I am sorry for the behavior of a fellow saints, Harry Reid and Bro. Huntsman.
Politics are obviously a high priority with integrity being a low priority for
this political behavior. That is the difference of telling the truth and
playing the game. It's not what is right or wrong with these individuals,
it's what they do to win. They will get their rewards from others who play
that game. As for me, they are the loser's.
Reid is a despicable partisan who always sides with his party when push comes to
shove. I am sick of him.
Did it ever come to the authors of this book that Reid was lying? It certainly
did to mine...
@A Guy With A Brain;It was Romney himself who made him look like a
"tax cheat" (your words); not Reid. Romney refused to release his taxes
when ALL other candidates had released theirs. The inference is clear: "I
have something to hide".
Google Bloomberg Romney Taxes.Romney has been paying "near
zero" taxes for years through charitable loopholes related to making
donations to the LDS church. "Renting your favorite charity's tax
exempt status" as the article calls it.Bloomberg released the
story DAYS before the election. And it was buried by the stories about how the
media and pollsters were catastrophically wrong about their predictions that
Romney would win the election by a landslide.Remember when Reid said
he had a reliable source with regards to that claim? Well, turns out the source
was, in fact, reliable.I think it's time we begin taking tax
exempt status away from churches, on that note. And then we can also start
making the IRS look into the countless charities set up for tax evasion, as well
as the bazillion PACs set up as non-profits.
Per the IRS those in Romney's shoes making less than $100,000 don't
have an effective tax rate more than his: (And if they had qualifying dividend
income, it would be even less)Income$50,000 IRA($5,000)Standard Deduction($11,900)Exemptions($7,600)Taxable income$25,500
Tax $2,955 Effective tax rate5.9%Income$100,000 IRA($5,000)Standard Deduction($11,900)Exemptions($7,600)Taxable income$75,500 Tax $10,935 Effective tax rate10.9%
After all the good both Jon Huntsman, Sr.and/or Mitt Romney have done in their
lives, I find it incredulous that anyone would believe Harry Reid's
politically motivated comments or that of a "tell-all" book that either
would risk their reputations for so little to gain in return.With
Reid and those like him, you only have to consider the source to understand.
With the writer(s) of the book, you only have to consider that earning money
though its sale, is the primary objective.
Article quote: "He (Romney) didn't pay taxes for 10 years!" Reid
said in the interview. "Now, do I know that that's true? Well, I'm
not certain."So, at first Reid said, without even the slightest
hesitation, that Romney did NOT pay his taxes and then immediately after that
essentially says he does not know if that's true.By his own
words and actions, Reid has proven to be a manipulative liar.Reid,
more than any other single person, planted the idea in the minds of the American
people that Mitt Romney was a tax cheat, which was a bold-faced lie that
Romney's tax returns, and the tax firm that prepared them, absolutely
proved false.Romney displayed the greatest of poise and restraint
during the election. I could not have done that. Not even close. Romney is a
hundred times the man that Harry Reid is.When Reid dies he's
going to answer to a higher power for his lies, manipulation and deceit. It will
not be pleasant experience for Harry Reid.
@skeptic and rlsintxThank you for your comments.Sage
advice, in a willing wilderness of political partisanship.
People get silly in these discussions.If someone really has proof of
tax misconduct they should go straight to the IRS with it and collect the bounty
money for reporting it. (applies to anyone in the country). If the
IRS has audited someone, found non-compliance with the code and the individual
not made it right, they'd be paying penalties or doing jail time, because
they don't let that stuff go for long. They crash down on your life and
accounts immediately.The effective tax rate bears little resemblance
to the tax bracket someone falls in. Even including payroll taxes, hardly anyone
in the country pays a combined rate of more than 22%, and that is a FACT
straight from the IRS themselves.If you think you're paying
more than 20% effective tax rate, get a better accountant because you're
very, very likely messing up and need to revisit your tax strategies.Have a good day, and don't fall for soundbite posts that are so fatally
flawed they reek of total ignorance whereof they speak.
Harry Reid is one of the biggest reasons that people view Washington with the
greatest disdain and dislike. And Nevada re-elected him. Charlie Rangel and
many other such politicians were also re-elected, on both sides of the aisle.
This would be a good time to oust them all. But America doesn't do that.
It's tough to figure, but it's also how we got 4 more years of Obama
It is entertaining but sad to follow how citizens defend their favorite
politician or berate the opposition without stopping to realize they all are
crooked politicians, it is just a matter of degree. Washington belongs to Wall
Street. Government needs to be reformed and venal career politicians replaced
with limited term public serving patriots .
A1994Centerville, UTWell, we KNOW the Obama IRS was/is targeting
anyone who is against the Price of Pennsylvania Avenue. So does anyone believe
they weren't targeting Mitt Romney? If Romney hadn't paid his taxes
for 10 years, you can be sure it would have been aired for the entire nation to
see.And YOU can be sure that if Romney had released tax returns the
way his father did (assuming they showed no fishy stuff) and he and Ann had both
not acted like royalty who were above the majority of Americans, that he would
Imagine a world without having to hear about Huntsman's, Reid's,
Romney's, and Obama every day. What a wonderful world it would be!
Wow, Mormons can be vicious to their own when they aren't the correct
Not to name names, but some of you liberals need to learn how marginal tax rates
work, as well as how the federal income tax works in general. I could go in to a
long explanation about how it works, but please at least learn the difference
between marginal tax rate and effective tax rate. If you are smart
enough to google and find the marginal tax rate table, you should be smart
enough to google how to calculate an effective tax rate and how individual
federal income taxes are calculated. Spoiler: comparing a 15% or 25% marginal
tax rate to Romney's effective tax rate is ridiculous.If you
are mad that Mitt and other people who are more successful than you can dream to
ever be paid a lower effective tax rate than your marginal tax rate, first of
all learn the difference between effective and marginal tax rate. If you are
still mad about it, be mad at the US Tax Code, the IRS, and Congress. Don't
be mad at the hard working successful people who don't pay more taxes than
they are legally liable to pay.
Harry Reid tutoring Mitt Romney on "True Character" would be like Molly
Putts explaining the correct way of shooting a basketball to Michael Jordan.
Harry is actively and aggressively showing us all what not to do as The Senate
Majority Leader. CHARACTER: Moral Excellence. 1.) MORAL: Virtuous, Noble,
Righteous, Ethical, Principled. 2.) EXCELLENCE: Virtue. Harry,....Mitt Romney
and family are all about CHARACTER. You ought to try it out for size sometime.
Well, we KNOW the Obama IRS was/is targeting anyone who is against the Price of
Pennsylvania Avenue. So does anyone believe they weren't targeting Mitt
Romney? If Romney hadn't paid his taxes for 10 years, you can be sure it
would have been aired for the entire nation to see.
... Totally agree!!!
The headlines is confusing, after reading the article
Romney only released 2 yrs of tax returns.The Romney campaign
released what it says are the effective tax rates Romney paid for the past two
decades. His effective tax rate was calculated based on his Adjusted Gross
Income. The Romney campaign is reporting the percentage of Romney's AGI
that he paid to the government, explains Brian Galle, an associate professor at
Boston College Law School who is an expert on individual and corporate income
tax. AGI is the number you get after you take certain, limited deductions. The
most relevant of these deductions for Romney are losses from the sale or
exchange of property. That could include stock or partnership interests in Bain
Capital and associated companies that were sold at a loss. The Romney campaign
is disclosing the percentage of tax he paid "on the amount he got after he
subtracted out all those losses," which could have been very substantial,
Galle says perhaps even enough to almost eliminate Romney's tax liability.
That means that although Romney paid at least something in previous years, it
could have been a very small amount. "He could have been paying 13.66% of
$100 in 2009. He might have paid $13.66,"
I've stopped defending Harry Reid. I used to say "Hi" to him every
day in the Halls of Congress. I didn't like his politics, but I thought he
was a decent man. The way he behaved during the 2012 campaign was so
despicable, that I can no longer have any respect for him. He lost his way a
long time ago. What else is there to say.
I don't believe anything that Harry Reid says. He hasn't told the
truth in 37 years. I am confident that Jon Huntsman ever said anything about
Romney's taxes.....that being said, I fully believe that his son, Huntsman
Jr. doesn't have the integrity of his father and would have certainly
revealed anything that could have helped him become a credible presidential
candidate. It's sad that the M.I.N.O. Reid never is confronted on the
bizarre things he claims. He's sick.
Reid is a politician. Do anything for party and get elected. Enough said!!
1-- Note that Reid say he was "told that". It is up to folks to remember
that Reid repeated it as hearsay, not fact. Not being a mind reader, I
can't tell more for sure.2- Will someone PLEASE recognize it
comes across to other Americans as disingenuous, at best, to keep stating, as
this does, and Mitt and Ann Romney repeatedly did, that donations to one's
church, particularly tithing required to maintain status, are "charitable
donations"?"Over that 20-year period, federal and state
taxes combined with charitable donations deducted represented 38.49 percent of
the Romney family's adjusted gross income"I think any
member of a church who is in politics ought to list donations to non-church
charities separately, so the rest of us can get an idea if you help out the rest
of the world, not just where you look good to your fellows.
"Cursed is he that putteth his trust in man, or maketh flesh his arm, or
shall hearken unto the precepts of men, save their precepts shall be given by
the power of the Holy Ghost." (2 Nephi 28:31)I guess I'd
be careful who you call evil. Politics is a dirty business and I'm sure
that there are "many who fall down and few who return to the sunlit
land" after serving in office. (Chronicles of Narnia, The Silver Chair)The point is that most Americans have become self-centered;
congratulating themselves over what they have achieved and judging those worse
off, for their poverty. The pride cycle is alive and well in America. We would
do well to get down on our knees, pray for forgiveness and for all of our
leaders and stop looking for answers in corruption. Government is
the people, so let's get back to the work of working together. Putting our
faith in the wealthy is just nonsense and neglects the gift of sacrifice that
all of our ancestors made to get away from monarchies. The Earth is the
Lord's and the government belongs to the people, not the 1%.
I don't think anything that Harry Reid has to say is the truth. This man
has sold his soul to Obama and the left-wing liberal democrats. Mr.
Reid's public behavior falls way short of being an example of a good LDS
church member. Frankly, I am ashamed of him. He will go down in history as
being on the wrong side of the issues of our day. The citizens of Nevada need
to step up and vote this guy out of office. Better yet, have him recalled for
not representing the views of the citizens of Nevada.
It's too bad that there are those who continue to dig pits for others to
fall into. In due time, those who continue along those pathways will fall into
those pits themselves.Read Proverbs 6:16-19 and see what the Lord
has to say.
I do not understand where Harry Reid is going with this foolish statement. Mitt
Romney is no longer running for president, and politicians like Mr Reid, just
want to draw attention away from their own. Brother Reid you should clean your
own house first, and as we tell our youth in the church. Remembe who you Are
Who cares?The majority of Americans voted Obama and against Mitt.
Mitt lost. Get over it
I hope we can start a legitimate movement to vote all incumbents out of office
and start over with strict term limits...so we can elect politicians who will go
to Washington to represent us and abide by the constitution...instead of using
all their time to cater to special interests for fundraising purposes. Get rid
of all of them!!!
Always disappointing when people, particularly elected leaders, are not honest
in their dealings with their fellow man. Reid's comments were completely
out of line by any standard. He should openly and publicly apologize to the
Romneys. It's never too late to do the right thing.
@grouchyoldman"For an independently wealthy man not to take all the
tax deductions that are available to him is like some poor smuck like me not
taking that home mortgage deduction. I'd like to hear from anyone,
including Mr. Reid and Mr. Huntsman, that they didn't take all of the
deductions to which they were entitled. "There's nothing
wrong with someone taking the deductions available to them (and likewise
there's nothing wrong with someone who wants tax rates to go up not
voluntarily paying more). We're just saying the system is wrong, and the
Ryan budget would've only made it worse (and Gingrich's would've
dropped Romney's tax burden to near 0% since he wanted to completely
eliminate capital gains which is where most of Romney's income comes from
as Romney pointedly noted in a primary debate).
Don't believe it where it comes to Mr. Huntsman Sr. However, Huntsman Jr.
is another story. I'd believe he'd do something underhanded and
dishonest like that. And Mr. Reid was wrong to say it on tv without proof.
So, we have one man who has made millions and given most of it away to
philanthropic causes to help others claiming he never said such a thing.And, we have another man who has made millions on shady deals and kept
it all to help himself, and made a career out or making unproven opportunistic
allegations against opposing politicians.Who is most likely to be
telling the truth?Even though the news media relentlessly repeated
Reid's wild and anonymous allegations, that does not make them true.I choose to believe Jon Huntsman, Sr. And, Mitt Romney, another guy who
has been extremely generous sharing his wealth, which he earned the hard way, by
honest work, not shady land deals.
Chris B - Uhm, I think you ought to read past the first paragraph if you're
going to cite a news article, plus you should know your tax brackets before
responding. According to your article and the Tax Policy Center, roughly 60% of
American families have incomes under $50K. The article goes on to note those
groups comprise the middle-class of America and a very quick search online
reveals that their federal tax rate is 15% (up to $36K) and then jumps up to
25%. If you call them "takers" (which is factually
incorrect) then Romney must be an outright crook for paying even less than they
do in federal taxes (his intentionally inflated 12%). Further, if
the middle-class that votes liberal and pays a higher effective percentage of
their income in taxes are "takers" in your mind, while tax evaders such
as Romney (ie Marriott's Son of Boss $220M fine) have legally been fined
for overseeing tax avoidance scandals, is the entire state of Utah not an
outright band of crooks given that your state is a net debtor in federal taxes
to the tune of over $20 billion dollars? Nearly every living American
conservative is a taker.
This is just another of the DN's bi-monthly articles about Mitt Romney. He
It would not surprise me one bit that Reid made all of it up to throw dirt
Romney's way. Not one thing the democratic party has done for more than a
decade is lie to get what they want. I'm sure he had to come up with
something so it would take focus off the fact that Obama wouldn't produce
his birth certificate.
Burden of proof is on Reid, not Romney. Reid made the claim, he better have
evidence to back up his claim. Simple as that.As the largest
accounting firm in the world, I think a letter from PwC is a pretty good source
of credibility to refute Reid's claim.Now, if you have a
problem with the fact that Romney had so many deductions, take your argument to
the IRS, not the guy who used the rules to his advantage. During one of the
last Republican Primary debates, Gingrich was all proud of the fact that he paid
such high taxes. If you can't figure out how to use the law to your
advantage, or can't figure out how to lower your tax liability, you
don't deserve to be in office because you don't have street smarts.
How am I supposed to trust a gov't leader who isn't economically
Nobody even understand the 180,000 pages in the tax code. The whole thing is a
scam.The government is getting fleeced by the crooked contractors
all day long. Medicare fraud is rampant. Americans are stealing from us all
every on almost every contract. The whole system stinks.We need
term limits to flush out all the underhanded deals and favors that are going on.
You can't stay in politics for long without making some stinky deal.
Let's limit the crooks with term limits.
Stewart, You should really take your own advice and study before commenting
again. The two lowest income groups as categorized by the New York Times are
those making under 30k, and those between 30k-45k. 63% of those under 30k voted
for barack. 57% of those in the 30-45k voted for barack. The majority of the
takers are those voting for barack.Again, time to study for you.
Ken - Technically, you are "wrong on so many levels" because
the majority of individuals you identified pay federal income taxes but tax
preferences (child credits or EIT) neutralize their taxes. A minority of
Americans (elderly/working poor) do not make enough to qualify to pay federal
taxes but they are not the bulk of your "47%". The dishonesty on
Romney's part is to 1) claim those 47% are liberal, and 2) claim they
don't understand a "low tax" policy. Re: 1 - there is ample
evidence that conservatives utilize tax breaks like child credits at a greater
rate than liberals and they also comprise a majority of low wage, elderly; and
re: 2 - these individuals pay little to no federal tax due to conservative low
tax policies (ie child credits). The lion's share of "takers" are
conservative. Further, from 1979-2009, the total average effective
federal tax rate has been between 22.7 and 17.4%. On average, the rest of us
pay a higher effective rate than Romney. Finally, you clearly
don't understand the way Bain Capital operates and how Romney used tax
payer dollars to fund key aspects of his ventures. Please study up before
I cannot think of a single politician that I like. Having said that, there are
some that are worse than others. I put Harry Reid in the top 1% of those that I
despise the most. Romney and Huntsman are on the other end of the spectrum. Of
course they are still politicians.
Old news. For an independently wealthy man not to take all the tax deductions
that are available to him is like some poor smuck like me not taking that home
mortgage deduction. I'd like to hear from anyone, including Mr. Reid and
Mr. Huntsman, that they didn't take all of the deductions to which they
were entitled. If you have a problem with this incident, attack the IRS NOT the
individual. Cheez, old news, old argument, same old response and problem.
Credibility, once lost is hard to regain, beware of what you speak.
The real culprit is the U.S. tax system, which allows very wealthy people to pay
a much lower percentage of their gross income than ordinary middle class
Americans who make much less. It's all backwards.
@mcdugal, Wrong on so many levels. Mitt was right that 47% of Americans pay 0
federal income tax. He pays more than 0% of his income. So unless you think
that the remaining 53% pay a higher rate than Romney, which isn't true
since many pay between 0%-12%, you're claim is false. Were you just
making that claim up? And besides, how much money he makes
doesn't matter. He should pay for the resources he uses. You should pay
for the resources you use. And I should pay for the resources I use. The fact
that Mitt is rich doesn't make the government suddenly more expensive to
run, make national defense more expensive, make other government expenses
increase. You and I use the government resources just as much as Mitt Romney.
Stop looking to others to pay for what you use.
As a member of the Church, I was embarrassed by both Reid and Romney during the
Reid is a crook and has always been. He's in politics, that's the way
If true it paints Huntsman in a poor light as a Republican who's son was
@Chris B - Romney never fully disclosed the entirety of his tax documents, in
fact there was a consensus by tax experts, given the disclosed, that Romney did
not utilize all of his deductions and left money on the table, which would
indicate his marginal tax rate was less than the ~12% he claimed. I don't
think he would have done this had he not hand political aspirations. Romney pays
more in taxes that a lot of Americans on the total amount paid but as a
percentage of income he pays considerably less than the majority of Americans.
The disclosure by Reid or whomever, had nearly zero impact on the Romney
Thank You President Huntsman, for being a man of honesty and integrity -
regardless of political party affiliations and any negative public opinion fall
What a foolish thing for Reid to say, perhaps the most foolish thing he's
ever said, and that's saying something.He really thought Mitt
didn't pay taxes for 10 years? And it wasn't caught by any of the IRS
checks, which are more stringent on the wealthy?He released his
taxes, and they showed he paid millions in taxes, every year.Mitt
Romney pays more in taxes than just about anyone in America. Frankly I'm
embarrassed there are lazy people out there who cry when they pay a few thousand
in taxes and Mitt Romney pays for his share and theirs with his millions in
taxes.And Reid's response when his tax returns were relased,
showing the millions he paid?Silence.Like a dog trying
to hide in the corner. What a dishonest attempt to impact the polls.
Did Reid honestly believe what he was saying? And I thought Mormons were
supposed to be honest?