Comments about ‘Mormon apologetics group announces new name’

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Published: Monday, Aug. 26 2013 3:25 p.m. MDT

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Moontan
Roanoke, VA

I think Christopher has asked a simple, uncomplicated, sincere question. Nobody has answered it yet.

The Taxman
Los Angeles, CA

@Abeille

It is impossible to ask a sincere "adult level" doctrinal question (that may stretch you) on this site. The DN moderators simply will not allow it. So we have to go with Chris B's simple question (which has not been answered).

@Samuel B Martineau
"Finally, it is easy to say things like "I am pretty sure that this organization can't defend all of the holes in doctrine and history." I could say the same thing about any church with little cost to myself."

Just because something is easy to say (with little cost?), does not make it untrue. In fact, it can be true for all religions. Your statement makes no sense whatsoever.

Aggielove
Cache county, USA

Faith. It's the king pin to a religious life.

michael.jensen369
Lethbridge, 00

Actually, I did answer his question, if you read what I said.

mattrick78
Cedar City, UT

@Christopher B

In the grand scheme of things, the prophets and apostles will never lead us astray with regard to the plan of salvation.

EternalPerspective
Eldersburg, MD

It's amazing to me the relentlessness of antagonists that fight against God's truths and Church upon the earth by using every "rational" argument to discount matters of faith and what is revealed by God, without sincere firsthand immersion and investigation of the very foundation under the microscope of such skepticism. Why such unprovoked zealousness in these movements?

Faith in God and whether or not His Church exists upon the earth has never been based on sight or worldly measurements of truth. Hence, just as apples cannot be compared to oranges with exactness, so too, faith that comes only by spiritual avenues versus unbelief from worldly arguments, have no possibility of emphatically disproving the other vantage point.

Faith is only proven by those whose life experiences have prepared an honest, sincere, and humble examination of truth that is not of the world. When such evolves to reflect a purity of intent to not only know for certain, but follow that which God is willing to give, then and only then, can the endless rhetoric of those wishing to renounce God and His works, transform into faith backed by a greater truth than the world can see.

maclouie
Falconer, NY

There is much confusion as to what a Prophet is. Christopher B. especially. Fifteen men hold the office of Prophet, Seer, and Revelator, just a President Obama holds the office POTUS. Just because you are POTUS does not make you the know it all of the United States. He does not even know how many States there are. Is he human? Is the Prophet human?

When the POTUS says something covered by the Constitution some of us will know because some (unfortunately not all) know what the Constitution says.

When the Prophet says something we can confirm what he says thru the Holy Ghost. No one is denied access to personal revelation if we live worthy to receive it (again some of us and not all). You know what he says comes from God when you confirm it thru your own prayers and/or the Prophet says "Thus saith the Lord...". Everything else is inspired counsel which we would be wise to follow. There are also the scriptures (a written document like the Constitution).

If you feel disappointed that God has withheld his Holy Spirit and revelations/knowledge from you then I suggest you visit a mountain top nearest you.

sharrona
layton, UT

@EternalPerspective, Faith in God and whether or not His Church exists upon the earth has never been based on sight or worldly measurements of truth.

Heb:1 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. Heb 11:2 For by it the elders obtained a good report. Heb 11:3 Through faith we understand that the worlds=(*time g165, aiōn) were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.

In (2Tim 1:9 & Titus 1:2)God existed before *time, implying he created time. … God who gives life to the dead and Calls into Being things that were not.(Romans 4:17 NIV)

For in him we live and move and have our Being...(Acts 17:28)Creation is dependent on God for it’s very existence.

By faith he(Moses) forsook Egypt, not fearing the wrath of the king: for he endured, as seeing him who is Invisible( Hebrews 11: 27)

Faith is only as good as the object of that faith.

JoeBlow
Far East USA, SC

How hard would it be for church leadership to put together a list.

The following things have been revealed to our prophet directly from God.

They are

1.
2.
3.

And anything else spoken by church leadership is our opinion and our council.

That would clarify things pretty well, wouldn't it?

The Taxman
Los Angeles, CA

So I'm hearing here that the prophet and other leaders are like any other wise men in the sense that what they say is usually accurate and good and we must figure out for ourselves it's meaning in our lives and how to use it?

suzyk#1
Mount Pleasant, UT

The only way anyone receives answers to their confusion or lack of understanding is through Faith and sincere prayer. If you truly want to understand and know if something is true, get down on your knees and in humility ask Heavenly Father if it is true. You will know it is true by the overwhelming feeling of peace and calm. If there is still doubt in what you are praying about then it is not right or good. Never in my life have I not received an answer to my prayers when I was praying with Faith and the knowledge that Heavenly Father was listening and thereby gave me peace. It's all about believing with all of your heart and soul and it won't always be the answer you hope for because it is not right for you at that time.

Brahmabull
sandy, ut

mattrick78

How do you know the prophets would never lead you astray?? Let me guess, it was a statement from a previous prophet or apostle that you are going off of. So then, it could just be his opinion, and you can't count it as fact.

Christopher.B
Salt Lake, UT

Abeille - I am Catholic technically but don't really align to any specific church in reality. So don't try pointing out inaccuracies in Catholicism, because I've never claimed that it is the one and only true religion or that you should listen to the pope because he talks for God.

Samuel and others -

So it is right then to say "Mormons(including the prophets themselves) don't ever know when their prophet is speaking for God or not"?

Yes or no?

Again, I bring this up because I can't tell you how many times during my life in Utah I've heard reference from Mormons to their prophet speaking for God and being the ONE AND ONLY TRUE RELIGION.

One of your brought up receiving your own "confirmation" after a prophet speaks.

That's problematic if two people receive different "confirmations" isn't it?

I thought that was the whole point of having a prophet, speak for God.

I'm honestly trying to understand what Mormons believe.

How do you know when any of the prophets or apostles are speaking for God or just themselves?

Still not answering the question.

Pac_Man
Pittsburgh, PA

@JoeBlow

If your intention is find the truth regarding the salvation and the Atonement, you must draw not just from the modern day prophets and apostles but also those past (scriptures) as well as personal revelation.

NedGrimley
Brigham City, UT

"I'm honestly trying to understand what Mormons believe." ... On the comment boards of the Des News... Honestly...

EternalPerspective
Eldersburg, MD

sharrona

Faith is also only as good as having a correct understanding of the nature, character, and works of true and living deity. This only happens when one has been sufficiently prepared to receive God's word and act upon it, that they may gain the ability to do the works of Christ. For such intent has the Gospel of Jesus Christ been given to the world.

All throughout the Bible, faith and repentance was always a prerequisite to entering into sacred covenants with God by Priesthood authority. But, how could covenants be made with people save Priesthood authority spoken of in the Bible existed on earth. God is unchangeable, so can mere grace alone save and exalt us because Christ has made His atoning sacrifice, or would not such be required of this generation too?

Faith is either placed on the world's knowledge of God, or the more sure spirit of revelation, which is the Holy Ghost and the Priesthood gift recevied by the the laying on of hands mentioned in the New Testament. For Jesus said to Nicodemus, save a man be born of water and the spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of Heaven.

JoeBlow
Far East USA, SC

"you must draw not just from the modern day prophets and apostles but also those past (scriptures)"

Which may or may not have been just the opinion of an infallible man. See the conundrum?

"I have never yet preached a sermon and sent it out to the children of men, that they may not call Scripture." - Brigham Young

I guess the next question is "what constitutes scripture"?

out of posts

atl134
Salt Lake City, UT

@Christopher B
And your churches' stance about Papal infallibility as opposed to actual results is somehow any different than that you claim about LDS prophets?

RedShirtMIT
Cambridge, MA

To "Christopher.B" the best way to figure out when a Prophet is speaking the word of god is based on the subject matter. If it has to do with the Atonment or the saving gospel principels they are speaking the words of God. Beyon that, if you want to know if what they say is true, it takes faith and prayer.

On a side note, Christ organized a church to ensure that his doctrine was taught correctly, why do you not follow Christ's teachings and find a church that is organized like Christ organized during his ministry?

LDS Revelations
Sandy, UT

I don't envy FAIR's job. Their new tagline illustrates the problem they have from the outset. Many if not most who doubt get to that point from critical evaluation of LDS doctrines, history and foundational claims. For many if not most nothing short of a critical review or answers will suffice. For better or worse doubters are those who cannot/will not be satisfied with non-empirical evidence when observable evidence is extant. For them faith only makes sense where evidence and reason cannot get the job done. To essentially say the default response to critical review is a 'faithful answer' suggests that fully honest and critical review of the issues is not only avoided but perhaps not even possible for FAIRMormon. My point: Clearly for many who doubt these answers will come up short.

New branding and positioning but the same issues remain.

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