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Comments about ‘British judge rejects case, calls it an 'attack' on LDS’

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Published: Thursday, March 20 2014 7:20 a.m. MDT

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Unreconstructed Reb
Chantilly, VA

@gildawg: wrong.

BCA
Murrieta, CA

Happy for the ruling. Beliefs do not belong being judged in court. Don't know how it got that far. It was interesting, though, that the church attorneys said these things are beliefs and not facts.

BCA
Murrieta, CA

"The LDS do NOT believe that we are saved by our works."

This really just semantics. Where you go is determined by how "well" you have done. If it isn't that way, what is the difference between the top and middle tiers of heaven? And why do so many fear they are not "good enough" to make the Celestial world?

Lilljemalm
Gilbert, AZ

Jesus Love U:
From what you have written, I can tell that you neither know nor understand LDS doctrine regarding tithing and salvation, nor can I say that you understand the Bible from what you have said.
Christ fulfilled the Law of Moses. Tithing is not part of the Law of Moses.
Salvation does come through grace to those who follow Christ. A true follower does his or her best to obey the commandments. If not, they have no faith and the grace of God has no place in them. Because of the atonement (I don't like to use the word grace because of how Calvinism misinterprets it), we can repent and be saved. Without it, we don't have that opportunity. Basic belief or confesion that Jesus is the Christ is not sufficient to receive of God's grace. That is LDS doctrine.

Owl
Salt Lake City, UT

Justice was served. Had this gone forward every church, political party, charity or any organization that is based on belief would be a target if someone became disenchanted. The plaintiff has serious problems that don't belong in court.

DocHolliday
reno, NV

Brio

He has remained true to his beliefs as well. His beliefs just differ from those of his family. To leave a man because he changes his mind regarding his own personal beliefs on god, religion, etc. is just silly. It is the "believe or else attitude." If his family would embrace his new beliefs maybe they would actually be able to accept them. Why must one believe in the same religion as another person in order to love them?

ZenMormon
West Valley, UT

Joseph Smith taught, "Let us here observe, that a religion that does not require the sacrifice of all things never has power sufficient to produce the faith necessary unto life and salvation; for, from the first existence of man, the faith necessary unto the enjoyment of life and salvation never could be obtained without the sacrifice of all earthly things." In other words, if a religion doesn't ask you to sacrifice of your time, you talents, your money, it can not and will not produce the Faith necessary for salvation. I am thankful for a church that asks me to sacrifice my time, my talents, and my money. Has we are taught that everything we have is a gift from God, all he asks is that we return 10% to him. That is not to much to ask.

Todd_i
Midway, UT

This is a fantastic ruling for all freedom loving people. This is as much a freedom of speech issue as it is a religious issue. Whether you love or hate the LDS church, the Catholics, Buddhists, Environmentalists, or Occupy Wall Street, you can celebrate the judge's ruling. It is up to the individual, not government, to determine who you want to align with and believe.

grandmagreat
Lake Havasu City, AZ

Early Saints were persecuted for their beliefs, the Prophet Joseph Smith endured many cruel acts prior to being murdered. I am so grateful tht my ancestors were strong in the gospel, and that I have been blessed with my church membership. My ancestors came to the United States in the 1600's from England. I am grateful for that heritage.

Moontan
Roanoke, VA

Bravo to this judge! We should get him to do a few seminars in America concerning how to think behind the bench.

RAB
Bountiful, UT

@BCA
Not semantics. LDS doctrine says we are saved by our mere commitment to follow Christ at baptism.

The final judgment (after a 1000 years opportunity to decide who you want to be) is merely Christ’s determination as to where you would be the happiest for all eternity. Your works are just one aspect of what God will use to make that judgment. He will be merciful as he considers your intentions, effects of your environment, your personal trials, your knowledge, your mental capabilities, and your available opportunities to do good works.

It is pointless to even try to judge ourselves or anyone else. We have only to commit to Christ, have faith in His love and His all-powerful ability to help us, and to serve Him to the best of our ability—continually repenting as we go. I do not give the slightest thought to what kingdom I will inherit. I trust Christ perfectly to judge me with the utmost mercy and fairness as I strive to be what I know He wants me to be. Christ want everything for me--for my sake--not His.

BCA
Murrieta, CA

"Your works are just one aspect of what God will use to make that judgment."

And yet they are one aspect. I am sure you know the scripture which includes the phrase "after all you can do".

To me that is semantics. To you something else. You can have the last word if you want.

Ghost Writer
GILBERT, AZ

Yet another example of "Can leave the church, but can't leave it alone" (sorry for the cliche).

SJC16
South Jordan, UT

There is no cash requirement to be saved, we are saved by works AND grace, the gift of grace is free, but we need to try to live the commandments that god has given us. We pay tithes to show god our love.(3 Nephi 24: 8-10) If you disagree I'm sorry but to sue President Monson for our doctorine of tithes is like suing the Pope Catholic doctorine of confession of sins. Because tithes are not forced, and the temples are on privately owned property. To sue President Monson is comparable to suing Bob Iger (The CEO of Disney) for having you pay to get into Disney land. It's Ridiculous. We know this won't go away greatness has always had great opposition. And we are ready to defend our faith, and our religious beliefs, now and forever.

Daughter of God
slc, UT

For those not of the LDS faith, I think it is important for you to also know what tithing go's towards. Our leaders are NOT paid and the money go's to many things to help around the world including building church's, temple's and paying for programs within the church such as programs to strengthen our youth. There are also many programs that help in disaster relief and providing programs in poverty stricken areas of the world, such as clean water or wheelchairs/prosthetics at no cost to them. We also have fast offerings that go towards feeding the hungry and sheltering the poor, not just of our faith. Also as stated above tithing is not new with the LDS faith it is in the Holy Bible as well, which we believe to also be the word of God.

Schnee
Salt Lake City, UT

@Redshirt1701
"Paying what you determine to be a full tithe is a requirement for entering the Temple. You do not have to enter the temple to receive salvation. Temple ordinances are needed for exaltation."

So basically this is where the argument is. Some non-LDS Christians (since obviously LDS is Christian too) are saying that the LDS church requires you pay money to be saved and your response is the equivalent of saying 'no... but getting the platinum membership in heaven requires it'.

So everyone is sort of half-right.

Daughter of God
slc, UT

I think we should all pray for him. For him to come to this....makes me feel sorrow for him. Regardless of his actions (which I strongly do NOT support) he is still a son of God.

Matthew 5:44
But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;

patriot
Cedar Hills, UT

using the same logic we could outlaw the entire New Testament for its fantastic and unprovable claims of the resurrection of Jesus and all of his miracles. Throw also all the angelic appearances and transfiguration of Moses and Elias with Jesus and let's just burn and ban the New Testament and shut down Christianity. Stupid is as stupid does...someone once said.

ginger76
Emporia, KS

Most LDS members are taught that if you want to be with your family forever, you need to get sealed in the temple to them. Now, in order to be sealed in the temple, you have to have a temple recommend. In order to get a temple recommend, you have to have an interview with your Bishop and Stake president, in some cases. Now, one of the questions asked of you is if, you are a full tithe payer. If you aren't a full tithe payer, you could either lie about it to get the recommend, or you could answer, yes, or no. Now, if you answer, No, as a honest answer, you will not get the temple recommend. This means, you cant go to the temple and perform the ordinances you need in order to be with Heavenly Father after this life. Now, what member wouldn't want to be with HF after this life? I dont know. Maybe there are some who dont really care. If that's the case, then why be in the religion at all?

sharrona
layton, UT

Re: Dave M, You should cite your source. OK,

(Reed Smoot)Faced with intense pressure, Church leaders accepted the resignations of apostles Matthias Cowley and John W. Taylor, who were rumored to have performed plural marriages after the Manifesto. To further evidence good faith, in the annual April conference of 1904 President Smith issued a "Second Manifesto" that added ecclesiastical teeth to the Manifesto of 1890. Excommunication would now follow for those who refused to relinquish the practice of plural marriage.(Encyclopedia of Mormonism).

A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife,…. 1 Timothy 3:2(KJV)
The Apostles did not maintain any .O.T. pattern of polygamy and they and the early church condemmed it.
1. Justin Martyr (c.160) rebukes the Jews for allowing polygamy:" [ANF, vol. 1, p. 266]
2. Irenaeus (c.180) condemns the Gnostics for, among other things, polygamy: a plurality of wives..." [ANF, vol. 1, p.353]

Re: BCA,.. to the one who does not work but trusts God who justifies the ungodly, their faith is credited as righteousness(Romans 4:5 NIV).

You who are trying to be justified by the law have been alienated from Christ; you have fallen away from grace.(Gal 5:4NIV)

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