Sure, you'll also get some fine engineers out of BYU or Wright State
University, but wouldn't most future engineers prefer the world-class
education and experience of MIT? Same with preparing for the NBA. Great talent
will rise to the top no matter where they go, but if you want the best near-NBA
level basketball education and experience, you go to North Carolina, Duke, or a
very select few others.
Flawed and inverted logic about OSU. Ohio State has more people in the NBA
because of the players they recruit. Andrew Bogut made Utah a great team. Utah
did not make Bogut a 1st round pick out of an average recruit. Tell Danny Ainge
or Damian Lilliard that their collegiate choices inhibited them. New Mexico and
San Diego St have great players in the NBA. Add in the tangible benefits from
being a student at BYU and Dastrup made the better choice.
Maybe all we need to do, is chill out, and enjoy ourselves a nice hot pocket.
Many who have to make big decisions have the experience of finding out that
their first decision was wrong. Kudos to him for being strong enough and humble
enough to to make it right. You always look like a great coach if
you have great players. But I think some coaches are overlooked who take good
players and help them become great. Jimmer and Tyler Haws thrived largely
because the coaches installed systems that maximize their talents -isn't
that what good coaching is all about?
When I first came to this thread, I saw a great comment by Chris B. Then I read
some of the BYU responses to it how you take it out of context or make
assumptions. Come on guys. I actually was very impressed with what Chris B had
to say and agree with his post. Coaches at Duke and other excellent basketball
schools do get more NBA exposure. That's just how it is. That's not to
say BYU doesn't, it's just the bias in the media, the NBA, the east
coast, etc. Chris B, please don't let these BYU "fans"
with their "the world is out to get us" mentality detract you. I firmly
believe that a united BYU/UofU is the best for Utah. I didn't like calling
out Utah fans when Sun Devils won. I did it because of all the antagonistic
posts from Utah fans. I was wrong to do that. I pledge not antagonize Utah fans,
and encourage everyone to pledge the same thing. If we want Utah on the map, we
need to keep it civil and cheer each other on (except when we play each other)
everyone needs to leave chris alone. I liked his comment, something I have
never done. I agree, the BYU fans are spinning things. Both coaches are good.
BYU has the potential to be a very scary team in the next few years.Way to go Chris B. Lets make an article that has absolutely nothing to do with
the utes-- about the utes. The utes will continue to struggle with winning games
against BYU for years to come.
It's funny how what Majerus accomplished in the WAC and MWC is now
considered by our arrogant little friends on the hill to be totally impossible
for any program not wearing a "power conference" logo on their
jerseys.According to their logic, if Van Horn, Miller, and Bogut had
really been serious about playing in the NBA, none of them would have even
considered playing for a mid-major school like Utah.
jpc53I'm sure all BYU fans are very aware of the fact that the
2014 recruiting class will all be back together to begin the 2016-17 season.
ucu"So what you are saying is that the Jimmer was over-hyped and
his numbers inflated?"Nope! Rose was savvy enough to
give Jimmer the freedom to allow him to become THE most exciting college
basketball player in the country, sweeping EVERY major national award in the
process.NOBODY accomplishes that simply by being over-hyped and the
beat-down Jimmer laid on U in his final game in the HC is proof that his numbers
@utahcountyuteHave you forgotten two of the greatest hallmark games
by a single player (Jimmer) against Utah and Arizona...both on the road. Sure,
he was over-hyped and had inflated numbers...wow.Get past the inane
rivalry garbage and give some credit where it is due.Great get
BYU...looking forward to this and many more exciting seasons.
Hey Chris B, look at Damien Lillard. He played for Weber State and is doing
very well in the NBA. Also, the guard who plays for Golden State; I think he
played for Davidson, a very small school. Size of school or what conference they
play in matters very little. There is plenty of parity in college hoops as
teams are smaller. Butler and VCU went to the final four recently.
To all the BYU fans talking about the 2016 team I think you are a year off. If
the 2014 recruiting class all go on missions right away as they say they will it
will be the 2016-2017 team that will have all these players.
tators,I apologize. It was Skywalker who said that:"To imply that simply playing for Ohio State is some sort of guarantee for
NBA success is a stretch."
"Chris B Salt Lake City, UTBig pickup for BYU. The other newspaper is saying this:"When he committed to
Thad Matta of Ohio State on Thursday, Dastrup said it was because he believed
playing there gave him the best chance to make it to the NBA"For
some people, the "byu experience" is just more important. Certainly
nothing wrong with that. To each their own. Crazy to think he wont
be playing in Provo for 3 years. BYU certainly has had some great
recruiting classes lately, but I think Utah is improving as well. Both Brekkot
Chapman and Jordan Loveridge were wanted big time by BYU and signed with Utah.
As bad as Utah has been lately, I think there will be evenly matched games in
the coming years."Why so few of these types of posts? More
@IndeMak:Big fish in a small pond.Worked well for
Gonzaga.MWC has had some small fish grow into big fish.I'm ok with the WCC.
2013 Y team against Stanford... Reminded me of team Ainge led to Great 8! They
ran on Princeton, UCLA like that. I'm excited about this years team.
A nice pick up for the cougs.TatorsCome and talk SOS
about half way through conference play. SOS means nothing right now.TalkinSo what you are saying is that the Jimmer was over-hyped and
his numbers inflated? I agree.
Chris B"I am saying that coaching and competition CAN and DOES
impact one's development. And YES, one's development will impact their
chances at success in the NBA. I don't think its crazy to say that better
coaches will develop players better."Most fans would agree."I think Thad Matta is a better coach."That's
your opinion. Given the talent pool and resources that Dave Rose has
had to work with at BYU, do you have any evidence that Thad Matta would have
been more successful? Would "Jimmermania" have happened if Matta had
been coaching BYU? Don't forget, BYU was on the cusp of securing a #1 seed
heading into the NCAA tournament, before Davies was suspended. Would Matta have
gotten that BYU team to the Sweet 16, and within a close OT loss of the Elite
Eight, after losing his best big man just before the conference tournaments
began?btw, Matta was a two-year starter for Butler after
transferring from Southern Illinois as a sophomore. Hundreds of great coaches
and players don't have an "elite program" pedigree, yet
they're somehow able to coach and perform at an elite level when given the
Ohio State has sent more players to the NBA than BYU because they have had more
talented players come into the program over the years.Personally I
think very good players have a better shot at the NBA with a very good program
like BYU than with an elite program.If Jimmer would have played at
Syracuse, Kansas or Duke there is no way he would have put up 30 points a game
his senior year. There were too many other great players on the team who would
have also demanded the ball. He would have averaged maybe 15 and been just
another player and never player of the year, top 10 draft pick. But at BYU he
was larger than life.With that said, this has to be the best three
year recruiting period in the history of BYU. Great recruiting classes in 2012,
2013 and 2014.Sure Utah got Loveridge and Chapman, who are / will be
very good, but BYU already has 2 players on the team of that caliber (Haws and
Collinsworth) and about 8 more players in the pipeline of that caliber. There
is no comparison.
I actually found something to which Chris B has written that I can agree is
correct. Both on BYU's future and on UTAH's pick-ups.
@ Chrisopher B:You implied that Solomon Levi and I each said
that: "He will for sure go to the NBA if he had picked Ohio State and
he for sure will not go to the NBA since he picked byu."I looked
back through each statement that Solomon Levi and I have posted on this article.
None of them even remotely stated such a thing. Now look who appears
to be making things up. Perhaps you're reading things into
other people's comments in the same way you claim others are reading into
yours. Misunderstandings happen.
With regard to getting to the NBA from a "name" school:Jazz
1998 starters:Stockton GonzagaHornacek Iowa StateRussell Long
Beach StateMalone Louisiana TechOstertag KansasBulls
ArkansasRodmanSoutheastern Oklahoma StateLongleyNew MexicoIf anything, I think this indicates it really is more about talent than where
one went to school. One could even make the argument in many cases involving
less than the biggest high school stars that going to the big-name schools
hinders one's chances to make it to the NBA. Would any of the Jazz's
players other than Ostertag--who got to Kansas solely because he was
7'2" and could block shots--have developed sufficiently if competing
for playing time at big-time schools? Would Pippen or Rodman have gotten
noticed sitting on the bench in the ACC? One may bash Jimmer all one wants, but
does he become player of the year competing for playing time at Syracuse? And
Jimmer may yet succeed if he gets into a better situation; few would argue that
Stockton would have had the same success on most other teams in the league.
@ caleb in new york and Ken:Both of you are making some wrong
assumptions. First of all, almost all ranked and powerhouse programs play more
than 4 patsy teams outside of conference games a year. Check any of their
schedules and see for yourselves. Also, concerning the PAC 12 teams,
only Oregon has a strength of schedule (SOS) stronger than BYU's. According to the latest USA Today Sagarin SOS rankings from 351 teams: Oregon #28 BYU #102 Stanford #136 Colorado
#164 UCLA #198 Arizona #229 California #244
Washington #247 Harvard #268 Washington State #270 Arizona
State #291 Oregon State #296 Utah (no games played yet)Of the current nationally top 10 ranked teams, only Duke has a stronger SOS
than BYU's. And only 4 teams total in the top 25 have stronger rated
schedules than BYU's.So yes, I think BYU's schedule is
overall very competitive and comparatively attractive to most recruits. The
facts (rather than personal opinions) speak for themselves.
Ted H.: Have you noticed that the *entire* WCC is undefeated, so far? 17-0! And
those aren't exhibition games. Our conference schedule is NOT bad.
@kenHow was what i said disrespectful.I mentioned no name no lol
just stated facts about basketball recruiting.
This is awesome news. Good choice, Dalstrup. You won't regret it.@KenAfter all your disrespectful posts, don't preach to us
about hypocrisy.It is that snotty attitude and overt generalizations that
so many people don't like about Utah and their "fans."
People Chris is making some good pointslets support the truth his comments
and hopefully all these boards become a much more enjoyable place.Have a
@ Chris B:It's so much what you said as what seemed to be
insinuated... and how it came across. Knowing your history as an ardent anti-BYU
guy didn't help. If you really didn't intend anything
negative, then I apologise for reading that into your statement and will let it
go at that.
I hope we keep up the AZ connection.
Solomon Levi and Tators,You byu fans are still making it out to be
like I'm saying "He will for sure go to the NBA if he had picked Ohio
State and he for sure will not go to the NBA since he picked byu"I've never said that. Never have, never will.But YES, I am
saying that coaching and competition CAN and DOES impact one's development.
And YES, one's development will impact their chances at success in the
NBA. I don't think its crazy to say that better coaches will develop
players better. I think Thad Matta is a better coach. Now LISTEN,
did I say Coach Rose is a bad coach? Did I say he wont go to the NBA?You guys are still spinning everything I'm saying. There is some give and
take in college decisions. He wanted to go to BYU, but he thought Ohio State
was better for NBA potential. No, I've never said he wont go to the NBA or
has given that up. Dastrup HIMSELF is the one who made the comment -
take it up with him.
I think skywalker made some legitimate points about players from "smaller
programs" being drafted into the NBA. While it is obvious that the Big Ten
is a first rate league and plays against tough competition, there is the
consideration of actual playing time. Sometimes, being the bigger fish in a
smaller pond, allows a player to develop skills and confidence that you
don't get with limited playing time. The chances of Dastrup being a major
player at BYU are probably greater than at Ohio State. It's one thing to be
a good practice player, but more difficult to be successful in an actual game.
IndeMack"BYU will be loaded for a while."BYU
will be loaded for a long time - Dastrup and company won't play their
senior seasons until 2019-20 and there will be many, many high quality recruits
following after them."Big 10 vs. WCC?"Kansas vs. Cal
Poly Tech?"You're obviously confused; Kansas is in the Big
12 and Utah is more likely to play Cal Poly Tech than is BYU.
Glad to have you on board Dastrup! Great school, great program, great chances
Chris B... your 2nd comment at 1:20 did read like you were insinuating that
playing at Ohio State would improve Dastrup's chances of playing in the NBA
and would be partly because of superior coaching. I can understand why some
readers could take that as somewhat of a putdown to Dave Rose. As
another comment said, the first pick in last year's draft came from the
Mountain West conference, and not a power-house conference. That strongly
indicates that individual skills and abilities are the primary consideration in
NBA choices, rather than primarily the school you are playing for. However, it does help your chances of being noticed by scouts if playing for a
decent, respectible program, which BYU undoubtedly is. And their affiliation
with ESPN helps. They played to a national audience on ESPN2 Monday night. Latest USA Today Sagarin NCAA basketball rankings: Ohio
State #5 with a SOS rating of 221 (out of 351 schools). BYU #31 with a
SOS rating of 102 (119 places better than OSU). Utah State #71 with a SOS
of 266. Utah #121 with no SOS rating (no games played yet).
@Ken Go read your post from 2:16 then get off your high horse about being so
Chris B"When he committed to Thad Matta of Ohio State on
Thursday, Dastrup said it was because he believed playing there gave him the
best chance to make it to the NBA"For some people, the "BYU
experience" is just more important. Certainly nothing wrong with that. To
each their own."-----------------The clear
implication from your comments is that Dastrup chose to compromise his chances
to play in the NBA in order to enjoy the "BYU experience".Kids say lots of things to justify their ultimate choice of school, but,
bottom line, if you were to ask Dastrup directly whether he chose the "BYU
experience" over the NBA, you'd get an emphatic "NO". The truth
is, he wants both and doesn't believe for a second that playing for BYU
will compromise his NBA aspirations.
Two strange things happened today. 1-BYU picked up a big-time recruit who
switched at the last moment in BYU's favor; 2-Chris B's comments seem
more reasonable than many of those posted here.What is going on?????
Rockwell - Dastrup is the one who said he would have a better chance of going to
the NBA if he went to Ohio State. That's simply a fact(that he said it).
But what does Dastrup know about basketball?
Bemsmart - I never said you only cheered for byu. Go check. I simply said its
hypocritical to say something in a disrespectful way in order to try and prove a
point about people being disrespectful. And having it be true doesn't
matter. Chris says a lot of things about BYU that are true.
"Dastrup... a four-star prospect by both scout.com and rivals.com... held
more than 30 offers, but narrowed his choices to BYU, Ohio State, Virginia and
Florida late in the process."Despite the jealous spin from a few
who obviously don't have a clue what they're talking about, Payton is
in line to have a very successful college career and excellent chance of playing
in the NBA regardless of whether he chose to play at BYU or Ohio State.
Dastrup committing to BYU is Huge! He is versatile enough to be on the floor
with Mika at the same time. Also,- Andrus is 6'10
not 6'8- BYU's schedule is a little harder than Utah's not
easier. I can't wait for BYU to take on a much improved Oregon and Utah
team and possibly go 3-0 on the road against pac-12 talent. But honestly no one
can argue that Utah has a stronger schedule than BYU when you look at the
schedules.-The WCC got off to a quick start by winning their first
15 games. Hopefully they keep it up.
KenI stated a truthful argument.it was accompanied by no lols
directed at individual fans.I stated no disrespect for anyone just showing
@ Ken.I don't only cheer for the cougars.Go check out Ute
@skywalker,Who implied that playing for Ohio State state is a
guarantee for NBA success?Here you byu fans continue making things
up left and right. Nothing even close to that was implied. The only thing
stated was the Ohio State and Thad Matta have done better at putting guys in the
NBA. That's a straight fact. No stretching needed. Unliked you, who is
stretching(to put it kindly) by suggesting anyone implied going to Ohio State
was a guarantee?Can you tell me where someone implied that? Or will you run away and cower now that you've been called out for
making things up?
Hmmm! Big 10 vs. WCC?Kansas vs. Cal Poly Tech?20,000 vs.
2,000?Top Competition every night vs. Community Colleges?Did
he make the right decision?It was his so I suppose he did. He
obviously didn't go to BYU to play basketball. BYU will be
loaded for a while. They will again be big fishes in a small pond for hoops.
Glory days are back. Whoop, whoop!
Thad Matta is a great coach, but so is Dave Rose. To imply that
simply playing for Ohio State is some sort of guarantee for NBA success is a
stretch.First player selected in the 2013 NBA draft was from UNLV,
coached by Dave Rice, Dave Rose's former assistant.Players from
UNLV, Lehigh, Gonzaga, New Mexico, Colorado, Murray St, Detroit, North Texas, So
Dakota St, San Diego St, Providence, Bucknell, Long Beach St, and Colorado St
were all selected before the only Ohio State player drafted, Deshaun Thomas,
late in the 2nd round. He's now playing in Europe.Brandon Davis
was undrafted, but he made an NBA roster and is now playing for the 76ers.Quite obviously, skill, rather than playing for a big name program, is
the most important requirement for NBA success.
@ Kenno I was using an example of something some other poster used to
berate another fan base.I don't feel that way at all I cheer for all
Utah schools it would just be nice for some mutual respect
TruthMachine, If we didn't have the challenge to stomach teams nationally
we would have told the Pac 12 no thanks and joined the WCC.
Chris B started off with an unusual show of generosity. Let's not spoil it
by letting this devolve into the usual rivalry rant. This decision is going to
elevate the level of basketball most of us are going to be watching in coming
years. Let's hope it continues an upward trend for both teams. The more
competitive they are the better!
@TruthMachine,"How impressed do you think Utah's recruits
are going to be when they see Utah playing home games against the likes of
Evergreen State" The question was whether BYU or Ohio State was
better(or equal) good places for the BEST CHANCE to go to the NBA. It
wasn't how impressed potential recruits were about opponents. Try to keep
up, it wasn't that difficult of a conversation. Where did you get lost?
But since you didn't understand the flow of the conversation,
lets now move to yours. I think that recruits yes are very interested in
playing Arizona, Oregon, UCLA, Colorado year after year after year. And how
interested are your recruits in playing Portland, Santa Clara, and Pacific for
the WCC title?
The level of competition in the WCC is substantially inferior in the WCC than in
the Big-10, and that is why playing at Ohio St. might have improved
Dastrup's chances of preparing himself for the pros.With the
types of recruiting classes BYU has coming in, they need to upgrade their
non-conference schedule even more. This years non-conf. schedule is pretty
good, but still have too many patsies (4) on it. Of course that is assuming BYU
doesn't receive any update to switch and update its conference. With the large number of in-conference over 100 RPI games that the WCC
provides, BYU should schedule at least a quality mid-major team for every single
non-conference game (and at most playing top 15 teams, even if on the road).
Then when you add in Gonzaga and St. Mary's then BYU's schedule would
start to come closer to the schedules of the upper echelon teams.
TruthMachine - I'm a BYU fan but that's not what Chris said. And I
happen to agree with Chris on this one. Thad Matta and Ohio State have a better
track record of putting guys in the NBA than byu. So yes, it can and does make
a big difference. And seriously, stop with the bragging about out
of conference schedule. I believe that Utah's strength of schedule is
STRONGER than byu's. We only look foolish by only talking about out of
conference. Let's not be cherry pickers in the conversation. If
we're going to brag about our good out of conference, lets also include how
bad our conference schedule is. And yes, its bad.
Truth Machine,Here you byu fans go making things up again.When did I say or even hint that Dave Rose is a bad coach?????????By saying that Thad Matta is a better coach is not even close to saying Dave
Rose is a "bad coach"You guys really need to start reading
and understanding what is written, instead of making things up.So in
your mind every coach in the nation is either a bad coach or a good coach and
every good coach is "good" to the same degree?Is that what
Huuuuuge get!!! Goodnight, Rose is putting together a monster team for future
years. Gonna be fun, heck just reading utes trying to spin this in a negative
light is comedy at its best!!
Well lets compare a humble argument to a non-humble argument"Big
pickup for BYU"BYU2014 3.5 stars avg2013 3.4 stars avg.Utah2014 3.33 stars avg.2013 2.20 stars avg.Maybe that is why we have beaten U 7 straight times.7-0a similar
thing has been posted on Football articles many times.Recruiting more
talent does matter.Lets just all respect one another makes life a lot
Chris BYou're really trying to make the case that Dave Rose is
a "bad" coach???As far as level of competition is concerned,
How impressed do you think Utah's recruits are going to be when
they see Utah playing home games against the likes of Evergreen State and Grand
Canyon for the first half the season, while BYU is playing Stanford, Iowa State,
Texas, U Mass, Oregon, and possibly Wichita State, as well as all of the
in-state schools - Utah, Utah State and Weber State (which the Utes are afraid
to play)?True, Utah plays in a stronger overall conference, but the
Utes don't seem to have the stomach to challenge any decent teams
@BlueCoug - and maybe, just maybe add Jabari Parker.Why, Lola
(Jabari mother) might work with him to go on a mission and tranfer to BYU. Would
that be something. But, who knows what is in his mind which it is up to him. He
is a good kid and wish him well.Dayton Dastrup, welcome aboard and
good luck on your mission.Go Cougars!
@ Chirs BWow, great comment, i too have much respect for you. You
gave props to the Cougars and didn't beat your chest talking about your
great BCS or PAC 12 membership. To be honest, if you had more civil
dialogue like this i may start cheering for U of U sports again, humility goes a
BlueCoug,You couldn't be more wrong. Coaching, as well as the
level of competition he would face in one of the best(if not the best)
conferences in the nation, can absolutely impact how much he develops in the
coming years. And yes, that impacts his success in the NBA.
Can't help but think that he was watching the BYU v Stanford game and
realized that a) Rose has put together a great system with talented players and
they're running it well, b) BYU was playing on a national stage and Haws,
Carlino and Mika were getting heaped with praise by Seth Greenberg & co.,
and c) this is a team that is playing hard, should crack the top-25 soon, and
seem to have great cohisiveness and chemistry, thus coming to the conclusion
that he CAN get national (and NBA) exposure and recognition at BYU while also
enjoying the "BYU experience". Good for Payton. 2016 seems a long ways
BYU Recruiting Classes2014**** Payton Dastrup - C (6-10)**** T.J. Haws - PG (6-3) *** Jake Toolson - SF (6-5) *** Dalton
Nixon - SF (6-7)-NR- Ryan Andrus - PF (6-8)2013**** Eric
Mika - C (6-8)**** Nick Emery - SG (6-2) *** Luke Worthington - C
(6-8) *** Braiden Shaw - PF (6-8) ** Jakob Hartsock - PF (6-7)BYU's 2016 team will be poised to make some serious noise in the
Big Dance.The 2013 BYU team may be pretty good as well.
Nice pick Y. I watched Parker play last night and he is awesome. That game
against Kansas is why he went to Duke. he'll only get better playing teams
at that level. Hopefully by the time Dastrup gets back the Y will have
scheduled teams at that level.
I second Chris B's comment. Good pick-up. Can't wait to
see BYU in 3-4 years.
Chris BThe truth is, Payton Dastrup has just as much chance of
making it in the NBA after playing for BYU, as he would playing for Ohio St.BYU's 2016 team is going to be AWESOME: Nick Emery, Cory Calvert,
Jordan Chatman, TJ Haws, Frank Bartley, Jake Toolson, Luke Worthington, Eric
Mica, Isaac Nielson, Jakob Hartsock, Braiden Shaw, Dalton Nixon, and Payton
Chris BI too think there is going to be good future matchups between
BYU and Utah. I'm encouraged by the improvement of Utah and the continued
success of BYU in the hoops. Good luck to both teams going forward.
@chris BWow, a civil, level headed comment. Respect! I agree this is a
big get for Byu and utah is on the up and up. should be a good game this year
and the coming years!Go Cougs!
Great choice, young Dastrup. Have a great mission. We'll see you in a
couple of years. Go Cougs!
So glad to hear. For what my opinion is worth (and I realize it might not be
much), I felt Payton was a better fit with BYU from the start, and I'm very
happy he will be helping to make BYU a better team rather than Ohio State. BYU
likely would have been very, very good without him; with him, I think they
ascend into "fantastic" territory.
congrats to dastrup and the cougs
Big pickup for BYU. The other newspaper is saying this:"When he committed to Thad Matta of Ohio State on Thursday, Dastrup said
it was because he believed playing there gave him the best chance to make it to
the NBA"For some people, the "byu experience" is just
more important. Certainly nothing wrong with that. To each their own. Crazy to think he wont be playing in Provo for 3 years. BYU
certainly has had some great recruiting classes lately, but I think Utah is
improving as well. Both Brekkot Chapman and Jordan Loveridge were wanted big
time by BYU and signed with Utah. As bad as Utah has been lately, I think there
will be evenly matched games in the coming years.
BYU's 2014 recruiting class is loaded! Coach Rose is going to have an
awesome team when all of these young men are back from their missions in 2016.