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Published: Thursday, Feb. 6 2014 1:50 p.m. MST

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Open Minded Mormon
Everett, 00

How many people have been imprisoned into dead-end jobs or can't move because of "pre-exisiting conditions"?

Ya - the ACA is GOOD for Americans and for better jobs.

And keep it up Republicans,
this is all your battle to keep loosing.

m.g. scott
clearfield, UT

If you like your Obama care, you can keep it. Otherwise the rest of us should be exempt from using it or paying for it. Simple as that!!!

pragmatistferlife
salt lake city, utah

Badger.."Obama declared the recession over and the country to be in recovery in June of 2009, yet we have more people out of the workforce than we had at the height of the recession. "

That's a very simplistic and pejorative statement to a complicated problem. In fact workforce participation started to decline in 2000 as the baby boomers started to retire. Then the trend was exacerbated with the recession.

Of course whether we're in a recession or not has nothing to do with workforce participation. It only has to do with GDP growth, and the fact is we have had nearly 4 years of positive growth.

What should worry you is the fact that the stock market has boomed (rate of return on capital) and the rate of economic growth has limped along, albeit positive. There in lies your answer as to why we continue to have a decline in the labor market.

There are a thousand individual reasons why some aren't participating, early retirement, staying in school, giving up, but the fact is the jobs aren't there for them because the 1% can make more with financial manipulations than they can creating value and jobs.

SCfan
clearfield, UT

Pragmatistferlife

There is no getting around that no matter how you spin it, our current economy is not what it was during Bush, Clinton, Bush, Reagan, ect. The average amount of money that the average American family is making in an average year is down by several thousand dollars. And if the 1%ers are not spending money and creating jobs, has it ever occured to you why they are holding back from investment and holding onto money? The word Democrat, and the name Obama come to mind as good reasons. Even the liberal rich 1%ers, of which there are a lot, are doing it. When we get the right President, (not Hillary) then the 1% will feel comfortable to open up and invest because government will be seen as their ally not their enemy.

2 bit
Cottonwood Heights, UT

Mavrick,

Re: "The decades of class warfare waged against the poor and middle classes started under Reagan"...

Define "Class warfare"?

It has a definition. Goggle "Class warfare". I don't think it means what you think it means.

According to the REAL definition of "Class Warfare"... Reaganomics doesn't fit.

====

You vilify Ronald Reagan, and blame him for today. Well here's a common sense test you can take to see if he really wanted to destroy the middle-class.

1. How were you doing under Jimmy Carter...
2. Then how were you doing under Ronald Reagan....
It was a night-day difference for me, and I'm middle-class.

When Jimmie Carter was President... Interest rates on home loans were 16% (that's when I bought my home). The economy was in "real trouble" (by all accounts).

It's called the "Stagflation" era. Goggle "A brief history of U.S. unemployment", reference the "Stagflation" graph. Unemployment skyrocketed to 10%! Is that GOOD for the poor/middle-class??

Then look at what happened as soon as Reagan took over.

Then tell us he engaged in class-warfare.

VST
Bountiful, UT

@Esquire said, "...if you have been paying attention, many took part time jobs just to get health insurance. Now they can get it on their own terms."

And now I get to be forced to pay for it. Right?

Where is my choice?

Badgerbadger
Murray, UT

Soon we will not have a choice. At the rate things are going, none of us will be able to work. It will be too costly to employ us, and we will get little or nothing for the work we do because all the earnings will be taxed into subsidies for those who aren't working.

I just wonder who will pay for all the subsidies when there are no workers left and we have all been forced into being recipients of subsidies?

But other than that, Obamacare is, uh,...

Still awful.

I want my plan and my doctor back, please.

Tyler D
Meridian, ID

@pragmatistferlife – “Everyone knows what the report actually said. It said the ACA will increase the number of jobs and increase economic growth.”

Exactly!

And this highlights nicely the problem many have with today’s Republican Party – they lack the courage to own their ideas or make arguments based on the facts.

For years conservatives have been rightly saying (back when they were sane) that employer based healthcare was a noose around the labor market. That if people didn’t have to stay in jobs for health insurance, they would chose different jobs (they were better suited for), or be free to take the risk of opening a business of their own, or leave the labor market altogether (which, all other things being equal, will raise aggregate wages).

Now when a non-partisan report comes out saying this is/will occur under the ACA, they twist that into “it’s a job killer.”

Just one more case of Republicans attacking their most hated president in history for things they thought up but failed to do when they were in control – too busy with other things I guess… wars, anti-abortion laws, etc…

pragmatistferlife
salt lake city, utah

SCfan;"There is no getting around that no matter how you spin it, our current economy is not what it was during Bush, Clinton, Bush, Reagan, ect. The average amount of money that the average American family is making in an average year is down by several thousand dollars."

No kidding! This recession cleaned out our economy. I strongly disagree however with why the rich are holding onto their money. In fact they are not holding onto their money, thus the massive gains in the stock market.

What is happening is the return on financial manipulations is much higher than the return on real value investment. Financial manipulation doesn't require any labor at all. It's labor free and currently very lucrative.

Please explain to me why anyone in the 1% would take their money out of the current situation where they are making insane profits through financial manipulations and put it in value production with all of it's risks and costs, regardless of who the President is.

pragmatistferlife
salt lake city, utah

Just for reference here's the ladder of reference;

The Ladder of Inference describes the thinking process that we go through, usually without realizing it, to get from a fact to a decision or action. The thinking stages can be seen as rungs on a ladder and are shown in Figure 1. Starting at the bottom of the ladder, we have reality and facts. From there, we: Experience these selectively based on our beliefs and prior experience. Interpret what they mean. Apply our existing assumptions, sometimes without considering them. Draw conclusions based on the interpreted facts and our assumptions. Develop beliefs based on these conclusions. Take actions that seem "right" because they are based on what we believe. This can create a vicious circle. Our beliefs have a big effect on how we select from reality, and can lead us to ignore the true facts altogether. Soon we are literally jumping to conclusions

freedomingood
provo, Utah

I know one guy that quit his corporate job to be self employed and another that retired 5 years early because they can now get insurance that is not tied to their corporate job. I think that is a good thing.

Of course corporate masters that like their employees a little more slavish and utterly dependent probably don't like the idea.

freedomingood
provo, Utah

It's clear from most of these right wing posts you have no idea that "Obamacare" is private insurance by the corporation provider of YOUR own choosing. The ignorance is sad.

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