Comments about ‘Brad Rock: Another down year would put Kyle Whittingham near the flame’

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Published: Sunday, Aug. 25 2013 12:53 a.m. MDT

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EdGrady
Idaho Falls, ID

Losses to Utah State and BYU - 4-8 record - Timpview HS has a new defensive coordinator.

AZUTE1
Mesa, AZ

mussingaround--

"What's utterly meaningless is the incessant obsession of the Ute fanbase trying to claim that a single game out of 12 or 13 somehow proves something."

Such as the 1 game against CU in '11?

"Bottom line is:

2011 #25/#26/#34 BYU(10-3) BETTER than unranked/#39 Utah(8-5)
2012 unranked/#26 BYU(8-5) BETTER than unranked/#61 Utah(5-7)"

Bottom-line is--

2011 The U 54 byu 10 in provo; The U final SOS ranking of #49 and byu #90.
2012 The U 24 byu 21; The U final SOS ranking of #41 and byu #63.

Final conclusion--

The U was better than byu in both '11/'12.

BTW, my reference to final SOS rankings wasn't a complaint, as I'm eternally grateful for the enormous upgrade in our SOS and its potential reward. I'm merely pointing-out what the byu fanbase conveniently avoids to acknowledge at every turn, namely that SOS definitively factors into a school's final record. It's inherently unequivocal.

Next.

TheSportsAuthority
Arlington, VA

AZUTE1

It's cute how Utah fans use BYU as their measuring stick for success, while BYU fans use national rankings as their measuring stick.

btw, SOS and record both factor into final rankings, a little fact that Ute fans conveniently choose to ignore.

The difference in 2012 SOS between BYU(63) and Utah(41) was puny in comparison to the difference in final ranking for BYU(26) and Utah(61).

Spokane Ute
Spokane, WA

It's definately a pivotal year for whittlingham. It's nice to see the usual band of haters on here hating. What a sad existence it must be to troll Utah articles and spew hate. What a truly pathetic M.O.

BigCougar
Bountiful, UT

Uteology said:
"I think KW has two more years. His first PAC-12 class graduates next year. If the program still can't compete in the PAC-12 then look for KW to be fired.

Look for BYU to make a 2nd offer if he's fired from Utah."

Agree and partially agree. If Kwhitt is able to coach his team to 5 wins on that schedule he did probably one of his better coaching jobs but with people mad they finished in the basement again and no bowl game it won't matter to them.

Worst case scenario Utah could lose as many as 10 games (wins vs Weber St and split with Colo/WSU). That would get him fired for sure but I think Kwhitt will find a way to coax them to 4 for sure and maybe 5. That will be good enough to keep his job one last year but it will only put off his inevitable firing after a 4th straight losing season in 2014.

On the 2nd part, when he gets fired he just might get an offer from BYU.....to be the new Linebacker coach when Tidwell retires.

WACPaddingOurSchedule
pocatello, ID

TheSportsAuthority
Arlington, VA
AZUTE1

It's cute how Utah fans use BYU as their measuring stick for success, while BYU fans use national rankings as their measuring stick.

btw, SOS and record both factor into final rankings, a little fact that Ute fans conveniently choose to ignore.

The difference in 2012 SOS between BYU(63) and Utah(41) was puny in comparison to the difference in final ranking for BYU(26) and Utah(61).

________

Why would the Utes aspire to follow BYUs goal of prearranged lame bowl agreements, and feel good stories for being in bottom end of the Top 25? Nothing cute about that.

AZUTE1
Mesa, AZ

thesportsauthority--

"The difference in 2012 SOS between BYU(63) and Utah(41) was puny in comparison to the difference in final ranking for BYU(26) and Utah(61)."

An enormous difference, particularly when considering byu only won 2 more games during the regular season than The U did. Not to mention, yet another loss to Mighty Big Brother, 24-21.

BTW, I noticed you conveniently evaded me on the respective '11 final SOS rankings, in addition to the '11 score, 54-10 in provo.

skywalker
Palo Alto, CA

upinthenight

Regardless of how many times Utah fans spam their conference affliation nonsense, a conference invitation is NOT an athletic accomplishment.

Down in the dumps Colorado was invited before U, and the invites of Maryland and Rutgers to the B1G is proof enough that conference expansion is completely market driven and has nothing to do with actual on field football accomplishments.

Utah being invited to the PAC instead of BYU is proof that "culture" and "academics" were far more important to the PAC than athletic excellence.

TheSportsAuthority
Arlington, VA

AZUTE1

What you seem to be struggling with is this: Despite your SOS hyperbole, BYU still finished with a better record and higher ranking in both the national polls and in Sagarin in 2011.

2011
BYU(10-3) #25 Coaches, #26 AP, #34 Sagarin, #90 SOS
Quality wins: Utah State(7-6) 27-24, Tulsa(8-5) 24-21 (bowl win versus #35 Sagarin)
Losses to quality teams: Utah(8-5) 10-54, @Texas(8-5) 16-17, @TCU(11-2) 28-38
Ugly losses: none

Utah(8-5) no votes in either poll, #39 Sagarin, #49 SOS
Quality wins: BYU(10-3) 54-10, Ga Tech(8-5) 30-27 OT (bowl win versus #56 Sagarin)
Losses to quality teams: USC(10-2) 23-14, Washington(7-6) 14-31, California(7-6) 10-34
Ugly losses: Arizona State(6-7) 14-35, Colorado(3-10) 14-17

BYU had 2 quality wins, 3 quality losses, no ugly losses
Utah had 2 quality wins, 3 quality losses, 2 ugly losses

Bottom line: Utah's biggest win (BYU) was offset by two ugly losses to losing teams, one at home to one of the worst teams in the country

wyoming cougar
Green River, WY

re:
SoonerUte
Salt Lake City, UT
"Utah has never had three consecutive losing conference seasons."
Yes, and the level of competition in the PAC12 is just like the Mountain West.

National press writers predicted it would take 5 years for the Utah and TCU programs to catch up to their BCS leagues. Shouldn't coach Whitt be given those 5 years? Hate to see him run off early because of the impatience of a local writer.

10:38 a.m. Aug. 25, 2013

Really- it sure hasn't seemed to take TCU 5 years to catch up as they're predicted to finish 2nd this year in the big 12 and contend for their conference championship. I'm not sure how you bring TCU into the conversation- they seem very well suited for the jump they made. Remind me again, what your excuse is?

AZUTE1
Mesa, AZ

TheSportsAuthority

"AZUTE1

What you seem to be struggling with is this: Despite your SOS hyperbole, BYU still finished with a better record and higher ranking in both the national polls and in Sagarin in 2011."

Only inside of the bubble is SOS irrelevant. Everywhere else, it's 100% relevant.

"Bottom line: Utah's biggest win (BYU) was offset by two ugly losses to losing teams, one at home to one of the worst teams in the country"

Bottom-Line--

No matter how much you and your fellow byu fans attempt to spin it, what happened against an ultra-talented/under-performing ASU in '11, a team which would've equally trounced byu and with DII Hays making his very 1st start ever in a game which was significantly closer than the final score would otherwise indicate, and against CU in '11, has zero to do with the fact that not only did The U brutally annihilate byu on their homefield, 54-10, The U also played against a SOS ranked 41 spots higher.

Spin it anyway you wish, but the fact remains, The U straight owns byu, period, end-of-story. Therefore, The U is significantly better than byu.

Chris B. 4 Prez!
Salt Lake City, UT

@TheSportsAuthority

2011: BYU ugly losses: none (ugly loss meaning, to a team with a losing record)

2011 BYU performance at home against the Utes: uglier than TDS 2009 home embarrassment against Florida State! GO UTES

jdub1942
PROVO, UT

The ole Y fan adage: If you cant beat 'em, find someone else who has and bring that up.

BleedCougarBlue
Enid, OK

Article quote: "Whittingham, whose conference record since entering the Pac-12 is 7-11, 13-12 overall. This from a program that won two BCS bowls in five years. Since then the Utes have been trending down. Injuries have played a big part, but so has coordinator turnover and offensive production."

The Utes trending down?

True, but don't tell Ute fans that. They don't deal well with reality....

GO COUGARS!

Rational
Salt Lake City, UT

Azute1

SOS is only relevant when you WIN!

CO Ute
PARKER, CO

@duckhunter - while the DN won't allow comments that attack posters, they don't have any ban on comments that don't follow the post. You insinuate I think my opinion is more important than other. Suggest you read the actual post before making false comments. Here is the exact quote:

your comments are irrelevant to real Utah fans; just as you don't care what we think about your coach

Second my post was also very clear in that it was to 3 or 4 poster above that made specific comments, not to all BYU fans. I'd ask that you actually look at the real text before making another false accusation.

CO Ute
PARKER, CO

@veritas -

The reason I am looking forward to a break in the Holy War game is simple. I'm tired of the comments from a number of supposed or actual Y fans on these boards. I'm also thinking that many of the Y fans feel the same about comments on their articles.

Given the other posts that agree with my comments and the number of likes, I think my sentiment is shared by many others.

The Solution
Las Cruces, NM

Timing is everything... A few years ago, if the Utes had been invited to the PAC, they would have done very well, competing with USC for the championship on a regular basis.

Call me delusional if you want to, but look at 2007, 2008, and 2009. In 2009, I the MWC was better than the PAC. Don't believe me, look it up. 2007 and 2008 were good years too, and TCU, BYU, and UU could compete with anybody.

PAC teams have resurged recently, probably due in part to sanctions on USC, allowing more evenly distributed recruiting throughout the league. Utah has two bad seasons, but they have had close games, which indicates that it is only a matter of time before they turn the corner. It's not just about recruiting either--learning your opponents style and nuances is just as important. Utah will be fine, and this might be the year that Chis B finally makes a good prediction.

The same things can be said about my Cougs, who were in every game last year, and will probably be just fine this year.

WON84
PLANO, TX

"Out of State Utah fan

Alpharetta, GA

@ WON84 : Greetings to TX! Love that area. Big Dallas Stars fan. I love reading these comment boards but had to call out Duckhunter's opinion that in STATE fans know their rival's team better than a fan living out of state.

You are correct that many of the earliest posts on articles are from rival fans - both sides are equal in the smack talk. Look, folks - neither team has proven themselves this year and living in SEC country, both teams are hardly acknowledged down this way. Except some do remember that Utah beat Alabama one year and that BYU beat GA tech and the GA tech fans want that corrected!

Utah fan through and through. Utah football has greater potential and the better opportunity to get where it wants to be. Kyle Wittingham has a few years to go before a losing season does him in."

Out of State, I worked off of Haynes Bridge Road a few years ago. Small world!

Anyways, agreed with most of what you wrote. Also, hope they give Whittingham that time. He'll get it done.

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