Quantcast

Comments about ‘My view: Pope Francis not Marxist’

Return to article »

Published: Tuesday, Jan. 14 2014 4:29 p.m. MST

Comments
  • Oldest first
  • Newest first
  • Most recommended
marxist
Salt Lake City, UT

Is Pope Francis a Marxist? With all due respect to the writer, that depends upon what we mean by the term. I consider myself to be a Marxist because Marx IMHO developed a theory of capital accumulation and exploitation of labor that is pretty close to right. Pope Francis is I'm sure familiar with Marx in that regard. I dare say he appreciates Marx's contribution to economics. So Pope Francis may well be a Marxist in these terms, but it does not mean the Pope admires tyrannical states which call themselves "Marxist." I've read some of the turgid output of the "Institutes of Marxist Leninism" in the Soviet Union, and they barely knew who Marx was. By my criteria they were not "Marxists."

Open Minded Mormon
Everett, 00

That's not what Rush Limbaugh, Glenn Beck and Sean Hannity tells the Ditto-heads...

======

BTW -- God Bless Pope Francis!

Mountanman
Hayden, ID

I don't know if the Pope is a Marxist or not; "To each according to their needs and from each according to their abilities". But I do know that Marxism has never succeeded in history, because
it is always necessary to enforced with tanks and machine guns. Why? Because people will not be forced work for that which they will not receive. Because only slaves are forced to work for
things they will not receive. Marxism is slavery and people will be free!

Hutterite
American Fork, UT

I think the pope is more of a true doctrinal christian, and that's making a lot of people uncomfortable.

Mark B
Eureka, CA

Marxists are all supposed to be atheists. Wouldn't that little fact be hard for a Catholic priest to cover up - for most of a lifetime?

airnaut
Everett, 00

Mountanman
Hayden, ID
I don't know if the Pope is a Marxist or not; "To each according to their needs and from each according to their abilities". But I do know that Marxism has never succeeded in history, because...

8:47 a.m. Jan. 14, 2014

===========

Guys like you crack me up.

You hate it,
yet - you are the very one's who support it and make it WORK!

Communist China would still be a 3rd world rice patty culture had it not for our Capitalist friends on Wall Street, and the Corporate Welfare Queens who play our politicians like fiddles.

FYI - Marxism works all the time,
It's called "The Family".

As for Societies;
it has worked at least 4 times:

1. the City of Enoch,
2. Moses and the Children of Israel,
3. Christians at the time of Jesus,
4. Nephites/Lamanties at the time of Jesus,

and
it will work in the New Jersualem, the City of Zion.
"To each according to their needs and from each according to their abilities".

2 bits
Cottonwood Heights, UT

Just because you love for your neighbor, and help carry each other's burdens... doesn't make you a Marxist.

A lot of people who aren't Marxist do that (on their own, not by government mandate). It's just fulfilling the law of Christ.

Mountanman
Hayden, ID

@ airnuat. What you don't get is the term FORCE! Families, church and charitable cooperation are not forced, it's voluntary. Force was and is a principle of the evil one! As anyone who ever cracked a history book knows, Marxism always exists only by force! Wise up!

Roland Kayser
Cottonwood Heights, UT

To me the Pope sounds more like Harry Truman than Karl Marx.

marxist
Salt Lake City, UT

These discussions are difficult because most do not know much about Marx. They know he wrote the Communist Manifesto - and that is about it. They know nothing about his contributions to economics. Marx was concerned, as were many others, with labor's status in the new commercial systems. That was the impetus for his contributions. He was not a Russian. He was long dead before any countries "went Communist." He was knowledgeable in virtually all economic thought extant in his day - including those he admired most - Adam Smith and David Ricardo. Marx is a legitimate descendant of both of them.

Thid Barker
Victor, ID

Re. airnaut
Everett, 00
You missed one very important principle difference between charity, families, City of Enoch, Christianity, Church and Marxism: FORCE. Force is an evil principle proposed, employed and implemented by Satan and others throughout history by Marxist/communist governments who force some to work for nothing so others can receive what they didn't earn, by force! That's the difference! The very definition of slavery is forcing someone to work for that which they will not receive so others can receive what they did not work for and earn! Free agency versus being forced, unable to choose for yourself! I guess the war in heaven isn't over, is it?

Irony Guy
Bountiful, Utah

Pope Francis is a disciple of Christ.

2 bits
Cottonwood Heights, UT

Open Minded,
Re: "That's not what Rush Limbaugh, Glenn Beck and Sean Hannity tells the Ditto-heads"...

If you could embrace this reality (vs the fog of partisanship stereotypes)... just because Rush or Beck or anybody on the TV says something... don't just assume that everybody you lump in with them also thinks that way.

Many Conservatives don't believe everything Beck or Limbaugh say. And I know at least Beck highly discourages his audience from just believing what he says on the air, and encourages them to do their own research and form their own opinions.

You may want to try that too (instead of just regurgitating the talking points and what you hear on MSNBC about evil Rush listeners, or Beck listeners, etc). We are really not all bad.

Thid Barker
Victor, ID

One more historical fact. Pol Pot, Joseph Stalin, Mao ste Tung and Ho Chi Minh were all Marxists with a military to enforce it!

Redshirt1701
Deep Space 9, Ut

To "airnaut" wow, you too. Are you LDS Liberal too?

Families are not "marxist" that is proven by the simple fact that what you earn cannot be freely spent by your 5 year old. Plus, you and your spouse own your house, not you and your kids.

As for your societies, those were not marxist, socialist, or communist. They were (gasp) capitalist. According to modern revelation, for a society to be free it must give allowance for property rights and private ownership. Those are 2 of the biggest reasons why we know that communal philosophies are NOT in accordance with God's laws. Not to mention that all of the collectivist philosophies rely on force to redistribute the wealth.

Open Minded Mormon
Everett, 00

Well,
I guess if you read the Bible, and see that Jesus taught Marxism -
Then, Yes - I suppose Pope Francis is a Marxist.

JoeBlow
Far East USA, SC

"Many Conservatives don't believe everything Beck or Limbaugh say"

Ok 2bits. Question. Did congress exempt itself from Obamacare?

marxist
Salt Lake City, UT

@ Thid Barker - "One more historical fact. Pol Pot, Joseph Stalin, Mao ste Tung and Ho Chi Minh were all Marxists with a military to enforce it!" But the social democrats of the European democracies also read Marx - and they're reasonably OK, aren't they?

Back to the 4 cited: Mao and Ho Chi Minh were also fighting nationalist struggles against the imperialist British (the world's first narco-state) and the imperialist French. Their militarism was in large part dictated by those struggles. As for the demonic Stalin, his installation was spirited by the U.S. invasion of Russia following WW I (yes, it's true).

I repeat: the conservatives here have never read Marx, nor know anything about him.

2 bits
Cottonwood Heights, UT

marxist,
RE : "But the social democrats of the European democracies also read Marx - and they're reasonably OK, aren't they"?

Define "Reasonably OK".

===

Re: "I repeat: the conservatives here have never read Marx, nor know anything about him"...

How do you know Conservatives have never read Marx?

I'm Conservative to the bone... and I have read Das Kapital, and The Communist Manifesto, and many commentaries and critiques on his writings and theories.

My grandparents were born and raised in East Germany (moving to the US in the early 1950s). What I know about it I learned at their knee telling me their stories and their first hand views on the subject (not just books).

My son said my studying Marx with him and discussing History at length with him is what lead him to get his Master's Degree in History.

Many Conservatives have read Marx (this may surprise you). They just don't agree that it works (mainly from observing history).

Karl Marx had many good and lofty ideals... but they just don't work in an imperfect system and imperfect people (which we are). History proves I'm right.

Unreconstructed Reb
Chantilly, VA

"Pope Francis is a disciple of Christ."

Bingo. Anyone's free to put him into whatever ideological box one wishes (marxist, whatever). This is the only one that matters.

to comment

DeseretNews.com encourages a civil dialogue among its readers. We welcome your thoughtful comments.
About comments