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Comments about ‘Letter: Non-discrimination bill’

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Published: Saturday, Nov. 23 2013 12:00 a.m. MST

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Kalindra
Salt Lake City, Utah

Let's start with the fact that, contrary to the claim in this letter, Utah does not have a law protecting against discrimination in employment and housing for LGBT individuals.

This letter presents no data or facts to supports its fearmongoring.

Contrariusier
mid-state, TN

Unfortunately, Utah does NOT have statewide anti-discrimination laws -- even though the LDS church has supported such legislation in the past.

Currently there is no Federal or statewide Utah law which bans discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation.

In states that do not have anti-gay discrimination laws, a man can literally be fired for simply saying "I'm going to the movies with my boyfriend".

Here's a few examples of how employment discrimination affects people across the country:

college soccer coach in Nashville -- fired in 2010 after she told her team that her female partner was pregnant.

legislative editor of the Georgia General Assembly -- fired in 2005 when she told her boss that she was transsexual and was going to begin dressing/presenting as a woman.

professor in Wisconsin -- offered a job as a university dean in 2010. When that university found out she was a lesbian, the offer was rescinded.

schoolteacher in Minnesota -- she was fired in 2013 after acknowledging that she's a lesbian.

This is a real problem that affects real people. Let's skip the hyperbole and fear-mongering and work towards equal protection for ALL citizens.

Hutterite
American Fork, UT

I've been to a few venues where the womens' is backed up and a few brazen (desperate?) ladies will use the mens'. No problem. Aside from the fact that us men might have to put some thought into keeping the place cleaner, it may be an idea whose time has come.

Pagan
Salt Lake City, UT

'There is no official process by which a person declares their gender identity….'

Um, wedding rings, vows, invitations, etc, etc.

I'm glad this is presented as an opinion piece, because people present their gender identity every day. It is just so common for some that they choose to ignore they're examples.

And only focus on LGBT.

If you are a heterosexual, I do not become 'outraged' over your wedding ring. Your photo's of your spouse. Brining them to company events, etc.

I just hope you act gay around my children. (Note: Sarcasm)

Orientation is omitted by various sources. Your FB page, anyplace you volunteer, etc.

Kalindra is correct. This letter does not present any facts.

Here, allow me:

'Study: Gay Men Offered Fewer Job Interviews' - By Winston Gieseke - The Advocate - 10/04/11

'According to a study published today in the American Journal of Sociology, men whose resumes indicate that they’re gay are 40% less likely to be called in for job interviews, especially in the south or Midwest.' – article

Pagan
Salt Lake City, UT

'This goes over the line of public decency and puts our community at risk for abuse.' - Letter.

You cannot claim you want to keep a community 'safe', while, attacking said community.

My examples are:

'Safety of gay people topic of Salt Lake discussion' - By Jennifer Dobner - AP - Published by DSNews - 07/14/10

'The high-profile incidents — from the 2008 beating of a South Salt Lake man in his home by angry neighbors, to an alleged April assault of two men at a Salt Lake City pub, and reaction when a gay couple kissed on the Mormon church's Main Street Plaza in 2009 — has left many in the gay community feeling vulnerable, center Executive Director Valerie Larabee said.' - Article

Pagan
Salt Lake City, UT

'What happens to them when a person decides to abuse this law?' - Letter.

Let's look to our Republican leadership…

'Republican Debate Audience Boos Gay Soldier Stephen Hill After DADT Repeal Question' - By Jason Linkins - Huffington Post - 09/23/11

**Gays GREATEST THREAT TO AMERICA, Buttars says' - By Aaron Falk - DSnews - 02/19/09

I see no reason to support a political party that not only refuses to take action against, clear and evident discrimination to LGBT Americans…

but seems to actually participate, in it.

Buttars election in 2000, 2004 and 2008. on a Republican ticket, in Utah.

Contrariusier
mid-state, TN

Unfortunately, Utah does NOT have statewide anti-discrimination laws -- even though the LDS church has supported such legislation in the past.

Currently there is no Federal or statewide Utah law which bans discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation.

In states that do not have anti-gay discrimination laws, a man can literally be fired for simply saying "I'm going to the movies with my boyfriend".

Here's a few examples of how employment discrimination affects people across the country:

college soccer coach in Nashville -- fired in 2010 after she told her team that her female partner was pregnant.

legislative editor of the Georgia General Assembly -- fired in 2005 when she told her boss that she was transsexual and was going to begin dressing/presenting as a woman.

professor in Wisconsin -- offered a job as a university dean in 2010. When that university found out she was a lesbian, the offer was rescinded.

schoolteacher in Minnesota -- she was fired in 2013 after acknowledging that she's a lesbian.

This is a real problem that affects real people. Let's skip the hyperbole and fear-mongering and work towards equal protection for ALL citizens.

RanchHand
Huntsville, UT

" Utah has non-discrimination laws for the workplace and housing for the LGBT community; no other laws are necessary. "

---

Next time you write a letter to the Editor, Carie, perhaps you should ascertain your facts first. The fact is that Utah DOES NOT have a workplace and housing non-discrimination law for LGBT people. Some communities have passed such ordinances, but Utah has not. Factually, Utah legislators considered passing a law PREVENTING communities from passing non-discrimination laws for LGBT people.

As for transgendered people using facilities appropriate for their gender identity, I'm all for it.

Bigotry is never righteous.

E Sam
Provo, UT

Since this writer clearly sees the necessity of non-discrimination laws, let's rally round! Such laws have, apparently, one strong supporter.

casual observer
Salt Lake City, UT

Are there documented cases in Utah where GLBT individuals have sought legal protection against discrimination and been denied?

Contrariusier
mid-state, TN

@casual observer --

"Are there documented cases in Utah where GLBT individuals have sought legal protection against discrimination and been denied?"

IIRC there were some specific cases mentioned in a DN article a few months ago, when the SLC anti-discrimination law was being debated. But you'd have to go looking for em.

Keep in mind that most cases of discrimination, of any kind, are never reported to either the law or the media.

QuercusQate
Wasatch Co., UT

My partner and I were both fired from our respective jobs when a rumor went around our small Utah town that we were lesbians. In fact, my partner's boss, a stake president, even told her she had to move out from our home in order to keep her job, so she found a separate residence. Even so, someone in town reported they had seen my vehicle at her place one evening (I was helping with the move), so she was fired. A couple of weeks later, I was told in an email that my services were no longer required--no reason given. My boss, for whom I had collegially worked for three years, was a friend of the stake president.

I personally know of several similar instances here in Utah, and you can look on the Equality Utah website to see photos and stories of many others. Contrary to popular opinion, you don't even need to be gay to be fired; people just need to think you're gay. In most of Utah, where there are no non-discrimination protections, gays are completely vulnerable to employers' ill will, bigotry and ignorance.

Samson01
S. Jordan, UT

The agenda crowd is in full force here. The comments are all about something other than the author's point. That is that the proposed legislation has potential for abuse. Anyone with any amount of objectivity can see that the writer has a valid point.

spring street
SALT LAKE CITY, UT

@ Samson01: Everything has the potential for abuse. That is not a valid reason for denying equal protection of the law.

To address the author's other point of how do you know - you don't. If an individual looks, acts, and dresses like a woman, she should use women's restrooms and locker rooms. If an individual looks, acts, and dresses like a man, he should use the men's restrooms and locker rooms. And for those who are not easily identifiable as one or the other, they should continue to do what they do now and use whichever one is most comfortable for them.

Will this prevent abuse? No - but neither does the current system.

Lagomorph
Salt Lake City, UT

As others have pointed out, the letter is full of factual inaccuracies, not the least is that Utah does NOT now have a statewide nondiscrimination law.

With the Senate's recent passage of ENDA and November being Transgender Awareness Month, transgender issues have made their way into this paper and the comment forum the past few weeks. This letter echoes a recurring theme in the comment threads, that a non-trans person would fraudulently cross-dress to gain access to opposite sex restrooms and locker rooms for nefarious purposes. This fear is presented as an inevitable outcome. Even though many states (not Utah) and municipalities have had nondiscrimination laws for years, actual examples are never provided. If it is a valid concern, surely there must be a wealth of cases to substantiate the claim. Let's see some actual evidence instead of just fearful speculation.

There are protections to prevent such abuses. The writer's claim notwithstanding, there are legal designations of gender-- court orders, drivers licenses, passports, etc. Gender reassignment requires a battery of tests and professional medical involvement. It is straightforward to establish who is legitimate and who is faking.

RFLASH
Salt Lake City, UT

Just more excuses to allow people to discriminate. As mentioned before, there are things people need to do to become recognized as a transgendered person, such as changing their driver's license. As for abusing this law, come on, anybody that has bad intentions will do it anyway! I do not think you will see people trying that kind of stunt. They would have done it by now! How many straight men do you think would do something like that! Give me a break! Meanwhile, you say it is ok for people to do whatever they want to discriminate. I lost my job for being gay. I wasn't even out! I was active in the LDS Church! " I have a problem with your personality" is how it was put! I have also had all the windows in my car smashed out. You should have that happen to you so you can understand what it feels like! People make up anything as an excuse, and their demented ideas come from their own warped minds. Who are the ones with their heads in the gutter?

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