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Comments about ‘Letter: Why move the prison?’

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Published: Thursday, Feb. 13 2014 12:00 a.m. MST

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Grover
Salt Lake City, UT

Here is an idea whose time has clearly come: Move the prison to the current site of the refineries and vice-versa. That way the refineries will be confined to a smaller space and the prison can be built in clear sight of the Capitol so the legislators can keep a close eye on it and the people in the south valley get all of those high paying jobs at the refineries! Case closed.

2 bits
Cottonwood Heights, UT

John,
If you're going to ask the question.... you need to at least do a little research on your own to see what the actual reasons are. (and not just the conspiracies you hear in the opinion section).

There are real "reasons" for moving the prison.

Do some research and find out what those "reasons" are (they have been published). I don't have space to go over them here. But there ARE real reasons.

===

The prison is not there just for the volunteers convenience. The prison is not there for the family's convenience, or even the State's convenience.

The prison needs to be located on land that can be secured (not an urban area). And on land large enough to house the population we have. The point of the mountain no longer fits either of those criteria (and it's going to get worse in the years to come). The population in the prison is growing (the current facility can't handle it). The population in the valley is growing. That's not going to stop because volunteers want it to.

There are real reasons to move.

Fred44
Salt Lake City, Utah

2 bits,

I wouldn't disagree that your reasons for moving the prison may be valid, but I think we should be honest and admit that the opportunity to develop some prime Draper real estate is the real driving force for the move.

Currently the legislators in favor of the move are claiming that there will be a mega tax benefit to the state and local communities which again could be viewed as a positive. Before we spend the money though lets see how many sweetheart tax avoidance deals are passed out to the developers of the land.

I will be shocked if the state receives anything near the billion dollars in claimed tax benefits from the development of the Draper land.

2 bits
Cottonwood Heights, UT

Fred44,
But who benefits from developing this land?

If you're buying the conspiracy-theory that some legislator will benefit.. identify him... and we will remove him from the committee making this decision. Some with conflicts have already been removed.

===

Again.. who benefits?

Some legislator? (can you prove it)?

Because I can PROVE that Utah tax payers (especially Bluffdale and Draper tax payers) will benefit from the sale.

Bluffdale will finally get a commercial tax base, and a business district. All Salt Lake County will benefit from the sales tax and businesses taxes paid by businesses that will open in this development, as well as from the property taxes collected from any homes built in this new neighborhood.

The State will also collect property taxes, business taxes, and sales tax from the new occupants (hint... when someone else pays taxes... that's good for you and me, every resident of the State). Because it's money for schools, roads, healthcare, etc, they don't have to come squeeze out of me.

We can't have the things we want as a society without taxes. And you don't collect taxes from parks or prisons. They pay NO taxes.

Grover
Salt Lake City, UT

The last time they moved the prison the city got Sugarhouse Park and Highland High and this time Bluffdale will "finally get a tax base". Sounds about even to me. Hey Bits, this isn't a court of law that requires proof. Check on line and find out just how many of the legislators are either developers, realtors or work for same. As deep throat advised in the movie: "follow the money!" Remember the tracks extension to Draper? What a coincidence that one of the officials making the decisions just happened to own property in the path of the trax line.

2 bits
Cottonwood Heights, UT

Grover,
Not all legislators are on the Prison Move committee. So just finding a legislator who was a realtor doesn't prove anything. You need to find one who's on the committee making the decision.

Google "Utah prison move committee"

You may learn something.

Also research the reasons for the move (not just the rumors). Independent research group projects that Utah's prison population will increase by 41% by 2033. So it needs to increase in size by at least 41% by then. There's not that much room at the current location.

The conspiracy theory of a legislator making money off the move is well and good, and many will believe it without even doing any research. But you should at least have LITTLE proof first, don't you think? Or is the mear innuendo enough?

freedomingood
provo, Utah

I don't live there anymore but I would leave it there. If it's an "eyesore" then fix it up. There's no law that says a prison can't look good on at least the side next to the highway.

Developers are going to cost YOU hundreds of millions of dollars so they can make 10's of millions. Brilliant. Only in a red state...

freedomingood
provo, Utah

2 bits, you know that Quid Pro Quo is extremely sneaky and hard to prove. The tax benefits will dissapear when they give tax breaks for the Walmart or Target to move in and the people getting benefits will be sneaky enough to get their "quo" down the road.

This comes up more than anything the people actually want done!

2 bits
Cottonwood Heights, UT

freedomingood,
Re: "Quid Pro Quo is extremely sneaky and hard to prove"...

Hard to prove, but easy to repeat and just put it out there (as if it's true). Just like rumors, back-biting, lies, etc. Nothing stopping you from just putting it out there (even with absolutely no proof, because none is needed, and there are soooo many people who will just believe, and repeat it... without even looking into it for second). And once it's out there (and people are repeating it)... whether true or false... the damage and the goal is accomplished.

That people would just believe this, and repeat it, with zero proof (and claim none is needed)... is amazing to me.

===

I'm cynical about politicians too but this is ridicules.

There is real reason for moving the prison.

Whether we move the prison or rebuild on the current site... it's going to be expensive. It would be nice to get some money for the old site to offset the expense of the new site.

It would also be nice for Bluffdale to have a tax base (like other communities in the valley). Walmart and Target do pay taxes.

Fred44
Salt Lake City, Utah

2 bits,

As freedomingood said quid pro quo is hard to prove, and only time will tell on the tax breaks. I do agree there are a lot of positives for the south end of the Salt Lake Valley. What I wonder is what will be the positives for Tooele County when the prison is moved out there? Will the benefits outweigh the negatives? Will the state kick in some of this big tax money they are going to get to help Tooele County out, who has even less tax base than Bluffdale, or will they allow a county that is on the verge of being broke absorb the additional costs and challenges of having a prison? I think it is always good to know where you are landing before you take off. This project is taking off without having really planned out the landing.

rlsintx
Plano, TX

A good solution: let whoever wants the property for development pay for all costs of the move, because that's what they expect the taxpayer do for them.

grandma45
Bountiful, UT

RE: comment that states "Independent research group projects that Utah's prison population will increase by 41% by 2033. So it needs to increase in size by at least 41% by then. There's not that much room at the current location." The very most important conclusion from this quotation is that Utah lawmakers should be enacting laws that safely reduce the prison population. It is much cheaper to treat a mentally ill person in a community setting than throwing them in prison and that is what often happens. Work on transition programs so released inmates get the help they need to successful reenter society and stay out of prison. Use drug courts more. Volunteers and family support are helpful in preparing inmates for the outside and for decreasing recidivism. To just accept that the inmate population is going to increase by 41% is pure folly. An ounce of prevention is worth much more than a pound of "cure."

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