Comments about ‘Is it possible that Americans may not recover from the recession?’

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Published: Friday, June 20 2014 1:04 p.m. MDT

Updated: Friday, June 20 2014 1:04 p.m. MDT

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JoeCapitalist2
Orem, UT

Recoveries happen because a large portion of the population is positive about the prospects available in the near future. If you think you will have a job, earn more next year than you did this year, and the government won't take away an even bigger chunk of your income; then you will feel more free to buy a home, a car, or some new furniture.

When everyone is worried that they might not even have a job next year, they will only buy what they absolutely need to get by. When everyone does this, like a mirage, the "recovery" is always on the horizon.

In 2008, the "hope and change" slogan of Obama was sold to us as a hope that things will change for the better. Instead everyone is just hoping that things don't continue to change for the worse.

Diligent Dave
Logan, UT

Because economists mostly only look at money and money flows, and don't expand their search into demographics, they have largely missed the real underlying causes of The Great Recession. And, let's be honest, it's really a depression, and not merely a recession.

To be sure, the underlying cause of the Great Depression was really the same. Drastically declining birth rates. From 1910 onward, a plethora of problems began. Including drastically declining birth rates. The deaths from war and the Spanish Flu Pandemic of 1918 killed so many in their prime child bearing years, that the 1920's began in trouble. Combine that with rebellion against the then newly passed Prohibition, and as more people didn't keep manmade laws, they also ignored God-given laws, like chastity. Anti-immigration laws that went into effect in 1924, combined to cause a decline in demand for housing in 1926. In early 1929, demand for housing plummeted. And the stock market crash in October 1929 made the beginning of the depression official.

Birth rates stayed low in the 1930's and into the 1940's. The Baby Boom (1946-1964) is what really got us out of the Great Depression.

Shane333
Cedar Hills, UT

We aren't doomed to an eternal recession. Reduce government regulation and drop Obamacare altogether (along with its associated new taxes) and the recession would disappear almost overnight. Allow new oil refineries to be built, too, and we'd see the economy really boom.

In summary, government involvement IS the problem, and the answer is to have less of it.

Fitness Freak
Salt Lake City, UT

I'm very much pro-business but I highly resent unethical businesses who take advantage of the American public by hiring illegal alien trespassers. This results in keeping wages low. Besides the fact that those practices result in unfair competition with businesses who DO follow the law.

The "middle-class" will SOON cease to exist unless competition between employers is regulated the way the laws of our country intended them to be.

Illegal immigration keeps wages relatively low, while the "midddle class" pick up the REAL costs associated with them being present in the United States.

There is a REASON why we have immigration quotas!

ordinaryfolks
seattle, WA

It should be patently obvious why the economy does not grow. We live in a consumer based economy. The economy depends on our spending endlessly (while arguably for things we really don't need).

The consumer has tapped out his/her credit. His/her earnings have declined in real terms. The effects of our profligate national spending will come home to roost with higher taxes inevitable to pay for the things we have already bought, and the things we must provide for. The only thing keeping the economy running now is the Federal Reserve policy of issuing massive debt.

I don't know what the answer is. I know that the Tea Party Republican answer is ridiculous (lower taxes). I know the Democratic response is also nonsense. The answer is neither bigger families nor reduced regulation either.

Things have changed fundamentally, and the sooner we come to grips with this, the sooner we might find answers. Until we all grow up and avoid simplistic answers, expect nothing different from either political party.

george of the jungle
goshen, UT

The limitless of every thing has changed the value of every thing. I can't see that any thing is worth what I'm spending.

markmongie
Kaysville, UT

I like Dilligent Dave's response, and it is exactly how I see things. To have a strong economy you need a booming population, harvesting of natural resources like oil, gas and food to fuel the growing population, and adherence to laws - both societal/legal and healthy maintenance of virtues that govern behavior. Strong virtues spur inspiration, invention, marriages, giving, charity, sharing, and everything GOOD that contributes to growth and prosperity. The USA had a lot of immigrants from 1890 to 1910, but then the immigration stopped due to stiff immigration laws, and when a ton of people died due to flu and war ,and when Americans became lawless during the prohibition era, the economy tanked.
Nowadays with the collapse of the family due to divorce/gays/infidelity and lowering of standards of virtues - we see the results in society at large; people are fixating on anti-growth agendas like fake science (global warming), LGBT rights (counter-family), and the rapid growth of the welfare state. Add into the mix costly wars and corrupt politicians who don't follow the Constitution, and we should not be surprised that the country is languishing in a Depression.

Liberal Ted
Salt Lake City, UT

This is what Obama and his supporters wanted all along. Then they can play the poor vs rich in every election cycle, and maintain power forever. This is called soft tyranny.

Brio
Alpine, UT

The first 4 comments make some very valid points.
This recession (near depression) is not going away anytime soon.

Government interference is the cause of many, if not most national issues. Unfortunately, the current administration has added significant more government interference in both the lives of individuals and in the entire business world.

Expensive, government mandated health insurance significantly hurts consumers.
Extensive government regulations, combined with the highest business taxes in the free-world has created a huge two-fold impediment to business growth.

The key to overcoming any and all recessions is a vibrant and growing business climate. But as long as the current administration continues with it's agenda, that cannot and will not happen. Its regulations and taxes are significantly hindering business expansion.

One of the biggest differences between someone like Mitt Romney and Barrack Obama is their attitudes toward business environments. Mitt is a business and economic genius. The results in his personal life are verifiable proof. Obama has never had any business experience whatsoever. His attitude toward business is also proof... and very telling.

Had the last election gone differently, this recession could well have been over by now.

UtahBlueDevil
Durham, NC

JoeCapitalist... just keep banging that deeply partisan bell. We experienced a global recession, and we are experiencing a global recovery. Anyone who thinks that America can ever act as a sole player, that somehow the fact that 50 percent of our economy depends on exports or imports can be mitigated from the equation, is setting themselves up for disappointment.

Change is what happened. The Recession was the catalyst for many industries to trim down, and they all will be very slow to regain that extra weight they were carrying during the bubble. Add to that the impact of ever increasing globalization of markets, resources, and talent, and there will be very much permanent job displacement.

So wish as you must that Obama is the cause, the game has changed, and would have regardless of who was in the White House. Baby-boomers were going to retire regardless. China's economy was going to grow. India and Brazil will continue to race into relevancy. There is no going back... sorry

Hutterite
American Fork, UT

Since we have to pay for it one way or another, how about getting the monkey of health care off employers' backs, set up a system that gives all citizens care and job mobility, and ultimately save money and move forward?

lost in DC
West Jordan, UT

Totally possible that we will not recover. We re-elected BO; we have no economic sense.

Bluedevil,
Someone needs to beat the right partisan bell to counter-balance your consistent beat of the left partisan bell

JoeCapitalist2
Orem, UT

UtahBlueDevil:

I wonder if you gave GWB the same pass for the troubles that happened in his 8 years as you seem to be giving Obama for everything he has done to contribute to the problems of the past 6 years?

I don't "wish that Obama is the cause" of all our current troubles. As a conservative, I think his policies are dangerous, but I would much rather have a booming economy than the current situation just so I had something to blame on him.

I think Bush did a bunch of dumb things that contributed to the meltdown in 2008 and I think Obama has done even dumber things that have kept us from a robust recovery.

If that means I am "banging a deeply partisan bell", then so be it.

Kings Court
Alpine, UT

Some of my fellow commenters just don't get it. This is not necessarily Obama's doing, but a mixture of various policies, regulation and de-regulation over the last 30 years. The recessions since the 1980's have required more and more government stimulus to pull us out and set a precedent for future borrowing. Republican Ronald Reagan led the way. Income inequality and globalization is a driving force of our economic malaise. In a consumer driven economy (capitalism), if the middle class has less money to spend, the economy will spiral downwards and reinforce that spiral due to stagnant wages. The recession in the early 2000's (Bush years) showed us just how messed up our economy had gotten. The aftermath was often referred to as the jobless recovery. The only thing that pulled us out of that recession was the widespread use of home equity lines of credit and easy access credit. Once that last source of stimulus dried up in 2008 with the financial market collapse (while Bush was still President by the way), the true state of the economy was finally exposed for what it is.

Midwest Mom
Soldiers Grove, WI

Well said, Hutterite.

America needs to start working together. House divided and all that. Value all citizens and give respect to those at the bottom who do the worst jobs for the least pay.

If we're a Christian nation, then we'd better start acting like one.

ordinaryfolks
seattle, WA

Amazing that the conservative, pro business types are so fundamentally myopic in their point of view.

Corporate America is doing just fine. Corporate balance sheets are laden with cash. The NYSE is at all time highs. Interest rates are low, and will stay there. We have little inflation. And the tax codes insures that almost any profit earned is sheltered. What else do these people want? Blood?

The problem is not Corporate America, it is consuming America. Most of us just don't have the money to buy stuff, even at Walmart. Real wages are stagnant for decades. It takes two incomes just to make ends meet.

Really conservatives, get off the high horse. Corporate America is having a field day, and the Obama administration is aiding and abetting them as much as Republicans do.

Diligent Dave
Logan, UT

The 2nd part of my comments is this. The Baby Boom subsided in part,if not in large part, due to the advent of "the pill" in 1960, just when the first crop of young female baby boomers were coming of age. What their parents learned or did, the boomer undid. On average, for every 200 baby boomers, they gave birth to about 170 babies. 211 is the magic number given our mortality rate just to achieve exact replacement.

Problems like inequality, interestingly, have been addressed by the now famous French economist, Mr Pickety, who has pointed out that inequality is least when populations are growing and markets are thriving. I've noticed in Utah, how as the typical maximum median number of children has dropped from 7 or 8 to 4 or 5, the number of bargains at grocery stores has greatly diminished. Since few are having all that many children,even in Utah, the deals aren't as lucrative to stores as other ways of making more money from fewer sales. Margin, not volume, on sales, has become more important.

SAS
Sandy, UT

Remember that even as the recession/depression drags on, and millions of people are chronically unemployed, the stock market is as high as it's ever been. Seems somebody is doing all right.....

(There's the old joke: A recession is when your neighbor loses his job. A depression is when you lose yours.....)

UtahBlueDevil
Durham, NC

JoeCapitalist.... see the difference between your post and the one above it is that at least you agree there is a problem on both sides. You can't fix what you don't acknowledge. Pointing the finger at the other side does nothing to solve the problem... telling the other side to fix there problems doesn't advance the cause. You fix what you can control, and that is the mistakes your side makes....

@Lost.... if you think I am a liberal.... you really are lost. I am simply one who doesn't like the use of misinformation, even lies, to make points. Genuine differences of opinion are great, and even encouraged. But making up stuff... by either side is something I will not let passively slide by.

If you call that being a liberal..... then so be it. If the opposite means that being a conservative means you turn a blind eye to deceptive statements... then I am absolutely not your brand of a conservative.

SCfan
clearfield, UT

So they're now trying to sell us the "New Normal". Hoping we forget what a good economy is really like when administered by a Republican. Reagan, Bush, Clinton (who did a lot of Republican things with the Gingrich/Dole Congress) and Bush again, until the Reid/Pelosi Congress began messing things up. All just to try to make us believe that Obama is a good President. I can't trust liberals to think in any way but emotional. No matter how bad he messed up, liberals just can't bring themsleves to criticize one of their own. Especially when he is a minority.

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