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Mike Sorensen: Pac-12 may get more than its share of bowl berths

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  • killarney Lincoln Park, IL
    Oct. 31, 2013 4:11 p.m.

    Uteology

    hmmm, since overall record the past three years is comparable, head-to-head, as in 9 in a row, 18 of 24, is completely meaningless, as is, apparently, SOS, even though Utah has only played a single BCS conference team OOC, and ASU has played SIX.

    ASU OOC:
    California-Davis, Missouri, and Illinois in 2011
    Northern Arizona, Illinois, and Missouri in 2012
    Sacramento State, Wisconsin, and Notre Dame in 2013

    Utah OOC:
    Montana State, BYU, and Pittsburgh in 2011
    Northern Colorado, Utah State, and BYU in 2012
    Weber State, Utah State, and BYU in 2013

    You should really publish a rules guide so we know which set of rules applies only to Utah versus BYU, and which set applies to Utah versus everybody else.

  • phoenix Gilbert, AZ
    Oct. 31, 2013 3:26 p.m.

    Uteology

    "ASU is +2 in wins. Wow! That's impressive... Yes, ASU has OWNED us but so has most of the mid-upper PAC-12 teams."

    It's hilarious how dismissive Utah fans are of head-to-head results when you're not talking about Utah's recent history versus BYU.

    U talk of "owning" BYU because you've won 4 in a row (3 of them by a total of 11 points)?

    Seriously?

    Let me explain what it's really like to be OWNED.

    In Utah's 1st two years in the PAC 12, ASU beat Utah 35-14 and 37-7, a 51-point differential.

    That's a larger margin in the last two games, than the Utes managed in their six wins versus ASU COMBINED, 41 points.

    But it's even worse than that.

    The Sun Devils are 18-6 lifetime versus Utah and have beaten the Utes NINE straight times.

    In fact, ASU hasn't lost to Utah since 1976, when the Sun Devils were still members of the WAC.

    Utah is WINLESS (0-8) versus the PAC 10/12 Sun Devils and have been blown out by ASU in both games since the Utes joined the PAC 12.

  • BeSmart Cheyenne, WY
    Oct. 31, 2013 2:45 p.m.

    Uteology
    As a Utes and cougs fan I have to begin questioning the Pac-12 depth question.
    Utah is playing with 3 classes of Pac-12 recruiting.
    So most of the team is Pac-12 talent. and I count 17 seniors.
    so roughly 20 percent is not pac-12 give or take a few.
    I hope the Utes do well, but I am concerned the Utes 1st year was the best they had in conference with MWC recruits.
    I think there is more of an issue than Pac-12 depth and talent though the utes do have some talented pieces.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Oct. 31, 2013 1:53 p.m.

    @CougarSunDevil

    And with that I'm done for the next week. I don't need to say anything else because, unlike Utah, ASU talks with how they play. It's super fun to look at the standings in the PAC-12 south...ASU is #1!

    -------------

    Since Utah joined:

    ASU: 6-7, 8-5, 5-2 (19-14)
    Utah: 8-5, 5-7, 4-4 (17-16)

    ASU is +2 in wins. Wow! That's impressive.

    We don't have PAC-12 depth or talent, what is your excuse? Yes, ASU has OWNED us but so has most of the mid-upper PAC-12 teams.

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Oct. 31, 2013 1:48 p.m.

    At MrPlate

    You and your wife aren't messing with anybody's mind; don't kid your self!

  • Cougsndawgs West Point , UT
    Oct. 31, 2013 1:47 p.m.

    Samurai Jake:
    My friend from Goergia, specifically Atlanta doesn't care about the utes or follow them. Obviously he knows the pac12 but like most people only sees or hears about the elite programs from that conference...not Utah.

    Any CFB fan that doesn't see the SEC or care that they are kicking everyone's behind on the only prize that matters is delusional, or purposely avoidant of reality. You say you're sick of them? Ya, that's usually what happens when you've been beaten down and taken to the woodshed so often. Your best teams haven't competed against their best teams in recent history and until they do get used to being "sick of them".

    As for SEC fans west of the Mississippi, there are plenty...unless you have your head in the sand which would be understandable for a ute fan right now.

  • DSB Cedar Hills, UT
    Oct. 31, 2013 11:00 a.m.

    @Uteanymous

    You're still not getting it, the celebration must be IN THE STREETS! Don't you see the vital importance of the celebrations happening in the streets? Also, it must be the first game of the season. Also, the opponent must not be ranked at the end of the season. Also, the coach must say something to the fans in the streets. Also, it must involve a D1 school of equal or better tradition. Under these very specific terms, clearly BYU has the ONLY fan base who would do such a thing, because Uteology can't think of another similar event.

    And who else in the history of football has ever blamed the rain for a loss? That's just the most bizarre, unlikely excuse of all time. Snow, cold, heat, humidity, sleet, slush, wind, every conceivable other weather condition - yes, naturally! But RAIN? C'mon, everyone knows rain is obviously the only weather condition that could NEVER be lamely blamed for a loss, except by Cougar Nation.

    Why can't everyone see how brilliant it is for Uteology to have found the pieces that finally prove beyond all doubt the foolishness of Cougar Nation? Who can dispute it?

  • CougarSunDevil Phoenix, AZ
    Oct. 31, 2013 8:52 a.m.

    Uteanymous

    You forgot...

    2012 - Utah fans storm the field THREE Times after BYU misses a field goal.

    I think that event alone was enough to make Utah the joke of the Pacific Conference. Why would they storm the field at all (let alone three times) against such a terrible and insignificant school?

    And with that I'm done for the next week. I don't need to say anything else because, unlike Utah, ASU talks with how they play. It's super fun to look at the standings in the PAC-12 south...ASU is #1!

    GO Devils!

  • Uteanymous Salt Lake City, Utah
    Oct. 31, 2013 6:54 a.m.

    Oct 2, 2008 - Utah fans storm the field and celebrate after beating Oregon State
    Nov 9, 2008 - Utah fans storm the field and celebrate after beating TCU
    Nov 22, 2008 - Utah fans storm the field and celebrate after beating BYU
    Jan 16, 2009 - Utah fans throw themselves a parade after beating Alabama
    Sep 5, 2009 - Utah fans whine about BYU fans celebrating a win over Oklahoma

  • Y's little brother Sandy, UT
    Oct. 30, 2013 10:55 p.m.

    Uteology

    Dateline: Deseret News, Tuesday, Jan. 6 2009

    "The Utah football team will be honored with a parade in downtown Salt Lake City on Friday, Jan. 16. The parade will begin at 3 p.m. and will end in Washington Square."

    Utah throwing themselves a formal parade for beating the SEC runner-up

    versus

    A few BYU fans spontaneously celebrating a win over then #3-ranked Oklahoma and their Heisman Trophy winning quarterback?

    Seriously?

    Get a life already if that's all you've got to quibble about FIVE years after the fact.

  • MrPlate Lindon, UT
    Oct. 30, 2013 9:30 p.m.

    Wow Uteolgy - I apologize for messing with your mind. Even I didn't fully realize how rabidly you would cling to "BYU fans are the ONLY ones who..." but your responses were otherwise rather predictable. Yesterday you said: "I quoted Tysom Hill for blaming his abysmal passing due to bad weather" In response, I found a college player who blamed weather conditions for a loss. This, knowing full well you'd then refine the parameters and further restrict the search criteria. You didn't disappoint.

    Using Appalachian State, I met your laughably ridiculous claim that only BYU fans party in the streets following a great season-opening victory, knowing full well you would mock BYU for acting like a D2 school, and suggest it therefore doesn't count. Right on cue, you follow script.

    BTW - I never said I found many teams in 2.5 minutes of research. Just another predictable word-twisting Strawman tactic. The point is how easy it was to find something to prove your provincialism. Too easy of pickins, and 2.5 minutes is all this game was worth.

    Respond if you feel compelled. I'm happy to leave our brief legacy in the hands of the readers. Good night.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Oct. 30, 2013 8:50 p.m.

    @Cougsndawgs/MrPlate

    Tysom and Cougar Nation clearly blamed the rain. I clearly said rain. They didn't say heat or even cold.

    I am still waiting for another team that says rain affected their game. Not the heat, or the cold weather. I am aware of plenty of teams affected by heat and cold:

    * BYU drinking pickle juice in the heat vs Mississippi State
    * Warm weather team ULCA getting hammered in the cold in Utah.
    * Even in the NFL, playing in the cold in Green Bay or Chicago, etc.

    I don't recall anyone blaming the rain, except Cougar Nation.

    I said my bad, I forgot about Appalachian State. I stand corrected. You claimed you found many teams in 2.5 minutes of research. I asked list those teams, so we can all have a laugh at 1-0 celebrations.

    Right now, for giggles I only Deseret News to refer to:

    "Provo - People danced in the streets. They hugged perfect strangers. They lit off fireworks. And in general, they celebrated and celebrated and celebrated."

    BYU football: Provo celebrates stunning win
    By Dan Rasmussen, Deseret News
    Monday, Sep 7, 2009

    Thanks in advance.

  • MountainMan25 Salt Lake City, UT
    Oct. 30, 2013 6:41 p.m.

    "Three of the remaining four are absolutely winnable, but not with an offense like the one that showed up in LA on Saturday."

    Agreed. Honestly, other than probably Oregon, the other PAC 12 teams aren't powerhouses - Utah is capable of beating each of them (see Stanford). In fact, some are terrible - USC on Saturday, Arizona, Washington State, Colorado, Cal.

    That is why it is so frustrating that Utah puts such a terrible product out there in PAC 12 play. Great win over BYU, but then what? I didn't think we signed up to be the doormat of the PAC 12 three years in. I thought we were headed in the right direction. Now I'm not so sure. Frustrating, to say the least.

  • Samurai Jake Salt Lake City, UT
    Oct. 30, 2013 6:22 p.m.

    @cougsndawgs:

    Ok, so let me get this straight - your friend from Georgia doesn't know, or care to know, about the PAC 12 whatsoever. Shocker! Do I care about the sports world that your friend from Georgia cares about? Not in any way, shape, or form.

    Let me put it to you this way - do you honestly in your right mind, think that any sports fan this side of the Mississippi, cares even one iota about the SEC? The answer is, all SEC graduates aside, absolutely not.

    We're tired of hearing about Alabama. The rest of the SEC, who cares? So the bottom line is, it works both ways. They don't care about our part of the sports world, and neither do we care about theirs. And that's totally okay!

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Oct. 30, 2013 6:16 p.m.

    MrPlate
    That support is something. Unfortunately the DN won't let me expand on it and I have on earthly idea why? Have a good one.

  • Steven S Jarvis Orem, UT
    Oct. 30, 2013 2:16 p.m.

    Its worth noting who BYU beat as well as how they have done it. So far they manhandled Texas, USU, GT and MTS, and Boise State. They outlasted Houston. Those six teams are all going to be going bowling.

    Its safe to say BYU bounced back. Lets get that game in Wisconsin! Go Cougars!!

  • BeSmart Cheyenne, WY
    Oct. 30, 2013 12:59 p.m.

    if all pac-12 teams were better than the MWC.
    Than all the teams would go to bowls.

  • Y>U Anaheim, CA
    Oct. 30, 2013 12:45 p.m.

    It's worth noting that BYU has already qualified for a bowl after beating 6 FBS teams, while Utah is still struggling to qualify for a bowl after only beating 3 FBS teams (only 1-4 in the PAC).

    Goes to show that the Utes, as has been proven over the course of 2 1/2 seasons, were only invited to the PAC to serve as cannon fodder for the big boys of the conference.

    The national media, coaches and fans recognize an upset when they see one, otherwise, why would BYU be ranked 20 places higher than the Utes in nearly every poll and national ranking?

    If you don't WIN, having a strong SOS is nothing more than a convenient excuse for losing.

  • DSB Cedar Hills, UT
    Oct. 30, 2013 11:38 a.m.

    To Spokane Ute

    So, by now you have accused me of being unable to read with comprehension, of fabricating and being dishonest, and needing to slooooow down to understand the comments I read. You've apologized to MrPlate that you have misrepresented him, basically acknowledging that everything I said was correct as well. If I'm wrong with anything, please identify where. Otherwise, it seems you owe me an apology just like you gave to MrPlate.

  • Veritas Aequitas Fruit Heights, UT
    Oct. 30, 2013 11:29 a.m.

    MountainMan25
    Salt Lake City, UT
    ===
    Seems to be the only clear headed thinking Utah fan out there...

    ===

    Sort of fun to watch the rest of the Utah fans get spanked here.

  • MrPlate Lindon, UT
    Oct. 30, 2013 11:26 a.m.

    @Spokane Ute - of course when a big-conference school LOSES to a patsy (i.e. Oregon St. losing to Eastern Washington), it's not meaningless. It means you're possibly worse than a patsy, and that's admittedly significant. I think you're well aware I was referring to OVERALL pre-season schedules, not individual games.

    BEATING a patsy just means you're better than a patsy - congrats on the win, and it actually benefits both teams, but how meaningful is the victory in terms of bragging rights? Since the vast majority of pre-conference games in all elite leagues are against patsies, and the elite conference typically wins those games, it only means they're better than patsies. I'll concede that means SOMETHING - PAC12 teams are better than Big Sky teams, and SEC teams are better than Sun Belt teams, overall. For some reason that's more meaningful to you than it is to me. I can live with the difference of opinion.

    Also, LetsDebate is my wife, and I appreciate her support. LetsDebate's most recent post was actually from me, MrPlate, but I failed to log off her account and back into my own before submitting.

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Oct. 30, 2013 9:54 a.m.

    CougarSunDevil

    Not sure why are comments were edited either? I just questioned the name calling of schools and screen names. If you take it personally, well my apologies. I don't recall ever saying anything about the Rose Bowl, heck I'd be happy with the New Mexico bowl at this point. As far as Chris B goes, I can no more control his comments then I can yours. I have no idea who the guy is and I dont agree with his MO. You will notice that I never acknowledge or respond to his comments. Please don't label all Utah fans because of him, and especially not me. I find it rather sad that you let one extreme fan on a message board, lead you to hating a University. That's unfortunate. Again, I don't hate BYU. Let's leave it a that; have a good day!

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Oct. 30, 2013 9:37 a.m.

    LetsDebate

    Thank you for straigtening the thread out. You have done some fine work this morning. I'm not exactly sure why you are even involved in the conversation, but again great work. Do you feel better?

    Mr. Plate,

    I did take your position regarding Texas A&M, Bama and Oregon out of context. My extreme appologies. We shall see how it all plays out, and possibly pick this up another time.

    In summary, yes I believe Oregon will soundly defeat anyone from the SEC. (IMO)
    Both the SEC and PAC 12 play patsies in non-conference games. (Fact)
    Non-conference games are not meaningless. Just ask Oregon State University if the game vs. E. Wahsingion was meaningless (IMO)

    Go UTES & GO Seahawks..............and to all a good day!

  • CougarSunDevil Phoenix, AZ
    Oct. 30, 2013 9:17 a.m.

    DN

    So you don't have a problem with SpokaneUte calling me Juvenille...

    "It's intersting how you have to exagerate the names of colleges and the University of Utah. Rather Juvenille, but interesting"

    But heaven forbid I say I don't like the utes?

    "Spokaneute, why do you have to personally attack me to make your point? You assume that I'm some diehard byu fan. I cheer them on, but my team is the devils. I've heard nothing from you and your alias ChrisB except disrespect for my devils. Runnin youths fans keep running their mouths about how they are going to the rose bowl blaw blaw blaw. That's why I don't like utah. Has nothing to do with the ute obsession of byu."

  • LetsDebate PLEASANT GROVE, UT
    Oct. 30, 2013 8:32 a.m.

    @Spokane Ute - the only fabrication is coming from your posts. Firstly, my post at 6:00 PM on 10/28 says nothing whatsoever about Oregon's ability to beat LSU and Texas A&M.

    Secondly, a fuller and more accurate quote from my post at 11:28 AM on 10/29 is:

    "...it's blind homer speculation to claim Oregon would definitely throttle SEC teams LSU and Texas A&M."

    This was in response to your post on 10/28 at 4:17 PM that said "Oregon will throttle anyone from the SEC, watch and see."

    Alabama, LSU, and Texas A&M are all SEC schools. YOU said Oregon would "throttle" any of them. My subsequent posts posited that only a blind homer could believe that. I am not a blind homer. I do NOT believe Oregon would throttle ANY of them, and NEVER said so The only way to suggest I made such an assertion is for a dishonest person to take my actual words, cut them apart, and use them out of context.

    You're full of advice about reading carefully for understanding, avoiding fabrications, and owning up to one's own words. Physician, heal thyself.

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Oct. 30, 2013 7:49 a.m.

    @Let'debate

    Great insight and what a great angle. Nice, keen observation. When posting such interesting comments and adding so much intrigue to the debate; us all of the explanation points you want; you deserve too!

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Oct. 30, 2013 7:39 a.m.

    @ Besmart

    Cool enough and fair enough. I agree.

    @ DSB & Mr. Plate

    At least own up to what you said and don't fabricate the truth. Per Mr. Plate at 6:00 PM on 10/28

    "Oregon would definitely throttle SEC teams LSU and Texas A&M."

    No need to apologize, but let's at least be honest when debating. DSB, you may want to read his comments again, but possibly sloooow down this time.

  • Cougsndawgs West Point , UT
    Oct. 29, 2013 10:22 p.m.

    Uteology:
    Also in your search for the meaning of Strawman, please refer to the section about making outlandish remarks regarding the actions if a large group of people such as "Cougar Nation is the ONLY".... Usually these statements are the centerpieces of a Strawman fallacy.

    That said, MrPlate needs to realize that he shouldn't debate on your parameters because of your fallacy, but either he wanted to play along, or felt he could still refute you. If he tries to refute your fallacy then the obligation rests with him to meet the ridiculous parameters you established. If he doesn't (and he hasn't) then he can't complain about your parameters...isn't that right MrPlate? Next time just call his Strawman and disregard trying to refute it's already flawed logic.

  • Cougsndawgs West Point , UT
    Oct. 29, 2013 9:52 p.m.

    Look BYU fans...the bottom line is that the experts & the nation see BYU as the better team. We care about ute fans' opinions why exactly? Should we believe the country and CFB experts or Chris B...tough one I know. I'm just going to give the "who's better" argument a rest and let the country and experts do the talking for me. Let Chrissy and her minions disagree with them if it makes her feel better.

  • LetsDebate PLEASANT GROVE, UT
    Oct. 29, 2013 8:54 p.m.

    @MrPlate - good heavens! Running circles around Spokane Ute and Uteology! They can't even keep up with themselves, let alone you. Well done - this is hilarious! This is so entertaining I'm breaking my own rules regarding the over-use of exclamation points!!!!!

  • DSB Cedar Hills, UT
    Oct. 29, 2013 8:44 p.m.

    To Spokane Ute - problem is, I've re-read MrPlate's comments, and he never said Oregon would thump Texas A&M. I don't know if you're making that up, or simply don't comprehend what you're reading, as you falsely accuse me of doing. Since it's all in writing, I suspect you've misunderstood something. Perhaps you should take your own advice and read a little more carefully before your call someone out.

    I hope that helps.

  • MrPlate Lindon, UT
    Oct. 29, 2013 8:40 p.m.

    Nice try Spokane, to divert your frustration at getting whalloped by numerous commenters here because of your faulty logic and opinions. I'm not upset in the slightest, and get quite a kick out of watching one post after another challenge your conclusions and interpretations of "facts." It's touching that you're so concerned with my feelings though.

    I care very little about who's the best conference. I root for BYU, and I like Utah and Utah State too. I find it interesting to see which conferences win their bowl games, as the final test of conference strength, but right now it's just chest thumping by a few (very few) really great teams, and a lot of others who built a supposed greatness by beating extremely weak opponents. That's the pre-season meaningless joke of a schedule I keep referencing that you think tells so much. If your Pac-12 chest thumping makes you feel better, sorry I dragged you down.

    The amount of ridiculous logic on these threads, by fans of all teams, is worthy of scorn and ridicule, and it amuses me to play with people who it obviously means so much to, like yourself.

  • MrPlate Lindon, UT
    Oct. 29, 2013 8:38 p.m.

    @Spokane - talk about being unable to read and understand posts. Please quote my comment saying Oregon would thump Texas A&M. I've been saying repeatedly that Oregon would probably NOT throttle Texas A&M, so you might want to "read posts a little more carefully before calling some one out. I hope that helps." @DSB - spot on!

    @Uteology - now I'm really laughing. I predicted you would change the parameters of your already narrow challenge. So, to be clear, now we have to show another team with a starting quarterback, who never left the game for treatment, who may have blamed the loss on weather conditions, but ONLY rain-related weather conditions! And, for the celebrations, it has to be a D1 school with a victory in the first game of the season, over a highly hyped team that was not ultimately ranked at the end of the season, and the only celebration that counts is one that occurs in the city streets. I know if I find more examples, you'll surely be satisfied! I'll get right on that!

    In addition to "provincialism," you may want to look up the meaning of "straw man" as well.

  • Marked it Down Park City, UT
    Oct. 29, 2013 8:27 p.m.

    pac12ute4life

    Fiction: "Utah is a national brand, recognized everywhere in the country. We recruit much better nationally than BYU, and we are regarded higher academically and athletically than BYU."

    Truth: Utah is a regional/commuter school that is barely recognized outside of the Mountain West. Even PAC 12 schools are still adjusting to Utah being a member of their conference. Utah recruits Utah, California and Texas, and only a handful of recruits elsewhere.

    Academically, Utah has great research, but its undergraduate programs pale in comparison to BYU.

    Athletically, BYU has finished significantly ahead of Utah in 20 of 20 National Association of Directors of College Athletics (NADCA) Directors' Cup standings (recognizes overall athletic excellence across all men's and women's sports).

    Average NADCA finish and points for the last 20 years
    BYU 30th, 519 points; highest 12th; lowest 47th
    Utah 63rd, 269 points; highest 37th; lowest 87th

    BYU's AVERAGE finish is higher than Utah's HIGHEST finish.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Oct. 29, 2013 7:29 p.m.

    @MrPlate

    First I said "Blame the rain for the loss". The rain not heat.

    "The humidity is ridiculous." Minter went to the locker room for intravenous fluids during the third quarter; Florida scored its first touchdown while Minter received treatment.

    Did Hill leave the game for treatment? To dry off?

    My bad, I forgot about Appalachian State, a D2 school. Ironically, they actually beat a final ranked team (AP #18). Legacy program down south, acts like a D2 school? Priceless!

    What else did you find in your 2.5 minute of research?

    For entertainment purposes, please list the other teams that celebrated a 1-0 Quest.

  • Cougsndawgs West Point , UT
    Oct. 29, 2013 7:11 p.m.

    Have any of you guys arguing with SpokaneUte watched Oregon this year? Look I'm an SEC fan, Georgia to be precise, but I think Oregon is the best team in the country...statistically and using the "eye test". Would Oregon throttle Alabama...I don't think so...no one has throttled the crimson tide in quite a while. But if you asked me to bet I would put the wager on Oregon to win that game. A lot can change between now and the end of the season but I think right now Oregon is the better team. In the end, that's nothing but my opinion...not facts, which is all any of us can give right now...conjecture.

    My opinion is that the SEC is the strongest conference from top to bottom, and the computers and power rankings back that up. 9 NCs in the last decade, including 7 in a row back up their dominance at the top. That said, it's my opinion that THIS YR Oregon would give Bama everything they can handle and then some.

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Oct. 29, 2013 4:03 p.m.

    DSB

    No trouble here. Now follow me closely. Mr. Plate stated that Oregon would thump Texas A&M, but not Alabama. I disagreed since Texas A&M only lost to Alabama 49-42; which is a fact. Looking at that score I stand by my position that Oregon would thump Alabama too. Now that's just my opinion, which really seems to have every one riled up. Throttle is a realative term; I would define that as a 21+ point victory. See, no problem distinguishing between facts and fantasy. In the future, you may want to read posts a little more carefully before calling some one out. I hope that helps.

  • MountainMan25 Salt Lake City, UT
    Oct. 29, 2013 4:03 p.m.

    Honestly, this Ute fan is fed up. It's time for a change, probably with respect to Whit, he just isn't cutting it.

    We know from past years that Utah is capable of playing with the big boys, which is why it is frustrating to see our guys go out and lose year in and year out, to mediocre PAC 12 teams like Colorado and Arizona. I don't like the direction this team is headed - which appears to be an Arizona-like trajectory - no championships, rare bowl games, mediocrity (but at least AZ has basketball, but I digress).

    Sure, the wins against BYU are nice, but to be honest a lot of those games could have gone either way, and if you look at the history of the series there are up and down streaks. Deep down I would like to see that the recent trend of BYU wins signifies a long-term dominance, given our new PAC 12 membership, but the fact that we have been getting beaten up in the PAC 12 doesn't give me a lot of hope. Time for a change.

  • BeSmart Cheyenne, WY
    Oct. 29, 2013 4:01 p.m.

    @Spokane Ute
    All I was saying that Utah is not at that level (yet they may become that)
    I think the Pac-12 is much improved over three years.
    I think from top to bottom they are the first or second best conference.
    All I said is Utah is not at the same level as Oregon, etc.
    I meant no offense.

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Oct. 29, 2013 3:55 p.m.

    @ Mr Plate

    You appear to be getting very upset because the PAC 12 conference is rated #2 in the nation, right behind the SEC; and in some polls, slightly ahead. As far as the whole wide world goes, are you reffering to Canada? It's also sad that you have go the name calling route and call me a "Homer' because I believe Oregon would throttle Alabama. It's just my opinion. I also like the term cup cake. It seems to make you angry that PAC 12 schools play these games, but its acceptable that SEC (and everyone else) does. Take a deep breath, it will be all right. Not everyone is going to agree with you; nor with me. I had no idea that my position, backed up with facts and statistics, would upset you so much. Have a good evening!

  • pac12ute4life Beverly Hills, CA
    Oct. 29, 2013 3:52 p.m.

    "Every football fan in American knows Utah is in the Pac 12

    Your OWN recruit thought you were a division II program.

    LOL!"

    TRUTH. Utah is a national brand, recognized everywhere in the country. We recruit much better nationally than BYU, and we are regarded higher academically and athletically than BYU.

    BYU and Utah State are regional schools (in a weak region, for that matter). Utah all the way. Bowl game this year Rose Bowl next year! Onward and Upward!

  • DSB Cedar Hills, UT
    Oct. 29, 2013 3:13 p.m.

    Spokane Ute

    Let me get this straight. Oregon would not throttle Alabama, but since Alabama defeated Texas A&M in a shootout by one touchdown, then Oregon would clearly throttle Texas A&M, as a matter of FACT? Not sure I'm following your factual analysis.

    Probably the lowest level of athletic intelligence is calculating that if Team A beats Team B by seven points, and Team C beats Team A by seven points (or, in this case Team C is thought capable of beating Team A by seven points), then Team C can beat (or throttle) Team B by 14 points. Seems to be your kind of math, Spokane.

    Johnny Manzeil has never been throttled in college football, and has narrowly lost to a few very good teams. You might reasonably bet Oregon could beat them, but a throttling is highly unlikely.

    Seems you're the one having trouble distinguishing between facts and fantasy.

  • MrPlate Lindon, UT
    Oct. 29, 2013 2:53 p.m.

    @Spokane Ute - that you need facts and statistics to show it proves nothing meaningful for top-quality teams to defeat a slew of Furmans and Nicholls States is enough to measure your football acumen. That you consider Cal to be a worthy measuring stick for Ohio State, again, says a lot. That you don't seem to know the difference between Oregon (as in University of) and Oregon St. is another indication (or, do you really believe Oregon St. is in contention for a national title?).

    Fact - Pac12 teams played 38 non-conference games.
    Fact - 22 of 38 games were against total cupcakes.
    Fact - Only 4 of 38 are current AP top 25 teams.
    Fact - Pac12 teams lost 3 of those 4 games against current AP top 25 teams.
    Fact - Pac12 conference has ONE victory this year over AP top 25 non-conference teams.
    Fact - only a homer believes Oregon would "throttle" Texas A&M.

    Wow - facts really prove the Pac12 is clearly the toughest conference in the whole wide world!

    Is that enough facts? 'Cause I could break it down more if you still have trouble understanding the difference between quality wins and cupcake victories.

  • CougarSunDevil Phoenix, AZ
    Oct. 29, 2013 2:52 p.m.

    Spokane Ute

    Interesting how you lump Utah with the other bottom dweller's non conference schedules. However, the Devil is in the details (pun intended). Non conference wins by the PAC -12 cellar dwellers

    Washington St.
    Auburn - Lost
    Southern Utah - Win
    Idaho -Win

    Those are some powerhouses. You state Auburn as a top 25 team. I'll concede that if you concede that ASU only lost to two Top 25 teams (Notre Dame and Stanford), and BYU has a win over a top 25 team (Texas) but you won't let that happen.

    Colorado's power non conference schedule

    Colorado St - Win
    Central Arkansas beauty and hair salon college - Win
    Charleston southern culinary arts college - Win
    Fresno state - Postponed (luckily)

    And now the mighty Youths

    Utah State (refs gave you that one) - win
    Weber State win
    BYU - (again refs gave you that one) - win

    Great strength in that non conference slate.

    ASU's win over Wisconsin? It's the same way Utah won against BYU with the same refs. So shouldn't I say that Utah fans boasting about that win is the same as ASU boasting about their Wisconsin win? I admit, Refs gave it to ASU. Can you admit it?

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Oct. 29, 2013 2:51 p.m.

    @Besmart

    Let's look at his claim that "Utah, WSU and Colorado bring the conference down"; shall we? Per the Saragin Rankings:
    #39 Utah; wins over #7 Stanford, @ #24 BYU and #41 Utah State
    #47 WSU: win over #31 USC, 7 point loss @ #21 Auburn
    #93 Colorado
    8-1 in non-conference games, Average SOS = #15
    Let's compare that to the bottom of the SEC
    #53 Miss St.
    #71 Arkansas
    #83 Kentucky
    7-4 in non-conference games, Average SOS = 27
    Those three don't even come close to bringing the conference down. They prove how tough the conference is, top to bottom. I would challenge anyone to prove this statistically. Biased, and pointed opinions are one thing; statistics and facts are another.

  • Chris B Salt Lake City, UT
    Oct. 29, 2013 2:38 p.m.

    Yes, Utah has been at the bottom of the Pac 12.

    And byu has been below the team that has been at the bottom of the Pac 12.

    If byu can't beat Utah, and Utah can't beat most pac 12 teams(except top 10 ranked Stanford)who WOULD byu beat?

    Most Pac 12 teams > Utah > byu

    Tell us how "bad" we are. You're WORSE.

    LOL

  • MrPlate Lindon, UT
    Oct. 29, 2013 2:08 p.m.

    @Uteology,

    Did I say you quoted a fan? Aren't team members a loyal faction?

    Following a loss to Florida in 2012, LSU Linebacker Kevin Minter says "It is Florida. The humidity is ridiculous."

    Regarding the celebrations in the streets, am I limited to only significant wins on the first game of the season? Typical strategy for someone building a straw man argument - create parameters so narrow that no similar situations even exist, but I'll play your game anyway. You didn't stipulate any particular "fan base," although I suspect you'll come back with more restrictions.

    After defending Division 1AA champion Appalachian State beat Michigan in their season opener, "the team flew back to an airport in Johnson City, Tenn., about 55 miles from campus. The team's four buses were greeted 10 miles from town by a caravan of fire trucks, police cars and ambulances." There's much more available online about their street celebrations.

    Ok, these examples took about 2.5 minutes to find.

    Apparently Cougar Nation is NOT the ONLY fan base in the entire nation that makes weather-related excuses for losing, and celebrates in the street after an awesome victory.

    Don't be provincial.

  • CougarSunDevil Phoenix, AZ
    Oct. 29, 2013 1:55 p.m.

    Uteology
    Let me break down for you what ESPN said according to this Quote.

    "If this were a five-year projection, I think the Utes would be higher. But I also think they need to go through at least a full class cycle before they can really start climbing the Pac-12 hierarchy."

    This means Utah isn't good. How can you spin that any other way?

    Our preseason hype last season [2011] was misguided, and the Utes' lack of depth was exposed. It takes time to build not only a starting lineup that can win in the Pac-12, but also the depth behind those starters. The facility upgrades are a good step in the right direction."

    This quote was last year? in 2012? and you're using it as argument for this year? All you have done is confirmed what everyone else is saying, and everyone else is seeing, except those who wear crimson red colored goggles. Utah isn't good today. They MIGHT be good in five years. but they are not good TODAY.

    Nice try at the spin. See you in two weeks.

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Oct. 29, 2013 1:32 p.m.

    @Sundevil

    I find your posts very amussing. You come on here and bust on everything Utah. You do realize that Utah, WSU and Colorado are 8-1 in non-conference games don't you? The lone loss was to top 25 Auburn, at Auburn by WSU; 31-24. Now some of these wins were agains inferior opponents, something ASU is very familar with. I would be emabarassed to come on here under that screen name, and rank on any team after what the Refs gave ASU vs. Wisconsin. What has ASU ever done in the conference any way? Noooothing! Lost in the Rose Bowl like 14 years ago. No final 4, talk about bringing a conference down. Also, if you don't think that Utah, WSU and Colorado wouldn't beat Arkansas, Ole Miss and Kentucky; you are only kidding your self. BYU? the team that no conference will take? The team that can't beat thier bottom dwelling rival? Man it must be sad to be you.

  • BeSmart Cheyenne, WY
    Oct. 29, 2013 1:09 p.m.

    Uteology
    So you are saying you are on the same tier as Oregon, USC, and UCLA?
    Cougar Sun devil is right Utah is not (yet they may become that)
    He has a clue because he is right.
    I want the Utes to do well.
    But the last three years the Utes have shown nothing to prove they are top tier in the Pac

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Oct. 29, 2013 12:41 p.m.

    @CougarSunDevil

    You have no clue what you are talking about. Stick to BYU football.

    Here's what ESPN had said about Utah:

    "If this were a five-year projection, I think the Utes would be higher. But I also think they need to go through at least a full class cycle before they can really start climbing the Pac-12 hierarchy. Our preseason hype last season [2011] was misguided, and the Utes' lack of depth was exposed. It takes time to build not only a starting lineup that can win in the Pac-12, but also the depth behind those starters. The facility upgrades are a good step in the right direction."

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Oct. 29, 2013 12:13 p.m.

    Mr. Plate

    I have yet to see a single fact or statistic from you to back up your position. Oregon would throttle Texas A&M, but not Alabama; yet when the two schools played Alabama beat A&M 49-42. Fact! Non conference games are generally a meaningless joke; such as FSU vs. Miami, Notre Dame vs. Stanford, Alabama vs. Va. Tech, LSU vs. TCU, Clemson vs. Georgia, Oregon vs. Tennessee, Ohio St vs. Cal? None of the teams (Bama, Oregon St, Ohio St, FSU) in contention for the National Championship game, lost a non-conference game, yet these games are a joke? Oregon St must not have got the memo that there game vs. E. Washington was a "joke". Again, PAC 12 is 29-4 amd SEC is 32-7 in nonconferene games. Another Fact! They are very comparable to the SEC. You do understand the difference between a fact vs an opinion don't you? You seem to struggle with the concept. Go ahead and look up the scores of WSU vs. Auburn and Oregon vs. Tennessee for some more interesting Facts; which back up my position. A least counter with some type of statistic or fact.

  • CougarSunDevil Phoenix, AZ
    Oct. 29, 2013 11:46 a.m.

    Spokane Ute, Uteology, and ChrisB,

    You guys are trying to stand on the shoulders of the top teams of the conference. There is no doubt that the PAC 12 is a tough conference. But not from top to bottom. The bottom three teams (Utah, Colorado, and Washington State) hold the conference down. Oregon, USC, and UCLA have for years been the face of the Pacific conference. The runnin' YOUTHS are benefiting off of other teams success. When ESPN and other commentators talk about the Pacific conference and the strength therein, they are not talking about you. The runnin' YOUTHS are not in any way a strength to the Pacific conference. You tell BYU fans to take a dose of reality in their independence, now take some reality in yours. When people talk about how good the PAC-12 is, they are not talking about you. They just don't have time to list the nine schools that give the PAC it's strength.

  • CougarSunDevil Phoenix, AZ
    Oct. 29, 2013 11:37 a.m.

    Utah isn't going bowling unless they beat Washington State (possible) and rival Colorado. In a rivalry game, anything can happen. Colorado brought their winless road record to RES and dominated the overconfident utes in 2011. It could certainly happen again. These are the only two winnable games left on the ute's schedule since they will be extremely overmatched against Oregon and the ASU.

    I haven't been to these Orchard lanes I've heard about, maybe a ute fan can describe them to me since they are becoming regulars every December.

  • MrPlate Lindon, UT
    Oct. 29, 2013 11:28 a.m.

    @Spokane Ute - very interesting... uh, logic. Fact is, Alabama is "any" SEC team. I think it's delusional to think Oregon would throttle Alabama. Oregon would probably throttle "most" SEC teams, true. And, it could be countered that Alabama would throttle "most" Pac 12 teams, probably every Pac-12 team except Oregon, although it's blind homer speculation to claim Oregon would definitely throttle SEC teams LSU and Texas A&M.

    Yes, non-conference records are generally a meaningless joke for the elite conferences. If you think beating Furman, Nicholls State, and a host of other cupcakes gives you bragging rights and a realistic determination of your conference strength, well as you said, there's probably no point in further debate. I suspect you discount BYU's defeat of patsies to determine their strength, but the Pac-12's defeats over cupcakes makes them great. Ute fan logic.

    And, you think 7 consecutive BCS Championships doesn't show dominance over Pac-12 and every other conference, because the Pac-12 was only good enough to compete against an SEC team (and lose) in one NC game? Again, Ute fan logic.

    Your opinions don't offend me, but when you pretend they're facts, I'm amused.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Oct. 29, 2013 11:23 a.m.

    @MrPlate

    I didn't quote a fan. I quoted Tysom Hill for blaming his abysmal passing due to bad weather.

    Yes fans do rush the field, even Notre Dame fans rushed the field when they beat Utah a while back. But I wasn't talking about rushing the field now was I, I clearly said "street" celebrations.

    Show me another fan-base that celebrated a 1-0 start by:

    "PROVO — People danced in the streets. They hugged perfect strangers. They lit off fireworks. And in general, they celebrated and celebrated and celebrated. BYU fans formed impromptu gatherings at places like LaVell Edwards Stadium, the Marriott Center, and the Wilkinson Center, among others, and several hundred of them showed up at the Provo Municipal Airport to welcome home the team when it landed at 1:45 in the morning."

    The only thing missing was a celebration speech from Bronco... oh wait he did:

    "With the BYU students corralled behind a string of orange cones, BYU's coaches and players gave high-fives to their admirers before Mendenhall took a mic and briefly addressed them."

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Oct. 29, 2013 10:49 a.m.

    MrPlate

    Nope, noticed you mentioned the patsies the SEC played, but failed to list them like you did the PAC 12. Now that's curious? As far as Oregon throttling an SEC opponent; check out the Oregon - Tennessee score and the South Carolina - Tennessee score. If using statistics and records, not to mention head to head games is a "blind defense of the PAC 12", then there's no sense carrying on the debate any further. Non-conference games are meaningless? Not even sure how to respond. You seem to get defensive when some one has an opinion that differs? The PAC 12 is as good, if not better, then the SEC this year. The statistics and head to head results confirm that. Also, of those 7 BCS championships, how many were won vs. the PAC 12? One. Again, I was, and still comparing the conferences in the here and now; this year.

  • MrPlate Lindon, UT
    Oct. 29, 2013 10:29 a.m.

    @Uteology - ever heard of the word "provicialism?" You can usually tell someone is provincial when their comment starts with something like the following:

    "Cougar Nation is the ONLY fan base in the entire nation that..."

    Here's a couple of little clues. Some loyal factions of losing teams all over blame poor weather on their team's performance. Yes, it's tacky, considering the weather probably did not play favorites. Also, all teams and their fans ALWAYS celebrate significant victories, especially when they were pre-game underdogs. Good grief - Ute fans regularly rush the field when they defeat an unranked BYU.

    That you think BYU is the only place where people blame weather and celebrate big wins just means you need to get out more.

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Oct. 29, 2013 10:02 a.m.

    @USNGary

    So a guy on the amazing race was wearing a BYU shirt? Wow, that's awesome. That certainly confirms BYU's world wide presence. Did you see the fan on Monday night football last night wearing the Weber State shirt? just askin.....

  • USNGary San Diego, CA
    Oct. 28, 2013 11:43 p.m.

    you guys crack me up. utah fans really are delusional. just because you are in the pac whatever doesn't automatically make you a big boy, hence not getting full share for a few years after joining the conference. as far as having a national presence, BYU has a worldwide presence...anyone watch amazing race? a guy in Poland on tv wearing a BYU shirt. Didn't see any utah shirts. just sayin.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Oct. 28, 2013 10:04 p.m.

    @Cougsndawgs

    Lastly, uteology, you refute WJCoug's opinion with your own opinion masquerading as "facts". Again, hilarious.

    --------------

    What I said were facts, the only one masquerading is BYU football as a "legacy program".

    A) Blames the rain for losing
    B) Celebrates a 1-0 Quest in the streets like a championship

    -- Source A:

    I’m not trying to make excuses, because we didn’t make plays, but by the fourth quarter, the balls we were throwing were completely waterlogged,” said quarterback Taysom Hill.

    'BYU football: Mother Nature plays big role in BYU-Virginia game’ -- Deseret News

    -- Source B: BYU football: Provo celebrates stunning win -- Deseret News

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Oct. 28, 2013 9:45 p.m.

    Cougsndawgs
    West Point , UT

    Uteology:
    "The difference, Alabama plays in the same league as Auburn".

    This is hilarious. Utah and BYU were in the same league also for 10 of the 13 seasons since 2000. It's hilarious how quickly some Ute fans have forgotten their history and turned to snobbery because of being in a conference where they can't compete.

    -----------

    Since 2000 yes, since 2010 no. The last decade according to CBS Sports Utah was the #10 program, BYU #27.

    Since then we still OWN you on the field and talent (per NFL).
    We're still beating the teams you play week-in-week-out (8-1).
    The difference we can't compete in the PAC-12 yet.

  • Cougsndawgs West Point , UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 9:16 p.m.

    Uteology:
    "The difference, Alabama plays in the same league as Auburn".

    This is hilarious. Utah and BYU were in the same league also for 10 of the 13 seasons since 2000. It's hilarious how quickly some Ute fans have forgotten their history and turned to snobbery because of being in a conference where they can't compete.

    As for one shining season...no BYU has a history and winning tradition that needs no enumeration because it has been done exhaustively on these comment boards. BYU has accomplishments that Utah will frankly never have. This is why BYU gets the respect and benefit of a doubt from voters while Utah gets no such respect. Sorry, it is what it is...tradition, not ONE shining season (ok, maybe 2 in Utah's case...still no tradition or history of any significance).

    Lastly, uteology, you refute WJCoug's opinion with your own opinion masquerading as "facts". Again, hilarious.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Oct. 28, 2013 8:29 p.m.

    WJCoug
    South Jordan, Utah

    Got to proud of that PAC12 Conference! Utah - the only fan base in the entire United States that a) uses their conference as an excuse for losing and b) roots for the conference more than their team!

    Hilarious!

    -------------

    That's your opinion, here are two facts:

    Cougar Nation is the ONLY fan base in the entire nation that...

    A) Blames the rain for losing
    B) Celebrates a 1-0 Quest in the streets like a championship

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Oct. 28, 2013 8:18 p.m.

    @Cougsndawgs
    since 2000 do U know what Alabama's record is against Auburn...5-8. Hmm, same record BYU has against Utah, but who in their right mind thinks auburn has been the better program during that stretch. They had one shining season...sound familiar? And no, I'm not comparing BYU to Alabama, I'm showing rivalry games don't always indicate which program is strongest.

    ---------

    The difference, Alabama plays in the same league as Auburn.

    But maybe you are right, in the BCS era the team with:

    * No undefeated seasons
    * No BCS bowls
    * No BCS bowl wins
    * No top 5 finishes
    * 3-9 against the weaker program on the Hill

    Is the better program because it has ONE more AP ranking at #25.

    Meanwhile, BYU's still waiting for it's ONE shining season so they can break out their Quest t-shirts.

  • Darth Vader Ogden, UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 7:46 p.m.

    This stuff is too funny.

    Here is another factoid:

    BYU is still undefeated against Utah in all their hypothetical rematches.

  • WJCoug South Jordan, Utah
    Oct. 28, 2013 7:39 p.m.

    Got to proud of that PAC12 Conference! Utah - the only fan base in the entire United States that a) uses their conference as an excuse for losing and b) roots for the conference more than their team!

    Hilarious!

  • Cougsndawgs West Point , UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 6:23 p.m.

    Oregon is ridiculously good. I wouldn't wish them on my worst enemy. I've said for a few weeks now that I think Oregon should be ranked above Alabama, but the Tide have been playing very good football lately. That would be an epic game...and possibly the end of the streak for the SEC. Then throw FSU in the mix, or even Baylor. We can't get a playoff system soon enough (not this plus one nonsense).

  • TanMan_101 West Jordan, UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 6:12 p.m.

    Ha, cougar fans mocking whatever bowl we go to. Haha, the Kraft fight hunger bowl is one of the most mocked bowls around.

    Utah could beat Alabama, Oregon, Florida State, and Stanford by a combined 80 million points and Byu fans would then say that none of those wins are quality, they would then throw on their parachute pants and take their time machine back to 1984.

  • MrPlate Lindon, UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 6:00 p.m.

    @Spokane Ute - I'm pretty sure I mentioned that SEC teams schedule patsies in their pre-conference lineup. In your blind defense of the Pac 12, I'm sure you missed that. Just like the Pac 12, the SEC goes into their conference games claiming they're invincible because they beat up on the Furman's of the college football landscape. Many SEC teams are also overrated, but the Pac-12 pre-conference schedule is no less patsy-free than any other big league in the land. Non Conference Records for all big conferences are a total meaningless joke.

    The only domination I cited was regarding BCS Championship games. You might not consider 7 in a row, and 8 out of the last 10 to represent domination for the SEC, but I think most rational people would. And though I believe Oregon may be able to defeat Alabama, Ohio State, or Florida State, I think only a deluded homer would believe that any of these teams would "throttle" any of the others.

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Oct. 28, 2013 5:15 p.m.

    BeSmart

    It would be cool to see for sure. Florida State also looks like world beaters. Still a few games to be played between now and then, we shall see. Have a good evening Guy!

  • BeSmart Cheyenne, WY
    Oct. 28, 2013 5:00 p.m.

    @ Spokane
    I think you are right about Oregon throttling just about everybody from the SEC.
    I think Alabama and Oregon would be a close hard fought game.

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Oct. 28, 2013 4:17 p.m.

    @Mr. Plate

    Reeling off teams does mean much, but I will play along. UAB, Kent State, Furman, Arkansas st., W. Carolina, Florida Atlantic, Austin Peay, Western Kentucky, South Alabama. That's who LSU, Auburn and Tennessee scheduled this year. Should I continue?

    Per ESPN:
    "SEC West vs Pac-12 North: The popular debate over the last few weeks has been whether the Pac-12 North is better than the SEC West. The rankings say that the race is very close, but the Pac-12 North has a 1.3-point advantage over the SEC West."

    Per Saragin Rankings:
    1) SEC West
    2) PAC 12 North
    3) SEC East
    4) PAC 12 South

    Non Conference Record
    SEC: 32-7
    PAC 12: 29-4

    Dominating? Hardley. Comparable? Certainly. Oregon will throttle anyone from the SEC, watch and see.

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Oct. 28, 2013 3:32 p.m.

    @CougsnDawgs

    I got ya. Always appreciate the back and forth with you. You are a straight shooter, no doubt about it.

    @Sportsfan

    I'm talking about this year. Look at non conference wins, non conference win against BCS (BYU and Notre Dame too) schools. Look at Wash St @ Auburn and Tenn @ Oregon. Then get back to me. The SEC plays 8 conference games, vs. the PAC 12's 9. The SEC plays patsies in the non-conference. Look at head to head; PAC 12 vs. SEC over the last 5 and 10 years. Not much difference. You do realize Colorado split with Georgia don't you? How many of those BCS championships came against a PAC 12 foe? One.

    @Tators

    Agreed. A bowl gives a team more practices, helps in recruiting and pads the check book. I would settle for the New Mexico Bowl; sad but true, but it's not gonna happen if the offense doesn't get it's act together.

  • BlackDiamond Provo, UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 3:24 p.m.

    @ChriB
    I'm glad Jamal chose to play with a Division II team rather than going to the doormat of the Pac12!

  • Mr. Plate Lindon, UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 3:02 p.m.

    @Spokane Ute - you say "the non-conference records speak for them self."

    Yeah, those Pac 12 victories against Hawaii, Southern Utah, Idaho, Army, San Jose State, Illinois, Idaho State, Northerna Arizona, UNLV, UTSA, Portland State, Nicholls State, Virginia, Colorado State, Central Arkansas, Charleston Southern, Eastern Washington, Sacramento State, New Mexico State, Weber State, etc. really speaks for itself! Pac 12 teams are great because they beat up on patsies in pre-conference play, then go into their conference schedule talking like they've beaten the world. Between all 12 schools, they played about 8 games against top-level teams in their pre-conference schedules, and lost half of those games. And that's if you count Notre Dame as a top-level team.

    SEC teams do the same, but like has been mentioned above, the SEC teams then proceed to dominate the BCS championship games.

    Everyone in the Pac-12 is overrated, except Oregon.

  • Tators Hyrum, UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 2:57 p.m.

    @ Chris B:

    FYI: Other than a few ardent fans of the specific PAC12 programs, the only other demographic who realizes Utah is in the conference are the trivia buffs who talk about who the cellar dwellers are in each conference. Sad, but true. Utah can change that by starting to win conference games on a consistent basis. But so far that hasn't happened.
    That's not BYU fault. You should quit taking out your frustrations on them. I know it's grates on you that BYU is currently ranked double digits higher than Utah in literally every national poll. But until Utah starts showing up for their conference games, it's just something you're going to have to live with.

    Finding a quote of a single solitary inner-city teenage football player who wasn't previously familiar with BYU doesn't help your cause at all. It only makes you look desperate. BTW... that teenager, after learning about BYU, chose to go there above any PAC12 school. That leaves your quote without purpose.

    Don't give up, Chris. Even though BYU is already signed to a bowl game, it's still possible for Utah this year.

  • Tators Hyrum, UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 2:42 p.m.

    @ Chris B:

    Some people never seem to learn and are therefore considered lost causes. Things are now going so bad for the Utes and so good for BYU that you are going back to comments you made 2 months ago... that didn't even make any sense at that time. That last comment of yours had nothing to do with the subject matter of the article. Unfortunately, it seems to have cost you what little credibility you had regarding local college football. Please think about how your thoughts will read to others before writing and submitting them.

    Anyone who watches ESPN and/or any of the BYU football games knows without question that BYU is one of the better-known programs in national college football. Stadiums are sold out wherever BYU plays across the country. Literally all national pollsters, including coaches in the AP Coaches poll vote for BYU much more often than they do for Utah... thus BYU is ranked much higher in all current polls which yes, do include strength of schedule factored in.

    Don't take it personally that BYU, though starting slowly, is able to finish their seasons strongly... just opposite of Utah.

  • Big R Danville, CA
    Oct. 28, 2013 2:26 p.m.

    I feel badly that the fans aren't getting more accurate information. USC played at Hawaii and will play 13 games this year so they need 7 wins not 6 and must win 2 more games to be bowl eligible. Not a big deal, but if the sports reporters don't understand things like this, how can the average fan get educated?

  • Tators Hyrum, UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 1:50 p.m.

    It's very notable that some of the more hardcore Utah fans were bragging unendingly in the pre and early season about their conference affiliation and how wonderful it was to have such an impressive schedule coming up.

    Now what we're mostly hearing from those same fans is complaints about how tough their schedule is. Some are even trying to deflect to only their non-conference games and hoping we'll all forget all the great conference games. Actually, there was one of those.

    @ TFUDD: The only reason some BYU fans are getting on some Ute commenters is because they earlier endured all those braggings about how great it was to be in a powerhouse conference. And now those same Ute commenters are complaining about how tough their conference schedule is and using it as an excuse for losing. Can't have it both ways.

    FYI: Besides conference leading Texas, BYU also gave Houston it's only loss of the year. Both are ranked significantly better than Utah in all the current national polls, while BYU is ranked better than all 3 of them... Strength of schedule included.

    @ Spokane Ute: Any bowl game is better than no bowl game.

  • perfidemintrepidus Riverton, UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 1:49 p.m.

    Wouldn't it be interesting if BYT and Utah ended up playing each other in a bowl game? I suppose the possibility is there, albeit not likely to happen.

  • SportsFan Orem, UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 1:31 p.m.

    Spokane Ute

    Remind us how many BCS championships the "most over-rated conference in the country" has won, and how many the "conference of champions" has won.

    BCS Championships
    SEC 9 (including 7 in a row)
    PAC 0

    The SEC is 9-1 in BCS Championships games; their only loss - when Alabama beat LSU in 2011.

    Utah fans embarrass themselves with their hyperbole.

  • Cougsndawgs West Point , UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 1:21 p.m.

    SokaneUte:
    You're right not everyone knows about BYU either...that wasn't my point. I was pointing out what's obvious to everyone except Chris B.

    I'm also not going to argue conference strength with you...I will let the SEC's dominance of CFB for nearly a decade speak for itself. Until another conference proves otherwise, the SEC is the true conference of champions when it comes to CFB.

  • BeSmart Cheyenne, WY
    Oct. 28, 2013 1:07 p.m.

    @ Chris B
    that running back you quote so often.
    Chose BYU over Utah
    He had offers from both.
    And Oregon for that matter.

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Oct. 28, 2013 12:58 p.m.

    CougsnDawgs

    "Every" college football fan doesn't know that Utah is in the PAC 12, nor does "every" fan know BYU is an independent. As far as SEC fans go; the most over rated conference in the country. Florida hasn't played a non-conference out of state game since 1991. The PAC 12 is stronger than the SEC this year, the non-conference records speak for them self. SEC fans don't even know the war is over.

  • Cletus from Coalville Coalville, UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 12:51 p.m.

    Every football fan in american knows we are in the Pac 12 and that we keep losing but no worry we will still get recruits despite are record because we are in a bcs.

    Go Utes!

  • BlackDiamond Provo, UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 12:48 p.m.

    I'm sorry Utes but playing tough games is not going to win you a National Champion, its actually winning them!

  • Cougsndawgs West Point , UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 12:48 p.m.

    Spokane Ute:
    "for my I-Pad so I can watch every Utah game, no matter where I go. I can't do the same for BYU games, but who gives a rip?"

    Actually, u can watch all BYUs games on apple devices too...BYUtv app, and watch espn. I'm not saying that to show you up, I'm saying that so u can enjoy cougar games wherever you go now too. And good question...who gives a rip?

  • Cougsndawgs West Point , UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 12:40 p.m.

    "Every football fan in American knows Utah is in the Pac 12 "

    LOL...no they don't. I have several friends that are SEC fans that don't care about the PAC12, let alone Utah. I was talking to one of them over the weekend because we do pick'elms and fantasy football leagues together. He said, I quote "Utah will beat USC because the Trojans can't even beat a mid-major program right now". He thought Utah was in the MW, still. He's from Georgia so I guess PAC12 news doesn't reach him out there...or he just doesn't care (I assure u it's the latter).

    I know in your play world everyone cares about Utah, Chris, but in reality they don't even know a lot about them because they just don't give a...

    LOL!

  • Veritas Aequitas Fruit Heights, UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 12:39 p.m.

    Chris B
    Salt Lake City, UT

    Every football fan in American knows Utah is in the Pac 12
    =====
    My Cousin Vinny (1992)

    Vinny: 'It is possible that the two utes...'
    Judge Chamberlain Haller: 'Ah, the two what? Uh, uh, what was that word?'
    Vinny: 'Uh, what word?'
    Judge Chamberlain Haller: 'Two what?'
    Vinny: 'What?'
    Judge Chamberlain Haller: 'Uh, did you say 'utes'?'
    Vinny: 'Yeah, two utes.'
    Judge Chamberlain Haller: 'What is a ute?'
    Vinny: 'Oh, excuse me, your honor.'
    Vinny: 'Two YOUTHS.'

    Chris, I have my calendar out. Anything I need to mark down?

    Rose Bowl still the winner of Utah and UCLA? Dang, we shoulda won that one!

  • Cougsndawgs West Point , UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 12:32 p.m.

    Utah fans: t's great that U are in the PAC12 and getting more money and more exposure. The fact that U get tough games every week with exciting opponents is great and I believe the envy of SOME BYU fans. U have had BYUs number for the last little while, so in terms of the rivalry U have bragging rights for now.

    But it's ironic that U use the hand that feeds U as an excuse for your fallures. It's also hilarious how U try and minimize BYUs accomplishments by saying they don't play anyone...they have the 21st toughest schedule in America, and I dare say Utah doesn't beat Texas, Boise, or Houston (who curb stomped Rutgers on the road this weekend) right now. Btw, in terms of rivalry...since 2000 do U know what Alabama's record is against Auburn...5-8. Hmm, same record BYU has against Utah, but who in their right mind thinks auburn has been the better program during that stretch. They had one shining season...sound familiar? And no, I'm not comparing BYU to Alabama, I'm showing rivalry games don't always indicate which program is strongest.

  • BeSmart Cheyenne, WY
    Oct. 28, 2013 12:21 p.m.

    Every football fan in america knows?
    That is a joke.
    getting a little desperate these days

  • Chris B Salt Lake City, UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 12:14 p.m.

    Byu has a "national audience" only so far as there are Mormon people spread throughout the nation. Let's look at what your non-Mormon own star running back said about byu.

    "I thought Byu was a division II program"

    Jamall Williams

    LOL!

    Every football fan in American knows Utah is in the Pac 12

    Your OWN recruit thought you were a division II program.

    LOL!

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Oct. 28, 2013 12:12 p.m.

    I have been watching every Utah and BYU game here in Spokane. I have an application (ESPN Familly and PAC 12 Channel)for my I-Pad so I can watch every Utah game, no matter where I go. I can't do the same for BYU games, but who gives a rip? Have we reduced our selfs to argueing over TV access? Pretty sad.

  • Steven S Jarvis Orem, UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 12:07 p.m.

    @Uteology

    TCU has the same sort of injury problems that Utah has. Its a depth issue. TCU lost their starting QB and other key starters during the first two weeks. Utah started losing key players early too. The injuries are piling up. BYU helped out with that even though Utah won. You can't ignore that the game had a physical and emotional impact on the Utes.

  • BeSmart Cheyenne, WY
    Oct. 28, 2013 12:04 p.m.

    @scenic view
    Or most major cable companies east of the rockies.
    Pac-12 Network available in 40 million homes
    BYUtv 50 million

  • scenic view Baltimore, MD
    Oct. 28, 2013 11:47 a.m.

    "BYU has had Every game on National TV."

    SoonerUte: "So do the Utes."

    Unless, of course, you have DirecTV, in which case, you can't even get Utah games in SLC.

    I've been able to watch every BYU game here in Baltimore, but less than half of Utah's games.

  • Reno Cougs Fan 68 Reno, NV
    Oct. 28, 2013 11:38 a.m.

    4 in a row,
    No bitterness here! 6-2 already bowl eligible and going bowling!!! Team is playing great and have some great games ahead!!! Must kind of hurt that the team you barely beat is now so far ahead of you in so many ways!!! Love my independence!!!

    Go Cougs beat the Badgers!!!

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Oct. 28, 2013 11:32 a.m.

    @USN Gary

    Yes, and the lowest of the low tier bowl game each year..........jusy stayin

    6, 7, 8, 9 or 10 wins sends BYU to the same destination. It is fair? Probably not. Is it true? Absolutely!

  • yarrlydarb Ogden, UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 10:28 a.m.

    "Pac-12 may get more than its share of bowl berths"

    Which really means the conference teams play against lower-level "competition."

    Otherwise, they'd knock each other off in conference play.

    I can't stand the Pac-12 football; yes, Utah included!

  • BlameItOnTheOfficials Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 10:22 a.m.

    I'm surprised that so many of my fellow die-hard Ute fans have given up on our team this year. It obvious by the focus and attention to next years schedule before we even finish this year. I'm disappointed in all of you. I still see a bowl game on the horizon for us THIS season!

    Go Utes

  • Mtn Tracker Ephraim, UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 10:17 a.m.

    I saw a shirt the other day that had a tiny little Utah logo in the middle of it with great big Pack 12 across the top. I couldn't help but laugh!! I'm sure New Mexico and Air Force fans are wearing big Mountian West Conference shirts loud and proud too!!! BYU has had Every game on National TV. Their contract with ESPN gives them more than the puke 12 ever could. Face it the only reason Ute fans wear that crap is to taunt BYU fans. Too bad they just make us laugh!!

  • BeSmart Cheyenne, WY
    Oct. 28, 2013 10:15 a.m.

    Give credit where credit is due.
    BYU is 6-2 with the 21st ranked schedule (probably the best record a school from Utah has had against this tough of schedule)
    9 out of 12 teams BYU will/ or has played will play in a bowl (10 if you include Utah)
    Houston, Texas, and Wisconsin could end up in BCS bowl games this year.
    No offense BYU has lost to 2 of the worse opponents this year.
    BYU victories (sagarin rankings) Texas-22, GT-33, BSU-38, Houston 40, Utah State 41, MTSU 110
    Utah victories Stanford-7, BYU,24, Utah State 40, Weber 211.
    BYU losses Virginia-86 Utah 39
    Utah losses OSU-34, UCLA 17, USC 31, Arizona 30.
    Looking at those rankings BYU has some good victories, and so does Utah.

  • USNGary San Diego, CA
    Oct. 28, 2013 10:11 a.m.

    The Moose, other than being in the MWC, when has BYU gone to the same bowl? Third different bowl in 3 years... just sayin'

  • Oatmeal Woods Cross, UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 10:10 a.m.

    Utah is in trouble for the next five years. No BYU game to energize their athletes and fan base for two years. We've always known that many Utah fans are more anti-BYU than they are pro-Utah.

    No bowl games. It will hurt recruiting.

    Membership in the PAC-12 practically requires that our 2nd and 3rd string players are as good as your first string. Recruiting must drastically improve for Utah to succeed.

    Will Coach Whitt be able to withstand rising criticism? Utah is in a tougher situation (in many ways) than BYU is with independence. And that is saying something!

    I predict that we'll see a change at head coach on the hill in 12-24 months. And that will be a shame. Whit is really good at getting his team up for 1-3 tough games per year. He certainly does it for the BYU game. Whit gets that last measure and effort out of his players. He plans and out-strategizes his opponents. But Utah lacks the depth to compete in the PAC-12 on a week-to-week basis.

  • PACute_ Salt Lake City, Utah
    Oct. 28, 2013 9:56 a.m.

    Utah fans are hilarious. They beat their chests about their tough schedules (2013 is the FIRST season in Utah history that Utah has had a SOS ranked in the Top FORTY), then instead of using their "tough" schedule as a springboard to success, they use it as an excuse for losing.

    LOL at Moose's spin. If Texas, Boise State, Wisconsin and Notre Dame are "patsies", what does that make Arizona, California, Washington State and Colorado?

  • rogerdpack2 Orem, UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 9:46 a.m.

    Utah seems to bounce back from losses reasonably well, my guess is they'll win another 2 [one being colorado, serously, that's a gimme, right?] and go bowling (from a BYU fan).

  • The Moose Southern, UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 9:34 a.m.

    The BYU fans make me laugh. They are ripping Utah for not having a good record. I have posted this before, but by their mentality Duschesne football is better than Alta football because Duschesne is 10 - 0 and Alta is sub 500. We beat you, we beat Stanford, we play with the big boys every week. I for one would not trade places with you. You lose your first few games every year and then play patsies to pad your stats and go to the same bowl no matter what. Talk about exciting.

  • USNGary San Diego, CA
    Oct. 28, 2013 9:23 a.m.

    Uteology
    This is the only year you have a top 5 schedule only because you are playing Stanford and Oregon and not cal and Washington, and you still didn't go bowling last year. You ute fans are delusional. Northern Illinois or Fresno do not have tougher schedules but are going bowling and are ranked. Guess a top 5 SOS means nothing except to you guys.

  • USAlover Salt Lake City, UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 9:21 a.m.

    Ute fans don't get it.

    BYU fans don't get it.

    Ute fans proudly displayed PAC 12 stickers everywhere: cars, refrigerators, kids clothing, faces, hats...almost more than Utah stuff. They stuck their acceptance in BYU's face and rubbed it in. Well, three years later, BYU has won as many PAC 12 championships as Utah...in every sport!

    BYU fans love to point this out but their football team simply is afraid of playing Utah. They play their worst, most conservative and nervous game against the Utes every year. So...be quiet. Your team is afraid of Utah! And for no good reason...

  • Uteanymous Salt Lake City, Utah
    Oct. 28, 2013 9:14 a.m.

    Uteology

    Better dust off a shelf in your trophy closet for another SOS trophy.

    Meanwhile, BYU is knocking on the door of the real Top 25:

    AP/Coaches/BCS/Sagarin/Composite(100 rankings)

    #28/#30/#27/#24/#16 BYU(6-2) #21 SOS - average BYU #25
    ur/ur/#44/#39/#40 Utah(4-4) #4 SOS - average Utah #41

  • Hochmut West Jordan, UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 9:12 a.m.

    Utah is in trouble, not just because of a dismas finish possible this year, but if they don't make it to a bowl game, then their recruiting will be hurt. Who will want to come to Utah to play when you don't go to a bowl game most of the time. The other PAC12 schools will use that in their pitch;

    And, BYU and Utah in a bowl game in SF? No way. Does nothing for either school. BYU and UT no longer need each other; Utah needs to concentrate on winning the PAC12 South, if ever that can be done. BYU needs to continue to play across the country teams from every part of the land to continue their exposure for the Church. This is not rocket science. BYU will continue to evolve into a national presence over time and their fan base will be treated to games that no other team can complete with and the end result will be increase in exposure; increase in recruiting away from the Mtn West; better schedules and an opportunity to pitch their product.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Oct. 28, 2013 9:00 a.m.

    @Steven S Jarvis

    So in your world Utah is so physically and emotionally beaten by the rivalry game that they end up not being able to compete in the PAC-12, thus missing out on a bowl?

    But BYU, the team that is getting owned in the rivalry, the team that is on record of saying that it's their Super Bowl game, is not affected at all?

    That's the logic your going to use to show why Utah struggles and BYU excels after the game?

    In your mind it has nothing to do with the fact that we play a Big 5 schedule and you don't?

    TCU after dominating the MWC is also struggling in a Big 5 league, do you want to take credit for that as well?

  • toosmartforyou Farmington, UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 8:54 a.m.

    Interesting, StGtoSLC, that you don't recognize subtle sarcasm. Or the fact that Utah is in deep trouble and will go bowling yet again at Orchard Lanes. Their offense was non-existent against a "winnable USC" that had a limited roster due to injuries and other issues. And the mighty Ute defense gave up several field goals, each one putting the game further out of reach.
    For them to think they were the greatest thing since sliced bread after eking out a home victory against Stanford, who obviously looked past Utah (why wouldn't they fall into such a trap since the Utes haven't exactly played like champions before even on their home turf), suddenly such thinking came home to roost in Arizona. That should have been a clarion call to improve immediately , not waiting for the pathetic loss in los Angeles. Now they are in a difficult spot and we see the blogs still saying things like the game against Colorado is a gimmie, Washington State is a sure bet, etc. They're even talking smack about beating BYU for a 5th time. And so it goes.

  • Ed Grady Idaho Falls, ID
    Oct. 28, 2013 8:44 a.m.

    "Who has BSU beaten?"

    Utah every time they've played since 1986.

  • hamrdown OREM, UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 8:29 a.m.

    I posted this about a week ago - What happens if Utah does get to 6-6 and are left out of a bowl game? First, I don't think Utah will get 6 wins. Second, would a bowl take a 6-6 Utah team over another team with 7 or 8 wins, my guess is no.

    In addition, I don't see Utah beating Oregon or ASU - both teams are rolling right now. WSU is a toss-up but the way the Utes play conference games on the road and with a weak secondary, I think Mike Leach will have his QB attack them all game long and win that game. My prediction, Utah only wins one more game this year - Colorado.

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Oct. 28, 2013 7:22 a.m.

    It's hard to go to a bowl when you can't win a conference road game; or even a home game against a decent team. I wouldn't be suprised to see Utah go 7-5; or 5-7 for that matter. The Arizona and USC games were very telling and dissapointing.

  • Cletus from Coalville Coalville, UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 7:04 a.m.

    We will win the rest of our teams and go play a bowl because we won byu and weber and because we are bcs and the teams we will win are winable.

    Go Utes!

  • thebig1 SLC, UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 6:49 a.m.

    any team with less than 8 wins should stay home. What a diluted piece of nothing the bowl season is.

  • Steven S Jarvis Orem, UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 6:31 a.m.

    @Uteology

    Honestly, Utah will do fine against Michigan and Fresno State next year at least earning a split. The problem that the Utes have had in playing BYU and USU as opposed to those two teams is that Utah lacks depth to win games the second half of the season that they really should win during the first half. Its the Utes Achilles heel! They beat BYU, take injuries then fall flat for the next four or so games while players recover. Beating BYU last year resulted in Utah missing a bowl last year. If Wilson doesn't recover from his finger issue (from the BYU game) and the Utes miss a bowl, beating BYU has cost Utah two bowls in a row. Michigan and Fresno won't beat up on the Utes as physically as rivalry games do. I also believe Utah is the stronger team in each of those match-ups since the games are in September. Utah should start stronger in the PAC12 next year having dodged USU and BYU.

    BYU will also benefit not having the Utes on the schedule.

  • BlueHusky Mission Viejo, CA
    Oct. 28, 2013 5:01 a.m.

    Problem is who will watch a couple of 6 win teams in a tater bowl game? Only some of their fans.

  • TFUDD SLC, UT
    Oct. 28, 2013 1:07 a.m.

    I love how BYU fans joke about the Utes not going bowling. Trying playing in the PAC-12! I can see BYU doing as well as the Utes but there is no way that you do better! So stop trying to rag on the Utes when your schedule is much much easier. Lets be honest...Who has BSU beaten? well when you play in the MWC it should be easy to win a lot of games. Houston has hardly played a tough team all year(you barely won). Who has Georgia Tech beaten? Texas is a decent team this year...decent. They beat Oklahoma...well we are 4-4 and we beat Stanford. Any team can be another team on any given day.

    BYU is having a good season but lets be realistic...who have you beaten? Your only "good" win was over a decent Texas. The Utes need to step up and string some wins together because we are playing terrible....pretty sure my thoughts are very random and unorganized but I thought I would vent a little before going to bed.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Oct. 27, 2013 11:48 p.m.

    This year is tough enough, next year will be brutal. Current BCS rankings have 6 teams in the top 30, with 4 games on the road.

    #2 Oregon 8-0
    #5 @Stanford 7-1
    #16 Fresno 7-0
    #20 @UCLA 5-2
    #21 @Michagon 7-1
    #28 @ASU 5-2

    Just for giggles the team down south should easily be able to make their 10 straight bowl game next year.

    #23 @UCF 6-1
    #31 Houston 6-1
    #33 @Texas 5-2
    #55 @Boise State 5-3

    Granted, Texas and Boise State could easily be a top 20 team again next year but still it's an easy schedule. Since Tyson Hill has learned to pass and Utah, a guarantee loss, is no longer on their schedule they could go undefeated.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Oct. 27, 2013 11:31 p.m.

    This year is tough, but next year it gets worse.

    Our built in win against BYU is replaced with a tough road game at Michigan (currently #21) and Fresno State (#16) replaces Utah State on our non-conference schedule.

    Hopefully this year we can fix the QB issues and win at least 2 more games.

    Go UTES!

  • SLCWatch Salt Lake City, UT
    Oct. 27, 2013 10:37 p.m.

    Wow, Chris B. (aka 4 in a row!) you don't recognize two of the previous four posts are U of U fans? Why so paranoid? Also you are off topic.

  • StGtoSLC SALT LAKE CITY, UT
    Oct. 27, 2013 10:32 p.m.

    Three of the remaining four are absolutely winnable, but not with an offense like the one that showed up in LA on Saturday.

  • StGtoSLC SALT LAKE CITY, UT
    Oct. 27, 2013 10:28 p.m.

    "Interesting that the three PAC 12 teams not going to bowls are likely Washington State, Utah and Colorado. That shouldn't surprise anyone."

    Interesting that you don't know conference teams' records at all or what most projections have. Shouldn't surprise anyone.

  • Steven S Jarvis Orem, UT
    Oct. 27, 2013 10:25 p.m.

    Utah will get to six. So will everyone else in the league leaving at least one team sitting home with six wins. I hope it isn't Utah.

    Right now the Big12 looks to have up to two open slots. Army probably leaves an open slot as well. Notre Dame and the SEC will get two of those open slots and that leaves one likely slot open for about ten or so teams (two from the PAC). There will also be a mid major with 8 or 9 wins that will get left out this year. Its very likely some 6 win teams won't go bowling.

  • 4 in a row! Ogden, UT
    Oct. 27, 2013 9:08 p.m.

    Wow, surely these previuos posts/folks only dreamed of going to BYU.

    Why so bitter?

  • Who am I sir? Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Oct. 27, 2013 8:56 p.m.

    A 30/6 record out of conference is over 80% wins. That is the record considering all 12 PAC members. That is one tough league! In conference when each member plays another - one has to lose. Is it any wonder why it is so difficult to win league games? 9 weeks of a tough opponent after another. Two more wins for Utah? Seeing two games are against top 25 teams it will be VERY difficult. Go Utes!

  • Tom in CA Vallejo, CA
    Oct. 27, 2013 8:43 p.m.

    "Utah and Washington State, each have four wins with four games left."

    Hard to comprehend.

  • toosmartforyou Farmington, UT
    Oct. 27, 2013 8:19 p.m.

    Interesting that the three PAC 12 teams not going to bowls are likely Washington State, Utah and Colorado. That shouldn't surprise anyone.

  • Joe Schmoe Orem, UT
    Oct. 27, 2013 8:14 p.m.

    Utah already played its bowl game a few weeks ago. Staying home for the Holidays isn't so bad. It wasn't last year was it?