Published: Saturday, May 3 2014 12:00 a.m. MDT
That's fine, but if the satanists who want to build a statue in the state
capitol don't get a fair hearing, then your words are hollow.
I tell my atheist friends that religions play a net positive role in America.Given the incentives in our economic system and the essentially
Darwinistic nature of our economic behavior, religions offer a moderating
effect.Were it not for their religious beliefs tugging at the
respective consciences of our leaders and the wealthy, it would be outright
economic warfare, all the time, with no moderation.
While I can agree with the premise of this Deseret News Editorial Opinion -- I fail to see the complaint here in Utah?I can go to Church, the
Temple, pray, serve others...There is NOTHING I am not being allowed
to do.This editorial piece needs to be run in Iran or Syria, NOT
Utah.And as far as Utah is concerned, The lack of Religious
Freedom is more prevalent amongst those not of the LDS faith, The Editors
of this Newspaper need to be honest and acknowledge that!
I'll believe that we want real religious freedom when Christians don't
protest a Muslim Rec Center being built in New York. Until then, I don't
put much faith in the sincerity of those who keep yelling "Religious
Freedom!"Why the double standard?Remember, religious
freedom means religious freedom for ALL religions, not just the ones we like.
@ 10CC"Were it not for their religious beliefs tugging at the
respective consciences of our leaders and the wealthy, it would be outright
economic warfare, all the time, with no moderation."I think
religion gets the credit for this when in many instances it is 1) we are
hardwired to do unto others because this is what best promotes survival and 2)
because we have laws to regulate what we also know to be true about human
nature: that we will do things we would not otherwise do if we think no one is
Gay people are not feeling the love of many religions. When your religion wants
to discriminate against some people, and the law says you can't, then you
say your religious freedoms are violated.
I don't see how any real student of history can view religion as anything
but a net evil on the world. Yes religion can and has do good but it isn't
much and all of that good would have been done anyway even without religion.
People generally strive to treat each other better, take care of each other,
work to improve life. There are countless examples of that happening by people
who aren't religious so religion can't claim it wouldn't happen
without it. Then when you look at the evils religion has forced upon the world
it just totally overshadows anything good religion has ever done.Religious dogma teaches to kill those that don't believe they same way
you do or won't convert. It stagnates progress by trying to control
believers and discouraging independent thought. There is just no question that
all in all religion is one of the worst ideas humans have ever had.
I think this editorial really makes the case for both religious diversity and
separation of Church and State. As the editorial notes, when those lines are
blurred, religion itself no longer has the moral influence it once had. The
influence of religious belief is strongest when it is free of other
Economic well being for as many as possible, if that is in fact the goal, can
only come about through Christianity's spread and acceptance. The Muslim
world as whole is woefully proof of its absence! Communism has centuries of
proof. Socialism is doing its darnedest to delude the masses into slavery and
tyranny. Some Capitalists are being deluded by its greedy, fascist complicity
with Government recently, looking backward toward the biggest delusion of all,
Socialism, and that delusion precipitated by envious, lazy, and immoral people
who no longer understand the truth that will make them free, both economically
and morally, Christianity! It is without doubt the biggest farce in the
world's history to even imply that religion has done anything but allowed
the greatest amount of freedom the world has ever known! I am now the
discriminated minority in society, which is ironic considering that I am one of
the few that is actually doing anything worthwhile, perpetuating children into
well adjusted, keenly aware human beings who forge ahead with faith despite the
countervailing philosophy that says to do just the opposite, including to
ironically ask the federal government to do more for them! Such is the
In a broader sense, religion plays the role of local institution that enables
people to become involved in their community. A successful church or religious
organization can be judged by how it provokes participation by it's
members. Growing up in the LDS faith there was rarely a week during my teenage
years that went by without some involvement with neighbors, many of whom
represented diverse ages, backgrounds, and life outlooks. It's this type of
community gathering that should be rewarded and encouraged. Unfortunately,
accompanying our current age of information is that the dogma from most
religions is being laid bare for scrutiny. So there's an increase of
people, disenchanted with the negative aspects of religion, who still have the
desire for community participation either grudgingly living more solitary lives
or reluctantly involving themselves more at work to compensate for the missing
component of neighborhood involvement. No, religion and faith aren't
inherently positive. Yes, the participatory element that accompanies local
community religions plays a crucial role in keeping people productive and
fulfilled. It takes a village to raise a child, and an adult happy.
Here is perhaps some insight as to why some people have negative feelings on
religion.At work there was a discussion of religion. Some of the
people were sharing what religion they were. One young man described himself as
a recovering Catholic. When asked to elaborate, he said he was tired of the fear
and the control and was trying to free himself.
While I agree with his negative perceptions of religion, I also think religion
has its positives.It teaches to treat other as we would want to be
treated. It teaches to give to charity.How nice it would be if the
bad of religion were separated from the good of religion.
Religious freedom equally means religious responsibility. God told us to put Him
first in our lives. He gave us life. He gave us rules to live by. He wants us
to be happy and to make others happy; therefore, He gave us instructions that
lead to happiness. Too many people reject religion and God because
they don't want to be bothered with rules. They don't want
instructions. They could care less that their rejection of "godliness"
shows only that they are in rebellion against "holiness". They think
that agency gives them the freedom to do whatever they want whenever they want
however they want. Agency is nothing of the kind. Except for infants and
children, there is no such thing as agency without accountability. We are
responsible for every thought, for every desire, for every action and for every
inaction. We will fully account for our lives to Him who gave us breath.Freedom to worship means that we will account to God for how we
worshipped or how we refused to worship.
Religious freedom exits, and is not in any way threatened in in the United
States. People can believe as they choose, worship as they choose, pray
privately whenever they choose, express their belies and opinions as they
choose, etc. And they can accept the consequences of their beliefs and words,
just like everyone else does. The only thing they can't do is attempt
legally to impose their religious beliefs on the country or to discriminate
against people in a manner contrary to the rules and requirements of established
law (the same is true for all of us).This article is a good advocate
for keeping strong the separation of church and state. Each has its own correct
area of operation. Don't mix and mingle their legal effects.
Religion is the most controlling influence on the lives of human beings. Other
government entities tend to limit their control over their subjects mainly if
not only in the outward freedoms. Religion seeks to not only control the
outward expression of a person but the inner most thoughts and beliefs of the
individual as well.
@cjb;What religion teaches and how it's adherents act are
usually two different things.@Mike Richards;One reason I
dislike religion so much is the mini-sermons from it's "special
adherents" (you, for instance). Not only are they boring as heck,
they're also self-centered and selfish. Just take a look at
banderson's comment above if you want an example of selfish - and arrogant.
The only reason that religion is so successful is that it plays upon the
greatest fear of life, which is fear of dying. No other imaginary, unproven and
improvable product could overcome the intelligence of a human being. But
religion has been given cart blanch to say and tell any thing it wishes without
question. But without it, life might not be so care free.
Religion is good for us, but given too much power in our society it strays from
its stated purpose of bringing peace to people and starts to use its control to
oppress them. All of history say that religion as a total government is bad for
people and civilization. I know of no examples of where religion has elevated
societies of mankind above the natural world. There are many examples of where
individuals have been elevated above the natural world but even then they are
ineffective for the whole.
LDS Liberal wrote: "There is NOTHING I am not being allowed to do."I suppose that's why the editorial is about protecting religious
freedom rather than trying to regain it. The latter is much more difficult to
accomplish than the former and usually requires bloodshed.Ultra Bob
wrote: "No other imaginary, unproven and improvable product could overcome
the intelligence of a human being."There is one tiny catch,
which is this: God has promised that he will reveal himself to those who seek
him and are willing to do what he asks them to do. I assure you that he is not
imaginary and not unproven, (I'm not sure about "improvable") as I
as well as millions of others witness of the truth of his existence. The problem
is that one can't prove it to someone else, one can only prove it to
one's self. God intentionally arranged it that way so that no man can say
they were compelled to believe or to not believe. It's a choice to seek God
or to not seek him, so your own eternal fate rests in your own hands and not
I just wish that religion would be a little more careful with truth. There's no war on religion. There's no need to use business and
other non religion entities to further their cause.
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