re: motorbike"Bottom line though, it's easy to see that RPI
rewards teams far too much for simply playing (not winning) against tough out of
conference opponents."I agree with that. The problem with any
single metric/rating system is that it will have inherent biases. Another
example is BPI rewarding teams for wins over embarrassingly bad teams. I found
it hilarious over the last few weeks that many Ute fans were littering BYU
boards with talk of how BPI is so superior to RPI. Indeed, Utah ranked 10
points higher than BYU largely due to their laughable OOC schedule. Give three
of their 300 and lower RPI wins to BYU and BYU's BPI would be higher.
+1 William Wallace
"eastcoastcougDanbury, CTI love SMU, but they
don't deserve to be in the NCAA's this year. Not over Pitt and FSU.
They don't stand a chance against Oregon with Collinsworth out (or with him
for that matter)." Too bad bro, BYU got in. Sorry your team
didn't! But, play a stronger schedule next time and maybe your fortunes
will turn.BYU is without Collinsworth but, they are also without Pac
12 officials and Oregon's home court with this one...
OldTimeFTBaller: Thanks for the comments. I too find it odd that so much trash
talk has gone Utah's way, and they handled BYU easily. I'm a Ute fan,
but don't go "Chris B." on everyone. I picked Oregon to beat the
Cougs, simply for the reason I stated a week ago. I don't think BYU is
built for NCAA success. I think it comes down to running good offense, and
playing tough defense. I don't think those are strong points for BYU, but
I think it will be a great game. BYU fans should be focusing on Oregon, and
Utah will have their hands full with a quality St. Mary's team. Good luck
HAHA! awww byu fans got their wittle feelings hurt after they saw and now
realize what the national media really thinks about their "powerhouse"
program, after ALL year claiming that everyone had "so much respect"
byu. This is hilarious! Now the national media is "biased" and doesnt
know what they're talking about? oh man im i having myself laugh righth
about now.Oh yeah, i forgot byu "fans" know extremely more than those
"self-appointed" experts, who btw, get paid for what they do while all
these byu fans are couch experts.
eastcoastcougI wouldn't say you're much of a BYU fan at
all - 90% of your comments are completely negative toward BYU, and those that
aren't are only mildly complimentary.Dave Rose is one of only 9
coaches who have lead their programs to 7+ NCAA tournaments in the last 9
seasons.The east coast bias in the media was never more apparent
than in the quick reversal by the pundits as soon as they discovered that the
numbers contradicted their personal biases.
Chris....Yes it was #3. That was their out of conference schedule
strength. The utes better man up next year with the players they have...and
with the same record result as this year...they will go dancing too.
PP,byu did NOT have the #3 schedule in the country. Try again
Two things are funny - People that say Oregon will kill us when there is
irrefutable evidence to the contrary (an OT loss in Eugene) and people that
claim that they are BYU fans yet state that BYU should not be in the tournament.
BYU won 23 games against the #3 schedule in the country. They are head and
shoulders above the other teams that they keep getting compared to. The
committee not only thought they should be in the tournament they ranked them
fairly well. The day your fandom has a lower standard than the NCAA selection
committee is the day you should renounce your cougar club membership and start
It sure is odd to me when Cougar fans don't seem to be happy that their
team is in the NCAA Tournament. Who cares if they "should" have not been
selected. They were! And a #10 seed to boot! Just be happy for them! I'm
not saying the detractors aren't happy, but they sure seem to be debbie
downers in this situation.
I'm a cougar fan. A cougar grad. And a blue blood. But the cougars, bless
their horrific three point shooting hearts, shouldn't be going to the big
dance. Are we talking about the same team that played an entire game without
making a single three pointer after taking 31 from beyond the arc? The same team
that claims to be playing their best basketball and was lucky not to have their
championship game with Gonzaga called on a seventh inning little league twenty
run rule? The free throw shooting is atrocious. The defending is non-existent.
Opponents walk through the lane like a hot knife through butter. When
they're at the foul line I'm screaming "Don't embarrass the
school, please don't, just give the ball to the other team and play
on". These boys are nice kids. And like most sports teams, they've
worked really hard this season. I don't think I could watch
them embarrass the school with another disgrace in the first round. Better to
call it a season and start practicing those foul shots.
ESPN had BYU making the tournament. That didn't come as much of a surprise.
Nebraska was the shock team.
Did Utah make the NIT?
Mark321"They picked Team C (BYU) then backtracked when they saw
who it was."Which really just tells us that basing the seeding
process so heavily on RPI is jacked up. If you look at any of the other rating
systems, which all take more data into account, you'd get a better picture
of what teams truly belong. And before Coug fans jump down my throat, the other
rating systems may very well have still been positive for BYU.Bottom
line though, it's easy to see that RPI rewards teams far too much for
simply playing (not winning) against tough out of conference opponents.Congrats to BYU though, they did what the NCAA system wanted them to do. And
until that changes, they should keep doing the same thing, win or lose.
Dear Digger,You embarrassed yourself. An analyst is not supposed to
be a cheer leader for or against any team. Stick to the facts and just forget 5
sends left and Danny Ainge with the ball.
Ltrain, you're absolutely right when you say "Phelps is a joke and
makes watching the ESPN show almost unwatchable."The thing that
bothers me most about these so-called experts is that they are self-appointed
and they get paid for spouting their opinions and stirring up controversy.Remember Bryant Gumbel and his Bo-dittly-tech comment after which the
Cougars won the National Championship? Quite ironically, BYU handily took care
of Bo Schembechler's U. of Michigan team, the true Bo's
Dittly-tech.You're right; these know-it-alls are not worth
listen to or watching.
@LtrainCan't agree with your assessment of Collinsworth.
He'll be missed, big time.This BYU team is young and scrappy.
Maybe they'll surprise us.
The Cougs nearly knocked off Oregon at Oregon. Playing on a neutral floor will
help even the odds.Losing KC hurts, but there is enough talent remaining
to pull it off, but only if their 3's are dropping. If they play up to
their potential, or anywhere close to it, they should win.
The eye test is usually the bias test. It shows when they showed the numbers but
disguised the teams. They picked Team C (BYU) then backtracked when they saw who
@3grandslams - believe me, Digger has been seeing those replays on Danny Ainge
over and over for so many years. It would be cool if Digger took a job at the
hill and seeing another Rick M. look a like in loosing his cool.
I think this is a great compliment to Dave Rose. He's built a good program
and done it the right way. Glad to see his team get some props.
BYU will continue their tradition of being one and done. Oregon should have no
trouble winning this game.
Coach Rose is a class act with recruiting disadvantages that continues to put a
great team on the floor year after year. What he has done at BYU is nothing
short of miraculous. I love the guy!
Exactly what is the "eye test?" Should we stand back 10 feet and cover
one eye? Seriously--- The "eye test" is nothing more than condescending
subjective people looking for a big name from a power conference. Get over it,
Digger! You look the fool on this one. Even among the other #10 teams,
BYU's at the top with #33 RPI & #17 SOS. The schedulers who had BYU
pick up those tough OOC games really deserve the praise for this bid. As
far as Ore goes, I think BYU will lose but that doesn't take anything away
from deserving the bid. Playing without KC impacts our future prospects but
doesn't negate the past accomplishments. I'm hoping to be proven
wrong but it will take everyone stepping up to take a piece of what KC brought
with his versatility and well-rounded game. Go Coug's!!
These national guys are nothing but a walking talking bias. Phelps is a joke
and makes watching the ESPN show almost unwatchable. As for J. williams I think
i'd take a road victory at Stanford over a victory over UMass. I think
that BYU will be ok without Collinsworth. He's the least important member
of the 5 main guys. They would be in a world of trouble w/o one of the bigs,
and Haws is by far the best player for them. Even Carlino is more important
because he's the wild card in games against the "big boys." If he
plays well they have a chance, if he doesn't it doesn't matter if
Collinsworth is there or not. Besides, this way we don't have to endure
the world's worst perpetual haircut.
Congrats to the cougars, they deserve to be there. Also, Oregon is an up and
down team and we should have won the game at their place earlier, blew a late
lead and lost in OT. Even without Collinsworth, I think we have a chance. The
key will be Carlino, can he play within himself and play smart? I am happy for
the team. If Collinsworth were healthy I think BYU would be picked by most to
win the game with Oregon. Oregon is not a good road team this year and they
won't be at home now.
Digger Phelps? Please......
EastCoastCougNo chance against Oregon? Did you watch the first
Is there anything more silly than the "eye test"? When the real test -
win/loss record, SOS,RPI, and etc - causes Digger to disagree with Digger he
reverts to this silly eye test which is nothing more than a beauty pageant
demonstrating nothing more than a personal bias. There is a reason the eye test
is not part of the selection process,...it's too subjective! Is the blond
more beautiful than the brunette? Who's to say? The eye test is just not a
reliable tool and it allows for too much bias. Give it a rest Digger.
Free Throws Will Win The Game......
Many teams going to the dance, are not as good as some not going.
This starts to make up for all the times BYU got jobbed on their seeding in the
Congrats to the Cougs, but we did get lucky on this one. Yes, BYU does deserve
to be tournament bound, the experts agree and one of them even picked us as a 10
seed prior to the show (check Greg Wrubell's tweet). The RPI, SOS and wins
vs. top 100 don't lie as the broadcasters noted. The selection committee
doesn't use the "eye test" much since it is not a measurable
(quantifiable) stat, so sorry FSU. While EastCoastCoug isn't a
fan of Rose, I absolutely am. All the guy does is win, win, win with a below
average squad year in and year out. The best player he has ever had hardly gets
playing time in the NBA (I still love you Jimmer!). So for him to make the NCAA
tournament nearly every year is a huge accomplishment coming from Provo. I love
our players, but here is a reason they weren't recruited to Kansas, Duke,
North Carolina, etc. etc. etc. Rose overachieves every year. He does
more, with less.
Digger should come to the hill in SLC, the crow has landed and there is plenty
to go around.
interesting article and video. Thrilled BYU is in a 10 position in a winnable
game. Not sure how winnable without KC, but winnable. Apparently,
the selection committee rewarded BYU for their strength of schedule and OOC
schedule, but I don't disagree with either commentator. On the eye test, I
too would take FSU and Pitt over BYU. But the numbers don't lie. I also think they missed giving BYU credit for a 2 point loss to Iowa
State, since they mentioned FSU's close loss to Florida.
digger phelps is still ticked off about his notre dame getting beat by danny
ainge in the ncaa tournament in the 80,s he is a sore loser and it shows
better rpi and sos than the other 2 teams makes them the better team
regardless of what the no count analysts from espn or cbs or any of them
Congrats to the Utah schools....and my CougsBut...All
the smack talk is a joke. BYU fan here, but let's win something before we
spout off at the U. We haven't won a league title or conference title. We
haven't won anything in a long LONG LONG time! And we may win one game if
we are lucky so stop like we are a powerhouse. And remember Utah beat us by
20...to talk smack on them when they beat us head to head is dumb people! Guess
you have short memories.And Utah enough. Much improved and a young
team with a promising future...but like football you are learning the PAC is
tough and you haven't done squat. So Coach K is great but fans get a
reality check and lets hope Weber State comes closer than u did vs Arizona
Digger really looked quite foolish back peddling the way he did. He's got
the memory of an Elephant, and is still dancing on table tops whenever
BYU's name is mentioned.Digger, why so bitter?Rise
Nothing like egg all over your face on national TV. I wonder if a Digger still
remembers Danny Ainge?
Strength of schedule matters for seeding in the big dance...Once
again this proved to be true.
I love BYU, but they don't deserve to be in the NCAA's this year. Not
over Pitt and FSU. They don't stand a chance against Oregon with
Collinsworth out (or with him for that matter). I'm not a Coach
Rose fan. I don't think he's done anything worthy of praise in the
digger is no friend of BYU, never has been, never will be. the test shows his
bias! of course we are a weaker team without Collinsworth, but it was still fun
to read of "foot in mouth" disease by some of the broadcasters. Every
game is a challenge in the tourney and Rose has his hands full defending Oregon
with one less player, he is now down to 7 contributors who will need to run the
whole game against Oregon. go cougs, run and not faint, you will need to shoot
the light out to win, but oh what a victory it will be if they can pull it off.
50% of the teams will lose, so I like the odds right now. Go cougs, you have
earned it regardless of what Digger thinks or says.
Good for BYU. Just shows that the experts who make the field have a lot more
respect than some local types who are out of touch with reality in their red