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Comments about ‘Herbert criticizes states that don't follow 'will of the people' on same-sex marriage’

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Published: Thursday, Jan. 23 2014 7:55 p.m. MST

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Badgerbadger
Murray, UT

What is so bad about not calling same sex unions marriages? Is a another name really so bad? Is changing the name to respect the religious rights and rites of others too much to ask?

Karen R.
Houston, TX

@Meckofahess

Are you sure you speak for ALL of your children? Polls are suggesting otherwise. Even the young people here in Evangelical-rich Texas are pushing back against their church doctrine on this subject. I think they have a different definition of "respect" than some of their elders.

Meckofahess
Salt Lake City, UT

@Karen B.

Yes, I am sure I speak for all of my children. As for polls, I know many unelected politicians who found comfort in the polls.

Moreover, even if the courts decide to legalize same-sex marriage, there will be a huge moral outrage from a large percentage of the heterosexual population who will feel that it was forced upon them and they will forever hold resentment. I'm sorry to say it won't be like racial integration laws where discrimination was based on race. That was a very different thing and after some time we did accept those laws because they were based on moral truths and had broad religious support. The same cannot be said for homosexual conduct.

SuziQ
Springville, UT

I would have to agree that although I think that everyone in our society has a right to live and love whoever they want to, I don't think that you should ever use the word marriage for same sex unions. Marriage has always been about a man and woman and their offspring. It defines a relationship rooted in biology that is not possible for same gender couples. I also have a problem with a same gender union invalidating the term mother and father because it would not be fair to have some families have mother and father and other families have two mothers (maybe only one biologically) or two fathers. In order to make things fair, we must only have "parents". Must the majority redefine everything so the minority is not offended? Seems more unfair.

Bob K
portland, OR

Badgerbadger
Murray, UT

--- Thanks for asking!

"What is so bad about not calling same sex unions marriages? Is a another name really so bad?"

--- Kindly suggest a name that folks will recognize as equal to marriage, in the supermarket, when kids say it about their parents at school, at work, etc.
--- Do you see the point, that nothing else seems like marriage and does not cause folks to start asking nosy questions?
Suppose you have 4 mormon children, and 3 get to be married, while one either needs to lie to people and to God or accept some cruddy alternative that no one "gets".

"Is changing the name to respect the religious rights and rites of others too much to ask?"

--- Why yes, it is. For instance, nearly all non-mormon Christians think that you calling yourselves "saints" is totally rude and pretentious, as well as degrading the original saints, the Apostles. Are we telling you not to?

Karen R.
Houston, TX

@Meckofahess

You and yours are being met with a huge moral outrage now, also from the hetero population (as well as their LGBT fellow citizens). In your misguided certainty that your view holds the moral high ground, your side has codified a particular religious belief into law. A religious belief not held by all religions. This is where you lose. If you are really concerned about your religious liberty, you will want these laws struck down.

A Quaker
Brooklyn, NY

@FREDISDEAD: I'm not sure, but I think I'm starting to see where your understanding is failing you.

Apparently, your definition of "gay" is a person who has sex with another person of the same sex. Therefore, if that person never has sex with another person of the same sex, they're not gay. And, if they "make a choice" to never have sex, then they're not gay.

Except, that's the wrong definition entirely. A celibate gay person is still gay. They can choose to be celibate. But, they can't "choose" to not be gay.

Because, the correct definition of homosexuality is a person who is innately attracted, romantically, to persons of their own sex. That, my friend, is not a choice. Those of us who are heterosexual are innately attracted to the opposite sex, and we're the majority by far. Our brothers and sisters who are homosexual are about 5% of the population, and their sexuality is no more a choice than ours is. Unless a person is bisexual and can be romantically attracted to either sex, there are no choices in any of this.

New to Utah
PAYSON, UT

Gov Herbert is completely correct in criticizing Virginia Attorney General Mark Herring. Herring
has betrayed the people of Virginia and in fact lied during his campaign that he would support the Virginia constitution. Hopefully the wise people of Virginia will either recall or impeach him. Herbert is fulfilling his oath of office and we should support his actions.

What in Tucket?
Provo, UT

Using the term "marriage" connotates respect for same gender marriage. What we need to do is support heterosexual marriage. A legal union can be done for gays.

dan76
san antonio, TX

During a recent time frame in our country's history, the "Will of the people" allowed Jim Crow and "Separate but equal" legislation.

equal protection
Cedar, UT

@Mechfaess "I'm sorry to say it won't be like racial integration laws where discrimination was based on race. That was a very different thing and after some time we did accept those laws because they were based on moral truths and had broad religious support. The same cannot be said for homosexual conduct."

Race, sex and sexual orientation (unlike religious belief) are considered for the most part to be immutable characteristics. In fact, just like race and sex, the 9th circuit court of appeals, just ruled that sexual orientation merits heightened scrutiny. So no, they are not a "very different thing" regarding civil marriage law. Everyone needs to operate from the same set of facts regarding constitutional law. Do you understand better now?

equal protection
Cedar, UT

@ Grammy, "You want rights but what about all of us who feel our rights are being taken away because you want to create a new law that goes against what I believe in. It is a religious union a marriage between a Man and a Woman."

Do the following religions that honor or perform same-sex marriages have religious rights? Should your religious view be the only one codified into civil law? You will find that these religions are blessed with special access to moral truth, where others are not:
Affirming Pentecostal Church International
Alliance of Christian Churches
Anointed Affirming Independent Ministries
The Association of Welcoming and Affirming Baptists
Christian Church (Disciples of Christ)
Community of Christ
Conservative Judaism
Ecumenical Catholic Church
Ecumenical Catholic Communion
The Episcopal Church
Evangelical Anglican Church In America
Evangelical Lutheran Church in America
Global Alliance of Affirming Apostolic Pentecostals
Inclusive Orthodox Church
Metropolitan Community Church
Old Catholic Church
Progressive Christian Alliance
Reconciling Pentecostals International
Reconstructionist Judaism
Reform Judaism
Reformed Anglican Catholic Church
Religious Society of Friends (Quakers)
Unitarian Universalist Church
United Church of Christ
Unity Church

Mayfair
City, Ut

Karen R said to opponents of SSM "You and yours are being met with a huge moral outrage now."

And you don't think you side is also being met with huge moral outrage??

lds4gaymarriage
Salt Lake City, UT

wrz
Utah has equality re marriage. All people can marry i.e., one man/one woman. Applies equally to all citizens.
LDS4
The pro-miscegenationists said something similar saying, "All people can marry i.e., White/White or Black/Black. Applies equally to all citizens."
Is it equality to allow child molesters, child pornographers and those who sell drugs to kids to marry and raise kids, but the gay couple who are excellent parents aren't allowed to?
Is it equality to deny gays marriage under the excuse of them not being able to have kids while allowing marriage to senior couples equally unable to reproduce?

CBAX
Provo, UT

Well if it makes you happy then OK. I will call the government tomorrow.

RedWings
CLEARFIELD, UT

@ Quaker: Actually, being attracted to the same sex but not acting on it is called "same-sex attration". Acting on it is called "gay". To act on an impulse or attraction is always a choice.

@equal protection: So, are you only favoring religious freedom for churches who you agree with? I would argue that your list of churches do not have special access to moral truth, but rather have been corrupted by the "philosophies of men"....

LovelyDeseret
Gilbert, AZ

In a democracy, "We the People" should always triumph. "I the Judge" or "I the President" should never have the final say.

Baccus0902
Leesburg, VA

@ New to Utah

"Gov Herbert is completely correct in criticizing Virginia Attorney General Mark Herring. Herring
has betrayed the people of Virginia and in fact lied during his campaign that he would support the Virginia constitution. Hopefully the wise people of Virginia will either recall or impeach him. Herbert is fulfilling his oath of office and we should support his actions."

My dear New to Utah,
In Virginia we are proud of AG General Herring who put first the citizens of VA than the "emotional outburst" of a bad moment in history. He and the Governor of VA were elected on this platform.

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