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Published: Friday, Jan. 3 2014 12:00 a.m. MST

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Happy Valley Heretic
Orem, UT

procuradorfiscal said: It's amazing that real scientists let "climate scientists" get away with torqueing their theories. models, and predictions to now assert that validity of their global warming alarmism is proven by widespread global cooling.

Sorry but glenn, rush and gang are not "real scientists" and spin from fox in no way validates your opinion.

What's amazing is how ideals interfere with critical thinking, perhaps that is why they fear common core, the critical thinking part, because makes it harder to listen to those radio jokers and actually believe them.

jsf
Centerville, UT

Again the question begs an answer, what is the right temperature for the earth? Why would a warmer temperature caused by AGW or just plain earth cycle warming be bad? Climatic scientists have said the hurricane in New Jersey and New York was not caused by global warming.

Temperatures in the ninth century B.C. were warmer than they are now. Temperatures have gone up and down since the earth was formed. If you say because of human life that would be lost, then you are basing your belief on religious bias that man is above evolution and evolution has ended. If you say we must control the temperature to prevent the loss of species, then again you support the argument there is no evolution. Millions of species have been lost from the earth from its first creation. If you argue we have a responsibility to take care of the earth, for who, a god that you say has no power to intervene? As a member of the international climate group said, global warming carbon taxes are for the redistribution of wealth. Of course we all know taxes rarely get to those that need them.

ugottabkidn
Sandy, UT

If one really did more that headline read, they would realize that Antarctica is larger than the U.S. and that the ice is melting on one side while thickening on the other. Moral of the story, don't scoff since no one here is a climate scientist and most do nothing but skim the facts. Since we are all fools maybe we should act as though the earth is important to us rather than arguing over our ignorance. After all isn't that what God is, the ultimate scientist?

Twin Lights
Louisville, KY

From Fox News (AKA “fair and balanced”):

"We're stuck in our own experiment," the Australasian Antarctic Expedition said in a statement Monday. “We came to Antarctica to study how one of the biggest icebergs in the world has altered the system by trapping ice. We ... are now ourselves trapped by ice surrounding our ship.”

So, apparently they knew about the recent phenomena. Darn scientists . . .

Redshirt1701
Deep Space 9, Ut

Ok here is the challenge to all of the Climate Change Alarmists.

The NOAA stated that if we ever had 15 years or more with no statistically significant warming, that would mean that the models are wrong. We are now going on to 16 to 19 years (depending on the dataset) with no warming.

There is not a valid model for global warming, so why do you still cling to the results of a bad model?

Would you fly on an airplane that was known to have major defects? Would you drive a car full of kids knowing that it was faulty?

Why trust theories based on something that is wrong?

nonceleb
Salt Lake City, UT

This "irony" was also reported by Faux News. The commander of the ship said it was warmer waters which broke up a large iceberg and winds pushed the pieces up against the ship. There is no irony here, but there is further evidence.

2 bits
Cottonwood Heights, UT

Back in the early hay-day of the global warming hysteria... Al Gore said scientists predict the Arctic ice would be completely gone by 2014... Maybe they were just going down to check for themselves to see if it was gone.

It's summer in the Southern Hemisphere now... so maybe they thought the ice would be getting thinner instead of getting thicker.

It will be interesting to see what their conclusions are when they get back. Probably that man really IS causing global warming (just not where they were).

Irony Guy
Bountiful, Utah

Global warming will have many consequences, among them wilder fluctuations in the weather as the atmosphere becomes more energetic. The widening of the jet stream is already producing more and more catastrophic results. These things are undeniably happening as a result of a quick trend up in global temperature.

happy2bhere
clearfield, UT

Onion Daze

Gee, in my day I was sure I was told it was around 19 degrees. I guess my memory is going or the Earth is tilting more. Either way, thanks for the correction. I just hope it stays around 23 degrees, and does not go for 45. Now THAT could cause global warming, or cooling, depending upon which part of the planet one is on.

Schnee

So yes perhaps we are sucking in more CO2 than in the past. Maybe it is a good thing in the long run. Maybe planet Earth is going to ask of its lifeforms to adapt to a more dense CO2 environment in the future. Maybe it will help prepare the human body in generations to come to better adapt to a very high CO2 planet like Mars, should we ever really need to go there to teraform the place and live. Who knows?, but change and adaptation seems to have been the order of life on Earth for eons. We are just part of it.

cjb
Bountiful, UT

The trend over the past 15 + years is no warming.

Is this enough weather to count as climate?

cjb
Bountiful, UT

When I was in elementary school in the 1960's we were told scientists were saying we were heading for another ice age. Is is possible that the carbon dioxide we are putting into the air is keeping us from that? This makes sense because in the past 15 years carbon dioxide has increased but the earth hasn't become any warmer. The trend towards cooling is being balanced by the warming effect of the carbon dioxide, or so it would seem.

If this is the case, we shouldn't decrease our carbon output for several thousand years at least, until the ice age cycle comes to an end. We are lucky this time around we have a defense, Last time, North America was covered by thousands of feet of ice.

Twin Lights
Louisville, KY

happy2bhere,

Just to be clear, the history is that when there are quick (decades or even centuries vs. millenia) adaptation does not keep up. Many of the species die off and then, in a period of slow recovery, the remainder (the most adapted to the new reality) repopulate.

Not a good plan given none of us know how we or our progeny will score on the CO2 adaptation scorecard. Perhaps we should think of something that does not resemble desolation.

Schnee
Salt Lake City, UT

@Redshirt1701
"There is not a valid model for global warming, so why do you still cling to the results of a bad model?"

Why are you ignoring the decades of actual observations we have? The models aren't perfect but they do a fairly good job.

@2bits
"Al Gore said scientists predict the Arctic ice would be completely gone by 2014."

The IPCC projected mid to late 21st century so most scientists disagreed with that idea.

@cjb
"When I was in elementary school in the 1960's we were told scientists were saying we were heading for another ice age. Is is possible that the carbon dioxide we are putting into the air is keeping us from that? "

Back in the 50s and 60s we had a large increase of aerosols in the atmosphere which have a cooling effect and that stalled the warming from CO2 and other greenhouse gases. It's the aerosols that led to the basis of fears of cooling but also were pollutants so we got those cleaned up and then we started warming up again since the GHGs and aerosols kinda were balancing each other out. China, India and others are increasing aerosols lately though...

jsf
Centerville, UT

A single comet and it all resets. But in a truly evolutionary and non religious point, why do we think our progeny rate more than the cockroach under the porch. We and our progeny are but a mere spec on the time line of the earth. To say that man is more important than all other evolutionary life is like the scientists of old who thought the universe revolved around the earth.

JoeCapitalist2
Orem, UT

I might have a bit less skepticism about all the "global warming" theorists if I didn't know that they are targeting my wallet. They want to impose carbon taxes and funnel all that money to projects under their control. It is a power grab, pure and simple.

Does anyone really believe that Al Gore gives a hoot about the environment? He cares about his money. When he and other liberals start getting rid of their big houses, limos, private planes, and yachts and giving their own money to fix the problem then I will start taking them more seriously.

Let me know when Harrison Ford sells one of his private jets and gives all the money to restore the rain forest. Then I will know he is serious about the message he is trying to send.

Redshirt1701
Deep Space 9, Ut

To "Schnee" actually the models do a poor job of predicting future temperature increases. The past 16 years are a perfect example.

Why trust a model that has proven itself wrong, that is the question. A broken clock is still correct 2 times a day, but I wouldn't use it just because it gets something right on occasion.

2 bits
Cottonwood Heights, UT

When I was in elementary school they taught us that we would be dead from over-population by now. Later on it was that all livable space was going to taken up by landfill (mostly paper diapers). Then it was something else. It's always something.

And yet... we are still here. So I guess we have adapted.

I remember the projections of how many people per square foot there would be in the year 2000... It was something very scary, like each person would have 6 square feet to exist in. And yet... when I fly across America today, most of the time you can't even see a human habitation. Just mountains, and deserts, and forests and lakes and prairies, etc. Some cities... but they are tiny compared to the amount of forest and uninhibited land.

That taught me not to be super concerned about the doomsday fad of the day. Kinda the crying wolf affect I guess. It will probably bite me someday, but so far none of them have come true.

Hutterite
American Fork, UT

I love the utah approach. If it didn't happen in my back yard today, it's not happening at all.

Ernest T. Bass
Bountiful, UT

You would think the dnews would consider printing some data and research showing that the climate is getting warmer. It may put an end to such inane letters like this.
But no, they have no desire for truth.

Roland Kayser
Cottonwood Heights, UT

to 2 bits: The Arctic and the Antarctic are not the same place. In fact they are on opposite ends of the planet.

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