Jordan Chatman transferring had nothing to do with Coach Rose. The
exceptionally bright Chatman was accepted to BYU's law school, which
prohibits its students from participating in sports. Thus he transferred
somewhere where he could go to law school and play basketball.
Michael Lloyd Jr."Rose could have kept Chatman. He elected not
to because he thought he had a better idea."Chatman chose to
leave because he wanted to attend Law School, and BYU's Law School does not
allow students to participate in inter-collegiate athletics.
Michael Lloyd Jr.re: Lone*Star: "Did you see the three St.
Mary's game? Any college coach would concur that coaching was a huge factor
in those games."NOPE. What any college coach would
concur is that having experienced players was a huge factor in those games,
especially with the style of ball Saint Mary's plays.Before
this season, Dave Rose was 5-6 versus Randy Bennett.This season,
Saint Mary's was #84 in experience and BYU was #338.
Michael Lloyd Jr."There is a huge problem when you are counting
on LJ Rose as one of your "best" players."L.J. Rose was
recruited to be the stabilizing, Senior, point guard, that Dave Rose knew that
the Cougars lacked heading into this season.It's interesting
that fans whine about Emery and Haws throwing up wild shots, even though they
made many of those shots and were 2nd and 3rd on the team in scoring, yet you
whine about L.J. Rose's lack of production, because he only lead the team
idablu"If experience was such a major factor, why didn't we
see a steady improvement as the team progressed."Injuries.BYU lost Davis early; didn't have Bryant until January; lost
L.J.Rose in early February; and lost Bryant, again, for the NIT."You can't deny the team didn't look any better against UTA than
they did against UVU--2 opposite ends of the season."Apples to
Oranges comparison.UT Arlington finished #44 in RPI, won the Sun
Belt regular season championship, and was #13 in experience. They also beat
Saint Mary's 65-51 in Moraga.UVU finished #204 in RPI and
simply caught fire from 3PT for a game, hitting 18 of 37 (48.6%), well above
their 36.9% for the season.The Mustangs were a very good, very
experienced team that should have been playing in the NCAA tournament instead of
being a #6 seed in the NIT.BYU was down THREE starters - Davis, L.J.
Rose and Bryant - when they played UTA, plus Haws and Childs were both sick. The
game was basically 2 on 5, with Mika and Emery doing their best to try to keep
BYU in the game.BYU did show that they could play great defense at
times, see Gonzaga, they were simply very inconsistent.
History says you are wrong and teams can overcome huge odds.Lone*Star - Austin, TX"Whether the naysayers want to admit it
or not, inexperience and injuries were the primary reasons why BYU wasn't
more successful this season."One response: US beats Soviet
Union (most experienced and most healthy team on planet) and wins gold at Lake
Placid. Coaching and chemistry lead the way over "inexperience". Are you related to someone on the coaching staff? Seriously. Did you
see the three St. Mary's game? Any college coach would concur that
coaching was a huge factor in those games. There is so much more to the story
than TJ Haws 3 pt. shooting percentage. If you don't think the coaching
staffs at Duke, Gonzaga, North Carolina, St. Marys, Villanova, etc. make a big
difference then you don't understand college basketball. If noone can over
come youth and inexperience why are they paid such huge salaries? Even Dave
Rose would admit there are some things he would have done quite a bit
differently. Why huge salaries for coaches if unable to
overcome?There is a huge problem when you are counting on LJ Rose as
one of your "best" players. You are big on stats so check out his.
@Lone Star and MLJI have to side with MLJ one this one. If
experience was such a major factor, why didn't we see a steady improvement
as the team progressed. You can't deny the team didn't look any better
against UTA than they did against UVU--2 opposite ends of the season. Defense
and ball security was no better at the end of the season than at the beginning
of the season. So, when is this "experience" supposed to kick in.I
freely admit experience is a factor, but a coaching philosophy that lacks
defensive emphasis and player accountability is a bigger problem. That MUST
change if this team wants to contend for the WCC championship.
Michael Lloyd Jr."I think many "naysayers" are just
making a point that too many excuses are coming out of the program...and that in
some of the matchups, i.e. St. Marys, coaches could do a better job. You are
correct that injuries are a factor. They were a factor for UT Arlington in Provo
when they had to go without one of their best players...but they adjusted.
Injuries and inexperience hurt but great coaching can often overcome obstacles
like UVU and UT Arlington."UT Arlington was missing ONE of its
best players.BYU was missing THREE of its best players.UT
Arlington is #13 in experience.BYU is #338 in experience.Coaching can't teach experience, anymore than having great professors can
cram four years of college into a single year.Fans are ragging on
Haws for taking wild shots, yet Haws shot BETTER from 3PT as a Freshman, than
Jimmer did as a Senior.Whether the naysayers want to admit it or
not, inexperience and injuries were the primary reasons why BYU wasn't more
successful this season.
Dick won't address the real problem with BYU basketball.Of
course the obvious problem is defense. But the real problem is
discipline.Defense is the product of discipline. The shooters that
flock to BYU aspiring to be the next Jimmer are woefully lacking in
discipline.Rose doesn't need new players... he needs to instill
discipline in the players he's got.Until BYU basketball
embraces discipline, the disappointing seasons will continue.
News alert: UT Arlington adjusts in Provo despite injury to star player.Lone*Star - Austin, TX"Once again the naysayers descend
with their clueless claims that inexperience and injuries had absolutely nothing
to do with BYU's inconsistencies this season."That is a
little harsh. I think the "naysayers" make some pretty good points. I
don't think they are all "clueless". You obviously have a strong
opinion. You seem to have a very, very high opinion of the BYU coaching staff.
I don't think you're clueless but you swing just as fast and hard in
your direction as they do in theirs. I think many
"naysayers" are just making a point that too many excuses are coming out
of the program...and that in some of the matchups, i.e. St. Marys, coaches could
do a better job. You are correct that injuries are a factor. They were a
factor for UT Arlington in Provo when they had to go without one of their best
players...but they adjusted. Injuries and inexperience hurt but great coaching
can often overcome obstacles like UVU and UT Arlington. A little more
accountability from the coaches would help "Naysayers" sleep a little
better and be more positive about the future.
How often this season did we get teams coming up against BYU and seemed to be
having their best offensive games, like with UT Arlington with their highest
scoring first half, UVU with over a 100-point game, opposing players having
career highs in scoring, etc.There ought to be a statistic that
evaluates a team by how often its opponents have their best offensive stats,
compared to how often an opponent is held below their averages.
I hear this word experience being thrown around like cotton candy.Is that
just a rumor that 3 of the players have been playing together since they were
knee high to a grasshopper.
MLJBYU has a Law School that doesn't allow students to
participate in intercollegiate sports; get your facts straight.
Once again the naysayers descend with their clueless claims that inexperience
and injuries had absolutely nothing to do with BYU's inconsistencies this
season.Rose is supposed to be some sort of miracle worker who can
simply wave his magic wand and make one of the least experienced teams in the
country, a team riddled with significant injuries to key players, play like a
veteran, well-oiled machine.
I agree with a number of comments on this article. But, lets clear up one
thing. Jordan Chatman is getting his MBA at BC ..... not his law degree. He
should have been given more than the 10 min/gm last year. He is another in a
long line of BYU players who aren't really given a chance and/or a green
light to play offense on the BYU bench. Bartley was a good defensive force and
obviously Issac Nelson would have really helped this year. The one missing cog
in this machine is a point guard. Calvert was the answer IMO. We will get to
see him next year. Haws is not it. He should be playing behind Emery as a 2.
Beo maybe could do it, but we will never know because he wasn't brought
along this year with any real playing time at the pt. Rose doesn't seem
capable of turning this ship around. He is in awe of Emery and Haws and they
aren't held accountable for anything. I don't care if Harmon thinks
that was because there was no one on the bench ..... we were losing games
anyway. Put them on the bench for 3 minutes everytime they do something stupid.
Same rules for everyone!
Experienced older players would be great, as well as better shooting and shot
selection, and taking care of the ball's gotta be mentioned, too. But most
of all, actually playing defense would have solved several of the worst losses.
114 points to UVU, for Pete's sake, to name only the worst example? Guard
Gone for good - Burley, IDBYU has a law school. Get your facts
straight. There would have to be good communication between Rose, the law
school and Chatman. I don't think you know the whole story.
Jordan Chapman obviously wanted to stay at BYU (and Rose wanted him too) because
he applied to BYU's Law School. For some crazy reaon, BYU's Law School
doesn't let their students play NCAA sports. So Jordan could NOT stay at
BYU. Everyone was disappointed. We really could have used him this year.
A lot of excuse making going on with regards to low continuity and lack of
experience. Problem is, Coach's inconsistent substitution patterns and
tendency to write young players off too quickly when they don't come in
scoring 20 pts a game right out of the gate and leave them rotting on the end of
his bench forgotten for weeks or longer has put him in this position. We had players who could've provided that experience we lacked and given
us quality depth off the bench or in the starting lineup. Some of these guys are
having success too in their new homes. Isaac Neilson is averaging nearly a
double double at UVU and is the WAC DPOY. Frank Bartley IV is scoring 15 a game
for ULL and Chatman is averaging 8 a game and set an ACC record for 3's in
a game recently. Also Cory Calvert and Jake Toolson were experienced role
players who could've made a difference.These guys felt that
they had no future at BYU (Chatman's was an issue with BYU Law School but
who knows how that might've played out if he was getting major minutes on
the team) to the degree that they decided the grass looked greener over the
fence. You reap what you sow.
Why does every one keep thinking that there was some way BYU was going to keep
Jordan Chapman. It was never going to happen and it had nothing to do with Dave
Rose. It was his decision regarding law school. He made a wise decision for his
future. Everyone needs to get their facts straight.
I like what Spencer Linton said today - it is maturity!!
Yes and No.Yes, Rose needs to recruit from the JC ranks that can play
defense to help hold the current guards accountable.But it is much
more than that. Rose desperately needs an experienced point guard. Haws is NOT
it and never will be. He needs a paradigm shift in coaching philosophy with an
emphasis on defense and movement & spacing on offense. This starts with
replacing his coaching staff with proven experience in these areas.Harmen is right that it boils down to recruiting--but it needs to be
recruitment of point guards, as well as recruitment of coaching personnel.
Dick you are right, BYU has "shooters". They just need more
"makers".The culture at BYU is the opposite to 99.9% of the
best programs in the Nation. The culture at BYU is: If you want to play you
have to be able to shoot the 3 ball. Every other serious P5 and
midmajor team in American have a different litmus test for players especially
freshmen to get on the court:You have to be able to defend. PERIOD.
Ask any coach of a D1 program the minimum qualifications for a player to get in
the game... Same answer: Defense. Until that changes at BYU we will continue to
get guys that are better than average shooters but don't have enough
defensive skill and athletic ability to play at Weber State.Look at
the Jimmer senior year: That was their best defensive team in years:Abouo - great perimeter defender, rebounderEmery- Top perimeter defender
and steals leaderHartsock-Good shot blocker , rebounder and defenderBrandon Davies: good low post defender.Kyle Collinsworth: very good
AVAILABLE SCHOLARSHIPS?Interesting piece Dick. However, don't
you need available scholarships to recruit? Maybe you could write a piece on
possible trades...like MLB or NFL. Something like the Houston Texans unloading
Oswelier to the Browns and giving up a valuable draft pick because Cleveland had
cap room to absorb his salary.BYU could trade Worthington, Beo and a
player to be named later for ....oh...I don't know....Lonzo Ball's
first born.With an eye on making another move at quarterback,
Cleveland acquired veteran Brock Oswelier and a 2018 second-round pick on
Thursday in a stunning trade with the Houston Texans, who were looking for a
partner to help them get rid of the QB’s $16m guaranteed contract.
JORDAN CHATMANRose could have kept Chatman. He elected not to
because he thought he had a better idea.
Yes, It's a problem with recruiting. And keeping players with experience.
Jordan Chatman and Jake Toolson would have gone a long ways towards stabilizing
this team this season.
More than recruiting. It's coaching. The kids need focus, discipline, and
play on both ends of the court. Their high school press clipping mean nothing
now. Let's see if Rose can rise to the challenge. Does he have the energy