Utah basketball: Utes can't execute in the clutch — again


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  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    Jan. 16, 2014 8:42 a.m.


    But do you know what my argument is? It is right and that is all that matters. Considering utah's team is not really "young" it means that whatever improvement they have shown is also fairly short lived unless they get some actual "young" talent to replace it. You see many of those guys won't be there long and once a player is gone then he no longer counts. So "set the bar" wherever you want to set it, but most of this particular group is not going to get you there.

    And by the way, I'm not arguing that BYU's team is "young", just that they are younger than utah's. Reading comprehension my friend....

  • Qwest Perfected Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 15, 2014 9:45 p.m.


    Do you know what isn't young? Your arguement is not young. According to your definition, byu is an old team since almost all of them played in high school together.

    I don't understand the constant comparing of the two programs. Byu has been a good team for the last decade. They won a handful of NCAA tournament games in that timeframe which has been the best the program has ever done. Utah during that time has been bad. The Utes are on their third coach during the Rose era and have been in a rebuilding mode for a long time. I know it's scary to think that the Utes have improved enough to compete with your mighty coogs but judging from the close game down at the Marriott Center last year and the not so close win at the Huntsman Center this year, it's safe to say they are just as good as byu this year.

    The Utes aren't quite back to where need to be but the bar is set higher for Utah's basketball program.

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    Jan. 15, 2014 11:04 a.m.


    Well not to get caught up in verbiage but unfortunately verbiage does matter. "Young" means young, mostly underclassmen would qualify as young. But jr's and sr's aren't young although being transfers it does make them inexperienced with the team. So if you want to claim they are inexperienced playing together I'll go right along with you but as I said they won't be there long enough to gain a lot of experience playing with each other because they are not young. Young just doesn't apply in the manner you want to use it. Inexperienced with each other fits better but they have to overcome that quickly because time is extremely limited for them.

  • motorbike Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Jan. 15, 2014 12:13 a.m.


    What you're saying is absolutely true... JC transfers or any transfer for that matter, are guys brought in to make a difference now. I agree whole heartedly. But what you're failing to see/admit, is that the lack of playing time with their team still makes them "young" in regard to experience and cohesiveness. So again I'll state that a team of underclassmen and a couple of JC transfers are the very definition of a young team.
    So you see, it's not me who's flustered or making things up. Instead it is you who fails to admit what experts around the country admit on a daily basis ... teams with a makeup similar to what Utah has this year are correctly labeled a "young team."
    Now lets move on to a more exciting conversation, this one bores me.

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    Jan. 14, 2014 6:40 p.m.

    motorbike I obviously have flustered you, lol. And of course I am right. If you only have two years to play then you don't have time to "be young". What does a program expect out of a 4 year player? They expect him to be mistake prone but to improve for those first two years because he is young and inexperienced. Then they expect him to be much better as an upperclassman because of those first two years of experience he gained.

    Of course that is impossible with a JC transfer, they have to be ready to play NOW, and at a high level because all they have is two years to do it, not four. "Young" does not apply to them for several reasons, one is they aren't young, they are upperclassmen, two is that they don't have time for them to grow up, they only have two years.

    you pride yourself on having some college basketball knowledge and I think you actually do. That is why your post is so ridiculous. You KNOW I'm right about this you just cant stand that I am right.

  • Utes-Best Lil Brothers Anaheim, CA
    Jan. 14, 2014 4:29 p.m.


    Of the 8 Utah and 8 BYU players with the most minutes played this season:

    6 were on Utah's roster last season

    only 4 were on BYU's roster last season

    Utah fans have been using the same whiny, tired excuse of being young and inexperienced for years. The reality is, that's nothing more than an excuse for losing.

    Programs like Kentucky are composed almost entirely of young, inexperienced players who are new to the program, yet you don't hear Kentucky fans whining about how young and inexperienced their team is.

    Re: the BYU-Utah game this season, upsets happen. Congratulations on beating BYU for the first time in the last 8 games and only the fourth time in 16 meetings during the Dave Rose era. It's obviously a huge deal for our little brothers, but on a national scale, practically meaningless, since that's the only quality win you've had all season.

    Current RPI Rankings:

    #37 BYU
    #166 Utah

  • Gone fishin Seattle, WA
    Jan. 14, 2014 4:07 p.m.

    By every announcing crew do you mean PAC 11+1 announcers that are paid by the pac? I thought so.
    We can discuss the Utah/BYU game this year if you would like because it will likely bring up 11 of 13 discussion. So please let's discuss.
    OK, never mind then.

  • motorbike Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Jan. 14, 2014 10:26 a.m.


    "Young only counts if they have 4 seasons to improve, it doesn't count when they only have 2 seasons and they are done."

    It's interesting that every tv crew calling a Utah game this year has disagreed with you. As much as I *cough* value *cough* your opinion, I'll respectfully disagree with your "spin." Two years of junior college ball or one year at SUU does little to nothing for D1 experience and certainly doesn't mean a guy will instantly play well with his new teammates. In college athletics this situation coupled with a lot of underclassmen is the very definition of a "young" team.

    By the way, I don't believe we had a chance to discuss the Utah/BYU game yet. You were saying??

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    Jan. 14, 2014 9:29 a.m.


    I don't think anyone is denying that utah basketball has improved but at the same time the vast majority of the teams they have played this year are among the worst teams in all of college basketball. In years past they were losing to some of those terrible teams and this year they beat them so the improvement, as it were, is obvious. But no one outside of a utah "fan" really believes they are all that good either. They've beaten one good team this year, that's it. They just lost to a really bad team. They've been successful in slowing down the game against good teams and hanging in with some ugly play but they cannot play anything that resembles an uptempo interesting style against a good team and have a chance. They are still a long way off.

    As for football, well their progression of more losses each year indicates they are not improving. I'm not sure how anyone can claim that with a straight face. 4-5 to 3-6 to 2-7 is NOT improvement. Escuses aside that is an increase in the gap not a closing of the gap.

  • sammyg Springville, UT
    Jan. 14, 2014 6:10 a.m.

    "This time next year Utah will be dominating in conference play because they will be older they will have the experience in playing in a tough league and not in highschool gyms."

    Over 12,000 empty red chairs came out to watch the Utes on Sunday.

    And someone is smack talking H.S gyms... priceless.

  • CougOrUte..Naah Nibley, UT
    Jan. 13, 2014 10:31 p.m.

    USC is a real bad team. If Utah doesn't beat them it is going to be a long, long season for the Utes.

  • CougarSunDevil Phoenix, AZ
    Jan. 13, 2014 10:15 p.m.

    I thought this was going to be about Brittany spears...oops I did it again.

    No seriously, I have real evidence that the ute players are throwing the game on purpose to make money.

  • UtesBy5 Syracuse, UT
    Jan. 13, 2014 9:40 p.m.


    "Utah fans are fond of wishfully predicting that success is just around the corner. Unfortunately for U, the actual results have fallen far short of that fantasy."

    Moving to a major conferences from the MWC has been difficult for TCU and Utah. It will take several years to have the athletes and depth to compete for a conference championship. Utah has improved in both sports, slowly. The depth and athletes are becoming PAC-12 quality, it takes time. TCU is making similar gains in the BIG 12.

    My point was this, with the 2014 recruits coming in coupled with the progress being made this season, I would be surprised if Utah doesn't finish in the top 4 or 5 PAC-12 teams next year. I'm not saying they will compete with Arizona for the conference championship.

    FYI, Utah is 9 points from being undefeated. I'm expecting them to be in every game this year with the exception of maybe Arizona in Tucson and UCLA in LA. If you have watched the Utes play this year, and you understand basketball, you would have to agree they have made substantial progress.

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    Jan. 13, 2014 6:05 p.m.


    So your contention is that because utah finally won a game, for the first time in 7 tries and only the 2nd time in 12 tries, that they are suddenly superior in every way? Let's see if you stick to that same spin next time BY beats utah in football after losing several in a row.


  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    Jan. 13, 2014 6:01 p.m.


    Nice spin. Sorry to inform you of this but no matter how young you want to claim those jr's and sr's are based on how long they've been in the program they are still jr's and sr's that won't be in the program for long. Young only counts if they have 4 seasons to improve, it doesn't count when they only have 2 seasons and they are done. They have to be good NOW not 2 years from now because they will be long gone 2 years from now.

  • Chamberlain Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 13, 2014 5:11 p.m.


    Utah does have a young team, but BYU's is even younger both in class and years with the program.

  • Chamberlain Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 13, 2014 5:10 p.m.


    Utah fans are fond of wishfully predicting that success is just around the corner. Unfortunately for U, the actual results have fallen far short of that fantasy.

    4-5, 3-6, 2-7 in football

    3-15, 5-13, 1-3 in basketball

    Keep dreaming.

  • UtesBy5 Syracuse, UT
    Jan. 13, 2014 4:13 p.m.

    Utah's season is progressing fine. Utah's more athletic and much deeper than in previous PAC-12 years. Their 2014 recruiting class is excellent. They will only lose Lenz after this season. The Utes will continue to build and should finish in the upper tier of the PAC-12 next season.

    The weak preseason schedule is what this team needed this year. Focus on confidence and cohesiveness has been achieved. I would hope in future years we have a few more road games and schedule a few harder games.

    I like the type of athletes that Coach Krystkowiak is recruiting. The PAC-12 teams have long, athletic players and the Utes are beginning to fit that mold. Their defense is much improved as well and with Delon Wright running the offense, ball movement has improved this season. I like the direction.

    duckhunter, keep telling yourself that byu lost to a "mediocre" team. Those that witnessed the game saw a Utah team that was more athletic than byu dominate the game from start to finish. But by all means, please continue to comment on Utah articles and remind everyone of byu's strong preseason SOS. Too bad they have to play in the WCC.

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    Jan. 13, 2014 2:29 p.m.


    That was a reasonable post, congratulations. utah has improved but the win total is obviously deceiving based on their schedule. Playing even a decent, not great, schedule utah is probably still a sub .500 team. BYU on the otherhand has played a great schedule thus far and despite the upset loss to utah is still squarely in line for an ncaa at large berth as long as they perform well the rest of the year. Their conference is rated in the top 1/3rd, their schedule is rated even higher, they have some good wins. They have some "good" losses against some top 25 teams although they have a few bad losses to, like the one to utah, against some mediocre teams that will probably drag their seeding down. But overall BYU is still the obvious best team in the state, even with the loss to utah, and is still the highest rated team in the state but a long shot.

  • PAC man Anaheim, CA
    Jan. 13, 2014 2:08 p.m.


    "This time next year Utah will be dominating in conference play because they will be older they will have the experience in playing in a tough league..."

    Utah fans have been spouting this same tired spin since Majerus left.

    Utah is 1-19 in PAC road games, 9-31 overall.

    You're obviously living under the delusion that Utah is the only program in the PAC with a chance of improving and that the rest of the league will remain stagnant.

  • motorbike Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Jan. 13, 2014 2:01 p.m.


    Your comment:

    Utah's key players, those playing the majority of minutes, aren't all that "young"
    Utah's Top 8 in Minutes Played
    Jordan Loveridge (SO)
    Delon Wright (JR)
    Brandon Taylor (SO)
    Dakarai Tucker (SO)
    Jeremy Olsen (SO)
    Renan Lenz (SR)
    Princeton Onwas (JR)
    Dallin Bachynski (JR)
    1 SR, 3 JR, 4 SO, 0 FR (avg 2.625 years)

    FYI ... When someone says "young team" in relation to college athletics it is implied that they haven't been with the program very long and/or they are underclassmen.

    With that in mind you may want to go back through the list and notice that not one of them has played with the Utes for more than a season and a half:

    Jordan Loveridge (SO)- 2nd year with Utes
    Delon Wright (JR) - 1st year with Utes
    Brandon Taylor (SO) - 2nd year with Utes
    Dakarai Tucker (SO) - 2nd year with Utes
    Jeremy Olsen (SO) - 2nd year with Utes
    Renan Lenz (SR) - 2nd year with Utes
    Princeton Onwas (JR) - 1st year with Utes
    Dallin Bachynski (JR) - 2nd year with Utes

    That's a young team my friend.

  • 11 of past 12 Seattle, WA
    Jan. 13, 2014 1:31 p.m.

    So when you saw dominate are you talking about winning one road game? That would be an improvement over the last three seasons

  • Jordan Lynchburg, VA
    Jan. 13, 2014 1:21 p.m.

    Gone fishin, I beg to differ on that last comment. There are as many BYU fans who are that "fickle" as any other fan. I don't think we will be dominating next year, however i am excited to see the continued improvement we've been seeing with Coach Krystco at the helm so far, plus our main players having another year of experience under their belt. Plus, from what I've seen, the ooc scheduling is much better next season.

    Either way, I'm still excited for what the Utes will do this season, hopefully they can get over the hump on the road and learn how to take and make decent shots down the stretch (the offense was horrendous in the second half). I'm still excited to go watch my team!

    Go Utes!

  • Robroy Murray, utah
    Jan. 13, 2014 1:01 p.m.

    There are a good many high school gyms in the mighty pac Mr. Crow.

  • mussingaround Palo Alto, CA
    Jan. 13, 2014 12:00 p.m.

    Elmer Fudd

    #38 BYU was quite obviously a huge upset win for the #166 Utes - Utah's ONLY Top 100 win of the season.

    Like Utah beating Stanford and BYU in football, it won't mean anything by season's end because the Utes will once again be left on the outside looking in at the post season.

  • Elmer Fudd Sandy, Utah
    Jan. 13, 2014 11:40 a.m.

    @ Real Bass

    "This is what happens when you play cupcakes at home. You aren't prepared when the real games come. You can't pad your way into success!"

    So I guess you could throw BYU into that category of cupcakes. Apparently the Cougies were an easy win.

  • TroyTown Anaheim, CA
    Jan. 13, 2014 10:59 a.m.


    "Utah is just young and are learning to play on the road."

    LOL at your delusion!

    The Utes have only played THREE road games (only one OOC) all season and played the 350th worst preseason schedule in the country. How did you expect the Utes to learn how to play tough teams on the road when you only played ONE such team in the first three months of the season?

    Utah's key players, those playing the majority of minutes, aren't all that "young"

    Utah's Top 8 in Minutes Played
    Jordan Loveridge (SO)
    Delon Wright (JR)
    Brandon Taylor (SO)
    Dakarai Tucker (SO)
    Jeremy Olsen (SO)
    Renan Lenz (SR)
    Princeton Onwas (JR)
    Dallin Bachynski (JR)

    1 SR, 3 JR, 4 SO, 0 FR (avg 2.625 years)

    BYU's Top 8 in Minutes Played
    Kyle Collinsworth (SO)
    Tyler Haws (JR)
    Matt Carlino (JR)
    Nate Austin (JR)
    Eric Mika (FR)
    Skyler Halford (JR)
    Frank Bartley IV (FR)
    Anson Winder (JR)

    0 SR, 5 JR, 1 SO, 2 FR (avg 2.375 years)

    BYU doesn't have a single Senior on their roster

  • souptwins Lindon, UT
    Jan. 13, 2014 10:57 a.m.

    I'm not sure why people are thinking a .500 season would get an NIT invite. Have any of you looked at the records of those teams from last year's NIT? Not gonna cut it-- no matter what conference you're in.

  • Gone fishin Seattle, WA
    Jan. 13, 2014 10:34 a.m.

    Here you go again, predicting that the utes will dominate the pac. You must be chris b. #2 reincarnated.
    By the way BYU also happens to be pretty young. I guess that means that they will dominate their conference? BYU fans are not that fickle to make such irrational predictions.

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    Jan. 13, 2014 10:30 a.m.


    "This time next year Utah will be dominating in conference play"

    LOL! I can't wait to see that.

  • Crow Sandy , UT
    Jan. 13, 2014 9:50 a.m.

    @Real Bass actually the schedule that Majerus put together in 98 was almost as bad. In fact I remember a lot of the experts saying that Utah would not go far because of their strentgh of schedule after they had won 18 straight but lost a couple of games including in the WAC tourney that year.

    If your a good team your schedule does not matter. Utah is just young and are learning to play on the road. This time next year Utah will be dominating in conference play because they will be older they will have the experience in playing in a tough league and not in highschool gyms.

  • Ed Grady Idaho Falls, ID
    Jan. 13, 2014 8:37 a.m.

    Hey Friel Court is a tough place to play.

  • Steven S Jarvis Orem, UT
    Jan. 13, 2014 7:37 a.m.

    Utah's confidence probably isn't hurting to bad the way they have lost their games this year. This 3-point loss is the largest margin so far. Utah will have a tough time winning on the road. They SHOULD beat both Washington and WSU when they come to town, likely play to around .500 ball and get an invite to a post season event such as the NIT.

  • Real Bass Idaho Falls, ID
    Jan. 13, 2014 7:14 a.m.

    This is what happens when you play cupcakes at home. You aren't prepared when the real games come. You can't pad your way into success!

  • Cletus from Coalville Coalville, UT
    Jan. 13, 2014 6:27 a.m.

    We are dang competetive on the road and battle good because we are a awsome road team. We are going to go far in the big dance.

    Go Utes!

  • Two For Flinching Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 13, 2014 2:34 a.m.

    Basketball is doing their best football impression. Come one guys, get over that hump!

  • midpacmajor Salt Lake City, Utah
    Jan. 12, 2014 10:33 p.m.

    29.5% shooting at Washington St for the #1 FG% team in the county says it all.

    The results of playing the 350th worst preseason schedule entirely at home, save one game, are coming back to haunt the Utes.

    Just as many predicted before the season began, playing such a cupcake preseason schedule left the Utes completely unprepared for conference play, especially on the road.

    If the Utes don't pick up a win against USC at home this week, the Utes could easily go 0 for the rest of the conference. Utah's game at USC may be Utah's only remaining chance to pick up a road win this season.