there should be a new election because he broke the state election laws. I
don't care what the cost is, have both parties pick their candidate next
week and hold the election in March. It will not hurt the state to go a little
while with out an A.G. - heck, its not like we had a working A.G. all this time
If he cheated to win the election, by law, the election is void. Never
happened.Hopefully they'll make him pay back the $90 he was
paid in his fraudulently-gained position, and deny him the $12k pension he would
have earned for his 4 years of Gov't service.Cheating is
cheating, and knows no party, race, or religion.Law is law.
"The comments made by the Democratic Party at this point are merely
speculation," Utah GOP Chairman James Evans said in a statement.Yeah...and maybe they "speculated" that Swallow was caught on video
asking if any incriminating paper trail existed about one of his illegal
deeds.And maybe they "speculated" that he didn't file
his election financials legally.And maybe they "speculated"
that he vacationed fraudulently at that spa in California.No, Mr.
Evans...they are not speculating...they are citing some proven, uncomfortable
I understand the Democrats point, and agree with it for the most part. But I
fail to see the point (nor fiscal sense) of holding a special election before
next fall, when there WILL be a special election. Let the governor choose an
interim AG and let's be done with it until then!
Avoid the caucus system that picked him.
While it seems logical to have voters decide the next Attorney General it's
far fetched to think Utahns will elect a Democrat to state wide office.
Shouldn't we be using our tax dollars to defend ourselves from the
tyranical abuses of Obama and the federal goverment instead of a pre-ordained
IMO we shouldn't even have elections for AG. The Governor should be able
to appoint and fire his attorney general just like the President appoints and
can dismiss HIS attorney general if needed.And if you say it's
because we can't trust the Governor.. If we don't trust the
Governor... why did we elect him?The AG is there to help the
Governor govern. The governor should be able to appoint someone to that
position that he can work well with.It wasn't that long ago
that the AG was an appointed position in Utah.I like the appointment
approach so we don't get an AG and Gov who are adversaries and just but
heads and can't get anything done. And IF the Governor appoints a
scumbag... we just get rid of the Governor and his AG goes with him.But it's no big deal. I honestly don't know why Democrats think
it's worth spending $1.5 Million on a special election (that COULD be spent
on education)... just to give them even the remote CHANCE of winning an office
for one of their cronies.
WOW... look at all the "Law is law" Democrats out there today!They sound like a bunch of Conservatives talking about Illegal Immigration!It's good to see some liberals saying, "Law is law" for a
change. Now if we can only get them saying this about immigration or something
other than an election issue that COULD get one of their guys elected... we will
have made some progress.I agree "law is law". Let's
try keeping that attitude the next time being lenient on illegal immigrants is
being debated in the media or on the hill.
BTW, the GOP delegates did NOT elect Swallow. He failed to win at the
convention, it was the primary voters that elected him. It is incorrect for the
democrats to suggest that the GOP delegates are to blame for Swallow's
@2 bits and FTSo having an election and allowing us little people to
have our say is just not worth the expenditure? Our votes as Democrats are just
not worth your time and money, is that what I'm reading here? I guess when you are the majority, you can just discount everyone else.
Two Bits---You elected him because he is a Republican, you would not even
consider voting otherwise.
and if a Democrat were to resign such as Becker, Libs would be crying that they
won the election and a DEM should be selected to replace the Mr Becker........it
just nevers ends the left will stoop to cheat and skirt morality!
I listened to Mr. Dabakis this morning on KSL. He was flinging out wild
accusations about Governor Herbert taking bribes and kickbacks, and accusing the
entire Republican party in the state of corruption. I wish KSL would have asked
him to prove his statements, since after all, he does represent the party of
corruption. Just ask any Illinois resident about how upstanding and ethical the
Democrats are when they get a chance. As far as Mr. Swallow goes,
I'm pretty sure that whomever Herbert picks would be a darn sight more
competent, honest, and decent than any candidate the Dem's offer. Because
after all, the shining example of Democrat Attorney Generals is our current one,
Eric Holder--and you would be hard pressed to find a more corrupt person.
Can we just not have an AG? How much does that position even get paid? It's
time we get rid of all of these fake, bureaucratic jobs. The city I live in has
plenty of prosecutors, who themselves get plenty of tax money. As far as I can
tell, the city runs smooth enough. Maybe not enough to justify city
employees' salaries and pensions, but smooth enough. Why we need all of the
state level bureaucrats? Yeah, let's replace one goombah with another.
What? When did government in America, and Utah of all places, become such a
burden on the governed class. All the while, the elite governing class live like
kings at everyone else's expense! It's time we start slashing some of
these 'non-essential' government appointments and elected offices.
Two notes. Did the delegates cast a majority of votes for another candidate? If
so, it was the primary system that gave us Swallow, not some grand conspiracy of
the caucus. This is contrived, false attack.Second, the moment I
read a headline about the Democrats wanting a new election I think Wisconsin,
Florida, Ohio, Minnesota, etc, etc, etc. The Left will hold election after
election after election, vote count after vote count after vote count until they
get the results they want.In a very much related note, Obama was
found to recieve over $100,000 in illegal donations from the 2008 campaign. I
suppose we need to throw him out because he cheated and hold the 2008 election
all over? We are no longer talking about the AGs office and have
officially stepped into the ACORN play book of counting votes until you win. An
election was held, Swallow won, he resigned and now the law kicks in to replace
him. It would be no different if Matheson stepped down, or Adams or any other
Democrat.Please, stop the ACORN-esque games.
I am one of those rare GOP delegates who feel that the delegates should be done
away with and let the vote go to the people. I do not think the delegates should
choose the next attorney general, neither do I think the governor should. In
fact, at the GOP county convention, Governor Herbert supported John Swallow and
was seen with him a good part of the convention. Therefore, to avoid any further
improprieties, I have to agree with the Democrats on this one. Let the people
Hmmmm...the law is the law? The law says if he resigns (as he has),
the Governor picks from nominees from the Party. Regardless of
whether we believe the election would be vacated based on a trial other than
"trial by press", which hasn't happened, nor would it be likely to
be completed prior to November...the law doesn't allow for trial by press
and pubic opinion to vacate an election.Under current law, the
office is vacated and replaced by the Governor until the election can be had in
November...candidates being able to file for that in March (I assume...like any
other election)...allowing for a full campaign and election process...and
ultimately decided by the voters.Sorry...I'm still convinced
that the actual Utah State Constitution and law works better than the Dems law
of ... ?
There should be a special election regardless of who did what (and I'm a
You would think that th GOP would prefer to avoid the appearance of evil. If
swallow gets to "resign" he gets yet more taxpayer money for his
Exactly what election laws were broken? We the voters need more information.
My understanding is he has not been charged with a crime. We are assuming he is
guilty. I am referring to the election law allegations, nothing else. I have
long advocated having the governor appoint the Attorney General.
"The AG is there to help the Governor govern. The governor should be able to
appoint someone to that position that he can work well with". What
government class teaches that?"The mission of the Office of the
Utah Attorney General is to uphold the constitutions of the United States and of
Utah, enforce the law, provide counsel to state agencies and public officials,
to work with law enforcement and protect the interests of Utah, its people,
environment and resources".Clearly the job go the AG is to
uphold state law and represent the the best legal interest of the state as a
member of the Executive Branch. If he broke election laws then yes the election
should be void and a new election should be held, perhaps next time Utah voters
will choose more wisely.
@TRUTHI don't live in Salt Lake City, but from what I remember,
the city elections there are non-partisan. Correct me if I am wrong. Why should we bother with any more elections ever if the chances are the
Republicans will win? It's just a waste of money to let people have a vote.
I guess all those armchair constitutionalists on the board here would agree,
Excuse me... attention libs and Dems. When you get one of your guys as governor,
your guy can choose, as for now it's the Republican governor's
right.You can change the law when you're in power if you so
choose to follow the example of your sinking in popularity president and senate
leadership.2014 can't come soon enough.
I'm Republican, generally, and agree there should be a special election.
Within a few days of the election truth began coming out about Swallow. I doubt
he would have won if he had not broken election laws, and if we had known the
extent of his dealings before the election.Let there be a new
election. It will cost more, but that is the cost of democracy. If
the governor appoints an interim AG, he will have the advantage in the next
One party rule leads to corruption.
20A-1-705 is where you want to look (2) (b) Upon issuance of the order, the
office is vacant and shall be filled as provided by this chapter.So
IF John Swallow was removed by they judge, which didn't happen, it would be
as provided by that chapter. That is chapter 1, Not Chapter 4. You go to
20A-1-504. SCC nominates 3 to the governor. If you go to Chapter 4, you get into
election contests. John Swallow was sworn in office in January. There is
evidence that 20A-1-705 might of allowed the office to be vacated by a judge. It
wasn't so 20A-1-504 applies. If it was vacated, 20A-1-504.Either way, current law requires the Utah GOP SCC to submit 3 nominees to the
governor to appoint, and we have a new election next year, and then another one
in 2 more years.
John Swallow's violation of campaign laws helped him get elected. That
makes his election illegal, null, and void.It makes sense that Utah
citizens should decide whether to take a chance and install another GOP Attorney
General into office, given the demonstrated proclivity toward corruption amongst
recent GOP Attorney's General. It makes much less sense to
allow a Republican governor to MANDATE that another GOP Attorney General MUST be
installed, regardless of the demonstrated corrupt propensities of GOP AG's.
For a democrat or independent (like myself) here in Utah to attempt to engage in
civil discourse with a republican is futile. It is engaging in an exchange with
unarmed opponents.All these narrow-minded, tunnel-visioned, straight party
ticket voters feel there is no way but their way.And their way isn't
working too well.Swallow cheated, he fraudulently acquired the
office, and as such, should be erased.A new vote to back up what in
reality never happened, is the only fair and just fix for this stinking mess.
So Swallow gets his pay and his pension even though he defrauded the electoral
process? Where is the vaunted Republican respect for the law this morning?
Since democrats don't respect the voice of the people in the last election,
why would be bother and pay for another election so they can disrespect the
voice of the people again?
Democrats are not the ones fabricating voting results to win elections. You are thinking of Republican John Swallow.
Since Swallow beat Smith 65% to 30% just what is Dabakis trying to prove? His
request violates state law. I have one better for him. If Dabakis thinks
Swallow violated election law, then using his logic, we should vacate the
presidential election and re-do it since many election laws were violated by the
Obama people and the Democrats in general. Some voting districts in Ohio,
Florida, Pennsylvania, etc had up to 150% of registered voters cast ballots.
Some precincts in major U.S. cities had zero voters vote for Romney, a
statistical impossibility. So let's start with the Presidential election
and work backward from there.Let's just get someone in office
that has ethics and brains. BTW, I didn't vote for Swallow. I
couldn't support him at all. I saw all this coming and refused to support
him. Reyes would be a good replacement.
So Pagan, just how many of those 65% do you think would have run to Smith if
these ethics violations would have come out prior to the election? Not near
enough for Smith to win the election. And to your charge, just what did Swallow
do to "fabricating voting results"? Just what do you mean by
"fabricating voting results"? Maybe the Black Panther party sat outside
of the voting precincts and stopped Democrats from voting? I
didn't vote for Swallow, I wrote in Reyes, but I find "fabricating
voting results" to be a bit difficult. Maybe you should choose better words
that actually make sense to make your point. Why don't you just accuse him
of stealing the election? That way we could accuse Obama of the same thing.
Could we have Obama's election nullified?
Evil doer? Cheat? Fraud? Pretty strong words, Mr Dabakis and Mr Hatch. Has Mr
Swallow been charged with violating any laws? Has he been convicted of
violating any laws? I don't see anything you and your followers allege that
would justify, under the law, nullifying an election. Show me a state statute
or even some case law that would support your claim. Or is this just more
political bluster to stir up people to anger?
@Web Geek - If the State of Utah invalidates the election, Swallow will owe
backed wages and will lose the majority of his pension benefits.
@Pat - The Lt. Governors Office and the Special Investigation committee have
found multiple issues regarding violations in campaign finance laws. Swallow has
not been charged with any civil or criminal violations as of yet, however, those
charges will soon come, pending any undue outside influence from powerful folks.
John Swallow has been hard to swallow from the day he took office. No ... even
before that ... from the day he began to use illegal tactics to win an
election.Now that he is "resigning" from the job he never
rightfully held, he wants to take home a lifetime pension he never earned.Since the day he took office, I submit, he has never put in a full
day's work for his employers; i.e., the tax payers of the state of Utah.Rather, he has been scrambling day and night to cover his behind and the
tax payers have been subsidizing his efforts.
Your ranting about Obama is off topic but Dnews always allows anti Obama ranting
it seems, even when a quick search proves your rumors to be false. The facts are he cheated during the election by not reporting what he should
have, not ballot stuffing.Got to love the I didn't vote for him
(now) but he's in my gang so I must defend him, even with all the
overwhelming evidence against him. Unlike your accusations against the POTUS.
The process that leads to a functioning AG now: Swallow resigns before
any sort of trial. Governor appoints an interim AG. The Voice of the People
get to decide on a new AG in Nov 2014, but until then we have someone actually
filling the office.The process that leads to a functioning AG in Nov
2014 and leaves us with a non-functional AG until then: Swallow does not
resign but holds out for a trial. Trial doesn't even start until summer of
2014 (at the earliest). For the next 7 month Swallow spends all his time and
energy getting ready for the trial and accomplishes nothing in the AGs office
(about what he's doing right now). After the trial, either he is acquitted
and finally gets to work as the AG, or he is found guilty and the 2 parties have
to quickly put together a couple candidates for the special election in Nov
2014. That assumes the trial completes before Oct 2014 and there is
time to hold an election. Otherwise we spend a couple million on a special
election later in the year.