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In our opinion: A de-Americanized world?

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  • LDS Liberal Farmington, UT
    Nov. 1, 2013 11:40 a.m.

    Why should the world want to be like America anymore?

    Extemeist want to kick out immigrants,
    Start Wars for economic reasons,
    Don't give a rip about the enviroment,
    Slash education,
    Over turn equal access to Healthcare,
    spit on the Unions and working Class,
    Worship WallStreet, and dispise MainStreet.

    We are no longer the bastion of hope and light for the wrold to admire,
    but a puppet Government being controlled by the money $ of special interest groups [Latter-Day Gadianton's]

  • The Taxman Los Angeles, CA
    Nov. 1, 2013 11:38 a.m.

    Unreconstructed Reb has outlined the real issue which is: "what jeopardizes the US position in the short term is the threat of default. The rest of the world cares little about our deficit, but world markets began bracing themselves for the impact of a potential default two weeks ago."
    "The dollar's position as the world's reserve currency provides powerful benefits for the US and its citizens. The national debt is a long term problem, one that will require a long term solution (the specifics of which can be debated elsewhere)."

    I can understand why the Republicans want to focus on the debt and the ACA. The stock market (which reflects investors economic expectations) is going through the roof and things are better than they were in January 2009 (when Obama took office). They have few real issues. But they are playing with fire when they endanger the US Dollar's position as the world's reserve currency. If you do not understand this, then please educate yourself. When you do understand the huge benefit the US enjoys by being able to print the world's reserve currency, you will be mortified by Republican tactics.

  • glendenbg Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 1, 2013 11:38 a.m.

    @Ultra Bob - I disagree that the American experiment has failed and is coming to an end.

    What is coming to an end is American Empire. America's empire is a huge burden on our nation. Our military budget is 4 times the amount of the next largest (China). Iraq cost something like $3 trillion and thousands of lives lost and thouands of soldiers wounded. We exhaust our human and financial resources through our empire. In return we get very little - we aren't any safer, we aren't any more free, in fact we are less free. We spy, we torture, we violate the core ideas of democratic equality and civil rights in the service of empire.

    I believe the American Experiment will benefit from the end of American empire. Pat Buchanan wrote "A Republic not an Empire" in which he argued ending our empire could revitalize our democracy. I think he's correct in that assertion. I read on Tom Dispatch that we spend $200 billion per year maintaining overseas bases. That's one third of our current year deficit.

    The American experiment is democratic experiment and empires are corrosive of democracy.

  • 4word thinker Murray, UT
    Nov. 1, 2013 11:33 a.m.

    The TEA Party is definitely not responsible for any of the nation's debt.

    Maybe that is why both parties rail against them so hard. They are trying to transfer the own dirt off their own hands on the 'new guy'.

  • one vote Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 1, 2013 10:52 a.m.

    The tea party does diminish our standing while trying to undermine the economy.

  • Badgerbadger Murray, UT
    Nov. 1, 2013 10:17 a.m.

    My favorite lies from leftists:

    "The debt is Reagan's fault
    The debt is Bush's fault
    Obama's debt doesn't matter
    The US debt is insignificant and doesn't matter
    Deficit spending is a good thing
    Giving people more money to spend will fix the economy
    We can afford the unaffordable healthcare act"

    It is not hard to see why we can't seriously work on the nations debt problem. Too many people won't deal with the present realities.

  • LDS Liberal Farmington, UT
    Nov. 1, 2013 9:50 a.m.

    Think of it like this --

    What group entices the local populace and creates devote followers by building schools, places of worship, provides jobs, and security --
    and
    another bombs them into submission?

    Hint: one is the Taliban, the other is the United States.

    What Would Jesus Do,
    or
    Who do you think is reigning with blood, horror, and acting like Terrorists?

  • Ernest T. Bass Bountiful, UT
    Nov. 1, 2013 9:03 a.m.

    Well one thing is certain: one political philosophy does not care about basic human rights. It rhymes with flea hearty.

  • LDS Liberal Farmington, UT
    Nov. 1, 2013 8:13 a.m.

    Hutterite
    American Fork, UT
    We aren't necessarily ready for a de americanised world, but the world seems to be. At least they're beginning to accept that we've lost the gravitas to maintain the title. We've given up on labour, education, societal institutions, and our own government. Our own worst enemies live here, and none of them have bombs. We have met the enemy, and he is us.

    7:35 p.m. Oct. 31, 2013

    ========

    So well said -- and also worth repeating.

    Look at the Tea-Party.
    They are not only trash talking more than 50% of the "non-Republican" Americans,
    But now they are trash talking more than 50% OF the Republicans.

    Proving they most certainly hate MOST Americans and America itself.

    This is why I am against them.

    It's not just their opinions on issues I have problems with,
    but it's they way the trash talk and atack any American who is not just as extreme as they are.

    Heck, THEY just shutdown the Government for crying out loud!

  • Hutterite American Fork, UT
    Oct. 31, 2013 7:35 p.m.

    We aren't necessarily ready for a de americanised world, but the world seems to be. At least they're beginning to accept that we've lost the gravitas to maintain the title. We've given up on labour, education, societal institutions, and our own government. Our own worst enemies live here, and none of them have bombs. We have met the enemy, and he is us.

  • redshirt007 tranquility base, 00
    Oct. 31, 2013 6:09 p.m.

    Why SHOULD the entire world be just like us?

  • UtahBlueDevil Durham, NC
    Oct. 31, 2013 5:21 p.m.

    I just got back from a conference in Europe about how cities are embracing technology to improve their competitiveness.... the over all message is that cities around the world need to understand they are competing for jobs and industry... more than ever. More so, counties are competing with each other....

    And the problem is very real. The number of people rising up to the middle class globally is astounding... and yet here in the states, we have a shrinking middle class... have been now for nearly 20 years.

    Our government is killing US competitiveness, and frankly not many in Europe see us as leaders anymore. The don't dislike us... they just aren't in awe of us anymore. Our government looks more dysfunctional than what you see in Greece and the Ukraine. It is completely ineffective. We can't even tread water... less alone compete globally anymore. It truly was in awe what other cities and countries are doing to improve their competitiveness... while we run around calling each other names and accusing our neighbors of being the enemy.

    It seems our arrogance is finally catching back up with us.

  • I Choose Freedom Atlanta, GA
    Oct. 31, 2013 5:18 p.m.

    Linus -- Bountiful, UT
    "The problem mirrors the fall of the Roman empire. The government encouraged a dependent citizenry who were satisfied with bread (welfare and food stamps) and circuses (NBA, NFL, MLB, etc.). Maybe we need a real depression to bring us back to a sense of reality and responsibility.

    And all you folks who keep blaming one party or another for all that is going wrong . . . . There isn't dime's worth of difference between the career politicians of both parties. Our problems can be traced to all the career politicians whose job is getting reelected, instead of statesmanship."

    So well said I thought it was worth repeating!!!

  • cjb Bountiful, UT
    Oct. 31, 2013 3:18 p.m.

    Why do we need to be world leader?

    We need to take some time to focus internally.

  • Mark B Eureka, CA
    Oct. 31, 2013 3:18 p.m.

    I just don't get what OMM is trying to say about the here and now. Let's hope this isn't one more sad attempt to play the NAZI card.

  • Meckofahess Salt Lake City, UT
    Oct. 31, 2013 3:16 p.m.

    The United States will never be able to sufficiently address entitlement reform until the American Healthcare system is able to reduce the cost of Healthcare. Given that the American people (especially Republicans) seem to be so enamored with the status quo, how is that ever going to be possible? Most Republicans aren't even willing to acknowledge that Obamacare promotes aligning re-imbursement for improved outcomes - not just more of the same old fee-for-service approach which is breaking the bank and not producing good outcomes on a broad basis. Moreover, extremist politicians like Mike Lee only complicate matters. We need political leaders who have some common sense and who can work with all sides to come up with some sensible solutons. We don't need radicalism from either party!

  • Linus Bountiful, UT
    Oct. 31, 2013 2:54 p.m.

    The problem mirrors the fall of the Roman empire. The government encouraged a dependent citizenry who were satisfied with bread (welfare and food stamps) and circuses (NBA, NFL, MLB, etc.). Maybe we need a real depression to bring us back to a sense of reality and responsibility.

    And all you folks who keep blaming one party or another for all that is going wrong . . . . There isn't dime's worth of difference between the career politicians of both parties. Our problems can be traced to all the career politicians whose job is getting reelected, instead of statesmanship.

  • Open Minded Mormon Everett, 00
    Oct. 31, 2013 2:29 p.m.

    As I recall --
    Years ago, a certain world leader,
    faced with a HUGE national debt they could not pay off,
    Told the world to take a hike --
    they weren't going to pay it,
    took it upon himself to:

    Instill a new uber-Patriotic and super-National pride,
    That God was with them, and them only - and against all others,
    he vowed to "Take Back" their country from fellow citizens who he said were trying to destroy it,
    Reminisce about the "Glory Days" of former times,
    called for huge increases in defense while cutting back all other non-essential Government programs,
    eliminate the rising costs of Healthcare by humanely euthanizing those deemed terminally ill,
    "concentrate" those they deemed the blight of their Society into camps;
    [the poor, the homeless, homosexuals, illegal immigrants, drug and alcohol addicts, prostitutes, Communists and Liberals, the Union bosses, and non-Christians] and banning the vices of pornography and abortion, ect.
    and then eliminate them later behind the veil of war.

    He called them the world's lone Super Power,
    established to last a Thousand years!

    Sieg Heil!

  • BeSmart Cheyenne, WY
    Oct. 31, 2013 1:55 p.m.

    @ atll34
    I disagree both parties are at fault.
    The two party system is not good.
    The Republicans shut down the government because they wanted to negotiate
    The democrats were unwilling and are unwilling to negotiate.
    They say the people supported obamacare and that is why he got re-elected.
    Did we forget the Republicans gained control of the House because of o-care?
    The republicans were trying to do what their constituents elected them to do.
    Both parties have major issues. This administration does not negotiate even with their own duly elected representatives.
    That is the problem.

  • Unreconstructed Reb Chantilly, VA
    Oct. 31, 2013 12:53 p.m.

    This article correctly points out that the US's position in the world is diminishing, but is off the mark on why. The rest of the global economy isn't overly concerned with the long term problem of our debt. The national debt is a long term problem over a generation in the making, one that will require a long term solution (the specifics of which can be debated elsewhere).

    No, what jeopardizes the US position in the short term is the threat of default. The rest of the world cares little about our deficit, but world markets began bracing themselves for the impact of a potential default two weeks ago.

    The dollar's position as the world's reserve currency provides powerful benefits for the US and its citizens. This position is founded on trust in the stability the American economic system. If that trust continues to erode -- or in the case of a default, disappear entirely -- the US and its economy will be devastated beyond recognition. And as governance of this nation lurches from crisis to crisis, we are only encouraging the rest of the world to find alternative to the dollar as the reserve currency.

  • Anti Bush-Obama Chihiuahua, 00
    Oct. 31, 2013 12:46 p.m.

    Yes. The process began in 1913. 100 years ago with the implementation of the cancerous Federal Reserve.

  • 2 bits Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Oct. 31, 2013 12:22 p.m.

    RE: "The history of the world shows that when a government fails from internal pressure it is because of commercial corruption in its government"... Ultra Bob

    So... Was the fall of the Roman government due to "commercial corruption"? I don't think so.

    How about the French and Marie Antoinette? Commercial corruption? No... revolution?

    You seem so obsessed with business and corporations and blaming them for everything. But seriously.. has every government fail been due to corporations? Or could it be the corruption and disinterest of it's people in electing good people instead of people who will promise them free stuff?

    A lot of countries have changed their government through elections, and some have had civil wars, or some have been taken over by other aggressive countries (hint... that's not commercial corruption).

    There are lots of reasons for countries to fail, not just corporations.

    Corporations are NOT inherently evil. Just like governments... corporations are created by you and me supporting them (one through elections, the other through buying their products or services). But Businesses (like governments) are made up of people. And those people are no more evil than you or me.

  • Kent C. DeForrest Provo, UT
    Oct. 31, 2013 12:16 p.m.

    All this handwringing over the debt on the same day when two articles appear, one showing that the deficit is on target to be lower as a percentage of GDP than it was in 7 of Reagan's 8 years in office; the other quoting economists who insist that low government has actually hampered economic growth (which is exactly what we should expect, since Europe showed us the fruits of the conservative "austerity" economics). Nevertheless . . .

    To turn this whole argument on its head, we really need to start dealing with the most fundamental problem of our corporate capitalist economy, and that it is based on a proposition that is totally irrational: that the economy can grow forever, can keep turning natural resources into waste for eternity, and can keep externalizing costs (offloading them onto society in general while turning the savings into corporate profits that feed the grand and accelerating divide between the rich and the rest). We really need to start exploring the possibilities of a sustainable rather than a growth economy.

  • marxist Salt Lake City, UT
    Oct. 31, 2013 12:14 p.m.

    "Unless changes are made, the demographics driving Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid will drive the nation into bankruptcy. " Is the constable going to show up tomorrow and throw us out of the country? Seriously, do you guys understand who owns U S debt. Two-thirds of the federal debt is held domestically, or as Keynes put it, "we owe it to ourselves." But this is game playing, the kind we have to do in capitalism to meet human needs. Eventually we will have an out-in-the-open socialism. It's just a matter of time, and sadly, the next big crisis.

  • Ultra Bob Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Oct. 31, 2013 11:40 a.m.

    The handwriting on the wall seems to be telling smart Americans and the world in general that the American experiment has failed and is coming to an end. The indicators are:

    1.The American government has been moving away from the people and into the hands of special interests. Now the forces of government are taking back the rights and freedoms of the people by reducing the protections for people.

    2.The weakness of the nation government has given rise of competing governments wishing to throw off the yoke of national government.

    3.Business is changing their agenda from continue forever to grab the money and run.

    The history of the world shows that when a government fails from internal pressure it is because of commercial corruption in its government. These are becoming more evident in the American government.
    x

  • 2 bits Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Oct. 31, 2013 11:36 a.m.

    Re: "it's not their fault Republicans refuse to compromise and continuously threaten shutdowns"... atl134

    One time in two terms as President it's been shutdown and it's "CONTINUOUSLY" threatening shutdowns?

    Compare that with Democrats in Congress actually shutting down the government 3 times in ONE YEAR when Reagan was President. That's not threatening, but actually shutting it down.

    Or Compare with the Democrats in Congress who shutdown the government 3 times in one year in a hissy-fit over the government refusing to pay for abortions (during the Carter admin).

    Kinda makes the weeping about how poorly Obama's been treated seem a little disingenuous... don't ya think?

  • atl134 Salt Lake City, UT
    Oct. 31, 2013 10:42 a.m.

    "Both parties acknowledge this, yet they refuse to do anything about it,"

    Democrats are... it's not their fault Republicans refuse to compromise and continuously threaten shutdowns and defaults just to try and get their way. They say uncertainty is holding back the economy... the Republican party and in particular the Tea Party movement, is the source of the instabilty.

  • glendenbg Salt Lake City, UT
    Oct. 31, 2013 9:12 a.m.

    I guess the D-News editorial board assumed no one would google the actual article from China's news agency.

    The article calls the US out for hypocrisy - proclaiming ourselves agents of freedom and liberty while torturing prisoners, using drones to kill people, spying on people all over the world, generally meddling in the affairs of other nations and waging wars based on outright lies. No where does it mention entitlements.

    The biggest criticism in the article is the way in which US political dysfunction threatens to destabilize the world. Republicans argued for and got a government shut down, and flirted with disaster over the debt ceiling. The political antics that created that situation are dangerous. The article argues the US is engulfed in rising political turmoil which threatens the world's stability and that situation should not be permitted to continue.

    To summarize the article from China's news agency says, "Live up to your professed ideals, deal with your political dysfunction or force the rest of the world to act in concert to reduce your ability to harm us."

  • 2 bits Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Oct. 31, 2013 9:07 a.m.

    Pagan,
    You really believe your post today (claiming Reagan and Bush increased our debt more than Obama).

    Well... maybe if you totally ignore Obama's first term, and only count his 2nd term (which isn't even half over yet).

    Comparing only a selected 2 years of Obama spending with 8 years of Bush spending and 8 years of Reagan spending... not intellectually honest.

    You really need to squint hard and be carefully blind to what you WILL count, and what you WON'T count during the Obama Administration to claim that Obama hasn't put us into more debt than all the Presidents of the United States combined. I really wouldn't go there if I were an Obama supporter.

    This is verbatum from FactCheck dot org...
    "There's no sugar-coating it, as some supporters of President Obama have tried to do ... the debt has increased more under Obama than under all previous 43 presidents combined".

    Hows that for reality?

    And we don't know how much Obama will spend... he still has 2 years to add to his record spending!

    Spending and debt are about the only places Obama looses. I'd avoid that one if I were you.

  • JoeBlow Far East USA, SC
    Oct. 31, 2013 7:56 a.m.

    "Just what are these easy solutions? I don't see them."

    Probably poor wording. Seeing the solutions is fairly easy, but the solutions will be painful.

    Solutions

    Tweak Social Security. There are a number of options. Probably our easiest challenge
    Medicare/Medicaid - involves stopping the rapidly escalating costs. Healthcare needs fixing.
    A smart businessman could do wonders if politics was not involved
    We need a slow and steady reduction in benefits
    Military - We must make large cuts and force our military to prioritize. This would AGAIN
    involve getting politics out of the way
    Taxes - In conjunction with the spending cuts above, Tax increases are a must. That is clear
    to anyone who studies the issue without political slants.

    So, Knowing the solutions are easy, but the solutions themselves will involve pain. There is absolutely no other way. Ever $ cut will affect someone. Every tax$ will affect someone.

    And the sooner we do these things, the less painful they will be.

  • Twin Lights Louisville, KY
    Oct. 31, 2013 7:49 a.m.

    happy2bhere,

    Not easy, but easier.

    The reality is that when Social Security was "fixed" in the Reagan years we could have made the fix permanent if we had instituted a true lock box (like a sovereign wealth fund) with Social Security coming out of the general fund. Now, those excess funds have been spent on both programs and lower tax rates (essentially Social Security has been help fund the budget). Now, the options are fewer. And it 10 years, they will be fewer still.

    Few financial problems get better by just waiting and seeing what happens. Once we know there is a problem, acting swiftly is usually best. Because our options diminish with each passing day.

  • Pagan Salt Lake City, UT
    Oct. 31, 2013 7:44 a.m.

    W. Bush doubled the debt.

    Reagan tripled the debt.

    You cannot say either about Obama in his 2nd term.

    Iraq war cost us $4 trillion dollars. The 42 attempts to defund the ACA cost us $50 million. Government shutdown? $24 billion.

    If my main concern was the debt?

    History shows I should vote Democrat.

  • happy2bhere clearfield, UT
    Oct. 31, 2013 6:44 a.m.

    ...despite knowing that solutions are easier to enact now.......

    Just what are these easy solutions? I don't see them.

  • 2 bits Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Oct. 31, 2013 6:40 a.m.

    I hope they are not suggesting we become a Communist China-ized World. That would NOT be good for anybody who likes individual freedom or self rule.

  • JoeBlow Far East USA, SC
    Oct. 31, 2013 4:02 a.m.

    "Both parties acknowledge this, yet they refuse to do anything about it, other than blame the people on the other side of the aisle in order to score cheap political points."

    Exactly correct. But, it is not just the parties. It is also the partisan people.