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Ordain Women founder's recruitment efforts result in excommunication from LDS Church

Kate Kelly's 'conduct contrary to the laws and order of the church,' bishop says

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  • 1956SLA San Lorenzo, CA
    July 2, 2014 11:13 a.m.

    I feel sorry for her family - if she has children what lesson are they learning from this experience? She took her law smartness to another level and thought she could challenge the higher law (God's law) Wish you well.

  • Midwest Mom Soldiers Grove, WI
    June 28, 2014 5:14 p.m.

    Mr. Lloyd-Jones -- You intentionally left out the name of Jesus Christ from the name of our Church.

    If I believe in Jesus Christ, pray in His name, repent in His name, take the sacrament in His name, and try to follow his precepts and commandments, then who are you to tell me that I am not a Christian, or any other person who says that they believe in Christ? Do you present yourself as one who knows the mind of God and His judgments?

    The scriptures are there for a guide, not a set of talking points to lay a snare for our neighbor.

  • jjtotten Washington, UT
    June 28, 2014 1:44 p.m.

    Although she was sincere in her desires she had worked from the wrong end of revelation. We do not decide what doctrine is and then attempt to force the Church to change it's doctrine. The doctrine comes from above through specific channels and she knows that, or should know, how the process works. Perhaps that is the problem, she does not know the process.

  • deniron Effurun/Nigeria, 00
    June 28, 2014 3:18 a.m.

    Nobody desire to have person excommunicated from church. But with this Kate will see how bitter is Satan's plan for her. Let others learn from it.

  • David Lloyd-Jones Toronto, 00
    June 26, 2014 3:46 a.m.

    Typographical error in my letter, above: Galatians 3:28.

  • David Lloyd-Jones Toronto, 00
    June 26, 2014 3:41 a.m.

    In recent years the Church of Latter Day Saints have made a frequent, and often convincing, display of claiming to be on the way to being a part of the Christian Church.

    In the light of Galatians 1:28, it would seem they have, perhaps temporarily, taken a rest from that trek.

    -dlj.

  • Elena K Alameda County, CA
    June 25, 2014 5:28 p.m.

    My love and my heart goes to Kate and her family. I know this must be one of the most difficult time as individual and as family. May Heavenly Father be with you, comfort you always. I don't think anybody except her direct leader should give words of hatred or punishment. Who are we to point at somebody? It seems that calling ourselves "LDS" makes us forget that we are really members of "The Church of Jesus Christ..." Be kind and merciful is one of our biggest task to achieve. Kate is our sister, we shouldn't forget that.

  • foldart OREM, UT
    June 25, 2014 2:26 p.m.

    I find it interesting that in multiple stories I have read and interviews she has given, she consistently refers to "The Church" as "My congregation" or "My Church". Member's of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter day Saints normally refer to to "The Church" and say it is the "Savior's Church". We are only participants or members thereby understanding that we do not make the rules or demand change. The wording she uses makes me believe that she feels like she has or should have say over doctrine and policies. As a "member" we believe that only our Heavenly Father and his Son Jesus Christ make doctrine. I have questioned many things as a member of the "Church" but I have always understood that as Christ said while praying to his Father "not my will, but thy will be done.

    Some people claim that all she wanted was to have the "Prophet" ask Heavenly Father if the changes she wanted would happen. My thought is that the answer came either No or not now. My guess is that he either did ask or has in the past. That is the way it works in the LDS
    Church.

  • John Pack Lambert of Michigan Ypsilanti, MI
    June 25, 2014 2:19 p.m.

    This is a good day for the order of the Church. Kelly has continuously shown disregard for the counsel of all Church leaders and been inherently disruptive. Her failure to even try to listen to the counsel of her Church leaders made this result almost certain.

  • neece Logan, UT
    June 25, 2014 1:52 p.m.

    I loved the touch of the Kleenex wiping away a fake tear. Really? I agree with pretty much everyone here. I think she is vying for attention. Joseph Smith said long ago, "“In all your trials, tribulations and sickness, in all your sufferings, even unto death, be careful you don’t betray God, … be careful you don’t apostatize.” he also said:"“I will give you one of the Keys of the mysteries of the Kingdom. It is an eternal principle, that has existed with God from all eternity: That man who rises up to condemn others, finding fault with the Church, saying that they are out of the way, while he himself is righteous, then know assuredly, that that man is in the high road to apostasy; and if he does not repent, will apostatize, as God lives."

  • m.g. scott clearfield, UT
    June 25, 2014 1:23 p.m.

    This just goes to show how many people read, but rarely post, on the DN website.

  • CylonesRus sunamn, IN
    June 25, 2014 1:10 p.m.

    She and her followers should just join the Community of Christ, the former RLDS.

  • Socal Coug San Diego, CA
    June 25, 2014 11:33 a.m.

    I Bleed Blue,

    I don't think people are taking delight in this decision, more that it's a course of action that needs to happen based on the situation.
    Maybe Mrs Kelly can move on and/or work through this situation now.
    It's interesting that maybe a year ago this seemed like a patient group, but swiftly became 'all or nothing' towards the end. Very martyr-like, somewhat hopeless.
    Had she met with her Bishop and dealt with some of the issues, her cause may have lasted longer and had more impact. Maybe she was drained and done fighting. "Kicking against the pricks" has got to hurt after a while (D&C 121.

    Of such who defy the Lord, trample upon his sacred ordinances, fight his leaders, the Lord has this to say:

    Cursed are all those that shall lift up the heel against mine anointed, saith the Lord, and cry they have sinned when they have not sinned before me, saith the Lord, but have done that which was meet in mine eyes, and which I commanded them.

    Wo unto them . . . they shall be severed from the ordinances of mine house."

  • Anti Bush-Obama Chihuahua, 00
    June 25, 2014 11:29 a.m.

    "The Church is always changing. Joseph Smith wouldn't recognize the church today. They will eventually cave in on this issue as well. Just a matter of time."

    That's your opinion.

  • Socal Coug San Diego, CA
    June 25, 2014 10:25 a.m.

    If "our ways" become more important to us than "His ways", this is what happens.

  • Laura Bilington Maple Valley, WA
    June 25, 2014 8:51 a.m.

    jsf writes, "When the church begins to have such a profound involvement in the lives of non-members and the community at large, it should be held to the standards that govern other public institutions, like due process, equal protection and transparency."

    The LDS church tried to keep its involvement in California politics secret. Propositon 8 would never have passed in the first place if the church had not poured money into deceptive advertising (check out the Gathering Storm video), trying to convince the voters that the sky would fall if gay marriage was approved. If Heavenly Father is truly speaking to the Prophet--and if he is truly listening--then more transparency can only bring more converts.

  • chito cedar hills, UT
    June 25, 2014 7:52 a.m.

    Why excommunication? What will happened to the rest of her family? Husband, Children? are they excommunicated too? where is the love and mercy of Christ?

  • johhen Salt Lake City, UT
    June 24, 2014 11:07 p.m.

    Hmmm. The Pope publicly excommunicates mafioso for criminal enterprise and venal behavior. Men who have held leadership positions in the LDS Church are under investigation for using their public offices for personal gain. A woman who appears to be a true believer and love her LDS faith is excommunicated for advocating change in a civil and respectful manner. What does it mean? What happens if the two men are convicted? What of the gentleman who admitted to inappropriate behavior with a young woman in a hot tub? Why was he given a standing ovation? I'm just not sure I understand some things. Perhaps it's because I'm not from here. Can anyone explain it all to me?

  • New to Utah PAYSON, UT
    June 24, 2014 10:58 p.m.

    Kate Kelly's excommunication was a great
    blessing to her and her family. She can humbly
    follow the counsel of her Bishop or choose
    otherwise.

  • wrz Phoenix, AZ
    June 24, 2014 9:22 p.m.

    @abv123:
    "Women have a divine purpose and destiny, co-equal with men."

    Women are not co-equal with men... whatever that means. Men and women are miles apart physically, mentally, and emotionally.

    If anything, women are superior to men, and in many ways.

  • Eliyahu Pleasant Grove, UT
    June 24, 2014 7:59 p.m.

    A correction to my earlier post. The last line should have read "One of the reasons we've lasted for so many thousands of years is because we haven't stifled debate.

  • bj-hp Maryville, MO
    June 24, 2014 7:06 p.m.

    A poster above stated that they wanted to hear more about Church discipline and excommunications of members. This poster also felt that when these are kept secret and not transparent that it is not a good religion and one she doesn't want to belong too.

    The problem is that these councils are supposed to be private and only between the council and the individual. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints is not the one that broke that confidentiality but the individual that was ultimately disciplined. The Church of Jesus Christ did not state at all that this individual was being disciplined or that others are facing discipline. These are confidential and kept that way as long as the individual maintains that confidentiality. It is no ones business of whom is being disciplined at all.

    Many have stated that she is good with God and that these men are just that men. However, they as I believe in inspiration and guidance from the Head of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. The head of this Church is not just a man but the Son of God, even the Lord Jesus Christ.

  • Harrison Bergeron Holladay , UT
    June 24, 2014 6:12 p.m.

    Blue AZ Cougar,

    Thank you! Your Elder Maxwell quote was so apropos, that I went and read the whole talk. And having read most of the comments related to this topic, I found the rest of that paragraph particularly relevant to what we see in the commentary:

    "Like the throng on the ramparts of the “great and spacious building,” they are intensely and busily preoccupied, pointing fingers of scorn at the steadfast iron-rodders (1 Ne. 8:26–28, 33). Considering their ceaseless preoccupation, one wonders, Is there no diversionary activity available to them, especially in such a large building—like a bowling alley? Perhaps in their mockings and beneath the stir are repressed doubts of their doubts."

    Elder Neal A. Maxwell, 'Becometh As a Child', Ensign, May 1996

  • Zed Orem, UT
    June 24, 2014 5:12 p.m.

    GameTheory, "*Jimmy Carter, my mistake. my comment still stands to be answered"

    Okay, I'll give it a shot. In the very kindest way I can say, you're completely mistaken on both counts. In the Book of Mormon, which was in print years before polygamy was instituted in the early church, it says, "Wherefore, my brethren, hear me, and hearken to the word of the Lord: For there shall not any man among you have save it be one wife; and concubines he shall have none;"
    It was always doctrine that polygamy was instituted by God only by specific command and in specific situations. Abraham and other Old Testament prophets practiced it, and then the practice ceased. The cessation of polygamy in the modern church is actually very consistent when looking at the big picture of gospel dispensations.
    Secondly, I was taught growing up, like virtually everyone else I know, that one day the ban would be lifted and the priesthood would be available to all races and all men.
    So neither occurrence was unforeseen, nor did they represent a change of eternal doctrine. Anyone who claims otherwise simply doesn't know the history, the scriptures, or the doctrine.

  • southmtnman Provo, UT
    June 24, 2014 4:55 p.m.

    "It's time to decide which side of the fence we will stand on. I have chosen my side and will fight for my testimony of the restored gospel and a living prophet every single day."

    Why is it always about building fences, and walls, and dividing?

    Shouldn't we rather be building bridges?

  • jsf Centerville, UT
    June 24, 2014 4:47 p.m.

    @rocklaw
    When the church begins to have such a profound involvement in the lives of non-members and the community at large, it should be held to the standards that govern other public institutions, like due process, equal protection and transparency. You mean like the state controlling the religion. You do realize the church is not arresting or suing Ms. Kelly. In the church hearing there was due process, equal protection and transparency according to the churches procedures. Step back to separation of church and state. So many want to apply state regulation to internal church matters. Now if the church took property, executed or physically punished individuals, maybe the state should step in but what civil rights did Kelly loose in excommunication.

  • truth in all its forms henderson, NV
    June 24, 2014 4:42 p.m.

    Church disciplinary hearings are supposed to be private events within the local congregation. If this is true than why are we hearing about this all over the news? We should move on with our lives and stop speculating on private matters.

  • abv123 Provo, UT
    June 24, 2014 4:27 p.m.

    Mormon doctrine honors women and teaches the true dignity of womanhood. It is sad to see this woman, excommunicated now, narrow the scope of things that she values down to this one issue. It is sad to see her trade the inestimable blessings offered by the church for the purpose of promoting a narrow and conception of equality. Women have a divine purpose and destiny, co-equal with men. To attack church teachings on the priesthood is to devalue that purpose and destiny. It means that she no longer understands the eternal significance of motherhood and family. Her conceptions are now circumscribed by the beliefs and prejudices of our day. Mother, wife, home, and family are phenomena pregnant with eternal significance. In our day when exact 50/50 split in domestic and professional duties is the only acceptable division of labor, the eternal significance of gender, home, and family is lost. Roles are devalued. These developments have injured the family. A woman who values motherhood above all else and considers her domestic duties to be of preeminent importance is the most valuable ingredient a society has. Societies that have forgotten this are dying. Shrinking with each generation.

  • rickswife Cordes Lakes, AZ
    June 24, 2014 4:15 p.m.

    One of the most interesting things I have found is that she separated herself from her husband by going by a different last name. Maybe her maiden name? Did he not want her to do this so she isn't going by her married last name?

  • payara OREM, UT
    June 24, 2014 4:01 p.m.

    Could it be that as human rights attorney, Mrs. Kelly got what she wanted; The fame.

  • Cinci Man FT MITCHELL, KY
    June 24, 2014 3:58 p.m.

    @GameTheory

    Asked and answered many times, but like KK, the answer is never good enough. But thanks for asking.

  • mattrick78 Cedar City, UT
    June 24, 2014 3:45 p.m.

    "The Church is always changing. Joseph Smith wouldn't recognize the church today. They will eventually cave in on this issue as well. Just a matter of time."

    Some may see it as changing, but I think Joseph Smith would still recognize that the principles of the gospel and the teachings of salvation have not changed.

  • GameTheory Salt Lake City, UT
    June 24, 2014 3:15 p.m.

    @ Midwestmom. *Jimmy Carter, my mistake. my comment still stands to be answered .

  • Judy Limburg Walla Walla, WA
    June 24, 2014 3:14 p.m.

    Does anybody really find this entire situation surprising? An excommunication, contention among members within the church, the world watching, judging, pointing, hating, laughing . . . these ARE the last days. As a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, there is no room here to quietly going about your business. We will either stand strong and steadfast or fall to the wayside. I have a feeling this is just the beginning. It's time to decide which side of the fence we will stand on. I have chosen my side and will fight for my testimony of the restored gospel and a living prophet every single day.

  • Itsme2 SLC, UT
    June 24, 2014 3:04 p.m.

    Hmm, so the truth comes out that this woman isn't really telling the truth about events after all. She's outright deceptive.

  • rocklaw Holladay, UT
    June 24, 2014 3:03 p.m.

    When the church begins to have such a profound involvement in the lives of non-members and the community at large, it should be held to the standards that govern other public institutions, like due process, equal protection and transparency. Good for her to call these men to account. We've all had enough of the righteous bullying done in the name of supernatural hocus pocus. It's time for a little reality check.

  • Allen Salt Lake valley, UT
    June 24, 2014 2:51 p.m.

    Lets view the church from two viewpoints, social and spiritual. The social involves relationships between members, potluck dinners, dances, etc. The spiritual involves revelations, doctrine, priesthood ordinations, etc.

    I'm guessing that Kelly looked at the church from the social viewpoint, that the church is led by men who make decisions and set policies. Blogs and protests are appropriate ways of influencing people to change their decisions and policies.

    Kelly's disciplinary council probably looked at the church from both viewpoints, and their decisions were appropriate for the spiritual view but less appropriate for the social view.

    It seems to me that the problem involved with this situation comes from the church being both social and spiritual. Sister Kelly and the OW organization did influence policies of the church. Examples are the opening of the Saturday priesthood session to women (via TV), more women giving prayers and talks in conference, and discussions of the priesthood among priesthood leaders and lay members. However, the OW is to be faulted for not recognizing that their actions are inappropriate for the LDS church. It takes time for the church to change its policies. And, some policies will only change if God changes them.

  • Tuffy Parker Salem, UT
    June 24, 2014 2:45 p.m.

    The term authentic as bantered about by Kate Kelly is somewhat intriguing. After all, one could reasonably argue that the "Natural Mam" might be defined as authentic.

  • CBAX Provo, UT
    June 24, 2014 2:44 p.m.

    Why doesn't she just start her own Mormon church! She can declare her church the true and living church of God and she will receive the revelations she feels she is getting.

    Then every hater can put their money where their mouth is and attend President Kelly's church weekly.

  • Sniglet Bellevue, WA
    June 24, 2014 2:43 p.m.

    I don't see what the big issue about excommunication is. Salvation isn't dependent on membership in a temporal church. All that matters is what's in your heart. If Kate's faith is strong then losing her membership in the church is no big deal. The individuals who excommunicated Kate are just men after all, even if they do pray for guidance, and are certainly not the ultimate arbiters as to Kate's celestial bliss.

    Let's not forget that many of the holiest people in scripture were the ones who were a thorn in the side of the leadership of the time.

    Kate should just take the excommunication in stride and keep on with following her own conscience with prayerful thought and reflection of her own.

  • RustyShackleford salt lake city, UT
    June 24, 2014 2:25 p.m.

    Well the way I see it is that she was excommunicated by human beings from the Church. It's not like she was rebuked by god. Her bishop made a decision to excommunicate her. I think such a decision will backfire in the end. The letter, published in the Salt Lake Tribune, clearly indicates that the men who run the show are upset that she won't keep her opinion to herself. I don't think it's fair for a church to make an assumption that it has a monopoly on salvation and communication with god, when it isn't god that is deciding who gets to be in the church, but a "disciplinary council."

  • Church member North Salt Lake, UT
    June 24, 2014 2:25 p.m.

    The Church is always changing. Joseph Smith wouldn't recognize the church today. They will eventually cave in on this issue as well. Just a matter of time.

  • Hockey Fan Miles City, MT
    June 24, 2014 2:17 p.m.

    @ Scientist:

    I echo InspectorC's sentiments. If I lived in Provo, I would be delighted you have you as a friend. It appears we're around the same age and we could have some great conversations while we ate pizza and drank root beer near the BYU campus. (DN policy prohibits me from naming the location we would eat said pizza, but you know where I mean.)

    Thank you for sharing your insights. And thank you for supporting your family in their Church activity, including cleaning the meetinghouse. I was a part-time meetinghouse custodian for 23+ years, so I appreciate your willingness to help out with that task.

  • Pack Layton, Utah
    June 24, 2014 1:51 p.m.

    The caravan rolls on.

  • RedWings CLEARFIELD, UT
    June 24, 2014 1:42 p.m.

    @ Craig Clark

    Yes, she did serve, and that was voluntary service. No one compelled her to go. Many who have served faithful missions have fallen away over the years.

    Sincere belief is one thing. Open defiance of the prophet and chruch leatership is another.

    @ hockeymom:

    So true. If you take many of these "equality" demands to their logical conclusion, where you end up is an untenable and quite ludicrious situation...

  • xert Santa Monica, CA
    June 24, 2014 1:14 p.m.

    Such loving posts. People who a totally devoid of anger or vindictiveness. It's clear that the love of our fellow man is what's important to most of the 233 who have posted today. I love how everyone ends their posts with comments like "how sad." That proves that they are really sad and concerned. And when they offer a prayerful desire for this woman to come to her senses and return to the fold? I can tell they really, sincerely mean it.

  • InspectorC Wasatch Front, UT
    June 24, 2014 1:14 p.m.

    @ The Scientist, 10:54 AM ---

    Thanks for sharing such a personal experience and for your insights; seriously-- thank you! I never knew all of that information before about your background.

    You have a very unique life experience that we all can learn something from. And all humans (on this spaceship called "Earth") need to keep an open mind and show more respect to each others' opinions and belief-windows. Thanks again! 8)

  • GR SANTA CLARITA, CA
    June 24, 2014 1:12 p.m.

    Surely Sister Kelly was not the only one facing a disciplinary council in the past few days. Oddly enough, the only one I have heard, read about, seen so publicly is hers. Nobody else ran to the media to garner support. I feel sad for her and her family.

  • Balan South Jordan, Utah
    June 24, 2014 1:00 p.m.

    There are few individuals who are finding "glee" or "satisfaction" from what has just transpired. Mr. Kelly is a child of God, just like you and me, and He loves and cares for her.

    However, I am grateful for a process that protects the Church from those who begin to pursue a personal agenda. As sad as it is to realize the potential loss for not only Ms. Kelly, but also her extended family and friends as well, the Lord has clearly stated (and I paraphrase) that it is better for one person to perish than for an entire nation to dwindle in unbelief.

    God has entrusted the leaders of His Church to protect the members of his flock. I am thankful that they take this responsibility seriously.

  • techpubs Sioux City, IA
    June 24, 2014 1:00 p.m.

    @
    Vanceone

    Provo, UT

    Totally not surprising. She tried to steady the ark. Repeatedly. Again I ask: What, exactly, was she thinking? The Priesthood has been exclusively male for 7,000 years. What made her think that she was going to change that?

    Are you positive that in the last 7,000 years there hasn't been any matriarchal societies or cultures that have had priestesses?
    Christianity on the other hand has only been around approx. 2,000 years and most Xtian religions have not had women in leadership roles until recently.

  • geegeejojo Moab, UT
    June 24, 2014 12:59 p.m.

    One of the beautiful things about the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, is that usually every effort is given for anyone who shows acts of apostasy, to return to full fellowship! It is also good to know that God is in control of His Church and has established it since the beginning of time, to function through the power of the priesthood. I am grateful for my position as a woman in the Church, that I don't have the responsibility of the priesthood along with the blessing and privilege of being a mother and being able to nurture my children and care for my family. There is spirit about motherhood, working in harmony with the priesthood, that builds the character foundation of any nation, building strong and faithful children, believing in God and desiring to achieve the highest potential within!
    To lose ones membership in the Church, is a greater loss than any boundless treasure the world offers!

  • bj-hp Maryville, MO
    June 24, 2014 12:56 p.m.

    Let me clarify something that was posted above. No Sister has ever had the priesthood conferred upon them. This has not stopped them from giving blessings or in some instances pass the sacrament. These were done without priesthood authority which is how it is done outside of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. These sisters again never had the priesthood conferred upon them though they acted as if it had been. Better clarification is on the official website.

    Secondly, I have lived outside of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints for many years before I came back. I know now what I missed in those years away from the Church. Today my life is happier and simplier than it ever was outside. Those who feel it is much better really don't know the eternal blessings that one shall miss. Some who have chosen to not join even though they have been taught and testified too will find their lives worthless when the final judgement comes. Those who have fallen away and have not repented will suffer even greater judgements than those they criticize.

  • U-tar Woodland Hills, UT
    June 24, 2014 12:36 p.m.

    @ Eliyahu
    "Unabashed Glee"
    Come on now, no one is dancing in the streets. You of all people should know that perception of religion as viewed from the outside is never reality. Your religion in particular. We have more in common than you think. There is plenty of room for discussion in both our faith's

  • hockeymom Highland, UT
    June 24, 2014 12:16 p.m.

    @ mayan elephant

    Are you sure you really want full equality in the church? Do you want women in the Bishopric and men in the Relief Society presidency? Do you want a female Young Men's advisor and male Young Women's advisor? Do you want a female deacon's quorum advisor and a male beehive advisor? Do you not see the not only silly but down right dangerous circumstance this would present? You can't have it both ways - full equality in the church would mean just that - full equality in the church. Please tell me how it would work out any other way?

  • wrz Phoenix, AZ
    June 24, 2014 12:12 p.m.

    @steamroller:
    "Her big complaint was that the church is full of 'gender inequality.'

    There is substantial gender inequality.

    Women can freely wear men's clothes... including suits/ties. Men can't wear women's clothes (without being considered kooky). Women can wear dresses at a variety of lengths all the way from mini to maxi. If boys wear their pants slightly below the waistline they'd be considered loose, sloppy, rakish.

    Men are encouraged to wear suits/ties to church and white shirts with ties performing priesthood and other church assignments. Women in Relief Society and Young Women's programs can wear almost anything in any style/color/cut they wish (except swimsuits/bikinis).

    Women can wear their hair long, short, in between, and in a variety of colors/styles. Men are to have their hair short with no coloring. Women can wear hats in church. Men would look/feel stupid.

    I suspect, if females were to receive the priesthood they would be required to adhere to a strict dress code like males. And I don't think they'd like it very much. They're far better off without being encumbered by a strict dress/appearance code.

  • Craig Clark Boulder, CO
    June 24, 2014 12:10 p.m.

    Let’s remember that Kate Kelly served a full time mission. That’s two years of her life that she gave for the Church without receiving a dime in compensation, two years she could have spent in college earning her law degree two years earlier or two years in some other personal pursuit.

    That alone is not the whole picture, of course, but it is a part of the whole that’s not being mentioned enough. Just something to reflect on for those eager to demonize her for doing something I think she sincerely believes in.

  • Twin Lights Louisville, KY
    June 24, 2014 12:00 p.m.

    GeekUSA76,

    I think the disregard you may see is because some of this was easily anticipated that shock or surprise on her part is unwarranted. Yes, I have certainly stopped to think of her as a person. I read her letter to Bishop Harrison. It had a lot of good detail about her.

    The apostasy had nothing to do with her beliefs. It was that she was teaching as doctrine that the priesthood should be open to women. This is evident in the lessons posted on the Ordain Women website (referenced in the letter from Bishop Harrison). She was counseled to stop teaching these things. She adamantly refused.

    This was not about the questions she may have had but about the "answers" she was openly teaching to others.

    What sins you or I commit are one thing. But when we teach others false doctrine (doctrine specifically renounced by the First Presidency and Quorum of Twelve) then we should be wise enough to know the likely consequence.

    Honestly, I wish Ms. Kelly well. I hope she will have a change of heart and be warmly welcomed home.

  • Midwest Mom Soldiers Grove, WI
    June 24, 2014 11:57 a.m.

    @ GameTheory -- "1978 President Harry Truman"?

  • Eliyahu Pleasant Grove, UT
    June 24, 2014 11:53 a.m.

    The unabashed glee expressed by so many writers here at her excommunication leaves me to wonder why she, or anyone else, would want to belong to the same church as those people. I'm very glad to be a Jew, a religion in which such questions would be enthusiastically discussed by both lay people and rabbis alike and where someone advocating an opinion in opposition to that of the majority can still be a member in good standing. The fact that my rabbi is a woman is because we already had this discussion long ago and two of the three main branches of Judaism found no reason that a woman can't be a rabbi. We still have people who disagree with ordination of women, but they're as welcome in our services as any other Jew. One of the reasons we've lasted for so many thousands of years is because we having stifled debate.

  • pburt Logan, UT
    June 24, 2014 11:49 a.m.

    Please, I beg every reader to go back about 10 comments and read the perfect one by GeekUSA76. It is astonishing that the harshest punishment the church dishes out--excommunication--is reserved for a humble young woman trying to do good, only trying to do good. She is faithful and loyal to the church, and yet we don't ex Shurtliff and Swallow, but we ex her? That is just wrong.

  • Hockey Fan Miles City, MT
    June 24, 2014 11:48 a.m.

    All choices have consequences. Ms. Kelly is a well-educated attorney. Surely she embarked on her Quixotic crusade knowing full well that it would likely result in the consequence for her that it did. Faithful members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints sustain Thomas S. Monson as the only person on the earth who possesses and is authorized to exercise all priesthood keys. Opponents and critics of the Church will scoff at this notion. Scoff away. Priesthood authority is God’s authority, not Thomas Monson’s authority. Those who sustain Thomas Monson as God’s authorized agent and mouthpiece on the earth for our time would never have the unmitigated audacity to demand that President Monson do anything that would contravene what God has directed him to do. If she no longer believes this fundamental doctrine of the Church, then in order for her to be “true to herself,” she should have voluntarily relinquished her membership in the Church instead of forcing this issue with a disciplinary council. And she didn’t know any of that? I don’t think so.

  • But seriously folks! Salt Lake City, UT
    June 24, 2014 11:47 a.m.

    This is part of the sifting process in the last days. Those that choose to follow their own doctrine will do just that, regardless of what the doctrine of their Church is. This sifting process will continue with this and other issues of our time.

    This will not harm the LDS church but will draw those that believe that religion is not man-made but is ordained of God.

    I feel bad that this woman choose to abandon a lifetime of belief so that she could gain the national spotlight for her own political agenda. This will blow over and will soon be forgotten by the media and she will be left to ponder her ways.

    My hope is that those that have been blinded by her personal agenda and want to maintain their membership in the Church will reconsider their ways and disassociate themselves with this ill-fated movement.

  • U-tar Woodland Hills, UT
    June 24, 2014 11:38 a.m.

    It is evident from the Bishop's letter that Mrs. Kelly was not altogether truthful in her statements to the media about her dealings with her leaders. Where I come from, it's called a lie.

  • GameTheory Salt Lake City, UT
    June 24, 2014 11:36 a.m.

    @StandAlone

    "His ways do not change with the worldly wind. " They do change, in the grand scheme of things God would rather be considered quite bi-polar, like remember the time he changed his mind about black people. --- President Benjamin Harrison; "hey mormons you can not have a state unless you drop polygamy, oh and we will be able to take your property away". Prophet Wilford Woodruff; hmm ok , oh wait a minute, wait a minute, this just coming in, God just told me he changed his mind on Polygamy, so yeah its bad, so bad *crosses fingers and continues. ….. year 1902, yup its real bad so don't do it or we will excommunicate you cause it makes us look bad *crosses fingers and continues.
    1978 President Harry Truman: Hey mormons you can't be tax exempt if you are going to keep being discriminatory. Spencer W. Kimble: oh actually I'm just getting something here… oh turns out God has changed his mind about blacks and not having the priesthood.
    doesn't change with the worldly wind? give me a break. Culture reflects god on to a canvas.

  • mhenshaw Leesburg, VA
    June 24, 2014 11:31 a.m.

    >>I don't think many LDS members truly appreciate how rich, fulfilling, and "blessed" life can be "outside" of the Church.

    I don't doubt that it can be. God loves all of His children and wants them to be happy.

    But unless you've made and kept the actual covenants with God that are part of church membership, you won't know what you're really missing because you'll never have experienced the blessings for yourself. Observing something and experiencing something can be two very different things.

    Attending but never joining is like watching someone else eat but never tasting the food for yourself; or watching a sporting event from the stands but never playing on the field. The food's a lot better when you're eating it and not just looking at it; victory in sport is more exhilarating when you're a member of thee team that wins the hard-fought game. And a relationship with the Lord is much deeper when you can feel the Spirit working with you, changing your nature as you keep those covenants and work to become more like Him.

  • RedSandMan St. George, UT
    June 24, 2014 11:30 a.m.

    It is an interesting discussion, for sure. Some facts will be unchanged when the dust settles on this sad event for Ms Kelly. Regardless of any opinion or disagreement, in the end the integrity of the Church's doctrine will remain. If your opinion sides with Ms Kelly and you are a member of the Church, maybe some sincere personal study and prayer regarding the revelatory beginnings of the Church, its core doctrines, and priesthood will answer your questions. Core doctrines of this faith are not going to change unless the Lord directs it, and revelation regarding doctrinal change for the church as a whole will come from the top (Jesus Christ). That's simply how it works in this Church. If you are not a member, but you have sincere questions and want to get past the misinformation and argument, then in the words of a living apostle of the Lord, simply "ask the missionaries, they can help you".

  • Flashback Kearns, UT
    June 24, 2014 11:30 a.m.

    Scientist, that's because our lives are rich and fulfilled just fine in the church. I don't feel the desire to keep up with anyone else. I'm responsible for my own salvation. I don't feel the need to "prove my superior worthiness" to anyone except when I get a temple recommend in a private interview. And my worthiness isn't superior to anyone else.

  • sid 6.7 Holladay, UT
    June 24, 2014 11:27 a.m.

    I have been thinking a lot about this situation. Being an inactive member of the Church I know enough to know that she had to be aware that she was going to be Excommunicated for her actions. Although it brings me no joy I must admit I would have followed the same course the Church has in this situation.

    So why would a faithful obedient member of the Church take it this far knowing her Excommunication was eminent? Why?

    Could it be Mrs. Kelly is the one receiving inspiration from the Lord and the Brethren are the one's not listening? Like it or not history dictates that our Church is progressive. A perfect example is the Blacks finally receiving the Priesthood. The list of changes the church has made to the original doctoren goes on and on. Perhaps it's Mrs. Kelly who is listening and its the Brethren who don't like the answer.

    I am Shure I am going to get flambéed for posing this question. The Church is run by man and man can make mistakes. Do I necessary believe this? No, but it is a possibility.

    It's just food for thought.

  • RedWings CLEARFIELD, UT
    June 24, 2014 11:26 a.m.

    Lost in all of this is Bishop Harrison. Here is a man called to lead his Ward. He puts in long hours and has no compensation for it. He must sacrifice time with his family to serve. On top of that, he had this agonizing decision placed upon him.

    His letter is a wonderfoul example of love and correction, which is exactly what Jesus did so often in the New Testament. Bishop Harrison is a Judge in Israel. Having sat with my bishop in a few council, and seeing his agony, I can only imagine how hard this process has been on this good Bishop.

    Thank you, Bishop, for your dedicated service to the Lord and the members of your Ward!!!!

  • Twin Lights Louisville, KY
    June 24, 2014 11:11 a.m.

    The Scientist,

    I am glad you have those friendships and familial ties. Clearly those faithful folks find that, on balance, the blessings outweigh the burdens.

  • Flashback Kearns, UT
    June 24, 2014 11:10 a.m.

    Sonia Johnson used the media to plead her case and shame the Church. Look what it got her.

  • Midwest Mom Soldiers Grove, WI
    June 24, 2014 11:08 a.m.

    I believe that God ordains only men to the priesthood for a very important reason; they need it and the world needs for them to have it.

    It is a natural division of duty. Women learn compassion and service from their divine role as mothers. If women had the priesthood, men would let them take care of the Church, as well as home stewardship. Many of my protestant friends have women clergy and the men in their congregations have receded into the background as merely observers of the faith, and no longer doers.

    The problem is that many men have seen the priesthood as a stamp of superiority and entitlement. They need to repent of that.

    I, for one, am glad that my husband has special meetings for him to attend. When he comes home, he usually says to me "can you see the boot print on my backside from the butt kicking I just got?" The duties of the priesthood humble him and remind him of the man he tries to be. Our family is truly blessed by the influence of the priesthood in our lives.

  • Flashback Kearns, UT
    June 24, 2014 10:59 a.m.

    Not any of our business that she got ex'd. That's her very preventable problem.

    I hope that sometime she goes and reads D&C 121. That section scares me an makes me realize that I have to be careful in how I deal with my family, others, and how I use my Priesthood. She appears to want the unrighteous dominion right at the beginning.

    Sad for her and her family.

    Ernest, I read nothing in the article that says her parents bullied her.

  • Ironeye Idaho Falls, ID
    June 24, 2014 10:58 a.m.

    I don't see how she can ever become a "son" of Abraham.

  • The Scientist Provo, UT
    June 24, 2014 10:54 a.m.

    "Kate Kelly has LOST an endless list of unspeakable blessings and freedoms this day!"

    Like what? Endless? Really?

    I have been a "non-member" attending LDS meetings and activities with my LDS wife for three decades. I am unable to give prayers or talks, unable to hold positions and formal "callings" (although I've helped clean buildings, done service projects, helped with scouting, one canning assignments, etc.), not allowed to wear Temple garments, and some other things.

    The only thing I truly missed out on over the years was attending one of my children's temple wedding. But I have heard descriptions and it doesn't sound like I missed much at all.

    I have dear friends in the Church with whom I have had deep discussions, and they seem more burdened than "blessed" by trying to "keep up with the Smiths" and keep up appearances, and give the appearance of superior worthiness so as to get called to more impressive positions.

    I don't think many LDS members truly appreciate how rich, fulfilling, and "blessed" life can be "outside" of the Church.

  • JLFuller Boise, ID
    June 24, 2014 10:45 a.m.

    It sounds like the bishop just reached the end of his rope and had no other options. Difficult people are unreasonable because often they see themselves as victims, something Kelly obviously believed about herself. She is not the first person to take that path and will not be the last.

  • Creeper51 Bountiful, UT
    June 24, 2014 10:38 a.m.

    Kann

    You're right you never did say that leadership wasn't necessary, however this is what you did say.

    "Those who follow a man or “priesthood” have a religion but they don’t have a relationship with God.

    Now you'll have to explain to me why Christ laid his hands on the heads of his apostles to give them his priesthood, is a man such as Peter isn't important with his priesthood (given to him directly by our Lord and Savior) What real need do we have for leadership in any church? If we all can cultivate a saving relationship just through Christ, what need is there for a proper baptism? Christ did everything the way the Father would have done it, That includes passing his priesthood to his worthy male leaders of his church. It is a practice that continues to this day in his earthly kingdom.

  • GeekUSA76 Lehi, UT
    June 24, 2014 10:38 a.m.

    Twin Lights,

    Don't get me wrong, It's not that I'm sad for Kate exclusively. I'm sad that there is such disregard for Kate by members of the church. Have you even stopped to think about Kate as a person rather than the sum of her actions (right/wrong)? What 'apostacy' was she committing? She felt that women should be ordained to the priesthood. SO WHAT? Was she laying hands on women ordaining them to the priesthood? No. Was she claiming to have the priesthood? No. Was she asking for 'executive' callings in the church? No. Was she claiming that the Church had gone astray? No. She had a hope that she would be heard and that her concern, and others who felt the same, would be validated and that a discussion be opened on this topic. I know most LDS people can't handle diverging thought and discussion. But without diverging thought, action, and a prayer by a 14 year old boy who didn't agree with religions convention there may not have been a priesthood to discuss. Maybe I should be excommunicated because I rejected the FP's counsel and didn't have FHE last night?

  • Bountiful Guy Bountiful, UT
    June 24, 2014 10:31 a.m.

    From the Ordain Women website:

    "As a group we intend to put ourselves in the public eye and call attention to the need for the ordination of Mormon women to the priesthood."

    This says it all. I believe that for most on all sides of this concern, this is truly a sad day for someone brought on my the actions Ms Kelly. All members of the church would welcome your return with loving arms encircling you, Kate. Imagine one day being welcome in His Holy Temple again. No day will be looked on with greater favor from our God and His Son.

  • ImABeliever Provo, UT
    June 24, 2014 10:24 a.m.

    None of this should be any of our business. This is the business of the Local Church Authorities, Katy Kelly and God.

  • FredEx Salt Lake, Ut
    June 24, 2014 10:10 a.m.

    Regardless of whether you agree with Ms. Kelly, this is clearly a case of her wanting attention. She has sought every opportunity to be on TV. She continues to feed the media with more sordid details. Sending the media copies of her private letters from the church shows her true intent: to gain attention. She even said so herself when asked about the ticket request to the priesthood session: she said this was an effort to draw attention.

    I supposed it can be very intoxicating to have the media and supporters heaping praise and attention on you. It certainly appears to me that the attention was far more important to her than actually following the counsel of those she claimed to sustain.

  • regis Salt Lake City, UT
    June 24, 2014 10:02 a.m.

    I just can't help but feel that the attitudes, methods and tactics of Kate Kelly and her organization are very similar to the attitudes, methods and tactics that were used by dissenters during that period referred to as the war in heaven.

  • TheProudDuck Newport Beach, CA
    June 24, 2014 10:00 a.m.

    The Church is not a democracy, but it is nevertheless true that not all change comes from the top down. Members (and even outsiders, as in the case of polygamy and Church racial doctrine) do have the power to influence the leadership to change teachings, and have successfully done so on multiple occasions.

    But you can't be too obviously adversarial about it. Starting a formal group, and holding media-driven street-theater events, positions you too much like an opponent and not a loyal opposition. And then the Church can't afford to give in to you, because it has so much invested in the appearance that it is not influenced by anything but direct revelation.

  • Owl Salt Lake City, UT
    June 24, 2014 9:57 a.m.

    Ms. Kelly, start your own church and you can make all of the doctrinal decisions.

  • Sparrow Surprise, AZ
    June 24, 2014 9:57 a.m.

    I am surprised at the arrogance of the responses regarding Katie Kelly. On the one hand I don't think she should necessarily continue to push for what it appears the majority of the women in the church do not want. On the other hand, she is not committing a sin by any stretch of the imagination. They said Katie Kelly's conduct has been contrary to the laws and order of the church. What laws? What order? Apparently everyone has forgotten that there were female prophet's in the Old Testament. Something happened that they were not longer holding that office, but it was not unheard of.

  • Samwise Eagle Mountain, UT
    June 24, 2014 9:44 a.m.

    The saddest part is I think she, at least partially, wanted this to happen. She is even now using it to further her cause, by going to the press and publicizing it. Rather than humbly accepting that she did wrong by the church in her recruiting people to a cause directly in opposition to a teaching and policy of the Church, she is pridefully using it to try to further her cause. She is even lying about the effect it will have, saying it is removing her from her congregation etc. The email she made public even says she is still invited to come to Church. No one would have even known about this (except a select few) if she had not decided to use this.

    One more thing, contrary to comments on here from some anti-Mormons, she was not excommunicated for questioning. She was not excommunicated merely for holing that belief. She was excommunicated for directly going against the church and aggressively recruiting others to a cause that could lead others to losing faith in the Church. Every Church (every organization for that matter) has the right to protect their beliefs, principles, and/or teachings.

  • Craig Clark Boulder, CO
    June 24, 2014 9:38 a.m.

    JohnCohen,

    "....No where does it say that women cannot be ordained--it isn't doctrine. It is an outdated policy."
    ______________________________

    In the early Christian Church, there were documented cases of women deacons and priests. A tradition of an exclusively male priesthood emerged under the early Popes and developed into Church doctrine. There is no scriptural basis for such a gender restriction. The current controversy surrounding Kate Kelly’s cause illustrates the extent to which the LDS Church is more a product of orthodox Christian tradition than the restored Church it proclaims itself to be.

  • DeepintheHeart Lewisville, TX
    June 24, 2014 9:37 a.m.

    I'm afraid ordination of women was only the tip of the iceberg for OW. It doesn't take much imagination to think where she and others might next focus their efforts to remove what they believe is sexism. There seems to be affinity with the LGBT community and gay marriage among Kelly's followers (active homosexuals, not just those with same-sex attraction.) Some Mormon feminists have attacked the temple as a place where inequality is taught (which I do not accept.) She and her group were wrong in the attempt to proselytize, but they are just as wrong in the "questions" they are asking and the doubts they are attempting to cultivate.

  • Mick61 UK, 00
    June 24, 2014 9:37 a.m.

    I feel rather sad to here about Kelly but it's obvious that she does not understand revelation and how the Lord works and conducts His affairs. It is the Lord she is fighting against not the Church as such and I personally would not like to be in her shoes. But saying that His arms are always open and we have the rest of this life to repent. Unfortunately we don't know when our mortal life will be brought to an end. All through the scriptures there is no mention of women priesthood but women hold a very special place in the Lord's eyes and they have a more important role to fulfill in this life. I believe that women do more in this church than in any other even though there are female clergy in other religions. They do in fact play a vital in the smooth running of the church.

    I hope she comes back into full fellowship for I believe that time is running out.

  • Tekakaromatagi Dammam, Saudi Arabia
    June 24, 2014 9:34 a.m.

    @The Real Maverick:

    "Let this be a lesson to others who desire to overrule those called to receive revelation for the church. No matter how loud you are, how popular you become, and how many cameras you seek out, you cannot overrule the church's inspired leadership."

    Blind, unquestioning, strident, obedience to church leaders is just as dangerous to the soul as open, rebellion.

    I think that your glee with her being excommunicated is out of order.

  • jsf Centerville, UT
    June 24, 2014 9:33 a.m.

    There is a far cry difference from set apart to do a task and ordained to the priesthood. Joseph Fielding Smith provides a very clear understanding of the subject.

  • swallowjuctice St George, UT
    June 24, 2014 9:25 a.m.

    As I've researched the Mormon church and been meeting with a couple of Mormon missionaries, I've had several questions. This issue with Miss Kelly brings up one again: Do Mormon doctrines change? The missionaries seam to believe they don't.

  • Uncle_Fester Niskayuna, NY
    June 24, 2014 9:25 a.m.

    Well duh. How is this is news? It seems more like the logical conclusion to her course of action.

  • Wellhellothere Idaho Falls, ID
    June 24, 2014 9:22 a.m.

    I heard her interviewed on a radio station here in my town a couple of weeks ago. She said that no one in leadership in her ward or stake had attempted to talk to her about her "issues". I felt sorry for her. She seemed so sincere. I don't believe in her cause at all, but her interview softened my heart towards her. I felt that she was sincere, but misguided. When it was documented that she had met with her ward and stake leaders, and that she was actually put on church probation, I felt lied too. No more sympathy from me! She is a human rights lawyer and activist. Perhaps she may be thinking that if she actually got the church to change its position that she would be the greatest human rights lawyer ever in the history of all mankind! This is not the last we have heard from her, that's for sure. Media outlets will be seeking interviews with her and her followers for many General Conferences, especially priesthood sessions, in the future...and yet, we will go forward!

  • wa1den Sandy, UT
    June 24, 2014 9:17 a.m.

    I disagree with those insisting, "all she did was ask". Absolutely NOT TRUE. The bishop's letter makes that clear. As evident in his counsel to her, there's a terrible difference between asking a question versus unwillingness to accept the answer, insisting on openly and actively provoking negative attention on the church, and attempting to recruit as many others as possible to follow your disregard for answers formally and appropriately given, despite direct counsel to not do so. Such defiance surely indicates lack of any belief or conviction that church leadership is inspired and have the blessing and approval of God, and if you feel that way and view the church as a social organization to be manipulated by popular vote and not as being governed by doctrine truly originating from God, why then would you want to be in the church? That's inherently contradictory. Nevertheless, as expressed by most, I agree that we should hold out hope that she may yet repent, set her life in order, and cease the efforts to gain attention and promote herself and the misguided cause she's been espousing.

  • AllBlack San Diego, CA
    June 24, 2014 9:08 a.m.

    Thankyou for publishing this article.

    It cleared up several questions I had over this matter....(I wish the church could actually make public some of its disciplinary councils especially those involving members who make their cases public, as in Kate Kelly case)

    Before this article all I read where disparaging commentary and arguments against the church.

    Now thanks to this article I can understand why they had to excommunicate her and what some of the reasoning behind that action was.

  • RBB Sandy, UT
    June 24, 2014 9:05 a.m.

    It is interesting that many assume that this decision will hurt the ability of the Church to reach out to non-members. It is apparent that KK has tried to use negative publicity against the Church for her benefit. However, I think the result will be just the opposite. Many Christian churches are struggling. They change abandon their doctrine to try and reach more people and it has the opposite effect.

    Most people who are baptized are looking for something more. They do not want a social club where a vocal minority can change the rules. They want to belong to an organization where the Lord sets the rules and we strive to live up to them.

    While I am sorry for KK that she has elected to leave the church, I am not sorry for the Church. There are enough antis outside the Church that we do not need more inside the Church fostering contention. Hopefully she will have a change of heart. Based on experience, however, I doubt it. Just like Sonia Johnson, she has earned her feminist bona fides - which is apparently what she really wanted.

  • Goddess Divine Orem, UT
    June 24, 2014 8:54 a.m.

    I did not know the church was ex-communicating several members until this issue with Kelly happened. After I learned from Kelly I continued reading and I also learned about John Dehlin, then I read some more and learned other members were already ex-communicated the previous weeks for writing books, blogs, etc. I don't have all the details about the other cases.

    Anyway, I am glad Kelly made her case public; otherwise, I wouldn't have known any of this. I like to be informed about what happens in the church. I doubt anyone else would have informed us about these problems. I don't like to be in the dark. I also.like to know how the church treats its members. The church can preach any doctrines they want but if they don't live up to those doctrines, they loose credibility and trust with the public and its members. I already made the decision long time ago, I will not be part of any church or organization that mistreats people, regardless of if they are right or wrong.

  • Shimlau SAINT GEORGE, UT
    June 24, 2014 8:52 a.m.

    Ernest T. Bass: She did a LOT more than ask. she fomented rebellion, refused to listen to leadership, lied to the press about the actions, and, if she has truly been a member and done all she has said, then she knew where this would end up at the beginning. Also, where do you come up with "bullying of her parents" I'd admit that if that really happened, then it was terrible. but having had 2 of my children undergo church courts, I'll say that I was never told about it until those 2 children chose to tell me. I was never bullied or oppressed in any way, and if they (her parents) received any kind of feedback, it was likely due to Kate's own words and actions to the public press.

  • LivinLarge Bountiful, UT
    June 24, 2014 8:52 a.m.

    This was a no brainer for the Church leaders. Sedition is not and should not be tolerated in any organization that has standards, ethics, honor and integrity.

  • Zoniezoobie Mesa, AZ
    June 24, 2014 8:52 a.m.

    The mantle of membership in The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is not a cloak of comfort but rather a robe of responsibility. Our duty, in addition to saving ourselves, is to guide others to the celestial kingdom of God.—Thomas S. Monson.

  • goosehuntr Tooele, UT
    June 24, 2014 8:47 a.m.

    ON PRIESTHOOD.... The following is doctrine... It is from the Doctrine and Covenants Sec. 121
    After you finish reading this... tell me if the OW movement and its leader would merit any power from the priesthood under current attitudes. While they could have authority if ordained, they could have no power...QUOTE: 36 That the rights of the priesthood are inseparably connected with the powers of heaven, and that the powers of heaven cannot be controlled nor handled only upon the principles of righteousness.
    37 That they may be conferred upon us, it is true; but when we undertake to cover our sins, or to gratify our pride, our vain ambition, or to exercise control or dominion or compulsion upon the souls of the children of men, in any degree of unrighteousness behold, the heavens withdraw themselves; the Spirit of the Lord is grieved; and when it is withdrawn, Amen to the priesthood or the authority of that man." I would encourage anyone to read the rest of that section. AMEN... Now, Mrs. Kelly, hurry home, we are here and waiting to receive you again..for friends at first, are friends at last.

  • dmcvey Los Angeles, CA
    June 24, 2014 8:37 a.m.

    I think we all knew this was coming. Good for her for standing up for her beliefs whatever the cost.

  • Cinci Man FT MITCHELL, KY
    June 24, 2014 8:36 a.m.

    @JohnCohen

    You refer to the ordination of women by Joseph Smith. Please give your source. Tell us to what office they were ordained, and please tell us what priesthood leadership callings they were called to that warranted these ordinations. Thanks. Your information could be very enlightening.

  • Goddess Divine Orem, UT
    June 24, 2014 8:36 a.m.

    Even though I don't support Kelly to ordain women to the priesthood, I agree with her when she says women in the church should have equal rights. By this I mean women should be treated with respect and their concerns taken seriously. The priesthood is here to protect the weak and to serve, especially those sisters that are widowed and single who are more vulnerable. Instead of that, there have been several occasion in which women have been mistreated by men in the church in public places and when they try to find support and protection in their leaders, the offender becomes more important than the victim. They are instructed to forget about the issue and to forgive.

    While forgiveness is good, it doesn't have anything to do with being safe. When leaders find out from aggressive men, discipline should come right away to make it clear to the offender the church of Jesus Christ will not tolerate aggressive behavior against women or others. Until this is explained clearly to the brethren and until the brethren start living this principle, there will not be equal rights in the church for women.

  • BJMoose Syracuse, UT
    June 24, 2014 8:21 a.m.

    Rather than reading postings on local news sources, I've spent the last few hours looking at comments from out of state, national and international news sources. Google lists 12 off the top and has links to "explore in depth" that will take you to another 476 news postings on this story. They range from references to local intermountain outlets to national news services like NBC and USA Today to international sources like the BBC for example. The common thread as I have read thru a selection of the comments is the almost universal condemnation of the church for it's actions. The other thing I have noticed is the harshness of the comments. Those who think the comments found in local sources are extreme should sample some of the national and international ones and really get a dose of reality. It appears to me that the Mormon Church has a PR nightmare raging. It will be interesting to see what actions they take regarding it.

  • JediMormon Omaha, NE
    June 24, 2014 8:11 a.m.

    To Ernest T. Bass and others who have similar opinions: Kate Kelly openly defied counsel from her local leaders. The church is not a democracy. It's a theocracy. It's the Church of Jesus Christ, not the church of Kate Kelly. Jesus Christ is the head of the church. We don't choose our leaders. Yes, we raise hands in church to "sustain" certain people who have received callings to act in certain capacities (i.e. Sunday school teacher, librarian, Elders quorum president, etc.) but the raising of hands is not a vote of whether that person should occupy the position or not. It is a confirmation that we will support the person in their calling. Kate Kelly crossed the line when she left the questioning phase of her beliefs and began actively promoting them.

    I sincerely hope that she can come to her senses and realize what she's done. Only then can the repentance process begin.

  • JBQ Saint Louis, MO
    June 24, 2014 7:50 a.m.

    This is a doctrinal issue. The acknowledgement that she is an "international human rights attorney" who moved to Provo, Utah should have sent up "hurricane warnings".

  • kranny utah, UT
    June 24, 2014 7:50 a.m.

    As in the past, this will only strengthen the church, though it will try the character of some. We're here to be purged, not pacified.

  • JohnCohen Buena Vista, VA
    June 24, 2014 7:46 a.m.

    Those that are happy to see her get exed completely miss the point. Rejoicing in another's condemnation is pretty messed up. Also, those who say that she opposed Church doctrine don't understand Church doctrine. Joseph Smith ordained women. The modern Church is getting the doctrine wrong, not Kate Kelly. Ally Isom admitted it to Doug Fabrizio. No where does it say that women cannot be ordained--it isn't doctrine. It is an outdated policy.

  • mightyhunterhaha Kaysville, UT
    June 24, 2014 7:45 a.m.

    @ Ernest T. Bass

    There is plenty of room for discourse know facts before talking. Since you brought up parents; if parents say no you don't keep harping on parents it does not help your cause. To be a member of the church you sustain your church leaders. You do not try and speak for the church. Your don affiliate with groups that go against the teachings of the church. This isn't open to go with the whims of individuals. If whims were followed Ninaveh would have been destroyed because that's what Jonah wanted to see. If you don't like organized religion fine you don't have to but don't try and tell any religion what their doctrine should be or how they should follow their doctrine.

  • PLM Kaysville, UT
    June 24, 2014 7:43 a.m.

    One cannot stand against God and succeed. The former missionary in question might recall the account of another attorney, Zeezrom, who rallied the people of his time against the prophet. Alma and Amulek were beaten and imprisoned and the believers, their women and children were burned to death and their records destroyed.

    Simply "questioning" the authorities produced dire results in this case. Happily in the end, Zeezrom was saved. I hope Ms. Kelly too finds the Lord, and I certainly hope the backlash from her malcontent does not injure the innocent.

  • pragmatistferlife salt lake city, utah
    June 24, 2014 7:27 a.m.

    Inspector C. I wouldn't expect you to understand or agree.

    You say "no longer free to use her agency within the auspices of the Church; etc. "

    Better said she is no longer obligated to do what she is told by the men in her life. Agency "in the church" is simply the ability to agree or not agree and if you disagree, you will likely suffer consequences of their choosing.

    "Kate Kelly has LOST an endless list of unspeakable blessings and freedoms this day!" What she's lost is her association with the Mormon church. She may or may not view that association as a blessing..her choice. To describe this loss of association as a loss of freedoms however is pure delusional.

  • Cinci Man FT MITCHELL, KY
    June 24, 2014 7:24 a.m.

    I am another who is deeply saddened by what KK has chosen to embrace. It not only affects her, but her family, especially innocent children, friends, associates, descendants, contacts from her mission, fellow missionaries, that many who follow this story, and the others who have joined her organized attack on the very priesthood she seeks. After reading her legal brief, I stand in complete disbelief that she is proud of herself for submitting that document to her former bishop. Really, Kate? A legal brief offered as support in a disciplinary council that lambastes the priesthood process of Christ-like divine love? Taking on this agenda has resulted in a complete withdrawal of the Spirit. A lifelong church member who has been blessed with so much could not possibly be further away from thinking on the spiritual plane that you must have once had. I have seen this in people after inactivity in the church, but this is a time I have seen it pronounced in one who has remained active while embracing such a course of self destruction. I look forward to a joyful heart-tugging day when we hear that KK has returned. Please return, KK.

  • LittleStream Carson City, NV
    June 24, 2014 7:19 a.m.

    What a sad day for Kate Kelly. But one she had to know was coming by taking the path she did. I hope she does some serious thinking about who was guiding her actions. It certainly wasn't Heavenly Father. She needs to ask herself, what effect has this political stand had on her plan of salvation? She needs to read her church history. Other people have tried to take down the church of Jesus Christ, they have failed. I truly feel sorry for her Bishop. I know how deeply the Bishops love their flock. If it is any consolation, he did the right thing. I am a woman in this church and do not feel treated "less than". As a woman, I feel she has created strife where it need not be. The women of this church do wondrous work. I am happy I'm not Kate Kelly today. I would not want to wake up knowing that I was not a member of my church. So sorry for her.

  • Spas Ivins, UT
    June 24, 2014 7:01 a.m.

    Most religions thrive on men telling women what to do. Goes to the male superiority complex. How sad for all concerned.

  • kolob1 sandy, UT
    June 24, 2014 6:48 a.m.

    This excommunication gives credence to the entire anti-mormon world. It vividly demonstrates the real differences with this 1830 religion that has never really come out into the 21 st century. Non mormons all over the US have already fought and won most of the battles for equality of the sexes. To have this Church stand up and take this struggle back into the 1800s is very revealing and extremely damaging to the LDS Church. especially coming so close on the heels of the Mormon Moment, aka Mitt Romney. If you ever wondered if Mitt Romney would run for President again wonder no more.

  • Mrs lds Uk, 00
    June 24, 2014 6:18 a.m.

    Ms kelly clearly has not grasped the concept within the lds faith of present day revelation. This is not a question about doctrine but an obvious claw for power and agitating the church with her demands on her terms. God speaks via his prophet. . If she was sincere she would pray about her dilemma. She would approach her bishop who would give her sound advice . The new york times gave her a platform to voice her opinions and her opinions only.
    Wishing her and her family well especially her spouse

  • Mtn. Man Bedford, WY
    June 24, 2014 6:02 a.m.

    This action should stand as an example to other women in the OW movement. To openly and publicly work to convert others to positions against the official doctrine of the Church, will eventually lead you out of the Church...either by your choice or by excommunication. Either one costs the person involved the loss of the greatest blessings available to members of the Church. I certainly hope others will learn from this tragic choice this woman has made.

  • JustGordon Cottonwood Heights, UT
    June 24, 2014 5:40 a.m.

    Hard to believe that two church disciplinary committees almost simultaneously considering the possibility of excommunication to two individuals are independent and without direction.

  • InspectorC Wasatch Front, UT
    June 24, 2014 1:14 a.m.

    @ Pragmatistferlife, 7:55 PM, 6/23 ---

    You said: "The good news sister, you are now free. Free to be a woman, free to be a human, free to be a leader. ...Trust me this is the best day of your life."

    Reply: If you are LDS, and truly understand the doctrines and policies of the Church, then I'm afraid you are blindly following the same misguided path that Sister Kelly sadly was on!

    This was without doubt the WORST day in eternity for Kate Kelly!

    And to falsely encourage her that now she is "free"?!? Sad.

    She is no longer "free" to attend the temple; no longer free to hold church callings; or to contribute tithes and offerings to the Kingdom; or to "bless" the lives of her family through Priesthood power; no longer free to use her agency within the auspices of the Church; etc. etc.; and no longer "free" to receive all the concomitant blessings associated with church membership!

    Kate Kelly has LOST an endless list of unspeakable blessings and freedoms this day! My heart is truly broken for her. How can you possibly be proud-of and happy-for her in light of this tragedy?

  • djofraleigh raleigh, NC
    June 24, 2014 12:54 a.m.

    On the one hand, how many non-members will now refuse to hear the missionaries because of this publicity and how many members will allow this controversy to put a wedge between them and the church?

    On the other hand, will the church one day be led by divine revelation to ordain women and would this controversy have helped that day to come.

  • sammyg Springville, UT
    June 24, 2014 12:39 a.m.

    Pretty interesting reading this evening. The commentary runs the gamut from those that know and understand LDS discipline and doctrine to those members that don't, to those outside the church that do and don't as well. Pretty amazing the amount of interest in this story.

    While I'm not at all surprised to hear of this woman's excommunication I am glad that it has occurred for her sake and as it signals the end of this topic in the coming days or weeks.

    Though it is sad that she chose this ending, it is of her own choosing. Yes, she could have chosen another outcome had she acted upon the counsel given to her previously.

    Being excommunicated will now give her two choices...

    1) a chance to really experience 'a broken heart and contrite spirit' if she misses the full fellowship of the church and to work on readmission OR
    2) more time to advance the OW agenda

    Sad to say that from her actions I would not be surprised that she chooses to continue on with OW.

    Poor choice.

    I hope she takes advantage of the rare opportunity she has... to start anew.

  • David Mohr Victoria/BC/Canada, 00
    June 24, 2014 12:25 a.m.

    I just finished watching "17 Miracles" and it moved me to tears. I was especially moved by the fact that every one of the miracles was performed by or came to the Sisters in the Handcart Company. The using of the priesthood power was fully displayed as available to women - there was no need for ordination to the priesthood. I suggest that Kelly return to the basics of our faith and rebuild her understanding and faith. And then return to the Church where we will welcome her back with open arms.

  • keepamericafree salt lake, UT
    June 23, 2014 11:54 p.m.

    It is sad that the general public as well as these ordain women founders are so confused about the priesthood and what it means. The priesthood is not a position of control or domination or power, it is a position of humble servitude. It is a responsibility and an obligation. Christ used the power of the priesthood to bless and heal the blind and the deaf and to raise the dead. Christ was a Servant! So the reality is that the priesthood is about service. Kelly is confused and what is more unfortunate is that she is misleading many with her determination to disparage and demonize the church.

  • MormonUte Centerville, UT
    June 23, 2014 11:52 p.m.

    I was excommunicated from the Church 20 years ago this week, for entirely different reasons than Kate Kelly, but I understand what it feels like. The one thing that was very different is that I knew that was the right decision in my case. It is quite simple. I had made solemn covenants in the Temple, and I violated those sacred promises. Although the Spirit had long since left me, there was a very real and tangible feeling the next day that I no longer had the Gift of the Holy Ghost. It took me 7 years for the reconvening of the Disciplinary Council. I was so eager to return that I was baptized that very night. I immediately knew that something wonderful had returned, that being the Gift of the Holy Ghost. A year later, my Priesthood and Temple blessings were restored, and I got engaged yo my wonderful wife that same day. I am still learning and growing, but I value my membership in the Lord's Church. It means so much to me, because it was hard to get back. I sincerely hope that Sister Kelly will repent. There is no greater joy!

  • worf Mcallen, TX
    June 23, 2014 11:41 p.m.

    Sorry Kate, but you don't make up the rules.

  • Brahmabull sandy, ut
    June 23, 2014 11:24 p.m.

    patriot

    "The Church Of Jesus Christ Of Latter Day Saints is not a political organization where lobbying and political pressure create change in doctrine any more than someone in Jesus's day doing the same thing."

    Funny, you must have forgot the reason that the church changed the doctrine of polygamy was so that they could become a state.

  • Brahmabull sandy, ut
    June 23, 2014 11:21 p.m.

    Vanceone

    You have been severely misled if you think that only men have held the priesthood for 7,000 years. Even in the early Mormon church women gave blessings by the laying on of hands, and thus, the priesthood. So no, that is not the case.

  • The Rock Federal Way, WA
    June 23, 2014 10:42 p.m.

    Excommunication is the beginning of the repentance process.
    She knew where her actions would take her. She refused to hearken to council. She attacked the church.

    Doesn't she know what it means to follow the Prophet?

    Feminism had become her religion.

  • Serenity Manti, UT
    June 23, 2014 10:33 p.m.

    Poor misguided woman. How sad to be separated from your Church and your God because you feel God was speaking personally to you to change His precepts. But you know, in your heart of hearts that what you did was wrong; that it was in direct violation of your temple covenants and that you were telling the Church of Jesus Christ that they are wrong. You expect them to change their ways because of your words and not regard the words of God and revelation. I've watched you, although not with true interest at first and then with horror because the path you were taking was paved for you by the adversary. The more your voice was heard, the braver you became and eventually the pride and self-justification which overtook your persona were not coming from God nor were they faith-strengthening or inspiring others in the faith. You will never be happy until you follow the guidance of your bishop and come back into the fold. Hear the voice of the Shepherd and come back into the safety of His love and into His fold. Please don't let the adversary lead you. Be humble; come back.

  • Globetrecker Arlington, va
    June 23, 2014 10:33 p.m.

    I saw this comment on one article and found it both insightful and interesting:

    "I am surprised to see so many people say that Kate Kelly hasn't done anything to lead people away from the church, and then admit that they themselves are considering leaving the Church. This is all a result of her actions, and by saying that you are leaving, you are showing how correct the Church has been on their stance. I'm sorry to see so many of my brothers and sisters hurting for disobedience and hope they take the opportunity to see why having an OW profile is sowing the seeds of apostasy and they humble themselves and come back."

    Having read this, I do wonder what the future holds for the current supporters of this group, now that the leader and founder has been excommunicated.Having an OW profile isn't worth losing ones membership or good standing over. I am hopeful there are some who seek to be humble and turn from these ways but I see so much anger and hard heartedness that I wonder what the future holds for them and their membership.

  • Freetochoose San Diego, CA
    June 23, 2014 10:31 p.m.

    She is free to choose and she did. That is all. Not a big deal.

  • Bountiful Guy Bountiful, UT
    June 23, 2014 10:29 p.m.

    I am very sad for the many saints in the Barcelona Mission who looked to Ms Kelly for direction. She testified of the priesthood, being from God. She testified of a living prophet to whom we should look for revelation pertaining to the whole church. She taught people to pray and then to listen humbly for answers. And then she chooses to launch a very public campaign calling for the ordination of women to the priesthood, so that they can be equal to men and have greater opportunities to serve in the highest councils of the church. She has no clue about the dozens of meetings held every month by committee after committee where many women take their rightful place and contribute in a most equal way to all present. Often times, the greatest input comes from those women. Women who are diligent, faithful, humble, and stalwart serve with the greatest distinction. But also equal to those women, are the primary workers, Young Women leaders, and Relief Society board members. All people are equal in God's eyes. He just asks us to lift where we stand. Every good thing matters equally.

  • RexWayne Idaho Falls, ID
    June 23, 2014 10:20 p.m.

    If she has a big desire to be ordained there are plenty of other churches she can join.
    Some churches even have female apostles.
    I do not know why women are not now ordained. I do know that some priesthood calling take a lot of time outside the home.
    Jesus had plenty of female friends but I never heard of a female apostle or 70 in the Church of Jesus Christ of Former-day Saints.

    "He will yet reveal many great and important things." (Article of Faith)
    Meekness and patience is a virtue.

  • Beulah South Jordan, UT
    June 23, 2014 10:19 p.m.

    Ms. Kelly's legal training may have informed her tactics but her arrogance did not permit her to think clearly - and remember that religion is not a democracy. And religious doctrine is not the same as a democracy's laws and rules. I don't buy Ms. Kelly's surprise at being threatened with excommunication. Anyone with common sense could see this coming a mile away.

  • Bountiful Guy Bountiful, UT
    June 23, 2014 10:09 p.m.

    @ Naval Vet

    "However, the tithing she will not pay, the talks she will not give, the callings she will not fulfill, and temple work that she will not do, will all be on the heads of those responsible for preventing her from fulfilling those obligations."

    Boy did you really miss the mark here. Ms Kelly is 100% responsible for this decision. She is the one who was completely aware that this was the inevitable consequence of her repeated actions against the church doctrines of priesthood and revelation for the church. No one but Ms Kelly, filled with pride, caused this sad outcome with far reaching consequences well beyond her.

  • StandAlone South Jordan, UT
    June 23, 2014 10:03 p.m.

    GameTheory

    The LDS church did not prevent her from speaking freely, that's something only a liberal would do. She spoke, and the LDS church listened. The problem is, it was she who did not listen. Limitless tolerance without consequences may be popular in the world we live in now, but it's not popular with the Lord. His ways do not change with the worldly wind. If this woman was a dedicated member as she has supposedly claimed herself to be, then she should also know that there is perfect order in God's house and in His ways. You can't just waltz in and start re-arranging His furniture any way you please. It looks to me like she has chosen all by herself which path to take.

  • nanato12 Spanish Fork, UT
    June 23, 2014 9:57 p.m.

    She made the decision, she therefore needs to accept the consequences. She obviously does not believe in following the leaders of the church. She needed to be excommunicated. If she wants the priesthood, go join another church that ordains women. The fact that it is a man-made priesthood and not from God probably won't make any difference to her.

  • wjalden Cottonwood Heights, UT
    June 23, 2014 9:56 p.m.

    "Sister Kelly is obviously a talented individual who has had success in her chosen field of endeavor, which I assume involves international human rights issues."

    Success? She graduated from law school only two years ago.

    That is what happens when you assume.

  • Twin Lights Louisville, KY
    June 23, 2014 9:53 p.m.

    GeekUSA76,

    I take no joy in this. I feel quite sad for her. And you are correct. She is our sister. But none of this excuses her teaching doctrine that the First Presidency and Quorum of Twelve have rejected. In such an instance, she had to know that excommunication was a real possibility.

  • LogicalPrime Rigby, ID
    June 23, 2014 9:46 p.m.

    Ever heard of Naaman? He's the guy in the bible who was asked to bathe in a dirty river seven times in order to cure his leprous skin. He refused, until his servant asked if he would have done some difficult task had it been asked of him.

    She was asked to do something relatively simple, but she put her foot down on the wrong rock. She was asked to put church policy back into God's hands (where it should belong) and she decided she knew better than God. The USA isn't supposed to compromise with terrorists, but sometimes it does. God, on the other hand, is not like that. God does not negotiate with people who place themselves at odds with Him.

  • Local Fan Aurora, CO
    June 23, 2014 9:41 p.m.

    Ms. Kelly,

    Could you be wrong? Simply wrong? Sometimes you can be so sure you are right, you run down that road of pride and arrogance without a thought to the opposite idea -- could you actually be wrong? Then you begin to do things to support your wrong idea, just to maintain it, because, in your pride, you must keep going with it. Admitting you are wrong would be humiliating. But that doesn't change that in the very beginning, you were wrong.

    Please come back. We will miss you.

    Deanna Tolman, Centennial, CO

    Deanna Tolman

  • Miss Piggie Phoenix, AZ
    June 23, 2014 9:37 p.m.

    @mayan elephant:
    "I hope that women and girls are allowed to advance in their lives and in the Church through promotions that are equal to boys."

    Are you kidding? Girls have the power to wrap boys around their little finger. They mostly don't comprehend until after puberty. They don't need the priesthood. In fact, the priesthood was given to males to bring them somewhat on par to females.

    @TheProudDuck:
    "The bishop had the responsibility to do what he believed God required him to do..."

    Too bad such a serious matter was left in the hands of amateurs. A professional coulda guided her toward the path to repentance.

    @GFuller:
    "I believe that if God intended for women to hold the priesthood He would have given it to Eve along with Adam."

    Maybe that's it... Eve ate the fruit against God's instruction and forfeited any leadership chances. Instead, she had to suffer childbirth (actually, I think something along those lines are in the Bible).

  • Globetrecker Arlington, va
    June 23, 2014 9:29 p.m.

    I am surprised to see so many people say that Kate Kelly hasn't done anything to lead people away from the church, and then admit that they themselves are considering leaving the Church. This is all a result of her actions, and by saying that you are leaving, you are showing how correct the Church has been on their stance.

    I'm sorry to see so many of my brothers and sisters hurting. But I am also incredibly grateful that pure doctrine has been upheld and false doctrine and false teachers have been disciplined to prevent further apostasy (hopefully).

  • souptwins Lindon, UT
    June 23, 2014 9:28 p.m.

    Kelly first asked her question in a public manner. She then made demands in public with her attempts to enter Priesthood session then protest with cameras in tow each time. The Church responded in public at the very meeting Kelly was demanding to attend since that appeared to be her forum of choice. The letter of excommunication was very well-written and made sure to detail the various attempts over several months to discuss the issue and be clear about the expectations & that the was not about "questions". It was Kelly who also chose to make the letter public. Had she merely asked questions in a private, adult setting with a humble heart ready to accept the answer from the beginning, none of us would be reading about it. Had she been simply curious about the priesthood session, she could have slipped in the back of any stake center and watched it. There are no bouncers at the door. Perhaps she was attempting to embarrass the church & lead others astray from the beginning. In which case, she did it so congratulations may be in order.

  • GeekUSA76 Lehi, UT
    June 23, 2014 9:16 p.m.

    I'm so surprised to see the reactions of my fellow Brothers and Sisters in the gospel regarding Kate Kelly's membership in the LDS Church. I've seen the following reactions... "Good!", "she got what she deserved", 'there is no room for her when all she wants is the attention', 'she should go start another church since she thinks she's receiving revelation for the entire church' and many more in that vein. What I can't figure out is where the Christlike love is for Kate. She is my sister. She is your sister. All of you who are leveling platitudes of grand approval of her excommunication are tearing me apart. This is going to ripple through every nation on this earth and so many families will be burdened with this 'flogging in the public forum of the internet'. I'm so sad for my friends who are not 'firm' in the faith like the 'strong faithful' Mormons who rejoice as one of their own family is kicked out of the house (kingdom). To you that are glad to see Sister Kelly go it would seem that you have your reward. I hope you enjoy it.

  • wjalden Cottonwood Heights, UT
    June 23, 2014 9:15 p.m.

    No love lost for the Church here, but Kate Kelly has never done anything that didn't make her sound either manipulative or unhinged. As a lawyer, she claimed "due process" entitled her to a disciplinary hearing in Utah, even though her "crimes" were committed while in her ward in Virginia. I'd wager that even if she had been offered a free airplane ticket, put up in the Ritz-Carlton and given a limo ride to the chapel, she would have turned it down.

    I really don't care for the ends the Church is being used for by its current leaders; I really can't grasp why so many Mormons put their money and faith and reveal their deepest secrets in "confession" to a church that reveals nothing in return. But Kelly is a non-believing leftist who wanted to change the Church to suit her own ends, which I don't really care for, either.

  • shc Cottonwood Heights, UT
    June 23, 2014 9:11 p.m.

    Sister Kelly is obviously a talented individual who has had success in her chosen field of endeavor, which I assume involves international human rights issues. I commend her for her work in an area which needs the involvement of high minded and talented persons. However, her training in the secular arena does not automatically qualify her for leadership in the Church. In that setting, spiritual leadership, not educational training, is paramount. In confusing her secular vocation with leadership in the Church she has disdained the counsel of her bishop and has sought to embarrass and discredit Church doctrine and Church leadership. Even more troubling have been her attempts to enlist others in her new-found crusade. Now she has the victory that she has likely sought; her name has been published in news releases across the globe. Unfortunately, most of these stories lionize her as an avant garde voice of the women of the Church. THAT she is not, but she shall attempt to recharacterize her excommunication as a stepping stone to ultimate triumph. This is a sad, sad result for which she bears full responsibility. I hope that she is sincere in warning others not to follow her example.

  • Miss Piggie Phoenix, AZ
    June 23, 2014 9:01 p.m.

    What she could do is start her own church. Many who've left the Mormon Church have. She'd make a fairly good prophetess.

  • bj-hp Maryville, MO
    June 23, 2014 8:58 p.m.

    Naval Vet: I would like to clarify something you seem to be missing and that is that what she received she basically walked right into it. The things you mentioned will not be on the heads of the Bishop nor anyone else but on her head. She is the one that took the stand and the stand that she failed to take the answer she was given. I take no joy in this as she once she started down this road started the seeds of apostasy. The Bishop really had no other choice given to him by Ms Kelly. Those of you outside the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints really have no say in this at all. What she did, she will have to answer for. Her actions are no different than Korihor or other apostates in the Book of Mormon or the Bible. Her actions and her actions alone got her excommunicated, nothing more and nothing less.

    When she finally comes to terms and gains an understanding of her actions she will realize the consequences of those actions. She will have to go through a very painful repentance process before she would be eligible for baptism.

  • conservative and proud Orem, UT
    June 23, 2014 8:50 p.m.

    All persons are children of God and God loves all of us, no matter who we are. However, there are the teachings of Christ, and there are the teachings of men. Ms. Kelly has decided to follow the world rather than the Lord. This reminds me, over and over again, of all the times this happened in the Book of Mormon, with the same consequences. She had her day on her Rameumpton as did prior apostates. As with the War in Heaven, the outcome is the same, no matter how much we want to change it. She chose to refight that battle, and lost, as did Satan. Still, we should love her, and care for her, as God still loves her. She will still be in one of the Savior's "many mansions," however, it simply will not be the one she most wanted.

  • GameTheory Salt Lake City, UT
    June 23, 2014 8:36 p.m.

    @Old Navy

    Get her life in order? what do you mean? is there something wrong with speaking up for what you believe in? is there something wrong with being a humans rights attorney? Having a kind and loving family? life in order, yeah she should really get her life in order because she really is on the path to outer darkness. Im glad at least the church order of super vip guys is making sure her life is in order by… by… wait how are they getting her life in order again?

  • GameTheory Salt Lake City, UT
    June 23, 2014 8:32 p.m.

    Heaven forbid you have freedom of speech in the church. Heaven forbid you speak your mind. I mean thats just not ok in any situation, except for in the United States of America… oh wait...

    "You are entitled to your views, but you are not entitled to promote them and proselyte others to them while remaining in full fellowship in the church. ... Your disregard of our advice and counsel left us no alternative but to convene last night's council."

    hmmm, i just , hmmm, wow i mean uh, go America? er i mean uh yay for Christ? no no, cheers to church correlation, yeah thats it, way to go correlation!….. hmmm somethings not right.

  • Cats Somewhere in Time, UT
    June 23, 2014 8:23 p.m.

    She was clearly determined to push the Church to the point that they had no choice but to excommunicate her. This is very obviously the outcome she wanted. She knew from the start that she would NEVER be ordained. She was determined to try to damage the Church.

    This is tragic for her and I hope she will eventually realize what she has lost and repent. Throwing away the fullness of the truth will NEVER succeed. "Wickedness never was happiness."

    The Church will continue in its divine mission and will not be thwarted from it. God will not be mocked.

    I truly hope she will change her path and return. She will be welcomed with open arms.

  • Baron Scarpia Logan, UT
    June 23, 2014 8:15 p.m.

    Very sad. I'm not LDS, so I can't say that I fully understand the social, political, and religious implications of excommunication. How can men's judgment on earth have any impact on what God decides beyond this world?

    However, I do know that OC Tanner's daughter, Carolyn, left the Mormon faith, eventually became ordained in the Episcopal Church, and then became the Bishop of Utah (similar to a stake president from what I'm told). Most Christian faiths now ordain women, and women clergy are quite common, even here in Utah.

  • postaledith Freeland, WA
    June 23, 2014 8:09 p.m.

    Thank you for your comment, Ernest T. Bass. Yours is the only one I liked. The only one with any compassion.

  • Past Utahn Aurora, CO
    June 23, 2014 8:04 p.m.

    Does this now mean that the hundreds of "temple recommend" holders that have followed Ms. Kelly will now need to be invited to their own respective disciplinary council? Isn't the question something like: "Do you support, affiliate with, or agree with any group or individual whose teachings or practices are contrary to or oppose those accepted by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?"?

  • pragmatistferlife salt lake city, utah
    June 23, 2014 7:55 p.m.

    All male jury..what a surprise. The good news sister, you are now free. Free to be a woman, free to be a human, free to be a leader.

    Trust me this is the best day of your life.

  • conservative and proud Orem, UT
    June 23, 2014 7:53 p.m.

    A sad day, but a day which had to happen. We have our agency, can choose as we desire, however, we do not have the right to choose the consequences for those choices.

  • gmlewis Houston, TX
    June 23, 2014 7:52 p.m.

    It is tragic that Sister Kelly chose this path, but she will always be our sister. We can pray for her and those who have been influenced by her.

  • justpatti Oceanside, CA
    June 23, 2014 7:50 p.m.

    Wow! So much for "inclusion". Did anyone bother to pay attention to Ally Isom's interview? As a representative of the LDS Church's PR Department, she made it very clear that The Church has a policy of not discussing such matters in public. Really? Guess all rules only apply when someone chooses to apply them. And, oh by the way, the way the who process was handled was completely contrary to the (sacred, ahem) "handbook". I'm not saying Kelly was right or wrong in her approach. I have experienced those in authority in the church who had a much more negative affect on the lives of decidedly more people and they continue to hold offices and exercise unrighteous dominion. This very public event will prove to be sadly more divisive in families than gay marriage...and it will be next.
    Be careful about those Temple Interview questions folks. Next you'll be asked about your position on all kinds of issues...and then to whom will you complain? The Bishop? Nerp...he's the one with the power to take away your membership, sisters.

  • Old Navy Provo, UT
    June 23, 2014 7:49 p.m.

    Wraith, I for one am not laughing. This is tragic. I just hope that she can make peace with all of this and get her life in order.

  • Aaron1122 king, WA
    June 23, 2014 7:44 p.m.

    The priesthood isn't something you can demand, bought, or shame others into giving you. The Lord doesn't play politics. Sadly, she doesn't really know what it is, where it came from, or what it represents.

  • Timboy09 USA , TX
    June 23, 2014 7:31 p.m.

    I disagree with what some people are saying. Did the bishopric seriously attempt to counsel her about the issue? They waited for her to move to Utah first before they called the hearing. Again, I don't know how much notice she had if the hearing date, but it's awfully fishy.

    Apostasy? Or an opinion? She probably didn't need to convince the women who support her. They already thought what they thought and now they have a spokesman, whoops, spokeswoman.

  • OnlyInUtah Cottonwood Heights, UT
    June 23, 2014 7:13 p.m.

    Her question became a demand and she refused to accept the answer she was given. She then turned from the Lord's will and followed her own. It's sad that she deceived even herself. I pray that she will someday understand the seriousness of her actions, humble herself before God, repent and return to full fellowship in the church.

    Her soul needs prayerful help.

  • Monsieur le prof Sandy, UT
    June 23, 2014 7:08 p.m.

    Those that understand the immutable doctrine of Christ's church and the eternal priesthood will understand the excommunication of this sister. Those who believe that religion and churches are like clubs whose policies can change at the whim of its members will never comprehend eternal laws that lead to exaltation and will continue to complain about "lack of discourse," when the facts show that there was, indeed, much communication and counsel given...and ignored.

  • Francis LeGuarde Sandy, UT
    June 23, 2014 7:02 p.m.

    Women often make incredible leaders. Unfortunately, Kate Kelly hasn't shown great leadership. Her excommunication, while sad, is no surprise. Apart from her significant doctrinal disconnect, Kelly's advocacy was publicly confrontational, adversarial and embarrassing to the LDS Church. However well-intentioned, it never had a chance. If anything, it drowned-out more constructive dialogue.

    Contrast Kelly's approach to someone like Salt Lake County Mayor Ben McAdams. As a state senator, he quietly helped persuade the LDS Church to support a controversial non-discrimination ordinance. How did McAdams build church support for LGBT protections during a heated same-sex marriage battle? He didn't try to publically shame or pressure church leaders. He didn't picket Temple Square. Speaking about his approach in the Deseret News, he said, "I usually find that when I listen to others, we can find common ground." And he did. So have many others.

    There are many important women's issues for the church to discuss — many of them cultural, not doctrinal; members who take a less public, ham-handed approach will make a far greater difference than Kelly or her group.

  • kann ferron, UT
    June 23, 2014 7:00 p.m.

    Creeper51,

    Just don't have enough room here to say all I wanted to say. However, I never said anything about leadership not being necessary. Please be clear on my point. The Priesthood is the salvation of the LDS church. Just look at some of the comments of your people. It's sad, but it's your choice to follow men. I prefer to follow Jesus Christ who does greater things then any man ever has. Good luck with believing in men.

  • OKWalker Duncan, OK
    June 23, 2014 6:47 p.m.

    Eternity is a wonderful thing. The Priesthood is a wonderful thing. Love is the center and essence of both. Disciplinary Councils are the most inspiring and love filled meetings in the Church. I have seen amazing outpourings of Christ's love and even miracles during such councils in the course of my modest service in the Church. The fact that Ms. Kelly chose to advertise the fact of her council but not attend, speaks volumes about her apostasy from the Church. The fact she sent a legal brief and 1000s of letters from supporters illustrates exactly what her priorities are: legal sophistry and popularity. The Bishop was exactly right in the Lord's decision that he confirmed. I am equally confident that the Savior greatly loves Ms. Kelly and yearns for the opportunity to share His indescribable love with her. No one who is the recipient of such love can forget it. Everyone who experiences it knows it is worth the cost of every change we must make to become like the Savior. Yes, the Savior does love Ms. Kelly and will respond to her sincere desires to change.

  • The Wraith Kaysville, UT
    June 23, 2014 6:44 p.m.

    Again I see post after post showing happiness and joy about this decision. I can tell you from an outsider perspective it's more than creepy to see so much joy over this woman's excommunication. I thought in mormon circles this was supposed to be a bad thing. Why are so many of you happy about it? Why are so many of you excited that this has happened to her? If you truly believed in your religion shouldn't you be saddened? I read a few posts where some of you are indeed unhappy but the vast majority seem like a pack of hyenas circling wounded prey overjoyed with the pain and suffering this woman is experiencing. It's not just off putting, it's down right disturbing.

  • Kora Cedar Hills, UT
    June 23, 2014 6:44 p.m.

    Why do so many commenting on here seem to think that God is suppose to change with the times and changing moral views of certain sects of society? When did God start bending to our will instead of the other way around?
    If you believe The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints is the Church led by our Heavenly Father's chosen Prophets and Apostles here on the Earth, as I do, why would you expect it to change with the whims of society? Why do you think God would have a survey or hold an election to decide what his doctrines are? Does that make any sense at all? So as one post stated that religion does not follow "reason", what level of reason says that we tell God what his doctrine is?

    Stormageddon- Why could she not return to Virginia? She always seemed to find a way to travel from Virginia to Utah to protest at Conference, but could not go the opposite direction for this council. We see what her priorities were.

    Kann- what were Paul and the Apostles doing after Christ when they preached and taught doctrine? Who wrote Hebrews from which you quote?

  • Bifftacular Spanish Fork, Ut
    June 23, 2014 6:42 p.m.

    I wonder if Kate has considered joining with the Episcopalian church? And if not, why not? They have women clergy which is exactly what Kate seems to be itching for. If she can't or won't conform with the teachings of the LDS church, I think she should seriously consider that religion. It might be the perfect match for her.

  • cambodia girl Phnom Penh, Cambodia
    June 23, 2014 6:42 p.m.

    I really hope she starts her own church. She will be able to have what she wants, include and change any doctrines that suit her whim, and she will be very happy. Her "followers" will be happier also because they will be free from the oppression that they feel. What a great day for Ordain Women!

  • 10CC Bountiful, UT
    June 23, 2014 6:41 p.m.

    I just noticed the fairly precise headline, "LDS bishop excommunicates..."

    This is a smart move by the Church, because if this story blows up in a big way and has a sharply negative effect, the Church can emphasize the discipline was administered by local church authorities, providing the option for a benevolent reversal by higher authorities.

    Also, a more tolerant stance on these comments by the D-News is noted, as many posts I previously assumed would not make the cut actually show up here! Bravo! (Sincerely)

  • manaen Buena Park, CA
    June 23, 2014 6:40 p.m.

    I don't agree with Kate Kelly but I must congratulate her on a flawless campaign. She worked hard earn this and was a model of persistence. She took control of the situation and made certain at every turn that there would be no other result.

  • Bountiful Guy Bountiful, UT
    June 23, 2014 6:34 p.m.

    I would never celebrate the loss of a person's membership. It is truly a very sad day she has chosen for herself, her family, and her posterity. Eternal life, temple privileges, covenants, priesthood blessings, and church membership mean less to Ms Kelly than her cause. The scriptures that come to mind exposing her apostasy are several. It is indeed sad, but it is a consequence of stubbornness, disobedience, disrespect, pride, and dishonor for the very priesthood she seeks. I hope that the few other sisters who have been misled will come to their senses very soon and seek for answers in the correct way, the way Ms Kelly knows but is unwilling to follow. I hope for the day when Ms Kelly returns. She will always be welcome, once she understands that no blessing in God's kingdom will be denied her. She can again lift where she has stood and all is valued equally to God when she does so.

  • 79Ute Orange County, CA
    June 23, 2014 6:20 p.m.

    @Instereo:

    The places I see questions raised, discussed, answered sometimes but admitting we don't know all the answers at other times, are in they most obvious places: Sunday School classes, Priesthood and Relief Society meetings, in the halls and foyers, at the dinner table, in the living room with home teachers and visiting teachers, around the camp fire with YM and YW, etc.

    Almost all of us have questions almost every day. There is almost no place where sincere seekers of answers aren't free to talk about doubts. In the Church I've attended all my life one simply has to raise one's hand to raise questions and doubts. That activity is not limited to social media.

    Another good place: on one's knees with a humble heart and a contrite spirit.

  • grandmagreat Lake Havasu City, AZ
    June 23, 2014 6:19 p.m.

    What a sad day for this woman and her family. Something she did, brought it all on, however the great principle of the gospel will make it possible if she changes her ways, and follows the teachings and principles of the gospel, she could be re-baptized and have the blessings that she originally had. It saddens me as her sister in the Gospel, that she made the decisions that caused her to loose the blessings of membership, instead of providing the hours she used to help build up the kingdom and serve others in her area that might need some help with food, clothing, housing or just a good friend to talk to. This effects her whole family. I have been a Relief Society President when the Bishop of our ward was excommunicated, so I do know how much sadness and heartache comes with this action. However, i know that his weeknesses were making it very difficult for them, and it was something they all had to experience. May the Lord bless this sister and help her find her way back into the gospel.

  • Commonman HENDERSON, NV
    June 23, 2014 6:17 p.m.

    The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is not a corporation. Ministers are not hired and not paid. They are called. If the Church is the Church Christ established then it is led by Prophets and apostles called by him. In this case, Mrs. Kelly has repeatedly and deliberately refused to follow Christ's servants. Why should she remain in the church if she feels this way? If it is not Christ's Church, then Sister Kelly suffered no harm. She is free to start her own church and ordain who she will. In either case, affiliation with the Church is voluntary. No one forced Mrs. Kelly to make covenants and she may not force others to accept her opinion as inspired. I hope she can see that her course hurts only herself and those who insist on promoting her views. I hope she can repent and return.

  • Creeper51 Bountiful, UT
    June 23, 2014 6:17 p.m.

    Kann,

    I would suggest you take a quick peek at Epesians 4: 11-13 KJV. Pretty compelling stuff about how Christ himself selected Apostles and Prophets to lead and unify the body of Christ, his church.

  • Lloyd.Smith Salt Lake, UT
    June 23, 2014 6:09 p.m.

    I feel so blessed to be guided by living prophets. I sincerely hope that Kate will listen to their words and return to the Gospel of Jesus Christ. I know that his heart aches to lose another one of his beloved sheep. May we use this time to realign ourselves to the one who loves all men and women equally.

  • patriot Cedar Hills, UT
    June 23, 2014 6:08 p.m.

    re:Baccus0902

    "I'm sure she took the best decision with the information she had."

    Had Kate read Elder Oaks talk in the recent General Priesthood meeting then she would have certainly "had" all the information she needed to make a correct decision. If she did read the talk then she rejected the doctrine. When you reject the words of the prophets and apostles you are "cut off" from amoung the people... (D and C 1:14)

  • t702 Las Vegas, NV
    June 23, 2014 6:04 p.m.

    @ Candide:"How do you think this news will impact conversion rates for women? I have checked several national news sites and the response to this decision has been overwhelmingly negative."

    ...and your point is...? so we should follow whatever the national news say, is that it? this point of view is as misguided as Ms Kelly

  • Vanceone Provo, UT
    June 23, 2014 5:58 p.m.

    Well, for those who are saying that others will withdraw from the church. Probably. I recall the parable of the Ten Virgins, and the wheat and the tares. Between the members pushing gay marriage, and now this Ordain Women thing--I'm sure lots of tares are ripening and outing themselves.

    It's sad, but I remember when Jesus announced that He was the Bread of Life. Many left and went other ways then as well, costing themselves who knows how much in the grand scheme of things.

    And Moses has HIS politically correct people too, who wanted to worship the "in thing" of the day: golden calves, rather than Jehovah.

    I'm sorry to see the members go who think that political correctness is more important than eternal life, but so be it. It is their decision, and their life. I hope they repent and come back, if they do apostatize.

  • Aeron Provo, UT
    June 23, 2014 5:52 p.m.

    The letter from her bishop was beautifully written. I truly hope that she will be able to come back to full fellowship in the church as well.

  • Stormageddon Spanish Fork, UT
    June 23, 2014 5:46 p.m.

    "The fact that she chose not to attend makes me feel that she intended to leave the church all along."

    Elwood, I don't think it's at all fair to say that she "chose not to attend". She was living 2200 miles away at the time, since the disciplinary action was in her old ward in Virginia, not her new ward in Utah. After her move to Utah, they put a hold on her records and started the disciplinary action in her old ward. So I don't see how she could have attended, given the distance and timing.

  • IMAPatriot2 PLEASANT GROVE, UT
    June 23, 2014 5:46 p.m.

    Now can we move on without KK being in the news? I feel sorry for her and those she has proselyted but she will be forgotten in a short time along with others who have chosen to follow this path. These Church councils are very sacred and private but this person has chosen to make it public and to diminish it's sacred purpose. I believe these brethren fulfilled their responsibilities properly.

  • kann ferron, UT
    June 23, 2014 5:44 p.m.

    I am a Christian. I say that proudly as many of those who have commented are proud of their founding father. I am a follower of Christ, Lord, Creator, and my personal Savior. What Kate doesn’t realize is that Jesus Christ has already made her equal with man. She was fighting for something that is not necessary. The most important authority an individual needs to recognize before they die is the authority of Jesus Christ. The Book of Hebrews tells us that God spoke to us through His Son. No more prophets. We have a need of a Savior not another human with all their infirmities leading us. Jesus is the High Priest. Dare anyone to say He isn’t, and then show me proof. But the KJV Bible says He is the only Priest we need. He is an eternal Priest. Those who follow a man or “priesthood” have a religion but they don’t have a relationship with God. Kate’s excommunication is a gift from God. Don’t look back. I pray for all who trust in men and an institution to find the true Lord and Savior.

  • rdrunner Las Vegas, NV
    June 23, 2014 5:43 p.m.

    Was her intention to further the agenda of the Lord or her own?

  • hermounts Pleasanton, CA
    June 23, 2014 5:41 p.m.

    She says "stay and make things better." By "better" she of course means "the way I want it>" It's not her place to say what is "better."

  • AZ Blue & Red Gilbert, AZ
    June 23, 2014 5:38 p.m.

    My wife and daughters hold the Priesthood each and ever time they give me a big hug. It is all in how you look at it. I can't think of a better way to hold the Priesthood if you are a woman (or girl). And I like being held by them! They can hold the Priesthood any time in my home.

    Different roles and responsibilities. I have mine, my wife has her. We are one.

  • 10CC Bountiful, UT
    June 23, 2014 5:32 p.m.

    I sincerely believe Kate Kelly felt inspired to push like she did.

    This will likely "chill" others who aggressively question, and will likely cause others to leave the church. In the short term I think there will be a lot fewer questions asked in church, and there may be a bit fewer people who will attend. These actions have a "shot across the bow" effect. You're either in, or you're out, and the dividing line is more clear today than yesterday.

    What is different this time is the Internet more rapidly - and forcefully - shapes opinions, and I sense this will be viewed as a pivotal event, in the future.

    It took the Catholic Church 500 years to apologize about how it treated Galileo. Things happen more quickly in 2014.

  • Baccus0902 Leesburg, VA
    June 23, 2014 5:26 p.m.

    It seems to me that the church is going through "growing pains". As the church grows and becomes more cosmopolitan is bound to encounter current of different opinions and perspectives. The church should work to prepare itself to "manage" those situations in a more church like manner than what can be consider "cultish behavior" by the outside.

    As someone raised as an LDS the decision of excommunication seems the logical conclusion to Ms. Kelly's conduct. However, I wonder how much of her actions were not inspired by God.

    As with the issue of Same Sex Marriage a dialogue about women and the Priesthood has started. May be Ms. Kelly's action will prove to be a preparation for changes to come. I don't advocate for Ms. Kelly's position but I certainly will not condemn her actions either. I'm sure she took the best decision with the information she had.

    I just know that the Lord works in mysterious ways.

  • 1conservative WEST VALLEY CITY, UT
    June 23, 2014 5:22 p.m.

    I wonder how long the media is going to give this person?

    She's ranking right up there with the "Kardashians".

    WHY doesn't she just start her own church?

  • DonO Draper, UT
    June 23, 2014 5:19 p.m.

    @4 Freedom

    You are correct. The emphasis should be on Ms. Kelly. But the purpose of the headline is to try to show that the decision to excommunicate her was made by local church authorities, not church leaders in Salt Lake City.

  • Instereo Eureka, UT
    June 23, 2014 5:06 p.m.

    Kate Kelly was excommunicated so membership in the church is down by one. But in spite of the church saying you can question or have doubts it's clear there is really no place to share those doubts or even talk about them.

    Many people on this forum are saying now she can learn her lesson or good riddance to her but I think what will really happen is many other people will see what happened to her and will silently withdraw themselves from the church.

    Steven Hawkins said that science is based on reason and religion is based on authority. This is a perfect example of that and how no amount of reason would change anything in the church. For me, this is the truly sad thing. We, the church, was founded on questioning of religious authority, grew because of questions, got answers from God because of questions, but now it seems everything is set and questions aren't really allowed anymore. And the saddest thing of all is the general leadership has been silent and local leadership acted and all of them have basically just said "because" and nothing about why which could enlighten some of us.

  • GFuller Mattoon, IL
    June 23, 2014 5:02 p.m.

    Avenue said: "I wholeheartedly oppose OW in everything they are trying to accomplish in the Church. I believe that if God intended for women to hold the priesthood He would have given it to Eve along with Adam. "

    It is my understanding that He did just that. God placed Adam in the Garden of Eden and with him, God place Eve as an "Help meet" for him. My understanding is that this meant that they had authority from God to do the things that He had organized them for and placed them on earth for. That is he gave them access to His Priesthood.

    What we are really quibbling about is the existence of offices in a priesthood organization. I happen to hold an office in the Melchizedek Priesthood. That speaks more about the amount of organizational or administrative responsibility I may be expected to be given than it does to how I may use the authority of God to help in His work of bringing to pass the immortality and eternal life of man.

  • Candide Salt Lake City, UT
    June 23, 2014 4:55 p.m.

    How do you think this news will impact conversion rates for women? I have checked several national news sites and the response to this decision has been overwhelmingly negative.

  • RedSandMan St. George, UT
    June 23, 2014 4:54 p.m.

    "While we are deeply saddened by this decision, Kate is a part of us, and Ordain Women will continue,"

    Continue with what? Its a sad, misguided, and ultimately dishonest notion to believe that any member and non-member of the church involved with this effort will change the doctrine of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints through this type of influence. If you believe in the doctrines of this faith, then you understand that's not how it works. If you really don't believe in its doctrines, as she has stated for herself, then you have the option of leaving the faith. It's very disengenuous to say you don't agree and must have change to fit your personal belief, but claim to want to remain a member. She has options now. She can do what she probably intended from the beginning, and that is to establish her own organization and ordain herself to it's leadership, however that works. This is no different than many other apostate efforts by individuals or groups through the church's history.

  • Ed from Nebraska Bellevue, NE
    June 23, 2014 4:49 p.m.

    Brother & Sister's
    I comes down to this point. You either believe or you do not believe the LDS Church is the true church as organized through the Prophet Joseph Smith under the direction of Jesus Christ. Joseph Smith was either a Prophet or he was not a Prophet. Those in the church that have a Temple Recommend know and understand why in a Temple recommend Interview you are asked certain Questions: The "HONEST" answer to these questions determines if a Temple Recommend is given and accepted. Bottom Line, You either believe or you do not believe. It is OK to question but once you receive an answer to your question(s) from church authorities you either accept or you do not accept. If you do not accept the answer that is your choice. BUT choices have consequences One of God's greatest gifts to you is your AGENCY. You notice I did not say Free Agency. Agency is not free because
    because choices have consequences Good or Bad. Your Father-in-Heaven Loves. Choose wisely.

  • Idahotransplant West Jordan, UT
    June 23, 2014 4:39 p.m.

    Some people just don't get it. If you would pay attention. Women in the LDS church have had a voice and representation since the Relief Society was originally organized in the 1800's. Plus, In my opinion they are more in tune with the spirit, are the glue that holds the family unit together and have a much higher "calling" then most men can handle.

  • shadowfx rio rancho, NM
    June 23, 2014 4:39 p.m.

    We are a church of order. We are guided by a living prophet. Revelation comes to Pres. Monson and he shares with the Church what God has in store. We are privy to our own personal revelation and not for the church as a whole.

    Kate knew the consequences for her actions would come at a price. Now she has paid the price for her actions. She has to live with her actions which will impact her family, friends, and other church members she recruited.

    If Kate wants the priesthood, she should seek out a religion that ordains women. There are many out there that will gladly give her the priesthood. The Community Church of Christ, RLDS, ordain women.

    This story reminded of Alma chapter 1. She wants to go perverting the ways of God and lead others astray. Instead of physical death, she has suffered spiritual death.

    I pray she will find repentance and soul searching in the future.

  • Kaladin Northern, CO
    June 23, 2014 4:34 p.m.

    To those who are crying "Why can't we ask questions": You know that's not what she was doing. She said she will not stop until women get the priesthood. She rallied people to do the same, marching on the conference center, held vigils, refused to speak with her leaders, refused to listen to the conference talks addressing this issue, went to the press to fight against the Church...She was not asking questions. She was demanding the priesthood. Contention is of the devil, and that is what she chose to bring. I am sad for her, but I am even more sad for anyone she has and will lead into strange paths away from the iron rod. Please, anyone who has followed her, talk to your leaders. They will be happy to hear your questions.

  • Arm of Orion Cottonwood Heights, UT
    June 23, 2014 4:30 p.m.

    Here's what I hope happens from this situation:

    1) a dialogue about gender inequaility in the church continues (because socially there is some of that.)

    2) Sister Kelly comes back to full faith and fellowship

    PS. Kaladin I don't know who you are but you are Stormblessed.

  • Frank Staheli Santaquin, ut
    June 23, 2014 4:28 p.m.

    Rather than simply harping on the one difference--that LDS males hold priesthood office while females don't, I wish that Kate would have also focused in a more balanced way on the many more similarities--that men and women share priesthood power, while serving in LDS temples, in ward and stake counsels, as presidents of ward, stake, and general organizations, etc. etc. etc. Instead, she used exaggerations and mistruths in order to put herself in the limelight.

    The Ordain Women movement can yet be a positive contributor in the discussion on LDS priesthood, but only if its members learn to use balance, fairness, and respect in their discussion. I feel sad that it came to excommunication, but I feel that it was the correct decision, and I hope that the Ordain Women movement can learn from this how to become an effective contributor to a very poignant debate, rather than marginalizing themselves and the many great insights that they probably have.

  • Abinadis friend Boise, Idaho
    June 23, 2014 4:27 p.m.

    So sorry to hear that a member has chosen to insert her desire rather than accept what our Priesthood leaders have explained to her was incorrect doctrine. As Members of the Saviors church we should know there are rules we all must follow. If correction is made, it will be from the Lord through the First Presidency of the church. Not from a lay member. I send my love to the one involved. Hope she see's the wisdom of the Priesthood authority, and discontinues to influence other members against the Church.

  • Blue AZ Cougar Chandler, AZ
    June 23, 2014 4:27 p.m.

    @HRM
    "I am disgusted by all the comments expressing happiness or gratitude for Sister Kelly's excommunication."
    Agreed. We should be Christ-like and help her see the error of her ways and come back to the fold. There is no place in our church to revel in the spiritual misfortunes of our brothers and sisters.

    "We should be sad that some men chose to cast out one of our own. She was cut off, and the decision was that of a panel of her male leaders, not hers."
    Disagreed. It wasn't 'men' that cast her out. Do not reduce this to a discussion of "boy vs. girl" because it's more than that. These were priesthood leaders. This was a common judge in the church, one that Kate Kelly herself sustained each year in her ward conference by raising her arm to the square. I wish she had some respect for the office, but it's pretty apparent she had no intention of being counseled or corrected. This is not something that 'just happened' to her. I'm surprised so many people are surprised at the outcome. Have you read some of her comments against her local leaders?

  • Jim Cobabe Provo, UT
    June 23, 2014 4:26 p.m.

    This is not a pleasant duty for bishops. I am sure it brings no joy. Wouldn't it be better to conduct such private business between the people concerned, instead of vigils and newspaper stories?

  • Kaladin Northern, CO
    June 23, 2014 4:19 p.m.

    A warning to any who follow her - she is not a prophet. Do not follow her. It will lead you down the same path to apostasy. "Follow the prophet, don't go astray. Follow the prophet, he knows the way."

  • Kora Cedar Hills, UT
    June 23, 2014 4:07 p.m.

    Ernest Bass- She did not just asked, she badgered. She tried pulling a Martin Harris. She got the answer she did not want and continued to badger hoping to get a different answer. Why should the Prophet keep asking until he gets the answer she wants. We lost 116 pages of the Book of Mormon when that happened last time, and learned a lesson.

    RoyceN- Where is the evidence that the leaders of the Church did not pray about it. From Conference talks on the subject it appears they did, and it was not the answer she wanted. Why is she entitled to get an official call or meeting with the Prophet himself regarding it? The Prophet does not have a questions hotline for anyone who wants to call. He is too busy. The leaders explained it in Conference for the whole Church, including her. Holding a meeting with her would have just fed her ego more.

    It is simple, you either believe in the Apostles and Prophet as led by God, or you don't. When you don't accept the answers that they convey, it signals that you don't believe in them.

  • fish8 Vernal, UT
    June 23, 2014 4:06 p.m.

    The church leaders said no to women holding the priesthood. I sure a popular vote among women memebers of the chruch would say no to women holding the priesthood (Most LDS women still try to follow the prophet.) so how does Mrs. Kelly want the matter desided? Her way? It appears she feels her opinion is the only correct one.

  • Clovis Fan Clovis, CA
    June 23, 2014 4:05 p.m.

    As a former bishop, I can assure you that these things are NEVER taken lightly. What's best for the church and best for the individual must be very carefully and prayerfully balanced and considered. Because Ms.Kelly made her desires and cause so public, anyone who is a member of the church and understands how the church is lead shouldn't be surprised at the outcome. The church is not a democracy, its a theocracy---"a form of government in which God or a deity is recognized as the supreme civil ruler, the God's or deity's laws being interpreted by the ecclesiastical authorities." I'm so glad to be a member of church that is led by a prophet and other wise and experienced men and women. I feel very bad for Ms. Kelly, she seems to be a great leader, just for a misguided cause. I sincerely hopes she comes back, but by reading her own statements, she'll have a lot of pride to swallow. It won't be easy. She'll probably be "kicking against the pricks" for some time.

  • common sense in Idaho Pocatello, id
    June 23, 2014 4:01 p.m.

    Loved the quote from Elder Maxwell. A sad day. When someone is excommunicated it is never a good day. But you reap what you sow. Kate Kelley knew this was coming. The sad thing is she earned it. Every bit. I pray that she will be touched by the spirit and find a way to reconnect with the church. She gave up alot today.

  • Say No to BO Mapleton, UT
    June 23, 2014 3:58 p.m.

    In many ways apostasy is the hardest road back. Forsaking the sin and embracing humility are very difficult, especially for one who has been so vocal and so unwilling to take counsel.
    And Kenya will lose a woman with great potential for good.
    Sad all around.

  • Elwood P. Suggins BEAVERTON, OR
    June 23, 2014 3:56 p.m.

    The fact that she chose not to attend makes me feel that she intended to leave the church all along.

  • EJM Herriman, UT
    June 23, 2014 3:53 p.m.

    It is one thing to ask questions. But if the answer coming back to you isn't the answer you were hoping for then why keep asking the same question? Do you ask until you get the answer you want? I'm not a member but it seems as if she was going to keep asking the same question until she got "her" answer. Like the little kid who wants candy at the grocery store and throws a tantrum until daddy gives in. Except in this case Daddy took her out of the store and said "we aren't going back until you behave better".

  • mecr Bountiful, UT
    June 23, 2014 3:52 p.m.

    Why should they meet with her? Long ago we were instructed to go to out bishops and stake presidents to address any concern we may have. Those are the channels. Why should she be the exception? Nevertheless, she had the PR department answering her every need and for the record, the PR doesn't talk unless the brethren told them what to do. Beyond that, the Church contracted air tv to transmit the Priesthood session (that costs $$$) and had an apostle answering her question in public, just the way she had been asking for what she wanted.

    It is sad. Sad for her and her family, sad for the people that are following her, sad for the Lord I am sure too.

  • Balan South Jordan, Utah
    June 23, 2014 3:51 p.m.

    I too, as others have expressed feel badly today.

    I support the Church 100% in its decision. There have to boundaries that simply cannot be crossed if you are to remain in good standing with the Church. Ms. Kelly knew those boundaries yet was not willing to give on her demands.

    The Church will move forward and be just fine. I hope the same for Ms. Kelly.

  • TheProudDuck Newport Beach, CA
    June 23, 2014 3:43 p.m.

    "Just remember, feminism is the radical idea that women are people."

    No, it is not.

    I believe that no person should be subject to artificial restraints because of sex. To that extent, I'm a feminist. (Alternatively, I'm just a human being who favors basic justice -- nothing fem- or mascu- about it.)

    But what goes under the label of "feminist" in the 21st century goes well beyond that. Because of that, I can't call myself one -- because too much of that "beyond that," which is objectively unjust and immoral, is baked into the package now associated with the word.

  • mecr Bountiful, UT
    June 23, 2014 3:43 p.m.

    "...You must be truthful in your communications with others regarding matters that involve your priesthood leaders, including the administration of church discipline"

    Not posting the complete letter tells me about her character. Either you post it or you don't do it. But if that sentence is true, which I believe it is, then she was not that honest as she wanted us to believe.

  • Jimmytheliberal Salt Lake City, UT
    June 23, 2014 3:43 p.m.

    As a non Mormon I find it quite hypocritical that numerous individuals continue to post such hateful rhetoric. How is it "good" that this women was excommunicated as @TheRealMaverick eloquently stated? Is this the message of your church? Help a non Mormon understand. A Catholic priest once told me that questions only make faith stronger!

  • HRM Salt Lake City, UT
    June 23, 2014 3:41 p.m.

    I am disgusted by all the comments expressing happiness or gratitude for Sister Kelly's excommunication. What we should be is sad...sad that some men chose to cast out one of our own. She did not choose to be excommunicated. She chose to ask, quite publicly, some uncomfortable questions. And when she was asked to be quiet and go away, she refused. But she did not voluntarily leave the church. She was cut off, and the decision was that of a panel of her male leaders, not hers.

    The more we rejoice in another's suffering and self-righteously congratulate ourselves for judging her "correctly", the more I fear Christ will not recognize us when He comes again. Nor will we recognize Him. Christ would be with Sister Kelly, loving and comforting her. Not looking out the windows of our glass houses, secure in our perceived piety.

  • HRM Salt Lake City, UT
    June 23, 2014 3:40 p.m.

    I am disgusted by all the comments expressing happiness or gratitude for Sister Kelly's excommunication. What we should be is sad...sad that some men chose to cast out one of our own. She did not choose to be excommunicated. She chose to ask, quite publicly, some uncomfortable questions. And when she was asked to be quiet and go away, she refused. But she did not voluntarily leave the church. She was cut off, and the decision was that of a panel of her male leaders, not hers.

    The more we rejoice in another's suffering and self-righteously congratulate ourselves for judging her "correctly", the more I fear Christ will not recognize us when He comes again. Nor will we recognize Him. Christ would be with Sister Kelly, loving and comforting her. Not looking out the windows of our glass houses, secure in our perceived piety.

  • Bluedoo13 Sandy, UT
    June 23, 2014 3:40 p.m.

    This is a sad situation! Everyone has questions but those questions can be answered through faith, sincere prayer, and listening to the spirit. "Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you." When she was asked to stop publically condemning the church, it's doctrine, and leaders, she should have had a sincere heart to heart with God to find His will and know has a plan that will lead to her happiness. It is not a prerequisite to agree with this doctrine, but it is a prerequisite to realize that God's know better than we do and submit faithfully to his will.

  • Naval Vet Philadelphia, PA
    June 23, 2014 3:40 p.m.

    That's too bad that Ms. Kelly's search for answers led to her excommunication. I think excommunicating her was the wrong decision. Nevertheless, while her former Bishop may have the authority to place temporal administrative sanctions on her, those temporal administrative sanctions cannot separate her heart from the Lord. If she went astray, her heart would have already ben separated from the Lord. But if she hadn't, and she'd been wronged by her former stake leaders as I believe she had, then nothing had changed...or at least not for her. However, the tithing she will not pay, the talks she will not give, the callings she will not fulfill, and temple work that she will not do, will all be on the heads of those responsible for preventing her from fulfilling those obligations.

  • TheProudDuck Newport Beach, CA
    June 23, 2014 3:40 p.m.

    To answer the question "why would someone who disagreed with a Church policy want to stay Mormon anyway?", consider this:

    The difference between Mormonism and most Protestant sects is that Mormonism -- like Judaism and Catholicism -- has become a cultural tribe, as well as a theological confession.

    As much as certain old-school Defenders of the Faith despise "cultural Mormons," they are real people. And their engagement with the LDS Church, while it might not be the one most favored by the Church institution and its zealous advocates, is real, too. That's what's being lost by an excommunicated heretic ("apostate" isn't quite the right word here). And that is not something for anyone to celebrate.

  • SharpHooks Sandy, UT
    June 23, 2014 3:39 p.m.

    She had to know that this would happen, so--one can only surmise she wanted to leave with both guns blazing.
    She will find peace and spirituality again.

  • Filthy Kuffar Spanish Fork, UT
    June 23, 2014 3:40 p.m.

    Why wouldn't members be happy about her being excommunicated? She was sowing discord and discontent within the church. It's great that the Bishop saw through her ruse and gave her what she undoubtedly deserved.

    I'm always happy to get the fox out of the hen house; there's nothing wrong with that is there?

    With that being said, I feel bad for her family. I hope she repents and comes back to the fold.

  • Hawkeye79 Iowa City, IA
    June 23, 2014 3:39 p.m.

    "As a group we intend to put ourselves in the public eye and call attention to the need for the ordination of Mormon women to the priesthood."

    This is not the mission of a group that is simply "asking."

    It takes a great deal of humility to recognize one's errors and change after making them such a public matter. Kate Kelly wouldn't be the first person in history who failed to do so. Then again, she wouldn't be the first person in history who succeeded in doing so either.

    Here's hoping that she can overcome the allure of having her own followers and recognize the importance of following the teachings of someone who is much greater.

  • Kimber Salt Lake City, UT
    June 23, 2014 3:34 p.m.

    I am saddened for this lady and wish her the best! I am a female and am not one that would want the things she wants, but I know everyone is different. I believe the leadership of mostly men in religion is more of a tradition rather than totally set in stone and I know there are religions that allow women clergy and maybe she will find a home in one of those.
    God Bless All!

  • USAlover Salt Lake City, UT
    June 23, 2014 3:33 p.m.

    @Blue AZ Cougar

    Don't you miss Elder Maxwell? I sure do. Thanks for the quote.

  • 4Freedom Columbus, OH
    June 23, 2014 3:31 p.m.

    No, Ernest T. Bass, she did much more than ask. Please read the whole story.

  • Johnny Triumph American Fork, UT
    June 23, 2014 3:27 p.m.

    What a shame, truly a shame that all of this happened. Good for her for asking a question. Bad for her for not taking the answer she got and finding peace from God about it. I hope she can find an unbiased resolution to her needs so she can return to full fellowship.

  • AreaReader Suburbs, AZ
    June 23, 2014 3:27 p.m.

    I would kindly suggest to commenters that if you find feminism to be contrary to the order and doctrine of the church, or if you think this excommunication is a judgment against feminism, you don't know much about feminism and probably don't know much about the history of women in the Church.

    Just remember, feminism is the radical idea that women are people. There are various movements within feminism, and you may disagree with some or many of their ideas, but if you agree that women should be able to vote or own property, you're a feminist.

  • mattrick78 Cedar City, UT
    June 23, 2014 3:23 p.m.

    Just like the Prophet Joseph in the grove. Its perfectly fine to question and ask questions. You just have to be humble enough to accept the answer. Its a lesson for all of us not just for those who have taken their complaints to the media.

  • rlsintx Plano, TX
    June 23, 2014 3:18 p.m.

    Pretty standard communication in such a situation/outcome.

  • RoyceN Salt Lake City, UT
    June 23, 2014 3:18 p.m.

    The church couldn't have handled this any worse. It started by her asking the brethren to ask god a question. But they refused.
    She asked for a meeting they refused.
    She asks for tickets to conference they refuse.
    All they had to do was meet with her after they had asked god about women being ordained and the answer was this is not the time. That would have been the end. Instead they have a movement that this excommunication will not be stopping.

  • ClarkHippo Tooele, UT
    June 23, 2014 3:15 p.m.

    I may not agree with Ordain Women, but it's always very sad to hear about someone being excommunicated.

    No one should find anything to rejoice in this. No one should think of this as a good day, because regardless of who it is, it is always heartbreaking to learn about anyone who is now out of the church.

    My advice to all devout Latter-day Saints is, pray for those who are no longer LDS that they will one day return to the fold. Don't pray anything negative because we're all imperfect.

    Pray for mercy and peace instead.

  • NT SomewhereIn, UT
    June 23, 2014 3:15 p.m.

    ...martyr for a cause, the wrong cause unfortunately. Saddening to witness. There is always a path back. Many many examples.

    Years and years ago, I ventured the dark and prideful path of apostasy. Thanks to a loving Heavenly Father for allowing me to live long enough to reconcile, to recognize the error of my ways - and for some amazing leaders who counseled with me in faith, patience and mercy..coupled with the support of my eternal companion - His mission and atonement became clear. Miraculous. Infinite.

    There is always a path back.

  • Ifel Of'a-sofa Alpine, Utah
    June 23, 2014 3:13 p.m.

    T. Bass -

    "all she did was ask"

    No, that's not all she did. There is no issue in asking EVER.

    She did ask but didn't like the answer so she kept going and pushing. I am sure she knew very well what her actions were going to get her.

  • patriot Cedar Hills, UT
    June 23, 2014 3:10 p.m.

    re:Ernest T. Bass

    "All she did was ask". No Ernest, she did MUCH MUCH more than just ask and that is why she was excommunicated. She went to the NY Times and other newspapers and brought scorn upon the Church in a very public manner and she also created her own following contrary to the teachings of the Church. That is an absolute recipe for excummunication. Elder Oaks responded in the last general Priesthood Meeting with a great talk on women and the priesthood but Kate rejected the words of the apostles and prophets of the Church she professed to follow and believe in. The Church Of Jesus Christ Of Latter Day Saints is not a political organization where lobbying and political pressure create change in doctrine any more than someone in Jesus's day doing the same thing.

  • Blue AZ Cougar Chandler, AZ
    June 23, 2014 3:08 p.m.

    "Church members will live in this wheat-and-tares situation until the Millennium. Some real tares even masquerade as wheat, including the few eager individuals who lecture the rest of us about Church doctrines in which they no longer believe. They criticize the use of Church resources to which they no longer contribute. They condescendingly seek to counsel the Brethren whom they no longer sustain. Confrontive, except of themselves, of course, they leave the Church, but they cannot leave the Church alone."

    Elder Neal A. Maxwell, 'Becometh As a Child', Ensign, May 1996.

  • USAlover Salt Lake City, UT
    June 23, 2014 3:07 p.m.

    "Good"? "...glad they excommunicated her"? Really? This stuff makes you happy? Wow, your Mormonism isn't working to the full extent that it can in your life when you make comments like this.

    My Mormonism finds no joy in this action at all, although I agree it's probably appropriate. Now let's get on with fellowshipping this woman to the extent possible and everybody...on both sides...STOP JUDGING. Come on, people, STOP IT!

  • Drew1house PLEASANT GROVE, UT
    June 23, 2014 3:07 p.m.

    I do not feel like she has had a fair shake. I know that in 1977 a couple of Mormon men were also excommunicated for their positions on Blacks having the priesthood. This might be just how the church does things? There is a good article in support of Kate that is available to read on the Tribunes site. Or just google (Apostasy council brief in support of Kate Kelly) after reading it I am dissapointed that her church leaders chose to do this.

  • I Bleed Blue Las Vegas, NV
    June 23, 2014 3:06 p.m.

    Shame on those of you who appear to take delight in seeing someone cut off. Let he who is without sin cast the first negative comment. This is heartbreaking for her family. My prayers go out to them.

  • Richie Saint George, UT
    June 23, 2014 3:03 p.m.

    She deserved it. For those of you that have never been involved in an LDS Church council it is not taken lightly by the church leaders involved in the action. It can take many hours of prayer and deliberation.

  • Craig Clark Boulder, CO
    June 23, 2014 3:03 p.m.

    Kate Kelly knew long before what the likely outcome would be for her course of action. A few eyes will be on her to see where she goes from here but it doesn’t really matter one way or the other. In a month or so this will be yesterday’s news. The issues that were raised will remain.

  • TheProudDuck Newport Beach, CA
    June 23, 2014 3:02 p.m.

    With the information I have about the situation, and if it had been my decision to make, I would not have made that decision. But it wasn't. The bishop had the responsibility to do what he believed God required him to do, and he did what he believed he was duty-bound to do. That is an honorable thing.

    I wish those who are questioning Sister Kelly's motives would consider the possibility that she believed she was doing likewise. Even if she is wrong, it is not gentlemanly to assume vicious motives without compelling evidence, and I have none that she was not acting according to what she believed her conscience dictated.

  • Ernest T. Bass Bountiful, UT
    June 23, 2014 3:02 p.m.

    Best of luck to Kate Kelly. You did a great thing. Keep it up!

  • Ernest T. Bass Bountiful, UT
    June 23, 2014 2:59 p.m.

    All she did was ask. Nothing wrong with asking. They bullying of her parents was a horrible thing. There really is no discourse in this organization.

  • Judith D. Los Angeles, CA
    June 23, 2014 2:58 p.m.

    It seems to me that Mrs. Kelly received what she desired: attention. She will continue to receive attention for a little while longer, and then she'll have time to contemplate her actions.

  • Fitness Freak Salt Lake City, UT
    June 23, 2014 2:58 p.m.

    How about if now the media now MOVES ON?

    This article WILL be the last I read about on "her plight".

    Religion isn't like politics where, if you can convince enough folks, you CAN have your way.

    She's manipulating the media!

  • Schnee Salt Lake City, UT
    June 23, 2014 2:57 p.m.

    I wonder what we'd call a company that categorically refused to hire/promote women to top leadership positions. Would we use the same terminology that we'd use to call a church that doesn't have female clergy/priesthood, or something different? If something different, why?

  • mayan elephant bountiful, UT
    June 23, 2014 2:57 p.m.

    I too am sorry for Kate Kelly. This must be a painful and disappointing chapter in her life. I hope her efforts move the LDS church forward to a point where women are equally represented in the Corporation of the President of the LDS Church, the Corporation of the Presiding Bishopric of the LDS Church and hopefully a to-be created Corporation of the Relief Society of the LDS Church. I hope that women and girls are equally represented in the things like a disciplinary action. I hope that girls are equally represented in the budget for girls camps versus scout camps. I hope that women and girls are allowed to advance in their lives and in the Church through promotions that are equal to boys. I hope that women can confess and confide in other women, including confessions or interviews for the temple or other cultural and doctrinal activities. I disagree that sharing the priesthood equals equality. I do not think sameness is essential. I hope for equality, and maybe Kelly moved that conversation forward. Kindnesses to her.

  • Sports Are Great Salt Lake City, UT
    June 23, 2014 2:57 p.m.

    She's not surprised how this played out
    I'm not surprised how this played out
    Church leaders aren't surprised how this played out

    Goodbye Kelly. Good luck to you in your struggles.

  • Brave Sir Robin San Diego, CA
    June 23, 2014 2:56 p.m.

    Let's be honest: When you start down a road like this, you know excommunication lies at the end of it. This is probably the least shocking thing that's ever happened in her life.

  • Aggie5 Kuna, ID
    June 23, 2014 2:55 p.m.

    Here's the crazy thing. If that was her only issue, why put your. Membership and commitments to our Heavenly Father behind?
    The church must of not meant that much to her.

  • Avenue Vernal, UT
    June 23, 2014 2:54 p.m.

    I wholeheartedly oppose OW in everything they are trying to accomplish in the Church. I believe that if God intended for women to hold the priesthood He would have given it to Eve along with Adam. I would be glad to bring Kate Kelly back into the Church, but only if she repents of her sins and forsakes these foolish and nonsensical ideas.

  • humbug Syracuse/Davis, UT
    June 23, 2014 2:53 p.m.

    I am grateful they ex-communicated Kate. This puts her in a position where she can decide to come back to the church, or continue to fight the church. It is her choice. I'm very grateful for the choice the Bishopric made and feel that it was inspired.

  • RedWings CLEARFIELD, UT
    June 23, 2014 2:50 p.m.

    Not a suprise, given her open defiance to requests to stop the open demonstrations, etc.

    Typically, a letter is written to the subject of the counsel listing their restrictions, and counsel as they move toward returning to membership. I am sure we will get to read this letter once Ms. Kelly releases it to the press.

    I am sure this will help Ms. Kelly advance her career as an equal rights activist as well.

  • 4Freedom Columbus, OH
    June 23, 2014 2:48 p.m.

    I find the title of this article troubling. It places the emphasis on the bishop rather than Kelly, who left the church, who did not even show up for the meeting. I anticipate that most if not all of the media will communicate this event as something that was done to Kelly rather than something she did to herself. I hope she comes back too.

  • toocoolforcoug Woods Cross, UT
    June 23, 2014 2:46 p.m.

    I also feel sorry for Kate Kelly in that she has lost her church membership and all of the blessings that have been and could have been hers. It's not wrong to question, but after you have been given an answer, as hard as it is to take sometimes, you need to let it go. After reading the letter she wrote to her bishop she left them no choice. If the church means as much to her as she says it does she will repent and work her way back. "The natural man is an enemy to God and has been since the fall"

  • liberty or ...? Ogden, UT
    June 23, 2014 2:46 p.m.

    No surprise, teach against the doctrine of a church and attempt to use media an public pressure to alter its beliefs and you will be excommunicated. Apparanlty she forgot her reccomend questions. She has the free will to believe what she wants but that does not make it doctrinaly correct or acceptable. I wish her well. Another example of someone who let pride kill her testimony. And for her defenders it is okay to have diverse opinions on church issues an doctrine but if you truly do ascribe belief in this church and its teachings then you accept some stances on how policy and doctrine is established in this church and the source it comes from. It would be good for members to re-visit Brigham Youngs statement in the Kirtland Temple in defending Joseph Smith from some members who believed they could do a similair thing and u-surp the defined channels and keys god revelaed through the prophets you might also revisit 2nd peter 1:20-21

  • Mack2828 Ft Thomas, KY
    June 23, 2014 2:45 p.m.

    It has always seemed to me that Ms. Kelly and her followers have chosen (perhaps without even fully realizing it) to center their lives on feminism instead of Jesus Christ and His Church.
    Ms. Kelly is now at a place in her life where 'two roads diverge in a yellow wood', she can choose to repent and come back to Christ and His Church or she can continue to stubbornly stay centered on feminism. I hope she comes back.

  • Vanceone Provo, UT
    June 23, 2014 2:42 p.m.

    Totally not surprising. She tried to steady the ark. Repeatedly. Again I ask: What, exactly, was she thinking? The Priesthood has been exclusively male for 7,000 years. What made her think that she was going to change that? r that God had suddenly changed His mind.... and she was the vehicle in which He chose to do so? That's kind of... hubris?

    If she thinks she was privileged to get revelation for the entire church that the prophet did not, well, she's welcome to start her own church. But that's apostasy from the LDS church, and no question about it.

    If she didn't get a revelation.... then what on earth was she thinking? Especially after Elder Oaks' talk?

    I'm sorry she brought this on herself, but her attitudes and actions could only lead to this. So be it. I hope she comes back like William W. Clayton did.

  • Pac_Man Pittsburgh, PA
    June 23, 2014 2:40 p.m.

    We should be careful when we take a minor issue we may have in the Church and mistake it for the whole. Even when we get that far most of us are willing to take correction. Very sad.

  • Go Utes Salt Lake City, UT
    June 23, 2014 2:38 p.m.

    With all of the deep issues she has with the church, I wonder why she hasn't just moved on before it came to this point. I think there is room to grow when it comes to issues involving women and the church. But eventually one runs into the fact that Jesus Christ is male. If the church is too patriarchal, and you believe that no man can understand, teach, or help you, how can a male Savior help you? That seems to be the end result of anyone who has issues with male leadership in the church that runs as deep as the OW group.

    The fact is that most people in the church, male and female, will never be in positions of authority. Bishops can be jerks to both sexes. Most members are just people, hopefully trying to be kind and improve their lives.

    Anyway, I wish the best for Kate Kelly and her group. But it does seem to me that she would be best in another religion, given the level of issue that she takes with the current church.

  • The Real Maverick Orem, UT
    June 23, 2014 2:38 p.m.

    Good!

    She came with demands not questions. When those demands weren't met, she tried to embarrass the church by going Jason Chaffetz with every camera she could find.

    The Mormon church need not cave to pressure from some uncivil people. The church has a right to have a doctrine and to stick with it. They shouldn't ever be held at ransom.

    Let this be a lesson to others who desire to overrule those called to receive revelation for the church. No matter how loud you are, how popular you become, and how many cameras you seek out, you cannot overrule the church's inspired leadership.

  • Blue AZ Cougar Chandler, AZ
    June 23, 2014 2:31 p.m.

    I feel sorry for Kate Kelly, I really do. I don't believe her Ordain Women movement was correct in its approach or interpretation of certain passages in the scriptures, but I don't find joy in knowing that she has repeatedly gone against the church in this regard and has been excommunicated. Perhaps her original intent (several months ago) was just a question, but it has certainly evolved to more than that over the past year. I hope she finds her way back, I really do.