Both Programs are in trouble....neither coach knows how to recruit and
win.....with all the great talent there is out there, too many are not being
recruited by BYU or Utah! No excuse for it! Fire Bronco and Whit!
I once heard a saying: When ifs and buts are candy and nuts we'll all have
a merry Christmas.When you think you already won the game before the
ball is put into play, why play the game at all. That's Alabama disease,
where they still think they beat Utah, they just didn't try but they are
still the wiener. There is way too much hype around BYU. They had
a great team on paper but I think they are being brainwashed into winning the
game before they play it and then not competing at game time.
Utah is the 10th best team in the Pac 12. And Utah owns byu and usu. Sad state of football for our state.
Every Notre Dame player on the field wore short sleeves and nothing else. BYU
however were dressed in many layers. It must have felt for the Irish like
hitting a styrofoam cooler when they made contact with the Cougars.
BYU at least had some creative plays during their game. Utah is the same old
offense: run up the gut on 1st down, run up the gut on 2nd down, attempt a pass
on 3rd down, punt on 4th. They always have the same formation with the RB to the
right or left of the QB. No I formation, no pro sets, just the same look on
every down. I miss the Urban Myers days when they had a bunch of different
plays, mis-directions, shovel passes, hook and ladder, and different formations.
It's time for a shake-up in the coaching up on the hill. It's boring
to watch the same plays with the same results. I won't spend another dime
going to a Utah football game until the coaches either get creative, or they get
a pink slip.
It is truly sad, tragic really. I appreciate this article putting it all into
perspective for me. Nothing has a more profound impact on my life than college
football -- except for college basketball, and that is where I have now turned
my hopes for happiness.
All four of BYU's losses were by 10 points or less. A play here, a
touchdown there or a big defense stop at a key time were the difference between
an 11-0 or 10-1 record and BYU's actual 7-4 record.-----------Stop it! You guys say that EVERY year.
"...former Auburn head coach Gene Chizik won a national championship in 2010
only to be fired two seasons later after finishing 3-9. Chizik got just one
losing season, and Whittingham already has two.Anyone really think
he'll still be around if the Utes make it three?"hands?Utah's 2014 Football ScheduleIdaho State - winFresno
State - toss upat Michigan - lossOregon State - toss upat UCLA
- lossat Stanford - lossArizona - toss upSouthern Cal -
lossat Arizona State - lossOregon - lossWashington State -
toss upat Colorado - toss up1 win6 losses5
tossupsThe Utes will have to sweep Utah's tossups in order to
save Kyle's job.
It's REALLY sad when Chris and I agree, because he's right: if all the
Utes can brag about is beating us and the Aggies (2 game out of an entire
season...and I'll even throw in the Stanford win), then things really are
especially bad for the U. At least BYU still has something to play
for in the post-season, with a bowl game against a quality PAC-12 team (likely
Washington, if you believe the sports pundits). All the Utes have to look
forward to is their 'storied' rivalry with Colorado...hoping not to
lose and claim the official "PAC-12 Doormat-of-the-year" award.
In my opinion (it doesn't really matter)If Utah throws a few less key
interceptions and they have a great year.BYU learns how to execute and
score touchdowns they have a great year.Both of these schools have
struggled, but there is hope.Fix the mistakes that have plagued them and
they will have bright futures.
At the beginning of the season I predicted that BYU would finish with a 7-5
record and Utah would finish at 6-6. I based that on their schedule and on
youth and inexperience at key positions.For Utah - Arizona and
Washington State turned out to be much better than I expected. The Stanford win
was amazing but the Oregon State loss at home was a huge disappointment.For BYU - I never expected a loss to Virginia or win against Texas and
was doubtful about Boise St as well as Utah State on the road.Utah
slightly underperformed and BYU slightly overperformed. I don't think I
would call either season a disaster however.Next year with more
experience on offense for BYU and fewer QB problems for Utah the seasons for
both schools should be better
Uteology - The writer is saying it, not a byu fan---------Stop it! You ute "fans" pay more attention to byu EVERY year.Oh, Brunswick called, they are holding out hope ute fans/players will
accept the bowling invitation they just extended.
Its Karma... Until BYU and Utah fans can get along this is what they get...Mark it Down!!! :)
Chris BSpeaking of OWN, when are you going to OWN up to your
guarantees that were miscalculated. Who says"I told ya"
before the game is even over? Own up!!!
This turned out to be a pretty typical year for byu: Lose to your rival, beat
the nobodies and lose to all the ranked teams you play(end of season rankings
are the only rankings that matter and since we're not at end of season our
best guess is current rankings).In fact, in the last 4 years, guess
how many TOTAL wins against ranked(again, only end of season rankings matter)
teams byu has?1 win. 4 YEARS.Utah state is the ONLY
ranked(only end rankings matter) team byu won in the last FOUR YEARS!LOL
Utah is in a league that they don't belong, especially when you consider
all sports, not just football. They rounded out the league to 12 teams so a
play-off would be permitted. They are fodder for the PAC 12. They got lucky
when Stanford looked past them. The same was true when they beat TCU in 2008.
Both games came down to the last play and the Ute defense played well. How well
did that same defense do at Washington State last Saturday, or at Arizona,
Oregon, USC, etc? I agree their schedule is a killer---one where they
can't compete except to maybe defeat Colorado and stay out of the basement.
How'd that work in 2011 in SLC?BYU just didn't execute
when they should. Fans deserve better from them. They need an infusion of a
killer instinct. They're just too gentlemanly too often, as well as being
undisciplined with regards to drive-killing penalties. Talent is there---the
coaching lacks direction at times regarding motivation to win.
I like how the article talks about BYU and Ute's but not USU, but USU goal
was to make it into the MWC Championship and it looks like they are going to
fulfill that goal even with all the injuries. Too bad the Ute's
couldn't adapt after their injuries. Coaching is the major factor why
Ute's could not adapt. It will be nice having two post season games to
watch. Go USU and RSL, the only two Utah teams that have done better than what
@ Chris B:The "sad state of football in the state of Utah"
is mostly in your own mind by falling short in so many predictions, and even
promises this season. Utah was better than USU and BYU on 2
particular days this season. That doesn't necessarily means they are
overall better. The Sagarin rankings at the end of the season determine that. It
takes account every measurable statistic there is... including strength of
schedule and head to head competition. We'll know next week which team in
the state had the best overall season, rather than trying to pin everything on
just 2 games.You obviously don't have any idea what
"owning" another team means. BYU has streaks beating Utah and Utah has
streaks beating BYU. It goes back and forth and has done so for many decades.
The closest any team came to owning the other is when LaVell Edwards came
onboard and BYU beat Utah 19 of the next 21 games. But that's history too.
Saying anyone's team owns anyone else is merely opinion. But
one indisputable fact is that Utah might be the 12th best team in the PAC12,
depending on what happens next Saturday.
Chris,You make it hard to cheer for the Utes. It's time to
accept the fact that the Utes are not good. They beat BYU because they were a
better team in September. They are not the better team now. It's okay to be
wrong and it's okay to admit fault. Stop living in the past and learn to
accept the present.
Chris B,Are you dizzy yet for all the spinning you are doing?
@ Chris BUtah has beaten 1 team that will likely end up being ranked at
the end of the year in 4 years.That is Stanford from this year.You
are bragging about something that has not even happened yet.Stanford could
finish the season losing 3 more games.They have Notre Dame, ASU, and a
bowl game.Utah State finished ranked 16thWe will see how Stanford
does, but if they lose one or two of those they will be no better than Utah
State.Go back to 2009 and BYU has beaten 3 and the Utes 14 in you
include Oregon State who finished 26th after losing to BYU in a bowl game.LOL nice argument
Utah collegiate football is going DOWN, DOWn, DOwn, Down, down, dow, do, d,...
@ Chris B:If "only end of year rankings matter", which are
your exact words, then why do you continue making such a big deal of Utah's
win over BYU this season? BYU has been nationally ranked better than Utah most
of the season and will very likely finish that way too. You sound
totally desperate and just as unbeleivable as your guarantees when you state
that BYU beat only a bunch of "nobodies" this year. How long has a
Texas team contending for the Big 12 conference title been considered a
nobody?How long has a 9-2 Houston team been considered a nobody?How
long has Boise State been considered a nobody by anyone else besides you?Who else in the entire country besides you considers Georgia Tech a nobody?Why do you consider USU a nobody, seeing as they beat Utah last year and
barely lost to them this year in SLC... plus, they are currently leading their
conference?There is apparently some delirium from not going bowling
for 2 years in a row. But don't compound the problem by adding a probable
case of foot-in-mouth disease.
Utah will NOT go to a bowl game - mark it down.
BYU's biggest problem is they are being man-handled on the line of
scrimmage by these BCS quality teams. If they don't fix this for next
year, they will be in the same boat. Hill will get better, Anae will hopefully
find his groove in playcalling, but my biggest fear is the O-line will continue
to get pushed around and the D-line will continue to get blown off the ball.
Just watch the Wisconsin and ND game for perfect examples of this. Still a die
hard Cougar fan here, looking forward to a good bowl game against Washington
This is a painful and accurate article for both fan bases. We stunk it up this
year. All we can say is "We beat you 4 in a row," or "At least
we're bowling again." But in the end what we are all saying is
"OUCH!" We are all fans. Some are red, some are blue. Let's all be
a little kinder to each other since really none of us has anything to brag about
this year. Hopefully both teams will do better next year (I really do hate
saying that year after year).
After watching the BYU Notre Dame game my conclusion is Hill couldn't hit a
bus if he was riding on it.
"This turned out to be a pretty typical year for byu: Lose to your rival,
beat the nobodies and lose to all the ranked teams you play(end of season
rankings are the only rankings that matter and since we're not at end of
season our best guess is current rankings)."Chris B,Is it better to beat a ranked team, or to BE a ranked team? How many years out
of the past 4 years has Utah ended the season ranked higher than BYU?
Not the great year Ute and Cougar fans were hoping for, but I don't think
either team (or its rabid, unreasonable fan base) should lose hope. The close
losses were the only thing separating each team from a much greater year, and
both teams have capable, young QBs with bright futures….although Travis
Wilson may not be back next year per the reports. With more experience at QB
and the offensive line, BYU should have a much better offense next year. Its
defensive front 7 will taken a step back, but the secondary should improve with
Jordan Johnson and Trent Trammel back.My only Christmas wish is for
Anae to learn some humility, clock management and play-calling skills in the
offseason. I loved his up tempo style and development of Taysom HIll, but his
play calling at Virginia cost BYU the game (let's pass deep in enemy
territory while nursing a lead with a minute left in game!), and his clock
management and play calling at Wisconsin and ND didn't help (although BYU
didn't deserve to win either game).Utes goal for the future?
Keep Whittingham from leaving.
BYU needs to recruit better players it's become obvious watching them play
against Wisconsin and Notre Dame how much mauling they were getting at the line
of scrimmage on both defense and offense.
BYU's recruiting has to get much much better. The way Notre Dame and
Wisconsin push BYU around at the line of scrimmage tells me things of got to
@ChrisB: "This turned out to be a pretty typical year for byu: Lose to your
rival, beat the nobodies and lose to all the ranked teams you play (end of
season rankings are the only rankings that matter ...)." Your
comment is lacking in logic. First, who is BYU's rival? Certainly not
Utah, as BYU and Utah are not in the same conference (as you keep reminding
everybody) and they don't even play each other every year in the future.
Second, if only end of the season ranking matter in your assessment of a quality
wins, it puts BYU (or any other school whose quality wins you are assessing) in
a highly biased situation. If BYU wins, the team they beat is likely to fall
out of the rankings; if BYU loses-they didn't get a win at all, let alone a
quality win. Case in point, if BYU had not blown out Texas, Texas would likely
be ranked. Since BYU beat Texas, you consider Texas a "nobody". Thus
like many of the points you make, this one makes no sense.
Bottom line: we suck right now. Consolation: So do the Utes.
I am happy for the USU fan, Mr. Ways - First name RSLf.
I miss the comment boards from 5 weeks ago, when BYU was surging and Utah had
just beaten Stanford and looked to be moving up. It's been a rough few
weeks since then. The games have all been fun to watch this year for both
teams, but the results have been pretty much awful. No way to spin it any other
"Utah is the 10th best team in the Pac 12"Huh? How do you
get 10th best team in the Pac when you're tied with Colorado for the 12th
best record? (Good thing there aren't 13 teams or you'd probably be
13th) Must be that pipe dream math she's using again.Speaking
of tied for LAST place - the Pillow Fight for the Basement is shaping up to be a
real barn burner. YAWN
All these losses land squarely on the coach's shoulders. Anae does not
have the offense prepared. Anae does not get the most he can out of players...I
would say they do not play anywhere near inspired football. The defense often
plays inspired, but not as often this year. Think what a great
coach gets medium players to give...the players consistently play above
themselves...begin to believe they are that good...they become that good.
Offensive calls are not creative, it is like the other team knows what is
coming...very vanilla.Sad for the fans. We had some exceptional
players, and many very good players, and we did nothing with them.
Chris Bwho has gone to bowl games the past 2 years Byu and Utah
state !!!all that needs to be said
Hey ChrisB I extend the olive branch! Go take care of Colorado and hold your
head up high. Send those seniors out with a W. Utah doesn't belong in the
If BYU replaced Middle Tennessee State, Idaho State, Georgia Tech and Houston
with Oregon, Oregon State, Arizona and Arizona State, UCLA or USC they'd
have the same record the Utes have now. Their losses against Virginia, Utah,
Notre Dame and Wisconsin showed that the Cougars can not consistently win big
games. Utah should be proud about the 4 game winning streak against
the Y. But when you look at the level of talent and the quality of opponents,
both teams are fairly equal. I'm saying this as a Utah fan who has gone
from optimistic after the Oregon State loss to disappointed after the Washington
State game. For both programs something needs to change. I love
Whit, but business is business and his teams aren't taking care of it. If
Hill gives him another year and he can't turn it around then find someone
who can come in and reinvigorate the program. Look what Rich Rodriguez did at
Arizona State this year. Utah has the swagger to attract a rising star in the
college coaching ranks. It would also free him up so BYU could have the best
coach available to them.
BeSmart in Cheyenne. BYU can't fix the OC problem, because they don't
an OC coach.
mohokatOgden, UT And just how many pick 6,s did shultz throw on
saturday i counted 2 as i recall Hill did not throw a pick 6 in the game ,so who
can,t pass,I Rest my case.
Actually, to be fair to both Utah and Colorado, their game isn't for the
conference most futile award this season... That was already won by California
at 0-9 and 1-11 overall... They are only fighting the rumble in the Rockies for
who is worst in the division... And Arizona will be playing for Stanford's
hope of hosting the championship game, as in a loss ASU would finish tied with
them in conference and lost that tiebreaker by 14 on the field September 21st...
The "irony of the year" award goes to the ultra-Ute fans who spent most
of the season bragging about their power conference affiliation, then watched as
their team stumbled home with a grand total of 1 conference win. Amazing!
Believe it or not, there are no other teams jealous of you. None. Better to be a bigger fish in a smaller pond, than a minnow in a big pond...
that continually gets eaten alive by the bigger fish.
Guam_BombBYU beat 6 bowl teams which each won at least 7 regular
season games.How many bowl teams did Utah beat?
Chris B's comments totally lack logic. If you beat a team during the
season and they are ranked at that time, then you beat a ranked team, period.
The logic is so flawed to say that only end of year rankings count, because any
team you beat will drop in the rankings because you beat them. Thus, if
Stanford loses to ND, loses the Pac 12 championship game and then loses their
bowl, they finish out of the rankings and Utah did not beat a ranked team. NO,
they beat Stanford when ranked in the top 5 and that is all that matters.Again, part of the problem with this rivalry is that to most of the byu
players, it has never been a rivalry unless you grew up in Utah. Because Utah
was not challenging for WAC championships, when I played, Utah did not matter,
so it was not a big deal, we were looking at other teams who were challenging
for conference titles. The game has been much more important to Utah for the
last 40 years or so.
Coulda, Woulda, Shoulda. The Rocky Mountain Mediocrity fever.Both
teams need to get an edge, play the whole game, put a dagger in it and ignore
their own press until they can point at the scoreboard because that's what
everyone everywhere else in the country remembers. Too much feel
good and not enough good wins to feel good about on their own.Best
of luck to Utah and BYU to close out with a win so their seasons don't
stink too badly. It was a real let down to your fans and doesn't speak
well for either head coach.
@cool cat cosmo.."At least BYU still has something to play for in the
post-season, with a bowl game against a quality PAC-12 team (likely Washington,
if you believe the sports pundits)." What does the cougies have
to play for? The kraft fight hunger nobody cares bowl? Washington a high quality
PAC 12 team? Their in the same position the utes were the last couple years so I
guess your saying Utah is a high quality PAC 12 team right? If the
schedules were flipped this year the utes would most likely be 9 - 2 right now.
The cougies would be 1 - 10. @utes home for the
holiday's..."Stop it! You ute "fans" pay more attention to byu
EVERY year.Oh, Brunswick called, they are holding out hope ute
fans/players will accept the bowling invitation they just extended."Going off your screen name and comments you don't pay any attention
to the utes do ya?...lol
Phychiatrist,And yet, Utah beat Stanford and Stanford is still
ranked. How is that so since you seem to believe if byu were to beat someone
they could no longer be ranked?Nice spin there.
Tators"Utah was better than USU and BYU on 2 particular days
this season. That doesn't necessarily means they are overall better. The
Sagarin rankings at the end of the season determine that. It takes account every
measurable statistic there is... including strength of schedule and head to head
competition. We'll know next week which team in the state had the best
overall season, rather than trying to pin everything on just 2 games."That's not an unreasonable position to take and hard to argue with,
but before going to far down that road bear in mind that those same Sagarin
rankings declared the Florida Gators the national champ in 1984.
BYU9293,No, it is your logic that is flawed. Yes, if you beat a
team they will drop. But if they're good enough still and thought of as a
top 25 team, they'll still be in the top 25. Are you aware that
not many teams in the top 25 are unbeaten?Stanford is ranked. And
yet, based on your logic that shouldn't be the case since Utah beat them
right?So you guys must think USC was the best team in the nation at
the beginning of the year last year since they were ranked #1 huh?Too funny
@ 2 BCS WINSI cheer for the Utes but c'mon. You are comparing the
Utes to Washington that is not even close.Washington is 7-4 with losses on
the road at Stanford, UCLA, and ASU.They have gone to 4 straight bowl
games under SarkisianThey have 2 national titles, and 20 all americans.Its great to be in the PAc for the Utes, but be realistic the Utes are not
even close to Washington in football.The Utes do have a better basketball
history that Washington but Washington has been pretty good for 5 years or
so.@ Chris B.I agree that psychiatrist's argument is a little
weird. I think it will be interesting how Stanford finishes the season out. They
still have 3 tough games and could lose all 3 or win all 3. If they win all 3
then Utah will have beaten an end of the year to 5 if they lose at least 2 out
of the 3 they may finish barely in the top 20. It will be interesting.
@BeSmart,Thank you. And if Stanford goes on to lose 2 more games
this season and drops to 20th or so, I will no longer claim that win as beating
a top 10 team in the nation. I don't think I'm being unrealistic by
saying that if a team is one of the best 25 teams in the nation, they'll be
in the top 25 at the end of the season. Byu has consistently been an
ok team under Bronco, and certainly the string of bowl wins is impressive. I
just don't think I'm wrong in saying that Bronco in his 8 years still
hasn't proven he can beat good teams. Whittingham beat an end of season
top 10 Alabama, end of season top 10 TCU, and we'll see where Stanford
ends. Bronco has never done that, even once. Whittingham has also had several
very bad losses, like you guys recently did with Virginia. I just think any
team that wants to call themselves a great team needs to beat end of season top
25 teams, more than 1 in 4 years. Utah included.
Utah has played the toughest schedule in the country per the Saragin rankings.
They are ranked #26, with only two teams in the top 50 with losing records
(Florida #49). Too bad they couldn't pull off the Oregon St and/or ASU
games. The Utes need to shore up the QB position. Eastern Washington has a
better QB, and it's not even close. The schedule has been brutal; but the
season is what it is: a dissapointment. A win against Colorado, and hopefully a
better season next year. GO UTES!
@ Chris B.I agree with you completely Utah has been able to win some
really big games under Whittingham.And Bronco has not he has had some good
wins, but never the great win and it is disappointing.I think Whittingham
is a great coach and can get Utah to win more in the Pac-12 (I think they mainly
lack depth at qb and wr).BYU unless they get an offense that can actually
score against good opponents then they will probably always lose to the great
teams and a lot of good ones.I personally think BYU's defense the
last couple of years is as good as it will get there because of recruiting.But BYU's offense since 2010 has been pathetic and has ruined what may
have been some fun years.Have a good day.
To Chris B,Yes, for the first week of the season USC was ranked #1 last
year, so they were number 1, period. If they lost after that, then they
dropped. You are ranked what you are ranked when you play, period. Also, my
logic never said that Utah was better than Stanford, they are not and were not,
it was an upset. It only says that Stanford was the #5 team at that time and
they were. The rankings are what they are. You cannot try to switch them to
something else to fit your needs. They are rankings, opinions, that is it, they
are not true. Every #1 team in the history of Division 1 football has always
been maybe, they don't have a playoff and it does not matter if every
person on the planet votes you #1, it does not make you the best team...ever.
Understand what logic truly is before you try to spout it.
fenderAP and Coaches National Championships trump Sagarin rankings
every time.Sagarin rankings are only relevant for ranking teams that
aren't good enough to finish in the final AP and Coaches Top 25.
byu9293.Great teams prove they can beat great teams. It's
significantly more impressive for a team to beat another team who is
unranked(and ends up being ranked at the end of the season) than it is to beat
the #1 team in the nation(at the time) only to see that team end unranked.Not a single person in the football world thinks USC was the best team
in the country, EVEN at the beginning of the year. Every expert agrees they
were not the best team, not even close.Anyone who thinks beating USC
last year at the beginning of the season is better than beating Alabama(who
wasn't ranked #1 at the time) doesn't understand football.The best 25 teams in football each year end the season in the top 25. Its
really quite simple.And in 4 years byu only has 1 win against the
best 25 teams in football. Some powerhouse program.And your coach
who talks national titles has NEVER beaten one of the best 10 teams in football.
No other coach who has done so little talks so highly. Sorry, the truth hurts.
Uteanymous"Utah's 2014 Football ScheduleIdaho State -
winFresno State - toss upat Michigan - lossOregon State - toss
upat UCLA - lossat Stanford - lossArizona - toss upSouthern Cal - lossat Arizona State - lossOregon - lossWashington State - toss upat Colorado - toss up1 win6
losses5 tossups"It's hard for Utah fans to admit, but
it's becoming more and more obvious that the Utes have bitten off more than
they can chew.Another losing, bowl-less season next year is more
likely than not.
redfeather, At least we wont be hearing about byu's amazingly tough
schedule next year huh?Total power conference programs byu plays in
2014:Texas(good one)Cal(12th of 12 in Pac 12)Virginia(14th of 14 in ACC, only 1 division win this year - you guys)LOL!
@ 2BCSWINS:By stating that nobody cares about the Kraft Hunger Bowl,
you honestly sound jealous and even somewhat desperate. I totally guarantee (not
a Chris B type of guarantee) that Utah would've jumped at the opportunity
to play in that bowl... or any other bowl if given the opportunity.
Unfortunately, it won't happen. I've been pulling for them (and
usually do when they aren't playing BYU or USU) to become bowl eligible.A truism you should never forget: Any bowl is better than no bowl. @ fender:I doubt they even had the Sagarin rankings 29 years
ago... in 1984. But even if they did, what has that got to do with this season?
Absolutely nothing at all. Two facts still exist:1) Like it or not,
BYU was crowned the 1984 National Champions based on the national polls that
year. Period.2) BYU will likely finish ahead of Utah in the Sagarin and
every other national poll at the end of this season... again. Polls are the
general concensus on who finishes the season as the better teams throughout the
country. Again, Utah better on September 21st, but BYU better overall.
@ Christopher B:Speaking of 2014 schedules... Utah's might even
be harder than this year's schedule. As such, and based upon what happened
to Utah this year, what do you expect the results will be next year? Not pretty.
You should think a litte harder before throwing out your ill-timed
LOL's.Kyle would probably pay big bucks to be able to switch
schedules with BYU at this point. And so would a lot of other Ute fans who are
getting tired or losing and not garning respect in doing so. How is that you
keep missing the boat? Head in the sand?You of all people should not
be poking fun at Cal... seeing that Utah is once again contending with them for
a very unenviable title. Something else your ultra-biased thinking
keeps forgetting... schedules are made years in advance. Nobody knows who will
be the power teams by the time those seasons actually come about. Every team has
up years and down years. Texas may be a top 10 team next year. Nobody knows for
certain, and especially not you. We all know how most of your predictions go.
BYU will lose 1 gsame next season. We have the talent, and our schedule is
@ Christopher B:It's actually quite silly to brag about a tough
schedule that you can't even compete in. Weber State could create the
toughest football schedule in the world, but what would that prove? Considering
how your comments made you look last Saturday, you should quit digging yourself
in deeper. Ute fans seem to be disowning the person making such claims and
guarantees, and everyone else is actually laughing... guaranteed. One other thought. At least BYU is smart enough to create schedules they are
competitive in. Can Utah claim the same thing? (and yes, by accepting PAC12
membership, they are creating their schedules). The proof is in the results. He
who laughs last (and ends up ranked better) laughs best.
@christina"The best 25 teams in football each year end the
season in the top 25. Its really quite simple."I agree with you
completely, it is just you that doesn't really agree with yourself.
Let's not forget that BYU has finished in those rankings yet you still seem
to think utah, which has not finished in those rankings, is better based on the
results of one game. I guess when it is utah finishing out of the top 25, and
BYU finishing in the top 25, that it really isn't that simple huh?Nothing like tuah "fan" hypocrisy to keep things around here
@TatorsConsidering BYU is ranked #24, and Utah #26; I wouldn't
beat on my chest just yet. Not much difference between #24 and #26 anyway. It
would be a shame if you didn't have the Saragin rankings to lean on,
because we all know who won the actual game.
Just to throw something into the conversationHow about a ranking that
actually matters (since both teams can't reach the top 25)BCSBYU-41Utah- 59
Tators,"At least BYU is smart enough to create schedules they
are competitive in"So you agree byu can only be competitive by
playing the 2 worst BCS programs in their respective divisions and then
texas?LOL!I thought you were guys were going after
national titles? That's what Bronco keeps saying. Shouldn't a
national title worthy team be able to play a national title worthy schedule?
@ Spokane Ute:When did I beat on my chest? If you actually read my
comments to this article, I said that whoever is ranked higher at the end of the
season... since the end of th season isn't here yet. Based on
what happened last week and also the last time Colorado played in SLC, there
isn't much reason to expect much from our SLC team this coming Saturday...
though I do hope they prevail. I believe (and odds-makers will
probably agree) there is a better chance of BYU beating Nevada, and thus, end up
higher ranked in the end-of-season rankings. It's pretty much an objective
assessment. No chest thumping.@ Chrisopher B:Quit being
so bellicose! You are much better at insidiously putting words into
people's mouths than you are at predicting games. But at least you appear
to be good at something. If you had any objectivity at all, you
would've understood I said that BYU has been more competitive with their
(top 20% in difficulty) schedule this season than Utah has been with their
schedule. It's not so difficult to understand. Try a bit harder to keep up
@christinaBYU's schedule SOS is 23rd, that is top 25 by real
math. Last I checked in the 5 so called "power" conferences there are
approximately 60 total teams. That means BYU schedule is btter than more than
half of those teams. Not evey single one of them has an SOS ranked #1, in fact
only one of them has that. That means all of the others have an SOS lower than
that yet they supposedly have schedules "worthy" of national title
consideration. You really struggle when it comes to some pretty
simple things, stuff like facts and logic.
@Be SmartWhy do the BCS rankings matter more than the Saragin, when
you aren't in the top 25 anyway? Neither team has any chance of sniffing a
BCS bolw. Where do I find a BCS ranking that goes beyond 25 teams? The Saragin
rankings, ranks 252 teams.
To the poster above who mentioned Rich Rodriguez being at Arizona State - he is
at the University of Arizona. Todd Graham is the coach at ASU. Formerly at
Tulsa, WV, Rice and the real program founder of what's become Allen, TX HS
football (ranked #2 nationally again this year). Sharp guy, Todd Graham. The U
should hire him away.
@christinaInterestingly NONE of the teams currently in contention
for the national championship have a SOS higher than BYU's, none of them.
Florida St. (76)Alabama (55)Baylor (65)Ohio St
(67)Oregon (25) they aren't in contention nor is any pac12 team but
their SOS is lowerWisconsin (45)Missouri (39)Oklahoma St
@ Christopher B:I really don't understand why people have to
keep taking you by the hand in trying to explain simple concepts. But let's
try this once again...BYU has a schedule this year that is in the
top 20% in the nation in difficulty. Not as difficult as Utahs, but ranked more
difficult than several teams currently listed in the top 10 nationally. As such, why wouldn't their schedule be considered worthy of
national contention if they had won enough of those games? Please try answering
in an objecive and non-obtrusive way, since most of your comments are just the
opposite.Every objective football pundit (you've already
excluded yourself) agrees that that level of strength of schedule qualififies
for national consideration. BYU soundly beat Texas who currently
leads a BCS conference, plus Houston and USU who also lead their respective
conferences. You somehow forgot to mention those facts. In fact,
BYU's strength of schedule this year is more difficult that any schedule
Utah has ever had prior to this year. Period... even in the years they qualified
for BCS bowl games. Facts (as opposed to some commenters who make
game guarantees) don't lie.
CBS sports will show you the full rankings.I actually mocked the fact that
rankings are brought into the picture when neither is the top 25.Lets see
why are the BCS rankings more important well lets see they decide the National
Champion. Sagarin rankings are a part of the BCS rankings so the BCS is
more comprehensive. That is like saying an arm is more important than the whole
body.Have a good day.
@rlsintx..Why in the world would Graham go to Utah when successful
at ASU? Sun Devils send him to SLC for a single day in January, and he would
get on the first plane back. Winters in northern Utah are horrific ( spent 21
of them in Cache Valley).
@ Spokane Ute:You seemed to have fallen into the same trap that a
few other Ute fans have... putting all their argument about who is better based
on a single game of the season. If you do that, then you also have
to say that Utah is better than Stanford, too. So do you actually believe
that?Texas is now ranked 27th in the latest AP poll. Yet BYU clobbered
them. No one in their right football mind considers Virginia even close to
as good as BYU... even though they did win in that first game of the season
against BYU's then new offensive scheme... before it became better honed.
Try harder to look at the bigger picture. You've already shown
yourself capable of that by being more objective than most fans of either side.
Let's continue to look at the entire season as a whole. The national polls
will soon make those assessments. BTW: There are not any national
polls I can find that currently have Utah ranked better than BYU. None. In fact,
the BCS poll currently has BYU ranked 18 places better than Utah.
Truth MachineSo you say. Re-read Tator's position on that
issue.TatorsSorry pardner, you can't have it both
ways, but nice try after painting yourself in a corner. And, yes,
Sagarin's ratings were alive and well in '84.
@BesmartThanks for the info, that's the first time I have seen a BCS
poll beyond 25 teams. The only reason I reference the Saragin poll, is because
that's the one that BYU fans always hang there hat on. Neither BYU or Utah
have to worry about the National Championship, not even close. You have a good
day too Guy!@TatersI'm lookin at the big picture. The
Saragin rankings are based on the entire season. The difference between #24
& #26 is oh so slight. You make it sound as if there's a huge ranking
difference. Is WSU better than Utah? Of course they are, they just beat Utah. I
can admit that. Wait, the Saragin rankings say other wise. I don't buy
that. I will look for your position after the season plays out: Utah beats
Colorado, BYU beats Nevada, then loses to Washington. I wonder what your
position will be then, if the Saragin rankings have Utah higher? Hopefully you
won't reference another poll that fits your agenda; we shall see. When
teams are ranked, basically the same, I would have to utilize head to head
results as the tie breaker. IMO
Tators"against BYU's then new offensive scheme... before it
became better honed."LOLWisconsin and Notre Dame
didn't think much of your honed go fast go hard offense.
Spokane UteIt's "Sagarin", not "Saragin".Regardless, Bronco has finished ahead of Kyle in record and ranking in 5
of the last 8 seasons, and stands on the cusp of making it 6 of the last 9.
@Chris BWay to go again. You're a genius at distorting the
records and efforts of college athletes. We get that you hate BYU. I don't
think you care about Utah, except as a foil against BYU.I've
never cared about Utah's record, and still don't. But you've got
me looking at the Utah scores and chuckling, thinking of yet another egg cracked
on your face. I take equal joy in each BYU win because I know it pains you
greatly.That is the definition of Schadenfreude, joy in the misery
of others. I love it when you come on these boards to whine and dissemble.As for you true Utah fans,, I feel your pain. But afterall, it is just a
game. There is always next year.
All this arguing is hilarious. I love college football and am a BYU fan but the
passion of fans can be ridiculous. The fact is college football is
not an object sport, it is a subject sport. As such anybody can carve out a way
to put their team in the best light as possible. Reduce the scope of inquiry
enough and you can make your team better than any other team in some form or
fashion. Let's all just admit the fact that we don't really know which
team is better because we don't have a good objective line to draw. Is it
the game between them? Is it the overall season? Is it the schedule? Is it past
history? I don't know. Any statistics professor would tell you
that no college football team plays a statistically significant sample of the
other college football teams to say that one is objectively the best. And in many ways that is the beauty of college football, it allows for lots of
discussion. So discuss away but lets not kid ourselves into believing that any
one of us can objectively say which is better than the other.
Chris B:Your use of only end of the season rankings as a metric for
quality wins is flawed as pointed out by both BYU9293 and myself for the reasons
given in previous posts (The generally true principle that ranked teams fall in
the rankings when they lose). It is also a flaw to base a quality win
only on the end of season rankings because the quality of many teams is not
static. Suppose Team A beats Team B at mid-season while Team B is ranked, and
subsequently Team B loses its star quarterback to injury for the season,
resulting in a weakened team and additional losses. Was the Team A win over Team
B a quality win or not? Such scenarios are not uncommon.
@ChamberlinThank you for the correction; I'm sure everyone was
struggling with the meaning of my post......sheesh! How have they done head to
head? Do tell.
"They dreamed of playing in the Rose Bowl and laughing at BYU languishing in
mediocrity. Well, they can still laugh at BYU thanks to Utah's four-game
winning streak over the Cougars"Come on give me a break. Is
there a DNews writer who isn't a BYU or USU grad or who doesn't have
the worlds biggest grudge against the Utes? Sports media in this state is a
joke. No rational Utah fan "dreamed of playing in the Rose Bowl"
definately not in it's first 3 seasons. As far as laughing at BYU, yeah we
Utah fans still do that. As bottom feeder we still manage to take them to the
woodshed. And personally I couldn't care less. That game was fun but
it's getting ridiculous lately. The media, the fans, the universities,
it's all getting to be way too much. I would love a complete halt of that
game. Point of the article: Both BYU and Utah just aren't that
good. I could just as soon fly to the moon than watch the Y play in the NCG and
Utah in the Rose.
Welcome back to Provo coach W!! Take the D for a couple of years and then take
over for Bronco where you belong.