If you want to be a successful politician and get re-elected, just use tax
dollars and public debt to buy yourself a large constituency of loyal parasites
who want and then depend on handouts to fill the void left by a dearth of
opportunity due to the way the economy has been stifled, overtaxed, and
over-regulated. The formula is fairly simple, and has been used over and over
to destroy free market capitalism and to replace it with socialism, which then
tends to devolve into absolute communism if even more self-serving and impatient
people grab power. But we're apparently very slow learners, so the pattern
repeats and repeats, and the factions cheering for this transition continue to
multiply and grow in number.
RedShirt,To know that you have equated me in your mind with one of your
children makes more sense and tells me where you are coming from. Please know
that, unlike you have indicated about your own children, we are not lazy. While
poor college students doing undergrad work, we didn't rely on food stamps.
While young in the years after graduating, we didn't anticipate losing a
job whose operations went overseas right after we bought our first car and home,
yet we certainly weren't lazy about looking for work. We did menial jobs to
get by in the interim. We hadn't been out of college long enough to amass a
good supply of food storage (we'd been saving up for a down payment on a
home). Pontificating as you have communicates an overly self-righteous and quite
misguided mindset. Also, you have failed to provide sufficient evidence that you
have walked in the shoes of those who care for (and transport) small children
with disabilities. My original post was to show how the food stamp program often
helps those not helping themselves, but is not always available to those who
Re:UthahNativeOne thing we know about Redshirt is that he has never walked
in your shoes.Some people are just stunted in their development as human
beings.“I would rather make mistakes in kindness and
compassion than work miracles in unkindness and hardness.” ―
Mother Teresa All i can say in response to some of the comments
here:"It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than
to open one's mouth and remove all doubt."Mark Twain
To "Utah Native" I have been out of work. However, I didn't worry
about food or missing car payments because I had a supply of food on my shelves,
and a car that was paid for.I used to ride the bus while going to
school, and I saw severly handicapped people getting on and off the bus along
with parents of disabled children doing the same.Still, lets look
objectively at what you were doing. You were borrowing money to pay for a car
when your children were hungry. To me, that seems like the wrong priority to
have. For me, I will feed my family first, then worry about the car payment.That is great that you have learned to be self reliant since then.You are reminding me of my kids when I tell them that they have to do
some unpleasant work. They don't like it either, they would rather sit and
Dear RedShirtMIT, Again, you do not "fully understand" the
situation. Who says we had a fancy car? We did not. It was very much an economy
car. It just happened to be "new" enough in its model year to disqualify
us from assistance. Again, who says we had money to make car payments? We did
not. You missed the point where I said we'd lost our jobs. We had to borrow
money from our parents for this. I think you also missed the part where a car
was needed to transport two small children, one with special needs who could not
walk until she was nearly 4. You may suggest the bus, but until you show
evidence that you have managed an immobile toddler while also carting an infant
in a baby carrier, you have no credibility in this matter whatsoever. It is also
laughable that you term this an "easy life;" in what way was it easy to
have no job, no food, and small children to care for? Your tone is so obtuse in
missing the point of my post, and self-righteous. We have done nothing but be
self-reliant since that time.
Does Obama even have a clue of what is going on in the country he runs? He is in
way over his head!!!!!!!!!!
To "Utah Native" that is a nice addendum to your story, but it still is
not justification for getting food stamps. Like I said before. If you have
money to make car payments, then you have money to feed your family. So what if
you lose you car? Does it really matter that it is "inconvienient" to
take small children on public transportation?I hate to break it to
you, but nobody is entitled to fancy cars or an easy life.Yes life
is difficult some times, but expecting others to care for us is not the
solution. We must do all within our own power to take care of the needs of our
families. If that means it takes 1 minute longer to get on a city bus, that is
far better than allowing yourself to become bitter waiting for others to care
"Poverty and the all-consuming fretting that comes with it require so much
mental energy that the poor have little brain power left to devote to other
areas of life, according to the findings of an international study published on
Thursday.The mental strain could be costing poor people up to 13 IQ
(intelligence quotient) points, and means they are more likely to make mistakes
and bad decisions that amplify and perpetuate their financial woes, researchers
found."Our results suggest that when you are poor, money is not
the only thing in short supply. Cognitive capacity is also stretched thin,"
said Harvard economist Sendhil Mullainathan, part of an international team that
conducted the study.(MSN 2013)In a series of experiments,
researchers from Harvard, Princeton and other universities in North America and
from Britain's University of Warwick found that pressing financial worries
had an immediate impact on poor people's ability to perform well in
cognitive and logic tests.Far from signaling that poor people are
stupid, the results suggest those living on a tight budget have their effective
brain power, or what the researchers called "mental bandwidth,"
dramatically limited by the stress of making ends meet."
Shortly after we had our fourth child, my husband lost his job. We applied for
food stamps and were accepted. I was appalled at how much we received. Nearly
$900 a month! Our previous food budget had been $100 a week, which included all
of our non food items. We also qualified for WIC, which we did not accept
because..well, we couldn't possibly spend it all. So could we just use
what we need and let the rest go? NO! IT ROLLS OVER. And before long, we had
an absurd amount built up on our card. So. Much. Waste. We could have easily
lived off half, and even less if we tried hard. Not much motivation to get a
job. Luckily, we found work soon and were able to get off the program (even
though we still qualified). But we've never eaten better than the few
months we were on food stamps.
What ever the problems are with SNAP, the alternative is unthinkable. I would
rather pay higher taxes than see starving families huddled in store doorways.
There are people who need help, for what ever reason, and I want my tax dollars
go to them. If the percentage of fraud was the same as the level of down right
larceny in the armed forces then I would be alarmed. But it's not.People are more important than money. If there is fraud then
investigate and prosecute. If states are short on funds then don't build
that big new police station, or school. Those things we can live without.
People cann't kive without food.
RedShirtMIT, By "fully understand," sounds like you have all the
answers without having heard the entire story. Let me fill you in. The car which
disqualified us from food stamps was purchased six months before we lost
employment. Upside down on the loan-to-value ratio, a hefty balance to pay back
the car loan would remain were we to sell, but that would also leave us without
a car needed to transport a small child with disabilities to and from hospital
and doctor's appointments. (Just for kicks, or so you can more "fully
understand" the situation, try hefting a baby car seat and a toddler with
substantial motor impairments around on public transportation some time.) Food
stamps were intended to temporarily sustain a small family while we searched
daily for six months for work. We've not been on public assistance since.
Is this not what the food stamp program should be about, helping families who
have temporary need, who go on to be financial contributors to society?
It blows my mind how many people saying they saw such and such person doing
something with food stamps and they have this and that and it bothers them. You
don't know their situations. You think you do. You assume you do, but you
really don't. Quit judging others and be grateful.
So, the percentage of SNAP benefits illegally converted to cash is 1 or 2
percent? Probably less than most retail businesses lose to shoplifters, etc.
Seems to me that the story was really about how effective the program is.Many of the comments on this thread reflect conservative mythology: SNAP
is plagued by rampant abuse. That's bunk. The program is not a handout for
the unemployed or lazy; over 90 percent of funds go to the elderly, working
families, or the seriously disabled.Shouldn’t food stamps be
every conservative's favorite benefit program? It's a success story
with a narrow mission, costs that link directly to impact, and a proven record
of effectiveness. An April 2012 USDA report credited the program with
singlehandedly reducing the prevalence of poverty by 4.4 percent from 2000 to
2009.Food stamps are the bottom layer of the social safety net. Even
if you think government generally does too much, can’t it step in to
prevent the elderly, children, poor, and sick from going hungry? A society that
leaves these people to die is hardly a society at all.
We could take a cue from the old Salem Witch Trials, where the suspect was bound
and trrown into deep water: witches would survive, innocent people would die.
Let's cut the program back to 36 billion a year: those who do not need SNAP
will not be endangered; those who need SNAP to survive--and their children--will
starve, or show up at local ER's for emergency treatment. A side benefit
will be that those who starve will be buried and will no longer need SNAP, which
can be cut farther until there are no more poor left and America will be good
osm from Idahotrue story! we had a man working for us getting paid $17 an
hour.He quit and moved to Washington to be with family. Is out of a job and
getting food stamps now. .why doesn't the government make people do
anything they can to make people earn the food stamps they receive. there are
plenty of community services that can be done to help people keep their dignity
and teach self reliance. there is definitely fraud in the system.
Lightbearer, You misunderstand me. I am not opposed to helping those who are
truly in need,or physically or mentally incapable of helping themselves or those
who occasionally need a hand up, but I am opposed to those who scam the system.
That is not being 'judgmental', that is seeing a wrong and wanting it
made right. The early church had such a problem, able bodied people refusing to
work and expecting others to support them. Read 2 Thessalonians chapter 3. You
probably won't like Paul's solution, It doesn't line up with
current political trends. Non of us would walk into our neighbors house and
clean out his frig to feed someone else. That would be stealing. Yet the same
people have no problem using the ballot box to vote for the guy who promises to
increase taxes and benefits which is the same thing. You are just using the
power of the gov't to steal the paycheck of your neighbor and give it to
someone else who may or may not need it. Theft is theft. Charity is Latin for
love. Charity is you giving freely on your own, not the gov't
redistributing other peoples money.
I stand with the prior comment made by RBB on this issue.No one is
saying there aren't legitimate needs out there. But to say this is the job
of government, is untrue. You fail to understand the role of government as
written in the Constitution.The role of government is to provide
basic rights and enforce laws to protect people's abilities to pursue those
rights. It does not give you a right to eat nor does it give the government to
right to regulate your eating. That law is biblical. It is that you
reap what you sow and that if you do not work, you do not eat.The
real tragedy of the food stamp program, beyond the wasted money and lack of
regulation and contention it causes among us, is this mindset it has created
that the government is responsible for providing our meals.This is
an unconstitutional and unrighteous mindset. It is not the government's
responsibility to feed you. It is yours. If you need help, then let's get
government out of the way. My neighbor and church can do that, unregulated and
discreetly.We the people are the answer, not government.
@ The Real Maveric and FatherofFourI have no problem with people
receiving help who need it. I take time off work and volunteer at our local
bishop's storehouse. I do get a little annoyed, however, then the woman in
front of me at the store is buying steak with food stamps and then drops a
Benjamin to buy a case of beer and a carton of cigarettes. If you cannot afford
to feed yourself, you cannot afford to smoke or drink. I have a
relative who is an administrator at a local high school. She gets really
frustrated when she processes fee waivers for kids who are "poor" and
they show up wearing the latest designer clothes (i.e. clothes she cannot
afford) and mom picks them up in a new Cadillac SUV at the end of the day.If you are truly in need, there is nothing wrong with accepting help.
When the government confiscates 40% of what I make, however, I think I have the
right to ask that they use that money to help people truly in need and not to
simply subsidize those who are gaming the system.
Re: "Try actually reading the Bible in context once in awhile ..."Is this enough context?"Do not judge so that you will
not be judged. For by the standard you judge you will be judged, and the measure
you use will be the measure you receive. Why do you see the speck in your
brother's eye, but fail to see the beam of wood in your own? Or how can you
say to your brother, 'Let me remove the speck from your eye,' while
there is a beam in your own? You hypocrite! First remove the beam from your own
eye, and then you can see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's
eye....In everything, treat others as you would want them to treat you, for this
fulfills the law and the prophets."If this isn't enough
context, perhaps someone can enlighten me. Where does Jesus tell us to do the
opposite of these things?Or where does he say, "Be envious, be
hard-hearted, be petty, be uncharitable, always assume the worst about people,
and don't treat others as you would like to be treated, but treat them
"Idiots. Total idiots." "Sadly, as a
nation, i.e., the nation as a whole, based on the November 2012 election, we are
nothing but idiots."Not even a hint of a suggestion of any abuse
I was on food stamps for 6 months while in school. Between my wife and 2 kids,
we couldn't spend the money we received. I even bought steak and lobster
with my ebt card. I ate better on food stamps than I do now. I could spend
more now but I would rather save the money. Food stamps should be limited to
basic staples. I don't want anyone to starve but if I am paying for their
food, they shouldn't be eating better than I am..
While many people do not see this side of it, I have a family member who uses
food stamps. My sister, who is bipolar and was supported off and on for many
years by my late parents,has needed and continues to sometimes need food stamps.
She usually works for little, can only find part-time work and loses her job
every 1-2 years due to her mental illness. During her times of unemployment,
food stamps was the only way she did not go hungry. (And the small town where
she lives in Colorado has no food bank for the poor to use.) When she is
employed her food stamps are reduced or stopped depending on her income (which
the program tracks closely). While my own family's money has occasionally
been used to help fix her car and sometimes pay rent when it was possible, my
family cannot afford to feed her and every month. For me, knowing she and
others like her can get food stamps and at least be able to eat is a huge
A significant portion of posters have problems using millions, billions and
trillions correctly.There are a thousand thousands in one million.
There are a thousand millions in one billion.There are a
thousand billions in one trillion.There are a million millions also
in one trillion.Powers of ten can be confusing.Typing
too fast is also sometimes the problem. Just one or two wrong letters before
the "illion" will result in very large errors.
My, doesn't the DN comment forum work in an "interesting" way.People can call each other, our President, and the opposing political every
kind of offensive name and have their comment posted.However, when a new
moderator comes in, a comment, approved by the previous moderator and posted for
an hour or so, can be taken off, apparently, because the new moderator "did
not like it".DN has "child, or newby moderators" and
"senior, easily offended moderators"? Watch out the "Boss" is
coming in!And your paper publishes all the "stuff" on Miley Cyrus
and similar stories?You have many of us very confused!
Seriously? Line up the 'poor' in this country with the
'poor' in say Haiti or Uganda and you tell me who needs food stamps,
gov't housing, utility assistance, paid internet and cable and free phones.
Here's a hint...it's not the perfectly healthy guy wearing the $100
Niki's munching a bag of Nachos.
@ gehelmke - Bastrop, TX - "The Food Stamp program, like so many other
welfare programs, is not, of itself, bad. The problem is in the failure to
monitor these programs....Selling, etc. are really bad, but the problem for
me(and I have seen this more than once)is the woman in the full length mink, who
pushes two baskets around the supermarket, pulls a roll of $100 bills out of her
handbag to pay for one of the baskets, then pays for the other with Food
Stamps.....Then, after she loads the goodies in the trunk of her Cadillac, she
drives away.....What's wrong with this picture??"Man!, I
would L-O-V-E to work undercover in fighting food stamp fraud! I would go to
work every single day with a smile on my face knowing that I'm saving
precious tax dollars (read that as "the PRECIOUS financial sacrafices of my
friends and neighbors") and catching bad guys. Put me in, coach!
Idiots.Total idiots.Sadly, as a nation, i.e., the nation
as a whole, based on the November 2012 election, we are nothing but idiots. We
literally are now a nation MORE of "takers" than "makers". The
Democrat party does not unitedly say "we want to work", and you're
in la-la land if you think they do. Instead, Democrats' unified cry is
"the government will take care of everyone". (Really? And where does
the "government" get their money?)And the extreme expansion
of the food stamp program is an undeniable indicator of just that. What?, you
actually thought that an INCREASE of food stamp users was a sign of people
standing up and taking care of themselves?It does NOT take a genius
IQ to see the destructive path we are on as a nation. It takes honesty, simple
honesty and integrity. The chaos that Greece went through 2-3 years ago is only
a SMALL taste of the chaos and massive destruction America will go through when
our economy implodes. You simply cannot run a home, a family, a town, a state,
a business or a country, with borrowed money forever. Sorry, liberals, reality
doesn't work that way.
KJB1You mean from BO cabinet members like Geithner? Is that where
we’re losing money to tax evasion?Truthslayer,Why do you
quote LDS scripture when you don’t even know the persecution the church
suffered at the hands of the feds due to its views on marriage?Bluedevil,Wouldn’t be “fare” to “loos”
To "Utah Native" I fully understand why you would have been denied the
food stamps. If you have enough money to pay for a car, you have enough to pay
for food. That would be the time to stop making car payments and buy food. You
can always walk/bike/bus where you need to go, but you can't survivie
Lightbearer, Try actually reading the Bible in context once in awhile and lose
the dog-eared copy of 'God's Politics".
re:JoseywalesDid you take down the license plate number and report it to
the state administrators of the foodstamp/SNAP program? If people see
fraud--why don't they report the store or the fraudsters to state
administrators or law enforcement? What resources do states commit to fighting
fraud? Foodstamps are a state administered program, allowing
states flexibility as to how the program is administered. For example, states
can require yearly face-to-face meetings for re-authorization. Other
administration options are spelled out in the SNAP "State Options
Report." Why doesn't DN write an article about the SNAP
program? For example it could provide valuable and educational information to
readers as to the demographics of people who use the program, requirements for
qualifying, average allocation, follow-up etc.
I will never be jealous of someone on food stamps. I'm sure there are
abuses and fraud and these abuses should be fixed but these programs help people
through some tough times.
The sad thing is, some people that get assistance stay on it because it's
too easy! I just had a convo with a young man last week that said when his job
ends in November, he was going to get on unemployment and food stamps and
snowboard all winter. The tragic thing is, he said he learned this from many
others who have done it! It's sad that the youth are now being conditioned
to let the government take care of them instead of working hard and either
getting an education, or looking for work in a stable industry. I only hope my
son who has been working an extra job to buy his pass, doesn't hear from
this group and think it's the way to go, because being on the government
leash is NOT the way!
I, too, wonder, time and again, if there's anywhere else in the world where
people are so envious of the poor.Where else do people complain that
the poor aren't suffering enough, and insist that they shouldn't have
any pleasures, not even simple pleasures like a fruit pie or a candy bar? Where
else do people take an inventory of other people's shopping carts, and keep
their eyes peeled to see how they are paying? Where else do they keep other
customers under surveillance in the parking lot, to check out the kind of car
they're driving away in? Where else do people know better than their
neighbor what their neighbor should be eating and drinking? "Why
do you see the speck in your brother's eye, but fail to see the beam of
wood in your own?" (Matthew 7:3-4)"Of all the preposterous
assumptions of humanity over humanity, nothing exceeds most of the criticisms
made on the habits of the poor by the well-housed, well-warmed, and
well-fed" (Herman Melville, "Poor Man's Pudding and Rich Man's
It starts at the top.Just think of the hundreds of millions taken in
benefits by our political leaders.
I do admit that many people in need should get some public assistance. But when
I'm in a Walgreens the other day standing behind a lady using her food card
who I then saw getting into a brand new Toyota Camre while I was getting into my
5 year old one, it bothered me.
I laugh at some of these comments... such simplistic views of the world.
Corruption, miss-use of funds, waste, happens in all operations of large scale.
Within my own ward I can tell you of many cases where people who have received
assistance from the church with questionable and dubious needs. One, while the
ward was supplementing their diatary and other needs, kept their cable
subscription with premiums added... because it wouldn't be fare to the kids
to loos those. This kind of stuff goes on everywhere. The U.S.
government isn't alone in those that abuse the generosity of the system. A
waste/fraud rate around 1 percent isn't shocking to me at all. What is sad
is the number of people on the system in general that is a bit disappointing.
In Chicago last I lived there real fraud was rampant both in getting into the
system and staying in the system. People would buy other's groceries at the
end of the year trying to spend enough to keep their assistance! Something
altogether flawed about a program designed to keep you spending more than you
really need. Or you'd see people driving sports' cars with designer
clothes and hair using public assistance for money. No surprise in Chicago but
it still hurts to see it as a taxpayer. REFORM!
There is considerably more fraud in military expenditures then there will ever
be in the food stamp program Lose the anger. The poor are not bad. Neither is
the food stamp program.
I depend on SNAP and live on $5.20 a day. This must include the cost of cooking
oils, spices, condiments, as well as nutritious vegetables which, cost as much
per pound, as meat these days. I am sure there is fraud, just as there is fraud
in Defense spending. However, when I see so much cutting in Federal and State
programs of all kinds, I know that enforcement of the laws surrounding the
government implementation of the program, is lax and lacking. If there are more
fraud enforcers, there is less fraud. That would go a long way to cutting the
needy from the thievery. It would mean a tax increase or an increase somehow to
the program. I doubt FOX mentioned any of that.
Some say "only" 1 percent fraud like that's a good thing. Any fraud
is bad isn't it? The truth is, the percentages would be quite higher if you
factored in the amount of people who get their SNAP card legitimately, but then
get items and then sell them. Having been on this program a few years ago for
about 6 months, we witnessed too many people buying boxed snack cakes and chips,
carts full of non-nutritional items, and the finest cuts of meat that most
people just can't afford. I witnessed with my own eyes at the Orem Winco, a
family with two carts full of mostly the items I mentioned, go out to their
Escalade with big chrome wheels and exchange one cart for cash right there in
the parking lot. I'm not opposed to this program, I am opposed to it having
no limits, other than alcohol and cigs, on what can be purchased. There should
be an approved list of nutritional food that can be bought. NO chips, snack
cakes or anything with little nutritional value. Basics, milk, bread, eggs,
fruits and veggies. Might help some people get healthy.
This is one of the least fraud-filled programs in the nation (order of 2% waste)
but that doesn't stop some of you from thinking it's a rampant
I have no problem helping the poor and giving them the help they truly need.
The problem lies in the program specifics. A family of 4 can receive nearly
$1000 per month for groceries. I have a family of 5 and never spend near that
amount. Another problem with the program is that this $1000 is basically a
monthly gift card to the grocery store that can be used for just about anything
but beer and cigarettes. This program needs to be more like the WIC program
where coupons are given for specific items (ie coupons for meat, cheese,
produce, bread, etc) instead of an open ended gift card approach. This would
save money while at the same time help people to eat healthier which would save
money on the back end in the form of health care.
And how come I can be in line in the grocery store behind someone who is getting
shrimp, steak, potato chips, candy, etc. while I am purchasing whatever fruits
and veggies are in season, whatever meat is on sale. That someone pays with food
stamps, and I am on a super strict budget to make our paychecks go as far as
possible. (shaking head in disbelief)
Why does anybody in UT need to be on foodstamps? The LDS Church has vast
resources in UT to help the poor. Churches do help the poor--I know of churches
(not LDS) which open their doors to feed and even provide a temporary place to
sleep for the homeless. There are thousands of malnourished LDS
children living in underdeveloped countries. The meager fast offering funds in
those countries more often go to bury the dead. D&C 78"For verily I say unto you, the time has come, and is now at hand; and
behold, and lo, it must needs be that there be an organization of my people, in
regulating and establishing the affairs of the storehouse for the poor of my
people, both in this place and in the land of Zion—For if ye
are not equal in earthly things ye cannot be equal in obtaining heavenly
Amen, hamrdown, Amen!Thank you for your post and providing a
personal example of how food stamps can be a positive thing for those who are
truly in need. Proves that not everyone using the food stamp
program is a deadbeat who is living off and abusing the system.
The thing I don't get is how does President Obama, and the big spending
Democrats in general, claim that the country is improving under their
leadership. In the 5th year of Obama, unemployment/underemployment/part time
jobs, is still very high. Food stamps at all time high. And deficit spending
is and has been astronomical. Trillions. Is this the kind of legacy that a
President can call greatness? How is he getting away with this? A Republican
President would never have been re-elected with this record. In reality the
Democrat candidate for President in 2016 should have to run totally away from
Obama to win. How could they sell continuing this for another 4 years? If this
is the "new normal", get your food storage in order and get ready to
ride out the storm. Well maybe that's what the Prophets have been saying
Unfortunately for me, I was laid off on November 30th of last year. My employer
gave me a small severance package that lasted about 45 days. During that time,
I actively sought new employment, applied for food stamps and other unemployment
benefits, and watched our spending (especially hard during the Christmas
season). Sometime towards the end of January, I was informed that I qualified
for food stamps (after my severance had run out) and I was very grateful.Fortunately, I found a new job and was hired on March 30th. During the
2 months we had the food stamps, my wife and I were extremely budget conscious -
especially with our food. We even clipped coupons like a crazy coupon queen to
help the food stamp money extend further.If ALL people could and
would use the program the way it is intended, this country would be better off.
But sadly, we mostly hear the stories of how food stamps are abused versus
hearing a story about how it has helped people. My family was able to have food
in the house during my short time without employment and it is due to this
Everybody please turn your tv's off (like your really need to be watching
Miley Cyrus anyway) and help your kids with their homework. Stop being lazy.Kids. Stop playing your video games. It will make you stupid. Go read
a book.Take control of your lives and stop being a victim.Everyone needs help from time to time and the people who think they don't
are actually just as big as a problem as everyone who is lazy on the public
dole.Get off food stamps as fast as you can.Also,
everyone crying about the minimum wage. Stop it. Go get a real job instead of
taking jobs from teenagers. Which should be just fine working for the minimum
wage. They don't need to raise a family on it.You fraudsters
are all going to have to stand accountable someday. Go look in the mirror. If
you are one of them repent and change your selfish wicked ways.There
are opportunities everywhere. Go make something good happen!
Any time there is a program there will be abuses. Any is too many and we have
too much abuse in this country. But the abuses are to be found at all levels:
Government which seems bent on self perpetuation on tax dollars. Some wealthy
who grind the noses of the poor; all the way down to poor people who take
advantage of kind heartedness and the list goes on.A recent study is
suggesting that welfare has a tendency to dampen a person's will to rise
above their situation. That should come as no surprise. And I'm not
suggesting that everyone on welfare is a slug, the program does help and lift
many.It is in our natures to work for what we eat and where we live
and what we drive, etc. Government would serve us better if they stopped
preventing innovation and creativity. Government has become the epitome of
waste and corruption and represents itself well in many facets of society who
have followed their lead and elected those who would insure handouts --- a most
" A federal government contractor in Huntsville pleaded guilty today in
federal court to charges related to a scheme to defraud the government of nearly
$14 million in contract payments over six years."Lockheed Martin
in 2008 paid $10.5 million to settle charges that it defrauded the government by
submitting false invoices on a multi-billion dollar contract connected to the
Titan IV space launch vehicle program.Northrop Grumman paid $62
million in 2005 to settle charges that it "engaged in a fraud scheme by
routinely submitting false contract proposals," and "concealed basic
problems in its handling of inventory, scrap and attrition." Despite the
serious charges of pervasive and repeated fraud, Northrop Grumman received $12.9
billion in contracts the next year, 16% more than the year before.The Pentagon paid $573.7 billion during the past 10 years to more than 300
contractors involved in civil fraud cases that resulted in judgments of more
than $1 million, $398 billion of which was awarded after settlement or judgment
for fraud. When awards to "parent" companies are counted, the Pentagon
paid more than $1.1 trillion during the past 10 years just to the 37 top
companies engaged in fraud.
There's a book called "That's not what we meant to do" by
Steven Gillon.It addresses the unintended consequences of government
programs.It was published back in 2000 so that takes away all the Blame
Bush and Blame Obama rhetoric.Gillon devotes a chapter to the history of
welfare programs. In 1935 it was created to help widows raise their children
without having to leave the home to go to work.Look at it now. every
effort at reform has only made things worse.Let's stop pretending the
government can fix our problems.As we think about Rev. King's
unfinished business, it may very well be that the best thing for our society
would be to STOP giving away government cheese.
Because business has failed to provide the means for people to sell their labor
for the money needed to buy life’s necessities, it will become
increasingly important that our government takes over that need. Lest we fall into the trap of riots, unrest and civil war like the rest of the
The reason the food stamp program was created was to provide new money and new
customers for the food industry. Once created, the food stamp
program supporters became vigilant and protective of their new business. They
didn’t want other non-food businessmen to take their profits that they had
The fraud measured only included retailers, but did NOT include any type of
black market exchange, where a drug addict would trade his/her foodstamps for
their next high while their kids go hungry. No telling what the fraud rate is
when you include all the types of fraud.Maverick,Cannot argue
with the facts about the fraud, so you obfuscate. Tell me, is 43% a majority
yet?The government used to provide food, rather than foodstamps. Go
back to that and the incidents of fraud would decrease while we still help those
There is so much fraud. The lefties want as many as possible to increase their
voting bloc. The bar is set way too low for eligibility and many of these
people are laughing at us skimming from the taxpayer. The income level for I
school luncheons and breakats is ridiculously high. Govt is fostering
dependency. Parents coan make lunch. A lot of their money goes to
booze,drugs,gambling ,waste etc.
Wow! They must have really changed the food stamp program if you can now
purchase fast food and hot prepared foods. My first job was working in a grocery
store back in the day when people were shamed by using their paper food stamps.
You couldn't purchase any fast food, hot foods from deli cases or even ice
(which I know that has changed). What I would like to know is how do
you (IDC) know what food stamp recipients are purchasing with their food stamps?
Since funds are now put on cards (along with other benefits like child support,
unemployment, etc.), how is it you know what they are purchasing with which
funds? Perhaps instead of being all judgy and condemning those in
need, we should find a way to help lift others from poverty. I'm not saying
there isn't abuse, but why condemn all because some abuse? Compassion.
We lose five times the amount spent on SNAP to tax evasion every year. When is
the DN going to run a front page story on that?
I'm wondering how many of you making these comments actually have any
experience with the food stamp program? Have any of you been out of work for an
extended period of time? Any of you had four kids to feed and no money to feed
them? What would you do if the food stamp program were the only option
available to you if you needed to feed your family?Remember,
"There but for the grace of God go I."
Brother Franklin, If Churches, neighborhoods, private businesses,
and non-profit organizations can easily step up and take care of those who need
this sort of help, why have they not done so? Does there have to be no
government help available for these people/organizations to step up and help
those who are struggling? What are they waiting for? These numbers indicate
over 95 percent of the need is real.RBB, If you
don't mind me asking: when was the last time you were in a inner-city
grocery store to witness the activities you allege?
The Food Stamp program, like so many other welfare programs, is not, of itself,
bad. The problem is in the failure to monitor these programs....Selling, etc.
are really bad, but the problem for me(and I have seen this more than once)is
the woman in the full length mink, who pushes two baskets around the
supermarket, pulls a roll of $100 bills out of her handbag to pay for one of the
baskets, then pays for the other with Food Stamps.....Then, after she loads the
goodies in the trunk of her Cadillac, she drives away.....What's wrong with
Big Government is a conduit for corruption. The more they try to control - the
more they lose control.
When we found ourselves unemployed in the late 90s (just months after purchasing
our first home and buying a new car) with two small children, I swallowed my
pride and went to apply for food stamps. We had been tax-paying citizens for
years, but I was told we did not qualify because we owned a new car. I explained
that no, we did not own the car, the bank did, and if I could, I would return
it! The food-stamp worker told me, "We can't issue you food stamps and
have you take your free groceries out to a brand-new car in the grocery store
parking lot." I was dumbfounded, having thought previously that programs
like this were in place to help people in times of temporary need. We did
qualify for WIC for our kids, but like IDC suggested in a previous post, the
food choices were limited to very specific items. That's the way food
stamps should be, too. Staples such as eggs, milk, etc., should be covered, but
not the junk food, the soda, and the gourmet items.
If each food stamp, feeds three people, than half our people are fed by a
bankrupt government. Add the school lunch program, and we find a very dependent
population.Why do I feel, we're being led into a trap?
barack's biggest "success"
Even if there is only 1% fraud, too many people are living off of the
government. Scale it back. Cut it in half. No fast food, no junk food, no
soda, no steak, no lobster, no nachos from the gas station.
I'm discouraged by the judgmental tone of so many of these comments.
Aren't we told in Mosiah not to judge those who needs help? Aren't we
told that we are all beggars before God? The food stamp program has very low
levels of fraud and there are some pretty strict income and work requirements
for applicants.Maybe we should ask ourselves why so many Americans
can't afford food while a very small percentage basks in absolute luxury.
If workers were paid a decent wage and if there were jobs for all, people
wouldn't need to turn to food stamps.
The food stamp issue is more broken than the government. And they issue the darn
So foodstamp use is up... and that means the President's economy is getting
More than 5,000 active duty US soldiers receive food stamps. Congress refuses to
give them a raise. More than 60% of the people getting food stamps work
full-time jobs, hence the term "working poor." And, as pointed out
above, 1.14% is used wrongly. Yet every person I have ever met who calls himself
a "Christian" derides the poor for being lazy and unwilling to work.
A Census Bureau report on Wednesday revealed nearly 46.2 million people (one out
of six Americans) live in poverty in President Barack Obama's economy. Yet,
the Obama administration touted the country's horrific poverty figures and
attempted to spin the statistics in its favor. Dependency is just another form
of slavery but it sure wins elections, which is really the point for Democrats.
Wow. Imagine that.During a recession people need to use
safety nets to survive. Kinda shows the purpose for which they were created.The solution? I have an idea. Lets give more tax cuts to the rich, get
rid of min wage, and cut food stamp funding while increasing agriculture
subsidies. That should fix it! I'm sure Walmart and McDonalds will finally
pay their employees liveable wages.
I'm tired of working so I think I will go out and take advantage of this
program. I have supported others for so many years that I think I will have
others support me now. It is only fair that I get my turn at the freebies now.
If all these government handouts are really helping people, then why isn't
the number of poor people going down? No one is complaining about trying to
help people who are needy. We need more accountability when applying for state
or federal funds. Another thing to consider is the people who are
qualifying for all kinds of programs because they are not using their honest
HOUSEHOLD INCOME. I personally know many situations where people are living
together, but not married and only using their individual income on the
government forms instead of the household income that is required.
That is just the amount that is sold. Just go to a supermarket in a bad part of
any big city and you will see food stamps used to buy junk food or steak while
the user buys booze and cigarettes with cash. If only yhe feds could work out a
model like the bishop's storehouse. Of course if the government tried it
would be run by SEIU and most of the food would be gone or rotten before the
poor could get their hands on it.
All government programs are subject to massive waste and fraud. Senator Tom
Coburn has detailed exact waste and fraud a hundred areas, but Congress yawns
and goes on wasting with the lame excuse that the savings would be
inconsequential, evidently mirroring their true feelings about the American
The real fraud is in the qualifying process.The second fraud is that
immigrants have become a public charge, with the official sanction of our
government. You should see the list of goodies an immigrant can get and still
not be considered a public charge. USCIS public charge information is available
on line. It may shock you.
The numbers speak for themselves. The program has doubled in size since its
inception, and the amount spent now is $75 million up from $36 million. People are seeking answers from the government cannot argue with this
data. All they can do is remain silent or use tactics to distract from this
information. This food stamp program needs to be scaled back
yesterday. It is such a waste. Churches, neighborhoods, private businesses,
and non-profit organizations can easily step up and take care of those who need
this sort of help. There will be the usual kicking and screaming
from those who have become dependent. But we must be strong and firm. There is
no such thing as a free lunch. This food stamp money is not always going to be
there. It will eventually run out. Those who believe the
government will always be there to take care of them will be sorely disappointed
when the money dries up. They are usually the people that have no problem
wasting other people's money, but when they have to shoulder the
responsibility, usually take responsibility for themselves.
Basically 1.14 percent of the money is being used wrongly.
..and those numbers don't tell the tale of how groceries are sold to family
members, friends, neighbors for 50 cents on the dollar and how much waste there
is in the program. They do tell that the benefit paid is, in most cases, too