Comments about ‘George F. Will: Why Iran should be contained’

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Published: Thursday, Dec. 5 2013 12:00 a.m. MST

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2 bits
Cottonwood Heights, UT

IMO they should be contained because they are lead by religious fanatics who think it is their job to bring about the war that leads to the end of the world as we know it.

People with that goal in mind should not have nuclear weapons. Leaders who believe in religion based genocide should not have nuclear weapons.

Leaders who think a whole nation should be wiped off the face of the earth IF possible... should not have nuclear weapons.

I don't care if you hate Israel or not... regardless of your religious or politically motivated prejudices and hatreds, Jews deserve to live as much as any other human being. Antisemitism is just as bad as racism IMO. And thinking seriously that a whole race or a whole nation needs to be wiped out... is not something the international community should overlook.

CLM
Draper, UT

That George Will's finds "risible" the idea that Iran's nuclear program is for peaceful means flies in the face of the International Atomic Energy Agency, U.S. intelligence, and the Pentagon, having all reached the same conclusions about Iran's nuclear program. That is, that Iran has only a civilian nuclear program, is not building a nuclear weapon, and has not made the decision to build such a weapon in the future.

Those who find these claims risible are the hawks--Israeli, Saudis, and their friends in congress--who don't want to lose an excuse to go to war with Iran. They fear this nuclear deal could result in a better relationship between the US and Iran, enhancing Iran's power at the hawks' expense. No wonder they are intensely opposed to a favorable interim agreement--it could lead to a realignment in the Mideast region and ultimately, peace with Iran.

happy2bhere
clearfield, UT

CLM
Many in the international community know that the Iran nuclear development is "both", a power and weapon program. Mr. Will made that clear in his article. The main question is not whether the program is weapons grade, but what to do about it. The most naive thing you said is that there could be a realignment in the Mideast region and ultimately peace with Iran. That will never happen as long as extremist Muslims run the country. It was peaceful when the Shah was there, but that ended back in 1979. Not likely any Shah type will be taking over Iran in the forseeable future. And as Mr. Will also sees, a military action against Iran will probably net as little success as it did with Iraq. Regime change is nonsense when dealing with Muslim countries that put religion over first world political concerns. Containment? Just what does that mean? Sanctions? Threats? They haven't worked up to now, and with the recent agreement have been lessened. So the fact is, we in this world are going to be stuck with a nuclear Iran, and whatever consequences that brings.

Tyler D
Meridian, ID

I agree with 2 bits’ 1st point but not his 2nd – Israel is more than capable of defending itself against Iran and if it ever thought it’s very existence was on the line (or even as punishment after the fact) it could send Persia back to the Stone Age.

The real danger here is ultimately religious (geez, how long is the human race going to have to deal with this nonsense?) and I simply cannot imagine a worse scenario, including war, than religious fanatics who believe killing infidels is the best guarantee of ‘eternal paradise’ having a nuclear weapon.

When asked what is the one thing that keeps him up at night President Obama responded “Pakistan.” But despite their similarities, Pakistan’s arsenal is focused on their arch-enemy India and that makes all the difference in the world.

Iran has no existential enemy (they’ve survived just fine living next to Sunnis for hundreds of years) so there is no reason the need a bomb other than to cause trouble – an understatement if ever there was one.

Happy Valley Heretic
Orem, UT

I agree with CLM there is no evidence that Iran is building bombs, there is however evidence that Israel assassinated nuclear scientists in Iran and nobody did a thing. Iran has a 200 year history of not initiating a war, can that be said of those wanting to start another war?

@2 bits: First you must separate the "jews" from Israel as there is an extreme element in the Zionist movement that is very similar to the other local zealots, see assassination above. Netenyahoo actually gave the Pope a book on the inquisition in a recent visit to Rome, talk about tacky diplomacy. Zionist movement is no different than what you call Islam extremist.

2 bits
Cottonwood Heights, UT

Heretic,
You claim Israel is no better than Ahmadinejad, Komaini, and others. I suppose because some antisemitic Leftist told you that. Open your eyes and you will see they are NOT the same.

Have you ever seen Netenyahoo say the entire people and country of Iran needs to be wiped of the map? I haven't. But Ahmadinejad said that. MANY leaders in Iran believe that. Israel just wants to protect their people. They don't WANT to wipe ANYBODY off the map.

I think there's a big difference. But you can pretend they are the same if you want to.

You can claim there is no evidence Iran will ever build a bomb. I think if YOU were their neighbor, and they had promised to wipe you off the map IF they can... you would think differently.

Giving a tacky gift, and vowing to wipe a whole people off the map... are VERY different things IMO. That you pretend they are the same... is amazing.

---

IF Canada vowed to blow Manhattan off the map IF they had Nuclear Weapons... would you blame Manhattan for trying to stop them any way they can (even assassinating their nuclear scientists)?

Tyler D
Meridian, ID

@Happy Valley Heretic – “there is no evidence that Iran is building bombs”

But there’s tons of evidence that they are developing the capacity to do so, which includes doing things far beyond what would be need for energy or ‘medical research.’

@Happy Valley Heretic – “Zionist movement is no different than what you call Islam extremist.”

This is where my more liberal minded friends really lose me (even though we agree on many domestic issues).

This is a false equivalency and is perhaps due to seeing the world through the lens of liberal (in the classic sense) values. And believe me it’s personally disturbing to share views with groups that I normally don’t (e.g., the Christian Right), but the Islamic threat is altogether different (in kind and scale) than the Jewish homeland movement – which was largely atheistic save for zealots living in the West Bank.

If an Iranian made bomb ever detonates in an American city, we will all (I suspect you as well) be wishing Israel’s assassination program had been far more robust.

jsf
Centerville, UT

International Atomic Energy Agency, U.S. intelligence, and the Pentagon, having all reached the same conclusions about Iran's nuclear program. Seems these same people got right Iraq's nuclear program, NOT.

Happy Valley Heretic
Orem, UT

Hate is hate and words are not actions. I am judging by history and actions not name calling.
Big difference between antisemitic and anti Israel but I've explained it and you choose to ignore the difference.
Ahmadinejad is no longer president and when he was it was a powerless position, he was voted out because Iranians did not agree with his racist remarks.

Israel plays the west like puppets and certain political groups enjoy this position of being subservient to this small unimportant country for religious and apocalyptic fantasies they believe in.

Of course Israel acquired their nukes without permission, but we expect Iran to bow to our demands?

happy2bhere
clearfield, UT

HHV

No evidence Iran is trying to build nuclear bombs? Actually there is some good evidence on that front. One primary piece of evidence lies with the centrifuges that are needed to enrich the low yield uraninum to the high level needed for a nuclear explosion. Iran has been using them to enrich the nuclear fuel.. No need to do that if your only requirement is to make nuclear reactors for electrical power. The ironic truth is, there appears to be more evidence of an Iran WMD program than there ever was for an Iraq WMD program. We went to war on the wrong country. Now, the U.S. has no credibility to get the world behind it in any attempt to stop Iran and the nuke. Iran knows that, and so does President Obama. So, as I posted above, we will just have to live with a nuclear armed Iran because neither the American people nor our allies will go to war in the Middle-East again after what has been going on these last 12 years. The big question of course is, what will Israel do?

2 bit
Cottonwood Heights, UT

Tyler D,
I think the fact that Israel HAS nuclear weapons, and they CAN wipe Iran out... but they haven't... shows they have restraint needed for a Nuclear Power (I'm not sure Iran has that).

I agree Israel could wipe out Iran any time they wanted. But to me that shows they have restraint (which I'm not sure the ayatollah has). I think Israel also knows that doing so would be the worst thing they could possibly do (other than just sit by and watch their own people be incinerated by Iran). But on the other hand... we know that Iran thinks it is their DESTINY to bring about that conflict.

So which is better... the side that CAN but doesn't? Or the side that can't but WISHES they could?

I think until it is inevitable and their people are in real danger... Israel won't respond to Iran. But when they do... watch out. Because Israel doing ANYTHING (including defending their people against imminent annihilation) will throw the whole middle-east into Armageddon (which some Iranian leaders say is their destiny).

The Real Maverick
Orem, UT

Why should we contain them?

How or why is that our job? The Middle-East is on the other side of the world. Iran is an independent and sovereign country, just as we are. We should have as much say over them as they have over us.

Let Iran take care of Iran and let the USA take care of the USA. Repubs wasting our precious tax dollars/racking up trillions in containment and nation building on China's credit card is getting us nowhere fast.

Mike Richards
South Jordan, Utah

"While Woodrow Wilson was sympathetic to the plight of Jews in Europe, he repeatedly stated in 1919 that U.S. policy was to "acquiesce" to the Balfour Declaration but not officially support Zionism.[7][need quotation to verify] The U.S. Congress however passed the Lodge-Fish resolution,[8] the first joint resolution stating its support for "the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people" on 21 September 1922.[9][10] The same day, the Mandate of Palestine was approved by the Council of the League of Nations. Despite two similar attempts by Congress during the war, the policy of acquiescence continued until after World War II.[

Israel is an ally. An ally has the right to expect that we will uphold the terms of the treaty. Israel was told that we would come to their defense if they were attacked and that the full force of the United States military would intervene. If the word of the United States means nothing, then we are nothing.

The Real Maverick
Orem, UT

@ Mike Richards

"It is our true policy to steer clear of permanent alliances with any portion of the foreign world; so far, I mean, as we are now at liberty to do it... In my opinion, it is unnecessary and would be unwise to extend them."

- George Washington

Think President Washington knew something about wars, foreign policy, and leading the nation?

It's interesting to see repubs who revere the Founding Fathers so eagerly "forget" some of their strongest and most important advice. My how far we've fallen.

Mike Richards
South Jordan, Utah

JFK said, "Israel was not created in order to disappear - Israel will endure and flourish. It is the child of hope and the home of the brave. It can neither be broken by adversity nor demoralized by success. It carries the shield of democracy and it honors the sword of freedom."

Why are so many Americans jealous of Israel's success? Why do so many Americans hurl stones at the only Democracy in the Middle East? What do those Americans have against Freedom, Liberty, and Democracy? Is it anti-American to be pro-Israel? Is it anti-American to speak out against Iran when Iran has told the world that its goal is to destroy Israel and every Jew?

Christ was once asked, "Who is my neighbor?" That question led to the parable about the "good Sameritan". Israel is surrounded by nations who would do to Israel what the thieves did to the man going from Jerusalem to Jericho. Too few Americans care. Is it because Israel is on the other side of the world or is it because too many Americans are too selfish to care about anyone but themselves?

one vote
Salt Lake City, UT

The far right is running out of enemies. They could be contained if the CIA put in a ruler after backing a coup. But that was the old days.

atl134
Salt Lake City, UT

@2bits
Netanyahu wants to keep Palestine from being a nation, that's quite literally keeping it off the map.

2 bit
Cottonwood Heights, UT

atl134,

I think there's a big difference between wanting to NUKE somebody off the map just for being different... and a nation not wanting squatters who keep saying your land is THEIR land, and who are lead by acknowledged terrorists, who keep lobbing missiles at your innocent civilians, to be acknowledged as a country and given YOUR land...

I think there's a BIG different.

CHS 85
Sandy, UT

How many of you right-wing zealots have actual skin in the game? How many of you will be called up on to go to war with Iran (which is what you all seem to want)? How many of you will gladly send your sons and daughters off to fight in Iran? How many of you are willing to risk your own lives to end Iran's nuclear program? The right-wing hawks are good at starting wars, good at sending everyone else's kids off to war.

Having spent a year of my life in Iraq, and having seen the vehicle in front of mine blasted into the sky by a Pepsi-can sized IED, I can tell you ALL, and I mean ALL avenues for peace need to be exhausted first. Until you are sitting in the front seat of that HMMWV and watch your friends blown to bits, you'll never understand.

mark
Salt Lake City, UT

CHS 85.

Right to the point.

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