Just like football, Utah's entire season hangs in the balance on this one
game - lose to BYU and Utah's season is over before Christmas.
A BYU bball win over Utah has not helped the cougars in years. Utah looks to be
making some small strides back to relevancy. However, they also seem to be the
one pulling the plug on the rivalry.
@sportsCenter- already hedging the byu loss with the "that's the only
game you get up for" line? You are right though, byu will lose.
Looking forward to seeing the series continue and agree with Rock that for BB
this is good for both teams. @sportscenter - possibly the most
ridiculous comment I have seen your post. First the game against the Y is
important to me as a U fan but far from 'the entire season'. Second,
how is a Y fan qualified to make a claim about what is important to U fans?
It isn't about how it helps you. It shouldn't be weighed in the face
of an RPI or setting up for a tourney. It doesn't even make or break your
season, although bragging rights are nice in their way. Its about playing your
rival-- a chance to exhibit passion and investment in a way that other games
cannot carry. A team should feel lucky if they have a real rival (even one that
might be a little bit down in recent years), and hold onto the chance to play
that game with white-knuckle grip. Basketball seasons have a lot of
games. There are no reasonable excuses to abolish the rivalry game.
Larry Scott controls who Utah plays out of conference and for whatever reason he
wants to sever the ties between BYU and Utah. Chris Hill knows if he steps out
of line Scott will take him out to the wood shed. Other schools in the PAC12 are
not controlled by Scott. BYU should do what they did in football and
schedule other PAC schools in basketball to replace Utah.
@Sportscenter"Just like football, Utah's entire season
hangs in the balance on this one game - lose to BYU and Utah's season is
over before Christmas."Nope. In football, losing to Utah, again,
would have ended byu's season if it hadn't already ended when they got
beat by one of the worst teams in college football.Remember, your
players called it their Super Bowl and took a bye week to prepare? Hang in there, buddy.
@truthsandwich. I admit, it certainly does mar what would be good
season when you lose to a couple of the worst teams in college football for that
year. But back to basketball...
Here's my idea:Put together an annual 4-team tournament at Energy
Solutions arena featuring BYU, Utah, Utah State every year and a rotation among
Weber State, UVU, Dixie State, Westminster, etc. for the fourth team. As a Utah
and a Dixie State fan I'd love to see this happen. It would be nice to see
Utah playing more in-state games and it would give Dixie the chance to go knock
off the big boys every once in awhile.
BYU gains NOTHING by playing Utah. Just do away with all games against them.
What are we something like 11 out of the last 12? All they are going to do is
drag down BYU's RPI. A win against them won't look good come March.
Utah pretty much gave up before the season started with the preseason schedule
they crafted. Just end it completely.
@adman85"I admit, it certainly does mar what would be good
season when you lose to a couple of the worst teams in college football for that
year. But back to basketball..."Did you just copy/paste that
comment from the past four seasons?
Let it end. I won't miss it at all.
As there are idiotic fans on both sides maybe a more relaxed scheduling of
rivalry games is okay. On the other hand, basketball doesn't seem to bring
out as much antipathy as football so maybe it is not a big deal to play every
year. With an average of about 35 games a season winning or losing a
rivalry game is not as big a deal as it is in football, so hopefully not as
emotionally charged as football. And thus not leading rabid fans to do stupid
things.Okay, I've convinced myself, keep it! I am looking
forward to watching the game Saturday.
mistruthsandwichStrange how BYU's season, which supposedly
ended in September, is still going on, while Utah's season ended two weeks
ago."Remember, your players called it their Super Bowl and took
a bye week to prepare?"Name the players.Although KVN
wreaked havoc on opposing offenses, he still only counts as one player speaking
@ ThrillerThe Big 4 (Utah, BYU, USU, Weber) deserve to be in the
round robin. UVU has no fan base, so they would be a waste of a spot.
Westminster and Dixie are NAIA and DII and therefore shouldn't get a place
at the table with the bigger programs. It's unfair, but a tournament
between these schools won't survive without netting some cash for all those
@ SportsCenterWrong. just like football the BYU game is irrelevant
to the success or failure of Utah's season. It's all about conf. play.
For example, Utah lost to BYU last year, but nobody was thinking about that
while Utah was making a great run in the conf. tourney...
BYU has to hand their hat on hoops as their football team can't beat the
PAC 12 cellar dweller.
Continue the rivalry, but do away with this silly boards! It's bringing
out the worst in fans of both sides and does nothing but poison the friendly
competition between the two schools. You'd think that people who shares a
faith which espouses kindness and civility among it's members would behave
better but sadly they're anything but, at least a good number of them do
and are just so full of hate! It's so sad!Go Cougars!!!
@thebigsamoan Amen brother! Best post ever! Go Utes!
It's a joke to think there is a chance that the rivalry in bball might take
a break as well. There is enough flexibility in every teams pre conference
schedule to put in a game both teams are interested in.About the
article: I have to disagree with Brad Rock about this game helping out with the
selection committee come March, unless you are speaking from only the Ute side.
Every year I see how teams on the bubble are evaluated (Good wins & Bad
losses). A win for Utah would be considered a "good win" but a win for
BYU will not mean much. On the flip side a loss for Utah would not be a "bad
loss" but a loss for BYU would be a "bad loss."From a
national perspective, this game doesn't do much for BYU but from a
local/rivalry perspective these games are fun for all involved and should
What good are Utah teams beating up on each other? Is it good for national
exposure?I really don't care about playing the Utes, or Aggies.
thebisamoan: You are right, but generally, the majority of the people who post
are either irrational rabid fans, or simply get their jollies out of trying to
rile people up.Though I'm a big BYU fan, I'm glad Utah got
in the Pac12. Good for them. Everyone needs to do what's best for them.
These decisions, including BYU's independent/West Coast decision, have
little to nothing to do with their rivals. It has to do with what is best for
their schools and sports programs.Utah has landed a wad of cash and
guaranteed matchup with great teams. Even if they never finish with a winning
record over the best of the Pac12, they will get better, will recruit better
athletes, and will increase exposure and revenue for their school.BYU is making 5 - 10 times what they would have made in the MWC, is scheduling
significantly better teams, getting far better exposure, and making
significantly more money than they would in the MWC.So, really,
everyone won. Its simply a shame that with all of these wins, we can't
keep the games alive between these two great schools.
Larry Krystkowiak told radio show BYU Sports Nation yesterday "I'm not
certain; I don't make those decisions solely. Dr. Hill our AD is in contact
with BYU's AD. We've been trying to stir up having an in-state
tournament at Energy Solutions Arena. I talked to Dave Rose a few weeks ago on
the phone about it and just said that I wasn't certain what our plan was
here." Based on the politically correct comments from the
decision makersUtah has been lobbying to move away from the traditional
home/away schedule. Either a yearly tournament at a neutral (wink-wink) site, or
a 3 year home/away/neutral (nudge nudge) schedule.Larry and Chris,
since Dave Rose isn't thrilled about your ideas, how would you feel about
this 3-year schedule: home/away/UVU Mckay Events Center?
2fer"just like football the BYU game is irrelevant to the
success or failure of Utah's season"Don't kid
yourself. Until Utah's fluke win over Stanford, the ONLY success Utah had
going for them, since joining the PAC, was beating BYU.Unfortunately
for U, in basketball, you haven't even had that.
@ IndemakBoy you're hanging you hat on BYU playing a cellar
Pac-12 team? Washington at 8-4? What's that make the utes? And last time I
checked, we're going to a bowl game and um, well you aren't.
Utah has the same two problems to solve with both football and Basketball.Problem #1 is that Utah is losing too many PAC12 conference games to end
up with any chance of post season play. To solve this they are looking to find
ways to win more out of conference games by creating schedules with lower risk
for loses. BYU has beaten Utah more than 90% of the time over the past 5 years.
If Utah is looking for wins, the math says don't play BYU. At the current
time all of the state schools pose too much risk. If Utah plays only the state
schools they know they can beat it would be embarassing.
When the Utes stop playing Wofford St and N.D. St maybe then the Cougars should
schedule them. But until the Utes have a decent SOS, I would NEVER schedule BYU
to play them, schedule a team that actually cares about their strength of
schedule, not the utes.
Problem # 2 is recruiting. In basketball this is especially a problem. BYU has
been picking up many of the best Utah High school players. Many of the other
Utah Utah schools also get their share. The University of Utah has a hard time
promoting their major conference status when they are losing to weber state, USU
or BYU. By not playing instate schools they can create a sense of
exclusivity. It is easier to say you are at a higher level than another team
that is not beating you evey year.Espeically in Basketbal....Utah knows that their conference games are not going to get easier.Utah
knows that local state schools have good coaching, good teams.Utah knows
that playing local schools would more likely will give them a L vs. a WUtah knows that it is going to take time to improve their program.Utah
knows that the quickest route to more wins is to play less competitive teams.Math says play out of state schools who are less competitive to generate wins.
An expected loss to Kansas hurts less than a loss to BYU, BOISE, Utah State,
UVU, SUU or Lone Peak High school.
If the rivalry doesn't continue, it is furhter proof that Utah has gotten
too big for its britches. They probably prefer a patsy schedule to run up some
wins and keep the tougher games for the conferencee. Time will tell if they can
be leaders in their conference. It isn't happening so far....
Is the threat to end the rivalry more of "Dr. Hill" who seems to know
more about what Utahns want than we do? How does this guy survive? Once a
national power, the Runnin Utes have been a disaster. One of the greatest
football rivalries in the country has been badly damaged. How long will it be
before the football team has a winning record again? A swimming program out of
control. What a resume.
There was a time when the BYU/Utah rivalry was a big deal. The games were not
only played for bragging rights but often the outcome played a major role in
deciding the conference title, NCAA tourney berths and bowl games. Not anymore.
It is just another game. The strategic needs of the two schools are no longer
aligned. When it comes to basketball, BYU needs to add SOS to help their resume
for the NCAA tourney. Beating Utah isn't going to help much. It
won't be counted as a quality win. Utah needs wins and playing BYU
isn't a gimme win. All that is left is playing for bragging rights. Until
either team really starts to make some noise in the NCAA tournament, bragging
rights are not worth much either.Unless the fans on both sides
really make a stink about the teams not playing, the BYU vs. Utah games will
most likely become a thing of the past.
Thanks Brad Rock for aiding Coach Rose's desperate attempt to fire up his
players and the BYU faithful by making an comment with no basis. Does anyone
really believe Chris Hill wants to do away with this game when just a few weeks
ago he proposed a tournament at ESA that would include the four major in state
programs? More likely the schedule hasn't been solidified beyond 2014,
because Dr. Hill wanted to gauge support for the tournament first. With Utah
State stalling on the tournament idea, BYU and Utah will likely go ahead and get
the schedule done for another year or two while they work on talking USU into
the tournament. So chill out Cougars. Nobody on the hill is trying to
disrespect your team.
I couldn't agree more with thebigsamoan, and that is why I would like all
games between the 2 schools to just end. I simply can't stand the hatred
generated in these posts and would rather just see it all end.
As a fan of both teams (or neither team, if you prefer), let me bring an
objective viewpoint. SportsCenter is right on. BYU is the only tough team on
the Utes non-conference schedule that will play in the post-season, thus making
Saturday's matchup Utah's de-facto "tournament" game.As for the round robin at ESA, it's a great idea, but has one big
drawback. Teams want home games, and they want students at home games. At ESA
you'll alumni, but not students. It would work great for TV fans, though.
What the four schools need to do is each agree to a home and home scheduling
arrangement. BYU's schedule this year is a good example: Weber St - home;
Utah - road; USU - neutral.
Mormon Ute:"Thanks Brad Rock for aiding Coach Rose's desperate
attempt to fire up his players and the BYU faithful by making an comment with no
basis".Seriously? I don't think this was an attempt by
coach Rose to do anything other than tell it like it is. He doesn't need to
get his players and fans fired up for Utah...it's a rivalry they will be
fired up regardless. And BYU obviously plays enough good teams OOC that Rose
doesn't need to fuel any fire to try and manipulate Utah into continuing
the series. I think you decided to take what he said and spin it to what you
think is happening. All Rose said was they've hit a snag and there's
no games scheduled past 2014 and who knows what the future holds. He said that
because that is actually the truth and the case here. Taking words from coach K,
Rose, and Hill it sounds like there are ideas about scheduling or tournament
format, etc but nothing has been signed...and that's all Rose said on the
@IndeMak lets reverse that statement:Utah has to hang (not hand)
their hat on football, as their hoopes team can't beat.... well anybody
stronger than DII, let alone a team from the WCC. A conference the utes have a
dismal record against to begin with; and yet you and the Chris B types have the
nerve to deride it anyway.
Cougsndawgs,You need to go back and review the Wrubell interview.
Coach Rose clearly said he believes the series will end after 2014 and when
Wrubell expressed surprise at that he explained that negotions have stalled. He
was very clear and his statement has been refuted by everyone at the U. Tom
Holmoe hasn't commented yet, but it would be interesting to see if he backs
up his coach or confirms what Chris Hill and Coach K have said.
I think the comment about Scott is correct. Colorado is the rival not BYU.
Personally I don't care. If you want to continue playing you do it in
around robin format at ESA with the four teams. Utah St, Weber St. UofU and BYU.
Call it what you want, maybe the Crossroads of the West Tournament, Tops of the
Mountains Tournament, or what ever. Make it a Donation to the Foodbank Game.
You need a ticket and a can or you don't get in. It is nice to see other
people wanting this same idea I started several years ago. Keep pushing for
this, lets get this done. Come on Jazz, you know it is an automatic sell out,
throw your hat in the ring on this one. It is only two days and you won't
Why bother playing the utes? They really are irrelevant. There are plenty of
programs with better teams just fill the slot with them.
Get ready to hear the excuses involving PAC 12 refs or the weather inside the
huntsman center for the reason byu loses"Just like
football"Get ready to hear it all year long byu fans. I will be here every day to rub it in!Every time you mention
utah's RPI will remind you you couldn't beat us!
CO UTE,The same way that Utah fans/ BYU haters are always telling BYU fans
what is important to us on these articles! I love how Utah fans keep swearing
they have moved on and out grown BYU and other schools in Utah and no longer
have rivals here but there actions say different! Rushing the field three times
after a football game, reading and responding to articles in the Deseret News a
pro BYU newspaper! A poll done by your own school which show that 64% would
rather beat BYU then go to a bowl!!! I think the rivalry is still alive and
should continue!!!Go BYU RISE UP!!!