Well the cougar faithful are back after mourning the demise of their beloved
cougars and beating up another of their gimme game opponents. Why is everything
always Utah's or Kyle's fault? I didn't read anything in the
article about the Mruphys yet they are the center of many/some of the comments?
The article I read was about QB's. About how common it has become for them
to transfer. It was not about steeling recruits from other schools. It was not
about missionary's transferring. It was not about attacking coaches or
parents of players. Isn't that off topic? Why does the Deseret News allow
bullying comments like these?
How to get an athlete to switch schools ? Send him on a mission.
@Navel "Upon returning from his mission, Jake, accompanied by his
father, drove straight to a Ute practice session to observe....Nowhere in that
article did it state that they drove straight to the U "from the
airport", and nowhere in that article did it state that the met immediately
with Kyle Whittingham.""Upon returning from his mission"
and "drove straight to a Ute practice" seems pretty clear if you take
Doug Robinson at his word. Show us some facts to prove your point
that it wasn't straight from the airport. That sounds pretty made up on
your part. Also in Doug's article it doesn't say anywhere that they
DIDN'T meet immediately with Kyle Whittingham. I don't
know if ute fall practices are wide open to the general public or if
they're closed and would require something arranged and permission granted
beforehand. If it was the latter then reason would dictate there was some
communication before hand to gain admittance and then upon arriving because he
would've been expected. Why get so emotionally frantic about
utah's recruitment of Jake while on his mission?
@Navel "And 100% of THOSE sorts of comments are based off of no real
facts whatsoever, but rather frantic emotion."nice swerve, but
you weren't able to avoid the direct hit and sinking of your battleship by
Bluentheface when he pulled out a cold hard fact in rebuttal. Actually both
Bluentheface and Darren Rowe fired salvos that found their mark. Both referenced
Harvey Unga commenting on the differences in being recruited by BYU and Utah.
@uteology"Speaking of doormat, BYU is 2-5 vs PAC-12 and
0-4 vs Utah. "and during the Bronco Mendenhall era BYU is 9-9 vs
the Pac10/12 (3 of those losses are vs Utah as a member of the PAC). I would say
that BYU in the Bronco era has been mediocre but certainly not a doormat
competing against the PAC.
@tinplaterSeems like a question not really worth asking. I bet Stango would disagree with you on something as simple and true as the
sky is blue or the pope is catholic just out of sheer spite.
Couldn't disagree more tinplater.
@tinplaterHow come there can't be more posters on the Des News
like you? You are one of the few who doesn't get caught up in the vitriol
and chest-pounding.I thought your analysis of Utah's situation
in the Pac-12 was spot on. They have a huge uphill battle and are in a
potentially vicious cycle if they don't make a bowl game again.Besides, the banter between U and Y fans is everlasting proof those fan bases
will never quit each other.
So Stang0, I don't care if you can't believe it or not..do you agree
tinplater,"I just don't get all this chest thumping at the
cost of other school's programs? Do you get a testosterone rush by
belittling others?" I can't believe you just said that. Especially
after what I've heard on other sports pages. That is incredible.
"Do you deny that your fan base is heavily comprised of folks that just need
a forum to hate the LDS church and their school?"I would
disagree that Utah's fan base is heavily comprised of people who hate the
LDS church. They certainly exist, but I believe that they are a (very vocal)
@ UteologyBoth schools have sportsmanship issues. Plenty of Utes,
including Alex Smith who never retracted his hateful comments like Max did, have
expressed their hate in various forms. But I won't get into a pity contest
over anecdotal stuff.Do you deny that your fan base is heavily
comprised of folks that just need a forum to hate the LDS church and their
school? There are plenty of these that give you decent fans a bad rep.
BYU's bad rep is for being poor sports and for not always being too
informed about the sport we're cheering for. Sometimes fans just show up
for a social gathering, etc.Go Cougs!
At Ute BYU fans...I just don't get all this chest thumping at the cost of
other school's programs? Do you get a testosterone rush by belittling
others? Both BYU and Utah face significant challenges..one as an independent,
the other almost doomed to be in the bottom half of their conference. Utah has
to deal with competing schools that have better climate, culture, academics,
coaching, and endowment. Rose Bowl dreamin is replaced by California Dreamin
for many potential PAC 12 athletes.
Naval I'm not sure what part of "Upon returning from his
mission, Jake, accompanied by his father, drove straight to a Ute practice
session"you don't understand. It doesn't say he went
home first, it doesn't say he visited his buddies forst, it doesn't
say he saw his girlfriend first, it says "Upon returning from
his mission, Jake...drove straight to a Ute practice session"Pretty clear language. lol
BigCougarBountiful, UT@proudute"We're trying to
wave politely to you all through the rear view mirror"I never
realized doormats had a rear view mirror. Yes, you have us there. It's
every football fans goal in life to become a doormat.-------------Speaking of doormat, BYU is 2-5 vs PAC-12 and 0-4 vs
Utah. It's every football fans goal that their team has a
chance to compete at the highest level. Is that what your fans were
dreaming of when your team tried to join the WAC?
@BlueAgain, without the BYU hate, your fan base doesn't have much to
cheer for. You just can't quit us. lol-------------This coming from fans that pelted PAC-12 refs with garbage last year?Or when players like Max Hall who only talked about his love for Utah, not his
teams big win? Or how about Lenny Gomes who in 1993 after a loss to Utah was
was so classy that he was more concerned about which Utah players will be
pumping his gas after graduation.
@ekute and Naval VetI can think of a great example of utah using
negative recruiting tactics... Harvey UngaHe decided to call Bronco
and tell him he was going to utah, and call Kyle and tell him he was going to
BYU. Whoever gave him the most polite and classy response is who he would play
for.Bronco essentially said, "Congratulations. You will have a
lot of success at utah and we look forward to playing against you. Good
luck."Kyle essentially said, "What!? Are you kidding me? Why
would you go to BYU instead of utah? They will just switch you to linebacker and
you will hardly play, and you will be poorly developed."And the
rest is history. He came to BYU and became our all-time leading rusher in 3
years. If you think I am making this up, feel free to Google it.
So we should solve the 'problem' by adding an additional quarterback
I was definitely not an athlete. I had two years of college in Texas when I
went on my mission and I had never considered for a second going to BYU. But by
the time my mission was completed I gave no thought to going to any other
college. My mission certainly converted me to why I should finish my college
years at BYU. Athletics and a scholarship had nothing to do with it. So
it's entirely possible that missionaries who are athletes might just decide
while on their mission that they would rather be at BYU.
@proudute"We're trying to wave politely to you all through the
rear view mirror"I never realized doormats had a rear view
mirror. Yes, you have us there. It's every football fans goal in life to
become a doormat.
@xam"So it's okay for kids to change their mind and transfer to
BYU (Josh Sharp, Riley Nelson), but if a kid changes his mind and transfers out
of BYU (Jake Murphy) then BYU somehow got shafted. Please explain the
difference."Just the opposite, byu haters and some actual ute
fans get in an uproar about it (ever read a message board on a DN article
before?) and Duck was pointing out the hypocrisy of their POV.Before
my mission I had no desire to go to BYU, but after my mission I felt entirely
different about it. For other kids it's just the opposite. I don't see
why it's a big deal to be honest.
"We're trying to wave politely to you all through the rear view mirror
but you won't let go of our bumper because we won't let you in the
back seat."Stop waving and wake up to the fact that your car is
@BlueAgain, without the BYU hate, your fan base doesn't have much to
cheer for. You just can't quit us. lol We're trying to
wave politely to you all through the rear view mirror but you won't let go
of our bumper because we won't let you in the back seat.
@ekute"A byu fan will never win a discussion about athletes
being pressured to change their commitment while on their missions."But I'm not trying "to win a discussion" I'm just
posting the facts and letting those expose utah "fans". It is what I do,
effectively and constantly, and I did it again here. It's fun.
@ ekuteGood catch about this being a 4-school article. I'm very
egocentric today I guess, plus I usually just go to "BYU" in the sports
section. lol. Still though, the articles with the most comments tend to be
BYU-related.Go Cougs, Utes, Aggies, TBirds!
@ Naval VetI'll give you that a lot of the Utah BYU fans may
loathe you, especially as of late. I've never been much of a Utah hater and
absolutely loved it when y'all handed it to Alabama in the 2008 season. I
don't personally know any BYU fans that hate the Utes actually. It's a
phenomenon that's played out online when BYU articles are overrun with
smack. I usually only go to the BYU articles since that's my team and I
have to sift through all the usual narration from Ute fans.Again,
without the BYU hate, your fan base doesn't have much to cheer for. You
just can't quit us. lolGo Cougs.
BlueNtheFace:"It comes from the same inferiority complex
that's demonstrated by all of you Y-haters on these BYU articles. 80% of
Ute fan pride is based on BYU hate."And 100% of THOSE sorts of
comments are based off of no real facts whatsoever, but rather frantic emotion.
I'll bet a lot of those deep loathing, frantic and emotional banter coming
from you Y fans are based on deep loathing for the U, and a terrible inferiority
complex. That sort of thing comes with the territory when your big brother
twice busted the BCS, then got the very invitation you all had been pretending
was coming your way for the past 30+ yrs.
Duckhunter,So it's okay for kids to change their mind and
transfer to BYU (Josh Sharp, Riley Nelson), but if a kid changes his mind and
transfers out of BYU (Jake Murphy) then BYU somehow got shafted. Please explain
Depth and competition is a good think; especially at the QB position.@NavalvetThanks for setting the record straight; not that I ever
put any stock into a certain individuals post.
BlueNtheFace,This is a Utah, USU and SUU article. lol.
@ Naval VetWhen trying to sway Harvey from decomitting from Utah,
Kwitt got a little frantic and emotional himself: "Unga said Whittingham
told him that the Cougars would switch him to linebacker and that he would
regret his decision. Unga added that BYU's coaches supported him regardless
of where he opted to play, which solidified his choice to stay in Provo."
-Deseret News, Nov. 22 2007 That's one from the top of my head.
Other BYU players have said that the Honor Code is used as a UofU scare tactic.
It comes from the same inferiority complex that's demonstrated by all of
you Y-haters on these BYU articles. 80% of Ute fan pride is based on BYU
hate.Now that's emotional.Go Cougars!
Duckhunter,A byu fan will never win a discussion about athletes being
pressured to change their commitment while on their missions.
@ekute"Administrators put a lot of pressure on college coaches
to recruit game changing athletes...Roger Reid."What does that
have to do with kids tranfering after their missions unless you are insinuating
that the university of utah is pressuring their coaches to recruit missionaries
that already committed to other schools?I don't recall Roger
Reid having ever done that, can you give us an example of when he did?
@braxtonSo let me get this straight, you think that because athletes
want to transfer to BYU after their missions it is somehow BYU's fault? And
you think BYU is making it difficult for other schools to recruit Mormons how?
What is it BYU does that makes it "difficult"?How about you
provide us with support for that claim?Also do you really think
other schools make it hard for kids that want to transfer or walk on at their
schools but BYU alone makes those things "easy"?Really that
was one of the more senseless posts I have ever read on here. I
think your bitterness stems from the fact so many kids that have gone on
missions do want to transfer to BYU when they return. This is generally because
they have changed as an individual while they were gone and if I had my guess
most of them probably think it is the best place for them to find a wife more
than any other factor but many probably want the BYU lifestyle as well. Nothing
improper on BYU's part there, it is just desirable for those kids.
BlueNtheFace:"I'm not sure there is a program out there
that uses negative recruiting tactics as extensive as Utah does when it talks to
a BYU/Utah recruit. Kwitt is a specialist."Such as...? Can you
back that up, or where you just saying whatever "felt good" to say?
Because that would have been the "frantic and emotional" response.
Let's see some facts.
Duckhunter:"Of course the murphies admitted when they said in an
interview in this very paper that dale picked jake up from the airport and drove
him straight up to the university of utah to meet with kyle whittingham."That sounded made up. So I checked.That Doug Robinson
article you were referencing ultimately said, "Because the Utes had not
recruited Jake, they were able to offer him a scholarship in the fall. Upon
returning from his mission, Jake, accompanied by his father, drove straight to a
Ute practice session to observe, and that was that."[re:
"Doug Robinson: Utah turns out to be the right fit for Jake Murphy",
Saturday, Aug. 20 2011]Nowhere in that article did it state that
they drove straight to the U "from the airport", and nowhere in that
article did it state that the met immediately with Kyle Whittingham. And
furthermore, it was very specific when it said, "Because the Utes had NOT
recruited Jake..." [emphasis mine].Yep. I was right. You made
it up. How frantic and emotional of you.
Duckhunter, I believe Dale Murphy told his son to go to Utah because BYU
didn't have anyone to throw the ball to him. A gritty defensive back and
a running back coming next posing as quarterbacks.
Hey Dick. I would love you to investigate and do an article to educate the
readers how BYU is making it difficult for mormon athletes to be recruited
because of the transfer issue. Coaches across the country won't recruit
Mormons for fear that they will put all their efforts and money recruiting a
mormon then have them want to go to BYU after the mission. BYU makes the walk
on and transfer so easy and some coaches at BYU find grey areas to contact the
missionaries. a coach at ASU, who is also Mormon has stated he won't
recruit anyone BYU show an interest in for this very reason. How about an
article on this subject.
BlueNtheFace,My comment has nothing to do with negative Utah/byu
recruiting but can you cite examples to backup your comment?
@ ekuteReid didn't last too long after trying that desperate
strategy. I'm not sure there is a program out there that uses negative
recruiting tactics as extensive as Utah does when it talks to a BYU/Utah
recruit. Kwitt is a specialist. Don't throw stones, sir.Go
Duckhunter,Administrators put a lot of pressure on college coaches to
recruit game changing athletes...Roger Reid.
@ JDCompletely false about Riley. Everyone in his family and his
Logan High coaching staff knew that he was going to go to BYU post-mission. I
heard it from Coach Anderson days after he left. No one at BYU recruited that
missionary. His dad was the facilitator. @ evansrichdmFootball wasn't the only reason Ammon chose to go to BYU, though a big
part. He gave it his best to beat out Taysom but fell short --> Plan B.
Riley N. saw something that attracted him to BYU as well. Go Cougs!
I know BYU has a great online program, but it feels weird to have kids that are
enrolled at other universities taking online classes from BYU for graduation
credit, especially athletes. This isn't a small problem, I understand a
lot of people are doing it. It has the potential to be a conflict of interest.
While I have nothing against educating youth, something needs to be done if you
enrolled somewhere else to limit BYU's online classes to non-credit only.
@jdGreat point. When the university of utah was busy recruiting jake
murphy while he was on his mission it was obvious something needed to be
changed. Of course the murphies admitted when they said in an interview in this
very paper that dale picked jake up from the airport and drove him straight up
to the university of utah to meet with kyle whittingham who was waiting for him
there. What an incredible admission of guilt and aknowledgment of
hwo the univeristy of utah works.
I think time will tell how these QBs will pan out. If I felt like I had enough
talent to play at the next level (which I can't even imagine what that
would be like), I don't think it would benefit me sitting behind a starter.
I too would transfer. I look at BYU and Utah and how many QBs they have and I
don't think I'd stick around unless I had a serious chance and they
were developing me.Go UTES!!
Players should be able to transfer without penalty.Coaches move on
without penalty.Players should be able to do the same.
The NCAA had to create a by-law because a certain team was contacting athletes
while they were on their missions and not allowing other schools to contact
them. So I don't think we can really include one of the QB's listed in
the article, he really didn't transfer, he was recruited, oh the life of
EvansrichdmNot sure about the "great talent" thing with
Heaps. He performed even worse at Kansas than he did at BYU. I think he was
overhyped beyond belief and his talent never came close to his hype.
I've said it before, I can't wait to have Ammon back in Thunderbird
red. Why he ever transferred to BYU is beyond me. There is no way he was going
to start there. Not with all the QB's they always have coming in. Now
he'll most likely start and help us get to more playoff games. Looking
forward to a great year in Cedar.
Dick... see if you like this idea. The self-proclaim insiders-only club Power 5
Conferences should keep all of the transfer rules, but every student athlete in
these Power 5 group can transfer to the lesser schools and NOT have to sit out.
BYU also benefited from Jake Heaps transferring out of BYU. Talk about great
talent no work ethic and you get nothing. Glad he transferred and it seems he
may transfer again to a MW team.
I hope the Utes got a viable QB in either the Wyoming or Oklahoma kid. They
really need someone who isn't a turnover machine to handle the ball.There seems to be a lot more of the graduate transfer types these days.
Does anyone know how long ago the rule was made? I wish the article had said
something about that since it just feels so recent.BYU really
stocked up on quality receivers this year. I can't wait till the season