"A very misleading story recently ran that the jobs lost in the recession
have all been recovered. Then why is unemployment still so high? And why are so
many jobs the low wage ones? That story was a classic case of figures lie and
liers figure."@SCfan - I will agree with you, just about
everything on here is opinion with respect to the economy. One of the things
that bugs me most is when people take over simplistic views on the data being
presented. To you point on jobs, and how we can have more people working but
not a lower unemployment rate. There are a bunch of reasons for it. One for
example is that since the recession hit in 2007, the US population has grown.
So while more people are working, it has not kept up with population growth.
This is not a case of anyone lying. The numbers are what they are.
There are more people working today. That is true. It is equally true that
worker participation is lower - because the raw number of Americans is greater
than it was in 2007... also a truism.
@Redshirt"According to the latest CBO report it will add to the
deficit"The second most recent report they said it'd cut
the deficit. The most recent report they said they weren't even going to
bother with long term projections because the bill keeps changing too much (heh,
I'm sure you can find a joke in there). "So you agree that
Obama's deficits are still larger than Bush's."Sure,
and they're getting smaller every year. "Obama's
policies have slowed the economy and have prevented recovery."I
would disagree since the problem is a lack of demand and we haven't done
enough to stimulate it or put ourselves in a position where consumer demand can
bounce back high enough thanks to high income inequality. "based
on your response, I assume that you agree that Obama has insulted our
allies."I do not. I just figured that neither of us would
convince the other that he did or didn't so I instead figured I'd
point out that insulting allies is not a policy position. "What
deregulation??? The CEOs of many major corporations report that Obama has
INCREASED regulations."Bush deregulation. Obama regulation.
To Kent C. DeForrest, I agree with you 100%. The DN has forgotten that there are
liberal and thinking Mormons out there who agree with the Democrats. I am very
proud of Harry Reid and the fact he is LDS. However the DN seems bent on
publishing letters from the same people all the time. The rebukes they get on
this forum should show them that people for the most part do not agree with this
practice. DN, broaden your base of appeal. Please.
Redshirt... common. The 1920 recession lost 38 percent of GDP, recouped in 10
months, then double dipped right into the 1923-24 recession that lost again 25%.
That recovery lasted a grand total of 18 months until we fell into the next
recession. If that is not enough, we then went into yet another recession in
1926. That is 3 recessions in a time period less than Obama has been President.
Not a great example of "better". Looking at it another
way, the last recession lasted 2 years, and recovery took 4 years - a 1:2 ratio.
The 1926 recession lasted 1 year, 1 month, and took 2 years, 3 months to
recover. The post WW I recession (1918-1919) lasted 7 months, and took more
than 3 years 8 months to recover... a ratio far worse. The issue here is
economic momentum. When the economy moves in a particular direction - velocity
and depth, there is a ratio to the recovery time needed. Additionally, you have
to look at the global economy. " Hyperinflation in Europe" deeply
effected the post WWi recession.Simplistic views of data often give
misleading results. You can't simply discount the global economy and its
To "UtahBlueDevil" but I can compare it to the 1920 recession where
everything tanked more than it did for the Great Depression or the Great
Recession. That was over and done within a couple of years. Historians agree
that what helped was the lack of government involvement. The Depression and the
current Recession lingered because of government interference. If you look at
every recession over the past 100 years, the more the government is involved,
the longer it lasts.You may not like the fact that we have had
recessions that were worse and we recovered from faster, but that is historical
fact. Do some research on the 1920 recession and look at what government did
and compare that to today.
UtahBlueDevilWhat you say is still something of an
"opinion". The Carter Recession of the late 70s had some things much
worse than this one. Interest rates very high. Oil shortages, causing gas
lines. And do you even take into account that Obama may well have caused this
recession to go longer than necessary BECAUSE of his policies? In other words,
using your medical analogy, he may not be a very good economic doctor, which is
my opinion. A very misleading story recently ran that the jobs lost in the
recession have all been recovered. Then why is unemployment still so high? And
why are so many jobs the low wage ones? That story was a classic case of
figures lie and liers figure.
"The Recession was over in July 2009, yet the effects of the recession
remain a drag on the economy 5 years later. Typically recessions are gone in
less than 2 years. Obama's policies have slowed the economy and have
prevented recovery."This would be a very accurate statement if
this had been an ordinary recession. But alas it wasn't. It was the
largest and deepest event in capital destruction since the great depression.
More jobs were lost from 2007 to 2009 than any other recession. You can't
compare an event that was twice as bad as the average, and expect recovery to be
average.It like saying someone recovering from major surgery should
have the same recovery time as someone who had minor surgery. Logic tells you
there will be a difference. Problem is logic has been completely lost, and
this is all about emotion... and hate.... not logic.
Imperial presidents don't live by the constitution.
To "Schnee" I don't think you pay attention to the news.Obamacare is not paid for. According to the latest CBO report it will add to
the deficit.Actually Egypt is our fault, according to the Huffington
Post article "Can America Take Credit for the Arab Spring?" Obama takes
full credit for the Arab Spring.So you agree that Obama's
deficits are still larger than Bush's.The Recession was over in
July 2009, yet the effects of the recession remain a drag on the economy 5 years
later. Typically recessions are gone in less than 2 years. Obama's
policies have slowed the economy and have prevented recovery.Yes it
isn't policy to insult our allies, but based on your response, I assume
that you agree that Obama has insulted our allies.Lets see tax cuts,
Obama added more loopholes and made the tax system worse with Obamacare. What
deregulation??? The CEOs of many major corporations report that Obama has
INCREASED regulations. Actually Obama never tried to close Gitmo. Bush never
did anything for or against the LGBT community just like Obama. Bush gave us
CFL bulbs for the environment. According to the CBO Obama has increased
@Curmudgeon Do you realize that delay is built into the system of legislation.
Delay causes consensus because it requires people to come to an agreement -
which requires people to convince people of the value of doing something (or,
Heaven forbid, doing nothing). No past president has acted as frequently to
substitute his judgment in the place of the legislature on what needs to be
done. This ignores the very system created to represent the people as a whole.
Yes, Congress is a good representation of the "people." Consensus on
what needs to be done, or not to be done, is difficult.This
President, along with his administration, has arbitrarily chosen to substitute
its judgment as to what laws are worthy of defense (DOMA) and what laws are
worthy of enforcement - rather than to let the judicial system have the benefit
of sorting out facts through the legal system. This is another system that
advocates delay in the interest of getting it right.When one person
(and his administration} = regardless of political affiliation - substitutes
their ego and philosophy upon a system, the people are meant to be protected by
that system no longer have the benefit of those protections.
I long for Americans who will see the flaws in the politicians of their OWN
party and admit it when they are wrong. But today we have in the Democrat party
many who will never admit the mistakes of Obama. Only attack the messengers.
Being a good patriot is not about defending the indefensible just because it is
of your own party. As One Vote pointed out, a mistaken war by Bush, true, but
the torching of the economy is of Obama. Bush has not been President for the
last 5 plus years. And yet so many still want to hang the economy on Bush. Why
not Clinton? The economy went sour back in 2000 at the end of Clinton.
Bushs' economy was pretty good during his 8 years, especially after having
to deal with 911. You guys never give him credit for that do you. Why
don't you liberals at least take Harry Reids lead and try to blame it all
on the Koch Brothers. At least you'd be living in real time liberal
@Cougsndawgs West Point , UTYou've never served in the
Military - have you.We never pray more, than when we are soldiers.Truth be known -- I prayed more a soldier, than I ever did as a
LDS Missionary.Big difference of praying for investigators, and praying for your life, or lives of your buddies.
This was an insult to the Deseret News. Why print such hatred towards our duly
elected President when other letters are not published as illustrated by several
writers on this blog. You need to step up and be more responsible. This letter
was an insult and not worthy of publication.
Irony Guy:You are wrong. He kept correspondence, letters to continental
congress, and his writings about strategy and combat together with a journal
that are all found in the Washington Papers in the library of congress. He even
had a specific soldier that he put in charge of protecting said papers. Multiple
times he refers to "invoking providence" for the continental army and
the leaders in the continental congress.. He also kept a prayer journal which it
would seem ludicrous to carry if he weren't actually going to use it,
don't you think? All of these are at anyone's disposal to read.
Nothing "made up" about it.Whether he knelt or not
isn't the point...though I appreciate your insight on that. The fact he
prayed both as a soldier and as a president without concern for how anyone else
would deem it (including wearing his Mason Apron) was the point.
one vote:"Long for a President that starts a war on a mistake?"I long for Senators who would vote against a war in Iraq War rather then
those who voted for it such as Hillary Clinton, John Kerry, and Joe Biden.I long for a president who will promise over and over that you can keep
your doctor and healthcare plan.I long for a president who will not
enforce the laws of the land such as our immigration laws.I long for
a president who will release five hardened terrorists fro jail in exchange for a
deserter.I long for a president who will tell Congress... 'What
difference does it make' when trying to explain why four Americans died
needlessly in Benghazi.The Real Maverick:"And why
doesn't she think Obama doesn't love the country?"A
president who loved this country will not try to destroy it... such as what the
current president is doing, in spades. And he only has 2 1/2 years left to do
it. So little time. So much to do.
Cougsndawgs, you are simply making stuff up. George Washington did not keep a
journal at Valley Forge. There is no record anywhere of George Washington
praying at Valley Forge. The picture you and Linda have in your mind was created
by Arnold Friberg nearly 200 years after the fact. I'm sure George
Washington as a Mason said standing prayers often, but he himself often said he
would never kneel for any reason.
Continued...To both Maverick & LDS LiberalWhy are you two
attacking me as if I've taken a conservative or liberal stance? My comment
called for more morality and reason from both parties. Or do you both assume
it's only the right side of the aisle with all the wrong ideas and
behaviors? Anyone who believes one side is more moral, honest, or without
scruples is naive and you both know it. I am a registered republican and voted
for bush the first time around...I openly criticized many of his actions and
didn't vote for him a second time. Why is it so difficult for liberals to
call their own president on the carpet for his incompetence and malfeasance?
Real Maverick & LDS Liberal:I couldn't understand why you both
were hounding me about the possibility of Obama praying. I read my post and
realized that it may have sounded like I was suggesting he doesn't. Let me
clarify, what I was saying was that a president can't openly pray in
today's climate without someone taking issue with it. LDS
Liberal:Now that I've clarified the above let me address the rest of
your comment. I have extensively read and studied George Washington's
history including his NUMEROUS references to prayer in his journal while at
Vally Forge. I am well aware that the painting is a depiction of those prayers,
but appreciate your patronizing way of pointing out the obvious to me. Nowhere
in my comments do I make reference to a "National Rameumptum".I have read the Book of Mormon but you've painted a picture that is far
too simplistic of the demise of the Nephites. It wasn't just war for gain
that cost them. To presume war is never necessary is to denigrate Captain
Moroni, Helaman, Mormon, and Moroni. The argument between liberals and
conservatives is WHEN is it necessary.
Mikhail:If the current president seems to be moving faster, it is
probably only in comparison to Congress, which is at a virtual standstill. It
looks to me like he has had little success in asserting power over Congress.And how is Obama increasing his power over the judiciary, when he
can't even get the Senate to vote on his judicial nominations (you do
realize that he has the Constitutional right and duty to nominate judges,
Many of these comments reflect the assumption that because people are not happy
with the current POTUS, they must have been happy with the previous POTUS. Not
true. Based upon the principles that I believe the Constitution is based upon, I
believe that there are complaints that would be valid against both of these
administrations. However, the current POTUS seems to want to accelerate - at an
even greater speed than the previous three presidents - the growth of the
Federal government and to specifically increase the power of the executive
office over the legislative and judicial bodies. Where the Constitution
requires a balance of powers, this administration has accelerated the
centralization of the executive powers at a greater rate - moving to imbalance.
That does not mean that the previous presidents did not do the same thing.
However, the rate at which this seems to happen and the extent of the hubris
involved is truly unprecedented.
@ George F.What exactly do you speak of? Your comment is without
explanation or validity.
@Redshirt"Bush gave us an expanded Medicare with subsidies for people
on fixed incomes. Obama gave us subsidies for healthcre for the poor."Obamacare is paid for, Medicare Part D was not (that was the liberal
issue with it)."Bush gave us Afghanistan and Iraq, Obama gave us
Libya, surges in Afghanistan, military action in Africa, and destabilized
Egypt."Starting two land wars is not the same as cleaning up a
mess and an air campaign. Egypt isn't our fault. "Bush gave
us $400 billion deficits, Obama gave us $1.2 Trillion deficits."Bush's 2009 budget (his last, it starts Oct 2008 so it overlaps) was
projected to be a trillion. Obama's 2014 budget is projected to be below
600 billion. "Obama gave us the Great Recession"Inherited."Bush angered a few of our allies, Obama has
insulted any remaining allies"Not policy. "I am
not aware of any major policy that Bush had that Obama has not pumped up and
made bigger and more intrusive."Tax cuts, economic deregulation,
Guantanamo (Congress blocked Obama's attempt at closing it), abortion
restrictions, LGBT opposition, environmental policy rollbacks, defense spending.
Great job Linda!
Great letter Linda.
To "Schnee" your view of Obama is quite limited.Bush gave us
an expanded Medicare with subsidies for people on fixed incomes. Obama gave us
subsidies for healthcre for the poor.Bush gave us Afghanistan and
Iraq, Obama gave us Libya, surges in Afghanistan, military action in Africa, and
destabilized Egypt.Bush gave us $400 billion deficits, Obama gave us
$1.2 Trillion deficits.Bush was away at his ranch, Obama spends his
time on the Golf Course.Bush had a recession to deal with that
lasted 2 years, Obama gave us the Great Recession that is still lingering on 5
years later.Bush bailed out home owners, Obama bailed out GM.Bush angered a few of our allies, Obama has insulted any remaining
allies that we had.Bush was accused of not being open, the Obama
administration is the most secretive in recent history.I am not
aware of any major policy that Bush had that Obama has not pumped up and made
bigger and more intrusive. Just think back to anything that you hated about
Bush, now look at Obama, has it changed or is it just bigger?
@Redshirt1701"why is Obama good for taking Bush's policies and
making them bigger?"I can't think of any examples of that
other than domestic surveillance type stuff, and that's one of the main
qualms liberals have with Obama.
Good letter! Me too!
To "LDS Liberal" I keep asking you this, and you never seem to respond
with anything coherent.If Bush and his policies were so evil and
bad, why is Obama good for taking Bush's policies and making them
bigger?Obama is the SAME as Bush. The only difference is the
magnitude of their programs.What you forget about the Nephites is
that their civilization collapsed when they abandoned God and looked to create a
strong central government that was run by a few Kings. They gave up their
freedom for a king, that is when the disparity occured. Much like today, we
have people looking to make the governmetn stronger and strong with more
authority over the people. Things will get worse until we break the bondage
that the government imposes and allow all people to be free.
LDS Liberal nailed it.As long as the Nephites cared for the poor and
sick, and weren't overwhelmed with trickle down economics (giving the rich
all the wealth and waiting for it to trickle down onto everyone else) they were
protected. They worshipped god more than money. In battle, they could not be
defeated in self defense. However, as soon as they started a pre-emptive war and
invaded the Lamanites, they were destroyed.I see today, a rush of
prideful people. They desire wealth as quickly as they can. They don't care
if they have to lie, cheat, gouge, or treat their employees as slaves. I see today, invasions performed by our country against countries that never
attacked us.I hear soothsayers on the radio talk about how living in
gluttony is acceptable and desirable. It's his money, he can do whatever he
wants with it!I fear that the lessons taught in scripture have been
lost. Remember, when much is given much is required. Heaven help us
@Cougsndawgs West Point , UTI long for a nation and a
president that, like Washington at Vally Forge, will get on his knees to offer
supplication and ask for direction and protection without concern at who might
be offended at such action.11:26 a.m. June 10, 2014====== 1. Do you live at the WhiteHouse? How do you know Pres.
Obama does in not praying?Prayers are given in private.BTW --
That painting of Washington praying at Valley Forge is just that, a PAINTING. By
LDS artist Arnold Freiberg. Accurate? most likely, but any President could be
painted praying.And he is portrayed as praying by himself.I never recall Washington climbing upon a National Rameumptum as you imagine
him.2. And if you are wo4rried about America -- Read the Book of
Mormon.It was the once righteous Nephites - who ignoring their prophets
about tending to the poor, the sick, and the needy -- became a War-thirty people
who wanted nothing more than to wipe out and destroy their enemies. For GAIN.They were lovers of War, more than lovers of Peace.IMHO, the GOP
seems is more in-line with that prophecy.I wish Pres. Obama well.
"I long for a nation and a president that, like Washington at Vally Forge,
will get on his knees to offer supplication"How do you know that
Obama isn't that President? How do you know that he isn't on his knees
in supplication every single night?I think what's questionable
are the religious convictions of people like this letter writer. How can you
pray to the master on your knees and then write such hateful words about one of
your fellow brothers and sisters? How can you enter the house of The Lord with
such feeling like those expressed in this letter?We definitely need
to be a humbled people. Slow to anger. Full of kindness and understanding.
I long for a day when ideology didn't blind so many to what we have.
@Mike RichardsSo which president falls into that category for you? So
Obama is a no(i'm making the assumption based on your comments,
Bush(please, justify if you disagree) Clinton didn't, HW Bush didn't,
Regan didn't.........Which presidents actually followed their duties, and
didn't stray even a little bit, for 100% of their presidency. Please lets
hear it. Because I can't think of a single one(that was in office for over
I long for peace where liberals and conservatives can see past the propaganda
they both circulate, and work for and take care of this great nation. I fear the
Lincolns and Jeffersons are gone, replaced by those with riches and influence
and a lust for power that our forefathers feared would be the outcome of a
government without proper balance. I pray every day for this country that I
love...unfortunately God no longer matters to most in this country because
he's been tossed asunder by the cries of being offended or psychologically
hurt by uttering his name. I long for a nation and a president that, like
Washington at Vally Forge, will get on his knees to offer supplication and ask
for direction and protection without concern at who might be offended at such
action. This nation was a model and beacon of how a free republic can
prosper...no other nation rose to power so quickly. I fear it may fall just as
quickly when undermined by dishonesty and bereft of morality on both sides of
Re: Kent DeForrestAgain your answer is yes! you hit the nail on the
head! That having been said, the liberal side gets a pretty fair shake in the
other local newspaper and to be fair they have their agenda also. It pays to
read them both and also any unbiased, although they are few and far between!
coincidentally I read yesterday on Politico that Jon Huntsman Sr. is interested
in buying the Trib. in an effort to keep a forum for both left as well as right
wing opinions! Kudo to him! Truely a man of character and class!
I am bewildered and dumb founded that any sane, right minded person can defend
what this president has been doing to our country.
@ Kent C. DeForrest, the answer to your question is yes.
I do what our Prophets and Apostles have told us to do -- I pray and
WISH President Obama the very best for our Country, Thank you.
You have just such a president now, and will also for the next 2 terms in
I long for a nation of people who can think for themselves and not be herded
into a corral of hate and misinformation. I long for a professional
media of information not owned and controlled by business interests. I long for the truth about why we have a military and what it is being used
for. I long for a president that would represent the people of the
U.S. giving more emphasis to their wishes for the good life rather than the
phony life imposed by others. I long for a president who loves the
people of this country.I long for an economic system that serves all
the people and not just the rich and powerful.
Well, Linda, you know what they say? What goes around comes around!For 8 years we suffered under the worst administration in the history of our
country. A man completely inept for the job but desired it so he could resolve
some childhood issue with his father (who also had been President). A quick
google search reveals that who were conveniently silent, writing zero letters
complaining about that President and the abuses practiced by his regime. He
wasn't even elected by the majority of Americans!Therefore,
because I had to deal with that you then need to deal with Obama. If you are
tired of Democrat rule, then be accountable and find better GOP candidates. The
current 2016 crop of Rubio, Santorum, and Bush, don't stand a chance
against Hillary. When you see 16 years of Democrat rule in the White House,
don't blame them, blame your own party.
Everything necessary has already been said about this ridiculous letter. But I
would like to raise a beef with the Des News opinion page editors. I ask in all
seriousness why you willingly print this sort of obnoxious Faux News type of
hate speech about the president but you refuse to print the far more cogent
"My View" piece I submitted recently. Is it because I directly addressed
the irrational stands the GOP has taken on nearly every possible issue? Is it
your editorial mission to protect the Republican Party from valid criticism?
Anyone can read Obama's list of authorized duties. Article II of the
Constitution lists his duties and the limit of his authority. Obama refuses to
accept those limits; instead, he demands the authority to replace
Congress's authorized duty to legislate with a self-appointed duty to write
his own legislation. He refuses to listen to the Court and decides for himself
whether laws are Constitutionally legal or not.He tells us whatever
he wants us to hear, never-mind that most of what he tells us is opposite of the
facts. He diverts attention from his follies by creating even
larger follies.The Democrats in office flee from his presence. They
don't want him anywhere near their States and districts. They want us to
forget that they voted for ObamaCare. They want us to forget the lies that were
told, the "deals" that were made, the rules that were changed, and the
fact that everything promised was one lie after another.We will not
forget Obama's lies nor will be forget the lies told by those in his
The transcript of President Obama's D-Day speech is readily available
online. It was a moving, non-partisan, thoughtful speech. That speech could have
been read by any American, including any current Republican with aspirations to
the presidency, and not have raised a single eyebrow. But because
President Obama spoke those otherwise completely appropriate words, the right
wing chooses to make a stink about. Nothing speaks more powerfully to the deep
irrationality of today's conservatives than this criticism of the
president's D-Day speech.
Gosh, Linda, we have exactly what you want. Only a lot smarter and principled
than the prior Administration.
More sour grapes from the right because of Romney's loss? Isn't it about time Linda gets over it?
Was this letter lost in the mail for about seven years?
"I long for a president who would make us feel proud."How
could he/she do that? I know, let's invade a country which has not invaded
8 of the worst years in U.S. History under GW and nothing...yet now we get
5 1/2 years of this dribble daily...
Re: Linda D. WagstaffLinda, you write "In hearing President
Obama delivering D-Day comments, I was flooded with these thoughts:I
long for a president who understands the need for a strong military and acts
accordinglyI long for a president who honors his oath of office and
would uphold (and live by) the constitution.I long for a president
who would strive to create opportunities for U.S. citizens, and not have created
a system that encourages dependency.I long for a president who would
make us feel proud.I long for a president who loves this country
write "Linda this is your lucky day! I have found just the man,
and he just happens to be the present POTUS. Whats more you get even luckier!
He will be followed by Hillary, your longing days are over. Enjoy!
The incumbent is the president you long for, but your right-wing, partisan
blinders prevent you from seeing that he has all the qualities you describe.
Linda... my recommendation then to you is to turn off the radio.... change
channels on the TV.... or do something productive with your life. Why do I say
that? Because you have obviously been listening to the wrong sources of
information. If you make the claim that the sitting President doesn't
love this country, then you are listening or reading to sources of information
that is propaganda, or being said for shock only.There is a huge
difference between someone not loving this country, and someone who doesn't
share you policy choices. People can completely disagree on how to deal with
health care, taxes, defense spending, and equally love this nation. To presume
one must think like you as evidence of their love of country shows an amazingly
narrow view of the world and nation we live in. Our histories are not the same.
Or regions are not the same. People are not all the same. They don't
have to be just like to - to love this country.Find something
virtuous, lovely, or of good report or praiseworthy to fill your mind with -
rather than the entertainment based news sources. Their whole is to make you
Wait, our military is weak? Since when? Apparently Linda wants us to
spend 4 times as much on defense as the rest of the world rather than just 2
times.And why doesn't she think Obama doesn't love the
country? What's different about Obama than all the other presidents?
There's something, I know, could someone please tell me?
Apparently Ms. Wagstaff didn't listen to the president's D-Day
message. Because if she had she would realize that we have in office today a
president that meets every standard she longs for.
Great letter. I agree wholeheartedly.
Long for a President that starts a war on a mistake? Long for one that torches
the economy and creates financial chaos?