Reid gets warm reception at BYU

He says he's a Demo because of his faith and not in spite of it

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  • Jordan
    Jan. 15, 2010 4:11 a.m.

    Bottom line is Harry supports the government taking, by force if necessary, from those unwilling to give and give it to those they decide that need it. God has never given the power to any man to take what's not his without asking. I don't care if it's good intentioned it's still wrong!! That's all there is to it. He is a Tare among the wheat. Mormon or not he is helping destroy our country.

  • melmanmark
    Nov. 19, 2009 10:37 a.m.

    The problem with Harry Reid isn't that he's a Democrat: it's that he's a Gadianton Robber! Anytime anyone pledges allegiance to an organization, for the sake of the organization ABOVE PRINCIPLE, he is engaging in secret combinations. I don't care how you justify it-it is ALWAYS wrong! Harry Reid says what he does, just like Korihor and Nehor, because it is "pleasing to the carnal mind." He knows what he's doing-and one day he will answer for it. Not to you or me, but he will answer for it.

  • Freshmen
    Sept. 21, 2008 5:15 p.m.

    Tolerance = Respect. Every single one of God's children was given agency. You can not choose how your neighbor lives. Whether or not you agree with Senator Reid's remarks or political views you have no right to judge him and call him "a disgrace to the church." The conservative party and many of the LDS church members need to remember that everyone is entitled to their own opinion and you are just going to have to tolerate their opinion and teach by example. How do you expect to proclaim the Gospel to the world if you can't respect another person's right to an opinion? I don't agree with everything that Harry Reid says or does, but he understands that you can't force the world to have morals and values, and you certainly can't take away someone's agency. So, don't condemn for being a democrat and not voting the same way you do. Instead, practice tolerance: Love your neighbors and respect the right for everyone to have their own opinion.

  • the lies people tell...
    Sept. 7, 2008 8:43 p.m.

    I watched Harry Reid speak and I do not recall him saying that we don't need to worry about abortion. I DO recall him plainly saying that he is pro-life, that there are many democrats who are pro-life, and that he has voted pro-life when he has had the opportunity. Him simply being a member of the democratic party does not mean that he supports abortion or gay marriage. Those of you who are basing your comments on what you read in the article have been misled by the press. Go to the source.

  • Denver Guy
    Oct. 24, 2007 2:35 p.m.

    I live in Denver, CO with my Wife and two children and we are active in the LDS church. I am very discouraged by the comments I see on here. I didn't realize all of the close minded right wing propeganda that alot of people in the LDS church believe in UTAH.
    Republicans don't believe we are Christians!! Period!! I would know I live outside of your state!!

    I see alot of religous zealots on this blog and it frightens me.
    My Brother whom I love very much is Gay and I would fear for his well being along with the way you would treat him if he lived in your state!!

    We Mormons are more tolerant from what I see on here than you that live in what appears to be a very close minded society where you are exclusive and not inclusive.

    I would never raise my children in Utah.

  • Carl
    Oct. 24, 2007 9:03 a.m.

    Interesting that Larry Richman wrote "Cheney said Mormons were ill-served by Benson's (and others') conservative politics" just after bad mouthing Harry Reid.

    WHY do people base their hate and anger toward Harry Reid on news reports of Harry Reid's comments AFTER the speech instead of what he said in his speech?

    We WATCHED the speech on KBYU TV as he spoke and he did NOT make one derogatory comment about Pres. Benson or church leaders.

    Try to find a copy of the actual speech instead of repeating right wing hatred of every member of the Democratic Party.

  • Larry Richman
    Oct. 22, 2007 1:40 p.m.

    What a disgrace! Reid uses BYU for his political agenda. Compare Vice-Presidency Cheney's speech at BYU, where Cheney didnt' bring up politics at all. But Reid used his speech at BYU as a bully pulpit to trash Bush and even past Church President Benson. Cheney said Mormons were ill-served by Benson's (and others') conservative politics. "Members of the church are obedient and followers in the true sense of the word, but these people have taken members of the church down the path that is the wrong path," Reid told reporters Tuesday after speaking at church-owned Brigham Young University.

  • Reid has a serious problem
    Oct. 20, 2007 2:43 p.m.

    Harry Ried comments show his true colors. By dismissing the emphasis of the church leadership concerns regarding abortion, Gay Marriage, and Gay rights he clearly does not believe the following statement from the First Presidency and Quorum of the Twelve stating:

    "...We warn that the disintegration of the family will bring upon individuals, communities, and nations the calamities foretold by ancient and modern prophets.

    "We call upon responsible citizens and officers of government everywhere to promote those measures designed to maintain and strengthen the family as the fundamental unit of society. "
    ("The Family:A Proclamation to the World" 1995)

    It is impossible to believe he has not read this, and more than once. He clearly is decieved and is now propogating on that deceit to others. He is on the road to apostacy.

  • Thomas
    Oct. 18, 2007 12:20 p.m.

    It's interesting to me to note that very few of the comments here were written by those who actually heard the talk. My wife and I attended that day, sat up close, and listened carefully. I assure you that during his talk, Senator Reid said nothing at all about Ezra Taft Benson or Ernest L. Wilkinson. He may have made some comments about the Republican bias of these two men during their time of service to BYU and the Church after his talk, but I assure you he never mentioned either of them during the forum. Since his comments about these two men are off-the-record impressions of Mr. Walch or other newspaper reporters who attended that day, perhaps we shouldn't be so judgmental about what he supposedly said.

    I think what LDS members are urged not to do in the temple is to speak evilly of the Lord's anointed. Surely the injunction extends far beyond the prophet to all anointed LDS members (of whom Senator Reid is one), the deeper question here might be to say, had Senator Reid really spoken evilly of Elder Benson? When he was prophet, President Benson stayed away from his earlier conservative pronouncements. Ponder that.

  • Jono
    Oct. 18, 2007 10:53 a.m.

    I can not understand how any loyal LDS member can open support Harry Reid. He clearly stated that members of the church should stop worrying about abortion and gay rights, but these are the very subject that the First Presidency seems to care about. I am absolutely confused to think that faithful intellegent people don't see this stunt as just that. He called evengelical christians, "anti-christians". Are you kidding me. He is in a position of great power and influence, and his statement is going to hit the news. Imagine the outrage the evengelical community will have. Who do you think they are going to take that frustration out on? Mitt Romney of course. Harry puts politics in front of religion. He is a snake. I ahve no hatred only disbelief. Come on people open your eyes.

  • BYU Grad
    Oct. 17, 2007 8:43 a.m.

    I really appreciated hearing Harry Reid's talk on byub.com. I've grown up in a very conservative family. It bothers me that so many conservatives dismiss liberal Democrats as kooks or lunatics. Saying so is an admission that we can't understand them within our viewpoint, yet a large part of our country follow this party line. They are as American as we are. Refusing to try to understand them is cutting out a large part of our country.

    In the comments above, I see people that won't listen to Senator Reid because they only see his connection to the Daily Kos or Moveon.org or other Democrat senators. I appreciated hearing what I heard as an honest expression of what he believes.

    I believe you can be a Mormon and a Democrat. I don't agree with Senator Reid's positions, but I can understand his criticism that some Republican's only talk about gay marriage and abortion; 2 critical issues, but they clearly are not the only important ones.

    I think going to Iraq was the right choice and we need to win the war, but I do not believe we have fought an effective war for the last 4.5 years.

  • Harry Cult?
    Oct. 16, 2007 10:26 p.m.

    Joseph Smith was against slavery? He must have been a Republican than. A Republican freed the slaves and a Republican gave us the Civil Rights Act. The Mormans are only hurting their cause by embracing the demonic ideals of Harry Reid. Time for some serious soul-searching my people. Harry sounds more like a member of a Methodist Church.

  • Rich
    Oct. 16, 2007 9:38 a.m.

    How can anyone stand for a party that has killed millions of babies and believes in gay marriage. By the way we have had 3000 die in this war and in the same time frame we have lost over 10 million babies to abortions. I do not hear any [D]'s talking about these little ones?

  • Frank
    Oct. 15, 2007 11:56 p.m.

    It's time for that OLD MAN to retire. Reid has gotten so for out of hand he can't be taken seriously anymore.

  • Clark
    Oct. 15, 2007 2:11 p.m.

    To Joe Watts:

    Not sure how you define the vote for the war. If you're talking about Congress' "Authorization for Use of Military Force Against Iraq" in October 2002 (which is what most people are referencing when they talking about this or that senator voting for or against the war), I'm afraid you're dead wrong about Harry Reid. Go to the U.S. Senate's website, look up that resolution (October 11, 2002), pull up the voting record, and find Senator Reid (D-Nev). You'll find a solid "Yea" next to his name. I think you must confusing him with Jack Reed, a Democratic senator from Rhode Island, who certainly voted against the war. But Harry Reid did not--he definitely supported the use of force. You can disagree about the wisdom of the invasion--I for one was opposed to it before it even happened--but please, at least get your facts right before condemning others.

  • Patrick Abernathy
    Oct. 14, 2007 11:44 p.m.

    In a press conference Harry Reid stated: "Members of the Church need to worry less about abortion and gay marriage and more about health care, global warming, education and jobs." I feel nothing is more important than stopping the killing the unborn and thwarting/perverting the sanctity of marriage. Supporting global warming claims that it is man-made will not endear anyone to my God nor will will the type of job h/she holds.

    He mentioned President Benson among past church leaders who have "taken members of the church down a wrong path". He also said the Church leaders have pressed many into being conservative. I was conservative long before I was baptized into the Church and the conservative nature of the Church was a huge draw when I was investigating.

    Also, Reid's bashing a sitting U.S. President from the BYU campus is patently crass and wrong.

    I am very annoyed that Harry Reid was invited to BYU. Almost any other speaker would have been better. I am from the class of 1970. My wife and I are offended by many of his comments at the university where we both graduated. Patrick Abernathy, Saint George Utah.

  • Skeptic
    Oct. 14, 2007 9:29 p.m.

    I am floored that people are so caught up on the message. I guess it is hard not to debate but I think the real story here is that BYU had a voice on campus different from its own. It doesn't matter what the message was, and it didn't matter that students didn't protest, but the fact BYU let a dissenting, different voice create dialog is a significant victory for the school's mission of education. Nice

  • Senior Student
    Oct. 14, 2007 7:22 p.m.

    I am a student at BYU-HAwaii and I am doing a senior thesis paper on Mormon Democrats being "in the closet" about their political views. Would anyone be willing to talk to me about how they view Democrats in the LDS church?

  • Gay Rights
    Oct. 14, 2007 1:28 p.m.

    What is wrong with being gay? I find that religious people say Gays are evil/sinners because the Bible doesn't believe in Gays. So what if the Bible says that? Does that mean that some religious people can harass gay people and smear them? No. Be tolerant for goodness sake.

    The issues of Gay and Abortions aren't important because they are both legal. End of story. Leave it at that and focus on something more urgent right now like the War and Global Warming.

    Both the War and GW are vastly more important than Gay and Abortions because they affect the WHOLE world, not just America. Global Warming will effect each and everything around us. Isn't that more important than banning gay marriages? I believe so.

    So a simple note to all the religious zealots out there:
    Live your life and your beliefs, but don't impose them on others.
    If you don't like gays, don't be gay. If you don't like abortions, don't get an abortion.

    I support Harry Reid because Gays and Abortions is nothing compare to the War and Global warming.

  • Army Guy
    Oct. 14, 2007 1:38 a.m.

    To Open Eyes:

    First, "political" and "rational" should never be used in the same sentence.

    Second, "the tyranny of religious belief?" Who are you, Karl Marx?

    Third, there are many who reject "progressive" ideas.

    Fourth, I will take your advice and question everything, beginning with your point of view. I respect your position, but you can't be serious in calling for the abolishment of all religious beliefs. Do you know how many billions of people in the world you are going to have to convince? Good luck with that. You might need a larger platform than the comments section of the DMN though...

  • Open Eyes
    Oct. 13, 2007 6:13 p.m.

    Mitt is a Mormon; Reid is a Mormon. Both men claim that their political beliefs stem directly from their religious beliefs. What does this tell us? It tells us that religious beliefs are so ambiguous that they are like "Barnum Statements" - they can be interpreted any way you like. And that is where the problem rests. Religious beliefs are practically worthless and are only stirring up disagreement and hatred among people. The solution is for people to stop being duped by religious beliefs. Be skeptical. Question everything. Do not acquiesce to fables, myths, stories of magic underwear, golden bibles, etc. and do not subject yourselves to the spinners of such tales and support them with your money or your time. Free yourselves from the tyranny of religious belief! Only then will political discourse become rational and progressive.

  • Proud Nevada Democrat
    Oct. 13, 2007 1:34 p.m.

    Mitt Romney was a liberal Republican before he decided to run for president. The opposition people have for him can be summed up in 2 points:
    1. People and other Republicans think Mormonism is a cult. They do not think we are Christian.
    2. People and other republicans think that if he is elected, then he will be a puppet for the Mormon church.

    Why do some Mormons want to be affiliated with an organization that hate them? If Mitt were to become president, will he be the president of the Mormons or the President of the United States? He would be elected to represent all of America, not just the Mormon Americans. This is the problem Harry Reid has to deal with. He is required to represent the views of Nevadans.

    As a school teacher, I cannot promote my views and ideas, I have to follow District guidelines, regardless of what I believe. That is my job.

    It is obvious by a lot of the posts, which posters listen to Rush and Hannity. They spew hatrid, name-calling, and bullying. Those are great Christian values that any Republican Mormon can be proud of.

  • LandSteward
    Oct. 13, 2007 1:17 a.m.

    All that I can say about Harry Reid is;

    1. He seems very comfortable with the shady deals that he makes in Nevada. He also took $60K from Lobbyist Jack Abramoff then said he wouldn't return it because it was a "Republican Scandal".

    2. He said in his comments on a Church campus that abortions and being "gay" is OK.

    I seem to recall that a fellow named Korihor seemed to think that everything that a man thought to do was fine as well. Follow him if you wish but I think that a guy who says anything for power and is allowed free speech on a Church campus then lies about Rush Limbaughs free speech of the truly "Phony Soldiers" will never get my support.
    I started out as a liberal Democrat too, voting for Jimmy Carter, (hapless) and Michael Dukakis, (maybe its OK to let the killer Willie Horton out on furlow only to have him kill again). After my older brother gave me the Democratic platform and it contained the abortion issue, I could not and will not be a member of that party anymore. They call it progressive. I call it evil, and getting worse.

  • El David
    Oct. 13, 2007 12:50 a.m.

    Harry Reid D-Nevada speaking at BYU was no big deal to me. Just because I share his religion, doesn't mean he has my support. Mitt shares my religion and I like Guliani as of late.

    As for the comments of "I Am Glad I am Not Mormon", I am glad you are not either. Thanks for leaving the LDS faith. I can sleep better now.

  • Democrat Mormon
    Oct. 13, 2007 12:39 a.m.

    Of course I am not going to stop believing because of what some people are posting on a website. I am the one out there every Sunday trying to talk people into coming back to Church, or at least sending them regular emails. My point is I really did not realize how anti-Democrats many people are deep down. I may be simple-minded (or perhaps one of the "evil learned" since I graduated from ivy league) but I am a Democrat because I oppose war and support helping the needy. In my reading of the scriptures, there is a lot more in there about helping the poor and needy, providing to the less fortunate, opposing violence and war, etc. than there is about making sure taxes are really low (and the reality is the difference between the tax plans of Reps and Dems is miniscule -- maybe Libertarians and Green party but not Reps and Dems) or attacking every country first that even has an inkling of being anti-American. I'm not starting a debate on this; I'm just telling why I am who I am. Like me or hate me, I will always be this way, and always go to Church.

  • Army Guy
    Oct. 12, 2007 10:42 p.m.

    I can help anyone who wants to take Carl's recommendation to join the Army. Let me know...

  • Carl
    Oct. 12, 2007 5:20 p.m.

    Question by Mike Beal at 12:31 PM Oct 11: "Any chance you brothers and sisters in Utah would like a Senator..... We have one we would like to trade!!!! "

    Reply:" YES, we will trade Bob Bennett for your Harry Reid".

    Orrin Hatch at least cares for the health of needy children while Bob Bennett and his cronies Chris Cannon and Rob Bishop lock their heels and keep on voting 100 % for the Decider who made the worst political blunder in history when he started a war against a country that had NOTHING to do with 9/11.

    When will all of you that support the war do something to support it like joining the US Marines or US Army? Take your own warm body to Iraq to show your support instead of placing cheap Made in China "Support Our Troops" banners on your vehicles.

  • anonymous mormon
    Oct. 12, 2007 3:40 p.m.

    Thanks Re: Democrat Mormon, for proving a lot of points. Mostly that too many people have lost their rational minds.

  • Re: Democrat Mormon
    Oct. 12, 2007 3:34 p.m.

    To Brother Democrat Mormon,
    I am a Republican Mormon that agrees that there is a lot of condemning of Democrats in this dialog. I get tired of the politics of division that individuals of both parties practice. I believe that if we are
    arguing for political parties, and criticizing each other for our differences of political philosophy, then we are putting our trust in the arm of flesh (see 2 Ne. 28: 31) and we are worshiping false idols.

    But are you really going to stop worshiping God (or even give thought to the possibility), because someone criticized you? Or was your statement just histrionic manipulation?

    By the way, it says in Mosiah 11:3, speaking of the wicked King Noah:
    "And he laid a tax of one fifth part of all they possessed, a fifth part of their gold and of their silver, and a fifth part of their bziff, and of their copper, and of their brass and their iron; and a fifth part of their fatlings; and also a fifth part of all their grain."

    And that is not all, in Mosiah 7:15, King Limhi equates their taxation by the Lamanites to bondage.

  • Dropped the ball
    Oct. 12, 2007 2:55 p.m.

    I think our bishops have their work cut out for them. Some of these posts are giving everybody else a bad name.

  • Army Guy
    Oct. 12, 2007 2:19 p.m.

    To Huh?:

    Check Mosiah 11:1-6. It doesn't say "too high," but it says King Noah "changed the affairs of the kingdom" by introducing the 20% tax on everything. It also says the people had to "labor exceedingly" to pay the tax... No, it doesn't say "too high," but this is certainly not an endorsement of the tax. Is that a fanatical interpretation?

    And to Anonymous 12:04pm:

    You're right. If you don't believe EXACTLY what someone else does, you have no right to quote them. What?!! Christianity is Christianity, and the LDS faith is part of it, whether you like it or not. We don't need permission to quote Lewis or any other Christian philospher just because they view the nature of God differently. And, it's not plagiarism if credit is given to the original author. Get a clue.

  • anonymous
    Oct. 12, 2007 1:41 p.m.

    I get the biggest kick out of listening Mormons' trying to out-Mormon other Mormons. So ... WHO'S NUMBER ONE? WHO'S NUMBER ONE? ...

  • Reid Reid Reid
    Oct. 12, 2007 1:11 p.m.

    I am a bit surprised how many Mormon Dems in here completely overlook Reid's approach in suppressing free speech on AM radio, especially Rush Limbaugh's "phony soldier" remarks that were taken out of context by Media Matters and then distorted even more by Reid on the Senate floor.

    Reid being a Democrat has nothing to do with the criticisms he is receiving in here. It is his ability to endorse politics that are not in the best interest of church members let alone millions of American citizens. It is his ability to distort facts and spin them for his own purposes.

    If Orrin Hatch or Gordon Smith or any other LDS Senator was doing what Reid is they would receive just as much scrutiny. If misrepresenting facts for political gain is part of the LDS culture and doctrine then Reid is fitting in just fine.

  • Amen to sulla
    Oct. 12, 2007 12:27 p.m.

    Amen to the comments by sulla. One day we can dispose of both parties and the American system itself when the Kingdom returns again to the earth.

  • Once again, read the book!
    Oct. 12, 2007 12:22 p.m.

    In response to my previous post by Doug, all I am saying is for you to understand church history a little better. The McKay biography by Prince is a great illustration of the actual disagreement among the brethren during the 1960s as a result of Benson's flamboyant political beliefs. I am talking members of the Twelve and First Presidency who were very disturbed and in disagreement with many of the things he said. So be careful to label all of his words at the time (that is, prior to becoming Church President), and books, as the pure word of God because as is evident by the disagreement he engendered among those brethren who represent the word of God as a whole, his words and stances were not in harmony with the Brethren. So you see, there is some substance to what Reid said about Benson although I disagree with the manner in which he approached the topic. All members of the Church need to exercise caution in defining true doctrine in the church from opinion and even speculation. Not every word spoken by the brethren should be considered official church doctrine.

  • Anonymous
    Oct. 12, 2007 12:04 p.m.

    Mormons must stop quoting CS Lewis. He believed in a Trinitarian theology, and all the wonderful "insights" you Mormons plagiarize from him are based on that Trinitarian doctrine - a doctrine your Elder Holland explicitly rejected and mocked in Conference!

  • Huh?
    Oct. 12, 2007 11:28 a.m.

    The Book of Mormons says NOTHING about tax rates being "too high"! What kind of fanatic, misinterpretation is that? Give us a break!

  • sulla
    Oct. 12, 2007 11:11 a.m.

    One can be Mormon and [fill in the blank], but CS Lewis' "Screwtape Letters" has it right - when we practice "Christianity AND" rather than "mere Christianity" we fall straight into the eternal enemy's camp.

    Dividing into slavering hordes of Democrat-ites and Republican-ites devoted to each others' destruction sounds very familiar to readers of the Book of Mormon. The only correct side is God's, and He has no party. He has only Zion, and if we want to flee to it, we need to drop our rhetorical arms and our warrior spirits and remember that we are brothers and sisters.

  • Will
    Oct. 12, 2007 10:31 a.m.

    I believe you can be a good member and affliate yourself with whatever party as long as you project your true beliefs.

    I wonder how Mr. Reid reconciles himself with the statement "Do you support, affliate with, or agree with any group or individual whose teachings or practices are contrary to or oppose those accepted by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints?"

  • anonymous
    Oct. 12, 2007 7:54 a.m.

    These hate-filled postings towards Brother Reid, clearly show the insane power of right-wing extremists like Rush Limbaugh. I wish his fans would listen to some relaxing music instead.

  • Boy
    Oct. 12, 2007 12:09 a.m.

    Reid should be praised for some things and booed for others. I am a conservative who is pro choice, but wishes with all my heart that people (women and men) would make better choices concerning their sexual relationships and, if pregnancy resulted, would plead with every woman to keep the baby.

    As for the war, I don't think Reid is correct. The war is one of those issues that polarize people. And it's causing a lot of good people to side with Hillary ONLY because Bush has mismanaged the war. This is a bad reason to vote for Hillary. There are plenty of good conservatives who would do a better job (McCain and Giulianni to name a few) with the war.

    Taxes: The Book of Mormon says that a 20% tax rate is too high, so I think any candidate that wants taxes above 20% for ALL people is not leading properly in that regard.

  • Joe Watts
    Oct. 11, 2007 11:34 p.m.

    There have been several posts, very sanctimonious posts, that have condemned Senator Reid for voting for the war and then opposing it.

    He didn't vote for the war. He got it right! The peacemakers were outvoted by the warmongers---simple as that.

    So your condemnation of Senator Reid is based in error----but it won't matter to most of you, because you don't really care about the facts. America can do no wrong with you. The church leaders can do no wrong with you. Facts, truth, and justice be damned.

    Senator Reid was the only Mormon in the Senate to vote against the war. To me he is the giant in the room. It may have been the most important vote in the Senate in the past 50 years and only about 30 of them got it right.

    Going to war against Iraq was a criminal act---the most heinous crime a nation can commit.

    Our flag should be flying at half-mast in mourning of our inglorious and barbarous attack on our innocent brothers and sisters who had never threatened us.

    We should be going through 'sack cloth and ashes' repentance ceremonies.

  • Democrat Mormon
    Oct. 11, 2007 11:28 p.m.

    I'm a Mormon Democrat but I never realized how many people in my own Church are condemning me to hell for being one. Seriously, I feel like I need to reconsider some things, like whether I should be slaving away so much every week for my calling or paying so much of my money every year to tithing, all for a group of people who deep down hate me. Just for perspective, I have a significant Priesthood leadership calling and also have an income in the top 1% of Americans. I didn't go to BYU but I donate to the school and am proud to be affiliated with it through my church membership. But I never realized there was so much hidden vitriole toward members like me who are Democrats. I'll have to remember not to let my kids know about our party affiliation or they'll be bullied right out of Sunday School and nursery. It's a crazy world we live in.

  • Nevada Boy
    Oct. 11, 2007 11:12 p.m.

    Senator Reid-what a simpleton. If he really believe the large number of LDS people are republican because of social issues; he has been in DC far to long. The principle of government welfare (something for nothing)which he so loving claims to be based on the LDS doctrine seem far from my understanding of principles of self reliance I have been taught. The modern democratic party wants to remove consequences from people's choice-this to seems opposite of things I have been taught. Being a Nevada native, Senator Reid is in political peril. Every time he seems to be struggling he tries to uses his religion to shore up support. Without republican LDS members in Nevada he cannot get re-elected. The most ironic thing to me, if Mitt gets the republican nod, the democrats will have a hard time using the church as a weapon. Why will it be OK for Senator Reid to be LDS, but not Mitt??

  • Army Guy
    Oct. 11, 2007 10:47 p.m.

    I'm sorry...did Military Historian just equate Utah-LDS-Republicans with Hitler? Wow, maybe your screen name should have been "I don't understand military history..."

    Clearly, a lot of the comments on this board are over the top. There are some who probably even regret their postings by now. This is an emotional subject for a lot of people, and it shows. But to suggest that somehow our church members in Utah are paving the way for the rise of another fascist dictator, well, that's just utter ignorance. Who would that Hitler-esque leader even be? Let people vent and go get some perspective.

  • I was there...
    Oct. 11, 2007 10:38 p.m.

    I was there before Mr. Reid's forum address as he took questions from a small group of those of us majoring in political science at BYU.

    I was there when he compared his sons' missionary service to serving in the military.

    I was there when he told us that when he voted against the Marriage amendment he did it without reservation.

    I was there when he told us that the war on terrorism would be won by the Democrats sending over a diplomatic group to talk and reason with the terrorists.

    I was there to stand and tell him to his face that the aforementioned idea was extremely ignorant.

    I was there to ask him if he truly believed that it would be Democrat policies that would defeat terrorism, then why did Clinton do nothing after the WTC bombings in 1993?

    I was there to see the look of shock on his face.

    I was there as he "answered" my question by praising Clinton for his "wonderful" foreign policy and blaming President Bush for the rise of Fatah.

    And I was there, walking away afterward, thinking that either he doesn't mind lying, or his brain is just wired differently.

  • Chad
    Oct. 11, 2007 10:08 p.m.

    Supreme Court decisions are not irrevocable. That is why I only can support those I know will defend the sanctity of marriage and the life of the unborn. It is a false notion that Supreme Court decisions can never be overturned.

  • bt
    Oct. 11, 2007 10:06 p.m.

    Lest any of you are actually worried that the title of this article represents BYU as a whole, it doesn't. Those of us BYU students from Nevada who actually know a thing or two about Reid's voting record and political habits were not standing at the door to welcome him with a handshake and a cookie. The standing ovation was given by a few. The minority will always be loud, and that's what gets the headlines. The controversy all over campus the past few days has been hilarious. Pres. Samuelson might have asked us to give him a "warm welcome" in his intro, but rest assured most of us can spot a wolf in sheep's clothing.

    And as far as the whole "stop attacking a faithful member of the church" argument goes, would your bishop still be as respectable if he told his congregation that the prophet was leading them astray? Would your mission president be the great man you looked up to if he ignored the council of the brethren and lobbied for gay marriage rights? "Brother in the gospel" or not, he's made some choices that simply aren't congruent with our beliefs.

  • dpamm
    Oct. 11, 2007 9:24 p.m.

    I've become a "Reagan Democrat". I'm tired of church members criticizing Democrats. At the beginning of WWII most members of the church were Democrats. My mother is a Democrat. You will never find a more faithful Latter-day Saint than my Mother. She's a Democrat because she's a teacher and Republicans don't take responsibility to adequately care for our teachers.

    You Republicans should consider whether the Republican Party actually cares more about abortion at all. The issue has become a blurred line. As Sen. Reid stated, he's been pro-life during his entire career. Mitt Romney has been adamantly pro-CHOICE for over 30 years (see his 1994 Senate campaign debate with Ted Kennedy). Rudy Giuliani is pro-choice. Colin Powell is pro-choice. I'm pro-life but it doesn't control my party affiliation as it has for the past 20 years. That's due to the change in position by our Republican party leaders, not a change in my values.

  • anonymous
    Oct. 11, 2007 8:40 p.m.

    Excellent observation Bart Mortensen. These are truly the nastiest of nasty times. What would you expect from a group of people that even slam people trying to help others calling them "do-gooders?"
    What can you say? It's a world gone mad.

  • Military Historian
    Oct. 11, 2007 8:38 p.m.

    LDS wards/stakes are all over the world. There are LDS members of various political parties. Ask
    members in China, Indonesia, India, Ghana, Nigera,the European nations, Central and South America, Japan,etc, what political parties they are members of. Not one of them will say "Utah Republican", and many don't even know what a Republican is. All that is important is that the Gospel is taught and people accept it and live it as best they can with whatever government is in power. You are not asked in any country when you join the church what your political affiliation is at the time of baptism or thereafter. The LDS church is a global church embrasing many cultures, societies and political affiliations. You in Utah who are US Republicans represent a minority of political beliefs worldwide that many in other nations just don't even care about. What I do care about are fellow members of the LDS faith who pontificate the kind of vitriolic fanaticism I have read in some of the above comments, and you wonder how Hitler came to power. Keep it up as your real master enjoys conflict, especially within the church. "Never Again" seems to be lost on you.

  • Bart Mortensen
    Oct. 11, 2007 8:10 p.m.

    Excellent job, Mr. Reid. Me wonders though, what the point is in casting your pearls before so many swine. A vast majority of the posting people here are so out of it that it's a disgrace--and this from a lifelong Republican who has just switched parties. You can only lie to me so many times and I get the point.

  • Harold
    Oct. 11, 2007 8:03 p.m.

    I am not a member of the LDS church, I was raised in Salt Lake and live in Nevada. Why is it that everyone questions Mitt Romney as being a Mormon, but not Harry Reid. Most people in Nevada and the rest of the nation have no idea he is LDS. I think his attack on the Christian right is disgusting. They are more in line with the LDS Church in their political thinking, than Harry Reid is. I find him to be disgusting and quite frankly a liar.

  • Franklin
    Oct. 11, 2007 7:58 p.m.

    There seem to be a lot of recurring themes here. Like, Boy those Utah people sure are dumb - glad I am not (or no longer) one of them. We're glad you are not,also. But give people some credit and stop making blanket judgments.

    We shouldn't judge others. I agree we shouldn't judge Sen. Reid personally, but he came to the University and made public political statements. We
    can certainly make judgments about those all day long if we want. And I intend to do so.

    Democrats really care about people. If you buy into the fallacy that the only way to "care" about people is to demand more taxing and spending on their behalf then I guess this is true. I disagree that compulsory Socialism is the only way to really "show you care" however.

    Democrats can be good Mormons too. Of course, what's your point? As regards to Sen. Reid's personal behavior and actions I cannot comment. I know that publicly he has lied, degraded other politicians, supported abortion, gay marriage and socialism. I don't judge him personally, but condemn his public support of these things.

    And he is way off track with regard to the military.

  • Ace
    Oct. 11, 2007 7:19 p.m.

    Hey, Scotwright, I am with you on this. HE is a complete disgrace to the state of Nevada, Utah and to the LDS church. My family grew up with him and his family in Las Vegas. He was really nice and all that stuff back then, until he got into politics
    and now he thinks that he is GOD himself!! Makes me glad that I am not a democrat, if I was, I would change immediately. What he believes in, is not what the church believes in, plain and simple. Harry Reid needs to stop telling people to stop worrying about abortion and other things, HELLO, Harry, who do you think you are?? This is my free- agency and my free-agency tells me that I need to follow the example the church has taught me and what I believe in also. Don't stand there and tell me what I can or cannot believe in. I am sorry that BYU let you come to speak and for you to tell everyone that Bush is wrong, think about your own life and where you went wrong!!!! Stop blaming everyone for YOUR mistakes!!!!!!!!!

  • Doug Brockbank
    Oct. 11, 2007 7:15 p.m.

    To "Read the Book" above...

    What specific stances did President Benson, a former Prophet, make in his teaching us about the "Proper Role of Government" that we should be so threatened by? We should be threatened when the highest ranking Democrat in the Senate...
    - Votes against the Marriage Ammendment (endorsed by the Church)
    - Says he pro-life but undermines that position by speaking against Alito after that Justice was the swing vote upholding the ban on partial-birth abortion (The Church has an official position against abortion).
    - Emboldens our enemy during wartime, and threatens our troops by calling the war "lost" and Bush a "liar".
    - Suggests Joseph Smith as a progressive would be a liberal Democrat like him.
    - Easily dismisses the importance of family values, protection of the flag, and marriage as being between a man and woman.
    - Says a past prophet took us down the wrong path, and thereby undermining his authority.

    Therefore, for those who say, "Yes, you can be a ood Mormon and a Democrat (or at least a Democrat like Senator Reid), please explain that to me...

  • DCrawford
    Oct. 11, 2007 7:15 p.m.

    I only know Sen. Reid by his works.

    1. He stands with those who would destroy the family. I don't care what he professes. You can't get in the pig pen with the pigs without getting some of the pigs on you.

    2. Regardless of his position on the war, for him to stand on the floor of the Senate as a leader and state that the war is lost is treasonious.

    3. He is openly in favor of forcing me to subsidize social programs and policies that are contrairy to my core beliefs.

    4. He supports a "Progressive Judiciary" that will continue to reinterpret the fundamental basis for our laws.

    5. He fails to be stand up for the rights of others not of his party.

    He is perfect to represent Nevada, The state without a soul. Sen. Reid is proof that not all that happens in Vegas, stays in Vegas.

  • Al
    Oct. 11, 2007 5:45 p.m.

    Free agancy, free thinkers? How about moral agency and moral thinkers. If more voters had been concerned about morals, Bush and Cheney would not have been elected. We winced at the immorality of the last president of the US but at least he didn't take out the infrastructure of a nation whose government did not attack us. The promise in the Book of Mormon is that if we become an offensive nation we lose the protection of the Lord. We don't go to war to protect our business assets or to expand the "Core" for furthering business. I am contently amazed at how many LdSs do not understand the message of the Book of Mormon. But then again, I don't see enough voters who follow the facts and can critically think.

  • James
    Oct. 11, 2007 5:44 p.m.

    One should be open minded if one has not investigated and evaluated the options available. The fact that most LDS have similar political views, for those who are confused, is due to the ability of most to understand doctrine in relationship to the political landscape today. Some comments here may seem overzealous but our freedoms and families face threats that are endorsed by Senator Reids party.

    Much has been made of our LDS leaders with Democrat ties. I do not believe that any of them endorse the democrat agenda. Elder Jensen said a couple of years back that the democrats need LDS people to help shape the party agenda. I dont think they are having success in accomplishing that.

    Much has been made of the hostility of the religious right toward LDS. I can cooperate with them in standing against immorality and corruption without their endorsement of the church. That compares to standing with the democrats which include the drug traffickers, criminals, pedophiles, etc.

    We can and should discuss Senator Reid civilly and showing respect. But not every man with good intentions is heading in the right direction.

  • Anti-crony
    Oct. 11, 2007 5:38 p.m.

    Any reasonable reading of Utah history would show that Mormon beliefs (in the early years) fall more in the communitarian camp than the supposed "free market" camp of supposed conservatives. It's "Republican v Democrat" devisiveness promoted by the "powers that be" and fooling the public with fake sentiments re abortion, gay rights, and immigration that distracts the common voters from the crimes committed against them and in their name by the ruling, "conservative" cronies who keep the common people working harder for less. ONE PARTY government, church and business dominance is bad for the common people. The cronies love it, though. I read their comments, or the comments by their willing shills, everyday to understand this. EVERYTHING, virtually, these cronies say and do goes against and distorts the lessons of our founders.

  • anonymous
    Oct. 11, 2007 5:34 p.m.

    Isn't it sad what is happening in this country?
    After 9/11 the country was united. Today it's liberal v conservative; dem v repub; and even Mormon v Mormon. These truly must be the last days.

  • Read the Speech
    Oct. 11, 2007 4:47 p.m.

    I read Harry Reid's speech online. It is not as caustic as it some in here are saying but it is also pretty boring. I am glad Reid has strong testimony of the gospel and expressed that in his speech. But overall it is a run of the mill "I spoke at BYU on Tuesday" address.

    Senator Reid's support of US military personnel has been limited and the speech showed that with his chatter about commendable service and mentioning how great the Peace Corps and VISTA programs are in his opinion and comparing them to King Benjamin plea to help you fellow beings. He didn't express anywhere in his speech that serving in the military was honorable or even an option to serve your country.

    His mention that there would be more LDS democrats in the future seemed a bit bold considering the latest platform of his party is one of the least friendly to those who are members of the LDS church.

    Reid is boring but Mormon and I am sure God loves him as much of anyone else on earth.

  • johnny cobert
    Oct. 11, 2007 4:38 p.m.

    I have read a goodly amount of the wave of rhetoric generated by Senator Reid. If nothing else, he has raised us from our bed of lethargy. It does boil by brain chemistry, though, to be told I am a "self-righteous hypocrite" because I am against abortion and in favor of the death penalty. In my layman's mind, these two issues are not on the same side of the plate. Interesting that the individual who brought this out DID NOT identify themselves. I admit, with no reservation, that I am active LDS and live in Texas. Only lived in Utah when I went to BYU many moons ago. I am not an intellectual. Some of the good folks who have made comments here could blow me out of the water with their superior ability to voice rethoric. Bottom line, Senator Reid did not sway me one little bit. I am now more firmly entrenched in my determination to follow the counsel of my leader, President Hinckley and whoever
    may succeed him till the day I die. Call me brainwashed or whatever you choose. That's OK. My thinking is, if I do this I will be safe.

  • Anonymous
    Oct. 11, 2007 3:55 p.m.

    Right on "ashamed"! Render onto Caesar the things that are Caesar's and ... (you know the rest)
    But don't tell this to some of these angry posters. It might freak them out.

  • ashamed!!!!
    Oct. 11, 2007 3:37 p.m.

    I am ashamed at the backbiting and sniping going on towards a fellow church member! Agree, don't agree - whatever! Brother Reid is our brother and has as strong a testimony as anybody I know. I would be honored if he was my home teacher, or bishop or even stake president!

  • Separation
    Oct. 11, 2007 3:20 p.m.

    At least one person has mentioned "Seperation of Church and State" - I don't have time to read every comment so I just wanted to post a fact here in case anyone else is thinking about it. There's nothing in the Constitution that mentions "Separation of Church and State." What it says is, "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or
    prohibiting the free exercise thereof." That's the first line in the First Amendment. That doesn't mean that a President or other elected official can't be religious, or be guided by their own personal beleifs, but rather that the government is to establish no official religion of the US.

    I beleive it's possible to be a Mormon and a Democrat. I also beleive it's possible to profess Mormon (or any other religion) beleifs without being a true Christian. Most of our Founding Fathers called themselves Democrats (because they were rebelling againt the Monarchy - they wanted a Democracy) and they were all Christians. Sadly, politics and religion have both changed a lot since then.

    That being said I'm dissapointed - but not surprised - by Mr. Reid's remarks.

  • anonymous
    Oct. 11, 2007 3:19 p.m.

    I love it when people get all preachy on these blogs.

  • Anonymous
    Oct. 11, 2007 2:15 p.m.

    The gospel is perfect not the people!

  • Marisa
    Oct. 11, 2007 2:08 p.m.

    I think I'll start worrying more about healthcare and global warming when President Hinckley starts making statements about them. So far, the Church has made statements about the damaging effects that abortion and same-gender attraction have on our society. I guess I'll just have to stick to my conservatism.

  • FDR vs W
    Oct. 11, 2007 1:48 p.m.

    Brother Reid says that FDR is his hero and that W is the worst president ever. But FDR did all the same things that Reid hates about W, only he did them much worse.
    1. After 12/7 FDR gets Congress to approve war with Japan. He then goes and wages an illegal war with Italy and Germany who had nothing to do with 12/7, distracting him from the real goal of bringing justice to the perpetrators of 12/7.
    2. FDR wastes the lives of 182,070 American soliders in his illegal war with Italy and Germany. The real war with Japan only cost 106,207. (And these are only the combat deaths.)
    3. FDR abuses civil liberties with severe rationing, controls on free speech (both individual and press), wiretapping, surveillance, and the racist seizure of property and interment of Japanese Americans in concentration camps without charges or trial.
    4. FDR starts his own WMD program and tests it on American soil, and effectively against American citizens.
    I guess W just hasn't gone far enough to gain Brother Reid's approval.

  • KingM
    Oct. 11, 2007 1:13 p.m.

    If you believe that abortion is wrong, but the spirit is eternal (as is the LDS belief system), shouldn't you be happy when non-religious people have abortions? After all, this just gives these spirits a better chance of being born into an LDS family (or at least some other Christian family).

  • Anonymous
    Oct. 11, 2007 12:52 p.m.

    Are people seriously continuing to defend the ill-fated justifications Bush used for his premptive strike on Iraq? Again I ask, where were the WMDs?

  • Forum vs. Commencement
    Oct. 11, 2007 12:49 p.m.

    Also, please realize folks, this was a forum, not a commencement address - this distinction is necessary to understanding the context behind the comments by Reid and Cheney. A forum is purposely focused on more secular topics; it is usually an opportunity for BYU to invite a specialist or expert to discuss his/her research and experience. So it very well makes sense that Reid would discuss politics, as this is his occupation and expertise. So please understand the differences in the settings for these discourses in your disparaging comments against Reid.

  • BC
    Oct. 11, 2007 12:44 p.m.

    Spell check hint to one of the posts on this blog containing an otherwise admirable attempt to both use and refer to civility in engaging in a discussion:
    The latin phrase referring to personal attack is spelled "Ad Hominem". The complete phrase is "Argumentum Ad Hominem" and is translated "argument against the man".
    "Homonym", interestingly is a member of group of words with the same spelling or pronunciation, but different meaning. Hence "homonym" is a homonym of "hominem" (more or less).
    Amusing.

  • Republican enemies
    Oct. 11, 2007 12:41 p.m.

    Isn't it interesting that Mormons have so blindly followed the Republicans for years when it was the same Republican Party during the 19th century that tried to destroy the LDS Church because of polygamy. Wasn't polygamy one of the twin relics of barbarism, along with slavery, that the Republican Party sought to destroy?

  • Mike Beal
    Oct. 11, 2007 12:31 p.m.

    Any chance you brothers and sisters in Utah would like a Senator..... We have one we would like to trade!!!!

  • used to work for Reid
    Oct. 11, 2007 12:27 p.m.

    Quit working for Reid in Nevada over 20 years ago, and became a republican because of contradictory actions of mr Reid. It's not the parties it's what the parties stand for and how that will effect our children and grandchildren. I'm very sure Mr Reid would have no objection to the church leaders whole hardedly supporting his views. But Reid gets flack and will always get flack because his legislative agenda and church affiation are in conflict.
    Reid degrades a truely God fearing man in the White House who took out a weapon of mass distruction and saw him executed. Don't be confused between weapons and tools. However, Reid openly adored and protected a man who openly cheated on his family disgraced the office and taught that it was ok to lie. Thousands of souldiers have died under Pres. Bush for the sake of liberty, and they new why they died. Millions upon millions of little American baby boys and girls have been murdered, executed, under the consenting nod and open defense of mr reid. And now he says, don't be concerned with that,
    because he dodges everything and leaves you and your family holding the Bag. Follow the Money!

  • W vs FDR
    Oct. 11, 2007 12:21 p.m.

    1. After 9/11 W gets Congress to approve a war in Afghanistan. He subsequently gets approval for a war in Iraq. He didn't need the approval for Iraq; the war from 1990 never ended. Iraq failed to comply with the terms of surrender and fire on our patrol aircraft at least every week. Just because Bubba chose to ignore it doesn't mean that we were not still engaged in a war.
    2. The cost of the Iraq war (this decade) has been the least costly war in terms of life and treasure in US history. Do some history folks (and be sure to account for inflation).
    3. W's wartime record on civil liberties has actually been mediocre. However, he has not taken as draconian measures as other presidents in other wars. In some ways this has been his weakness. With no sacrifice, the American citizenry feels no connection with the success or failure of this war.
    4. WMDs were one of several justifications given for the Iraq war. It was based on intelligence believed to be correct by a vast majority of Congress and the White House. It was also unnecessary (see #1 above).

  • READ THE BOOK!
    Oct. 11, 2007 12:11 p.m.

    I would encourage all to read Gregory Prince's biography on President David O. McKay in order to realize some of the great contention that Benson caused among the brethren during the 1960s as a result of his overzealous, extreme political views. Then you will realize that, contrary to what you might think, there were many of the brethren that disagreed with his views and as such, we should all be reluctant to characterize such views as the pure word of God. Such a story tends to undercut some of the premise behind such conservative-promoting books like Prophets, Principles, and National Survival.

  • whoa nelly
    Oct. 11, 2007 12:08 p.m.

    WOW...you folks are the reason that mormons are looked at with a jaundiced eye by "outsiders".

    UHHH...see any issues here with religion and politics mixing together anyone? Anyone? Anyone?

  • anonymous
    Oct. 11, 2007 12:08 p.m.

    After being away from SLC for a while I see things are just as wacky as ever.

  • Clark
    Oct. 11, 2007 12:04 p.m.

    There's been a lot of talk about why Dick Cheney was protested at BYU but not Harry Reid. Most of the comments regarding this issue have been made by people who aren't at BYU and have no idea what they're talking about. Yes, liberal students here protested Dick Cheney, and yes, there is a glaring inconsistency between saying that Dick Cheney's visit amounts to Church endorsement and not saying the same for Harry Reid's visit.

    However, the reality is that there was no protest of Harry Reid not because everyone welcomed him, which was certainly not the case, but because most of us who disagree with him felt that a protest would be inappropriate. I agree wholeheartedly.

    Protesting is a wonderful right we enjoy, but if used too often it loses its effectiveness and hurts true political dialogue. In this case, there has been more than enough dialogue (just look at this site!), and everyone has been able to express their approval or disapproval, so why protest?

  • SLC Native
    Oct. 11, 2007 11:49 a.m.

    To all those who say LDS (well, Utah LDS, actually) aren't anti gay, just read all these posts above: "Gay Rights, Gay Marriage, Gay Marriage, GAY MARRIAGE!" ad nauseum. Tell me, are our gay brothers and sisters not tax-paying, American Citizens? Do they not deserve legal rights for their families? Why such derision for them? All of you should try living a day in their shoes, then you might not be so quick to condemn them.

  • Politics
    Oct. 11, 2007 11:45 a.m.

    Many Republicans and Democrats have posted. All profess to be good LDS. Is it "possible" that both Republicans and Democrats can be recommend holding Mormons?

    And what about people from other countries. Should we "allow" Mormons from Amsterdam, South Africa, Germany, Italy, Mexico, Russia etc. to hold Temple Recommends.

    Vent all that you want, have your opinions, and judge who you will, but with all due respect, unless you allow others their opinion, what makes you think you deserve the right to your own.

    Personally, I came out of conference week feeling super strong, and right now many make me feel my religion is a tad soiled. I guess it is my testimony in the gospel (not the members,prophets, or senators) that keeps me strong.

  • New Okie
    Oct. 11, 2007 11:39 a.m.

    Did he say that President Benson led members (if unintentionally) down the wrong political path? This man continually makes me speechless... I don't know whether to apologize for him or just ignore him. AAAAAAAGGGGGHHHH.

  • Carl
    Oct. 11, 2007 11:36 a.m.

    WHEN will all those who support the War in Iraq stand up and join the US Marine Corps or the Army Infantry? If too old, take your children or grandchildren to sign up to go to Iraq to help fight this War of Choice in Iraq.

    Talking about supporting the War in Iraq is cheap. Actually carrying a weapon as a Marine or a Soldier would give REAL proof of your commitment.

  • Read the Family Proclamation
    Oct. 11, 2007 11:16 a.m.

    Reid may not believe it important, but the proclamation to the family says that "calamnities foretold by ancient and modern prophets will come upon any nation that doesn't uphold the family and marriage between man and woman" Okay, I'm paraphrasing, and have bad spelling. But that is what it says. Not important? when the idea of marriage is under constant attack? with Harry Reid leading the charge?

  • Steve - Las Vegas
    Oct. 11, 2007 11:01 a.m.

    As a Nevadan and a Mormon, I am embarrassed by Senator Reid. He is a black eye on the Church. Wrapping his heresy up in his testimony, sounds a lot like the way Satan gets someone to take a step down a slippery slope. Casually throwing away the issue of same sex marriage and abortion by focusing attention on global warming and saying those are more important than issues that are at the heart of Christianity, leaves me wondering if he really does have a testimony of the Gospel. Accepting President Hinckley as a Prophet of God, while throwing the Proclamation on the Family into the mud, and then saying that Church Leaders have spoken wrongly about conservative issues is Heresy! Saying that Mormons are leaving the Republican Party in droves is a great example of "Democrat magic", that if you say something from a podium, it must be true. Mr Reid, I know Baloney when I hear it, and you Sir, are full of it. The truth is you are an Embarrassment to the Church and to Christian values. Comparing yourself to Joseph Smith is like comparing Korihor to President Hinckley. Shame on you!

  • Negativity
    Oct. 11, 2007 11:00 a.m.

    Hey, you people who don't like negative comments -- don't read forums. IF we disagree with someone who is publicizing views we abhor, we have the right to complain. You can stick your head in the sand; it won't change facts. And that fact is that many people are disappointed in Harry Reid and his political stance. I admire him in many respects, but his fight to preserve Roe v. Wade is as wrong as that decision was, in my opinion. Remember, what really counts in America nowadays is the 5-4 vote in the Supreme Court. With one different vote, the court could not have made some of the mistakes it has made and would have made many more mistakes in recent years. The chief reason I vote Republican is to keep the court from going liberal. I don't trust the Republicans any more than I trust the Democrats. But I think they give us a better chance of keeping the Supreme Court from becoming an unelected and superceding legislative branch.

  • Glen
    Oct. 11, 2007 10:55 a.m.

    Bravo for Harry Reid, and kudos to BYU for extending the invitation. I hope that most of the hateful comments on this board are not from BYU grads, because they would represent the university very poorly and reinforce the stereotypes already out there.

  • Patrick J. Morris
    Oct. 11, 2007 10:26 a.m.

    I think people like Reid are just a start of a movement of people that will try to undermine the prophet and God's church. I don't see a better way to weed out people than to have the church 'split'. Don't be fooled by Reid or his 'fancy' words.

    Belonging to a particular political party doesn't matter. However, the more important thing is what does your party believe and are you supporting that?

    Harry Reid, may say one thing, but in reality he fully supports all the evils of our society. He is using the church for evil purposes and I would like to see someone critize him for it.

    He says jobs and health care are more important than abortion and gay marriage. I would rather be jobless and sick in the city of Enoch than well off in Sodom and Gomorrah.

    Follow the prophet not Harry Reid.

  • Issues
    Oct. 11, 2007 9:56 a.m.

    Issues more important than abortion? Taking lives of precious spirits? Help!

  • Democrats
    Oct. 11, 2007 9:50 a.m.

    Can someone explain why Democrats can take one man or one Republican who does something hypocrytical and "label" the entire Republican party as such? Do they honestly think that the entire Democratic party is free from being individually human and making poor choices??....these comments make me sick! open your eyes and quit whining so much! Can't wait until Hilary comes to Utah begging for all your money....remember what her hubby did in the White House...can we talk about someone who did some great things but made a poor choice??

  • Pam Smith, Henderson, NV
    Oct. 11, 2007 9:48 a.m.

    Hmmm? Lets see.. Elder Ballard goes to Washington representing the First Presidency and the Twelve to lobby for a marriage amendment to the Constitution, and who votes against it? Senator Harry Reid.

    Despite claiming to be a good Mormon, Senator Reid paid more attention to the gay and lesbian lobby than to the First Presidency and the Twelve.

    Then he wants to tell us that President Ezra Taft Benson led us down a dark path? Hmmmm???

  • Russell M. Black
    Oct. 11, 2007 9:40 a.m.

    "Brother" Reid is wrapped around the axil. He belongs to the hate America first crowd. He is a plank holder to the Iraq surrender group. Mostly, his hatred for President Bush has been starkly evident,and he has done very little to support the war on terrorism. We are in a war, believe it! In my view, "Brother" Reid has done all he can to undermine the policies of this administration,and do everything possible to cause the defeat of the U.S. in Iraq.
    Senator Reid will not be re-elected. The day of the "good" democrat has long since passed. what a shame.

  • Inquirer
    Oct. 11, 2007 9:35 a.m.

    A corrupt, lying and hateful politician lecturing belivers in what is Christian and what is not. This is hilarious. A wolf telling the sheep that he is the good shepherd.

  • Death Penalty Murder?
    Oct. 11, 2007 9:30 a.m.

    How about repentence? Isn't that why God killed so many people in the old testament, because only their own blood would help them in the afterlife?
    Death penalty is not the same as abortion, so don't call me hypocrite when I side with what God has done to help those who commit such foul sins!
    Abortion IS murder.

    Did you know if you kill a woman who is 1 month pregnant, you will be tried for TWO murders? Yet she herself could have gone and had the baby killed. Now THAT is hypocracy.

    One more thought. Any ever here of a talk by a leader of teh church where he would say the devil would be happy if he could sneak one lie into the truth?
    Sounds like he's happy with both democrats and republicans.

  • Reid Bashers?
    Oct. 11, 2007 9:19 a.m.

    Only Reid bashers once believed there were weapons of mass destruction? Didn't Reid sign the paper to go to war, didn't most democrats? Quit trying to back out of what they chose!

  • Democrats
    Oct. 11, 2007 9:19 a.m.

    He seems nice, but I just don't get why the Democrats can't admit that they would have also attacked Iraq....President Clinton has said so on the news himself....they act as if they never would have entered the country, which is hogwash....I have a taped news interview of Clinton saying he would have sent over double troops at first....the democrats just always complain yet they do not offer solutions to everything anymore than the republicans....they are just better whiners..

  • To SHock and Awe
    Oct. 11, 2007 9:15 a.m.

    YOu have met Reid, and think he is not pro-gay and pro-abortion? Okay, HAVE YOU LISTENED TO HIS SPEACHES?!

  • NEVER
    Oct. 11, 2007 9:10 a.m.

    NEVER put Elder Faust and Reid in the same likeness. THERE IS NO SIMILARITIES, other than both are democract. What they believe and SAY are completely different.
    It is an insult to Elder Faust to say such a thing!

  • becca
    Oct. 11, 2007 9:02 a.m.

    I love how Reid is getting credit for "expressing what he believes" and getting standing ovations for his talk about his tear-jerking childhood and faith-promoting life. HeLLO?! Do any of you people know anything about his voting record? He voted FOR the invasion of Iraq. Mr. Reid, were you a part of that "worst blunder?" Yes. He claims to be pro-life (and made a big deal out of it in his speech, probably to excuse himself) yet does nothing to further the pro-life cause (and gets mad at the Supreme Court for upholding the ban on partial-birth abortion). He claims to believe marriage is between a man and a woman, yet votes against it in Washington even when Nevada has voted for it twice at home. "More important issues..." That's a wonderful example. No wonder no one gives Harry Reid a hard time for being Mormon back in DC, yet they do to Mitt. Mitt at least acts it!

  • DClark
    Oct. 11, 2007 8:27 a.m.

    So, I guess the Family Proclomation, the church's recent stance, very strong stance, against gay marriage has no meaning? Reid claimed there are more important issues. What does the proclomation say? DESTRUCTION! if the family values are not upheld by nations!

    He's quick with his words to move sidetrack on issues, push blame onto others, and wiggle like a snake out of a possible uncomfortable question.

    Reid can be a democrat all he wants AND be a church member. But he can't lie and decieve and contidict what the prophet is saying. In my book, he is a kingsman.

  • Doug Brockbank
    Oct. 11, 2007 8:24 a.m.

    Republican Dick Cheney comes to BYU in the midst of protests, and cries that he not speak. Harry Reid comes to BYU, disparages past prophets, and gets a warm reception at BYU. Perhaps we as members of the Church have bought intothe "tolerance", "diversity" and "political correct" movements so much that we will bend over backward to accomodate those who appear open-minded and diverse. When will we learn to affirm our beliefs, rather than be embarrassed by them.

  • Q-Ball
    Oct. 11, 2007 8:12 a.m.

    I have no problem with Reid speaking at BYU - differing opinions are usually constructive. However, having lived in Nevada for the past 12 years, I want to clarify for others that Reid's actions in Nevada HAVE NOT mirrored what he perports to be his beliefs. I am very much a conservative Republican, but I do believe that a person can be Mormon and Democrat. A perfect example of that is the Mayor of Henderson, NV. His actions, statements, and policies are consistent with his beliefs. Reid cannot say that. None of us is perfect, and I can accept the best efforts of imperfect people who's actions, however imperfect, mirror their true beliefs. Either Reid's beliefs are not what he says they are, or else he is lying to far more than himself.
    As you consider Reid's speech, remember (and I encourage you to do the research)"Actions speak louder than words".

  • scott chahalis
    Oct. 11, 2007 7:31 a.m.

    Sen. Reid at BYU - GREAT! Maybe we'll get it after all. The same people who condemn the "Christian" right for being anti-LDS (and make no mistake they are) appear to me to be similar to the "good" Mormon's who think every member that is not a Republican is the Anti-Christ. Go Hillary!

  • Tithing
    Oct. 11, 2007 7:31 a.m.

    I know many people think that BYU is funded by tithing. I have been told by those who know that it is not.

    Can anyone tell me how, and why they know that my tithing supports BYU.

    Oterwise, I would appreciate people not using that as an excuse to dictate what they believe should happen at BYU.

  • Carl
    Oct. 11, 2007 7:19 a.m.

    I would love to have Harry Reid or Mitt Romney as my home teacher, quorum leader, bishop, or stake president.

    I don't agree 100 % with the political decisions of either but get disappointed reading all the bad mouthing of Harry Reid by people who claim they love the Savior, Prophet, and/or the LDS Church. I get just as disappointed when the "moral majority" won't support Mitt Romney because (in their words) he is a member of a cult.

    Listen to the tape of Harry Reid at the BYU Forum. Please don't base your opinion on other people's interpretation of his remarks. Unless you were at the actual press conference after the assembly, you can NOT give an accurate account of his reference to Ezra Taft Benson.

  • another Vegas mormon
    Oct. 11, 2007 7:15 a.m.

    I don't care for his politics, but it sounds like Brother Reid has a solid testimony of the church, the Book of Mormon, and the Prophet Gordon B. Hinckley. And that is what counts!

  • I'm so brainwashed
    Oct. 11, 2007 6:56 a.m.

    All these years I thought I had prayerfully been considering my stance on all issues that the LDS church teaches, but Mr. Reid tells me that President Benson was "to political". Gee, I just thought he stood up for the constitution and freedom of religion and freedom from oppresion of communisum and socialism. So I guess I won't complain anymore that eventually half of everything I make will go to people who don't want to work or come here illegally so I can feed and clothe them. That way I won't have extra money left to support the church's welfare system which actually asks those who use it to pay back their loan by working for the church (welfare farms...canneryetc.) in some capacity. The US Govt. does not. I'll stop complaining about the millions of deaths of innocent unborn children...no matter how viable and how old the fetus. I'll stop complaining about worker's comp law which rewards stupid employees who don't follow company procedures, thus making companies pay and often go under because they have to pay for their employees stupidity along with ridiculous legal costs. I'll stop complaining now and become open minded...so any junk can fall in.

  • MT
    Oct. 11, 2007 6:48 a.m.

    I appreciated a better perspective of Senator Reid. He is committed to his beliefs and active in his political cause. That deserves respect. Disrespect and lack of protocol to others does not. That was unfortunate to see.

  • embarrassed by Harry
    Oct. 11, 2007 6:08 a.m.

    I cringe whenever it's mentioned that Harry is Mormon because I think that people will begin to think the rest of us are like him. What a way to hamper missionary efforts.

  • ed from florida
    Oct. 11, 2007 5:16 a.m.

    Has any one asked Senator Reid about his real estate dealings and how he came about his wealth as part of his recommend interviews? We seem to have "buried" his past as we evaluate his trustworthiness and integrity. Maybe he needs to read President Benson's great talk on pride and take a lesson.

  • jim steart
    Oct. 11, 2007 5:03 a.m.

    I am disgusted, appalled and offended by what Harry reid said about Ezra Taft Benson. Harry is a wolf in sheeps clothing.

  • NVborn&raised
    Oct. 11, 2007 3:26 a.m.

    Politics aside (which is where they belong) - Reid is an embarrassment. His comments in the press are inflammatory. He opens his mouth and inserts his foot-he's ridiculous and has bought in "hook, line and sinker" to the Liberal ideology that is leading this country down a path that will destroy it, and from which there will be no return. (And sorry, I have to say it...global warming is the biggest hoax ever perpetrated upon a people that are supposed to be the most educated and informed in the world.) It's a sorry state of affairs when someone spouts that we should be more concerned about a non-existent bunch of garbage than the state of the Families in this country.

  • Rick
    Oct. 11, 2007 2:04 a.m.

    #1 There are major problems with both leading political parties and many of the politicians within them.#2 It was foretold in The Book of Mormon that there would be many church members that would apostatize in the Latter-Day Church.

    "Behold, there are many called, but few are chosen. And why are they not chosen? Because their hearts are set so much upon the things of this world, and aspire to the honors of men, that they do not learn this one lesson-- That the rights of the Priesthood are inseparably connected with the powers of heaven, and that the powers of heaven cannot be controlled nor handled only upon principles of righteousness. We have learned by sad experience that it is the nature and disposition of almost all men, as soon as they get a little authority, as they suppose, they will begin to exercise unrighteous dominion." D & C 121:34-36,39

    Income redistribution is one serious form of "unrighteous dominion." Socialism is no different than stealing, rather than mugging me at the point of a gun you use the government as your unlawful agent. 51 people have no more rights than 49.

  • HELP US!!!!
    Oct. 11, 2007 1:55 a.m.

    All I can say is that every time Reid opens up his mouth I stand in awe at what comes out. How long do we have to deal with this man in power? Please return to Nevada and live your religion and stop corrupting nation with your ignorance and lack of judgment.

  • Former Republican
    Oct. 11, 2007 1:30 a.m.

    Way to tell it how it is Reid. I'm happy that BYU invited him and he got the reception he deserved. Contrary to some of the opinions above, not all of us Mormons are closed minded conservatives.

  • CJB
    Oct. 11, 2007 1:12 a.m.

    Dale H: I like your idea about baking cookies and visiting people. Your comment about "judging not" is, I think, somewhat misguided. If you look at the Joseph Smith translation, you'll see something along the lines of "judge not unrighteously," or something along those lines. To me, that means to judge with the spirit. Really, we have to make judgments daily about people, events, politics. Reid himself does so about Pres Benson and others, or about whether to emphasize trying to outlaw abortion.
    In general, although I am LDS and conservative, and I don't agree with Reid on most issues, and I think his belittling of the President is somewhat damaging to the country, I think it's good that we have such a high-ranking politician who is an LDS, liberal Democrat. It proves that the Church really IS apolitical and tolerant of many philosophies, that this position is not just lip service. Anytime someone accuses us of being just a bunch of conservatives, we can say, "Oh yeah, well what about Harry Reid? He's a Mormon."

  • Nancy P.
    Oct. 11, 2007 12:38 a.m.

    Whats the big deal? So Harry pocketed 400K in a shady land deal. Who cares? And those gifts from the Nevada Athletic Commission...come on, everyone does that stuff.

    Also, you cant make a big deal out of greasing the skids for an Indian casino. He only got a mere $66,000 out of it. You must not like Indians. Racist.

    Oh and that $330,000 in federal grants got for Rev. Willie Davis? It was just Pork. How could he know there would be an indictment?

    And those comments about already having lost the war, well what do you expect him to say? If we win the war, it might make Bush look good. Its just politics. Who cares if it emboldens our enemies?

    You all need to lighten up. Teddy Kennedy has done much worse.

  • Vegas Ed
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:50 p.m.

    Harry is an embarrasment to my adopted state. His slogan for his last election here--INDEPENDENT LIKE NEVADA-- Can you believe that? He's as independent as I am a giraffe.

  • Jay Brown
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:47 p.m.

    Harry Reid is amazing. In 2004 Harry received a $700,000 profit for the sale of land he hadn't personally owned for three years. I wish I could do that!

  • Harry
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:46 p.m.

    Can you imagine Harry as a home teacher? A quorum leader, or a bishop, a stake president? Maybe a tourist.

  • Love Harry?
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:40 p.m.

    Reid must not have been there (or read about it) when Brigham Young divided the conference in the tabernacle down the aisle. One side, he said should be Republican, the other Democrat. Something must have happened for, though we don't record members' political party, we all know in which camp most members rest. All Americans are disappointed in many Republicans this year, but probably not enough to see the switch Harry is suggesting. Young people don't want to go to war, so no surprise he got a rise out of BYU students who have never lived through a real one.

  • Clifton
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:39 p.m.

    Reid Advises us to worry less about abortion ect(Democrats usual rallying Cry) while at the same time in the Senate calls the President names, advocates cutting and running from Iraq, has great regard for Military lives in Combat, while telling people not to be to concerned about abortion, which claims more lives in a single year than the entire time the US has been engaged in Iraq to date. Usual Democratic demogoguery and blatant hypocrisy!

  • Most Important fact
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:28 p.m.

    So I read all the posts--and the most important item that sticks out is Reid's decision to vote against an amendment to define marriage. The leaders of the Church sent an official statement inspired by God to vote for this ammendment to solidify the morals of our country. Mr. Reid decided that this inspired council was not worth following. What does that tell you about his character and testimony? He is more concerned about his party's stance on the issue than the Lord's. What will he justify next?

  • Clifton
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:27 p.m.

    To Claudia: Thanks for posting and fine comments. The LDS Church was being prosecuted a long time before these self appointed Religious Right folks came along, while I'm not sure of the exact time it began, Latter Day Saints have mostly voted Republican for ages. Some try to associate the LDS Church with the Rekigious right, which is absolutely false, so you see the nit picking of the Church continues in this regard. Many WERE and voted Democrat too, and I believe when the Democratic Party was the real Democratic Party, and not like the present one. Much of the persecution of the Church in its early days was during periods of Democrat Administrations such as Presidents Polk and Buchanan and States and local governments.

  • RBH
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:26 p.m.

    It amazeses me how we can continue to miss quote.
    I challenge anyone (if there is someone srill reading) to show where it says "thou shalt not judge" followed by a period.
    I would be willing to pay anyone that can show me anywhere in scripture that, "free agency" or "fredom of choice" is followed by a period. You will always find reference to good or evil and consiquence.
    And someone, please, point out to me where the president of the United States spends one penny, let alone into "record deficets". As important as we claim the constitution to be I am amazed at how little we know about it. Especially to the roll and limits of each of the three branches. [Go ahead test yourself. Name the three branches.]
    Finally, If charity is the greatest of all the gifts, define charity for me. I doubt taking my money or goods or talents by force and giving it to someone else and keeping most of it yourself can be called charity
    Not exactly on the subject of Sen. Reids visit but just some observations in the comments.

  • Anonymous
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:20 p.m.

    The Book of Mormon makes it apparent that we should vote for the person with the best morals first, and then go with what we agree with second. I see heros and losers in both parties. Frankly, I think many Republicans sold us out in the last few years because they robbed us with their "pet" projects. We now have the worry about becoming like Weimark Germany if China "nukes" our money. I don't want to take a wheelbarrow of money to buy a loaf of bread. Democrats are also guilty of this. I think Clinton should've been impeached for breaking the law, but I also am outraged by the Republicans that wanted to impeach Clinton, now wanting to give "amnesty" to illegal aliens. How's that support the "rule of law"?!

    I disagree that abortion and gay marriage are not critical issues compared to "global warming",etc.

    I have the agency to commit robbery, murder, etc. Are you going to legalize those in the name of "choice" as well? Science is contradicting Roe vs Wade. Five month old fetuses are living when born, so how can you rationalize an abortion at that point? It is no different from legal murder!

  • health care
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:19 p.m.

    Fellow LDS republicans. Republican leadership believes in Universal Health care.
    (Universal health care is different from sociolized medecine)

    Sam BROWNBACK : " We need high-quality, affordable health care for everyone."
    -- Announcing his candidacy, Jan. 20, 2007

    Tommy THOMPSON:"We must build a system that is affordable and accessible for everyone"
    --Iowa, April 2007

    Mitt ROMNEY : "We found a way to get everybody in our state, Massachusetts, insured. I like the plan. I think it's one of the best things we did in my administration. It's not perfect. We will learn from it"
    --On Fox News' "On the Record," April 23, 2007

    Ron PAUL:"It's time to rethink the whole system. The rise of HMOs has created a harmful collusion between politicians, drug companies, and organized medicine that raises the price of health care by stifling competition between providers. And all this in favor of moving us towards universal health care."
    ---- Muckraker Report, June 28, 2007

    Indeed, it is astonishing that in the richest country in the world, the citizens (and even children) cannot get access to health care -- not by lack of medical know-how or facilies or money-- but because of HMO profit.

  • warm welcome?
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:16 p.m.

    I too am disappointed about BYU's warm welcome for Reid. In the past few months, I've heard many comments in the news, etc. that came out of his mouth.. and after reading this article I was shocked to hear that he is LDS. I literally laughed out loud. It's a good thing his religion isn't out in the main media yet as much as Romney's religion is questioned.

  • What?
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:16 p.m.

    To all of you up in arms about abortion and the "right to life"... I have to wonder if you feel the same way about the death penalty? Is the death penalty murder? Think about that before you slam someone on their right to have a few cells removed from their own body, you self righteous hypocrits.

  • Me
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:11 p.m.

    Doesn't the church teach that you should not judge others? This is a free country, and not everyone subscribes to the same religion. I believe we, as Mormons, should sympathize more with gay people who just want their rights. Especially given our own history of being persecuted for what many felt was immoral sexual behavior (Polygamy). Let gay people have all the rights they want, and practice their beliefs the way they see fit. Even if we find it to be immoral. In the end, God will sort it out. We should just be worried about ourselves.

  • Don't be flossin where you live
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:04 p.m.

    We don't care...

    Just makes you sound stupid.

    I grew up in Utah, moved to So Cal 21 years ago, and back to Davis County 1 1/2 years ago. That being said, Please don't mention how cool you are and enlightened because you don't live in Utah.

    I found Male and Female "Molly Mormons" in both places, and free thinkers in both my ward in So Cal and Utah.

    If you live out of state, the freedom you feel is from your own issues. Deal with them, get a beer and mow your lawn on Sunday. My Utah mormon neighbor does it every Sunday after church. (He won't smoke while doing it though, it pisses off the Bishop).

  • RE: stumblefall
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:04 p.m.

    The problem, Stumblefall, is that decent Godfearing conservatives most often do not give with one hand while voting against socialism with the other. One only needs to look at the Bountiful and Provo benches or the very exclusive riverbottom communities between Provo and Orem to see what opulence exists in the mist of "the saints". The "surplus and excess" are brutally evident. On the other side however, there are so many poor people just minutes away who, through no fault of their own, cannot afford even the necessities of life. When caring hands should, according to their religion, be reaching out to lift and help and even succor (see my previous post "finally finished") their poor brothers and sisters. This sort of feigned concecration because they give back a fraction of what God has so graciously given them is not "true religion and undefiled before God". Maybe someday we will get there as a people but we are nowhere close yet.

    We can, however, vote for policies that approximate the giving spirit, however awkward and false they may be until more are ready to truely give as Christ gave.

    Good luck with this on a personal level.

  • Global warming
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:58 p.m.

    Fellow LDS republicans, the Republican leadership believe in Global Warming

    Mitt ROMNEY : "You're seeing the climate get warmer or climate change is occurring and I believe that human activity is contributing to that."
    -- Business and Industry Association National Leaders Forum, May 29, 2007

    Sam BROWNBACK: "Global warming has occurred. We have far more CO2 in the atmosphere than we had 100 years ago. That's factual."
    -- U.S. News and World Report, Aug. 2006

    Rich GULIANI: " I think we have to accept the view that scientists have that there is global warming and that human operation, human condition, contributes to that."
    --Republican debate, June 5, 2007

    John McCAIN:" I believe climate change is real. I think it's devastating. I think we have to act ... the overwhelming evidence is that greenhouse gases are contributing to warming of our earth and we have an obligation to take action to fix it.
    -- Video on campaign site

    Ron PAUL:" [Global warming] is a problem."
    --Campaign stop in Iowa, May 3, 2007

  • Zonie
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:57 p.m.

    If you discovered that Adolf Hitler, Joseph Stalin, or Chairman Mao was still alive and still killing people by the millions, and then a trusted leader told you not to worry about it, would you trust that leader? Since Roe v. Wade, over 40 million children have died in abortions in the United States alone! Approximately one million babies will be aborted this year. You've been worried about Ahmadinejad? So have I. But if he or one of his stooges nukes a major U.S. city, we will likely lose fewer lives than we do from abortion this year. What a sick world we live in. What twisted logic to not consider abortion an important issue.

  • CJ Grisham
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:55 p.m.

    The thing that annoys me about Reid's comments is that they are false. He praises Joseph Smith (and rightly so) for his stance against slavery but faults Ezra Taft Benson who, along with President Kimball, brought about the revelation that blacks be given the priesthood while he was President of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles. Either Reid is a bad mormon because he's a Democrat or Reid is a bad mormon because he has integrity issues. While it's probably a little bit of both, I'll put more weight into the latter.

    If Reid has issues with the Church's stance on abortion and gay rights issues, then he should excommunicate himself from it since that is our stance, like it or not. The Catholics are looking for more high profile people and he'd fit in with their recent decisions to loosen up their beliefs about gays. The Church is run by divine revelation, not blind political expediency.

  • Wayne Cambell and Garth Algar
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:52 p.m.

    I say we make a rule that people can publish posts, but they can't use the word Republican or Democrats. Rather we use only ideas and beliefs.

    I think it was Dick Van Patten who said "If you label me, you negate me". It was good enough on the greatest family show ever made, "Eight is Enough", and that makes it good enough for me.

    In closing, asphink terseyzwhat???

  • Clifton
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:51 p.m.

    My issue with Harry Reid isn't so much with who he is, as what he is politically. We here so much from our left wing Democratic friends about "separation of Church and State, especially when it comes Republicans and Conservatives, yet Reid can come to BYU and mix Politics with religion and can get away with it. Dick Cheney gets invited to speak at BYU and BYU's young Democrats have fit and a tizzy. Reid gets a pass.

    David in CA lectures us to be respectful. Fred says he is ashamed of the reprehensible intolerance displayed in the comments made by so many "God-fearing" people. Then he says: "Whats the matter with you?"

    Well Fred, and David in CA, I ask what is the matter with you? Have you never witnessed the Vitriol and snide remarks spewing forth from the mouth of this sanctimonious jerk on the U.S. Senate floor? He and the rest of the Democratic Party are leading this Country down the path towards socialism and Communism, and oh by the way Fred,its his character Thats "what is the matter with me!"

  • Proud Democrat
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:48 p.m.

    Didn't the church practice the United Order at one time? That was a socialized program. How about the Perpetual Immigration Fund? Maybe we should get rid of the Church Welfare Program. We should probably stop doing service projects....After all, people should not receive things they have not worked and paid for......

    Some of the most abused words in the last few years have been: Honor & Integrity. If you have to brag about it, you don't have it. I am so thankful that I was inspired to leave Utah....It was so hard to stay on the pedestal that I felt pressured to put myself on.

  • Anonymous
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:47 p.m.

    Awwww...I was just trying to be helpful, and I ended up putting in a URL, and there goes my comment. BYU's website mistakenly spells it 'redi' instead of 'reid', so if you want to read the transcript of the forum, there you go. What I was trying to say was that it's very politically astute for Reid to paint the Democrat Party as an alternative to the Republicans, because the Republicans are very unpopular these days. As well they should be, since they are obvious corrupt. But it's very typical for liberals to paint just two alternatives: better for the government to feed and house a homeless person than for him to die in poverty on the streets. But there IS another alternative: lower taxes, and private citizens will step in to take care of their fellow man. Reid neglects to mention that many true conservatives have abandoned the Republican Party already, and not to join the Democrats. Better for him politically not to mention the Constitution Party, because it espouses the Constitution, God's law, and his party does not. Actually, better for Democrat politicians in general not to mention the Constitution, because that engenders questions they can't answer easily.

  • finally finished
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:42 p.m.

    Well, I read all of the comments and am amazed at the negativism.

    Lets consider some of the "weightier matters of the law" as spoken of by Jesus. I want to refer to Mosiah chapter 4:14-26. This is essential when considering the morality of ignoring the poor. Mosiah states that those who "turn (the poor) out to perish" and who use the justification that they have "brought upon (themselves)this misery" (because they were lazy, indolent, etc.??) will "perish forever" and have "no interest in the kingdom of God"

    Check yourselves on two points that have been brought up previously.

    1) There are many more forms of immorality than what the Democrats display and many of these other forms are on full display in the Republican party as well.

    2) Both parties are corrupt and not any one party will come to this country's aid when the constitution is hanging by a thread.

    The question for each of us on these issues is "where do I stand?".

    I suggest that if we are unwilling to separate from our surplus to help the poor (whether through taxation, free will offerings, etc.) then we stand on very shaky ground and offend the creator.

  • I'm proud of the posters
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:41 p.m.

    I know many of you are chastizing the "negativity", the "hate", the examples people are setting to non-members, and heaven forbid we do anything to hurt the missionary process...

    Bottom line, LDS and Non LDS are posting, using their 1st ammendment rights to Freedom of assembly, of the press and speech.

    "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

    Face it, it is a worldwide church and so many members could care less of this arguement. They are living a pure gospel in a developing country. President Benson doesn't care what you say, he's dead and living in the presence of the almighty (I know the guy, he's allright). Slammin him does not really do a ton of good.

    Nope, you are exercising our rights as Americans, one thing that the church supports. I am proud of each and everyone of you.

    OH, one last thing, there is really no fire and brimstone. It was an Urban Myth.

    Post your hate away.

  • stumblefall
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:37 p.m.

    Let's have a little talk about what the Savior taught. Yes, he taught that we should love our fellow men and take care of them. No, he did not teach that the government should enforce that. When the government seizes tax money from its citizens by force and distributes it to the poor and the needy (after taking their cut, of course), that is not the Savior's plan. When private citizens do so out of the goodness of their heart and out of a desire to follow the Savior's teachings, that IS the Savior's plan. When the government seizes said tax money, it makes it much more difficult for citizens to do good things with their money. It is very common for Satan to present a plan that is similar to Christ's plan. In this case, Satan has presented socialism, which is so much like the Law of Consecration, except for one thing: it's forcible, not based on free agency. Just because someone doesn't believe the government should be involved in something doesn't mean they don't believe in the thing--e.g., education, charity, swimming pools, skate parks. True god-fearing conservatives give with one hand and vote against socialism with the other.

  • Utah Pharisees
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:33 p.m.

    What Reid was espousing is that eventhough he (and I also) are against abortion and same-sex marriage, as aborrant as they are, the far greater wickedness destroying our nation under Bush is the exponentially increasing gap between the rich and poor (D&C 49:20). That is the reason the Lord gave for destroying Sodom and Gomorra, that they did not take care of the poor (Ezekiel 16:49-50), and the other abominations only added to the anger. Republicans have the beam in their eyes on this one. While they try to take care of the mote of saving lives while in the womb, they do all they can with their policies to destroy life once born by supporting policies that enrich the few while sinking the masses into poverty and degradation. These Utah Republicans walk around in their long robes, believing they are more righteous because of their obvious prosperity, but their hypocricy is clearly discernable. They will answer for the destruction of the Constitution, and other great values we once stood for, for supporting despots like Bush who push policies that destroy. 90% of the world and 75% of US see Bush as a despot. What is with Utah?

  • johnny cobert
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:33 p.m.

    To say that we LDS should put abortion (no comment on gay rights) on the back burner and give it secondary attention is disturbing coming from an active LDS man. Yes, the world issues, especially those that focus on the middle east are important. But sancity for life is at the top of my list of priorities. I will balance every thing else. But I say again, human life and the right to live is at the top of my list.

  • stumblefall
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:30 p.m.

    Dear "Request for Clarification": the Deseret News articles attributes Reid's comments on Benson and Wilkinson to a press conference at BYU today, not the forum itself.

  • Coushatta Indian tribe
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:22 p.m.

    We love Harry. Back in 2002 we were involved in a casino dispute with a rival tribe. Harry sent a letter to then Secretary of the Interior Gail Norton. The next day, we sent a 5,000-dollar check to Harrys tax-exempt political group, the Searchlight Leadership Fund. Reid was so good to us that we decided to funnel about $66,000 to Harry through Jack Abramoff. Harry is great! Stop saying bad things about him.

  • James
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:18 p.m.

    As a Mormon, a Republican, and a Nevadan, I find it disquieting how ridiculous some of the LDS comments are. To try to say that only one political party's platform is compatible with the Church is narrow minded and runs counter to what Church leaders say. Last time I checked, the First Presidency hasn't been ashamed that Senator Reid is a member.
    I wish the few pretentious LDS out there would shut up about how evil and corrupt and unfaithful Sen. Reid supposedly is. Sen. Reid is a politician, not an anti-Christ, and those who confuse the two need to brush up on the doctrine they say Reid ignores.
    Senator Reid represents my state in the Senate. And though I find his positions contrary to mine, I find no reason that he is not a faithful member of the Church. And if we are going to hold Reid up to the microscope when it comes to Mormon politicians, take a look at Orrin Hatch and every other politician.
    Stop turning our religion into a political game. We're a Church, we're supposed to be Christians, not an exclusive self-righteous-Republicans-only club.

  • Disengaged
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:15 p.m.

    I cannot believe some of the fully charged, emotional, and idiotic statements that have been posted here. The problem with our society is that we have become too polarized with the Republican and Democratic parties. In my opinion, neither party has it right and do not have the best interest of this great country. They are completely consumed with their idealogies that is backed by lobbyists and big time interest groups. Until we realize what we are doing by debating some of these irrational points of view, this entire country will continue to head for a train wreck. By the way, last time I heard - the brethren have counseled us to ponder and pray about how we vote and to keep politics out of the church meeting houses. From the comments afforded on this page, I seriously doubt that is happening.

  • Request for Clarifcation
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:14 p.m.

    Again, this is a very important point...

    What did Harry Reid really say about Ezra Taft Benson, President Wilkinson, flag burning, abortion and gay marriage?

    The Deseret News article attributes to him some pretty bold, and certainly controversial commments.

    However, BYU's website contains a PDF of his address, but doesn't mention these quotes.

    Can the publisher of the PDF document at BYU please clarify this important point?

  • Truth be told
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:14 p.m.

    Of course President Benson was leading the Church astray; why else would the Lord strike his mouthpiece mute and dumb?

  • Utah Pharisees
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:05 p.m.

    Foreigner, but no stranger:

    I'm with you. The invective coming from these Utah Mormon's, of which I am ashamed to admit I am one, is very unchristian. It is just stunning to see how barbaric many of these supposed disciples of the Savior are behaving, with articulating rationale for their hypocrisy.

    For one the socialism, caring for the poor, that they rail against is actually much closer to what the Savior taught than the rugged individualism or capitalism that they promote with so much emotion. If they actually understood their own scriptures they would see that capitalism is actually the opposite of consecration, and leads to the huge gap between rich and poor we now see clearly destroying our nation. They preach Korihor's (the antichrist's) doctrine a little too vehemently, as Rush Limbaugh types, which was "that every man prospers according to his own genius." The hypocrisy of their positions is readily discernable to those who can think past their noses. On the one hand they rightly do not believe in evolution, yet readily accept survival of the fittest (social darwanism) as gospel--naturally, they are prospered because they are so much better than others. These Republicans are latter-day hypocrites.

  • AG
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:05 p.m.

    I AM VERY DISAPPOINTED WITH THE WARM RECEPTION GIVEN SEN REID. I WAS VERY DISAPPOINTED WITH STUDENTS THAT ATTENDED WHO EMBRACED HIS SOCIALISM AGENDA WHICH HAS NOT CHANGED FROM DAY ONE. ANYONE, STUDENT OR NOT, WHO SAYS WE HAVE BIGGER PROBLEMS THAN ABORTION AND SOCIALIZED HEALTH CARE IS A HIGHER PRIORITY LEAVES ME SAD. I AM NOT A DEMOCRAT NOR A REPUBLICAN. NO POLITICAL PARTY TELLS ME HOW TO VOTE. THE CHURCH DOESN'T TELL ME HOW TO VOTE. I AM SAD THAT THIS SO CALLED MEMBER OF THE CHURCH COULD STAND AT THIS GREAT UNIVERSITY AND SAY THAT BRO WILKERSON, FORMER UNIV PRES, AND PRES BENSON, LED MEMBERS ASTRAY WITH THEIR CONSERVATIVE VIEWS. I REMEMBER YEARS AGO IN GEN CONF WHEN SOME LIBERALS WERE CRITICAL OF PRES/ELDER BENSON SPEAKING SO MUCH ABOUT THE COMMUNIST AND THEIR AGENDA MADE A STATEMENT THAT HE HAD NEVER SPOKE IN CONFERENCE WITHOUT PRES MCKAY APPROVING HIS TALK. PRES BUSH IS LIKE HIS FATHER, NOT VERY EFFECTIVE BUT WE ALL STICK OUT HEADS IN THE SAND IF WE THINK AN IRAQ PULL OUT WILL CLEAR THE AIR ON TERRORISM. THESE FOLKS PLAN TO WIPE US OUT EITHER THERE OR HERE.

  • Progressive Mormon
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:01 p.m.

    100 years from now Harry Reid's views will seem mainstream WITHIN the Mormon Church, just as Romney's anti-polygamy views are mainstream NOW. Social progress cannot be stopped. Sooner or later the Church catches up.

  • Proud Democrat
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:01 p.m.

    I used to live in Utah. I left because I did not like people judging me for expressing my opinions. I am pro-life. I don't care who gets married to whom. Those are things I have absolutely no control over. I even listen to Rush and Hannity....just so I know what the opposing opinions are. I am appalled at their constant spewing of hatred, name-calling, and slander. This forum is spewing the same "talking points." So much for independent thinkers. Reid is my Senator. I don't always agree with him, but he is the Senator for the whole state of Nevada, not just the Mormons who live in Nevada. He keeps church and state separate. He is required to represent everyone. People need to stop listening to OPINION RADIO and start thinking for themselves. Rush & Hannity are only expressing their opinions. They are not expressing actual facts. Think about it. When have they ever referenced facts? When they make statements, do your research and decide it they are actually correct. Rush has been know to say, "Let me do your thinking for you!" That is one scary comment.

  • Doug Brockbank
    Oct. 10, 2007 9:41 p.m.

    What did Harry Reid really say about Ezra Taft Benson, Joseph Smith, flag burning, abortion and gay marriage. Senator Reid is quote bold if the Des News article quotes are accurate.

    But BYU's website has a pdf link but I don't see that quote. Nor do I see his reference to Joesph Smith being "progressive".

    Can someone please clarify? Did the reporter get it wrong, or did Reid censor his bold (even outragous remarks) after the fact?

  • Disheartened
    Oct. 10, 2007 9:39 p.m.

    I am so disheartened. I have a family connection to Harry Reid. Though most of the time I am embarrassed to admit it. I wonder if I'm being too judgmental about him, because we are to love our neighbors and pray for our enemies. But it's not being judgmental to disagree with him. And I strongly disagree. I had a comment made to me the other day by a young adult that the church was evolving towards accepting gay marriage and abortion. Wow! That frightened me to the core that we are raising a generation that actually believes that. We have been warned to guard our testimonies with our lives and to beware of false doctrine. Now is that time to be very guarded. Even though it is frightening to think about all the liberal chaos that is overtaking our world, we have also been promised that if we are prepared we shall not fear. My take on that is to teach our families true gospel teachings that haven't changed since the beginning of time. Do what we can to better ourselves and serve others. But most of all, listen to our prophet, not Harry Reid. No animosity intended.

  • Shaun Williams - Phoenix,Az
    Oct. 10, 2007 9:38 p.m.

    Harry Reid is rather unique a mormon who is a liberal democrat and power hungry and ruthless in his attacks on President Bush, he simply hates the President and everything he stands for. I for one have a strong dislike for the man and as Queen Victoria said "We are not amused."

  • Think about THIS
    Oct. 10, 2007 9:12 p.m.

    Compare LDS doctrines with the "platforms" of the Republican and Democrat parties, and it's not surprising that most Mormons are Republican. Some earlier people writing here mentioned a few past LDS church leaders that were or are Democrat, and quite a few regular LDS members too. Sure, it's their choice to make, but they are clearly a minority of the church. Political parties gradually change over time. Ronald Reagan, when commenting about switching to the Republican party many years earlier said something like "I didn't leave the Democrat party... it left me." Also, kids are more likely to affiliate with the same party their parents do, so it's no surprise that some LDS are still Democrat... it sometimes takes tradition a while to catch up with reality. The Democrat party (whose symbol is a JACKASS) for decades gradually became the party of socialism... a big powerful federal government which "buys" votes through income re-distribution, and pushes secularism too far, at the expense of morality and the family. It involves much more than abortion and gay rights. Speaking of abortion, many dems cringe at the thought of executing a convicted murderer, but are OK with aborting unborn babies. hmmm.

  • Nevada Citizen
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:54 p.m.

    All I can say is let God be the judge of Senator Harry Reid. I personally have no love for him or his political ideas at either the state or national levels. However, with him in the opposite corner of Mitt Romney and both claiming to be "recommend toting" members of "the church" this next year ought to be entertaining at the very least. All I can say to anyone thinking about jumping on the "Harry Reid is a great leader" band wagon is do your homework on him first - as you should with any political leader...many of them are not what or who they appear to be. I believe this is a case of Mr. Reid playing to his audience.

  • Joe Watts
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:51 p.m.

    This comment is directed at the previous post entitled, very ironically, TRUTH.

    Truth didn't state the truth, and it would be a good idea for Truth to do a little truth searching before shooting off his mouth.

    Senator Reid did not vote for the war. He was one of the few who recognized the immorality of invading a country that had never threatened us.

    Anyone who believes our 'shock and awe' invasion of a defenseless, impotent nation was a moral act is in some mystical sphere I don't understand.

    It wasn't a mistake when we invaded Iraq. It was a crime.

    Joe Watts

  • Rex
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:42 p.m.

    I have known Harry Reid since he first ran for public office in Nevada, and won, as Lieutenant Governor. I was distrubed by him then, and have continued to be disturbed by his politics ever since. He has done nothing but disappoint me for decades.

    Harry Reid says he is "pro-life" but votes and supports every abortion bill he has ever faced. And if he thinks health insurance and this phony global warming baloney is more important than all the moral issues in this country, he's not only in the wrong church, he's in the wrong country.

  • Colorado mormon
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:35 p.m.

    Becareful when a leader sets himself up as a light for the praise of men and criticizes the leadership of the church and country for leading us towards principles of life, accountability and independance making us free to help those in need by our own free will and choice and not because our resources have been given to the government to be redistributed as they see fit. We need many more Ezra Taft Bensens and less of the Harry Reid, Korihor, Nehor, Sherem types.

  • Anonymous
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:22 p.m.

    These comments - unbelievable drivel - the whole lot.

  • Foreigner, but no stranger
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:17 p.m.

    BYU is paid for by my tithing as much as it is by yours. Too bad the only GA present was the one that had to be. Guess there are no Democrat-voting GA's in Utah.

    In my country we have health-care for all and we're careful to conserve energy and water, yet we are governed by a right-wing party that supports the USA in Iraq and Afganistan. Call us Socialists, if you dare!

    You actually seem to believe that universal health-care is a bad thing! Go live somewhere else in the world for a while - see what a blessing is universal health care!

    Can't you Utah Mormons see that you are very rude and intolerant of people who see and do things differently to you?

    Can't you see that you're not just politely disagreeable, but that your words are actually atrociously rude, offensive and hateful? Glad Br Reid isn't black, he might have been lynched in another decade - but no, he wouldn't have received an invite back then.

    I'm also glad God told me the church is true. That's why I stay.

    God isn't a bigot - neither should we be.

    Hugh B Brown where are you?

  • Fred
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:14 p.m.

    Second, Reid is not criticizing "the Lord's anointed." Ezra Taft Benson was notoriously conneted vis his son to the John Birch Society and actively solicited endorsement of that organization by President and prophet David O. McKay,who rebuffed him. As an apostle, Benson went about preaching Birchism at stake conferences over which he presided. Church history of that period will doeument the fact that he was called on the carpet by the prophet for doing so. In that event, does it mean to you ultra conservative LDS that McKay was a fallen prophet? Probably. How sad that for political purposes you continue to pervert the goapel and become the very wickedly intolerant people you would condemn. sad . . .

  • Fred
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:13 p.m.

    I am ashamed of the reprehensible intolerance displayed in the comments made by so many "God-fearing" people. What is the MATTER with you? Do you think God will love you more when you spew this kind of venom? Most of you who object to his comments are deliberately twisting what he said to your own vile purposes. First he never says that we must think less about abortion from the standpoint of a moral view. He clearly is telling us that we need to focus less on religions moral issues in this supposed democracy where freedom of belief and action is a protected right and instead let the GOVERNMENT focus on problems that affect the whole population. And since the church recognizes the efficacy of abortion under certain circumstances, Ried's view of the government's role in dealing with it is right on target. God gave us agency. If you don't approve of abortion, don't get one! simple as that Continued

  • Go to a BYU Forum
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:08 p.m.

    Those of you that are appalled by Harry Reid's side-swipe (sort of) at prior LDS Leaders need to go to some forums.

    That was nothing.

    Read "Infinite Inwardness" by Li-Young Lee (1/27/04) available at speeches.byu.edu and see what you think of that.

  • David in CA
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:04 p.m.

    I'm posting a bit late o this site, but there's a lot of rhetoric here that's NOT very "Christ-like".
    I personally saw a tape of his speech last night at BYU by setting the VCR to record it off the BYU-TV channel.

    Mr./Brother Reid I thought gave an excellent talk.
    He talked about his early childhood, he talked about his discovery to Jesus and the LDS Church, THANKING
    EVERYBODY who helped in that path. He talked about
    his wife and how they met and the circumstances of
    their marriage. He spent only a little time on
    Partisan politics. He's a Democrat. So what!!
    I'm a registered Republican. I vote the issues and not just "party line". I'm glad that we have two major political parties. Wish we had 3 or more.
    What if we only had one?? ..like some places.
    This man is an example of how one can get somewhere in life starting with very little. Kind of like
    Johnny Cash in the music biz.

    LET's BE Respectful....

    Thank You and God Bless....










    nG

  • Thane
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:02 p.m.

    I find the fact that Senator Reed chose to bring politics into his visit to BYU unfortunate. Instead of focusing on the mission of BYU, the church, and the gospel of Jesus Christ, he made it a political stump. I also find unappealling his rudeness in the way he characterized President Bush as stupid. Such name calling is inappropriate and rude. It is one of the reasons both the legislative branch and the president have such low approval ratings...

  • Lets get it straight
    Oct. 10, 2007 7:45 p.m.

    AT JAZZ FAN SLAPPER:

    Listen lets get it straight- KERRY IS THE MOST CORRUPT POLITICIAN IN MODERN HISTORY.

    Reid is corrupt, but not the most corrupt.

  • Randy
    Oct. 10, 2007 7:43 p.m.

    Interesting how Reid talked about learning of the greatness of America when he and his fellow liberals (oops I mean progressive) disregard the constitution of the United States. Dingy Harry represents the cook fringe that wants to strip all personal rights(i.e Bill of Rights and rest of the constitution) and make government the all powerful be all and end all.
    He and his co-horts including many republicans are a greater danger to the U.S than terrorists.
    People that actually applaud Reid need to listen to what he says on the senate floor to actually know what he stands for.

  • george
    Oct. 10, 2007 7:40 p.m.

    Edward - ??????????????//
    Being honest with military folk is disgraceful??????
    This war and any war of aggression like it is. It is a simple fact. How can anyone justify it. Even Iraqi's are clear they were better off before the American invasion. Mr Reid is an honest American . The real traitor are folks like Mr Bush and Cheney that are motivated by their own financial gain.

  • Jazz Fan Slapper
    Oct. 10, 2007 7:32 p.m.

    Dirty Harry Reid is the most corrupt politician in modern history. That is a fact. I don't care if he's Mormon or not. And I don't care that BYU had him over. But just know this: he is a vile man whose pockets are stuffed with dirty money.

  • jsmith
    Oct. 10, 2007 7:04 p.m.

    History Buff,

    Youre right. There are just as many unfavorable favors given on the liberal side of the bench.

    Im not trying to defend one side or the other. As I mentioned above, Im an independent who is sad that I cant find satisfaction with any party Ive encountered.

    I hope I have not come across as too strident. What I did mean to express was that Harry Reid should not be attacked just because he is a liberal. There are too many skeletons in both the Republican and the Democratic closets for the followers of either party to suggest that they have a monopoly on virtue.

    On the other hand, there are enough good people on all sides of all issues for us to learn to listen to what they might teach us.

  • Edward
    Oct. 10, 2007 7:02 p.m.

    Mr. Reid is a disgrace as an American. A man in his position telling our men & women in uniform that we have lost the war. His type of Democrats have no respect for our military. It is our military that has given us the freedom we enjoy, not people like Reid. I don't want this type of person defending our country. We will lose our freedom with his type of leadership. Sixty years ago he would be called a traitor by everyone. Unfortunately so many in our country today are so uniformed about what our enemies want to do to us. As a politician Reid is a fool. As a Mormon he is a disgrace to say that there are more important things than worrying about killing unborned babies. He should read The Family, A Proclamation To The World and then think about the gay agenda. The nerve of the man to attack former Presidents of the of the Church. He has a very screwed up belief system. Non members cannot believe he is a member of the Church. His political beliefs and our Church are out of sync. BYU officials have lost their moral compass by inviting Reid.

  • Charles
    Oct. 10, 2007 6:44 p.m.

    I am an alumnus of BYU and my politics have been definitly against abortion and the deplorable scourge of sexual perversion so raised out of purportion to the numbers of people who really do practice such life styles.

    But when it comes to health care, global warming and caring for the poor,President Bush showed more of his oligarchic approach to the poor and defenseless as he tried to reduce the money for CHIP the money for which is comparatively a drop of water in the ocean to even just the daily cost of the war. In the balance I can't conscience such callousness. I think we as a people need to read King Benjamin's speech really closely. Senator Reid sounded a lot more like King Benjamin than the speaker of the great and spacious house!

    We are a people who are commanded by scripture to study these issues out for ourselves. But we are rather quick to label, judge and then dismiss. The issues ought to be our focus and NOT some one's label and the diatribes attached to those labels.

    I think Senator Reid was very courageous to enter the lions den today!!! Daniel would be proud!

  • History Buff
    Oct. 10, 2007 6:43 p.m.

    jsmith:
    And George Soros (with MoveOn.org) doesn't lobby or attempt to influence Congress?

    The whole idea is for various factions (or groups of people) to petition government for action. Ideally (maybe) everyone would have altruistic motives, but that is not reality. So business owners/operators have every right to lobby government for favorable legislation. You do it. I do it. Not the same way as monied interests, but we do do it every time we cast a vote or write to those who represent us in Washington for some action on things of interest to us. McCain/Feingold is such a horrible law: It prevents us from banding together to exert some influence on our national legislators (via political contributions). That law has been upheld by the Supremes, but it violates every principle of Freedom of Speech.

    I think we can agree that corporate welfare is seriously abused.

    IMHO, Conservatism is a much more equitable and just philosophy over modern liberalism. Big government is anethema to liberty, and that is where I disagree with Reid and his party (and more than a few republicans, including Bush).

    (BTW, I saw your correction after I posted...thanks.)

    TTFN

  • jsmith/Anonymous
    Oct. 10, 2007 6:38 p.m.

    History Buff,

    I cannot let pass your comment about "indolence" being "common to the poor."

    This is exactly the sort of attitude that makes some conservatives seem uncharitable. (Note: I did not say that liberals have the solution to poverty. Only that they are not as likely to be condescending.)

    Most of the poor work far, far harder than most of the rich (and even the middle class). And they see so little reward for their labor because they were born in the wrong circumstances, or got sick at the wrong time, or just werent as smart or talented or lucky as others.

    I know because I grew up among the poor. I am no longer poor, but not because I alone was a hard worker. In truth, Im pretty lazy; but I happened to have the blessing of good parents and the good luck to be very good at school (thus, full-ride scholarships, job offers, etc.).

    Please note Im not saying that Democrats have the solution to the problems of poverty. They dont. But please dont be so smug as to suggest that Republican favors to Wall Street would solve poverty if only the poor werent so lazy.

  • Anonymous
    Oct. 10, 2007 6:26 p.m.

    "He (Reid) has no experience in the military" says Brian. And Bush, Cheney, and Rice do?

  • Observant
    Oct. 10, 2007 6:24 p.m.


    What I don't understand about Mr. Reed's comments is that if it is wrong for a conservative church leader to state his political views: why is OK for Hillary Clinton's chief stooge to use BYU as a bully pulpit to press his left wing political agenda. Shouldn't both parties have to play by the same rules.

  • Mormon tired of Bush
    Oct. 10, 2007 6:20 p.m.

    Reid has been saying all along that the war in Iraq is unjust. Turns out he's right. I have a son in Iraq who loves his country and I am proud of his service. Bush is wrong and his stance on Iraq seems to be motivated by the interests of the multi national corporations instead of the preservation and support of our freedoms. I voted for Bush twice and I am sorry that I did. Thanks to BYU for letting Reid stand up and present another view.

  • 2 cents
    Oct. 10, 2007 6:16 p.m.

    locals , or we and they ...like in SE Utah ,this guy wouldn't stand a chance and would be banned from the good ol' boy system in place. but good try

  • Anonymous
    Oct. 10, 2007 6:13 p.m.

    Hopefully at the dinner on Monday night Reid drafted a proclamation on Globel warming for President Hinckley.

  • Brian
    Oct. 10, 2007 6:09 p.m.

    He has no experience in the military but states that the military has failed in Iraq. His whole career has been in politics except for a few short years as a lawyer. He has no moral compass as Sean says. He simply panders to MOVEON.ORG.

  • jsmith/Anonymous
    Oct. 10, 2007 6:08 p.m.

    History Buff,

    You are right about the quote. I corrected myself a few posts down (or up now, I guess).

    I am not against capitalism. I am all for capitalism.

    What I am against is capital-seeking businesses being let into the political process. Lobbyists have used the Republican party to further their own interests. And that is a shame.

    There is much value in the principle of separation of church and state. There would be at least that much value in the principle of separation of business and state.


  • anonymous
    Oct. 10, 2007 6:01 p.m.

    Ah yes, always something "supported by scripture." Next we'll hear about a talking snake in The Garden or man giving birth (Adam's rib). Why not try to take others into consideration and stay the civic course on these blogs? That way it won't sound like pontification and might actually make some real world sense.

  • History Buff
    Oct. 10, 2007 5:57 p.m.

    To Anonymous:
    The "welfare" clause you allude to isn't in the Declaration of Independence. It's in the Constitution.

    I presume you are employed by a company that is either (1) big business, or (2) aspiring to be a big business. (If you're not employed, then you are either retired or living on the largess of government.) Since I presume you are employed, then your being employed is most certainly something in the interest of public good: frees gov't resources for needed services.

    Liberal philosophy is that money in the economy belongs to the government (after all, by whose Constitutional authorization is money printed -- and I'm not talking Federal Reserve) and they make a determination as to how much you get to keep.

    Conservative philosophy is that the money you earn is yours and you should keep most of it. The Constitution provides for government functions that are paid by taxes (infrastructure, etc.), but overall, I believe the republican philosophy to be more honest. It's not government's job to "provide the general welfare," just to "promote it."

    Only a fool ignores the poor. A bigger fool supports indolence common to the poor.

    In DOI, Pursuit of Happiness is property rights.

  • Dana
    Oct. 10, 2007 5:56 p.m.

    Just a couple of quick thoughts. I have followed Mr. Reid for years and never knew from his actions or words that he was LDS until a few years ago. I have found him to be untruthful, vitriolic, and a rather despicable person. But that is all I know of him and I will allow the Savior to be his ultimate judge. All I can do is judge his public personna and the words that he uses. To me, abortion (the taking of life) is an extremely important issue and far much more than global warming which man can not affect anyway. I personally have believed for years that liberalism, the way in which it is practiced today, is evil. It is the devil having perfected his craft and winning the hearts of people with a destructive message that holds just enough appeal and truth. It is a philosphy of man that places the government in the role of deity. And, to the person that said that abortion rights are irrevocable, you obviously do not know about the way the Supreme Court works. It is not irrevicable.

  • re:re:To Revise that thinking
    Oct. 10, 2007 5:55 p.m.

    It may be of interest to those that think "Republican are too cozy with big bisiness" that it is that business that provides JOBS and money to those that want to work. Big business is owned by stockholders, who also are your neighbors. Big business is not an "enemy", is is a vehicle for all of us to support our families and way of life. If that is not general welfare, I am not sure what is. Harry doesn't understand the basics of life!

  • anonymous
    Oct. 10, 2007 5:47 p.m.

    Isn't it interesting how the gay issue always comes into focus today? The fact is, persons secure with their masculinity or feminity couldn't care less about what someone else does with theirs.

  • Mmmmm
    Oct. 10, 2007 5:48 p.m.

    I wonder how his remarks would stand a comparison to scripture when we look at moral principles (abortion and same-sex relationships) or the political philosophies of men in context of "cleansing the inner vessel" or how to deal with "robbers".

    I think I will stand with the Prophets including Pres. Benson.

  • Don White
    Oct. 10, 2007 5:39 p.m.

    Brother Reid mentions Joseph Smith. It is important to mention that when Joseph Smith went to Martin Van Buren, a Democrat, to redress the wrongs done to the Mormons in two states, he was flatly turned down. Joseph said his refusal to even try to help would result in his not winning another election, and he didn't. In 1840 he ran against William Harrison, a Whig, who defeated Van Buren. Was it any wonder that the Saints of that time also voted against Democrats and most of them wanted to be Republicans in 1896 when Utah became a state. But one of the provisions for statehood was an even division of Demos and GOP. It is no longer 50/50 in the Beehive State because most Utahns are conservative and the Democratic Party long ago moved away from conservatism. Brother Reid is an albatross flying in the wrong direction. We suspect he will also lend his support to Mrs. Clinton when she runs for president and vote against Mitt Romney, who is the best candidate out there.

  • jsmith
    Oct. 10, 2007 5:38 p.m.

    Oh come now, dball.

    NOTHING else matters?

    Harry Reid wasn't saying that abortion is right or that gay marriage is right. In fact, you may note that he is pro-life.

    But there are other issues too. Surely you don't think that Christians shouldn't care about issues like war and peace?

    Harry Reid didn't say that we shouldn't take a stand on abortion and gay marriage. What he did say was that we shouldn't take a stand ONLY on abortion and gay marriage.

    And it just might be possible that in world we live in right now (with courts deciding those two issues), the stands that our legislative officials take on other issues will actually have more impact on our lives.

  • Bensonite
    Oct. 10, 2007 5:36 p.m.

    It's not about right vs. left or Republican vs. Democrat, it's about individual liberties vs. collectism and tyranny. Individual have rights intrinsicly, and delegate there rights to our government as a master does to a servant. If i do not have a right, neither does the government. If i cannot force my neighbor to pay my rent because i am crippled, the government cannot do it for me. I may believe that those who do not share my religious beliefs will be damned, but does that mean I can force my religion upon them? Of course not! I may believe that gay marraige is wrong and destructive, but as long as it's concentual, I have not right to force my opinion, only to persuade. The entire purpose of government is to protect my rights. NOTHING ELSE. Not determine how I live, what I do with my money or free time. Allowing natural law and consequence to teach me what is correct or advantageous is best. People have the right to destroy there own lives as long as they don't take the rights of others. That is constitutional law, that is the gospel, that is church doctrine.

  • Don White
    Oct. 10, 2007 5:30 p.m.

    Brother Reid mentions Joseph Smith.

  • jsmith
    Oct. 10, 2007 5:31 p.m.

    And by "Declaration of Independence," I (Anonymous a few posts up) clearly meant "preamble to the Constitution." :-)

  • dball
    Oct. 10, 2007 5:22 p.m.

    Harry Reid said that people in the church have to understand there are issues more important than abortion and gay marriage.
    Apparently Mr. Reid has not read the family proclamation. He needs to reread the last paragraph. Because if that is true nothing else matters.

  • Who would you vote for?
    Oct. 10, 2007 5:16 p.m.

    Question. Given the choice between Guiliani and Clinton, who is Utah going to vote for? Both are pro choicers, both are pro gay marriage, but only one is anti war. It will be interesting to see who Utah sees as the most moral candidate.

  • anonymous
    Oct. 10, 2007 5:02 p.m.

    What would Hinckley say (says "these comments...")?
    Absolutely nothing. Who would want the IRS on their backs wanting to strip them of their tax shelters?

  • Anonymous
    Oct. 10, 2007 5:02 p.m.

    To Revise that thinking:

    I definitely dont think that all rank-and-file Republicans forget about the country's poor. I also dont think that all Democratic policies are good for the poor.

    However, I do think that too many of the Republican party leaders are too closely wedded to big business. Big, big business. Oil, pharmaceuticals, Wall Street.

    And these big businesses are in the business of making money (as they should be, they are businesses). In fact, these industries are in the business of making money at all costs, at anyone's expense.

    The interest of big business is not the public good (or as the Declaration of Independence put it, the "common welfare"). That is why it is dangerous for our politicians to be cozying up to them.

    When I said that Republicans too often forget the countrys poor, I did not mean to imply that Democrats have this issue figured out. Far from it. Rather I meant that Republicans have caused many problems in this area by simply ignoring the effects that favoritism for business can have on everyone else. Far too many LDS Republicans seem to be choosing to ignore the consequences of our societys lust for riches.

  • Mormon Independant
    Oct. 10, 2007 4:47 p.m.

    I agree with Senator Reid when he said that we focus too much on abortion and gay marriage. The current Republican party gets the public to focus so much on issues that they don't really affect (the courts do). They've got us all afraid that everybody's going to turn gay if the Dems are in power. I think I've decided in my relatively short time here on this earth that some people are just born different and that we just don't understand why(Elder Oaks made mention of this in a news release) and making gay marriage legal isn't going to have the same effect as a government offering incentives to a company (in the form of tax breaks, etc...) to attract their business.
    I believe these two issues are important but we, as a nation, are forgetting about the "poor among us." This is one of the main teachings of the New Testament, BOM, and D&C. "Who has done it unto the least of these..."

  • these comments drive people away
    Oct. 10, 2007 4:44 p.m.

    Look at the filth both sides are posting on this -- everyone is speaking with god-like phrases. Is this the Mormon image we really should be putting out there...??

    Everyone believes that they are right. LDS believe they are the only true church, so do Muslems, Catholics, etc...all confirmed by feelings/experiences.

    What people need to realize is that EVERYONE thinks this way. No comment board will change that.

    To those that are LDS: What would Hinkley say?

  • Joe
    Oct. 10, 2007 4:43 p.m.

    Hurrah for Brother Reid.

    Hurrah to BYU for inviting him.

    Shame on those who would allow only speakers who pass a particular political litmus test. I remind them that it was not long ago that Utah had political leadership that was more often Democratic than Republican. MANY members of the church hierarchy have been Democrats. When I joined the church, two of the three members of the First Presidency were, as were my bishop and stake president. Like Brother Reid, I also was uncomfortable with Elder Benson when he was in his period of high partisanship and diviseveness. But as he came closer to the presidency he moderated his tone, and as church president he was not the polarizing figure he had been.

    It amazes me that some in the church are joining with those voices who call the church a cult, who have redefined the good word "conservative," giving it a harsh and intolerant cast, the same kind of people who drove the church from the Midwest. And Mitt Romney's courting of them will backfire on him, because they will not let him into their club.

    I am not a Democrat. I am a faithful LDS member.

  • Revise that thinking
    Oct. 10, 2007 4:32 p.m.

    Do you honestly think that Republicans forget about the country's poor? Try thinking of conservative positions on welfare in terms of "give a man a fish and you feed him for a day; TEACH a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime." Look what happened in New Orleans: the city was basically a welfare state, where the government handed out benefits like they were candy, and when Katrina hit, half of the city's citizens had nowhere to go because they hadn't built their own financial foundation by which they could recover from the destruction. We Republicans firmly believe that taking care of the poor in the way you see it--giving people free money--does far more harm than good. We even feel that way in the church. In the church, recipients of church welfare funds or supplies have to work for what they get, and are instructed in ways to staty out of financial trouble. Giving government handouts makes people rely on government to take care of them. That teaches people that work isn't necessary because you can just get everything you need for free anyway. Republicans do not forget about the poor, they help in diffferent ways.

  • kd
    Oct. 10, 2007 4:33 p.m.

    There have been a lot of sanctimonious and self-righteous postings against Harry Reid. This should not bother otherwise rational persons. Don't forget, these same people (Reid-bashers) once believed weapons of mass destruction were plentiful in Iraq.

  • Anonymous
    Oct. 10, 2007 4:29 p.m.

    At the time the war broke out, President Hinckley spoke about how to reconcile the apparent contradiction between the scriptures "Renounce war and proclaim peace...(D&C 98:16)"and "Defend your families, even unto bloodshed...(Alma 43:47)" He stated "there are times and circumstances when nations are justified, in fact have an obligation, to fight for family, for liberty, and against tyranny, threat, and oppression." However, I remember listening very carefully for an outright endorsement of this war, which I never heard. He did say that this (Iraq) war is a continuation of the war on terror, but that is as far as it went. It is easy to suppose that there was a tacit endorsement, based on the timing of the talk and his strong statements that there are times when defense is justified. But the emphasis of the talk was to pray for peace among all of the nations, leaders, and people of the world. He also emphasized that it was healthy to have dissent and various opinions.

  • Rich
    Oct. 10, 2007 4:20 p.m.

    To "I'm glad im not mormon": You're wrong in thinking that as a Mormon you are required to think a certain way. Brigham Young taught that Mormonism accepts truth wherever it comes from, and that would include science, politics, etc. Just as there are physical laws that govern the universe, there are spiritual laws that are in effect. If you violate such a law, you'll suffer the natural consequences. Lie or steal, and you'll suffer lack of self-respect, for one thing. The "90-year-old" man you disrespect, through experience and inspiration, can teach you much about the spiritual laws you should be obeying. He doesn't want to force you to do good, but he certainly has the duty to teach you what is right. You have the right to reject his advice and live the way you wish. You even have the right to become an ex-Mormon and criticize the LDS church and its leaders at every opportunity. But there are consequences to that, too. Question: As an ex-Mormon do you still believe in God? Christ? Ancient revelation? Modern revelation? Life after death? If so, do you actively support a religious group that strives to make the world a better place?

  • G. West
    Oct. 10, 2007 4:18 p.m.

    We Mormons should be acutely aware that both political parties are utterly corrupt. The right is filled with sectarian hate-mongers who would, if it were not the restraints secular society places upon the, be tarring and feathering Mormons and burning down our homes and churches. It is these good "conservatives" who won't vote for Romney because he is LDS.

    Likewise, the socialist Democrats are part of the dangers Ezra T. Benson warned us about that will make America's constitution hang by a thread one day. Reid's willingness to badmouth a prophet doesn't speak well for him. One doesn't speak evil against the Lord's anointed without negative spiritual consequences.

    Looking back at Joseph Smith's 1844 candidacy, the predominant reason for it was to prevent the political parties of his day from dividing the Church over political differences. The battle of leftist and right-wing demagogues will be the undoing of America, as political compromise becomes all the more unlikely and each side perceives the other as the ultimate evil. Mormons should vote, but neither the Democrats or Republicans are worthy of that show of support.

  • jsmith
    Oct. 10, 2007 4:11 p.m.

    One message that is very clear from the Book of Mormon is that a society that forgets about its poor is on the verge of destruction. One message that is very clear from the Doctrine & Covenants is that we have weighty stewardships over what the Lord has given us: possessions, positions, and the earth itself.

    In my understanding of the gospel, I ignore these principles at my own risk.

    One message that is very clear from all scripture is that all life is sacred. One message that is very clear from modern revelation is that the traditional structure of the family is sacred.

    In my understanding of the gospel, I ignore these principles at my own risk.

    In today's political climate, it seems nearly impossible to find a political party that gives enough emphasis to both sets of principles (Republicans tend to ignore the first set, while Democrats often ignore the second). So I choose to be independent.

    But I still want to be an active citizen and vote. So, like Harry Reid, I choose to support whatever party seems to me to have the most potential to actually accomplish some good in a given situation.

  • Las Vegas Dave
    Oct. 10, 2007 3:58 p.m.

    RE:KMAC

    I'm not sure your read my comment before you wrote. I just re-read it and no where did it say I believe all Utah Mormons act the same. You may feel that way. I lived there for 40 years and know first hand there are about 10% that do not.

    I did state that on my mission I was told all Utah Mormons were closed minded, but in the real world they are not.

    I do think that the 160 comments (most of them anti- Reid) should be forwarded to the First Presidency and a new church policy should be written using these majority rules comments:

    AFTER SENATOR REID'S ILL FATED TALK AT BYU, FROM HERE ON FORWARD ALL MEMBERS MUST BE A REGISTERED REPUBLICAN OR YOU WILL BE EXCOMMUNICATED. YOU MUST BELIEVE AS WE DO, SAY AS WE DO, ACT AS WE SAY AND YOU WILL ALL BE SAVED.

    Oh wait wasn't this the plan in the pre-existence?

    I went searching the bible for those Jesus was hateful, spiteful, and only loved those who agreed with him scriptures and setting it straight LV Jesus didn't care for a liar but he still loved all no matter what.

  • Chris
    Oct. 10, 2007 3:55 p.m.

    This guy pretty well disgusts me, and that is hard to say since I am LDS too. Why does he tell BYU students, on BYU campus, not to worry about two extremely important moral issues like abortion and same sex marraige? The church adamantly opposes these issues, and publicly. Doesn't the church also teach self-reliance, and yet he would have a national health care plan that would be a large leap toward gov't dependence, and much higher taxes. Doesn't the Book of Mormon state that high taxes are "grevous to be borne"? I am insulted and offended that he would have the arrogance to say those things on our campus. The gall of this man! Go ahead and trash President Benson. Why stop there though, why not trash President Hinckley and Monson too? They believe in conservative moral, family values too. They are political party neutral but in no way are they moral values neutral.

    People are welcome to have their own beliefs and vote how they wish. Just know what kind of values you are voting for (abortion, same-sex marraige, gov't dependence, higher taxes, retreat and surrender, and all the rest).

  • Say no more!
    Oct. 10, 2007 3:54 p.m.

    Harry Reid reveals his true thoughts on past church leaders to a reporter. He states that President Benson, called of God, was guilty of leading obedient church members down the wrong path because Pres. Benson was too right wing. Hmmm. Stop the tape! Red flag alert! I think I have heard all I need to hear from Harry Reid. Oh, and if that doesn't do it for you then listen to this- (according to Harry Reid) "Social Security is the greatest social program ever". Wow! Say no more again.

  • dk
    Oct. 10, 2007 3:50 p.m.

    No, JROD, the fact of the matter is the NeoCons are further right than Genghis Khan. And down the road the country is going to have to pay the price for a policy of preemption, torture, and shock-and-aweing civilians. Our country has been duped by a group of megalomaniacs (almost all former CEO's of corporations) who only care about the bottom line. Want to know how much $$$ Halliburton and Lockheed Martin made last quarter?

  • dvhansen
    Oct. 10, 2007 3:42 p.m.

    The one thing that stood out to me was his comment on how the right wing, ultra conservative evangelicals are not Christian. The sole purpose of that comment, apart from his complete lack of respect for their religion, is to make it hard for Mitt to become President. By trying to anger them, and setting himself up as a spokesman for the LDS Church, he is trying to alienate the conservative base that Romney is trying to cultivate. He needs to keep in mind that many of them don't consider us to be Christian - he is only adding fuel to their fire by these highly rhetorical and vitrolic statements.

    I'm a BYU alum currently living in Nevada - having to put up with Pinky is an absolute disgrace. I'm embarrassed to call him my Senator... I find it hard to reconcile his pro-abortion, anti-marriage stance with that of the Church leadership. Again, embarrassing...

  • JROD
    Oct. 10, 2007 3:40 p.m.

    the fact of the matter is that Mr Reid and the liberal democrats are so far off the left that they even forget they are really supposed to be doing.. they are even going agains the fore fathers of this country and not against some of our prophets.. we have to support our military, they are doing a great job and i can only imagine that it is way harder than one sitting in congress or at home may think.. we have to deal with the problem now, so our children dont have to... how many 9/11's is it going to take before the support is obtained...?? How many innocenct people have suffer.. this is a great nations and as we all know and heard..." FOR HIM TO MUCH IS GIVEN, MUCH IS REQUIRED"
    we that are LDS should all support our candidate Mitt Romney, he may not be the best option, with all the necessary experience, but surely he will be led by the spirit to do what is right and much needed.

  • I knew him
    Oct. 10, 2007 3:34 p.m.

    I knew Senator Reid before he was a senator. He openly stated his ambitions, which were primarily to be a success as a politician. He was quick to embrace the unfortunate practice of putting political success ahead of common decency. Most politicians do so now, which is probably the reason for the low ratings our politicians currently receive. I abhor the constant tearing down of others with negativity to garner votes. That side of this man was given no attention in this article, maybe appropriately so. Having said that, I see no reason for all the venom in these comments. Would you say the same things face to face? I keep asking myself why I waste my time reading comments on articles. Now I intend to stop.

  • dennis
    Oct. 10, 2007 3:30 p.m.

    These postings are prime examples of how nasty and disgusting the political climate in Utah has become.
    Reminds me of my favorite story where Christ bodily threw all of the hypocrites out of the temple.

  • Shock and Awe
    Oct. 10, 2007 3:21 p.m.

    I am in shock and awe at the level of personal attacks directed against the Senator on this blog. I have met him, and he is NOT pro-choice. But even if he were, is it impossible to disagree with him in a civil manner. Yes, he has made some inappropriate comments about Bush and others in the past, but is that the excuse to continue to do the same now?

    Many of you seem to believe, despite instruction from the leaders in the Church, that it is impossible to be Mormon and a Democrat. One can have conservative moral views and believe that education, the environment, providing for the poor, etc. are important issues. Conversely, many republicans are socially liberal, including the likely nominee, Giuliani (pro gay marriage, pro choice, married thrice, not supported by his own kids).

  • Mo-town
    Oct. 10, 2007 3:15 p.m.

    Many on the Left are great people, good at their trade, worthy, charitable, good neighbors. But when it comes to the political realities of our day, they don't get it. That's not neccessarily their fault, they just don't get it

    And honestly, I don't mind engaging, hanging out or worshipping alongside Liberals, but it does however scare me when they're in power

    That's the difference bewtween Reid and your typical liberal. Reid has the power to shy away from protecting us from our enemies (which is 10% of the Muslim world. a lot of folks). Reid has the power to sacrifice our moral integrity. Reid has the power to waste our valuable time and resources on the myth that man is responsible for the slight increase on the earth's temperature

    Reid is a man capable of alot of things, including being a righteous Latter Day Saint. Running the House of Representitives and protecting me and my family, however, are not things he's capable of

  • David Edward Garber
    Oct. 10, 2007 3:13 p.m.

    I've been highly critical of Bush, myself, although I'm a lifelong Republican. Bush's "neo-conservative" policies, whether domestic or foreign, are not even remotely based on those sound political principles of Constitutionally-limited government and liberty and non-interventionism and such advocated by men like J. Reuben Clark Jr. and Ezra Taft Benson. Or countless other Church leaders, to some degree or another, for that matter. But for Harry Reid to accuse the Brethren of leading our Church astray--well, I'm astounded, to say the least.

  • Jayson
    Oct. 10, 2007 3:11 p.m.

    Mr Reid whole commentary has one fundemental flaw. The Democrat party is all about taking away personal accountability and placing it with the government because they know what is best. Whereas the LDS church teaches self sufficiency and personal accountability. Members are encouraged to set aside money and food in the event of a disaster or unexpected loss of income. They are also encouraged to take responsibilty in all their financial obligations and to pay them off and not try to blame someone else for their poor financial decisions.

    Also for someone who believes in not pushing his views on others he should have a major problem with the Democrat approach to redistribution of other people's money.

    He has a right to believe as he sees fit but he should know better than to try to claim that somehow members are blindly obedient.

  • johnny
    Oct. 10, 2007 3:08 p.m.

    Yea! Senator Harry Reid to the rescue! Trust me; Ezra Taft Benson will get the last laugh on Reid. I'll accept Benson's insight 1 trillion to 1 over Reid's any day. This has nothing to do with "Republicrats" --excepting for a few politicians from both parties they are pretty much the same.

    Socialists like Reid are nearly indistinguishable from genuine Communists. Both believe in the involuntary/forced redistribution of wealth through income, sales, property, payroll, social security, Medicare, and a maize of other taxes. Both believe the government does a better job than the citizens could possibly do for themselves on a voluntary basis.

    It's a flawed philosophy because the hand-out lines grow longer while the debt spirals and prices increase. The illegal printing of paper currency only exasperates the problem.

    Too bad we have all these taxes and paper money. Without them, Reid could only focus on the protection of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness for all Americans.

  • Morals?
    Oct. 10, 2007 3:01 p.m.

    My comment is for all those that seem to think that Senator Ried's comments on abortion and gay marriage were immoral. Senator Ried's point was that morality spans across more political agendas than just gay marriage and abortion. People should use their moral judgment when considering ALL policy, including healthcare and education.

    The problem is that most members just do what their explicitly told by the Church (gay marriage/abortion) and then vote against anything that costs them a little money.

    I personally think it's immoral to let someone go without surgery because they can't afford it just because I don't want to pay the taxes. I think healthcare is the moral decision. It's immoral to not increase educational spending because I may pay a few more dollars a year in income taxes. You may feel differently...fine. People have various moral stance on issues.

    The whole point is that the Church is explicit about a few moral issues and implicit about other moral issues. Make sure you consider both in finding your political stance.

  • JROD
    Oct. 10, 2007 3:01 p.m.

    I think most comments are being mis-interpreted...
    being a conservative Republican and clear open minded, have lived in various other coutries, it is not a matter of being a close minded Utahan... we as LDS live as we do, not because we are told or because we are threatened..we do live as we do and abide by the priciples and standards because we elect to live this way and we see the most fit way to live and raise a family. Our prophet Joseph Smith once said... We teach them the priciples and they govern themselves. Yes, we should do our part as citizens and members and vote against the so called " popular open minded" we should stand for what is right and deep down inside even the liberals know they are wrong and in sin, but they try to take as many down as they can. As our current prophet said many times...as Jesus says, we do not hate the sinners, but we hate the sin, and we all know perfectly clear what is right and what is wrong.

  • Dave in Vegas
    Oct. 10, 2007 3:00 p.m.

    You went to Vegas to understand Jesus?

    Did you find him at the casino's, strip clubs, or the houses of ill repute?

    The spirit goes where the spirit is Welcome. I have been to Vegas. Not the best place to find the lord.

  • abortion question
    Oct. 10, 2007 2:57 p.m.

    Can someone please reconcile this for me:
    1) Conservative Republicans are, for the most part, against abortion.
    2) Conservative Republicans do not support teaching sex education in schools or making birth control readily accessible to teens.
    3) The crime rate plummeted after abortion was legalized in the United States.
    4) Many who seek an abortion are lower income Americans and/or young teens.
    5) Conservative Republicans HATE social service programs that aid these families.

    So isn't this logic essentially forcing those who should not be parents or those who cannot afford a child to do so?

  • dennis
    Oct. 10, 2007 2:53 p.m.

    I wholeheartedly agree with you KMAC. The problem is that there is a subgroup in Utah that has become so enamored with "Democrats cannot possibly be good Mormons" that these fools actually believe it. It's no wonder so many of them tune in each day to hear offensive and divisive remarks from Rush Limbaugh.

  • Marc
    Oct. 10, 2007 2:46 p.m.

    Expressing a big "Thank You" to BYU for inviting Harry Reid to address the students and faculty. We should be grateful to them for bringing to us prominent people who choose to share their successful life stories and as a bonus choose to share a sincere personal testimony of his or her beliefs. We should all appreciate, (no matter our political views), Mr. Reid's generosity in beginning with feelings that mattered most to him. Any additional opinions expressed by Mr. Reid are his personal viewpoints that we can simply choose to accept or reject. They are certainly secondary to those expressions that mattered most. It's really that simple. For anyone to ridicule him, or anyone else, for sharing their personal or political views is not Christlike. Rather, shouldn't we emulate Christ's example, as President Samuelson and other BYU staff members did, by showing equal respect to all invited guest speakers, as in this case by extending an invitation to Mr. Reid as they previously had done for Mr. Chenney. Our BYU president is a shinning example for us all to follow.

  • anonymous
    Oct. 10, 2007 2:40 p.m.

    When people learn to mind their own business, the world will be a better place.

  • MikeD
    Oct. 10, 2007 2:39 p.m.

    To "Only in Utah",
    Perhaps you should read the official position. The last time I read it, it advised counsel with your Bishop and the Lord before having an abortion.
    Now, how often is the Lord going to authorize an abortion?

  • dennis
    Oct. 10, 2007 2:32 p.m.

    No, Kirk. Reid was referring to government leaders taking us down the wrong path. But Rush Limbaugh, no doubt would soundly agree with you in an attempt to make the other side look bad.

  • KMAC
    Oct. 10, 2007 2:33 p.m.

    Re: Dave in Vegas...

    Claiming that ALL Utah Mormon's act and think the way you claim they do seems pretty judgmental to me. I think the narrowmindedness of any "group" tends to come from a vocal minority. Most Utah Mormons do think for themselves and treat others with respect.

  • Judging Senator Reid
    Oct. 10, 2007 2:29 p.m.

    Last year the LDS church leadership took a strong stand for a constitutional amendment to define marriage as being only between a man and a woman. In fact, they issued a statement that was read in all the congregations in the U.S urging members to contact their representatives in the Senate and urge them to vote for this Amendment? Now I ask you, how did Senator Reid vote for this important piece of legislation that the LDS Church took an official public position on? He voted against it.

    I'd like to put this in context. The scriptures have many examples where the prophets of God went to the leaders of government with inspired counsel for the benefit of mankind. And now this just happened in our modern day society and what did our esteemed LDS senator say to the prophets? He told them he believes he knows more that they do and he took the adversarial position. In my opinion he's going to have some answering to do in the next life for his wrong decisions.

    "Where much is given, much is required."

  • Kirk
    Oct. 10, 2007 2:20 p.m.

    I have no problem with church members being Democrats. What gets me is Reid's assertion that the only reason many members of the church are conservatives is because of church leaders that have "taken us down that path." In my opinion, that just isn't accurate and it's very offensive. It's also very silly since the church doesn't endorse a party and there are church leaders that are Democrats. Most church members are conservative because the philosophy aligns much more closely with what they believe, and not just regarding moral issues. The other thing I disagree with is Reid's criticism of those that believe that the issues of abortion and gay marriage are more important than global warming. I'm sorry, I think that those issues are way more important. And not because any leader has told me to think that way.

  • Only in Utah
    Oct. 10, 2007 2:20 p.m.

    I am constantly amazed at the narrow, self-righteous world view that members of the church have in Utah. Please, get a grip. May I please remind you that the church is NOT against abortions as a whole; they are against abortions for the wrong reasons. You need to stop listening to the right-wing whack-jobs. We should be the first people standing up for safe, legal abortions, under the proper circumstances.

    Additionally, have you so soon forgotten how the saints were persecuted in the 1800's. How can you, in good conscience, dictate morality to other people? If you don't support gay marriage, don't have one. Otherwise, you are simply jumping on the same bandwagon as those who drove the saints into the wilderness because they didn't want a "deviant" religous group in their otherwise pure land.

    Do us all a favor and think before you launch into your diatribe.

  • Judy
    Oct. 10, 2007 2:17 p.m.

    This is directed to those of you who think Harry Reid's position on abortion and gays is okay. The homosexual powers that be will not end with wanting acceptance they are going to see to it that our children will be taught this from kindergarten on up.That it's okay and if you think otherwise. You and your familys will be charged with a hatecrime. Barney Frank has already seen that law put into effect with the help of the like of darling Harry Reid &TED Kennedy. Wake up you people. The wolf is at the door.

  • How Sad
    Oct. 10, 2007 2:00 p.m.

    How unbelievealy sad that so much ill-will could be directed towards a brother in the gospel, considered worthy by his priesthood leaders to enter the temple, whose children have atteneded BYU, served missions, and been sealed in the temple to worthy companions.

    No gosepl principle condones or authorizes such hatred, no matter how cautiously it is presented, nor does the Church's strict political neutrality serve as the basis for such behavior.

    Seems to me that in our politics, as with so many other areas of our lives, we would all benefit from reading and rereading the 121st Section of the Doctrine and Covenants, paying particular attention to the last 25 verses, and trying our best to ask, introspectively, how those words can have meaning in our lives.

    If Senator Reid or any of his family members or firends were to make it this far in this blogging thread, please know there are many readers here full of respect and admiration for thoses of both political parties who do the best they can to improve our Nation. Thank you!

  • LVCK
    Oct. 10, 2007 1:55 p.m.

    Reid is the titular head of the Democratic Party-- a party that embraces gays, lesbians, abortions, socialism, anti-gun ownership and anti-family values. The party that believes that what's mine is yours. The party of Al Sharpton, Jesse Jackson, and Rosie O'Donnell. The party the Hollywood elite support. Yep, that's the party most Mormons want to belong to--the party Reid believes the majority of Mormons will belong to. Not.

  • John Tate
    Oct. 10, 2007 1:51 p.m.

    Q- What coalition has 3 members?
    A- The one representing Religion and Family Values at the Democratic National Covention!

    Congratualations Harry for hanging in there. As for me and my house, we will serve Lord.

  • Looking in from the Outside
    Oct. 10, 2007 1:42 p.m.

    All of the "Rush Limbaugh-sounding Utahns" are embarrassing to the Church. The Church (fortunately) now had more members outside the U.S. than inside and more in non-Utah states than inside Utah - so there is a "watering down effect" of the "Utah Mormon Caricatures" that seem to be all too real in here... How can you publicly judge Senator Reid in terms of his spirituality, testimony or conviction? You can judge him all you want on his stated political views and on how he votes in the Senate, but you are straying into dangerous territory by judging him "unfit" for membership in his Church. If you polled Church membership worldwide, I guarantee that you'll garner a wide spectrum of political views, with more in the "center" than anywhere else. There would appear to be both "good and bad" in both of your parties. Instead of being so polarized, I'd suggest more of you get involved with BOTH parties and work to influence them to "do good".

  • Destiny
    Oct. 10, 2007 1:37 p.m.

    Why is it when conservatives voice their opinions, it's always hate speech or judging others? All the while the liberals can call names and spew malicious vile until the cows come home and they are the darlings of the Democratic party. I think that the volume of response to Reid's appearance at BYU is a testament to why he should not have been invited. The Church teaches us to avoid contention as far as Church doctrine. By the way, I think many of you are using this discussion as a forum for expressing your anti-Mormon feelings and really couldn't care less about Senator Reid. I'm just glad he is not in my Ward. I can't imagine having him for a Sunday School teacher. I'm LDS conservative, a Rush Limbaugh, Hannity fan and proud of it! As for you Jack Mormons, go on loving Senator Reid; we'll leave the judgement to the Lord. The gospel does not teach support of abortion and gay rights. READ the Proclamation to the Family.

  • Korey Smith
    Oct. 10, 2007 1:35 p.m.

    I think that history has shown that whever a party in politics gains a majority, corruption becomes excessive. To a certain extent, I feel the Republican Party is now having troubles steming from this. If for no other reason then to keep the Republican Party in check, I feel that it is good to have a opposing views represented in our political system. However, the modern Democratic Party has lately leaned so far to the left they are representing views that I feel our morally corrupt and eccentric. All one has to do is listen to the verbal abuse that the leadership in the Democratic Party regularly speaks about people of religion. Tune into any left leaning radio talk show and it is common place to ridicule God worshiping people. The Democratic Party has become a party that promotes values that are detrimental to families, Our Society, and Religion. They do this under the guise of "Freedom of Speech and Expression." Their talking point word called "Progressive" is none other then then word "Degressive" in disguise. Harry, in the words of Luke Skywalker "Come back from the Dark Side!!"

  • Mormon and Republican?
    Oct. 10, 2007 1:28 p.m.

    Perhaps you can be a good Mormon and a good Republican, but you can't be a good Christian and a good Republican.

    I'm amazed at the number of LDS who simplistically think that just because Democrats are "evil," Republicans are "good." Cuckoo! Time to wake up!

  • Never Forget
    Oct. 10, 2007 1:28 p.m.

    Reid is pro-abortion and pro-gay marriage.

  • Setting it straight in LV
    Oct. 10, 2007 1:21 p.m.

    Reids definition of think instead of blindly follow is Rationalization, not reason w/study and faith. Faith is an action word, not blindness. If you've ever witnessed an abortion you would not call it agency. Perplexed is just that be/c the message of the BoM & Bible is If you take Christ & morality out of government, something very dangerous fills the void and we are witnessing it right now with our Socialistic experiment. What land swindling? As the misguided Ezra Benson said government's use of power is FORCE. Force to "legally" do as he wants while squashing all other's attempt to do the same and calling them "criminals." Reid is a known factor in NV. This is not backbiting, its front biting & this is what makes US great. BTW, it happens in other states also. Dave in Vegas, if you missed hate in teh Bible read Matt 3:7, 12:34, 23:33, 3:7 among others. Christ did not mince words with liars. Also, the religious right love the Mormon vote. They may not like their doctrinal beliefs but they LOVE the vote and the moral stances we have with them. BTW, Reid is pro-abortion and pro-gay marriage. Watch his footsteps.

  • Clark
    Oct. 10, 2007 1:15 p.m.

    To Beam Me Up Scottie: Amen! Here's for brotherhood and good will.

  • Washington State Reader
    Oct. 10, 2007 1:14 p.m.

    It continually amazes me to find LDS Republicans criticizing Senator Reed. Especially supporters of Mitt Romney.

    Can't you see that Senator Reed is the balance to Governor Romney?

    Most of the criticism of Governor Romney for being LDS can be handled by reference to Senator Reed.

    It is absolutely wonderful to have two strong LDS leaders representing their paries at such high levels with very different views. It makes the statement from the 1st Presidency concerning the political neutraility of the Church concrete and real.



  • Doug Brockbank
    Oct. 10, 2007 1:13 p.m.

    Harry Reid
    - Says hes pro-life, but denounced Alito who help upheld a recent ban on partial birth abortions.
    - Implies that Joseph Smith would be a liberal Democrat, and undermines President Benson, a past prophet, and Pres Wilkinson (formter president of BYU).
    - Undermines the Churchs official position against abortion and support of a Constitutional Ammendment favoring a traditional definition of marriage by saying the Republican Party,They have focused on just a few issues, flag-burning, gay marriage, abortionThe country has gone beyond that to other issues.
    - While brave men and women fought in combat in Iraq called the Iraq war lost and called the commander in chief a liar.
    -Said Bush is driving people to the Democratic Party (even though he presides over a Democratic Congress that has a 14% approval rating while Bush's is at 34%)
    - May fit the profile of who President Hinckley referred to in his General Conference talk War and Peace by saying It may even be that He will hold us responsible if we try to impede or hedge up the way of those who are involved in a contest with forces of evil and repression.

  • and 3 more
    Oct. 10, 2007 1:13 p.m.

    If reid wants healthcare nationalized, where will the candians go for their healthcare, when they can't get quick and adequate care in Candada? Ask Reid that one. Betcha you won't get a good answer.

  • Chris
    Oct. 10, 2007 1:09 p.m.

    To Reid supporter: In sunday school, I learn how to be self sufficent, not dependent upon the church or government for my daily bread. Ried needs to re-visit this concept.

    Secret war? LOL. AT least were not bombing asprin factories in the middle of the night.

  • 2 cents plus
    Oct. 10, 2007 1:05 p.m.

    I used to be a democrate, until I got out of college and got a job. Then, my thoughts were tuned into the high taxes I paied out to support those that could work, but won't. Then I noticed the SSI deduction and was told "Don't worry. By the time YOU retire, it won't be around". No, I hear I might have to pay for irresponsible parents who choose to have cable TV, rather than purchase healthcare for their kids. Stop the train, let me off. I'm out of cash.

    Yes, it is possible to be a good LDS and a liberal democrate. I've known many. Good people, yes. Misguided with my cash? Youbetcha.

  • Reid Supporter
    Oct. 10, 2007 12:59 p.m.

    If you love Bush because his is pro-life and against gay marriage, consider this: he has done nothing to prevent either. In fact gay marriage is now legal in Mass. and nothing has been done to reduce the abortion rate. Bush says he cares about these issues, but he does not.

    Please also consider that the War looks more like a secret war to attain riches (Hel. 6: 17), than any sort of liberation. There is genocide in Darfur, bloodly demonstrations for democracy in Burma, proliferation of WMD, human rights abuses, etc. But Bush only sees big contracts for his buddies and lots of oil.

    Please also consider that issues which are important to Reid, (education, health care, environment), are principles which are taught each Sunday.

    I see absolutely no contradiction between being a liberal and being a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.

    Thank you Senator Reid for your speech.

  • anonymous
    Oct. 10, 2007 12:58 p.m.

    Keith's posting above exemplifies the danger in America today. Disagreeing with the current Bush Doctrine gets you a "traitor" label. And these same poor NeoCon souls refuse to see the similarities between what is going on today and what happened in Fascist Germany and Italy. Is it presidential election time yet?

  • M. N.
    Oct. 10, 2007 12:57 p.m.

    Senator Reid is correct about the truly far right. They dispise the Mormon religion and have no problem denigrating our faith by telling us what we really believe; that we aren't Christains; and that we are going straight to Hell. They view all the good we do around the world as strictly vain acts of works. That why business savy people like Mitt Romney would have a hard time winning over the South - because of their views of Mormonism. They'll disguise their language by saying he's a flip-flopper but what they really want to say is, "I could never vote for a Mormon."

  • Beam Me Up Scottie!
    Oct. 10, 2007 12:57 p.m.

    I'm bewildered that there can be so much hate and discord among LDS members after such an uplifting and edifying General Conference. What a contrast! Perhaps many who have commented on this blog did not watch conference? Whatever happened to becoming a Zion people "of one heart and one mind"? What happened to trying to see other people's point of view? Are we so caught up in our own opinions that we can see clearly? President Hinckley has said: "We have been a very quarrelsome and difficult people in our conflicts one with another. We so need to turn to the Lord and look to Him." Annonymous blogs like this seem to bring out the worst in people. Would we rail on and ridicule each other and SHOUT at each other if we were all in the same room? If we could talk face to face, would we be more civil? Would we find that we really have quite a lot in common? Isn't America about compromise?

    P.S. Oh, and by the way, I didn't leave the Republican party, it left me!

  • Name Calling All Around
    Oct. 10, 2007 12:52 p.m.

    Im not so concerned about the vitriolic nature of the dialog that gets posted in response to a subject such as Senator Reids visit to campus. Both political parties have their faults and short comings. Both have extreme elements that tend to dominate or hijack certain elements of their respective platforms. In the case of Senator Reid though, I quickly lost respect for him, as a person and political figure, shortly after his rise to prominence when he resorted to personal name calling and ad homonym attacks. He renders himself much less credible when he stoops to such antics. The recent example was using the Senate floor to attack Rush. Senator Reid is an intelligent and thoughtful person I'm sure, thus it is all the more astounding that he would take Rush out of context to such a degree, all in the name of advancing his own partys political agenda. It reduces civil dialog and discourse to its lowest common denominator.

  • Anonymous
    Oct. 10, 2007 12:51 p.m.

    You should be praising his name Keith, as a serviceman and especially as a Mormon. He dares to break free, not of the doctrines of Christ, but of the sub-cultural, man-made, constructions that are so often touted as doctrines. The church has given each of us (as members) full sway (in either direction, left or right) in the prerogative to go where our consciounses lead. Mine, and apparently Reid's, has led me away from a "war" (occupation?) that was ill-founded and will lead to nowhere but a terroris breading ground.

    Renounce war, proclaim peace!

  • Funny
    Oct. 10, 2007 12:49 p.m.

    Wow, I am truly impressed at the amount of hate leveled by supposed good members of of the church against another. Of course he's a democrat so he should be excommunicated because it states quite clearly in 1 Nephi 2:14 "Woe unto the Liberals and Democrats for they are the minions of satan and are beyond redemption and are deserving of hatred and loathing beyond all reason." And wasn't it Alma the Younger that said "Hatred of those you disagree with is the portal to heaven"?

  • Anonymous
    Oct. 10, 2007 12:45 p.m.

    Tell me what the following have in common with the Republican party ..

    anti-mormon propaganda
    the Iraq War
    out sourcing of jobs
    failure to solve social security
    tax breaks for the wealthy
    immagration amnesty

    Answer: EVERYTHING!!!

    I used to be a Republican. No more. Until the Dem's change their abortion and gay marriage views I can't join with them either but I will say that both Harry Reid and President James E Faust ( also a democrat) make a lot more sense than the likes of Shawn Hannity and the nut cases that call themselves the religious right.

  • To BYUProf
    Oct. 10, 2007 12:43 p.m.

    The faculty of BYU should follow the lead of the Brethren to not preach personal political opinions rather than the subject matter to which you are deemed expert. Many of the Universities in this country are already dominated by left-leaning educators who openly disparage and trample upon conservatism. Professors should check their political leanings at the classroom door and simply teach and educate, not politicize. When the faculty openly aligns themselves with a political ideology they render themselves less than neutral. They polarize the educational environment and stifle the free flow of thought and expression.

  • There's Hope Yet
    Oct. 10, 2007 12:42 p.m.

    Finally a topic of some real societal significance that draws more comments than the latest story about BYU sports. Perhaps there is hope for DN readers.

  • Keith
    Oct. 10, 2007 12:38 p.m.

    This man is a disgrace to the United States of America. I am a practicing Latter-day Saint and a veteran of Operation Iraqi Freedom and I say loud and clear: Senator Harry Reid does not represent me as a service member nor as a committed member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. He should be tried for treason and promptly removed from public office, so as to prevent any damage he may do our nations defense.
    Shame on you Harry Reid and all like (or absent) minded followers. There are men and women fighting and dying for yours and the worlds freedom and all you can do is belittle their efforts. You all ought to be ashamed.

  • dh
    Oct. 10, 2007 12:38 p.m.

    I am a Republican and have never voted any other way for 30 years however after 8 years of Republican failures I am now listening more to people like Harry Ried and less to propaganda artists like Shawn Hannity. If the Dems would change their abortion and gay rights views I would switch parties in a heart beat. The Republican party has lost its way and is being controlled more and more but the right wing nut cases called the "christian right".

  • Bill
    Oct. 10, 2007 12:33 p.m.

    I agree with A.D. 34. I am also appalled at how some members of the church can be so easily led astray from the teachings of the church by those who "come in sheep's clothing". Reid's political views are a perfect example of what our prophets have been so valiantly warning us against in modern times "those who call good evil, and evil good". Reid and his parties' issues are a direct contradiction to Christ's teachings. I do not live in Utah, and yes, there are millions of us who live outside the state!

  • Setting it straight in LV
    Oct. 10, 2007 12:27 p.m.

    GWB, how poor your understanding of the pre-earth life is. There was no war to determine if we would have agency here or not. The war was who would follow Christ to earth and have agency. As if we all chose to follow Satan that Hev Father would say OKay, Let's try it without agency this time. So I guess the Lord is wrong by telling us what decisions to make re: Thou shalt not kill, steal, covet, adulterate, honor father, etc. You are off your rocker. And Mr. Let's Remember, Reid is not anti-abortion and he is pro-gay marraige. I know him, I and my family have watched him before he even ran for Federal office, and he continues to support those issues. He IS a chameleon and his side-stepping the issue by saying that the courts have decided the issue is exactly why he wants to block any Supreme Crt justice who may overturn the issue. They routinely overturn their decisions on many topics. And Mr Prof if you see war as a moral issue you need to read the Old Test and BOM more carefully: PHD. BTW multiple members of the 12 are reigned in often.

  • Mary
    Oct. 10, 2007 12:27 p.m.

    I don't dislike Reid because he's liberal, but because he lies. He continually attacks President Bush in a nasty fashion. He took a comment of Rush Limbaugh's and made a total fabrication out of it. I am a Utah native living in Texas. My dream has always been for my grandchildren to go to BYU, but I hope they can find someplace safer for them to continue to have idealism and high morals.

  • kd
    Oct. 10, 2007 12:25 p.m.

    Hmmmm. Utter silence about President Hinckly ever saying anything contradicting his Iraq War being a just one statement.
    Maybe Reid is on to something. Liberal, Dem, whatever. He most certainly is not speaking from some radical fringe, and the overwhelming non-approval ratings (what is it today - 70% or something?) would indicate the majority of America agrees with him.

  • To Sen Reid:
    Oct. 10, 2007 12:18 p.m.

    Senator Reid, if you want people within your own religion to take you seriously, then start acting more like a member of your own faith!! That begins with your blatent anti-Bush personal attacks. How is that Christ-like? Then lets talk about your support of the pro-choice/pro-homosexual elements within your party. I mean, really, do you think active LDS voters will support your positions when you talk, act and vote completely on the opposite side of almost everyone within your own religion? And finally, stop hiding behind the feel-good, welfare, "womb to the tomb" mentality that your liberal Democratic party touts! Face it, the Dems don't want anyone to think for themselves unless it is in lock-step with them. That "keep em on the farm" thinking will kill this country.

  • No Rocky Reid
    Oct. 10, 2007 12:18 p.m.

    Now theres two losers. Enough Said!

  • Kent
    Oct. 10, 2007 12:13 p.m.

    My concern with Harry Reid is not that he is Democrat or even sees the world from a liberal perspective. My concern is twofold. First, he actively espouses far left wing ideaology and supports organizations that are totally against what the Gospel teaches. In his role as Senate Majority Leader, you have no idea that Mr. Reid is even LDS! Instead, he portrays himself as someone with values aligned with Moveon.org and those types of far left organizations. This is a big concern to me. Second, he is mean spirited. I have really been offended by some of the things he has called Pres. Bush. To publically call a man a lier doesn't seem to fit the teachings and values that we have as members of the Church. While speaking at BYU, he should have been asked some very tough questions about his positions. He can't have it both ways, namely, be an active LDS person but then support ideologies that are in direct opposition of what the Church teaches!

  • Gun Boats
    Oct. 10, 2007 12:08 p.m.

    I am sure he is a great church member and I can't judge him in that the arena nor should anyone else.

    But he has been a lousy Senator and done little during his time as majority leader to improve our nation. I throw him in with Orrin Hatch who is another Mormon Senator that is lousy and done nothing great his past 3 terms.

    I am sure there are better LDS men and women who could address the issues better for the USA if they were elected to office. Reid and Hatch need to retire yesterday.

  • kd
    Oct. 10, 2007 12:06 p.m.

    I know for a fact that President Hinckley was quoted as saying the Iraq war "was a just one."
    This of course, was way before certain facts such as no WMD's were ever found and many other conflicting facts came to light. Pardon my ignorance, but has President Hinckley mentioned anything since regarding this "just war?"

  • Carl
    Oct. 10, 2007 12:05 p.m.

    Thanks to BYU Undergrad (11:32 AM) suggesting people read Harry Reid's talk.

    Clark (11:40 AM) accurately represented the views of many of us who have lived outside Utah.

    I never heard the vitriolic comments by or directed toward LDS Church members while living outside Utah before moving back to Utah. We have enjoyed the Sacrament Meetings in the Anaheim 3rd and 1st Wards and Barstow 1st and 2nd Wards where LDS members (as a whole) treat everyone more kindly than happens in too many places within Utah.

  • Dave in Vegas
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:59 a.m.

    I left Utah for Las Vegas with 100,000 Mormons because of the close mindedness of Utah Mormons.

    On my LDS mission I was always told my opinion didn't matter because I was a Utah Mormon. It upset me.

    Listen to you people, and ask yourself what would Jesus say or do?

    From the comments on Mr. Reid's speech Jesus would be saying I hate Democrats, anyone who believes differently than I do about Gays, Abortion, the war in Iraq! I missed anger and hate in the bible from Jesus, in fact I'm not sure the book of Mormon had it either.

    Isn't being a true Christian or being able to listen to opposing views and be able to re-affirm your position stronger?

    Most Mormons feel that Pres. Bush supports their beliefs, but as I read he follows the religious right. If I'm reading the news right they HATE Mormons and think they are a cult.

    How many Democrats tear down the Mormon church?

    Not living in Utah anymore I can see that possibly the people on my mission were correct, my opinion was very short sighted from living there.

    I think I now understand what Jesus taught.

  • Army Guy
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:53 a.m.

    I took BYU Prof's advice and read the New Testament. I learned about Armageddon. I think it might refer to a war...

  • dk
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:51 a.m.

    I knew it wouldn't be long before some catholic-bashing would enter into this blog discussion. Perplexed J.D. unfortunately speaks for too many in this community who focus on this sort of nonsense. It's much easier than look at one's own group and expect positive change.

  • jade
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:46 a.m.

    I wonder how many Israelites made fun of Moses's inability to speak well. Just as well Harry Reid isnt chosing Prophets.

  • anonymous
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:45 a.m.

    For those who proclaim to be "the chosen people" there certainly are some nasty ones in their group.
    Never seen such back-biting in my life.

  • MINNIE
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:42 a.m.

    To: "GLAD I'M NOT A MORMON"
    I think tho protest too much????

  • Perplexed J.D.
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:43 a.m.

    I stand corrected. Secularism is evil. I now support requiring all publicly funded schools to teach religious doctrine and requiring all government gatherings to begin with a prayer. The new national religion will be Catholicism. Those who disagree will be prosecuted.

  • tj
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:42 a.m.

    Get a grip folks. Once and for all Harry Reid is not pro abortion or in favor of gay marriage. He is a democrat but he personally does not favor those issues. What exactly is wrong with that? Can one be a Republican and not agree with every position the Republican party takes? Yes and Yes again. This dialogue makes me want to vote Democrat. And to the many who think you cannot be a Mormon and a Democrat please think again. I stand by my previous statement that I would vote for Harry Reid over George Bush any day of the week. And once again I am currently holding a temple recommend.

  • Clark
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:40 a.m.

    Wow. Reading these comments makes me glad I'm leaving Utah in two months. Let's all get over the idea that you can't be a good Mormon and a Democrat. Even if it were true, what does it matter to you? You're not giving him his temple recommend interview. You don't have to support him. I'm a conservative who respects President Bush while having serious issues with many of his policies. I also very much respect Senator Reid after attending the forum yesterday. I didn't agree with him on a lot of things, but overall I thought his talk was excellent and he was right on regarding a number of issues. So while I'm still a conservative, I say HURRAH for Mormon Democrats!!! Hopefully there will be more of you in the future and we'll learn to look beyond political differences. But either way, LDS people commenting on this article, let's quit the bickering, accusations, and name-calling. That is certainly not consistent with the doctrines of our Church.

  • Where are older comments?
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:39 a.m.

    What happened to the older comments posted on this story yesterday (October 9th)? They are gone now. Why has the story been revised today? Is that why yesterday's comments are gone?

  • To Dale J. Christensen
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:39 a.m.

    Ok Dale, stop judging those who apparently are judging Harry Reid.

  • Paul
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:38 a.m.

    Harry Reid, Are you honest in your dealings with your fellow man? As a politician, your greatest skill is the ability to lie with that transparent straight face. I lived in Nevada and I was ashamed of you every minute I was there. Oh by the way, how are you and your son doing with those land swindles?

  • Jayson
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:37 a.m.

    I have no respect for a guy who holds himself up as a member of a church and through his actions in the public eye brings disgrace on that church. I can't recall any other LDS politician who spent so much time disrespecting our soliders and fellow politicians. It is a shame that he can't be more like Mr Lieberman. Mr Lieberman is an example of the civility that is lacking among many of our modern day politicians.

  • Very sad
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:36 a.m.

    The sad part of so much of what I read is the hatred spread by people. Why is it nesecary to turn to name calling either by Mr. Reid towards Pres Bush or by readers towards Mr. Reid. Here is our biggest challenge, we no longer want to allow people to have their beliefs, their opinions, If you are not with with me then you are my enemy, so we turn to spewing hatred. Is it not possible to disagree with someone and still have them be a good person?

    Very sad...

  • Democrats
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:34 a.m.

    Interesting that when Dick Cheney comes to town there is no respect from the Democrats, but the Republicans at least show a little courtesy and dont picket this guys speech. When are the Demos going to clean up thier act and not play so dirty.

  • BYU Undergrad
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:32 a.m.

    Before all of you start throwing rocks at Reid, remember that there is as much rhetoric in this article as the news writer claims there was in Reid's talk.

    Although I wasn't at the press conference afterwards, I was at the forum assembly and I can assure you that this article is extremely biased to the traditional republican point of view.

    I felt that Reid's address was one of standing for one's principles (as he has done regardless of his union or political affiliations) and warning us to think rather than blindly follow. A major portion of his talk was devoted to telling us HIS political views and explaining why he stands by them (never in a tone of judgment of disagreement).

    I don't agree with the writer of this article that he was attacking former LDS political leaders. In fact, I believe that he was applauding them and recommending that we follow their lead in taking a personal stance on the issues.

    Like previous writers on this blog have argued, go and read his words yourself before taking a stance based on a biased writer's perspective.

  • Ken
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:29 a.m.

    I don't know about this guy. There's a whole lot of compartmentalization going on within this guy when he belongs to a church that definitely feels that abortion and gay marriage are moral (meaning serious) threats to the American family, but then dismisses them as unimportant.

    Sure the economy and the American dollar are important to all of us, but it's hard to walk away from infanticide and men marrying men and say that we live in a good society because our bank accounts are fat and the polar bears are walking on solid ice again.

  • Carl
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:27 a.m.

    We watched Senator Harry Reid on KBYU yesterday and were impressed by the polite reception BYU gave him.
    Harry Reid praised Ezra Taft Benson "while serving as an Apostle serving in President Eisenhower's cabinet".

    Sen. Reid said "The invasion of Iraq was the worst foreign policy blunder in our country's history" (without mentioning George Bush). His opinion of the wrong path of some LDS leaders was NOT part of his speech but was a comment given in a press meeting AFTERWARD. He did NOT critize Ezra Taft Benson - The President of the Church.

    I had served one year in Vietnam in the US Army and was VERY offended when Governor George Romney said the US Military had "brainwashed" him.

    Shortly after beginning my 2nd one year in Vietnam I realized that George Romney was a rare politician who spoke the truth about the War in Vietnam.

    Senator Reid and Governor Huntsman are good examples that Democratic and Republican parties EACH have a few, good, honest politicians.

  • To Perplexed J.D.
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:23 a.m.

    Stop imposing your secularism on the rest of us then

  • anonymous
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:23 a.m.

    It's hard to believe that there are still those who literally believe in a "talking snake" in The Garden and belief in a white haired old man who lives in the clouds who hides on everybody and throws people into everlasting fire --- because he loves them. Were people asleep in school when they were being taught metaphor?

  • Ian
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:22 a.m.

    So its OK to allow people to kill babies (3,700 per day in the USA), but we should be upset that our soldiers are fighting against oppressive governments and terrorists that want to enforce their beliefs on everyone!

  • Lee
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:19 a.m.

    Maybe the LDS church's standards have slipped when it comes to giving temple recommends. I always thought the church taught "love thy neighbour". With the name calling Mr Reid engages in he is certainly lacking in that department. I am surprised that someone did not tap him on the shoulder when he started to criticize your prophets. What is BYU going to allow next... a speech from an anti- Christ explaining to students Christ did not really exist? After all, do you not believe your Prophets are Christ's/ God's spokesmen on earth?

  • Perplexed J.D.
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:11 a.m.

    People seem to forget that the law of the land is suppose to be the Constitution, not the Bible. The Bible may have influenced the framers, but their main concerns were taxation and religious freedom. I do not understand why conservative members of the church, not just the LDS church, insist on imposing their religious views on society as a whole. If you personally choose to have conservative religious views why should those views be forced upon society as a whole? That seems to be counter intuitive to the framer's intent. Live your life by your beliefs and allow others to do the same.

  • Alma 30:7-11
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:09 a.m.

    7 Now there was no law against a mans belief; for it was strictly contrary to the commands of God that there should be a law which should bring men on to unequal grounds.
    8 For thus saith the scripture: Choose ye this day, whom ye will serve.
    9 Now if a man desired to serve God, it was his privilege; or rather, if he believed in God it was his privilege to serve him; but if he did not believe in him there was no law to punish him.
    10 But if he murdered he was punished unto death; and if he robbed he was also punished; and if he stole he was also punished; and if he committed adultery he was also punished; yea, for all this wickedness they were punished.
    11 For there was a law that men should be judged according to their crimes. Nevertheless, there was no law against a mans belief; therefore, a man was punished only for the crimes which he had done; therefore all men were on equal grounds.

  • Blake
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:09 a.m.

    To everyone here that is questioning if you can be a good Mormon and Democrat: YOU DO REALIZE THAT YOU ARE GOING AGAINST CHURCH DOCTRINE AND TEACHING?

    Church leaders read the same script every year telling people to be involved in politics, regardless of what party it is. Why are you able to disagree on this point and be a good Mormon, but not disagree with a stance like gay marriage. QUIT PICKING AND CHOOSING!

  • Mo-Town
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:08 a.m.

    Who cares that Reid is LDS, that's not the issue. There's a lot of members of the church who are nothing short of political nut jobs. They may be worthy, kind, great neighbors, the whole bit; but when it comes to the political problems and realities we currently face, those on the left are absolutely clueless. Great people, but politically stupid, Mormon or not.

    And I don't mind the Left living in the same country as I do, as long as they're not in power. I have no problem shopping, hanging out or worshiping with a political nut as long as he/she isn't in a position to to impliment their absurdity

    That is what makes Reid different. He is in position to sacrifice our country's security. He is in position to sacrifice our country's moral integrity. He is in position to waste people's time and resources with the myth that man is responsible for the slight increase in the earth's temperature

    Great man. Dangerous political nut

  • rcronk
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:06 a.m.

    "We believe in agency" and therefore we should have no laws or punishments? If someone kills, we should let it happen because "we believe in agency"? I disagree.

    If you saw someone trying to kill a defenseless child, would you let them because "we believe in agency"? Watch the defenseless fetus open it's mouth to scream as they chop it to pieces and tell me that's not one of God's children who just got their chance to live get killed and then tell me that we should not only let that happen but should support it. I couldn't disagree with you more.

    It's a disgusting practice that should go the way of slavery. Most people now believe slavery is disgusting and that those who engage in it should be punished and I hope people will think the same of abortion some day and pass laws to punish those who engage in the act the same way we punish people who kill other people for convenience. With so many parents willing to adopt, why kill? For convenience and selfishness.

    I do agree that it would be nice for politicians to do their job, represent the people, hold to correct values.

  • Sweeping generalites
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:06 a.m.

    People on these pages seem to be making sweeping generalizations about each other. No one says anything about voting for only the letter behind each name. No one says Reid is a bad member and Hatch is good because of the letter behind their name.

    What a silly and simplistic argument. For those of you who think Christ doesn't sanction war at times, you don't know your scriptures very well. For those claiming not to judge others, again, you don't understand the scriptures. By their fruits ye shall know them.

    For the people who flame that if you oppose Reid one is for Bush is ridiculous. One can oppose both!

    For the Rush/Coulter haters out there, please provide concrete evidence of your assumptions. Then please provide evidence that MoveOn.org, Air America, Media Matters are not people with an agenda and spew propaganda. I think you've watched too much PMSNBC.

    The issues are deep and widespread but the comments on these pages are just the little branches. Want to solve the issue, get to the roots and then you can strengthen the greatest country in the world!

  • Bocas Brain
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:04 a.m.

    To those who see a huge struggle between religion and politics it may be a surprise for you to know that you do FULLY EXPRESS your religion (your beliefs or your faith) in how you are politically. What you really are is what you are politically.

    If you separate them then they can only operate in a mind that is compartmentalised or be in a state of schizoprenia.

  • Deeply Concerned
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:02 a.m.

    I am amazed at the people who are saying BYU is a bastion of liberalism and that they don't want their children to go there. What am I missing here? BYU is considered one of the MOST conservative universities on the planet. Which bubble would you rather your children to be educated in? Church teachings encourage LDS members to live in the world, be engaged in civic issues, and be connected to our community and neighbors (yet not be of the world). How can you be engaged if you don't understand issues from multiple points of view? How can we defend views and beliefs if we don't understand differing points of view and how to counter opposing views? Also, there are some issues that are ambiguous and we have no clear definitive guidance and a left to "be anxiously engaged in a good cause" and "are not commanded in all things."
    The mentality that we should "hole up" and shelter ourselves from the outside world is deeply disturbing and actually goes contrary to the teachings of President Hinckley. Look at Colorado City as an example of the outcome of that mentality.

  • anonymous
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:02 a.m.

    At the beginning of Bush's War on Iraq, President Hinckley said, "this war is a just one." Not long afterwards he was invited to Washington to receive a medal. It doesn't take an overworked imagination to connect the dots and wonder if a political party is being endorsed.

  • A.D. 34
    Oct. 10, 2007 11:00 a.m.

    "Beware of False prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves..."

    Beware of of those that call good, bad and evil, right. For me its easy to discern which is true.

    Apostles and Prophets have led us astray? Gay marriage and Abortion are not important issues? Global warming and health care are the greatest issues facing us today?

    Having just watched General Conference, the contrast in message could not be more clear.

    Take Senator Reid's speech for what it was, a prominant Democrat leader sharing his beliefs. A good man, probably? An inspired religious leader, absolutely not.

    For "ye shall know them by their fruits"

  • Nelson Thomas
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:55 a.m.

    Response to remarks by Brother Reed;
    We do not have any right to compel others to be charitable by forcefully taking the fruits of their labors by taxation and giving it to others. The plan to force others to be good was Satins plan which we rejected in premortality. Brother Reed has a good heart and noble desires but his means to accomplish them are contrary to the fundamental principles of the gospel. Such a course is tantamount to slavery. Americans are the most charitable people on the face of the earth and give billions of dollars a year to charitable causes of their own freewill. In the LDS Church we can donate to Humanitarian Services, the Perpetual Education fund, and pay generous fast offerings to assist the poor. These programs are exceptionally well managed with virtually no waste. President Benson who Brother Reed disparaged to the national press after the assembly was a righteous man who understood these sacred principles better than Brother Reed.

  • Ethan
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:54 a.m.

    It is a very good thing the LDS church does not endorse candidates or political parties. Neither democrats nor republicans have all the answers and both are extreme in their positions. There needs to be more meeting in the middle by both sides and a presidential candidate from a third party.

  • anonymous
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:52 a.m.

    "Just do as you are told and everything will be just fine" is the Utah credo. Step outside the guidelines and you will be punished severely. Stay within the lines - the lines are your friends. Stay within the lines - the lines are your friends ...
    (repeat as often as needed)

  • Rachel
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:50 a.m.

    I agree with his statement that we need to forget about abortion, etc. only because of what BYU student already mentioned... we believe in agency. But I can't stand either party right now, so his assuming that republicans will change to democrats because of Bush's mistakes... not me! I'm not happy with the democrats in office either. I just want someone to actually do what they are elected to do, their job! Instead, they focus on finger pointing and arguing and a lot of empty promises.

  • Thomas
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:50 a.m.

    LDSboy -- If Reid is a "political moderate," I'll eat my hat.

    Dale -- Re: "judge not," the whole context of that scripture was that we'll be judged with the same measure we judge. If I ever become as dishonest, shallow, and sniveling a weasel as Senator Reid, I will readily confess to the world that any judgment of me as such will be entirely deserved.

    And it's not because Reid has the temerity to be a Democrat. I actually somewhat admire one of my Democratic Senators, Dianne Feinstein. (I said "one.") Reid is simply not an honorable man, and my opinion wouldn't change if he had an (R) after his name.

  • rcronk
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:48 a.m.

    It's true that we should not judge Reid himself, but we can judge his fruits. It's true that there are problems in all parties and with all politicians - we're all imperfect. I think the thing that brings people out to post here and condemn Reid is that he's a high profile Mormon who is doing things that people don't agree with and that don't seem to match the gospel principles they hold to. They could just as easily rail on Bush for debt, border security, etc.

    I think it's OK to have dissent. In fact, I think it's healthy if kept civil. It's OK to judge fruits, reject, and stand up against what we think is wrong - if it's kept civil. I don't think it's right to sit back and remain silent when we see something wrong.

    P.S. I think it's really funny to watch the people here who have said "don't judge" and how they themselves are judging the people who they claim are judging. lol.

  • Leon
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:43 a.m.

    Pardon me, "anonymous." Don't you mean ignernt?

  • Thomas
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:41 a.m.

    BYU Grad --

    "Mormons aren't welcome in the Republican Party (outside of Utah) and never will be."

    Hogwash. There's a boatload of Mormon Republican Congressmen and Senators from districts outside of Utah. And of course Massachusetts Republicans had no problem electing one Governor.

    My impression is that it's a minority of evangelicals who would refuse to vote for a Mormon. It's also been my experience that for every evangelical conservative who objects to Mormons on theological grounds, there's at least one political liberal who would refuse to vote for a Mormon because of the Church's stances on gay marriage, abortion, etc., or because Mormons' allegedly far-fetched beliefs supposedly reflect an insufficient commitment to the liberal goddess Reason. (From which deity they regularly apostasize when science contradicts their own beliefs, but that's another story.)

  • Kyle
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:41 a.m.

    BYU-Prof

    Maybe he can re-reconcile his politics with his testimony when political circumstances warrant. Maybe Mitt Romney could give him some hints. Professors like you are exactly the reason I don't encourage my children to go to BYU. I want my children to "stand for something", and to be consistent in their beliefs. Pro-choice and church membership are absolutely NOT compatible.

  • Anon
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:40 a.m.

    The intellectual climate in the LDS church is not compatible with critical thinking, and because of demographics and history, it pervades the state. Emotion trumps rationality, and discussion degenerates into testimony or vitriol. I'm glad that I don't live in Utah.

  • anonymous
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:39 a.m.

    Some of these posts clearly show why Utah is considered the "Reddest of states." Poor, ignorant people easily swayed by almost anything they are told.

  • For Dan RE PP&NS
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:38 a.m.

    Dan, my comment RE PP&NS was in direct relation to socialism/communism. Some parts of the book are incorrect; however, when a person is called and sustained as a prophet and speaks from the pulpit under influence of the Holy Spirit, shouldn't we pay attention (I recall a verse somewhere about that)? Under such circumstances, aren't those statements duly considered doctrinal (another verse somewhere)? Such leaders as Joseph Smith, Brigham Young, John Taylor, Wilford Woodruff, Heber J. Grant, George Albert Smith, David O. McKay, and more than a few of the apostles of the same time periods very plainly stated that socialism and communism are the devil's counterfeit to the Lord's plan. And yes, there are corrupt (and corruptible) people in both major parties -- making it hard to support either one.
    The Church has no position on politics (only moral issues). ALL persons of ALL political persuasions are welcomed into the Church.
    Members of the Church in high political positions are just as susceptible to temptation as are everyone else (I think there's a verse on this, too). I have difficulty reconciling Reid's positions with statements from people I hold to be prophets of God.

  • Kyle
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:33 a.m.

    ldsboy,

    If Reid would have spoken his beliefs purely as a politician, I could at least partly agree with you. He didn't. He used an LDS forum to try to use his LDS influence, to persuade other LDS persons to join him in his political agenda while criticizing former LDS leaders whom he probably feined to sustain at the time in order to get a temple recommend.

  • BYU Grad
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:33 a.m.

    It is sad that members of this church confuse different views on policy with faithfulness. Senate Reid said it all when he commented that: "I don't have to answer to any of them. When I go to get my (temple) recommend, they're never present." Are we so quick to pass judgment on a good faithful recommend holding Latter-day Saint. If you want to point fingers look at the Romneys and their liberal leaning ideas on social issues (before they switched). But no one mentions that because he has an R behind his name. While Senator Reid a pro-life and ani-gay marriage Democrat gets all the abusive rhetoric. It is time for Mormons to leave a party that a majority of it's members (Evangelical Christians) won't even vote for one of us simply because we are LDS. Bigotry in its truest form. Mormons aren't welcome in the Republican Party (outside of Utah) and never will be.

  • BYU Prof
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:30 a.m.

    Senator Reid's talk was inspiring. He was just as unapologetic about his testimony as he was about his political views. I have heard nothing but good from my colleagues here on campus, even those who disagree with Reid politically.

    Many of you commenters need to read or consider the article more carefully. First, he did not speak about Pres. Benson in the talk, but in off-the-cuff remarks to reporters afterwards. And he didn't criticize PRES. Benson, the prophet, at all, but BROTHER Benson and SECRETARY OF AGRICULTURE Benson, who was very outspoken (and very, very right-wing) before becoming the president. It is public record (read the McKay bio) that as a junior general authority Benson had to be reined in by the brethren several times for preaching his personal political opinions rather than doctrine.

    If you have a problem understanding how Reid can reconcile his testimony and his politics, you really need to reassess what "testimony" means. If you see abortion as a moral issue but not war, you need to read the New Testament more carefully.

  • ljl
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:28 a.m.

    Interesting! When the Republican came to campus the Democrats protested. When the Democrat came, the Republicans didn't protest. Just shows how much more respectful and open-minded the Republican are.

  • Sam
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:29 a.m.

    Where was the coverage about Reed's visit and speech? I don't get much media so I may have missed it. When Cheney visited BYU there was months of coverage and advance notice. You couldn't pick up a news paper or listen to a news report with out it being mentioned. I would have attended Reid's speech had I know he was going to be here.

    I am an independent voter but usually tend to vote Republican. But I do like to hear from both sides of the isle.

    By the way--ANYONE BUT CANNON--for the second congressional district!

  • Flame Thrower
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:27 a.m.

    You can't be a good mormon and a republican:
    1. The likely GOP presidential candidate (Rudy) is pro-abortion and pro gay marriage. The senior democratic leader in congress (Harry Reid) is pro-life and pro-traditional marriage.
    2. Under GOP control, the federal deficit has reached all time highs. This goes contrary to church teachings of living within our means.
    3. The GOP has drastically cut programs for the poor. Read King Benjamin's speach on how we should care for the poor.

    I could go on, but I won't. My point is to provoke and incite a reaction. I don't really believe what you can't be a good mormon and a republican, just like I don't believe people who make similar claims that "you can't be a good mormon and be a democrat." I have great respect and admiration for both Harry Reid and Orin Hatch. I don't agree with both of them all the time, but I respect both of them as honorable and decent people who have the best interest of their constituents and the country at heart. I am active LDS, hold a current reccomend, church leader, and vote for both Democrats and Republicans. We can think for ourselves.

  • dk
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:26 a.m.

    I've been away from Utah for several years now. I see things are even more divisive than I first thought. Heaven help these people.

  • rcronk
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:26 a.m.

    P.S. In my last post, I might have come across as claiming that democrats were the problem. Republicans are following the democrats' lead, they're just not quite as far down that road.

    Pro-choice? It's my _choice_ to kill someone - should there not be a law or punishment against that? This country twice now has drawn a line in the sand and said "those on this side of the line are human and those on the other side are not." Once dealt with blacks and slavery, the other dealt with abortion and the unborn child - both are dead wrong.

    Founding documents protect the rights of citizens AND their posterity, which includes millions who have AND have not been conceived yet. It's not an issue of choice - the fetus is NOT a part of the mother - the DNA is different and if the child wasn't protected by fetal-blocking antibodies, it would be attacked by the mother's immune system as a foreign body. It's about convenience killing and it's amazing how people have rationalized it.

    Reid should be fighting against abortion, socialism (global warming, universal healthcare), gay marriage, and many other things that Mormon doctrine is against.

  • BOM example
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:25 a.m.

    You are refering to the anti-Nephi-Lehis that buried their weapons of war and refused to fight right?

  • Dale J. Christensen
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:24 a.m.

    Jesus said "Judge Not"

    How come so many here feel it is their role to Judge Senator Reid?

    Christ's word should be the end all of this thread because most of what I read here is judgment of Reid.

    Instead of engaging this debate, go bake cookies and take them to your new neighbor, go help the elderly, go into your private places and pray for guidance from God. This debate seems to be guiding so many away from the teachings of the man they claim as their personal savior.

    JUDGE NOT!!!

  • Taxpayer
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:22 a.m.

    the reason there were no protests when Reid visited BYU is because Republicans don't have the time to protest. They are all busy at work earning money so the Democrats can re-distribute The Republicans wealth through burdensome taxation to pay for the the Democrat's "Great Society" of welfare and benefit recipients.

  • ldsboy
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:22 a.m.

    finally byu invites a political moderate, what an honor to have the majority leader at BYU! wow! thanks for treating him with respect. Mormons need to open their eyes to the evil and misleading actions of the Bush admin.

  • James
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:21 a.m.

    I am LDS conservative. I used to think Harry Reid was one of the better Democrats but in recent years he has revealed his poor judgment and lapses in ethics and honesty. LDS in the Democrat party could be beneficial if they could guide the agenda in a positive direction but Reid has let the agenda shape him.

    The Democrat agenda has not only been counter to morality and the constitution but to some of the fundamentals of the gospel. Personal accountability and progression is a fundamental principle. The democrat agenda of big government and communal society is aimed at equal outcomes for all. Experience and failure are great teachers. Millions already suffer from not learning to discipline themselves because the government will atone for their mistakes. Liberals want to expand these destructive policies.

    We are taught the need to have oil for our lamps and that it cannot be borrowed. Those who have not mastered their temporal lives will never conquer the spiritual. The BOM teaches us that we need to be engaged in defending righteousness in the political arena and on the battlefield. LDS who support the democrat agenda of today, have failed to connect the dots.

  • NotFromUtar
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:19 a.m.

    SELLOUT!

  • Let's remember...
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:19 a.m.

    I am a conservative Mormon Republican, but it concerns me when people imply that someone cannot be a "good" Mormon and a Democrat. When you express such views, you are saying that the First Presidency is wrong when they explicitly state otherwise. That is your right, of course, but just know that you are in more opposition to the church's position than the person who has chosen to be involved in their community as a Democrat. Also, let's remember that Harry Reid is against abortion and gay marriage...he just says that those issues are not the highest priority on the current agenda. I believe that we need more honest church members of varying viewpoints who are willing to get involved in the party they connect with most.

  • Commanded in all things?
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:15 a.m.

    It is not meet that you should be commanded in all things. Just because General Conference doesn't mention Global Warming doesn't mean it isn't a real, important issue that we should take seriously. Do the brethren have to refer to genocide in order for you to recognize it as a problem? How about crime? How about the poor situation of schools in America and especially Utah? I think Reid was just trying to expand our view beyond the very important issues of abortion, gay marriage, and flag burning to recognize other very important issues. Expand your horizons beyond conservatism and you may find there is a whole world of additional issues that are important and that matter a lot.

  • NCBuckeye
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:14 a.m.

    Senator Reid is a disappointment on many levels. That he can use political expediency to trash anything uttered by a Republic is dispicable, particularly when good men (and women) can have differences of opinion without resorting to name calling. Reid craves power and it only comes by going along with the power givers, which for him are a select group of socialist/communuist Democrats. He trashes evangelical Christians because he knows there is no room in the Democrats for their views, and he gets a double bonus by proclaiming evangelicals are not Christian and doing so as a Mormon. Thats a back door way to fan the fires against Mitt Romney. Reid is now leader of the group-think party because he parrots their propaganda. Does he really believe it or is his morality suppressed because, as with abortion, the courts have settled the law? Does he do the same when he makes his testimony of the Church public? Is he just saying what the Church power-givers want to hear? Neither his political arguments nor his testimony hold any merit for me because I can't tell if he is telling the truth about what he truly believes.

  • John Adams
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:12 a.m.

    What bothers me most about Harry Reid is not that he wants to bring the troops home (we can debate this back and forth until we're blue in the face), but that he would like to put a timeline on it ("hey, let's give the terrorists 9 months to kill as many of our soldiers as they can"). If the war is wrong, bring the troops home now. If we must win it, then stay and win it. Reid's middle ground only causes more confusion and problems.

    And he must be just plainly deceived about where the socialistic programs he is part of will lead our country.

    As far as him being part of the church and speaking at BYU--well none of us are perfect so we take what he says, apply it as applicable in our own lives, and leave his judgment up to someone smarter than us. Besides if he didn't come speak, just think how we all would have missed out on this back and forth of ideas.

    P.S. Have you googled Ron Paul? :-)

  • Jozef
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:10 a.m.

    As a church member and non-American I am appalled by the rudeness and the naivete of those that attack Reid. Viewed from the international scene and from the church in the world, Harry Reid is the most precious man we have to counterbalance the image of Mormons as right-wing fanatics (for examples, see previous comments). Whatever his weaknesses are (and who is perfect?), Reid is helping make friends for America in many countries. And therefore helping to protect our missionaries and further the work.

  • Dan
    Oct. 10, 2007 10:08 a.m.

    The Democratic Party is no more "Satan's Plan" as is the Republican Party's insistence on forcing other nations and peoples to abide by the American way of life. Why are Republicans so quick to demonize those with whom they disagree? And by the way, "Prophets, Principles, and National Survival" is a book of selective quotes by the brethren that support conservative principles. There are many, many statements by some individual church leaders in the book that do not represent the views of the church as a whole. In fact, many of these statements by certain LDS leaders and members in this book were and are hotly contested by other high-ranking church leaders. So please do not portray this book as if it were LDS doctrine. It just isn't. Please refresh your view of what constitutes church doctrine. And besides, please hold with skeptism the comments of anyone that reads Coulter or listens religiously to Rush. There are some good things that they contribute, but most of what they say is propaganda and sensationalism that avoids the civil discussion of real issues that we so desperately need (the same can be said of other extremists on the left).

  • Anonymous
    Oct. 10, 2007 9:55 a.m.

    Those Reid bashers in these posts obviously are not aware of the LDS Church's most recent official policy on politics (issued March 2006): "Principles compatible with the gosepel may be found in the platforms of all major political parties." There is a fine tradition of well-known Mormon Democrats in the Church: President Hugh B. Brown, Hugh Nibley, James E. Faust, Marlin K. Jensen, just to name a few. So why do Republican Mormons continue to doubt the church loyalty of their brothers and sisters who believe in principles espoused by the Democratic Party, some of which principles the Church itself recognizes as "compatible with the gospel?" Why do Mormons continually try to dogmatize political matters? It is actually true what Reid said: there have been some past prominent LDS leaders who have tried sway members to the right. But there were also other LDS leaders that opposed such methods. Who is not aware of the great controversies among the brethren that Benson caused during the 1960s as a result of his over-zealous support of the New Right? As one church leader said: "Allow within the bounds of definition of religious orthodoxy a variation in political belief."

  • Dottie
    Oct. 10, 2007 9:53 a.m.

    While I agree with inviting Senator Reid to speak at BYU, I fail to understand why anyone who claims to be an LDS following the words of our prophet can agree with the things he said. I, for one, don't understand how he receives a temple recommend while supporting abortion and gay marriage. Yeah..I'll wait to hear when the theme of General Conference is "Global Warming." I wonder if he has a copy of the Proclamation to the Family hanging on his wall. One thing he does need is every book President Benson wrote. This man is a poor example of an LDS. One other thing..why is there such a big deal made of Romney being LDS and nothing is ever mentioned about Reid's religion? I think I know the answer. I'm amazed and sadened by how many LDS are following the ways of the world to be politically correct.

  • Miguel
    Oct. 10, 2007 9:53 a.m.

    Every once in a while, when I am a little homesick for Utah, I read the comments to a Deseret News article and am reminded why I am so glad not to live there any more. I am a devout member of the church. I also happen to be a republican, but I am disgusted by all the personal attacks on Reid simply because of his political beliefs. Why is it evil not to actively oppose gay marriage but not evil to fail to oppose a war based on false pretenses that has killed tens of thousands of innocents and soldiers?

  • Engineer2007
    Oct. 10, 2007 9:54 a.m.

    No one is going to force any of you to get an abortion or to marry a gay person. Live through example. If there are people that feel like these things will help them, remember they are in a bad place and need help. Those are true Christian values, not passing restrictive laws that are supposed to achieve social engineering. Most of these "Conservative Values" people are control freaks that are after power and get it by making people afraid to stand up for their rights by telling them to do so is "Un-Christian". Read their comments, they use insulting words and call the people who dont agree with them evil as well as anything else vile and disgusting they can throw at the competition. Be assured these Christian Conservatives have a not so hidden agenda and it isn't saving souls. It is power and control of people through guilt and intimidation and using their religion to rally support for restrestrictive laws that tread on all people rights. They use intimidation and lies all the while claiming they are the ones under threat. Read their words, they are not words of good Christians.

  • Brent
    Oct. 10, 2007 9:47 a.m.

    The issue with Mr. Reid is not a Democrat or Republican issue but a moral one. For him to say that we need to forget about abortion as if it were insignificant is unbelieveable. Those of you who agree with him should do a little research on abortion, especially partial birth abortion.(4 to 7+ months pregnancy) The abortionist delivers the baby feet first until only the head remains in the birth canal. Then a hole is made in the baby's skull. A suction catheter is then used to suck the child's brains out causing the skull to collapse. The dead baby is then removed. If Harry say's the country has gone beyond this issue then we have gone beyond charity also. I don't believe the LDS church leaders will change church policy to be politically correct. If this same barbaric procedure were used on an animal or peoples pets you would soon see a law against it. Perhaps some are "beyond" feeling in this country.




  • Julie
    Oct. 10, 2007 9:45 a.m.

    Why is it when a Republican speaks, the media and Deseret News report "People are offended and will protest! They demand someone else to speak!" and then they report on the protest of about oh, five people. But when it is a Democrat, they are welcomed with a warm reception and open arms....

  • Claudia
    Oct. 10, 2007 9:43 a.m.

    In the late 70's, I received my degree from a highly-regarded, conservative, Protestant university on the West Coast. . . and was the sole Catholic, along with one LDS student, among the huge enrollment.

    I continue to be amazed that LDS would align themselves with the "Religious Right" branch of the GOP.

    Throughout the years, each and every one of their ilk with whom I've spoken continues to insist that LDS are *not* Christians, that LDS *are* subject to false teachings, and that LDS are certainly "folks who live good lives, but aren't going to Heaven."

    Ask one of them. Ask straight out if an adherent to the Religious Right will witness before the conservative congregation where they attend that the LDS are true Christians.

    I have witnessed thus, in Mass and in a LDS Sacrament meeting. It's not difficult for this Democrat to do so; no human can guarantee a fellow congregant's faithfulness, infallibility, morality.

    Thankfully, it is up to the Father to take stock of our lives, without regard to political party membership.

  • Maggie
    Oct. 10, 2007 9:41 a.m.

    Senator Reid is a hard working, caring man who is doing great service to Nevada and our country. I'm grateful for his strength and humor, both of which he puts to great use everyday.

    I'm a little put off by the Deseret News reports surprise of a warm reception at BYU. If you spend any time on the BYU campus you would quickly come to realize that the students and faculty care deeply about their country, their fellow man, and the world.

    It should be obvious that being stone cold sober helps all of your faculties to work at a higher level. Bravo - again - BYU

  • RE
    Oct. 10, 2007 9:39 a.m.

    I think Harry should read the Proclamation On The Family put out by the First Presidency and Council of the Twelve Apostles. There is direct conflict of Mr. Reids words and the words of this document.

  • LDS Member
    Oct. 10, 2007 9:33 a.m.

    Funny how he says that Pres. Benson and Pres. Wilkinson have lead members down the wrong path when as church members we believe that the Lord will not allow the leaders of the Church to lead the church astray. I think Reid would like to lead the members astay.

  • Rush is Right
    Oct. 10, 2007 9:30 a.m.

    Harry Reid says members who question his faithfulness are not present when he gets his recommend. Maybe we should be present to remind him how he bore false witness against a private citizen on the senate floor last week and got 41 Democrats to vote for his resolution condemning that citizen. He was instrumental in perpetuating a smear campaign by left wing extremists. Conduct unbecoming a member.

  • rcronk
    Oct. 10, 2007 9:30 a.m.

    The democrat party used to be more decent but has been hijacked by socialists. I think Reid is deceived. Satan's plan in the beginning was to force people to do what's right - that sounds like forcing rich people to give to the poor through wealth distribution and taxation instead of letting them do it through charity of their own free will. Rewarding Gay marriage and abortion is wrong. Global warming is just another plank in the environmental movement that has also been hijacked by socialism. Universal health-care is also socialism. The general authorities have already said that communism is the most powerful satanic force on the earth and when Russia fell, communism/socialism metastasized and it has now infiltrated the democratic party and the environmental movement. The law of chastity and the law of consecration are two high level laws and Satan's counterfeits for these laws (gay marriage, socialized anything, etc.) are swinging into full force and democrats create/reward it all. Look up President Hinckley's talks "The World in Which we Live" Oct 2001, and "War and Peace" Apr 2003 to see the how the church's position on our military and war on terror don't seem to match Reid's.

  • EMW
    Oct. 10, 2007 9:28 a.m.

    These comments sound like they come from a bunch of wolverines who have been backed into corners. Why so defensive?

    The sad truth is, neither political party represent well the religious beliefs I have. Both parties have been hijacked by groups on opposite extremes of the political spectrum. Their narrow agendas aren't the everyday things I have to concern myself with.

    I think we can be too blindly loyal to our government. Jesus wasn't that way--he was killed for it. Joseph Smith wasn't that way--he was killed for it. Brigham Young wasn't that way. How did we become that way?

    There is plenty of corruption on both sides of the aisle. In the end, we may have to choose to be loyal to our country over our government, and loyal to our religious convictions over our government, too.

  • Utah 1939
    Oct. 10, 2007 9:28 a.m.

    It is interesting that in Utah it is the Party (GOP) first and Christiandom second, Kind of like Germany in 1939. To say that you will not donate to BYU because of a liberal coming to BYU is like saying the mission of the church only influences me as long as it is ultra right wing. What a box we all live in.

  • Silly comments
    Oct. 10, 2007 9:26 a.m.

    Brian says the Supreme Court decisions are irrevocable...I'd say Brian needs to go back to school and get a better education. I'd also like for Brian to indicate what law was overturned in Roe v Wade which took the legislature out of the role of creating laws. Please expound to enlighten us.

    For "I'm glad I'm not Mormon" any longer. What's truly sad is that you didn't use your brain the whole time you were in the church. Can you please tell me where it says that I'm supposed to stop thinking for myself and learn but to turn my whole brain over to someone else? What it sounds like is you think you are intellectually superior to people who have faith and rely on the Spirit and learn through much study, fasting and prayer. Intellectual snobs like you are what give the LDS Church a bad name.

    Ever read in the Bible where Christ tells those who think they are intellectually superior that they are fools to themselves? Might want to look it up my friend.

    Reid is a disaster along the lines of Katrina and Rita. He needs to just go away.

  • Reader from Denver
    Oct. 10, 2007 9:26 a.m.

    Fascinating story and blogs.
    Interesting that conservatives did not protest Mr. Reid's appearance at BYU (are conservatives truly more tolerant of different view points?).
    Interesting that Mr. Reid believes prior Church leaders who wore the mantle of apostle/prophet and spoke against socialism/communism are now to be considered outdated. (Read "Prophets, Principles, and National Survival" and see just how much and how far back the counsel is given -- and still valid.)
    Equally fascinating that Reid has swallowed the lie of man-made global warming (debunked by noted climatologists). May be normal/natural, but not manmade. And since when is today's climate ideal for people? What hubris.
    Questions for Mr. Reid: why should I be forced to pay for social programs under threat of penalty/imprisonment (via taxation)? Isn't it a personal choice/responsibility? Can you reconcile Thou shalt not covet with the democrat policy of taxing for social programs/welfare?
    Temple recommend questions are on personal behavior and testimony, not politics.
    And for the investigator, base your investigations on the Church's teachings and fidelity to God. Put the Church's teachings to the test. And by all means, pray to God for direction, with the intent to follow that direction.
    And finally: GO ROCKIES!!!

  • anonymous
    Oct. 10, 2007 9:23 a.m.

    While perusing some of the postings above, I am convinced there is no hope for "The Reddest State."

  • Mark
    Oct. 10, 2007 9:23 a.m.

    The main problem with many conservatives at this point in history in the church is that they sometimes confuse their own ideology with the gospel. There are many discrepancies with such logic.

    One is that in doing so, they cheapen and weaken the eternal principles within the gospel itself. No political ideology is stable, whole and complete. Ideologies evolve over time and can turn in the wrong direction. Case in point: Could we possibly compare the attitudes and policies of Abraham Lincoln, an early Republican, or Ronald Reagan, a President respected by the majority of Americans, with those of the Neo-cons of today?

  • Gayle
    Oct. 10, 2007 9:21 a.m.

    Harry Reid is neither as bad as the conservatives paint him nor as good as liberals paint him. He is a politician which explains his seeming duplicity, and the wide range of emotions he elicits. Having your words, and deeds dictated by the need to advance your own political power and that of your party, instead of by the charity that the Savior says we should all strive for is indeed a pathetic situation. He is to be pitied just as an alcoholic who doesn't think he has a drinking problem, eventhough he's alienated everyone but the bartender.

  • idiut
    Oct. 10, 2007 9:20 a.m.

    Oops. "has ran" should be "has run". Apologies...I'm an idiut.

  • mdub
    Oct. 10, 2007 9:20 a.m.

    Politics and religion just shouldn't mix. If they do, then there is no separation between church and state. The fact of the matter is that the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints stays out of politics and does not endorse any political party. Any members of the church that believe otherwise are incorrect. So each member of the church has the ability to choose for themselves what political figures they should vote for.

    I think it is awful that people are bringing up Romney's religion to determine whether or not we should vote for him. We should never even consider religion when it comes to politics. Politicians should stand on their own values and platforms of their political parties.

    I personally don't believe any party has all the answers, so I don't vote down any party lines. I look at each candidate for their principles and their political agenda. Religion does not factor into that decision.

  • idiut
    Oct. 10, 2007 9:19 a.m.

    I don't think KSL TV or ksl.com has ran anything on this. Am I wrong?

  • GWB
    Oct. 10, 2007 9:18 a.m.

    To "Right to Life" - being Pro-Choice does not mean someone is Pro-abortion.

    I could take from your name that you oppose killing of all people, and infer that you oppose the death penalty. I bet I am wrong and that you do, in fact, support the death penalty - so claiming to be Pro-life is not accurate, you really are anti-abortion.

    Pro-Choice, on the other hand, is entirely different. Pro Choice means that a person doesn't believe that it is their role to tell other persons what decisions they have to make.

    It seems to me that Jesus (at least according to LDS teachings) was Pro-Choice and a War was fought in heaven to determine whether we would have freedom of choice on this earth or whether we would not. If I remember right the plan to limit the ability of people to make their own choices was a plan sprouted by Lucifer.

    Harry Reid is not pro-abortion but, like Jesus, is pro free agency.

  • Sen. Craig is the example
    Oct. 10, 2007 9:13 a.m.

    I'm just thankful that the current events of the day show the hypocritical nature of the Republican party. Look at homophobic Sen. Craig soliciting gay sex in a MN airport bathroom stall and that gives the clearest picture of where the Republican party stands today.

  • Athena
    Oct. 10, 2007 9:12 a.m.

    I was there for his talk, and I was rather impressed. It is possible to be a Democrat and a Mormon at the same time, because a person's faith is not determined by their political party.

    I am neither Democrat nor Republican, but Harry Reid's talk impressed me. I'd vote for him if he was running for president. Whereas President Bush lately; his speeches amuse me. "Al Qaeda's here, Al Qaeda's there, Al Qaeda is responsible for this, Al Qaeda did that, we must exterminate Al Qaeda, Al Qaeda is a great threat, Al Qaeda, Al Qaeda, Al Qaeda." It's like reading the monologues of Chauvelin and Robespierre in "The Scarlet Pimpernel".

    No, I found Harry Reid's speeches and reasoning much more impressive and more intelligent than Bush's. I really don't know what people see in Bush.

    And you could tell that he impressed the audience, which was mostly educated students and faculty. The audience gave him a standing ovation. He's an intelligent guy, and I think he's a good Mormon. Again, your political party does not determine whether you are a good Mormon. That is so short-sighted.

  • Justpassinthru
    Oct. 10, 2007 9:09 a.m.

    Just reading all of the comments here really shows how intolerant the religious right is of anyone who disagrees with them. Such hatred. My oh my.

  • Glad you're not mormon
    Oct. 10, 2007 9:05 a.m.

    "I applaud them for bringing in someone who helps them break the sameness of thought they seem to endorse."

    That endorsement is something you have picked up. There is no official stance. Bringing in Harry Reid is "Standard Procedure".

  • Cheney vs. Reid
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:59 a.m.

    Two men mentioned they acheived great success in their lives.

    Cheney said how he failed, but many people he knew failed to get to where he and the rest of them are today, but he said to never give up. It was 100% inspirational.

    Reid bashed the president, bashed past church leaders, and bashed Christians, including LDS members.

    Whose speech made you want to be better?

  • CAP
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:56 a.m.

    I love it when Democrats say people are leaving the Republican party and elude that they are entering the Democratic party. They are leaving Republicans, that is the Republicans fault, but they are not going to the Democrats.

    I love being told socialized medicine and global warming are the real issues. Socialized medicine does not work!!! Look at the quality of doctors and the real measurements of a doctors ability.

  • Anonymous
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:55 a.m.

    Benson did not want any communists at byu but as chairman of board of education Kimball as prophet gave approval of soviet secretary of supreme court to speak as law school. In ed Kimball's lengthen your stride.

    As for as being pro choice but anti abortion and on the agency battle. Laws are here to protect people and there is no agency for the fetus. That is why we should be pro life. And agency we should use our agency for the right choice. To help people be righteous. Dallin H Oaks and Jim faust said that. Use our agency for laws that protect all people including unborn.

  • Anonymous
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:48 a.m.

    As for his criticism of President Benson Has he been throuth the temple? IF you are how can you in good faith criticize those the lord call's? There is nothing untrue about what President Bensoon said. Joseph SMith when socialism came about, Marion G Romney and David O mCkay all were just as critical of socialist policies reid endorses.

    And for me it is easier to be a republican because of church membership than a democrat and abortion and gay rights are more important than coveting and theft.

  • John
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:47 a.m.

    President McKay and President Kimball would agree with Senator Reid about Elder Bensons political activism while Apostle. They were constantly trying to get him to keep his mouth shut, because his views did not represent that of the church, but members often thought they did (read David O. McKay and Rise of Modern Mormonism and Stand a Little Taller).

    Like all of us, the brethren are not flawless gods. And like all of us, they grow. President Benson was very good about not addressing politics during his time as Prophet.

    Also, those who in one breath criticize senator Reid for his criticism of the a few past church leaders and criticize "BYU" for having him, are actually criticizing current church leaders who stand as the board of directors and extended the invitation.

    Its fine...just know your doing the very thing for which you are denouncing Reid.

  • Christopher
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:43 a.m.

    My take on his position in not that we should should ignore abortion because it is not important, but because other than voice our support, there may be little we can do to change the law as those laws are made in the courts.

    A person can be pro-life and choose to focus their energies on other areas that may be more effective in reducing the number of abortions such as poverty, family planning.

  • I'm glad im not mormon
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:42 a.m.

    You guys make me happy that i am not mormon anymore. I was my whole life up until a year or so ago (im 28). I went on a mission, married in the temple, the whole deal. It is quite liberating to be able to think for myself without having 90+ year olds telling me what and how to think. Have an open mind and let the man think and say what he wants. If you dont agree with him that is your business. You have lived a different life than him and his perspectives are different than yours. I used to think BYU was the pinnacle of closemindedness and a joke at teaching young minds how to think and expand. I applaud them for bringing in someone who helps them break the sameness of thought they seem to endorse.

  • Raymond Takashi Swenson
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:39 a.m.

    I am old enough to remember that, before the left wing rebellion in the Democratic Party that won George McGovern the nomionation for president in 1972, Utah and other western states tended to equally elect Republicans and Democrats for major office, and even today, the Republican governors and congressmen elected from Utah tend to be largely moderate in their policy positions.

    The national Democratic Party has become dominated by a left wing that is dedicated to preventing Congress and individual states from legislating on abortion, and to preventing judges who might overturn Roe v. Wade from being confirmed to the Supreme Court. If Senator Reid does not think abortion is a major issue, why do Senate Democrats so firmly oppose the confirmation of judges who might think it is a complex issue that should be returned to the state legislatures? If it is not important, why do they threaten filibusters, stopping all work in the Senate, to prevent the Senate from exercising its constitutional duty to vote up or down on judicial nominees? The unrestricted right to kill babies even at birth is something the Senate Democrats, like Hillary Clinton, will defend to the death.

  • Conservative Utahn
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:37 a.m.

    Brian, Conservatives in the LDS church do NOT focus exclusively on abortion and gay marriage. They do oppose socialism and the erosion of the divinely inspired U.S. Constitution by those who call it a living and breathing document, subject to the whims of whoever is in the Supreme Court. They also believe in capitalism. Why do many liberals fight for the rights of strip clubs and pornographers to exercise the First Amendment, then turn around and try to neutralize the Second Amendment? I, for one, think bigger government is NOT the answer in health care or education. Let the people keep their money and decide for themselves what they want. Socialism and its big brother communism have failed miserably wherever they have choked out capitalism and freedom. America has superb health care. Ruin our system by nationalizing and socializing it, and you can be sure you will have to wait months even for cancer treatment, which happens in Canada. I know a woman whose mother in Canada had to come to the U.S. to get cancer treatment because she might have died before her turn for service came up in Alberta.

  • Ben Franklin
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:35 a.m.

    Need to worry LESS about abortion? I can't think of a more important issue for our nation to address. It is terrible that the leader of the U.S. Senate has his priorities so wrong.

  • Chris
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:35 a.m.

    Why can't Harry Ried be a democrate in the vein of President Faust? I learned many years ago that he was democrate. I thought that if they were all like him, this might be a good 'home' for my vote. President Faust was an outstanding example to us all. But the modern Democrate party? I was wrong, as the type of democrate President Faust was is NOT the type that Reid and Co are today. Civility has gone out the window, and my vote is where the views that I know to be right and true (through free agency) lies in the conservative party.
    Welcome to BYU. Now go home.

  • Lew Jeppson
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:31 a.m.

    Senator Reid's remarks are inspiring. They take me back to the days of my youth in the old 22nd Ward, Salt Lake Stake. The late Bishop Egan A. and Blanche Glaus were great testimonty bearing LDS and great Democrats! Maybe those days can come back. No political institution has done more for this country than the Democratic Party. That said, the current party has lost its way on a few things; e.g. it's social philosophy is gender and race based, not class based, so it has lost touch with and concern for working class white men, and it has been entirely too shy in opposing the immoral Iraq war. Moreover, the local party doesn't concentrate on the war, but on school vouchers! But still, only the Democratic Party can get us out of our present mess nationally and internationally.

  • Barbara
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:31 a.m.

    I'll try to stand up as an LDS convert, for Christ, a golden mean and the polar star. Keep me out of politics!

  • Farmington Boy
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:24 a.m.

    Our ancestors fought for our rights of free speech and of religion. I applaud the many conservative students and faculty at BYU who welcomed Mr. Reid to the campus and respectfully allowed him to exercise his rights. At the same time I question the morality of those who tried to prevent the Vice President from exercising those same rights.

  • Dear David
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:18 a.m.

    You are right Bush has done nothing but great things for ALL of us.

    Please enjoy your "vacation" in Iraq. To all the parents of boys in Jr high and especially High School reading this kiss your children every day knowing that more than 3000 families can never do that again.

    How long can we blindly follow before we must say "the emporer has no clothes"?

    The 2 nice young men that live next to me worry me FAR less than the wasted deaths of our youth.

  • Matthew
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:12 a.m.

    There is much, much more to morality than sexual purity! As to the abortion toll in lives, Senator Reid addressed that. The courts have spoken. You mention 4000 lives in refering to the war in Iraq. That refers only to the toll in American GIs killed (actually the total is currently 3818, 4119 for the coallition). What about the tens of thousands wounded whose lives have been shattered along with their bodies? What about the hundreds of thousands of Iraqs that have been killed by shock and awe and the violence that has resulted from our hasty invasion and poorly planned occupation? Please refer to all Pres. Benson's political comments while he was President of the Church. Oh, that's right, there aren't any. Isn't there a message in that? There certainly is for me. Are you practicing what he did preach as Prophet? Go ahead and be a Republican, but be sure and hold that party as rigidly to a complete moral standard as you do the Democrats. Both parties have plenty of weaknesses, choose one and work to strengthen it. They both need good, truly moral people.

  • currently LDS
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:11 a.m.

    Mr looking, you would be better off with the evangelicals. They are closed minded and short sighted enough to be just right for you

  • Instereo
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:11 a.m.

    There's a big difference between being pro abortion and pro choice. As I seem to remember in Mormon Theology, in the pre-existance the battle was over forcing someone back to heavon. So I think a democrate can say they don't believe in Abortion on a personal level but believe still believe in Choice for someone else. We should go to church to learn how to love, not to learn how to hate. It seems that most learn to hate and can't accept someone like Reid who want to put the Gospel (Good News) and Charity (Love) into action. I, an LDS member, like him. President Benson spoke in a different time. President Hinckley sounds a lot more like Reid then he does like Benson.

  • Re. Not currently but looking
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:09 a.m.

    Either the gospel is true or it is not. If you base your testimony on the actions of any member, you are not ready to commit to it as a belief system.

    If I were you I would wait to join until I understood the tenents of the religion, and not join just because you agree with someones political beliefs.

  • Hmmmm I hear violins.
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:04 a.m.

    While Rome burns.

    You folks are awfully fixated on gay marriage and abortion. Take a look at your own houses first perhaps?

  • Amy
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:03 a.m.

    I agree Don, this guy is a joke, joke, joke! And, what are you talking about Alan Robinson? I haven't ever heard Harry state in the media his religious affiliation. Have YOU? Not that I want him to either..talk about an awful missionary!! Shame on Harry.

  • John
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:01 a.m.

    Where are all the protests, I thought we are a equal opportunity protesting country. The protests were there when Dick Chenny came to the University, but Harry Reid? Could it be that Conservatives are actually the more tolerant than Liberal who claim to be the tolerant view. There is something to that. Liberals are all for freedom of speech as long as it is their point of view.

  • Reason
    Oct. 10, 2007 8:01 a.m.

    You don't have to be a Republican to be a good Latter Day Saint. I found it very interesting when President Faust died articles in this newspaper described him as "very active" in the Democratic Party before he was called to full-time service in the Church. He was over thirty at the time. I doubt anyone would say he needed to "grow a brain" as was suggested above.

  • Appauled
    Oct. 10, 2007 7:55 a.m.

    I graduated from BYU last year and I was sad I couldn't listen to this, but now I'm glad I didn't. From the remarks he said, I really don't think that was a good talk. I don't care who you are, you don't not go to any school and tell them President Bush had the worst foreign policy ever! That is a terrible thing and what a terrible example to bash someone at a large university. Even worse, saying that prominent LDS leaders were wrong to do anything. I can't stand this guy. The little respect I had for him totally went down the drain. This why I can't stand the democratic party. They feel they can say whatever they want and people say you should be open minded to them and they may change the world. I seriously cannot believe this guy said what he did. Cheney's speech was inspirational, while his speech was bashing. I would have booed those who gave him a standing ovation. What a disgrace!

    P.S. Funny how no protestors were there and a democrat came to the school.

  • Brian
    Oct. 10, 2007 7:54 a.m.

    While I agree that issues like gay marriage and abortion may be important, Reid's point (which is quite valid) is that Mormons often focus EXCLUSIVELY on those issues which have already been decided by irrevocable Supreme Court cases and forget about issues where they really can make a difference. These issues, like health care, gun control, education, etc. the right-wing big-business evangelical Christian-owned Republican party has morally reprehensible views about. The late Jerry Falwell counseled his followers that God's greatest priority was tax cuts for the wealthy. That sounds more like filthy lucre than anything Senator Reid espoused yesterday. At least think about whether your own party affiliation really expresses your beliefs or not.

  • GSL
    Oct. 10, 2007 7:52 a.m.

    So, Reid says the Iraq war is the biggest blunder in U.S. history. What about allowing ourselves to be attacked at Pearl Harbor with the loss of nearly 3,000 lives and the near destruction of the Pacific Fleet? His favorite politician is Pres. Roosevelt who was Commander-in-Chief at the time and during nine years in office up to 1941 allowed our military to become one of the smallest (16th, I believe) on the planet. We don't know the outcome of the Iraq war yet. We do know that if Reid were in charge it would be surrender! How does he know that this war isn't part of the Lord's larger plan to eventually bring his gospel to these people. Remember, the Lord moves in mysterious ways. Look what happened to Japan and Germany after WW II. There are now temples of the Lord there. Pres. Bush is a stubborn man and that bothers alot of people. He is also a very prayerful man. We do not know what kind of inspiration he may recieve because he is also a private individual.

  • Qweenmum
    Oct. 10, 2007 7:51 a.m.

    Thank you brother Reid for telling me how to me a better LDS member. All this time, I thought that living my standards, listening to the teachings, and making my choice to be conservitive was the right choice. Now, because of your insight and prophecy, I can now go to my bishop and ask for forgivness for being a conservitive. I repent. Thank you.

  • Re. Not currently but looking
    Oct. 10, 2007 7:49 a.m.

    You are so right! It is so hard to believe that it takes a person that is not of LDS faith to realize that. Abortion and gay rights are a big deal, it's what be believe to be WRONG! I'm not going to vote for a man who proclaims to be mormon and who believes it's ok to do those kind of things, and if you are LDS and believe it's ok to love men when you are a man you need to talk to your Bishop. You're are right not currently we do believe in loving our naighbor and I feel Reid is wrong in call Bush an idiot, Bush may not be the smartest man alive, but how long has it been since we have had an attack on the US? Oh yeah how since we went over seas.

  • Keith
    Oct. 10, 2007 7:50 a.m.

    For Harry Reid to criticize leaders of the church is a disgrace. Harry! Look at what is happening around you. If conservative values wre ever needed in this country, it is now. Shouldn't church beliefs not only dictate your everyday life, but your philosophy of government policies--such as abortion.

  • Andrew
    Oct. 10, 2007 7:42 a.m.

    Harry Reid is very wrong to attack religious conservatives as 'un-Christian'. That was an evil thing to say and Harry Reid has said far too many things likes that during his life. I've always been appalled at his angry temperment. He's quite undisciplined and really runs with his anger, which is not a quality in a public servant. I don't belong to LDS but I find Reid very disappointing.

  • Truth
    Oct. 10, 2007 7:41 a.m.

    If one just researches what Reid has said about his political opponents, about the war in Iraq, about the US military, etc, etc, his actions have been despicable. There are some decisions in life that can't be remade, you do the best you can with the information you have at the time. War is one such decision, none more important. Yes Reid, and a majority of democrates, voted for the war and now he says, among other things, it is the worst foreign policy decision ever. If so, he is as responsible as anyone. He is an embarrassment!

  • Right to Life
    Oct. 10, 2007 7:26 a.m.

    According to a very thoughtful talk given by Elder Oaks a few years ago it is not possible to be a "good" pro-abortion Mormon - Republican or Democrat

  • Proper Role of Government
    Oct. 10, 2007 7:22 a.m.

    If you want to know what Mr. Reid is denouncing when he comments on Pres. Benson Google "The Proper Role of Government" and you can read it for yourself. Since we can't post URL's on this overly controlled website.

  • David
    Oct. 10, 2007 7:21 a.m.

    I am currently serving in Iraq as a Soldier. I am offended that Senator Reid was so welcomed at BYU to spout his propoganda. He is not fairly stating the good we are doing for the people of Iraq.

    I am not here to judge him because all I know of him is what he says in public. I am not there when he has his temple recommend interviews. But, from what he says in public about abortion and gay marriage, it certainly doesn't seem like he supports the Brethren.

    I wish Senator Reid would reconsider his political positions because I do not think they are consistent with Church doctrine. I hope those that heard his speech were not blinded by the craftiness of men!

  • Larry
    Oct. 10, 2007 7:10 a.m.

    Although I disagree with a lot of his liberal views on government, I very much respect his conviction and commitment to the Church. The Republican Party doesn't and shouldn't have a monopoly over the LDS church. As long as you are pro-life, I believe you can be a mormon democrat. My grandfather was a democrat and an active member of the church his whole life(Bishop and Stake President).

  • Brother Jim
    Oct. 10, 2007 7:07 a.m.

    So Reid is now a spokesperson for Mormons and Republicans is he? He asks us to ignore our teachings and beliefs and to embrace the Democratic party line. He is a fool.

  • anonymous
    Oct. 10, 2007 7:06 a.m.

    Isn't it hilarious how the Rush Limbaugh-sounding Utahns like to speak for the church?

  • george
    Oct. 10, 2007 7:00 a.m.

    Scotwright -What planet do you live on?
    Mr Reid is a great example to all, especially members of the LDS Church.
    As to the military - who cares - they are the disgrace - take a look around the world ( with Iraq and Vietnam showing the worse side of military persons and their actions)

  • kahrcarrier
    Oct. 10, 2007 6:59 a.m.

    I agree wholeheartedly with Scotwright! Anyone who doesn't should read Ann Coultler's book "Treason." And to have someone say that we ought to worry less about abortion and gay marriage and worry more about global warming and jobs is simply trying to water down the teachings of the church. Will the next General Conference will focus on global warming?? No, but I think the church leaders will have more to say about gay marriage or abortion than they will about the global warming farce.

  • Don
    Oct. 10, 2007 6:54 a.m.

    This guy is a joke.
    He does not hold the beliefs to his heart.
    His is on of those that call evil good and good evil.

    He reminds me of the BOM leaders that would not send supplies to Capt. Moroni.

  • Adam McMillen
    Oct. 10, 2007 6:45 a.m.

    I think it sad how people slam Reid for supposedly not living his religion when they do not realize that they are not living their religion by the vitriolic words they use against him.

  • Carl
    Oct. 10, 2007 6:43 a.m.

    The reporter heard a different talk than the one they broadcast? He makes it sound judgmental, controversial, sensational.

    Go listen to the replay (next Sunday sometime) or
    in the 'Find a Talk' database on BYU Broadcasting's website -- you'll hear a whole different view in what he actually said.

    The only thing we could fault 'Brother' Reid on, was generalizing ALL 'Mormons' to have any particular belief or behavior, such as the implication they are [blindly] obedient. Yes, some are, just like any other group, but that's "in spite of their faith" and "not because of it".

    He, and you, and I, cannot reduce the LDS Church to just another man-made organization, such as a political party. The Bashers would like to have you think that way. But anyone doing that gives away a shallow spot in their thinking.

  • My Two Cents
    Oct. 10, 2007 6:39 a.m.

    I am very distrurbed that he wants members of the church to worry less about gay rights and more about health care and other issues that are generally viewed upon as democrat agendas.

    I believe we NEED to worry first about the morality of a country before anything else. If a country has terrible morality it will get destroyed ( SODOM AND GOMMORHA).

    Moreover if our general morality is weakening any chance of an effective society is also weaking. The reasoning behind this is clarified by one question
    WHAT IS THE BASIC UNIT OF SOCEITY?
    THE FAMILY

    If we are not worried about abortion, gay rights, and just general morality we stand to greatly weaken our society and governement.

  • Gary S.
    Oct. 10, 2007 6:07 a.m.

    I would not say Brother Reid is a disgrace to the Church. I see Republicans and Democrats as "effective" and "less effective" respectively, not "good" and "evil."

    However, Reid sends a mixed message on mixing religion and politics. He wants to state publicly what is right and wrong with the Church. But he does not want the Church to state publicly what is right and wrong with the government. Doesn't that seem backward?

    Also, criticizing President Benson, one of the Lord's prophets and a good man, was not a particularly good move on Reid's part. And attacking President Bush for mispronouncing words is not going to win friends or influence people either.

  • Ken Nottingham
    Oct. 10, 2007 6:03 a.m.

    Here's the deal...I choose to take a stand on abortion and gay marriage that is similar to what the current prophet and the doctrines of the church dictate. My opinions and actions about health care, global warming, education and jobs are insignificant in relation to my moral character.

  • Jackie
    Oct. 10, 2007 5:46 a.m.

    Sen. Reid reminds me of the kid in the out-crowd who will say and do anything to get to hang out with the popular kids.

  • Janet
    Oct. 10, 2007 5:18 a.m.

    Let us be Christians all and practice love and charity towards another. I appreciate the fact that our Church doesn't espouse any political party.

  • Disgusted Idahoan
    Oct. 10, 2007 5:01 a.m.

    It is unbelievable that students and others could be so supportive of an advocate of Socialism by Carl Marx, which was just the opposite of What Joseph Smith advocated. All of his positions are true socialism and will eventially lead us down a path of total destruction in this country if we do not wake up. These were the very things that Ezra Taft Bensen tried to warn us about that very few have heeded.

    To have him stand up in a University forum and criticize President Bensen and others who are of a consevative nature is offensive and reprehensive to me. While I am not a supporter of the Iraq war and have never been, it is appalling to me that he and his party can be so critical of the the war and the 4,000 or so deaths that has occured, but totally ignore and actually support abortion which continues to murder innocent babies at the count of millions since the legalization of Roe v. Wade.

    This guy is a total disappointment to me and I hope and pray that some day He will come to a realization of his incorrect philosiphies.

  • Tom
    Oct. 10, 2007 4:31 a.m.

    Scotwright, I am not a democrat or republican. If you are a Mormon and say that Reid is a disgrace to yur Church, you must have some problems. Most of the Mormons that I know do not behave as their ultra enemies: the ultra right Christians of the Republican party.

  • Winston Churchill
    Oct. 10, 2007 4:22 a.m.

    Churchill was also an alcoholic atheist: a good model for any Mormon.

  • Not currently LDS but looking
    Oct. 10, 2007 4:09 a.m.

    Talk about a compartmentalized life. It seems unfathomable that Mr. Reid who walks arm in arm with liberal organizations such as Daily Kos and Moveon.org would be lauded by so many LDS people while he "seeks after these things."

    I'm not LDS, but I am looking. I am conservative and I do know a little about the LDS doctrine and I find the separate silos Mr. Reid lives in at work and at church are hardly reconcilable with LDS doctrinal claims of virtue and holiness.

    Mr. Reid's example gives me considerable pause. Calling President Bush "an idiot" as Senator Reid has, seems to strike me as calling his neighbor Racca or empty head. This is who you laud? And before the indignant liberals begin throwing rhetorical stones at me let me remind them that calling your neighbor an idiot is a sin in YOUR doctrine. Now start throwing.

    If indeed Mr. Reid is an example of "temple worthy" member as he himself claims and that status allows for public support of move-on.org I don't know that I want to be "temple worthy".

  • BYU Alumni
    Oct. 10, 2007 3:58 a.m.

    With more and more liberal professors and now Reid getting a warm welcome I am through with BYU. The Church may own it but the spirit is gone. Flamers are warned I will not read your comments.

    My only reason in posting this is to let BYU know they can stop calling. I will no longer donate.

  • B. S. Jorgensen
    Oct. 10, 2007 3:08 a.m.

    According to research by Mark T. Shirey, citing Nice Guys Finish Seventh: False Phrases, Spurious Sayings, and Familiar Misquotations by Ralph Keyes, 1992, this quote was first uttered by mid-nineteenth century historian and statesman Franois Guizot when he observed, Not to be a republican at 20 is proof of want of heart; to be one at 30 is proof of want of head.

  • tj
    Oct. 10, 2007 3:03 a.m.

    A disgrace to the church? Are you kidding me? Why, just because he states his opinion? Bravo to Harry Reid for saying what he believes. That is what freedom of choice is all about. Can you be a Democrat and a Mormon? Absolutely. I am an independent voter who has voted both sides of the aisle. And also a recommend holding Mormon. I'd vote for Harry Reid over George Bush any day of the week.

  • J. Carlyle Parker
    Oct. 10, 2007 2:27 a.m.

    Reid's address was wonderful! Scott, above, is wrong. Reid is a fine example of an outstanding Latter-day Saint. I have had it with our current Bushwhacker. Sending a woman (an outstanding and a fine woman) to deal with foreign Muslims is joke. Doesn't Bush know that women are dirt to most foreign Muslim males?

    As a drafted veteran, it is past time to get out of Muslim countries. No one can stop them from killing each other. We should spend our funds and time protecting ourselves, on our lands, borders, and shores from these foreign Barbarians.

  • BYU Student
    Oct. 10, 2007 2:14 a.m.

    Isn't it the belief of the church to let people have their agency, even if people choose to sin?

  • Reid is right, ur Left
    Oct. 10, 2007 2:11 a.m.

    Reid leads by example. We need to cozy up to Move-on.org, I think they ARE Christlike deep down inside.

  • Scotwright
    Oct. 10, 2007 1:32 a.m.

    I DON'T like this guy! He is a disgrace to the Church and to the state of Nevada. The lies he has told against the American Military should have everyone at BYU booing him. That someone could cheer "Dingy Harry" at BYU is evidence that anyone who tries to live the Gospel is welcome in the LDS Church.

    Abortion was supposed to be something that Mr. Reid was against, but it seems that every evil, stupid, self-serving, worldy position is OK to him if it gives him a little power in the Dreamocrat Party. I was a Democrat and a Baptist in 1960 when John Kennedy was President. After a lot of experiences, some good and some bad, I am a Vietnam Veteran who is now a Latter Day Saint and a Very Conservative Republican.

    Winston Churchill said that if you were not a liberal at twenty years of age you had no heart. Then he said if you were not a Conservative at 30 you had no brain. Mr. Reid is over 30 and it is just about time he grew a brain.

  • Alan Robinson
    Oct. 10, 2007 12:55 a.m.

    I like this guy! He sticks to his guns and says what he thinks. He even praises his LDS Church and strangely doesnt get the same support from his members as Mitt does who tries to 'distance' himself from his Church. Strange huh!!