Are the horses receiving adequate care? That is the real question here. How
often are they watered? Can they find water when they want to? The heat is
unbearable for people walking on days like this. Add a nice thick coat on top
of the heat coming off the asphalt and it would seem that 150 degree heat index
is way too high. I know everybody has to make a living, but certainly more
consideration and care should be given to the well being of the horse.
This is the order of the day: if it is difficult, quit; if it is challenging
file a protest; if it requires effort and thought, walk away.I
appreciate PETA and the Human Society for their original mission statements.
But out of boredom (and we can only be glad they didn't just shoot the
horse out of boredom) they seem anxious to become involved in all things whether
they understand all aspects of the situation or not -- if an animal is moving,
it must be a bad thing.A little work never hurt anyone, and some may
even suggest that it is actually a benefit and not a curse. We have enough
humans who no longer wish to work, let's not impose that same corrupt
philosophy onto the animal kingdom as well.
I totally agree with Beaver Native. Enough water, shade and. not being over
worked in the mid day heat is common sense for an owner. Perhaps Spring and Fall
would be better options for carriage rides. Greed should never trump responsible
ownership of animals. All animals.
The Humain Society said, "The question always comes back to whether animals
should be used for this purpose". What purpose? Pulling a cart? Of
course horses can be used to pull a cart! Horses have used for pulling carts
for hundreds of years!I don't think it's any harder to
pull a wagon on a city street than it is on a farm.If car fumes are
the problem... then maybe it's the cars that should go, not the horses.
I love horses and have owned, ridden and trained them for pleasure riding. They
have a special relationship with humans, and are wonderful to watch and just be
around. For those who think they should not be pulling carriages downtown,
please remember:1 Horses are expensive to keep. If they do not work, they
could be put down because of the cost.2 They love to work. They come to
the fence wanting to work.3 They work 6 hours a day, 3 to 4 days a week,
and spend the rest of the time at pasture or in a stall.4 They are in good
condition, well groomed and well fed, with water kept under the carriage.5
They work part-time at an easy job they love, with full health, hoof and dental
care, housing and food included. 6 They travel in and out of shade as they
travel downtown, and rest in the shade between trips.7 In the winter, they
have double thick fur.8 A beloved small business would be forced to
close.9 Carriage drivers would lose their jobs.10 They add to the
charm and delight of our city. Leave them alone.
I agree. It's so cruel to have horses do what they were created to do so
let's just send them all to the packing house to be made into dog food.
I love horses. They are animals who have a special relationship with humans. I
have owned and trained them for pleasure riding. They are wonderful to just
watch and be around. All of you who want the carriage rides stopped, please
remember:#1 Horses are expensive to keep, they could be put down because
their owner could not afford them.#2 They love what they do, it is easy
for them, they are eager to work. They want to be picked to work each day.#3 They work 6 hours a day, 3 or 4 days a week. The rest of their time is at
pasture or in a stall.#4 The horses are well fed, well groomed, well shod
and well taken care of.#5 They travel in and out of shade as they travel
around the downtown, and rest in shade between trips. In the winter, they have a
double thick coat of fur. #6 A small business beloved of many people would
close.#7 The carriage drivers would be out of jobs.These horses work
part-time at a job they love, with full medical, hoof and dental care, housing
and meals included. Leave them and this business alone.
@J-TX"If the temp is above 90-95, they shouldn't pull. What is
that, 2 days a year in SLC?"In the past 60 days at SLC, 56 of
them have been 90+ (3 of the other 4 were 89 degrees).
150? I would bet that a heat index above 120 has never been exceeded in Salt
Lake City (outside at least, in a car left in a parking lot that's a
I'm glad Jerry is on the verge of recovery (what that means, I don't
know -- will he recover or is it still not known) My sister was on scene as
this happened. She is from Wyoming and we grew up around horses. As everyone
was trying to figure out what to do, including the driver, she said they needed
to get him unhooked from the carriage and get water for him, which they did. He
was trying to get up and kept slipping and she told them they needed to get
something that he could get his footing on to keep from falling and was told his
horseshoes were made for the asphalt. Well and good, but they were still
slipping. She stayed until authorities showed up and the people from the
stable. I'm sure they are well taken care of, but I wonder how many of the
drivers actually have horse experience and know what to do when an animal goes
down. According to my sister, this driver didn't.
@Pete1215 - A heat index might be too hot for a human, but horses (and many
larger animals are better adapted for extreme temperatures on both ends of the
spectrum. My guess is that if it's truly too hot for people to be out, then
the carriage guys aren't making much money anyway, and they're likely
to pull their horses off the street until it cools down. These
horses are the livelihood of this business. I'm sure they get regular
checkups and care. From what I've been able to dig up, Horse Colic is
probably a condition that is hard to diagnose until the symptoms show. As for
the dismal picture of how this horse was loaded on a trailer by dragging it, I
doubt if it was as traumatic as it's being made out to be. I would even
speculate that if the horse had been out in a field or pasture, it probably
would've laid there for hours before anyone realized it had a problem, and
it could've potentially died. So, the reality is that being hooked to a
carriage in the middle of downtown probably benefited the horse...
Just a little wake up call to the folks at PETA and the Humane Society that are
going bonkers over this:These are work horses, whose sole purpose is
to pull carts, wagons, carriages, plows etc. If that seems too extreme to you
all, please keep in mind that your next interaction with these horses will be
when you lick the glue on the flap of the envelope in which you place your
ridiculous protestations. (Just in case you missed the subtlety of
that reference, the glue factory is the next stop for work horses that
I grew up on a farm where we used horses a few times per year to look for or
move cattle. Dad taught me to take care of the horses and not over-stress them.
I don't have any problem with using horses in the city - so long as they
are cared for well and aren't overworked.We also had a horse
die of colic despite veterinary care and all our efforts to save it. It had
nothing to do with heat or work or any of the concerns cited by PETA or HS, as
the day was not a particularly hot one and the horse hadn't been used
recently. The pasture had plenty of food, water, shade and room. Horses are
going to get colic whatever the circumstances and wherever they are, and horses
are regularly used in much hotter temperatures and harsher conditions than faced
in Salt Lake City.
Of course the horses belong downtown. They've been in SLC and the downtown
area since day one! They are a vital part of the history of the city. One reason
the streets were designed so wide was so a team of horses could make a U-turn
without the driver cussing and swearing. Sure there should be some precautions
put in place for the old horses, but banning horse drawn carriages would be
ridiculous and unnecessary.
thunderbolt7; I'd add to your list a horse that doesn't eat either.
that would be ideal.
Horses enjoyed it and let them continue. I don't know anything about horses
but I think 90 degrees and higher should be kept off the street. Why not banned
motor vehicles on some parts of downtown and remove those paved roads (partial)
and put in straw and dirt. See, this sound a little silly but why not. Horses do
enjoyed entertainment and my wife has this bucket list to ride the carriage at
downtown. Maybe this fall would be a good time to do it before the ordinance
(BIG IF but hope not) come in place.
I only want horses that never die, get sick, or have health problems.
One horse with colic decides he's calling in sick, and the HS and PETA want
to take away the livelihood of dozens of people.If the horses are
healthy, they should stay. If the temp is above 90-95, they shouldn't
pull. What is that, 2 days a year in SLC? Now, if they were pulling here in
Dallas....PETA and HS have no Horse Sense.
Changes need to be made so the horses don't work when its too hot and also
so the horses have access to water every half hour or so.Beyond that
there's nothing wrong with having horses pull carriages horses enjoy
getting out and about just like the rest of us.
I have seen a heat index of 119. That is too hot for even a pleasant walk.
Someone actually thinks a heat index of 150 belongs in a law? Or is the point
to kill horses?
A heat index of 150? Yeah, because the Arabs never ride horses. There were
never horses in Vegas or Tucson or Mexico or the Sahara...Having
been raised around horses I find "When you go out to pick the horses they
all come over and come over as if to say 'pick me, pick me, pick
me'" entirely plausible.
I love horses, but they aren't exactly weak animals. If properly cared for
and not overworked, can they not pull such a load? Modern streets aren't
exactly harsh conditions. Stage coaches could have many horses. Why not have 2
pulling today? (other than cost)Care for the animal has priority. I
agree with that. But I don't think putting and end to this may be the best
Yeah, when protestors objected to the University of Florida's mascot (The
Seminoles) they asked the Chief what he thought. He liked the name.Sure, give the horses the day off when temperatures reach 90 or 100. Do these
city slickers at the Humane Society really know anything about horses? I'll
bet a bunch of those horses enjoy pulling a carriage.I hate nosy
Seems like the Humane Society and PETA is fluffing up some horse feathers again.
And SLC Councilman Charlie Luke is eating out of the same oats. I'm so
tired of nonsensical whinnying, such as it would be better if a horse collapsed
in a stable or pasture. Hmnnn, it would be better if humans collapsed in a
hospital, too--then there would be no need for ambulances. *Snort* Horses
shouldn't pull? Shouldn't be in a city? The HS and PETA have no clue
why they were created. Horses have a greater purpose other than for humans to
gaze at them in a stable or pasture. Sounds like animal activists are putting
the cart before the horse.Horses pose a risk to themselves and the
public? Well, so do cars, pedestrians, bikes, etc. with far greater incidence
rates. If you really feel that way, grab the horse by the mane and ban them all!
Get rid of 'em! Then there will be nothing to pose a risk to anything. Even
though they would rather the horses live their idyllic life there, it sounds to
me like the Humane Society and PETA are the ones out to pasture.
"Arky said horses on the streets pose a risk to the horses as well as the
public."You know what else poses a risk to people, cars,
bicycles, pedestrians, etc. So I think we should just ban everyone from
Leave them alone and mind your own business. If the animal is taken care of
correctly there should be no risk. Find another broom to ride.
Horses don't belong? Say what? These folks have gotten a bit of loco-weed
in their feed. They want to see the nice horsey in the stall or the corral, and
from what I can gather in the article, it's because they are afraid of
horses. If they truly cared about the animals they claim to want to protect,
they would actually spend time with a horse. They would touch and care for and
feed and muck out the stall, they would curry and comb and become familiar with
the horse. They would learn about what a horse wants and what they like and
don't like, what a horse needs and what it would do in a certain situation.
Then let's see who wants to do what with them.Who was it that
said:" the best thing for the inside of a man is the outside of a
I've been around horses most of my life. I believe they should be given
humane reasonable care, and possibly there are hot summer days when they should
not be pulling carriages. However, to completely eliminate the carriage rides
seems extreme to me. If there have not been serious injuries to humans or
horses, that speaks a great deal in favor for the carriage rides. There is
virtually nothing any of us, or our large or small pets, can do that does not
involve some risk or hazard. In the days of my regular association with horses,
my most serious injury was a broken arm, and it had nothing to do with my wild
horseback riding, and actually happened at school (which is a dangerous
environment, all too often).
I have had concerns about the horses for a long time. I live downtown, and
drive by them frequently during the week. I have seen horses that look utterly
exhausted. A few summers ago a friend of mine helped a different carriage horse
that had collapsed downtown. I have made phone calls and email inquiries, but
my efforts led to a dead end.
The urban air is OK for humans but not horses? I think this goes to far.