nor the AG have made any effort to enforce the law. Public employers such as school districts, counties and cities generally ignore the law.

    Utah is rapidly becoming a sanctuary state(maybe it already is) due to the non-enforcement policies of the Utah Attorney General and the Utah Governor.

  • kwb
    July 16, 2010 2:13 p.m.

    All of you who think these "patriots" have done something noble will have a chance to show your financial support. After they pay their legal bills for the criminal charges, they are going to confront civil lawsuits from all those named on the lists who have legal status in the country.

    Do you have any doubt that lawyers are already lining up clients to sue these criminals? I wish I had gone to law school. I'm sure the "patriots'" supporters will pony up some cash for legal fees and settlement costs.

  • kstep15
    July 16, 2010 2:12 p.m.

    You have OVER 1300 illegal people in Utah and your going after the whistle blowers?? I'm sure those two whistlers are TRIED of seeing tax PAYERS money going to where it SHOULD'NT BE!! What's wrong with the picture here?? HELLO!!!!

  • june
    July 16, 2010 2:11 p.m.

    The law is the law on both sides of the fence. Have these people stand in line and become citizens. We need them and they need us. We will welcome them with open arms when they are legal. Stop supporting the breaking of the law. Now on both sides of the fence. Both parties should be supporting the law. Please get your citizenship. This will help the criminal element out of the country. It was drugs from the illegal criminal from Mexico that killed our son. Keep that element out of Utah. Get tough and send them back to Mexico. To the good people from Mexico, show them the value of US Citizen. No more support until they stand in line like my family had to do years ago. Blessed citizenship. God bless America.

  • cuscoln
    July 16, 2010 2:11 p.m.

    The signers of the Declaration of Independence did just that -- the signed their names and risked death. Most of those who committed civil disobedience for civil rights and against the war in the 60's did so in the open and often went to jail. The cowards who distributed this list slithered under the rocks and called themselves anonymous.

    I am just stunned at the posters who scream "what part of ILLEGAL don't you understand" then call the criminals who made this list "heroes" and want the AG to back off.

    As a state employee, I am sickened by the release of private information that public employees are supposed to safeguard. Whistleblower protections do not apply to what they did.

  • positiverealist
    July 16, 2010 2:09 p.m.

    FYI "Unlawful Presence" is a Civil infraction and Police do not arrest people for Federal Civil infractions. If those people were caught while crossing then yes it would be a criminal violation but only a class B misdemeanor. If we want it to be more serious we need to change the law. However the people that released this information committed a felony by so doing. It is also important to note that many of the people on this list are here legally, some are about to be granted Citizenship and other have legal status. Releasing their information is more serious than the civil infraction of being here without permission or letting your visa expire. I am not pro-illegal immigration but we need to be reasonable here. The supreme court even ruled last year that they will not be charged with identity theft if they were only using false documents for the purpose of obtaining a job. Once again a civil infracton of the law does not make you a criminal, if so then getting a speeding ticket would be criminal but it is not, it is civil.

  • Another Perspective
    July 16, 2010 2:03 p.m.

    To quote the self appointed patriots of Utah.

    It is never right that someone benefit from their illegal behavior. They or their children.

    Now do you understand why this list can't be used to round up and deport the illegal aliens? Doing this would reward lawbreakers.

  • BigBenzo88
    July 16, 2010 2:02 p.m.

    @Mike Richards

    I appreciate your post. I am referring to people who are here illegally. My proposal to them is why didn't they apply for legal citizenship before coming to the US?

    My suggestion would be for all illegal aliens to go back to their respective countries and then apply for legal US Citizenship through the INS. Of course the country and our state would feel an economic impact....but so be it.

    My suggestion would be for the state and federal governments to begin deporting anyone here illegally. The problem is that this issue is more deeply routed then most people understand. What do you do when an illegal alien couple have a 10 year old child that is a legal US Citizen? The child has a legal right to be here and a legal right to have his parents care for him and should not have to choose between the two.

    In the end, I believe it will come down to this...anyone here illegal should live with the understanding that they are wanted and the time may come that they will be deported...unless that take action now to become legal citizens!!!

  • Pancho Villa
    July 16, 2010 2:01 p.m.

    Give the state employees the death penalty.

  • coachcarter
    July 16, 2010 1:59 p.m.


  • bgl
    July 16, 2010 1:57 p.m.

    Their tactics are eerily similar to Gestapo and Stasi like work. I am all for sensible and human immigration reform, but people who support these types are the same ones who would have thrown a party for those who revealed Ann Franks whereabouts.

  • Say What?
    July 16, 2010 1:57 p.m.

    re Patrick Henry | 12:13 p.m. July 16, 2010

    Fire them then hire them back? Wouldn't this be amnesty?

    I don't think the "patriot" types would ever agree to that.

  • So-CalAggie
    July 16, 2010 1:54 p.m.

    anyone who defends these two morons needs their heads examined, how would you like your name and SOCIAL SECURITY NUMBER put on a list accusing you unfairly of something? I'm sure some of you think these two dolts are somehow heroes, but think about what I said, think about having your private information published accusing you of breaking the law w/o the right to defend yourself! These two jerks need to spend some time in the slammer for that!

  • Uncle Rico
    July 16, 2010 1:47 p.m.

    Doesn't government information belong to the people?

  • One Angry Salebarn Worker
    July 16, 2010 1:47 p.m.

    Good for the workers, finding instances of waste and misuse of resources in the state, and rooting out corruption. Let's give them a hand.

  • Not_Scared
    July 16, 2010 1:47 p.m.

    "Before our Governor takes any steps to prosecute or fire whoever made the list, he darn well better have every name on that list checked, and every illegal on it thrown out of our state!"

    We don't reward lawbreakers.

    I'm not a bit impressed by conservative moral relativism.

    1. The list only had Hispanic names.

    2. Information mined from a government database, which also listed people here legally.

    3. These state employees didn't take this issue through channels first.

    4. These state workers didn't address this issue by writing their elected representatives or the governor.

    5. They didn't write, explaining the issue to the press, without attaching the list.

    If they had done the above, one might be able to argue they were seeking enforcement of laws.

    This is why conservative have no credibility. They use moral relativism while they point fingers at liberals. They speak of personal while they do anything to escape being accountable, they call distortions fair and balanced and chant illegal is illegal and then the made heroes out of criminals.

    These aren't values I want children to learn.

  • Mike Richards
    July 16, 2010 1:45 p.m.

    Big Ben,

    Without being condesending, what part of "illegal" don't you understand?

    What problem are you trying to solve?

    This list shows that we have three problems:

    (1). Illegal aliens.

    (2). Governemnt services being supplied to those illegal aliens.

    (3). A governor who is more concerned about helping the illegal aliens than he is with "fixing" the problem.

    Deporting the people will keep those people from breaking our laws.

    Deporting the people will keep those people from illegally using services of which they are not entitled.

    Deporting the people will show that we will not tolerate breaking the law.

    Citizenship requires certain responsibilities. One of those responsibilities is to sustain the laws of this nation. Why do you, as a citizen, propose selective enforcement of our laws?

  • BP
    July 16, 2010 1:35 p.m.

    I'm more disheartened by the people defending these employees than by what they did. At least there were no more than five of them...I could write them off as lunatic aberrations.I would like someone to prove to me that illegal immigrants The fact that so many people want to hire them or give them raises gives me the creeps. Do you want them to send your records to the IRS when they find that you aren't paying all of the taxes that you should be paying?

    How do illegals drain the system more than they add to it? I have worked with social services legislation for years, and have never seen a social service offered to undocumented individuals (unless they lie about being undocumented, which is an entirely different crime altogether). While its true that many of these undocumented individuals access medical care through emergency rooms (a legitimate drain on societal funds), many pay taxes and social security money that they know they will never collect.

    Its also a shame that so many of us place priority on justice over mercy. I wonder if God will use the same justice in judging us for our "crimes?"

  • Shaun
    July 16, 2010 1:33 p.m.

    Just because two people compiled a list of illegal aliens does not mean they are illegal aliens. They suspected they were illegal.

    I know people who think every person who has brown skin is illegal. They think if they speak spanish they must be illegal and that is not necessarily the case.

    I am tired of the illegal debate. Every one in this country is an immigrant by the fact that their ancestors were immigrants and i bet most did not come here legally.

  • BigBenzo88
    July 16, 2010 1:28 p.m.

    Not so fast!!! We still don't have the whole story behind the list and who compiled it. Its possible that these workers were trying to stop the illegal disbursement of aid to illegal aliens. If the DWS was knowingly providing aid to illegal aliens, then the DWS, the State of Utah and the Governor would be held liable. If this was a civil/corporate case...these two workers would be given whistleblower/immunity status.

    Second, in a time where our economy and natural resources are being stretched to the limit...illegal aliens had to recognize that it would eventually come to this. Not saying that it is right. But what else would you expect. I mean it could be worse. Look at what happens to illegal aliens in China and North Korea...they go to jail and are senteneced to hard labor.

    I'm not totally sure why the list was created, but I think it serves as notice to illegal aliens that the public view is starting to change.

    This would be an excellant opportunity to apply for citizenship through INS using the proper channels. Thousands of immigrants become US citizens every year!!!

  • Big_Ben
    July 16, 2010 1:22 p.m.

    can someone tell me how deporting people will solve the problem?

  • Lofty_Hopes
    July 16, 2010 1:17 p.m.

    Shirtless is angrier at being shown a fool, who ignores enforcing the law, then he is angry at people's private info being published.

  • IakoSan
    July 16, 2010 1:17 p.m.

    The governor should resign.

  • Big_Ben
    July 16, 2010 1:15 p.m.

    This is a joke. I hope that they throw the book at those who compiled this list. You can't do this. I hope they are charged with a felony.

    We need to solve our immigration issues, but private citizens taking the law into their own hands is not the answer. Deporting these people is not the answer, at least not long term.

    Come on folks, we are better than this!

  • michaelitos
    July 16, 2010 1:12 p.m.

    Just wanted to point out to you the ridiculous rhetoric you insist on using. The group of people to which you refer are not "illegals".

    To some, they are undocumented workers. To others, they are illegal immigrants. Even others still consider them children of a Heavenly Father. What they are NOT, is "illegals".

    It's not about being politically correct, nor is it merely semantics. It's about framing a debate in a fair, ethical, and dare I say, a humane way.

    Actions are illegal. Human beings are NOT.

  • Reasonable Person
    July 16, 2010 1:09 p.m.

    You people don't get it.

    Because the information was ILLEGALLY OBTAINED, it cannot be used to prosecute anyone.

    The people responsible for this data breach, are not operating with full intelligence.

  • Reasonable Person
    July 16, 2010 1:08 p.m.

    The State of Utah DOES NOT have a list of "illegal aliens" who are receiving services.

    The people compiling the list pulled 100% Hispanic names, many of whom are NOT illegal.

    (sarcasm on) If the data thieves get away with this, I am going to petitition the State of Utah for a list of all tax cheats, tax protestors, and registered Republicans -- and then publish another "list" of people I don't agree with. (sarcasm off)

    This "list" was ONLY about hispanics; when the names and associations of the people responsible, we'll not be surprised. These will be anti-government false patriots whose names have already been in the public venue.

  • Watch Dog
    July 16, 2010 1:06 p.m.

    If the state can so handily, find those that posted this list, certainly they can find those who are on welfare, state aid, etc., and deport them. Right? Right!

    IF, and that is the keyword here, IF these people are not protected via our whistle blower laws, then by all means prosecute them. BUT, let's not distracted from the fact that the state DOES have information on illegal aliens - and should be seeing that they are deported. EVERY ONE of them.

  • chubbymagoo
    July 16, 2010 1:06 p.m.

    Absolute hypocrisy. All I've heard is "it's not racism, it's illegal." These people are not whistle blowers. They engaged in illegal activity. They could have gone to the press and law enforcement to expose problems without releasing sensitive information. It is clear that they acted as vigilantes and intended to spread fear. I can't wait until their names are released to the press.

  • Lofty_Hopes
    July 16, 2010 1:06 p.m.

    We would be better off if we would replace Shirtless and Cox with the two that compiled the list.

    The incumbants want the status quo and not to rock the boat. The boat needs to be rocked.

  • DN Subscriber
    July 16, 2010 1:03 p.m.

    Before our Governor takes any steps to prosecute or fire whoever made the list, he darn well better have every name on that list checked, and every illegal on it thrown out of our state!

    If the "list makers" can figure out who the illegals are, they deserve a promotion and a raise, and full time assignment to tracking down criminals!

    Refusal to take action against illegals should be grounds for impeachment of the Governor, Attorney General, and any police officers who fail to uphold the law.

    If they won't prosecute illegals, why should any Utah citizen bother obeying any other laws? Be they privacy protections at DWS, or taxes, or anything else?

    Are we a nation of laws, or just let everyone do whatever helps their family?

  • UtahnativeinliberalCA
    July 16, 2010 12:58 p.m.

    Give those employees a bonus.

  • Question
    July 16, 2010 12:56 p.m.

    What happened to the Liberals who praise people who broke the law to bring about social justice, civil rights, etc???

    Are these people not doing that same thing? Putting their necks on the line to expose this?

    Are they not trying to change the world? Expose some illegal activity they've seen going on while working at the Dpt or Workforce Services? Expose corruption in our government AND illegal activity in our community?

    And that's a BAD thing? But it wasn't when people resorted to "Civil Disobedience" in other cases?

    I'm not approving of what they did. But I'm trying to keep an open mind at this point. At first I condemned them. But the more I think about it... I wonder if they were TRYING to do a good thing... and are not just common criminals.

    IF they were being wistle-blowers, exposing corruption in our government... they should be protected (according to the law). But if they were just trying to intimidate people... they should be punished (according to the law).

    I think I'm being consistent, but I realise I may be a little biased.

  • Leesha
    July 16, 2010 12:54 p.m.

    DR Hall says there are much better ways of taking care of the situation. Any suggestions? Seriously, We'd love to hear a real effective solution to this.

  • Digbads
    July 16, 2010 12:52 p.m.

    Thank heavens for whistle blowers who are letting us know that the state is ignoring, even rewarding, this behavior.

    And Orrin Hatch wants your tax dollars to pay for illegals college.

    These guys don't have a clue.

  • Fiscal Hawk
    July 16, 2010 12:52 p.m.

    There's nothing hateful about wanting the law enforced and government handouts eliminated.

  • verily_verily
    July 16, 2010 12:52 p.m.

    We must protect the children, of illegals on "the list," that are citizens.

    They are deserving of government assistance, due to no fault of their own.

    Apparently safe guards need to be put in place to protect these 'legal citizens,' from those intent on causing mischief.

  • canyonist
    July 16, 2010 12:51 p.m.

    It seems to me that the republicans, with few exceptions, have never wanted to short-circuit illegal immigration.

    Its no secret, they do very little because it would effect the extra profit of the constituents they cater to: BUSINESS...most especially hotels/motels, slaughter houses, construction outfits, roofing, house keeping/building maintenance, landscaping/yard maintenance, oil/gas drilling and coal mining (which, also harm us in their processes and end products).

    As usual, they put bigger profits for a few (but enough to fill their campaign coffers and treat them to sport events and trips to the Bahamas) at the expense of workers and, including, yes, illegals, who, though they have a comparative bed of roses, most of the time it is with thorns.

    The lust (greed) for bigger profits not only compromises our political system (bought and paid for), it also results in the type of disaster we are seeing in the Gulf of Mexico...where thousands of jobs and tens of thousands of wild lives have been lost.

    One can continue to rant and rave (such bitterness and lack of compassion, in these posts!)...or one can vote the party of business out of office.

  • Mike Richards
    July 16, 2010 12:51 p.m.

    How many ways can the Governor show that he is unfit for office?

    He cedes the sovereignty of the State of Utah to the Federal Government.

    He wants to prosecute those who leaked information about illegal aliens and illegal distributions of State funds and services to those illegal aliens.

    He (apparently) condones using State funds to provide services to people who are not citizens of this State.

    The Governor has just lost the support of most of the law-abiding citizens of this State. There were many ways to handle this problem, but threatening prosecution of two people who "leaked" the illegal activity of the State of Utah was not acceptable. Instead, he should have spoken out against those who leaked that information and then focused total attention on prosecuting those who used State funds for non-citizens of the State.

  • Murray Dad
    July 16, 2010 12:50 p.m.

    publish their names DWS.

  • moonman
    July 16, 2010 12:46 p.m.

    The crime here is that the state has this information and is not using it.

  • Hunt
    July 16, 2010 12:45 p.m.


    What? I really hope your not being serious. In what way does the Minutemen Project in anyway resemble the Ku Klux Klan. I don't mind lively debate but your statement is borderline insanity and positions you so far on the fringe that anything you say from that point of view will not be taken seriously. In addition, yours and others attempt at Race Baiting isn't going to help you and your ilk gain any ground in convincing anyone of anything. It only makes those that want to see the illegals return home even more upset and more determined.

  • chopperdan
    July 16, 2010 12:43 p.m.

    I am ashamed of those responsible for this mean act. They are so caught up in hatred that they turn into hate and fearmongering people. Deliberately trying to tear a family apart. I am so saddened by this racisim. Anger, hatred and malevolence are alive an well in the great state of Utah! What a great people.

  • couragous
    July 16, 2010 12:43 p.m.

    To Malign: You brought up some good and interesting points on this subject matter. However, step back and take a look at this whole picture. Why or how come State Agencies do not pursue non paying people. It's always give me, give me attitude. This list came from Workforce or Wellfare system. As a taxpayer I would be concern about free stuff given to individuals who have not worked at all.

  • Question
    July 16, 2010 12:39 p.m.

    I anybody investigating why Workforce Services had a list of illegal aliens to begin with???

    Were they helping place illegal aliens in jobs???

    In my mind, Gov Herbert needs to be answering some questions, not just ASKING them.

    -Is the State a "sanctuary" for illegal aliens?

    -Does the State know where illegal aliens live, work, etc, and provides cover for them?

    -Does Workforce Services knowingly help place illegal residents in jobs? (isn't that illegal)???

    -Does Workforce Services knowingly pay benefits to Illegal residents?

    -Why did they have this list of illegal aliens living in Utah at the Dpt of Workforce Services... If they claim they don't know of any illegal activity in the State, when obviously they are in the practice of covering up illegal activity in the State? And providing jobs and state benefits to families they KNOW are in the country illegally???

    Splain it to me Lucy!

  • taicho
    July 16, 2010 12:38 p.m.

    Just what is illegal about a list of illegals.

    The real criminals are overlooked. They employ illegals against the law.

    The attorney general ought to be going after them. But you will never see it.

    If I present lists of speeders or DUIs, you mean it is against the law. Some of them may be Mothers too. So the health Act is nothing but political.

  • The Sensible Middle
    July 16, 2010 12:38 p.m.

    The minute men types are all against amnesty, until now. Now they want the actions of the employees to be viewed as whistle blowing with all its protections.

    I guess whether amnesty is a good concept depends on who is recieving it. It really isn't about strict adherence to the law.

    I suspected it never was.

  • MenaceToSociety
    July 16, 2010 12:38 p.m.

    Stealing personal information? Throw the book at them.

    It's funny how some call Mexicans who are here illegally WORKING freeloaders. They actually contribute a ton to government bank accounts through the taxes they pay on purchases, the corporate income tax their employers are supposed to pay from their production, etc. And most of them can't work here legally due to the American government's much-too-small quota for Mexican guest workers, so they do so illegally. Our tax coffers benefit tremendously from their work. I'm sure if they were from Canada, everything would be a-ok! Because, after all, most Canadians are white.

    It would be REALLY FUNNY if unemployed housewives hanging out at the mall are calling these workers freeloaders.

  • Hanksboy
    July 16, 2010 12:36 p.m.

    Kudos to the governor for jumping on this quickly and getting to the bottom of where the info came from.

    To those who want "the state" to deport illegals, it can't be done. Only the feds have the authority. Also, unless or until the feds change the law, children born in the U.S. are citizens, regardless of the status of their parents. As such, they (the children) are eligible for food stamps and other aid.

    Let's hope the Feds finally enact some meaninfgul immigration reform to close the borders, close the loopholes and close down the free lunch.

  • SpanishImmersed
    July 16, 2010 12:34 p.m.

    Too bad these employees have sacrificed their careers and lives. They apparently violated the very rule of law they were sworn to uphold as government employees. They will probably be punished with incarceration for a long time.

    What an incredible ordeal for them and their families.

    Although some may think them valiant, the rule of law must prevail. Those who sympathize with their cause need to rise up and call for action through legal means and the democratic process to protect our nation against the foreign invasion of illegal aliens seeking a better life, or those escaping persecution and lawlessness in their own homelands.

    The illegal aliens have also imposed an incredible ordeal upon themselves and their families, and must answer to our laws. They can no longer be a drain on our social services.

    Because of our economic collapse, their actions can no longer go unnoticed, nor unpunished as well.

  • jorge
    July 16, 2010 12:32 p.m.

    Dear Cocosweet:

    Well stated!

  • Christine
    July 16, 2010 12:28 p.m.

    Food for thought for those Conscientiousness individuals who decry hate, racism and discrimination.

    "The government of the United to bigotry no sanction, to persecution no assistance".
    George Washington

    "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing". Edmund Burke

    "First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out -- because I was not a socialist. Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out -- because I was not a trade unionist. Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out -- because I was not a Jew. Then they came for me -- and there was no one left to speak for me". Pastor Martin Niemoller

    "Thou shalt not be a victim. Thou shalt not be a perpetrator. Above all, thou shalt not be a bystander". Holocaust Museum, Washington, DC

  • Christine
    July 16, 2010 12:26 p.m.

    It's a very sad state of affairs in the state of Utah when you have a witch hunt going on against the poor, the least fortunate, and most vulnerable people in the state.

    Why aren't more good people in Utah outraged?

    Stealing private information to persecute, publicly shame and harm families.
    Targeting and discriminating against people (including legal and American citizens) because of their culture and Spanish surnames.

    Persecuting unlawfully divulging private data about American citizens (including inocent children), legal residents, and illegal immigrants.

    DEATH THREATS against Mr. Yapias for speaking out against injustice.

    Inocent AMERICAN children are being TERRORIZED by anonymous phone calls from nazi cowards threatening their families, their wellbeing and their safety.

    The police and FBI should get involved to solve these crimes.

    Good people in Utah need to stand up for the right and against abuses and persecutions in our own communities.

    "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing". Edmund Burke

  • Wasabi
    July 16, 2010 12:25 p.m.

    I understand people's frustration but one illegal action does not justify another. If you want to report someone to INS, there are proper ways to do so. How would these people feel if their personal information were spread about to further someone else's agenda?

    This becomes a very slippery slope and I see many of the people equating the government with using Nazzi and totalitarian tactics using exactly many of the same tactics to get their ideology out and stifle discent. Many of their arguments and tactics are exactly how Hitler came to power. Blame others who are different for their problems. Make scapegoats out of those who can be easily singled out.

    Most imigrants I know aren't taking jobs from whites. The whites are just too danm lazy to do the jobs at any price. At least that has been my experience.

    Look at yourself before you start pointing fingers at others.

  • Christy
    July 16, 2010 12:23 p.m.

    (as people debate immigration reform,) "We need to do it in a way that is not through lists, that is through hate mongering, through political rhetoric, through threats, through outright and implied racism. That's not how we do things, and we condemn it."

    GOOD TO HEAR. And good for their quick investigative work. It feels really good to have your faith restored.

  • Murphy
    July 16, 2010 12:23 p.m.

    As a former employee of DWS I just want to know when on earth these individuals found the time to do this???

    - Every minute she/he/they sat and compiled this list, they were not doing the job they were hired to do - issuing benefits to an OVERWHELMING majority of US Citizens. If any of you applauding their efforts have family who is currently or has ever received Food Stamps or assistance paying for Child Care or is a resident of a nursing home because Medicaid is paying for it - YOU are paying the salaries and benefits of these people NOT DOING THEIR JOBS!!! DWS employees are understaffed and overstressed and if someone is off busy putting together a list, they are cheating their co-workers, their clients, and YOU the taxpayer.

    List or no list, if you are employed by a government agency to assist those in need YOU DON'T have the time or freedom to play rogue vigilante. Otherwise, quit this job and head to the border and get a job there where you are actually paid to enforce immigration laws.

  • GmaxD
    July 16, 2010 12:23 p.m.

    Illegal immigration is simple--it is NOT rocket science. And it is not about religion.

    If a person is here illegally, then he or she gets to leave the country--NOW!! Or, deportation can be carried out by ICE.

    Please note that I do not care one iota about the amount of melanin present in an illegal alien's epidermis.

    This is about the rule of law and the national security and the sovereignty of the United States. Either you believe in the rule of law, or you don't. And if you don't, perhaps you will be more comfortable living elsewhere with another form of government.

  • mkSdd3
    July 16, 2010 12:22 p.m.

    The Federal, State and Local Governments throughout this great country of ours have been ignoring immigration laws long enough. It is time to enforce the law.

    We already read in the story that the government is going to go after the people that released the list. This is as it should be. Now tell us about the government going after illegals!

  • skeptic
    July 16, 2010 12:17 p.m.

    If in fact the State of Utah has information and is providing assistance to people the State knows are illegal aliens, then the State of Utah is harboring and abating criminals and the govenor should be arrested and the State put on trial. The State employee who uncovered the crime should be given an award for outstanding performance.

  • Not_Scared
    July 16, 2010 12:15 p.m.

    Once more, we are faced with the shallow argument that doesn't seen to apply to those who are white: illegal is illegal. If you're Mike Noel or those two suspected criminals, illegal is...well; not really illegal.

    Those writing comments here to use this situation to ferment hatred, gloss over the facts like Fox News omitting facts about the lies Jan Brewer as been caught telling to ferment hatred in the conservative media.

    These state employees had the obligation to the citizens of Utah to take any issues they had through proper channels. The rejected acting legally. They could have written state lawmakers or their government. This is legally protected speech. They rejected this legal option.

    They could have even written the press about this problem and omitted releasing names in violation of both state and feral laws but they choose to brake the law.

    Most illegals are in America because they over stayed their visa,. For you conservative, this means they legally crossed our border. Using, mere average intelligence, you can extrapolate that not all illegals have Hispanic names.

    There were people on their list who where here legally.

  • ouisc
    July 16, 2010 12:14 p.m.

    cocosweet said: For those of you who think the government workers did the right thing... you will never understand that you can't pick and choose which laws to follow.

    Yet we do pick and choose which laws to follow by condoning illegal immigration.

  • JohnJacobJingleHeimerSchmidt
    July 16, 2010 12:14 p.m.

    It is crazy how so many people are interested in personal data, not just for the people on the list but all of us are ok with it just flying out there.

    You cannot BREAK THE RULE OF LAW to enforce the rule of law.

    What if these people wanted to compile a list of Mormons or other enemies for various reasons?

    Immigration needs to be dealt with but it needs to be done in a LEGAL manner according to the rule of LAW.

    By the way, there are people on that list here LEGALLY, in fact some that have HELPED the US government.

  • Patrick Henry
    July 16, 2010 12:13 p.m.

    The employees who created this list apparently broke a law. But I say they broke a lesser law to uphold a more important one.


    Punish them by firing them from their current positions. That will serve them right for breaking the law.

    Hire them to work in jobs that find and round up illegals. That will serve them right for standing up to illegal immigration.

    True patriots will sometimes break lower laws and rights to satisfy higher ones. ( See founding fathers)

  • ouisc
    July 16, 2010 12:12 p.m.

    We should investigate everyone. Investigate the compilation of the list for illegal activity, and investigate who is here illegally, and let everyone have their consequence for their poor decisions.

  • Suborno
    July 16, 2010 12:10 p.m.

    I certainly hope they find out who sent this list.... And give them a medal for being outstanding Americans. More people should be this proactive.
    If this information is already in a state database why hasn't the state already taken action to deport these people? I think it is ridiculous that the state has spent time and money finding out who sent the list instead of spending that time and money doing something about the people on the list.
    I understand that whoever sent the list broke the law but in doing so they have provided a list of 1,300 people that are breaking the law. I guess it is cheaper for the state to go after a couple people than 1,300 people. Even though if they got rid of these 1,300 people that are on state assistance it would save the state a small fortune.
    Comments here are great, if anyone actually reads them, but you should go to the governor's website and send him a note.

  • Gella
    July 16, 2010 12:03 p.m.

    The Utah Minutemen Project eerily remind me of the Ku Klux Klan. Creepy!

  • DR Hall
    July 16, 2010 12:02 p.m.

    I wish that those people involved in creating those immigrant lists would have really thought about what they were doing. Thought of how it would affect those lives and families especially the children. There is enough bigotry and bias in the United States already. There are much better ways to take care of this problem. I also hope the majority political party in this state is not behind this effort. We are forgetting a big value here and that is to Love thy neighbor as thy self.

  • The Rock
    July 16, 2010 12:02 p.m.

    You can't get social security numbers, names of children and due dates of pregnant women by following people around.

    It would have been more intelligent to delete data that could identity the exact source of the data. Mixing some errors in would through investigators off the track.

    Misusing data from state computers is a serious crime. I hope they get treated the same way Ohio treated the folks that violated Joe The Plumber's privacy, but no worse.

  • WWJD
    July 16, 2010 12:01 p.m.

    i hold these truths to be self evident: all men are created equal and that God in heaven has given all men certain rights that can not be called ALIEN. included in these rights are Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness. Has anyone stopped to think how un-American the current way of dealing with illegal "aliens" is? Let them work!
    Also, you are completely ignorant of how things work if you think they get free education. unless they are living in tents, they pay property taxes. and if they are being paid under the table, then their employers have nothing to expense and probably pay a higher income tax (corp or individual). and if they're paid above the table, they are paying medicaid, social security just like you, except they'll never see their social security come back to them. if they leave, its not like the tax base is going to go up because citizens are working those measly jobs. half of you should take a business class or two and calm the freak down. all the problems you cite are poverty based, not "papers" based. persecute the wage payers if you must persecute someone.

    July 16, 2010 12:01 p.m.

    Where can I get the resumes for these two patriots.......They are waisting their time and skillset working for the likes of the state....

    So the list has proven to have was sent to ICE last spring.....and not one illegal has been arrested and deported even though this information has been given to ICE and law enforement.....I just got a ticket for parking to close to a driveway......I am not going to pay it until the city officials stat doing the job or taxes and fines pay them to do?

  • Malign
    July 16, 2010 12:00 p.m.

    @ Conservative: "Those that committed these crimes should be prosecuted to the extent of the laws. Their deeds cannot be undone."

    Way to look at the situation; now replace your ignorant argument with the illegal immigrant situation and you'll see that the individuals that put out this list and illegal's are one and the same (lawbreakers). This list is not public information (try to find it yourself), so keep quiet about demonizing the people who are looking out for the well being of our country and our children's future.

    @ Conservative: "any more than those that break and enter and steal your property."

    There must be something wrong with your sensibilities, because this is exactly what illegal immigrants do when they walk into our welfare offices, take our tax money and walk out without ever paying into the system that supports them.

    Garbage argument Mam, Sir, whomever you are, you are absolutley no Patriot and should be deported yourself.

  • stanfunky
    July 16, 2010 11:59 a.m.

    To: Conservative | 11:14 a.m. July 16, 2010

    I'm CERTAIN a number of State and Federal laws were broken by the people here unlawfully, whether they were on this list or not:
    1. Stealing Social Security numbers is a Federal crime.
    2. Using personal data about minors to work in the US is a State & Federal crime.
    3. Identity Theft of a US Citizen is a State and a Federal crime.
    4. Harboring, hiding, or protecting those here illegally is a Federal crime.
    5. Overstaying a Visa, Work Permit, etc. is a Federal Crime.
    6. A foreign national who commits crime while in a country other than his home, is subject to immediate deportation, by Federal Law.

    Those that committed these crimes should be prosecuted to the extent of the laws. Their deeds cannot be undone. THESE criminals are ARE those that break and enter and steal your property, whether physical, intellectual, or otherwise.

    Stop promoting the illegals as 'victims' and realize that they do not care for you as you do for them. The sooner we fix our broken system and stop hiring people here unlawfully, the better our country will be off in the long run.

  • Gary
    July 16, 2010 11:59 a.m.

    Many of you here don't get it. You think the illegals are taking money from the state and this is untrue. They work to make money to live on. That's it. They have no welfare assistance at all. State law and Fed law requires proof of citizenship. If you all did your research thoroughly, you'd retract your words. All you're doing is showing your hatred for illegals with the wrong things in mind. The illegals are only working at jobs that no one else wants to do. So have a heart for them. Also, what the two workers did was illegal and is considered theft. Would you like someone to take your information and make it public when it's supposed to be private? Think about the consequences. If they can do this, they could do this to your own personal information and ruin your lives. Watch your words before you speak regarding illegals.

  • danaslc
    July 16, 2010 11:59 a.m.

    Utah has information that should have been turned over to ICE and did nothing and they contend these two people are in the wrong? Two wrongs don't make anything right. If they want to throw the book at these two people then the people should be able to throw the book at Utah. Utah has been protecting illegals for years. What makes Herbert think he is in the right? What is good for one set of people should be good for the other set of people. Prosecute one you should prosecute the other.

  • mkSdd3
    July 16, 2010 11:56 a.m.

    @OnTheOtherHand, you are off base. If there were a list of people that were speeding and not prosecuted I am sure everyone would be in favor of rectifying the situation. No one is proposing posting police on every corner to find illegals, but once it is established that a person is illegal they should be deported.

  • Butch70
    July 16, 2010 11:55 a.m.

    The indivuals who released the infermation should be fired when were not to do.

  • coachcarter
    July 16, 2010 11:55 a.m.

    fyi. it says nothing about them being here illegally. get a clue

  • cocosweet
    July 16, 2010 11:54 a.m.

    May the two who release the information receive their proper punishment (two wrongs do not make a right). Bless all of the government employees who know WHY this was illegal and would never use such private information for personal vendettas. For those of you who think the government workers did the right thing... you will never understand that you can't pick and choose which laws to follow.

  • Leesha
    July 16, 2010 11:54 a.m.

    ON the other hand,
    What exactly are you trying to say?

  • TheWalker
    July 16, 2010 11:54 a.m.

    I find it incredible that this information was in the hands of our state government and nothing was done. I am in full favor of LEGAL immigration, but we are being overrun by MILLIONS

  • Brian H.
    July 16, 2010 11:52 a.m.

    From the article - Herbert also said that it is a violation of federal law for anyone in DWS to turn over that information "no matter how noble they think it is."

    And Utah's citizens still want to run with it. Nice. Fight fire with fire. Nothing like "illegal is illegal, what's so hard to understand about that..." You people are sick. Breaking the law is only bad when it's somebody else.

    Funny thing about this whole thing is it's exactly the same thing from both sides. Illegal immigrants are frustrated with their situation and can't legally do anything to fix it so they take it into their own hands and come here illegally. Anti-immigrant whistleblowers are frustrated with their situation and can't legally do anything to fix it so they take it into their own hands and steal information that was meant to be private and release it publicly. What is the difference?

    Yeah, the system is broken. Yeah, it needs to be addressed. NO, we don't need ordinary people breaking the law to combat illegal immigration. You're only making things more chaotic.

  • comchris
    July 16, 2010 11:51 a.m.

    When did the breaking of one law make it ok to break another? If you break the law, that makes you a criminal and subject to the consequences of your actions. People who are here in this country without proper documentation are criminals. The people who published the lists are criminals. Our elected officials are obligated to enforce our laws and punish all the lawbreakers. Seems rather simple to me.

  • sunnymorsap
    July 16, 2010 11:50 a.m.

    Cawley is a fool. He and others are actually supporting the ones that formed the list!?

    And you people claim to enforce the law against law breakers! All the supporters of those that fromed this list are supporting lawbreakers!

    Think people...such ignorance.

  • Leesha
    July 16, 2010 11:46 a.m.

    The answer to that is simple. It is so much easier to just leave and come here (No one has stopped them so far) where things are already so much better, than to work hard and change things there. There probably are people in Mexico trying to make it better there, but that's a lot of hard work and must seem futile, just like times in our history.

  • Malign
    July 16, 2010 11:44 a.m.

    Funny how this country wants to prosocute people who have legitimate concerns for the well being of the future of our country and it's broken back financial struggles; their children and the fact that the welfare system is flooded with giving handouts to people who have never paid a tax in their lives, but they will do nothing about the ILLEGAL'S that are eating away every paycheck I recieve that 35% of what I earn will never be seen by myself.

  • Hallsy
    July 16, 2010 11:41 a.m.

    These two employees should be fired, then rehired to a new position that works solely on weeding out illegal aliens who are using stolen IDs, trying to register for government assistance, or simply living in the state of Utah illegally. These employees risked their jobs to do what nobody else seems willing to do - protect our sovereignity!

  • CKS007
    July 16, 2010 11:41 a.m.

    So now that we have proof that the state is holding information on illegal immigrants, why is the state not enforcing the law? If the politicians will not enforce the law, then it is time to vote someone else in.

    I'm waiting to hear from the Govenor why the State of Utah is failing in it's duties to it's citizens.

  • JRJ
    July 16, 2010 11:39 a.m.

    How is it Steven Jarvis has access to all the "truth" when the article says the information was being turned over to the authorities for investigation? Either we have to live by the laws of the land or continue to pay for millions of people to live here illegally.

  • oxymoron
    July 16, 2010 11:39 a.m.

    Oh lordy! People, the individuals who have been included on the list - there is no proof if they are even here illegally or not. Maybe some are, maybe some aren't. Your argument that the illegal individuals should be punished but the state employees WHO ALSO BROKE THE LAW should NOT be punished is an idiotic double standard.

    Do not harp on and on about illegals breaking the law, and then turn around and praise others who also break the law.

    please, have a consistent standard.

  • CKS007
    July 16, 2010 11:36 a.m.

    So now that we have proof that the state is holding information on illegal immigrants, why is the state not enforcing the law? If the politicians will not enforce the law, then it is time to vote someone else in.

  • CKS007
    July 16, 2010 11:36 a.m.

    So now that we have proof that the state is holding information on illegal immigrants, why is the state not enforcing the law? If the politicians will not enforce the law, then it is time to vote someone else in.

  • On the other hand
    July 16, 2010 11:34 a.m.

    @FatMountainMan, of course you're right. The law is the law. Prosecute anyone who drives over 65 MPH on the freeway, and double the fines and prosecute anyone who goes over 55 MPH in a construction zone. Also prosecute anyone who changes lanes without turning on their blinker for at least three full seconds before changing lanes. I request--no, insist--that police be posted every 100 yards along the freeway and that all violators be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.

  • oxymoron
    July 16, 2010 11:34 a.m.

    The people on the list "who are using state services illegally" is a misrepresentation of why the people are on the list. Many people in this database are just individuals who have applied for state services but who have been denied them because of their status. There also can be people in the DWS system because they are applying for jobs - you have to have an account with DWS website in order to find out where to apply for jobs.

    I can't believe people are uptight about people who wish to work for a living.

  • Perplexed
    July 16, 2010 11:34 a.m.

    How about we just enforce the law - all of them. Then we will not have a problem with being respecter of persons or their origins. Deportation of people here illegally is what the law calls for, as for the list makers, I imagine we will find out what the penalty is - to the fullest extent of the law. Just enforce the law - all of them.

  • Barry
    July 16, 2010 11:34 a.m.

    So does this mean that all "Whistle Blowers" are law breakers. how does that match with the law that protects the whistle blower? This is a little confusing...

  • WWJD
    July 16, 2010 11:32 a.m.

    let's see.... working in terrible conditions in order to better one's life with out the proper papers: illegal. compiling a list by abusing your power (access) and making the list of private information public: illegal. "defending workers who released data, saying they are patriots and whistle-blowers who deserve praise and not criminal charges.": gestapo.

  • patriotandmore
    July 16, 2010 11:32 a.m.

    These two government employees have more brass than anyone else in government. They should be given a raise and promoted! Our elected officials tinker around the fringes of the law and give lots of lip-service but won't do anything about illegal aliens. Throw out all the spineless politicians and bring them to justice. These illegals who applied for aid are draining the country dry and these two heroes are just trying to bring injustice to light.

  • 1776
    July 16, 2010 11:31 a.m.

    @ FatMountainMan | 11:00 a.m.

    Couldn't have said it better myself. Unfortunately, I predict that all we're going to see is backlash against the government employees.

    The rule of law is vital to the survival of our republic. Arbitrarily not enforcing certain laws because they are unpopular (also known as the rule of men, not the rule of law) leads to mobocracy and/or vigilante behavior. I'm not excusing the actions of the government workers...just explaining it. The government workers should be prosecuted, just as any other law breaker should.

    I have an about equal justice under the law for all individuals.

    "Equal laws protecting equal rights; the best guarantee of loyalty and love of country." --James Madison

  • Veracity
    July 16, 2010 11:30 a.m.

    It is a shame that individuals have to stoop to releasing a list of illegal immigrants to try and put pressure on the government to do their job. And it is a bigger shame that the government has this list and does nothing about it. Who is the real criminal here?

  • scambuster
    July 16, 2010 11:25 a.m.

    chris8484, you want to uphold the law where it concerns illegal immigrants but then give the so-called whistle blowers a pass for breaking the law, making you no better than those who won't prosecute illegal immigrants. Don't forget that the "whistle-blowers" were illegally accessing the files of tens of thousands of legal Utah residents in order to compile their list. That is why they need to be prosecuted to the full extent of the law, then the state needs to ask why the state is providing services to illegal immigrants when it is not legal to do so.

    As FatMountainMan said, the law is the law, and nobody should be above it.

  • BoomerJeff
    July 16, 2010 11:24 a.m.

    The individuals who created the list might not criminals. There is a whistle- blower defense in the privacy law stating if the individual who violates the law believes he or she is exposing government corruption, then they are protected.

  • mkSdd3
    July 16, 2010 11:20 a.m.

    Is it against state law to register for state assistance if you are a foreign national?

    The Governor and Attorney General should be going after the illegals not the whistle blowers.

  • Rob
    July 16, 2010 11:19 a.m.

    I don't think private information should be taken and used like this.
    But why are illegal immigrants using our precious tax dollars. I know we have thousands of people coming into the United States from Mexico every day. I wonder since it is so bad there, why can't the citizens in Mexico put major effort into changing things there? Many people here in the United States have given their lives over hundreds of years to make our Country the way it is. Maybe that is what is needed there. I don't think lives lost is a minor thing. I am so grateful for all the men and women who have given their all for our Country and for freedom around the world.

  • KW
    July 16, 2010 11:18 a.m.

    Give those two workers a promotion. Create a department for them to track down illegals to send home. Why is the Governor looking to prosecute people who should be given a medal. Where will all this end. Why do liberals want to destroy this state and country? Send the illegals home so they can build up, pay taxes in their own country. Why would they want to stay here as non-citizens, with no rights. And we here need to hire Americans because if you haven't noticed, we have a problem here. Its irrelavant that they are such hard workers, and such nice people, they are illegal, and don't belong here. It's sad that it is hard to support their families in mexico, but what will change that? They need to go home and change things there. We don't need change here. We need our jobs back, and our taxes back, and our country back. Close the border and put one-way doors that swing out. If they want to come back, go through the well designed ,properly functioning, system that is already in place that screens and prepares good people to become Americans.

  • ST
    July 16, 2010 11:17 a.m.

    I say give the two state workers promotions and raises.

    The GOVERNMENT should follow the LAW and DEPORT THE ILLEGALS! It is shameful that the State has easy access to a list of ILLEGALS in their own databases and does nothing about it. ENFORCE THE LAW (Burbank and Shirtliff). What if all of us started ignoring laws that we didn't like? If you don't like it the work to change it.

  • DocSarvis
    July 16, 2010 11:17 a.m.

    The state is willing to investigate and prosecute the people who created the list, but unwilling to investigate and prosecute those who are here illegally. Something is sick in America. It won't last.

  • Utefan1
    July 16, 2010 11:17 a.m.

    The State of Utah needs to back up Arizona and the other 9 states that are following and do something about this issue. Enough is enough. If the State of Utah is aware of illegals then they should do something about it. What does the government not understand with the word "illegal"? Illegal is illegal. If we prosecute people for other illegal acts then we should be doing the same thing for illegal immigration. Props to all those fighting for the rights of "legal" citizens and those waiting in line to become citizens.

  • Conservative
    July 16, 2010 11:14 a.m.

    I'm sure a number of State and Federal laws were broken in the haste to point fingers at these unfortunate victims:
    1. Publicizing Social Security numbers is a Federal crime.
    2. Publicizing personal data about minors is a State crime.
    3. Publicizing personal data about citizens (including children born in the U.S.) is a State and possibly a Federal crime.
    4. Publicizing information obtained through confidential process is a State crime.

    Those that committed these crimes should be prosecuted to the extent of the laws. Their deeds cannot be undone. The list has been distributed to a number of news sources and is therefore public information. These criminals are not "Patrots" as some are calling them, any more than those that break and enter and steal your property.

  • Steven S Jarvis
    July 16, 2010 11:13 a.m.


    The answer to your question--because the list wasn't a list of actual illegal aliens. They gathered a list of hispanic sounding names, some legal residents, some US citizens. It is posible some names are illegally here because they didn't file when they turned 18, but all reports so far suggest otherwise.

    The whistle-blowers lied. They are going to face the music for stealing government information.

  • open minded
    July 16, 2010 11:12 a.m.

    If these two people did create and release this list- they should be deported. Why does Cawley want to protect some criminals and not others? Cawley has claimed that illegal immigrants are criminals and yet he wants these two people- who violated the law- to be exempt from their criminal activities. Ultra-conservative hypocrisy is awesome.

  • Fiscal Hawk
    July 16, 2010 11:11 a.m.


    Law abiding citizens are a lot more concerned about prosecuting and deporting ILLEGAL ALIENS than we are about accessing information for "the list." We are tired of having to pay to support ILLEGAL freeloaders!


  • FatMountainMan
    July 16, 2010 11:00 a.m.

    The law is the law: Prosecute to the full extent the government employee(s) who broke privacy laws in obtaining and releasing personal info from the DWS database. And the law is the law: Prosecute to the full extent each every person on that list that is in the US illegally.

  • chris8484
    July 16, 2010 10:56 a.m.

    Why does the state have a list of illegal aliens who are using food stamps and do nothing about this information. The problem seems to lie with Gov. Herbert and state officials who protect illegals, not with the whistle-blowers.