From ESPN today: "BYU coach Bronco Mendenhall wants in the Big
12, but two league athletic directors told ESPN there have been "zero
discussions" about the conference expanding""Luck added
that there are no "available teams" -- schools from the non-Power Five
leagues -- that would add value to the Big 12's per-school revenue"The power 5 conferences are moving on, without mid majors like byu, usu,
Can we please not do the list thing anymore, it takes 10 times the time to read
the article/ get the information. Which is the point right?
Amusing that Bronco only says BYU would love to be in the Big12 and now
it's blown up all over again, even on espn's website today.
I love how at the end of each section the author inserts "myth busted"
or "myth plausible" according to his own speculation. Is it
plausible that BYU joins the AAC? Sure, but it's also plausible they join
the PAC12, Big 12, MWC, stay independent, etc. We won't really have any
clue what will happen until another round of conference realignment is a
reality. Until then BYU is making the most out of being independent and trying
to position themselves as an attractive addition to the BIG 12.
The only people in the nation who think byu deserves or will ever get a seat at
the big boy table are byu fans. No one else is talking about byu. I'd
hate to be in their position right now, but we're not!
@Wiscougar,"plausible they join the pac12" No. We will
never invite you
Part of me wants byu to be invited to the Big 12, just to watch them struggle
worse than Utah is struggling in an even better conference(Pac 12), but more of
me enjoys watching byu's coach have to beg publicly for an invite, only to
watch the Big 12 turn their nose up to byu.Its delicious! I hope no
conference ever invites byu, and its looking almost certain that's the
Best part of reading BYU article is comments from Utah fans. They claim no one
is talking about BYU while posting 100+ comments in every BYU article. Oh irony!
Chris BSalt Lake City, UTFrom ESPN today:"Luck
added that there are no "available teams" -- schools from the non-Power
Five leagues -- that would add value to the Big 12's per-school
@utesonthehill looking down at byu,We do enjoy mocking your football
program that no one wants to invite. We do enjoy beating you year after year
after year, even though you aren't our rival. We know we are your rival so
its fun to smash your dreams of beating your rival in your "Super Bowl"
Lifelong UteI hate to admit it; but I feel the same way. The BYU
fans on these boards, not all mind you, that come across as overly sensitive and
pompous have pretty much sealed the deal for me. Also, no one is going to invite
a school that comes in demanding TV rights and dictating what days they will,
and will not play on. The Big 12 has basically confirmed that.
Sour grapes?Do Utah fans google every mention of BYU just so they
can be the first to post their negative remarks?Perhaps they should
finish in the top half of their conference, at least once, before disrespecting
other teams?Maybe they should ask themselves how long their present
football coach will have a job before ripping Bronco?I'm just
It's very possible that BYU may never be invited to join any of the 5 so
called power conferences but if it ever happen, it'll be so delicious, if
for no other reason than to see the haters squirmed and gagged in their nauseous
hate and venom against everything BYU! Frankly, I don't give a
hoot if they ever got invited. I'm quite content with them staying
independent and play to win no matter what schedule they play.Go
(last comment to previous post)"The best thing that BYU can do
to help its cause is to win games. While an 8-5 season certainly isn't bad,
the Cougars need to assert that they are a team that can't be ignored. BYU
hasn't finished ranked in the AP Top 25 since it went independent, and that
has to change this year."Total agreement. Who knew the U was
working to get into the PAC-12 for some 10 (?) years? Was there any public
pleading - no. Any discussions were "behind the scenes". That is where
most serious issues are discussed/resolved. There is a natural reaction against
seeking outside pressures. I've said it before, and it applies here, Utah
made its case of being difficult to avoid. Highest winning bowl percentage of
teams with more than 5 bowls. Most wins by a "non-bcs" team over bcs
teams. Beating Alabama(!) in the Sugar Bowl. Two undefeated seasons in the
past 10 years. This is how Utah earned an invitation to the PAC-12 conference.
(Not to forget its status as a highly ranked research university!)
@ChrisB just the fact that you enjoy mocking BYU more than having a good
football team makes me want BYU to stay mid major all my life so I don't
need to resort mocking another football team to make myself better. That's
so elemntry school bro.cheers!
"Luck added that there are no "available teams" -- schools from the
non-Power Five leagues -- that would add value to the Big 12's per-school
revenue"That's going to hurt some egos.
Another comment, from a Utah fan’s perspective, what Utah did to earn
the invitation to the PAC-12:Many Y fans express the opinion Utah
was invited only when the other 5 schools rejected an offer. Utah was not a
"first choice". Absolutely correct - but not quite as they imagine.
Colorado was in... it was the PAC-11. Five offers were made but not to the
PAC-12's top choices (IMO). Probable top choices - Texas, Oklahoma, Notre
Dame, Ohio State, and Florida (or Michigan ...) But that wasn't going to
happen!Similarly, the five offered were not going to happen. Texas
A & M was not going to accept the PAC-12. Why? Someone much more
knowledgeable than I about Texas A & M would have to say. But they wanted
SEC ( got it) or get away from Texas or...As Commissioner Scott
said, Utah was always in the PAC-12's plans. Now Utah's
position1) Accepted (probably) proposed phase in. $0 first year - 4
years for full share2) Acknowledged Colorado deserved full membership -
$5M buy out to Big 12 and bigger TV market 3) Position of working
together in any way to earn membership!Deal closed!
Utah a highly ranked research univ.? Forbes top 20 (US): No.The
Center for Measuring University Performance (US): Utah #49.I'm sure
that there are other reputable US based rankings that someone else can scour up.
thebigsamoan:"...it'll be so delicious, if for no other
reason than to see the haters squirmed and gagged in their nauseous hate and
venom against everything BYU"...but until THEN......Haha! Midmajors forever!Aaah! That was "delicious"!
The backstory on how TCU got into the Big-12 is fascinating.DeLoss
Dodds was the Texas Athletic Director who essentially was the decision maker of
final resort for the Big-12. In other words, if Dodds didn't support it,
it wouldn't be done, in terms of Big-12 business.TCU's
Athletic Director drove to Austin to meet with Dodds, and waited all day long
from 8:00am to 3:30pm to have a word with Dodds, and finally DeLoss came out of
his office and invited the TCU AD out for dinner and drinks. Four hours later,
and without having discussed any of the actual merits of inviting TCU, the two
parted ways after an evening of drinking, and the next day phone calls to the
TCU Athletic Director's office started coming in, asking what he had
done.It seems DeLoss Dodds called a Big-12 meeting the morning after
socializing with TCU's AD, the Big-12 voted to extend an offer to TCU that
day, and that was it. It took less than 24 hours.DeLoss Dodds is
gone now, retired, but what a crazy story about how the Big-12 added TCU.
I see Utah, on a year to year basis, able to compete to some degree with
Washington State, Oregon State, Colorado, maybe Arizona. But if you are a n in
demand high school star athlete, where are you going to go given all
choices…Seattle, Palo Alto, Berkley, Los Angeles, Phoenis/Tempe, or Salt
Lake City? I rest my case. Good luck to the Utes, but they have to contend
with a miserable climate and less than cool SLC. And I doubt the athletes care
much about the U as a research center!
Jim1027St. George, UT"Perhaps they [Utes] should finish in
the top half of their conference, at least once, before disrespecting other
teams?"Actually, Jim, it's a lot of fun knowing that byu
will never finish in the top half of ANY conference.
Hmmmm, no mention of the impending NCAA violations? I guess corporate put the
kabosh on that one.My sense is the damage caused by the inevitable
punishiment and public shame will drastically affect the other myths.
Ken"The only people in the nation who think BYU deserves or will
ever get a seat at the big boy table are BYU fans. No one else is talking about
BYU."Apparently, the only people in the nation who share your
head-buried-in-the-sand opinion that "no one else is talking about BYU"
are BYU-obsessed haters like U.CURRENT ESPN Fan Poll: Should the Big
12 let BYU into the conference?YES 64%No 36%
little perspective"it's a lot of fun knowing that BYU will
never finish in the top half of ANY conference."It's a lot
of fun laughing at the desperate "predictions" of the haters.WAC/MWC/PAC Football ChampionshipsBYU 23Utah 6It's a safe bet that BYU will win their next conference championship,
long before the Utes play in their first Rose Bowl.
hedgelogWhat "impending NCAA violations"? Is the
U planning some so the Utes can feel like "big boys"?
Personally, I dont think BYU (or Utah for that matter) have the recruiting power
to get the depth necessary to compete in a major conference. They both have
the talent to compete in a big game or two, but not in a full season. Should
BYU get a bid to the Big 12, they will be a bottom tier team, just like Utah in
Wow!The vast majority of interest to this article is from Ute fans
apparently scared of what might happen to BYU regarding it's relevancy to
Utah. How ironic. I've never seen rival opponents of any team
more concerned with their rival than Utah fans are with BYU. Totally fixated...
as verified by the number of Ute fans commenting to this article. And not just
this article. It's every BYU article that comes out. That truly
qualifies as some sort of obsession, per it's very definition. But the big question is why?Why are they so concerned about BYU's
future in any conference?Why are they so concerned with each player who
commits to BYU?Why are they so concerned with each and every media article
on BYU?It says a lot about the legitimacy and overall significance
of BYU to have their rival so overall and totally concerned.May your
great interest in BYU continue, Ute fans. It's truly entertaining.
It's more entertaining than watching most Ute football game with
little hope of winning.It's more entertaining than watching the
Ute football coach merry-go-round at the end of each season.
I would never be willing to spend even half the time reading and commenting on
Utah articles that so many Ute fans ALWAYS do on BYU articles. Ute articles just
not worth it to me. Simply not enough genuine interest in what's happening
in Uteville. Most BYU fans apparently and undoubtedly feel the same way.It's a genuine tribute to BYU that so many fans of all surrounding
colleges (even many from out of state) show so much interest in whatever is
happening to BYU. Love em or hate em, the interest is definitely and visibly
there. It's no wonder at all that so many more articles are
written about BYU than all other college programs in Utah put together. BYU fans
enjoy the articles and fans of other programs jump on them quicker than
lightening with avid and obvious interest.
To all Utah fans:A program that seldom even competes for a
conference title (only 6 in the last 60 years), has no business even discussing
national title scenarios.--------navelvetThe
Utes are nothing but a midmajor masquerading as a big boy - NOTHING Utah has
done since joining the PAC 12 gives any indication that the Utes are anything
but a midmajor; you're not even good enough to qualify for a bowl anymore
-- 4-5, 3-6, 2-7, with back-to-back bowl less seasons says it all.
@ MyPerspective:Actually BYU has literally almost always finished in
the top half of every conference they've been in for the past half century.
And that's been 95% of that time period that they've competed in
conferences. It's been a very long time since they haven't been in the
top tier of each and every conference they've played in.That's a claim Utah can't make. Not at all.On top of
that, BYU has more conference championships than Utah. Comparing the trophy
rooms of each program is very telling of how each school has done in the past...
overall. And based on what's been happening with Utah's
latest conference affiliation, it is going to be a very long time before they
can even think about adding any more conference championships. A very long time!
What is with the lack of maturity and civility here? The bottom line is the same
for both BYU and Utah. Why did Utah get Fiesta and Sugar Bowl invites despite
being a member of the lowly MWC? Why was BYU given the national championship in
1984? Because they did then what they cannot consistently do now. Win! If they
don't start, Utah can continue to brag about their PAC-12 membership...from
the bottom of the PAC. BYU will never achieve Notre Dame-like respect as an
independent, nor will they become any more attractive as a target for expansion.
They both have to earn respect. I think Utah's ability to do that in more
recent history than BYU has paid dividends. As for the Big 12, we don't
need another Iowa State or KU in football. We like to see competition. I'm
not saying BYU would be on that level if they got an invite, but they need to
prove it to be in.
The Power Five reminds me of the pigs in Animal Farm. It has become four legs
good, two legs better among the pigs. They have defined college football so
that the pigs get the slops. By their redefinition over time no recognition for
good college football will go to deserving colleges who have that once in a
while great team. Consider Boise State and the U of U in their great season
having to face each other rather than one of the members of the Power 5
conference. It has been an evolution. Of course, the U of U is now a member of
the pig squadron. I am sure there are others who would like to be included in
the pig conferences.This latest iteration of the Power 5 is not
static. The Big 12 doesn't want to expand because they don't want to
share any more of the slops. While some pundits see an expansion of 14 teams in
each of the Power 5, there is no guarantee that they won't decrease by
letting go of their bottom feeders so there is more for the schools that
MidwestOutsiderIt seems that by stomping Texas in 2013, losing at
Texas by a single point in 2012, beating Oklahoma in Cowboys Stadium in 2009,
and being 5-1 combined versus Texas(3-1) and Oklahoma(2-0), BYU has already
proven that the Cougars can compete with the big boys of the Big 12.That's not saying that BYU would immediately become one of the top teams
in the conference, but they've definitely proven that they would be
competitive in the Big 12.
Peavler makes some good points. I particularly like what he says about the Pac
12 and BYU. The U has established itself as a major research institution and
the Pac 12 values that heavily. A friend of mine has been making that case for
a long time. That could be the major deciding factor behind not inviting BYU.
The Church leadership long ago made a decision that the main focus at BYU is to
give a quality education to as many students as possible. Research has not been
a high priority.Also, on a percentage basis, the Utes have outsold
the Cougars in football for years. This includes a higher percentage of season
ticket renewals. I have mentioned on these comment boards before that my Bishop
used to get a letter every summer inviting us to buy tickets to football games
for a dollar each for our youth groups. I saw this as BYU's desperate
effort to fill LES.
-What "impending NCAA violations"? Is the U planning some so the Utes
can feel like "big boys"?--snack pack-Wow, nice
deflection. Probably not the best way to handle what could be a program
crippling decision.I'm somewhat amazed how cougar fan spends its time
putting together lists and pie charts on how great their program is but finds
the ability to not address the more urgent issue. NCAA violations.I
guess you found your happy place
It's interesting that 18,106 fans have responded to the poll question on
EPSN:Should the Big 12 let BYU into the conference?65%
Yes35% NoFor a program that, according to the kids on the
hill, NOBODY except BYU fans cares about, there certainly seems to be a lot of
interest from around the country, with a 2-to-1 majority, even in Big 12
country, favoring the Big 12 inviting BYU to join their conference.
@ Brio"On top of that, BYU has more conference championships
than Utah."Not true. All-time Utah has 24 conf. titles. BYU
hedgehogTrust me, there weren't any major violations and there
won't be any "program crippling" decisions.When the
results are finally released, it'll be obvious that all of the hysteria and
hand-wringing was a tempest in a tea cup.Nothing but a few minor
indiscretions and some mild hand slapping will be the end result.
Mormon Ute:You conveniently forgot to mention that BYU outsells tickets
and attendance to their games over Utah by over 40%. Percentages are secondary
to overall numbers and is just a backdoor approach to a topic you're not
going to win on.You also said your bishop received offers (in past
tense). Present tense is more meaningful. Those former offers were for nosebleed
seats and in very limited numbers. Even those tickets are now harder to come by.
But nice try using a squirrelly twist. And so we see that
regardless of the angle or approach (often very fickle and hardly on topic when
coming from rival fans) the overall fascination with all things BYU continues...
just as previously noted. Keep em coming, Ute fans. Your imaginative
approaches truly are entertaining to read.
"The only people in the nation who think byu deserves or will ever get a
seat at the big boy table are byu fans. No one else is talking about byu.
I'd hate to be in their position right now, but we're not!"Because--we are big boys look what we can do. We can play like big boys
do. We can win them on and off. Golly wow! We are big boys now.Go
Two For FlinchingMeaningful conference championships won in the last
half century in conferences that still exist:BYU 23Utah 6It's laughable that Utah fans still cling to championships won when
the Utes were only playing a 4- or 5-game conference schedule.
With the amount of interest most Utah "fans" give to BYU, I don't
know why the Big 12 WOULDN'T want BYU, to be honest. BYU would bring the
BYU fanbase AND the U fanbase to the table as well.Granted
that's only about 50,000 extra people on top BYU's national fanbase,
but still, every little bit counts, right?Now THAT's market
power. How many schools could say they could bring two separate fanbases to
another conference? Not many :)Go Cougars!
If we can’t get into the Big 12 or the Pac 12, there is still a way that
BYU could have it great by staying an Independent. Don’t misunderstand
me. More than anything else in college football right now, I want our Cougars
to be a part of the Big 12. But, having said that,If the powers
that be, get rid of the point system, and increase the play off system to
include all teams from the Power 5 conferences + the Mid Major Conferences +
the Independents, there would be no real reason, other than scheduling issues,
to ever leave the Independents.Don’t force Texas to expand
beyond 10 teams for a conference playoff, but instead, let all conferences and
all independents, decide within there own group how many teams they have for
their own group play off and let that winner of that play off advance to the
National Playoff. Inclusion for all 128 Division Teams into the national
playoff system to equal access to play for the National Championship would end
the need for constant scrambling to expand or retract in each conference or as
Brio Mac:Stating the obvious: BYU does sell more tickets. Both main
venues are larger. With 50%+ of the population of Utah being fans
of BYU and less than 20% of the fans being Utah, they should sell more seats.With that said, Utah had 99% renewals for football even as a lowly Pac
12 team and the prices continue to go up at an alarming rate. I have asked for
two more tickets the past three years only to be denied. Utah also sells more
apparel, souvenirs, cool Pac 12 stickers.BYU did sell out the Utah
game and Stadium of Fire last year.
ESPN Fan Poll Should the Big 12 let BYU into the conference?65% Yes35% NoSo the Cougar fan boards must be alive with "go vote in
this poll!"... but ignore the actual article where the Big12 says "no
interest, at all".If you can't make the Big12 take you on
the strength of an ESPN poll, consider starting a whitehouse.gov petition.
Perhaps the President can issue an executive order forcing the Big12 to take
IndewacThe fact that Utah can fill a 45,000-seat stadium
doesn't prove that they could come anywhere close to filling a 65,000-seat
stadium.Unfortunately for U, Utah simply doesn't have enough
fans to fill a 65,000-seat stadium; if they did, they would have expanded RES a
long time ago.BYU was drawing 46,000, more than the capacity of RES,
in 1981, the year BEFORE LES was expanded to 65,000.BYU has averaged
15,000+ MORE fans for the past 32 years.That's not speculation;
that's a verifiable fact.
SoonerUte"So the Cougar fan boards must be alive with "go
vote in this poll!"... "More jealous sniping from the hill?
U have absolutely no proof that the majority of fans voting on the ESPN poll are
BYU fans.The meer fact that the poll exists is proof enough that
there is a national interest in BYU.Remind us, when was the last
time the national media cared enough about Utah to post a poll question about
"ESPN Fan Poll Should the Big 12 let BYU into the conference?65%
Yes35% No "My only question is how many "bots" did
cougarboard use to jimmer this poll. Byu fan spends its life trying to convince
the world (and themselves) they matter....even if it means voting 40,000 times
per person.Smoke and mirrors
SoonerUteDid the Utes "force" the PAC 12 to take them, or
did the Utes beg the PAC to take them as 2nd-class citizens for three full years
before the Utes were even allowed to become full members?The poll is
the opinion of fans. The article is about the statements of a few
Big 12 officials.Try not to confuse the two.
hedgefog"My only question is how many "bots" did
cougarboard use to jimmer this poll."Your only answer is:
NONEGotta luv the jealous sniping from the kids on the hill, though,
based on nothing but their own BYU hatred.
Just to clarify,Utah fans / BYU haters are spamming yet another BYU
article "claiming" that "nobody" has any interest in BYU except
BYU fans?Meanwhile, Utah fans are busy trying to jimmer the ESPN
poll, doing exactly what they're falsely accussing BYU fans of doing.LOL!
Cletus...that was pretty funny! Ute fans beating their chests over being at the
big boy table sounds just like the Huggies commercial with the kid singing about
being a big kid now. Thanks for the laugh!
Interesting results from ESPN polls:Do you believe Pete Carroll when
he says he wouldn't have left USC had he known of the impending NCAA
sanctions?18% Yes82% NoShould the Big 12 let BYU
into the conference?65% Yes35% NoWith similar
results state-by-state, in every state from Washington to Florida, California to
Maine.Only West Virginia and Deleware, with very small vote totals,
say "no", by a slim majority.Regardless of how you slice it,
either BYU truly does have a national fanbase, or thousands more fans of other
teams nationwide care much more about BYU than the jealous kids on the ever
thought possible, or both.Total Votes, so far: 21,024
@ DeepBlueDoesn't matter. They happened, which mean
Brio's statement was false. Also, do you care to explain why conf. titles
won 50 years ago are meaningful, but titles 80 years ago are not? Plus are you
aware that the WAC doesn't exist in football anymore? So I guess we can
throw the titles and awards that BYU won in that nonexistent conference out the
window... Apparently Utah and BYU both have 4 "meaningful"
FACTchequer:"U have absolutely no proof that the majority of
fans voting on the ESPN poll are BYU fans...The meer fact that the poll exists
is proof enough that there is a national interest in BYU."...just as you have no proof that the majority of fans voting on the ESPN poll
are NOT cougar fans. Had you tried reading the comments on those ESPN articles?
Those comments don't reflect a very large margin of pro
BrioAlpine, UT@ MyPerspective:"Actually BYU
has literally almost always finished in the top half of every conference
they've been in for the past half century. And that's been 95% of that
time period that they've competed in conferences. It's been a very
long time since they haven't been in the top tier of each and every
conference they've played in."The point, Brio, is simply
this...byu can't win a conference championship without a conference and it
has become abundantly clear the last 3 weeks that the byu faithful would rather
have a conference. Ooops, Too late.
DeepBlueAnaheim, CA"Trust me, there weren't any major
violations and there won't be any "program crippling" decisions.When the results are finally released, it'll be obvious that all of
the hysteria and hand-wringing was a tempest in a tea cup.Nothing
but a few minor indiscretions and some mild hand slapping will be the end
result."I completely agree with you, DeepBlue. When byu is
finished with its investigation of byu, there's no doubt in my mind that
the alleged improper conduct by an administrator is simply unsubstantiated. And for that very reason, the NCAA needs to take over and conduct a
MyPerspective"the NCAA needs to take over and conduct a proper
investigation."Except for your biased, BYU-hating opinion, what
evidence do you have that the investigation currently being conducted isn't
a proper and fully NCAA-approved investigation?
Its time to start saying that the Big Ten is perfect for BYU.Privately turned down by the PAC12.Publicly turned down by the Big12.Given a not-major label by the SEC and ACC.The Big Ten is the only P5
conference which hasn't taken a position on BYU.Could this be a
match??The Big Ten has gone to simpler "West / East"
division names. Clearly, BYU belongs in the West. Much simpler than trying to
decide if they were a "Legend" or a "Leader". Illinois, Iowa,
Minnesota, Nebraska, Northwestern, Purdue and Wisconsin rolling through Provo
every other year? Awesome!
Solomon LeviAlpine, UT"Except for your biased, BYU-hating
opinion, what evidence do you have that the investigation currently being
conducted isn't a proper and fully NCAA-approved investigation?"You make it too easy. Answer: Except for your byu-loving opinion, what
evidence do you have that the investigation being conducted by byu is as robust,
fact driven, and thorough as it should be? Further, what evidence do you have
that corrective action recommended by byu for byu will be commensurate with
penalties handed down by the NCAA for similar offenses? In short, I
know the NCAA allows self reviews but there are significant and compelling
reasons for the NCAA to exercise a great deal of oversight...especially in this
"Luck added that there are no "available teams" -- schools from the
non-Power Five leagues -- that would add value to the Big 12's per-school
revenue"Please note the last few words: "per-school
revenue". They did NOT say that no schools would add value to the Big 12.
They were talking specifically about the amount of revenue each school would
get. They are saying financially it makes more sense to stay at 10.My take from this whole thing is that in the future if the 5 conferences start
expanding to 16 teams, BYU will be included somewhere. When one conference does
it, another will follow until most or all of the 5 are expanding. I really
don't see BYU not being included in ANY of those expansions.If
none of the teams expand, then they won't invite BYU. Simple as that. If
they are expanding, however, unless there's some bias involved (like with
the PAC), BYU will be a very attractive option for expansion.
little perspective"what evidence do you have that the
investigation being conducted by byu is as robust, fact driven, and thorough as
it should be?"Easy, BYU self-reported the infractions and is
doing the investigation with the NCAA's blessing.It'll be
up to the NCAA what corrective action, if any, is administered.---------------"I know the NCAA allows self reviews but there
are significant and compelling reasons for the NCAA to exercise a great deal of
oversight...especially in this case."Based on what evidence,
besides your own BYU hatred?
SportsFanOrem, UT"Based on what evidence, besides your own
BYU hatred?"Based on byu's penchant for claiming that as a
faith based institution that they are above reproach. Disappointing as it may
be, it has nothing to do with "hate."
little perspectiveBYU tries to hold itself to a higher standard, but
you can't name a single source anywhere that has ever said the BYU claims
to be above reproach.Your entire tone is proof that for you it is
all about "hate" and has absolutely nothing to do with whatever minor
violations might have occurred.
SportsFanOrem, UTCordonBleuPark City, UTLet's wait and see how this plays out.
CordonBleuPark City, UT...and here is the problem..."...nothing to do with whatever minor violations might have
occurred."If you work your way up the chain of comments to
understand the full context of my statement, you will see that it started with a
byu fan minimizing the allegations (just as you did) of what, if anything,
occurred. byu conducting this investigation, any investigation on itself where
outside criteria (NCAA rules) is involved, creates a conflict of interest.
Though the NCAA gave byu the green light to conduct their investigation, the
risk of a slanted outcome is not lost on the NCAA. They will, no doubt, view
the proceedings and conclusion with a healthy dose of professional skepticism as
they should in this case.Now, do I believe that byu will attempt to
minimize the results/conclusion/corrective action in much the same way as the
byu, you, and several fans who posted above? Yes, I do.I'm
sorry, bro, it isn't about "hate" as you so much want to
believe.As I just stated...let's wait and see how this plays
little perspective"If you work your way up the chain of comments
to understand the full context of my statement, you will see that it started
with a BYU fan minimizing the allegations"How do you know that
the BYU fan who, according to you, was trying to "minimize" the
allegations, isn't simply privy to details of what actually happened, but
is smart enough not to discuss those details in an open forum or to reveal
his/her sources?It's quite obvious that you're just
speculating about the possible worst case scenario based on nothing but your own
distortedperspective"I believe that BYU will attempt to minimize
the results/conclusion/corrective action in much the same way as the BYU, you,
and several fans who posted above?"And this makes BYU different
from every other program that's ever been "investigated" by the
NCAA in what way?It's going to be a VERY disappointing day for
you when the findings are announced and the only thing that was "found"
were a few minor infractions.The media and the haters tried their
best to make this into a major storm, when it was really nothing more than a
@My Perspective "I completely agree with you, DeepBlue. When byu is finished
with its investigation of byu, there's no doubt in my mind that the alleged
improper conduct by an administrator is simply unsubstantiated. And
for that very reason, the NCAA needs to take over and conduct a proper
investigation."That is incredibly ironic coming from a fan of a
school who had serious allegations of abuse directed towards their swimming
coach and whose AD apparently knew about it, conducted their own investigation
that basically swept everything under the rug, and who were then mocked by Yahoo
Sports for running such a biased investigation.Fortunately for Utah,
nobody cares enough about the Utes to have done any kind of a follow-up to that
issue.Still, the irony in your previous post is hilarious!Go Cougars!
@MyPerspective It's also amazing to me that you think BYU would
cover or minimize any kind of violations on their part. That would be the same
BYU who immediately suspended Brandon Davies for the rest of the year after an
HONOR CODE violation, a suspension which severely dampened BYU's NCAA
tourney run hopes. Or the same BYU who, after some Ute fan snapped shots of
Spencer Hadley at a party drinking alcohol and reported it to Utah compliance,
suspended Hadley for 5 games (later reduced to 3) for another Honor Code
violation?Didn't the Utes have a player busted for a DUI for
driving on the wrong side of the road get suspended a half of a game? Or Brian
Blechen, who failed multiple drug tests, get suspended for the same number of
games as Spencer Hadley? Talk about minimizing violations. The
Utes are the poster-child for that one.Go Cougars!
BYU should focus on scheduling Big XII opponents. I can't imagine that it
is really THAT hard to get a home and away with Kansas State, KU, Texas Tech,
Iowa State, Baylor, TCU or Oklahoma State. That would beat out home and aways
with Middle Tennessee State. I would like to see annual games with Utah, USU,
ASU, Baylor, and BSU, plus four other Big XII teams and three other games with
power conferences. I'm a Utah BTW. If BYU wants to be taken seriously as an
independent it pretty much can't ever schedule a an FCS team again.
@tinplaterI'm not Mormon and I would WAY rather live in SLC
than anywhere in Arizona. That's not even a comparison.
truecoug1Provo, UT"That is incredibly ironic coming from a
fan of a school who had serious allegations of abuse directed towards their
swimming coach and whose AD apparently knew about it, conducted their own
investigation that basically swept everything under the rug..." Actually, the U didn't conduct their own investigation. It was conducted
by a third party. Although that is far better than an internal investigation,
there are steps I would have liked to see them take to further strengthen the
integrity of the process they used.
phoenixGilbert, AZ"It's going to be a VERY
disappointing day for you when the findings are announced and the only thing
that was "found" were a few minor infractions."I
won't be disappointed at all with that result...if factually correct.
Again, as you stated..."when it was really nothing more than a light
breeze." Let's hope byu's process is more robust and diligent
than your conclusion.skywalkerPalo Alto, CA"How do you know that the BYU fan who, according to you, was trying to
"minimize" the allegations, isn't simply privy to details of what
actually happened..."I know it because the investigation
hasn't concluded and anyone with knowledge of the matter, and possesses a
lick of common sense, wouldn't be talking about it in any way shape or
form.Let it play out, gentlemen. Until then...cheers!
@MyPerspective "Actually, the U didn't conduct their own investigation.
It was conducted by a third party."True, though as the Yahoo
Sports article pointed out, it was a "third party" investigation that
was "paid for by the university and carried out by a team handpicked by the
university". The people spearheading the investigation both had direct ties
to the U, being alumni of the University.But I'm sure they were
completely objective. Luckily, "with a few possible exceptions", there
were no indications of any abuse having occurred at the U. Probably the
single-most hilarious line from an internal investigative report! Yet, it was all swept under the rug, and Chris Hill was let off the hook.
Pretty awesome.U should check out the "Utah failed" article
by Yahoo Sports. Great read. Fortunately, Utah's not a big-time program,
or else the scrutiny from this report would have put a ton of pressure on Chris
Hill to step down.Talk about minimizing violations. Go
deceivingperspective"Actually, the U didn't conduct their
own investigation. It was conducted by a third party."The
"investigation" was conducted by a lifelong Crimson Club member - but of
course you conveniently swept that little detail under the rug.Your
biased minimizing of what goes on at the U versus your hyperbole and false
accusations concerning the Y are grossly inconsistent. Take a look in the
mirror and tell yourself that you're honestly using the same strict
standards of scrutiny when judging the U as you're using while judging the
A few comments on Colorado have shown an arrogance by BYU fans that may come
back to bite them. Colorado was sanctioned for giving walkon athletes meals
below what the NCAA determined that they were worth. A few thousand dollars
destroyed them. They lost scholarships and made bad coaching changes, both of
which together buried their program. They have won a national championship in
the last quarter century, have a Heisman winner and have individual seasons with
more victories over teams that finished in the top 20 then BYU has in its
entire history. Providing free rent to star players over years is a level I
violation. If true, BYU is in trouble. Broncho has done a good job of changing
the topic. Don't be overly critical of the PAC 12 for inviting a school
with 27 NCAA national championships, the last 6 months ago, and a physics
department with Nobel Laureates for leaders. BYU is a top 300-400 institution,
Colorado a top 50 iUniversity in world rankings.
CVMDSorry to disappoint U and the other BYU haters, none of
BYU's supposed "violations" even comes close to a level 1
violation.Colorado's invitation to the PAC 12, like
Utah's, obviously had nothing to do with the "excellence" of their
football program which has been in the dumps for most of the last decade.
I'm not a BYU hater. I just hate arrogance without cause. I also have a
memory. In 2010, Colorado was 5-6 years from its last bowl victory and 3 years
from its last bowl game. But it's history at that time was better than the
lower half of the PAC 10. I find it ironic that BYU fans would trash talk a
school that by all measures had a football program, and currently have a
University, that was superior to BYU until those dreaded under charges for
walkon meals. You too can fall farther, faster. BYU's violations? They
will likely never be really known. However, if, and I mean if, non-LDS athletes
were given money for rent and then paid the apartment manager reduced or gratis
rent and pocketed what was given (otherwise free rent has no purpose), and if
that occurred over several years, as has been alleged, BYU is in trouble. A
decade's worth of lack of institutional oversight fits well within the
definition of a level 1 violation, especially because the violation essentially
would involve direct payment from the University to players less likely to be
attracted to BYU, all arranged by the Director of Football Operations.
CVMD"I'm not a BYU hater."LOL!Your tone and unfounded accusations and conclusions prove otherwise.
@ skywalkerJust because somebody isn't singing praises to BYU,
does not make them a hater. There is a a lot of middle group between those two
In regards to BYU's 2015 FB schedule: Pencil in a home game on Oct 17,
2015. It is rumored that the game on that date at So. Miss is off. It will
probably be rescheduled at a later date. BYU WILL have 6 home games and 6 away
games. We just need to waiit for the contracts to be signed and returned. BYU
doesn't usually finalize their next years' schedules until all leagues
have theirs finalized, as ther are sometimes cancellations and changes that have
to be made. It will work out, I have no doubt.
2ferDon't kid yourself. Anybody who has already appointed
themselves judge, jury, and executioner without even knowing the evidence is
obviously just a hater.
I have to smile. From my perspective there is no reason to hate a middle tier
school with some very good programs and slightly better then middle tier
football program. I do hate the arrogance demonstrated by some fans. But BYU
itself is too blah to hate. As I have now said twice, BYU can fall far fast.
And without a conference, there is no net. Significantly better schools then
BYU on and off the field have had their chops busted by the NCAA for less
serious violations then BYU is investigating. Minimizing the problem is
natural, but I would not dismiss the possibilities I bring up, especially
dismissing them with personal attacks against me instead of reasoned counter
points. Bronco was very wise to change the subject. But the NCAA is not the
Utah press. I would follow some very wise advise 'to walk humbly' at
this stage of your independence sojourn. The other shoe has not dropped, it
might not, but it likely will in the next year or two.
Myth: BYU will join the PAC-12 sometime. Myth busted.As mentioned,
BYU is not a research university on the scale of PAC-12 members. However, I
believe it is much more than that. Granted BYU has some fine individual schools
ie. accounting, law, MBA, etc. But BYU has a major academic problem to
overcome. "Academic Freedom" BYU's academic freedom policies have
been criticized by the American Association of University Professors (AAUP). A
study concluded "that infringements on academic freedom are distressingly
common and that the climate for academic freedom is distressingly poor." In
1998, the AAUP voted to censure BYU, which remains on a list of censured
institutions..."Furthermore, "Northwest Association of Schools and
of Colleges and Universities (the "Northwest Association") reviewed the
University's academic freedom statement and renewed its accreditation. The
Northwest Association specifically approved the University's academic
freedom statement. Such accreditation standards permit "religious colleges
and universities to place limitations on academic freedom so long as they
publish those limitations candidly."Is it any wonder schools like
Stanford, Cal, USC, UCLA admitted Utah rather than BYU?