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Utah basketball: Utes fall short in late-night tilt against the Washington Huskies

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  • jarka-rus Layton, Utah
    Jan. 11, 2014 11:03 a.m.

    @Chrissy B and Draper Ute
    Let me teach you something Coach K is a hall of fame coach at Duke that will be playing deep in the tourney, Coach Krysko coaches for the Utes who won't make the tourney. glad to be able to teach you something LOL

  • SportsFan Orem, UT
    Jan. 10, 2014 11:01 p.m.

    DUF

    "...you know BYU's SOS is going to drop and Utah's is going to increase considerably by season's end."

    Not as much as you seem to think.

    #37 BYU's and #150 Utah's conference SOS are MUCH, MUCH closer than their non-conference SOS.

    non-conf SOS BYU #4, Utah #350 (+346)
    conf SOS BYU #126, Utah #58 (-68)

  • Uteanymous Salt Lake City, Utah
    Jan. 10, 2014 10:22 p.m.

    motorbike

    "I'm glad you realize the Utes would've beat BYU in a rematch last year. :)"

    Pure speculation - the Utes MIGHT have beaten BYU in a rematch last year.

    It doesn't always work out that way. Sometimes, such as in Jimmer's one-man annihilation of Utah in 2011, and in 2010 and 2008, the margin of victory is even greater on the opponent's home floor:

    1/11/2011 SLC BYU 104 Utah 79 (+25)
    2/12/2011 Provo BYU 72 Utah 59 (+13)

    1/30/2010 Provo BYU 82 Utah 69 (+13)
    3/3/2010 SLC BYU 71 Utah 51 (+20)

    1/27/2009 SLC BYU 88 Utah 94 (-6) (OT)
    2/28/2009 Provo BYU 63 Utah 50 (+13)

    1/9/2008 Provo BYU 55 Utah 52 (+3)
    2/20/2008 SLC BYU 67 Utah 59 (+8)

    1/31/2007 SLC BYU 76 Utah 66 (+10)
    3/3/2007 Provo BYU 85 Utah 62 (+23)

  • DraperUteFan Draper, UT
    Jan. 10, 2014 5:13 p.m.

    Nobody on the Ute side of the aisle has argued in favor of the Utes nonconference SOS, so it is a moot point. Cmon Cougar fans, you know BYUs SOS is going to drop and Utah's is going to increase considerably by season's end.

    Utah is a long shot to get into any tournament this year. Utah fans are happy our team is improving and showing signs of life, but looking back over the thread, I don't see vast delusions of grandeur from all Ute fans that BYU fans keep talking about. An improving team does not yet mean a winning or tournament-bound team and contrary to what many BYU fans post on these boards, beating BYU does not make a season for most Utah fans.

    The Huntsman Center is full again (some youngish Cougar fans think only the HC had a problem with attendance and forget late in the Roger Reid era and early with Steve Cleveland, BYU's attendance tanked for a few years).

    SOS, RPI, this team beat that team and so on and so forth. Utah is improving and that is what matters to this Utah fan.

  • motorbike Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Jan. 10, 2014 4:52 p.m.

    scott

    "A little history lesson:
    1/25/1990 BYU 65 Utah 49 (+16 BYU)
    2/10/1990 BYU 73 Utah 89 (+16 Utah)
    A 32-point swing in less than 3 weeks."

    I'm glad you realize the Utes would've beat BYU in a rematch last year. :)

  • scott Alpine, UT
    Jan. 10, 2014 4:08 p.m.

    pocyUte

    It's funny how Utah fans who once embraced the computers as the end-all-be-all superior method of determining BCS "worthiness" are now discrediting those same rankings.

    Final BCS rankings for 2013:

    #5 Stanford
    #40 BYU
    #54 Utah

    BYU's #38 SOS was TOUGHER than ANY schedule Utah had played prior to 2013 (#41 in 2012), though not as tough as BYU's 2004 (#11) and 2003 (#14) schedules.

    ------

    In basketball, Utah did beat BYU on Utah's home court, but it's not at all uncommon for a team to lose to an opponent on the road, but beat that same opponent at home.

    BYU at Pepperdine 74-80
    BYU versus Pepperdine 84-72

    As far as records go, Utah's record was built on the 350th weakest OOC SOS in the country. BYU's record was built on the 4th toughest OOC SOS in the country.

    NINE of Utah's twelve wins have come against teams ranked in the Bottom 100.

    -----------------

    "I would argue that a 2 point loss on the road is easier overcome than a 17 point loss."

    A little history lesson:

    1/25/1990 BYU 65 Utah 49 (+16 BYU)
    2/10/1990 BYU 73 Utah 89 (+16 Utah)

    A 32-point swing in less than 3 weeks.

  • Cougsndawgs West Point , UT
    Jan. 10, 2014 3:13 p.m.

    PocyUte:
    What's your point? I never stated BYU was better than Utah in my post...not once did I even insinuate that. I was pointing out the fact that the better team doesn't always win, using Washington over Utah as a case in point. I don't think BYU is better than Utah in basketball this year, so why would I have said that? My point was that BYU fans have often said that one loss to Utah (or any other team) doesn't mean they weren't the better team (this argument is usually about football). Utah fans can never accept this logic because they only want to see head to head results (which favor their position). Utah is better than Washington despite losing to them...that does not equal BYU being better than Utah despite losing to them by 17 points. Utah beat BYU because they were/are better than BYU, but lost to Washington DESPITE being the better team. Hopefully that cleared it up for you.

  • pocyUte Pocatello, ID
    Jan. 10, 2014 1:08 p.m.

    Scott

    I'm not saying 1 game makes the season. But in the BYU fan mentality, head to head results matter less than computers. Do you think BYU would have their National Championship in football if it had been up to the computers?

    Utah BEAT BYU this year, AND has a better record. Utah may not have a huge signature win, but neither does BYU. The one thing that BYU has over Utah is 2 hugely ugly losses.

    Cougsndawgs: To your point, the season may play out that Utah is better than Washington. I would argue that a 2 point loss on the road is easier overcome than a 17 point loss. I would also argue that with BYU's losses in the WCC, the season has already played out that Utah is better than BYU.

  • motorbike Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Jan. 10, 2014 10:07 a.m.

    scott

    "BYU lost at Pepperdine 80-74 less than two weeks ago, but beat the Waves 84-72 tonight, an 18-point swing."

    Keep in mind Pepperdine was missing 3 players, two of which are starters and the top two scorers on their team.

    Yes, Mika wasn't playing either, but that had far less affect on BYU than what Pepperdine was dealing with. Imagine if it were Haws, Collinsworth and Sharp who missed the game last night ... that's close to what Pepperdine was dealing with.

    And yet right up until near the end, Pepperdine still made it a competitive game. This doesn't bode well for BYU.

  • DraperUteFan Draper, UT
    Jan. 10, 2014 8:39 a.m.

    @sammyG

    You would need to actually use my thoughts to put them into perspective. First, I spoke about the PAC as a conference and mentioned nothing of Utah. Second, I made no such point that conference affiliation makes for a successful athletic program. Third, when did you become the spokesperson for the fans of the entire conference?

    Ouch.

  • sammyg Springville, UT
    Jan. 10, 2014 7:31 a.m.

    DraperUteFan

    "Cougar fans mocking the PAC, historically the strongest conference in all combined NCAA sports, is comical if it weren't so absurd."

    Let me put your thought into some perspective...

    The absurdity is Utah fans thinking that conference association makes for a successful athletic program on 'the hill'.

    And that's the sentiment from your brothers and sisters in the conference as well.

    Ouch.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Jan. 10, 2014 6:40 a.m.

    @Kiboo

    Rose can't measure up to Majerus??? If I'm chosing a coach for my son to pay for, I'll take Rose over Majerus ANY DAY. And I know of many former U of U players who would agree.

    ----------

    And let me guess, you also coached these "many" former Ute players in high school as well?

    As far as winning in the tournament, there is no comparison between the two. Majerus is king! RIP big man!

  • Cougsndawgs91 West Point, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 11:59 p.m.

    Here's a kicker ute fans...I'm a BYU fan who still thinks Utah is better than Washington! ...say what? Ya, I truly believe that. Because you see, the beauty of sports is that the better team doesn't always win. If that were the case the games would never be played. BYU went into a four game funk that I still haven't figured out, but they are still a decent team. Utah IS a better team than Washington but did not do some things, especially in double teams that they should/could have done to win. The season WILL prove out that Utah is better than Washington. Just because you don't subscribe to that logic doesn't make it untrue...watch and see. Utah will finish higher in the PAC than Washington will and losing to Washington won't matter because Utah IS the better team. I just used the logic BYU fans use in your favor...don't thank me when you see that it's true at the end of the season.

  • DraperUteFan Draper, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 11:11 p.m.

    Following the Texas who beat North Carolina who beat Michigan State line of reasoning, Texas is better than Michigan State and BYU is better than all three of them, yet the Spartans drilled Texas 92-78 recently, leading to a Texas skid of 3 of their last 4 (with an 0-2 conference record after getting soundly beaten by both Oklahoma schools).

    Keep trotting out the Texas argument. Fans did it in football and keep dreaming that it will be a signature win in basketball too, but it isn't so.

    The one thing your argument did prove though by mentioning the 18-point swing against Pepperdine is that BYU basketball is as inconsistent as the football team and nothing to brag about. Oh, I forgot, BYU trumps Utah in non conference RPI, so that makes BYU clearly the better squad.

    BYU could beat Utah if they played again this year and Utah could beat Washington if they played again, and Texas could beat Michigan State if they played again, but it isn't a game of Woulda, Coulda, Shoulda. It is about who won and who lost and that is all that matters for this year.

  • scott Alpine, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 10:05 p.m.

    pocyUte

    "Anytime they take pot shots at Utah, BYU is just 17 points worse."

    BYU beat Texas 86-82, which beat No Carolina 86-83, which beat Michigan St 79-65, which just beat #3-ranked Ohio St 72-68.

    By your line of reasoning, BYU is 17 points better than the 3rd-ranked team in the country.

    Following that same line of reasoning, Utah was better than PAC 12 champion Stanford, yet Stanford played in the Rose Bowl, while Utah was home vegging on the couch during bowl season.

    Utah fans just can't accept the fact that one game does not a season make, nor does it prove which team was better.

    BYU lost at Pepperdine 80-74 less than two weeks ago, but beat the Waves 84-72 tonight, an 18-point swing.

    Anybody who denies that the same thing couldn't happen in a BYU-Utah rematch in the Marriott Center this season obviously doesn't know anything about the game of basketball.

  • pocyUte Pocatello, ID
    Jan. 9, 2014 7:19 p.m.

    I find it comical that Utah loses a road game by 2 points, and the Cougar trolls are falling all over themselves to talk smack.

    But really, what are they talking about? Anytime they take pot shots at Utah, BYU is just 17 points worse.

    So according to worf if Utah would finish in the bottom half of the WCC, it's likely that BYU would finish at the very bottom.

    Utah is fine, but they need make the transition from competitive to winning.

    Let's go get Wazzu.

    Go UTES!!

  • worf Mcallen, TX
    Jan. 9, 2014 4:56 p.m.

    History will soon repeat itself.

    Utes play tough teams, and the cougs play cupcakes.

    In all honesty, the utes would finish in the bottom half if they were in the WCC.

  • Kiboo South Jordan, Utah
    Jan. 9, 2014 4:13 p.m.

    Rose can't measure up to Majerus??? If I'm chosing a coach for my son to pay for, I'll take Rose over Majerus ANY DAY. And I know of many former U of U players who would agree.

    Majerus had a nice run with Van Horn, Doleac, Miller and company, but NBA caliber athletes, especially three or four within a couple of years, hardly ever come to Utah, or BYU for that matter. It will be well into this century, maybe the next, before Utah experiences another run like that.

    As far as winning, with class, there is no comparison between the two. Rose wins hands down.

  • DraperUteFan Draper, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 4:10 p.m.

    Coach K. has a young team and scheduled light in non conference so he had ample practice time to prepare his team for conference play. As a Utah fan, I have no problem with that, so I'm not sure why BYU fans should care. Realistic Ute fans don't think we've suddenly gone from cellar dwellar to national prominence, but the team is much improved and has almost no seniors.

    I have no idea why BYU fans keep making a big deal about RPI when few Utah fans care. We are a team in rebuild mode. RPI could stand for Retired Primordial Insect for all we care...it is meaningless in the development and long-term goal of what Coach K. is trying to do on the hill.

    It bears repeating over and over, RPI only helps you if you win. BYU's RPI may still not help them get to the Dance and it certainly isn't helping them win games in the WCC.

  • DraperUteFan Draper, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 3:44 p.m.

    Jarka rus, the PAC 12 went 6-3 in bowl games, 2nd best among all conferences. BYU fans talk up their record against the PAC 12 whenever there is something worth talking about, yet denigrate the conference when it suits them.

    The last Independent or WCC team to win a national championship in basketball was?? The PAC 12 has more national basketball champions than any conference. It is very likely the PAC will have one #1 seed and UCLA, Oregon, and Colorado could all end up a top 5 seed. It is possible the PAC 12 could send 6 or more teams to the NCAA field of 64.

    Cougar fans mocking the PAC, historically the strongest conference in all combined NCAA sports, is comical if it weren't so absurd.

  • Chris B Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 3:36 p.m.

    @BeSmart,

    I'll teach you something about bracketology. They use today's RPI to factor that decision. And this would make sense for a team whose future is reasonably expected to maintain the same RPI for the rest of the season.

    In byU's case, such logic would say that byu's future schedule is more or less comparable to their strength of schedule in non-conference play.

    But byu's RPI is going to drop like a rock as byU continues to play nobodies throughout conference play. Whereas Duke and Lousiville, which currently have worse RPI's than byU, will begin to increase significantly as they play a very challenging conference schedule.

    LOL!

    Glad I could teach you something.

  • Down under Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 3:36 p.m.

    Chris b, Spokane ute, and the likes,
    RPI has a lot to do with the confidence a team has in themselves. A higher ranking means that a team has the clout and guts to schedule tough teams. Utah has neither. Their records does not indicate the quality of the team when they only play at home and against the weakest schedule in the entire country.

    If WSU gets their leading scorer back for Sunday then the utes will lose by more that two points. The coach and AD have done a huge disservice to the program, instilling false expectations of who they really are.

  • 81Ute Central, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 3:14 p.m.

    @talkinsports

    So what? Lots of tourney appearences lots of cougar no shows. He is a little tidbit for ya', in 1998 Utah won 5 games in the NCAA tournament, that is more tournament wins than BYU has since 1994. Again so what? Comparing Rose to Majerus is not fair to Rose...he can't measure up. As far as losing star players, every year every college loses start players (usually at the end of the season). The honor code issue has NOTHING to do with Utah basketball that is a BYU issue only...who cares?

    Utah has it's course and byu has theirs, unfortunately, we still must be entangled with you. If Utah were to never schedule a game/event/meet with byu, life would go on and we would all be better off.

  • BeSmart Cheyenne, WY
    Jan. 9, 2014 3:01 p.m.

    ESPN Bracketology today is predicting BYU as one of the last 4 out.
    The Pac-12 projected with 4 teams in the dance.
    The MWC with 4 teams in the dance.
    And the WCC with 2.
    No Utah schools are projected to make it.

  • atl134 Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 2:42 p.m.

    They've lost 3 games by a combined total of 6 points and some of you want to proclaim them finished.

  • motorbike Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 2:34 p.m.

    ND95CA

    "The Utes would very likely lose a return visit to Provo."

    It's funny that this is the only thing left for Cougar fans to say ... but go ahead and hang your hat on that hypothetical rather than the embarrassment of a game the Cougs actually played this year.

    I wonder what you and other Coug fans will say when the Utes walk out of the Marriott Center victorious next year... My guess is we'll hear the same crickets we heard when the football Utes walked out of LES this past season... well... until BYU rolls off a meaningless win streak over WCC teams and the Utes drop some games in the substantially better PAC-12. You guys will always have that to come back to.

    I'll give you this much, it's tough to be a Coug these days. Hang in there!

  • jarka-rus Layton, Utah
    Jan. 9, 2014 2:26 p.m.

    @Spokane Ute
    Ute fans have been on high spin cycle ever since joining the mighty Pac, in both football and bball. Talking up the conference like they own everyone. Yet ASU gets slapped around by a non ranked Texas Tech team and a freshman QB, oh and Stanford gets denied by MSU, all spin turned to Oregon the last team standing barely. I'm sure now we will hear all about how the Pac is such a juggernaut in Bball they'll have four #1 seeds in the tourney.

  • Chris B Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 2:05 p.m.

    scott,

    And byu has a higher RPI than Duke and Louisville.

    Keep telling yourself RPI matters this early in the season.

  • DraperUteFan Draper, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 1:59 p.m.

    @talkinsports, your argument lost all credibility when you said "very easily put BYU back in the national title conversation."

    First, whose conversation? Jay Billas, Digger Phelps, and the pundits who actually follow national contenders like Arizona, Kentucky, North Carolina, Duke, Kansas, Michigan State, and the like? I don't recall anyone talking a lot about BYU basketball being in the "national title conversation."

    Second, the implication that they are "back in the national title conversation" assumes that they consistently or even irregularly were in that discussion.

    How many times have we heard of national championships being won on the basis of the latest and greatest recruiting class? The promise of greatness rarely materializes and winning a national championship in basketball is the hardest thing to do in college sports. BYU has come marginally close twice in my lifetime, and I'm pushing the half century mark. It isn't easy and history tells us that it is not likely BYU will make an NCAA finals game appearance any time soon.

  • utahcountyute Cedar Hills, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 1:56 p.m.

    Talkin

    ByU "Back in the national title conversation"? When have they EVER been mentioned?

    Scott

    ByU losing to bottom of WCC really hasn't helped the Utes RPI either.

    All I have to say, Football and Basketball, SCOREBOARD!

  • Solomon Levi Alpine, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 1:31 p.m.

    SoonerUte

    So now you've chosen to completely ignore the pre-season except for your win versus BYU?

    Moral victories are all the rage on the hill now that conference play has begun, since that's pretty much all that Utah can count on going forward.

    Washington and Washington State, btw, are the easiest opponents left on Utah's schedule.

  • worf Mcallen, TX
    Jan. 9, 2014 1:27 p.m.

    Huskies are the latest of many ute busters.

  • scott Alpine, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 1:12 p.m.

    DraperUteFan

    I'm amused with your switch to football and your spin.

    In football, BYU finished 8-5 and qualified for a bowl playing the 38th toughest SOS, according to Sagarin; a schedule that was TOUGHER than ANY schedule Utah had EVER played prior to 2013.

    Switching back to basketball:

    BYU is ranked #30 in RPI after playing the 4th toughest non-conf SOS.
    Utah is ranked #146 in RPI after playing the 350th toughest non-conf SOS.

  • ekute Layton, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 1:05 p.m.

    poyman,

    A 1/2 gallon of Lavell's Vanilla at the BYU Creamery says that Utah is currently and will continue to be the premier basketball program in the state...just like in football.

  • SoonerUte Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 1:02 p.m.

    "Can we change the running utes to the "moral victory" utes?"
    Is moral victory a bad thing? That just means Ute fans are disappointed in the loss, but appreciate the hard work of the players, and fans still support the team.

    BYU doesn't have any moral victories. They started conference with two flat out losses. What does that mean? Read the boards after a Cougar loss. There are no "good game" of "tough loss" comments. There are "fans" questioning if coach still has it, or calling out players by name as "hurting the team". Blaming the refs, hand wringing, finger pointing, and name calling. I feel bad for those kids. They'll never meet fan expectation.

  • talkinsports Gilbert, AZ
    Jan. 9, 2014 1:02 p.m.

    81Ute

    The problem isn't Utah's close losses, the problem is, except for BYU, Utah hasn't beaten ANYBODY.

    Besides #30 BYU, Utah has beaten #122, #124, #232, #261, #304, #316, #323, #330, #338 and two lower division opponents that are so bad that they aren't even counted in the RPI calculations.

    -----------------------

    DraperUteFan

    Dave Rose was within one made basketball of beating Florida in regulation to advance to the Elite Eight. If BYU hadn't lost Brandon Davies just before the playoffs began, BYU would have been a legitimate national title contender.

    How would Majerus have done in 1998 if he'd lost one of his two best players just before the playoffs began? Would he have still made it to the NCAA final, or would he have lost to Arkansas in the 2nd round?

    In his first 8 seasons, Rose lead BYU to 6 NCAAs, 2 NITs.
    In his first 8 seasons, Majerus lead Utah to 5 NCAAs, 1 NIT.

    Looking forward, Rose has assembled an amazing group of recruits over the last couple of recruiting classes that could very easily put BYU back in the national title conversation when they're all back from church missions in a couple of years.

  • souptwins Lindon, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 12:58 p.m.

    Why must every sports article involving BYU or Utah digress into a spitting contest between seeming to be 5 yr. olds? As a BYU fan, I watched most of the game last night and thought the Utes came back very well. They played hard and UW had great defense against Loveridge. I was very surprised Utah made it that close at the end. Nice job! At some point, I also wonder if Coach Kryst's strategy of playing doormats at home wasn't taken a bit to the extreme. I understand the reasoning behind it but think this was a game where they could have used a little road experience against tougher teams. When BYU (home) and BSU (away) are your only somewhat decent teams on your OOC schedule, there's going to be little rude awakening at some point.

  • ekute Layton, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 12:41 p.m.

    I guess that if my team was struggling in the wcc all my attention would turn to the Runnin' Utes and the PAC 12.

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Jan. 9, 2014 12:33 p.m.

    Utah throttles BYU, so their fans are left to pull for Utah's other opponents, in hope they can do what BYU couldn't; beat them. Then the spin game, and connect the dot game begins. Oh well, if you can't beat 'em, make stuff up.

  • DraperUteFan Draper, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 12:28 p.m.

    @ Scott in Alpine, so you are going to play the "year, but we beat Texas" game that all the BYU fans foisted on us during football season when trying to convince us all about how amazing BYU's schedule was and how difficult the teams were they beat?

    Now after the bowl season is over, the house of cards comes crashing down. BYU loses to Washington, Texas gets beaten badly AGAIN by the PAC 12 BYU fans love to belittle so much, Houston loses, Wisconsin loses, Georgia Tech loses, and Notre Dame becomes the only bowl victorious team on that mighty Cougar schedule (except of course that BYU did not beat them).

    Texas has lost 3 of 4 in basketball and just like in football season, BYU fans are desperately clinging to the "yeah, but we beat Texas" mantra, which sounds like the broken record it is.

  • poyman Lincoln City, OR
    Jan. 9, 2014 12:23 p.m.

    @ekute

    Bet you a McDonalds lunch that BYU ends the Season in a much higher seed in the WCC than Utah in the big bad pac12... So far BYU has done better in the pac 12 conference than the utes... And the Cougs aren't even in it... We'll see how Utah does agains the Ducks in Eugene and against the Indians (I mean the Cardinal) in Palo Alto.

    BYU played all 3 games against the pac12 on the road and have a better Road Record by a mile over the utes.

  • poyman Lincoln City, OR
    Jan. 9, 2014 12:17 p.m.

    @ 2-11 or I mean 54-10

    Whoever it is y'all need you will need them on your home floor... Seems to me the next game will be in Provo... Not in the HC... We all know that would mean a very good evening for the Cougs.

    @stgtoslc

    "Abad WSU team??? They took a much better team than the utes into OT last night and lost a game that they should have won... They are however, much like the utes... They have a very tough time on the road... Although they have won a game "away" this year (unlike the utes).

  • scott Alpine, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 12:08 p.m.

    DraperUteFan

    Chaining together comparative scores is the most worthless exercise in sports analysis.

    BYU beat Texas 86-82, which beat No Carolina 86-83, which beat Michigan St 79-65, which just beat #3-ranked Ohio St 72-68.

    By your line of reasoning, BYU is one of the top 3 teams in the country.

    Even more proof that one home game upset does not a season make.

  • DraperUteFan Draper, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 11:59 a.m.

    talkinsports, BYU has had a great run during the Rose era. Most Utah fans agree, Rose is the classiest and most likable coach BYU has had since Lavell. Rose has a fun to watch style of up tempo basketball.

    That said, how many Sweet 16 appearances and wins does Dave Rose have? BYU has a very long history of losing in the first round of the NCAA tournament, with two notable exceptions (the Danny Ainge year and the Jimmer year). Take those two away and BYU basketball has very little to get excited about in postseason play.

  • talkinsports Gilbert, AZ
    Jan. 9, 2014 11:52 a.m.

    ekute

    BYU wasn't just "competitive", BYU BEAT #78 112-103, #62 86-82, and #83 85-74, all on the road or at neutral sites.

    If you're only talking competitive, BYU was very competitive versus #2 88-90, #5 96-105, #9 96-100 in OT, and #15 62-75 (BYU was only down 3, 61-64, at the 2:33 mark).

    Meanwhile, #30 BYU is the only team of any significance that the Utes have beaten.

    Upsets happen, especially on the road. It's the nature of the game.

  • Down under Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 11:51 a.m.

    Draper,
    Just like football utah fans hang their ENTIRE season's success on the BYU game. True that the utes beat BYU this year but what about the past 12 years? That does NOT make them the better team this year. The utes are in their regular nose dive once they got past their high school preseason schedule.
    Jus come to grips with it and move on to skiing or gymnastics.

  • 81Ute Central, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 11:50 a.m.

    Lots of hate on boards today. The direction of the Runnin' Utes is upward (there will always be losses). 3 Losses by a total of 6 pts, what about your team?

  • talkinsports Gilbert, AZ
    Jan. 9, 2014 11:41 a.m.

    Chris B

    "Yes the Pac 12 is more than we can handle."

    True!

    10-20 all-time in the PAC 12.

    -----------------

    "And Utah is more than BYU can handle."

    False!

    Dave Rose is 12-4 versus Utah; 11 wins in the last 13; average score last 16 games:

    BYU 72
    Utah 65

    -----------------

    "as "bad" as we are, you're worse!"

    False!

    Overall during the Dave Rose era:

    BYU 218-73(75%) - 6 NCAAs, 2 NITs, 8 straight 20+ win seasons, 4 conf championships
    Utah 128-140(48%) - 1 NCAA, 6 losing seasons, 1 20+ win season, 1 conf championship

  • whowhatwhy Shire, 00
    Jan. 9, 2014 11:40 a.m.

    Ute Fans Ignore them. Their statements are just meaningless! So funny that fans get on here and rip on you when they can't win anything agains MUCH LESSER teams! Good luck moving forward and you guys will be just fine!!!!

    Go Aggies!!!

  • Uteanymous Salt Lake City, Utah
    Jan. 9, 2014 11:24 a.m.

    Chris B

    If you think RPI doesn't matter, wait 'til Selection Sunday and see how many teams with +100 RPIs get at-large invitations to the Big Dance.

    Sitting at #146 with almost half the season already behind U, the Utes have an enormous task ahead of them just getting into the Top 100, let alone getting into the safe at-large RPI range of >40.

    Of course, if U can't win road games in the PAC 12, it's a moot point. A team with a sub-500 conference record and a +100 RPI has absolutely no chance of getting an at-large bid to the NCAA tourney.

  • ekute Layton, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 11:15 a.m.

    skywalker, congrats to byu for being competitive vs #78, #62, #83...and for finishing in the top half of the wcc and earning an nit bid. lol.

  • ND95CA Lincoln Park, IL
    Jan. 9, 2014 11:12 a.m.

    Trust Chris B to refer to a respected university with something as juvenile as "Lola Mary community". You'd think he'd show a little more respect to a university that represents his stated religious affiliation.

    -----------

    motorbike

    Don't kid yourself. The Utes would very likely lose a return visit to Provo. Dave Rose has never lost to the Utes in the Marriott Center.

    In his first year as BYU's head coach, Rose lost to Utah by 19 in SLC, but beat Utah by 12 in Provo.

    It's happened numerous times in the long history of the BYU-Utah rivalry that the teams have traded double-digit wins on their home courts.

  • BeSmart Cheyenne, WY
    Jan. 9, 2014 11:09 a.m.

    @ Myperspective
    "your lousy basketball conferences and your precarious independence experiment is what we live for"
    That has to be one of the saddest and funniest thing I have ever read.
    Usually a fan of a team lives for their team not a different team.
    Thanks for the laugh

  • Down under Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 10:59 a.m.

    To all utah fans that think utah is better than BYU, they may have been better on one night with PAC officials. Shall we look back over the past 13 years? Yeah, I didn't think so. But just for grins I believe that BYU OWNS utah 11 of the past 13. Just thought I would throw that out.

  • jarka-rus Layton, Utah
    Jan. 9, 2014 10:57 a.m.

    and that squeaker win against Boise State is looking less and less grandiose.

  • Alpiner Alpine, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 10:53 a.m.

    Coach K is a terrific coach. As a BYU fan I can only hope the Jazz will recognize this and hire him as their head coach.

  • skywalker Palo Alto, CA
    Jan. 9, 2014 10:52 a.m.

    ekute

    BYU has three wins against against RPI Top 100 teams, #78 Stanford on the road, #62 Texas and #83 Utah State at neutral sites, and played as well against #9 Oregon on the road as Utah played versus the Ducks at home.

    Meanwhile, Utah is winless outside of the HC this season, 1-18 on the road versus PAC 12 teams in the last three seasons, and just lost to a weak PAC 12 team that was smoked by UC Irvine(9-7) on their home court 72-86.

    BYU has finished in the top half of the MWC/WCC and played in the NCAA or NIT every season during the Dave Rose era.

    Utah has finished in the bottom half of the MWC/PAC in 7 of the 8 seasons during the same period.

    It's obvious which team is really "in the mix", and which team is only, at best, an improved pretender.

  • Down under Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 10:47 a.m.

    Can we change the running utes to the "moral victory" utes?
    Seems more fitting.

  • Down under Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 10:45 a.m.

    Crissy B,
    We all know that you are the sports authority but just so you know ALL national experts disagree with you about ho is the better team. Utah has an RPI of 146 while BYU is in the top 50. Just thought you should know in case the national experts happen to call you for an opinion.

  • Ernest T. Bass Bountiful, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 10:42 a.m.

    Like football, can't never beat good teams.

  • Down under Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 10:35 a.m.

    ekute,
    In case you don't know how to read I am not in happy valley. Nice try though.

  • MyPerspective Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 10:32 a.m.

    Down under
    Salt Lake City, UT

    StGtoSLC,
    Chris B represents EVERYTHING UTAH. When the ute fans keep him off the BYU threads then you will see the BYU fans stay off the ute threads. Until then..........well, we will just keep cheering for the ute opponents,.

    We don't want byu fans off of the Utah threads. What fun would there be in that? Tormenting you, Duckhunter, jarka-rus, et, al. because of your lousy basketball conferences and your precarious independence experiment is what we live for. Of course there's the unavoidable decline from relevance that has resulted as well. And let us not forget the fact that Utah is now padding their football, basketball, and gymnastics schedules with byu.

    What continues to amaze me is that you people keep coming back to the Utah threads for more ridicule. It's like you can't get enough. Why is that?

  • motorbike Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 10:30 a.m.

    It's one game in a long conference season, no need for panic or celebration depending on your affiliation.

    Additionally, no matter what one thinks of UW, they have one of the better home court advantages in the Pac 12 and they'll rack up a lot of wins there this year.

    Lastly, nothing suggests the Utes are on the right track more than seeing our BYU friends posting negative comments on the Ute article threads. I love the angst coming from happy valley and beyond.

  • TroyTown Anaheim, CA
    Jan. 9, 2014 10:23 a.m.

    Uteology

    "Delon Wright can ball! He's the reason we're better than expected."

    Wright was a one-man team last night. Jordan Loveridge was a virtual no-show with only 10 points, only 6 from the field.

    Versus Washington, Delon lead the Utes in scoring, rebounding, assists, steals, and blocks.

    Unfortunately for U, Wright wasn't able to lead the Utes to a road win over the Huskies.

  • motorbike Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 10:20 a.m.

    PAC man

    "Come to Provo for a return game anytime. The Utes haven't beaten the Cougars in the Marriott Center since 2005."

    Trust me, Ute fans wanted a return game last year as much as you want one this year. The difference is Utah actually led last season's game until the final minutes when your Cougs barely pulled out the win in your beloved Marriott Center.

    Considering Utah's current road woes, I'm guessing pretty much all Ute fans would join you in wishing we had a game scheduled in Provo this year. Having stomped BYU by 17, a score that suggests it was closer than it really was, I know I'd certainly join in your wish for a rematch.

  • Down under Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 10:10 a.m.

    Well StGto SLC,
    Yes all 14 of us made a new year's resolution be be more kind on the threads but WE just can't contain our joy when the utes lose so we are ALL back.
    Thanks for moderating these threads.

  • ekute Layton, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 10:10 a.m.

    PAC man,

    Is that "the mix" that byu has been is their last 4 games?

  • jarka-rus Layton, Utah
    Jan. 9, 2014 10:00 a.m.

    Utes motto: "Horeshoes and Hand Grendades" I gave UW wayyyyy too much credit, they are not a good team at all. But Onward and downward right Chris B? LOL

  • ekute Layton, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 9:45 a.m.

    Down under,

    Thanks for supporting our conference. Any time I need information about the Utes and/or the PAC 12 all I have to do is ask somebody down in happy valley. Go Runnin' Utes.

  • PAC man Anaheim, CA
    Jan. 9, 2014 9:43 a.m.

    ekute

    The Utes are WINLESS on the road this year and have lost 18 of 19 PAC 12 road games.

    Despite your spin, a team that is incapable of winning on the road is NEVER "in the mix".

    BYU has more road wins against PAC 12 teams this season and in the last three seasons than the Utes have had.

  • Gone fishin Seattle, WA
    Jan. 9, 2014 9:37 a.m.

    StGto SLC,
    I don't believe that downunder said ALL Utah fans. Try to keep up. I remember some Utah fan guaranteeing a Utah sweep against bad Washington teams so please just fess up and admit that the utes are not as good as their cupcake schedule indicates. Utah's current RPI has improved to a whopping #146. Way to go utes. Their pre-season schedule is going to keep them out of tourney play if they don't win the conference or conference tourney.

  • UteNationAlum Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 9:35 a.m.

    BYU fans suffer from short term memory loss!

  • PAC man Anaheim, CA
    Jan. 9, 2014 9:33 a.m.

    54-IQ

    "Where's BYU on the schedule when we need them?"

    Come to Provo for a return game anytime. The Utes haven't beaten the Cougars in the Marriott Center since 2005.

    Rose is 12-4 versus the Utes, including 11 of the last 13.

  • Down under Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 9:33 a.m.

    StGtoSLC,
    Chris B represents EVERYTHING UTAH. When the ute fans keep him off the BYU threads then you will see the BYU fans stay off the ute threads. Until then..........well, we will just keep cheering for the ute opponents,.

    Way to go Huskys and GO WSU Cougars and all the other pac foes.

  • MyPerspective Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 9:25 a.m.

    Ed Grady
    Idaho Falls, ID

    Washington State is bad. If the Utes lose to them - well....

    That's funny, Ed but I'm going to ask you what the "well...." means. It sure wouldn't be saying much about byu.

    The Utes will prevail in Pullman on Sunday. Out elite conference is deep in talent top to bottom and the Utes are in the mix for the first time in years. GO UTES!

  • ekute Layton, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 9:22 a.m.

    poyman,
    The Runnin' Utes away record is 0-2.
    What's byu's record vs the PAC 12 and the wcc this year?

    worf,
    No matter how you spin it...The PAC 12 and the wcc are more than byu can handle.

  • Riddles in the Dark Olympus Cove, Utah
    Jan. 9, 2014 9:21 a.m.

    "Takes a lot of courage to downgrade a team that beat yours by 17."

    Not really; just accepting reality.

    Current RPI
    #30 BYU
    #83 USU
    #146 Utah

    ------------------

    "Frustrating game. The 3-ball disappeared for some reason."

    No mystery there; it happens frequently on the road playing in front of hostile crowds.

  • Ed Grady Idaho Falls, ID
    Jan. 9, 2014 9:07 a.m.

    Washington State is bad. If the Utes lose to them - well....

  • Carnak Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 9:06 a.m.

    Christine B. Hedgefog
    Salt Lake City, UT

    Washington proved that they are better than your Cougars. Takes a lot of courage to downgrade a team that beat yours by 17.

  • StGtoSLC SALT LAKE CITY, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 9:06 a.m.

    Gone under, please refer us to all of these Utes fans that assured Utah would get a sweep this week (and no, Chris B doesn't count). You won't because you can't.

  • StGtoSLC SALT LAKE CITY, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 8:55 a.m.

    And every one of gone under's pseudonyms come out of hiding again.

  • Christine B. Hedgefog Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 8:50 a.m.

    Nice. Keeping the perfect road record intact. That's our ultimate goal. Does this still count as a moral victory for us like the Oregon game even though Washington isn't that good?

  • worf Mcallen, TX
    Jan. 9, 2014 8:50 a.m.

    No matter how you spin it,--a loss is still a loss.

    PAC 12 is just more than the utes can handle.

  • kitsutsuki South Jordan, Utah
    Jan. 9, 2014 8:48 a.m.

    The Utes could easily have won this game and the game against Oregon - if it had prepared properly in the preseason. These two losses are on the coach and administration.

    Utah is off to its best start since 1997-98 beating the likes of Saint Martin, Evergreen State, UC Davis, Grand Canyon, Lamar, Savannah State, Ball State, Fresno, ISU, BYU, Texas State and St. Katherine - all at home. Impressive.

    If I were a Utah fan I wouldn't be pleased with how things have transpired. This really is a pretty good team with woefully inadequate preparation for the rigors of PAC12 play - particuarly when playing on the road.

  • Brave Sir Robin San Diego, CA
    Jan. 9, 2014 8:48 a.m.

    It's OK, Utah fans...take heart. According to some BYU fans head-to-head results don't determine which team is better. So basically if we decide that Utah is better than Washington, it's true.

    Congratulations to the Runnin Utes on being better than Washington (even though we lost to them)!

  • 54-10 Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 7:44 a.m.

    Where's BYU on the schedule when we need them ?

  • BeSmart Cheyenne, WY
    Jan. 9, 2014 7:40 a.m.

    Delon Wright is a very good player.
    I watched Washington State almost beat Colorado, it should be an interesting matchup Sunday.

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Jan. 9, 2014 7:23 a.m.

    For Starters, Washington is far from a bad team. There last three loses were all to top 25 teams. However, Utah can not win on the road. Whether it football or basketball, it makes no difference. Until they break this stigma they will be destin to remain in the bottom half of the conference. Very dissapointing.

    Notice how all of the usual Haters chime in? Of course they were dead silent when Utah throttled BYU. What a classy bunch.

  • Cletus from Coalville Coalville, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 7:18 a.m.

    No mater, we are still a dang awsome road team so no reason we can't finish in the top 4 of the PAC 12.

    Go Utes!

  • poyman Lincoln City, OR
    Jan. 9, 2014 3:40 a.m.

    Well, that's a bummer... So what does that make the utes "away record" now?

  • gdog3finally West Jordan, Utah
    Jan. 9, 2014 3:10 a.m.

    Coming up short in the last second category yet again. When will the worm turn?

  • Denver to Portland Portland, OR
    Jan. 9, 2014 12:47 a.m.

    Once again a Utah teams enters Pac 10.2 play, and next thing you know, the loses and reality set in. Just not that good...

    go Ducks!

  • StGtoSLC SALT LAKE CITY, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 12:20 a.m.

    Turnovers, turnovers, turnovers. Killed the game offensively. And Andrew Andrews couldn't be stopped tonight. Tough loss. Head home, take care of business at practice, and rebound against a bad Cougars team Sunday. If they can't win in Pullman, they have no business being in the postseason this year.

  • Two For Flinching Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 9, 2014 12:05 a.m.

    Frustrating game. The 3-ball disappeared for some reason. Hopefully these guys can find their stroke before heading to Pullman. Also, Utah needs a better play when we have the ball late in the game. We're 0-3 when we have the ball with a chance to win it late in the game.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Jan. 8, 2014 11:41 p.m.

    Great defense again! Next step? Learn to finish out close games.

    Delon Wright can ball! He's the reason we're better than expected.

    Go UTES!

  • Ute buster Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 8, 2014 11:37 p.m.

    ..............and so it goes, AGAIN.

  • Utah rules Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 8, 2014 11:35 p.m.

    Well here we go, again. The PAC is too tough for us if we can't beat a bad 9-6 Washington team. The WSU Cougars won't be much easier as they lost to Colorado OT by a single point.

  • SoonerUte Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 8, 2014 11:34 p.m.

    Really amazing that the Utes were in this game after starting 0-10 from the field. Defense kept them in the game though! Good game, overall.

    Still room for improvement. The trap is too successful against our ball handlers. At times we seem unaware of the shot clock. We need better execution on "last shot" plays.

  • Snack PAC Olympus Cove, Utah
    Jan. 8, 2014 11:30 p.m.

    Utah returns to form losing their 18th PAC road game in 19 tries.

    Next up, the battle for the conference basement with Washington St.

  • Down under Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 8, 2014 11:31 p.m.

    It was just days ago when the ute fans said they would sweep the Washington schools because they were bad this year. As it turns out they are bad, but certainly good enough to beat the utsies. Utah is headed for the basement again, pretty much just like last year. Way to go Huskies. Go WSU Cougars on Sunday.

  • talkinsports Gilbert, AZ
    Jan. 8, 2014 11:26 p.m.

    Utah's strategy of playing only one road game in the first half of the season backfires as the Utes lose to a weak Washington team.