The line between the righteous and the non-righteous is widening with
ever-increasing speed.I, for one, tire of the fools who deride
common sense and decency and will be glad when we are free of them.And, yes, you know who you are...Is that a Christ-like attitude?
No, I admit it is not. However, the Savior will not endlessly ignore the pain
and agony the disobedient and wicked among us cause.The only
difference I can see is that Christ is more patient than I am. He waits until
His Father says "go" whereas I'm ready for it now.Anybody else out there ready for it, too?....
I'm not sure why people who tend to be so adamant about what Islam teaches
are so annoyed with a Muslim giving his view of Christ.
"Either Jesus is who He said he is, the Son of God, or the grandest of all
hoaxes."First of all, there is ample evidence that the
appellation "son of god" was an idiom in its contemporary vernacular
that did not mean what we moderns take it to mean. Moreover, it was applied to
multiple people, not just Jesus (of Nazareth?).As such, the same
pseudo-logic can be applied to countless "sons/daughters of god",
prophets, seers, revelators, spiritualists, occultists, and the like: Zoroaster,
Moses, Isaiah, Buddha, Confucius, Mohammed, Swedenborg, Mary Baker Eddy, Gandhi,
and numerous others, including David Koresh, Jim Jones, and many other infamous
personalities.Since the affirmation that Jesus is "the
Christ" logically eliminates the veracity of all other claims made by all
other religious/spiritual leaders, it means their claims are "hoaxes"
(false), according to the Christian believer.Others argue that so
many people being duped by a hoax for so many centuries is so unlikely, we must
conclude that Christianity is probably true.But if Islam, Hinduism,
Buddhism, etc can be "hoaxes" with more followers and longer histories
than Christianity, then why can't Christianity "probably" be a hoax
This guy's twitter account is chalk full of obscenities, insults, cursings,
bigoted statements, etc that he's made. Anyone who uses such language in
everyday life loses credibility as an author and historian and frankly an
The author and his Zeolot book are simply " the philosophies of men, mingled
RE:Truthseeker … Reza’s, master of the New Testament Greek.Is the New Testament Reliable? Even Bart Ehrman Says Yes.The
position I argue for in ‘Misquoting Jesus’ does not actually stand
at odds with Prof. Metzger’s position that the “essential Christian
beliefs are not affected by textual variants in the manuscript tradition of the
New Testament”.Bruce Metzger is one of the great scholars of
modern times, and I dedicated the book to him because he was both my inspiration
for going into textual criticism and the person who trained me in the field. I
have nothing but respect and admiration for him. And even though we may disagree
on important religious questions – he is a firmly committed Christian and
I am not – we are in complete agreement on a number of very important
historical and textual questions. If he and I were put in a room and asked to
hammer out a consensus statement on what we think the original text of the New
Testament probably looked like, there would be very few points of disagreement
– maybe one or two dozen places out of many thousands.
"patriot""However one day you will pass through the veil
of death ...as will I ... and we will then SEE for ourselves what truth really
is."Or not. "What a pitiful waste of life to not
at least do an honest investigation into Jesus Christ especially since your
eternal welfare may depend on it ...and it does!"Or not."One day you will look back and wish you hadn't wasted the days
of your probation. That my friend isn't a matter of if but is a matter of
when."Or not. You do realize don't you that
just saying these sort of things don't necessarily make them true? Just
believing or hoping they are true doesn't necessarily make it so. You
realize that, don't you? No, I guess probably not. In that case
let me say, What a pitiful waste of life to not at least do an honest
investigation into Zeus especially since your eternal welfare may depend on it
...and it does!
re: RanchHand[My "eternal welfare" is going to be based more
on how I live my life, how I treat others, etc. than what I 'believe'
or which god I choose to follow (or not follow).]Agreed. Its what we
do not what we think we should know.As for the books premise,
Judas's betrayal was allegedly part of 'the plan' and there is a
good chance he was zealot/nationalist. What better way to promote a cause than
through martyrdom? There is an analogy that fits perfectly but this would NEVER
get posted if I entered it.
Re:JohnPackLambertReza Aslan’s dissertation adviser, Prof.
Mark Juergensmayer, weighed in:Since i was Reza’s thesis
adviser at the Univ of California-Santa Barbara, I can testify that he is a
religious studies scholar. (I am a sociologist of religion with a position in
sociology and an affiliation with religious studies). Though Reza’s PhD is
in sociology most of his graduate course work at UCSB was in the history of
religion in the dept of religious studies. Though none of his 4 degrees are in
history as such, he is a “historian of religion” in the way that
that term is used at the Univ of Chicago to cover the field of comparative
religion; and his theology degree at Harvard covered Bible and Church history,
and required him to master New Testament Greek. So in short, he is who he says
Jesus fulfills the meanings of the Jewish feasts. 1. Passover
(Leviticus 23:5) – Pointed to the Messiah as our Passover lamb (1
Corinthians 5:7) whose blood would be shed for our sins. Jesus was crucified on
the day of preparation for the Passover at the same hour that the lambs were
being slaughtered for the Passover meal that evening. 2. First
Fruits (Leviticus 23:10) – Pointed to the Messiah's resurrection as
the first fruits of the righteous. Jesus was resurrected on this very day, which
is one of the reasons that Paul refers to him in 1 Corinthians 15:20 as the
"first fruits from the dead."3. Weeks or Pentecost (Lev
23:16) – Fifty days after the beginning of the Feast of Unleavened Bread
and pointed to the great harvest of souls and the gift of the Holy Spirit for
both Jew and Gentile, who would be brought into the kingdom of God during the
Church Age (see Acts 2). The Church was actually established on this day when
God poured out His Holy Spirit and 3,000 Jews responded to Peter's great
sermon and his first proclamation of the gospel. 3of7
I have read this book and found it to be a solid compilation of many decades (or
even centuries) of scholarship on the topic. No, not much new, but that is
partly what gives its thesis credibility.Dismissing this author
merely because he is not "christian" (or particularly LDS) is certainly
a low-information approach to burying one's head in the proverbial sand.
Alas, to each his own.
Aslan over-inflated his background in the Fox interview. He does not have a
Ph.D. in religious history, he has a Ph.D. in sociology, with a religious
emphasis, with his main focus being things that have primarily happened since
1900. This does not neccesarily mean he lacks the ability to write this book,
but he does not actually have the background he claimed for himself in the Fox
@patriot;Likewise, belief does not determine truth either. Because
you believe something, doesn't automatically make it true.My
"eternal welfare" is going to be based more on how I live my life, how I
treat others, etc. than what I 'believe' or which god I choose to
follow (or not follow). But I do, sincerely, thank you for your concern. As a
side note, I've probably investigated Jesus Christ more than you have,
believer that you are.
Re: "Opinion alone has no power to determine truth....Death is subject to
opinion and neither is the life that follows. What a pitiful waste of life to
not at least do an honest investigation into Jesus Christ especially since your
eternal welfare may depend on it ...and it does! One day you will look back and
wish you hadn't wasted the days of your probation. That my friend
isn't a matter of if but is a matter of when."Have you
earnestly investigated every purported god and prophet? If not, how do you know
you're not betting on the wrong one?Just because you believe
something doesn't make it true, not even if you believe it with all your
heart, not even if a burning in your breast or a whisper in your ear or the
declarations of a hundred prophets or ten thousand pages of scripture
"testified" that it was true. It's still a mere belief.In this world, what follows death is subject to opinion, because nobody knows.
Not one single person knows. It's all speculation, as far from certainty as
one end of the universe is from the other.
@patriot – “…especially since your eternal welfare may depend
on it…”I was wondering how long it would take to see the
ever faithful, always played trump card, and last desperate attempt to convince
the Heathens of the Christian story… a story that, best I can tell, goes
something like this:We’re born into this world already
condemned for a theological crime we (as individuals) did not commit. Then our
salvation is (statistically speaking) largely a function of hitting the
celestial lottery (i.e., being born into the right family/culture). After
you’ve passed through that eye of a needle, it gets better. Being good is not good enough… you must believe certain propositions
that if you get wrong, will ensure a one way trip to the eternal torture
chamber. But it gets even better! These beliefs
won’t depend on logic, reason or (good) evidence but instead on a
credulous mind as susceptible to believing in Santa Claus as it is in the
correct theology.And for the doubters, all of this can be
“confirmed” by spiritual feelings that are reported across all
traditions and even outside of religion altogether.
re:RanchHandOpinions - yours or mine - mean nothing. Truth exists
in spite of our ignorance or opinion. Opinion alone has no power to determine
truth. A few hundred years ago the so-called elite and educated of the day
considered the earth to be flat. The earth never was flat and had these ignorant
folks been able to see the planet from a few hundred miles up they would have
known the truth. Again - their opinion didn't change the earth's
shape. You may consider Jesus to be a fraud - it's a free country as the
saying goes. However one day you will pass through the veil of death ...as will
I ... and we will then SEE for ourselves what truth really is. Death is subject
to opinion and neither is the life that follows. What a pitiful waste of life to
not at least do an honest investigation into Jesus Christ especially since your
eternal welfare may depend on it ...and it does! One day you will look back and
wish you hadn't wasted the days of your probation. That my friend
isn't a matter of if but is a matter of when.
"One of the foremost interpreters of Islam today, Professor John Esposito is
a Catholic who spent a decade in a Catholic monastery. He teaches at Georgetown
University. One of the foremost scholars of early Christianity is Professor
Paula Fredriksen, who is Jewish. She is the William Goodwin Aurelio Professor
Emerita of the Appreciation of Scripture at Boston University, and now Professor
of Comparative Religion at the Hebrew University in Jerusalem."In fact, Jesus’s advocacy for the “poor and the
dispossessed,” as Aslan documents throughout “Zealot,” is, in
my view, yet another driver of the conservative Christian push-back against
“Zealot,” in addition to the well-known Islamophobia message machine
of the right.The life and teachings of Jesus, understood in their
historical context, are about feeding the poor, housing the homeless, caring for
the sick and loving the neighbor as yourself.That’s
Jesus."(Susan Brooks Thistlethwaite writing in the Washington
Post, is a Professor of Theology at Chicago Theological Seminary and its former
Truthseeker,"I would like to know what historians are saying
about this book."______________________________I
haven’t seen any reviews of his book by historians. But from what the DN
piece reports here and what I heard on the news, there’s nothing original
in what Aslan suggests. Many scholars have considered the angle of Jesus as a
political revolutionary. Criticisms of what Paul did with Jesus’ teachings
are old as Christianity itself.Suggestions by scholars that Jesus
was illiterate is nothing new. But it's still sheer conjecture that
can't be proven or disproven. Jesus was obviously familiar with the
scriptures, quoted them liberally, and understood the law of Moses better than
did many of his Pharisee critics. Of course, he could have picked up much of
that in the Jewish oral tradition. That too is a form of literacy that deserves
higher regard than modern norms of literacy might allow.
@Tators;Been there, done that.Hopefully, someday,
you'll come to the realization that life is what you make of it, not what
some voodoo religionists believe it to be.
I would like to know what historians are saying about this book. For example,
does it accurately represent/portray the historical record of the time period?
I don't see any problem with someone writing about Jesus from a
historical standpoint. Of course, it should stand up to peer review for
accuracy. Many people during Jesus' sojourn here didn't see/view him
as the Son of God. Jews don't view Jesus as the Son of God. Had the
author been Jewish would he also experience the hyperbolic criticism? The author, Reza Aslan, was an Evangelical Christian. His wife is an
@ RanchHand:Based on many of your past comments, this latest opinion
of yours is no surprise. Hopefully, someday you'll be fortunate
enough to find out for yourself what many have known for a long time... That the
Jesus we worship so completely is anything but fiction, and is in fact, central
to the very plan of mankind being here on earth in the first place. But until that day comes, I very much respect your right to your opinion... no
matter how uninformed it may seem to many of us who believe... and to some of us
Personally, my opinion is that the Jesus everybody worships is a fiction,
created by those who "followed" him, well after his death in order to
justify their continued existence.
I wonder, don't all who profess Christianity have to believe that Mohommad
was a false prophet? He didn't teach that Jesus was the Messiah. Christian
doctrine demands that Jesus is. So there is nothing to get riled about with
this guy. He supports Mohommad and the Koran. Christians support Jesus and the
Bible, and for some of us the Book of Mormon. Like goes on.
@TatorsYes, I know. But some didn't like my asking him to be honest.
I guess they thought it was a personal attack even though I specifically said
it was not. Just because someone makes a false caricature of there true
position does not make it a comment free from moderation. Basically my first
comment said exactly what you just got away with saying but the powers that be
thought it was too personal. Back to this article...I find nothing wrong with
disagreeing with some ones position. We just shouldn't allow people to
misrepresnt their own position to draw negative attention to those they disagree
with. A certian party on here has an absolute history of doing just that and it
violates the first rule of being disruptive.
re: Tyler D earlier todayAgreed. I'd like to add, "...religious moral imperatives... as a “Johnny-come-lately”
role that emerged only as an addition to our natural instincts for cooperation
and empathy. - The Bonobo and the Atheist - Frans De Waal"to
9MM"I have often heard that history is written by the
victors."History is written by the survivors.
To SLC Watch:It was Ernest T Bass who made those silly comments.
Most regular readers of these DN comment sections know that he (or she) is
always purposely sarcastic regarding both the Church and BYU... and so should be
taken with a grain of salt. For proof, look at the number of his (her) likes.
There usually are none or close to it. His (or her) purpose is only get your
dire up... which is obviously what happened. It's best to just ignore those
particular (and derogatory) comments and let it go.
As the Deseret News moderators don't want to moderate I will stay within
their boundries (which I did before) I will refrain from: * Comment was
off topic or disruptive. * Comment included obscenities or
vulgarities. * Comment included name-calling, epithets, racial slurs or
other derogatory statements. * Comment included personal attacks.
* Comment included advertising or other promotion. * Comment included
copyright infringement or plagiarism. * Comment included web links,
excessive ALL-CAPS or punctuation, excessive length or violated other formatting
rules. * Comment included personal informationAnd say:"Only an LDS author really knows Jesus.This so-called
"scholarship" is sad." is not representative of a
comment made by myself, I am LDS and misrepresents my faith and was a personal
attack on me by making a derogatory statement.
Healthy Skeptic,"LOL...yet another entrepeneur seeking to build
a cash cow. How many more ways can you twist a thousand or so words spoken
centuries ago and reported second-hand well after the fact?"______________________________Well, why not? Why should
theologians and Christian ministers have all the fun?
It should be fairly obvious to most people that the main reason this book was
written and purposely made controversial was to sell books and make money... not
something so hard to understand, given the nature of our capitalistic society
and of people in general. From what I've read of this author,
there isn't much reason to put stock in what he says and writes about
Jesus. The very simple truth of the matter is that he was and is the Christ.
Jesus himself prophesied that this fact would become and remain controversial
among mankind. And so it has. If someone really wants to read a much
better and more thoroughly researched and documented book about Jesus, they
should read "Jesus the Christ" by Talmage. You will learn multiple times
more about who Jesus really was (is) and his background Jewish society than from
this current controversial written-for-money book.
@bandersonIf you need a believe in a higher power to have love
towards your fellow man that is reflection on you and not the rest of society. I
have more trust in those that are able to use basic compassion and reason to
manage their actions towards the world around them.
9MM,"....To sum up, modern Christian Scripture was written by
the political losers."______________________________The
pattern I see is the best ideas of the vanquished being co-opted by the
victor’s children and grandchildren. Rome sent Jesus to the cross. But by
the time the Roman Empire fell, Christianity was its most ascendant religion. Of
course, what Jesus taught had been greatly modified by the new claimants. But it
had found new incarnations that were sprouting into new forms. That includes the
emerging literature that survived as scripture
This is just more of the same old conflict between "relatives" back to
Abraham's era. Sadly, having a Savior didn't mean as much as it should
have when Jesus was actually living on earth and doesn't now either. As a
poster has said, one can debate spiritual matters until the end of time, but
what one discerns through the spirit is what counts. We waste our time worrying
about the likes of this author and his speculation. Listening to a debate on
national media is a waste of time too.
I have to wonder why such a hateful book was written in the first place? The
author (A devout Muslim) has the right to publish any thing he wants ...freedom
of the press. However I am surprised at how excited the so-called main stream
media is about this book as well as leftist liberals everywhere. A book comes
out that trashes Jesus and calls him a fraud and liberals get all excited. I
think this says a lot about the state of the union today in America and how far
this country has fallen from its founding Christian principles. Pretty sad and
actually quite scary. One nation under God? Not any more. America is becoming
more and more atheistic and especially anti-Christian. I see a day in the not
too distant future where the out right persecution of Christians returns ...this
time to America of all places. The shinning city on a hill doesn't shine so
bright anymore. Of course we are reminded of the out right booing of God at the
Democratic National Convention a few months ago so the atheistic theme in
America is alive and well.
JapanCougar says: "The assumption that scholars aren't incredibly
biased is false."Are we to assume then that scholars are always
biased? Assumptions in general are poisonous, aren't they?I'm also not sure who is more strangled by bias; the highly educated or
the highly religious. The highly educated may tend to think they have more hard
information than others, so their opinion is unassailable. The highly religious
may tend to believe (or "know") that they got a warm fuzzy feeling about
stuff in their bosom, so their opinion is unassailable.
Why is everyone getting so upset that a Muslim is trying to tear down Jesus?
The Muslim world has been doing this for centuries, they believe in their
religion, and in order for Islam to be correct Christianity has to be false, so
of course they are going to try and tear down the Savoir of the world. People
just need to stay strong in their belief and let others do the same. Personally
I know that Jesus is the Son of God and is the Savior of the entire world.
LOL...yet another entrepeneur seeking to build a cash cow. How many more ways
can you twist a thousand or so words spoken centuries ago and reported
second-hand well after the fact? We are perfectly capable of reading those
words ourselves and drawing our own conclusion...the opinion of really smart
people notwithstanding. Whether the Jesus of Nazareth described in the New
Testament was illiterate or not...a condition that was probably more common than
not...is irrelevant. He demonstrated a keen knowledge of the scriptures of the
day...probably better than this self-proclaimed expert author. The subject is
overwrought and tired, but will guarantee wealth for the author.
Many times PHD really stands for "piled higher and deeper". Historical study of religions whether in the guise of social studies or
cultural studies or historical studies or what ever is often buttressed by the
assimilation of many layers of opinion concerning events that definitely get
piled higher and deeper. The real answers are individual in nature and a
realized only when one wants to know the truth with the true intention of
becoming a better servant of God. And said real answers are limited naturally to
the particular idea or principle being studied. To obtain additional true
answers it is necessary to seek further again and again; never being satisfied
with the current state of knowledge and always realizing one could be and should
be more subject to the will of God willingly and energetically.Jesus
is the Son of God. He is God. He is our Savior and Redeemer and all this I know
because of my individual investigations into specific principle and doctrine and
receiving spiritual answers from and through the Holy Spirit. For me that is ALL
that matters. And I hope others will believe me enough to make their own
I have often heard that history is written by the victors. And yes I do believe
that in general, world history is written and therefore viewed by the victors
perspective. This I believe has caused much confusion regarding modern Christian
Scripture, (Bible & Book of Mormon)The Old Testament is the surviving
documents of a society that lost to the powers around it. The New Testament was
written by a society that probably lasted not much more than 130 years, again
the political losers. Oddly however the surviving scriptures of these loosing
societies were adopted by the winning political group that was far afield and
removed from the beliefs and practices of their nativity, and even though later
European societies claimed the Bible as their spiritual guide it is quickly
proved to not be the case. Greed and political power were the principle tenants,
thus enabling such horrible atrocities as inquisitions, and barbaric wars with
those of differing beliefs to increase wealth and dominion as well as to
solidify political standings of kings and clergymen.Put pointedly, the
scriptures that testify of Christ do not source from the winners.To
sum up, modern Christian Scripture was written by the political losers.
@bandersen – “Without God there is no respect and love”Good point… the process God started whereby our morals evolved
over millions of years (see Evolution of Morality Wikipedia page for a quick
summary) is quite impressive, and the foundation of empathy this process
fostered certainly got us to where we are today.Or was your point
that we were all stealing, raping, murderous savages until some rules were
chiseled on a stone tablet?
John said "And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which,
if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could
not contain the books that should be written."I presume there
are many things that would round out the life and times of Jesus. I don't
think he was a nationalist like the author paints him to be. There are wild
leaps to jump to that conclusion from what we know of him. I am delighted that
Jesus becomes the basis for a best seller -- AGAIN.
It's a good thing that for spiritual things you do not have to rely on
academics or the opinions of men, no matter how many accolades they have
received by other men. Spiritual things can only be discerned by spiritual
means. If you want to know if Jesus of Nazareth is who he claimed to be - then
you must ask God in prayer, and or prove the word by trying it in your life.
Seek your own witness, that is the only way I know to learn God's will in
this life. Every other method is an open and endless debate by mortal men with
narrow views and gross ignorance of eternity.
Lord, Savior, and Redeemer were what Jesus was made into by adherents who needed
to salvage a victory from his crucifixion at the hands of Pilate. The question
of whether Jesus was God or man were consuming issues in the early church and
were still being debated three centuries later at the Nicaea Council of 325 AD.
The trinity solution to the question demonstrates how strained the Bishops were
to create the unified belief system Constantine insisted upon in convening the
council in the first place.Was Jesus a Jewish nationalist? Why, the
very concept of Messiah was inextricable from Jewish hope for the restoration of
their sovereignty. The coming of the Kingdom of God was the recurrent theme in
Jesus’ teachings. That doesn’t necessarily make Jesus a political
insurrectionist. But his kingdom may have been more of this world than the
author(s) of John found themselves able to acknowledge.
History is written by the victors, in this case the Christian Church, in
particular the Catholic Church. Myths get written into the history books all the
time. The Bible (New Testiment) is no exception . The books of the New Testiment
were collected for 300 years by semi-educated people and then in 300 C.E.
gathered up by the new Roman State religion the Catholic Church and turned into
the religion they wanted. It is obvious by the thousands of
errors/contridictions in the New Testiment that they did not do a very good job.
So anyone that believes that the New Testiment is completely factual and the
true word of God and that Jesus is all the Bible claims he is is not living in
the real world. If you are one of those people? I have some oceanfront property
in Nevada I would like to sell you.
to eastcoastcoug("The Bible is not the kind of book that can be
"sourced".)If it is full of fictional characters &
events then you are right. (the teachings really do have the power
to change individuals and change the world)Nobody expects the
Spanish inquisition or the crusades.
Only an LDS author really knows Jesus.This so-called "scholarship"
I thought Lauren Green became a bit unnecessarily defensive toward the end of
the interview, but other than that I thought she asked so good questions and the
interview was interesting.I'd like to see how a devout Muslim
would conduct an interview of an Evangelical Christian who had written a book
entitled Zealot: The Life and Times of Muhammad.
Aslan's claims are nothing new, and I don't understand the sudden
shock we're all supposed to experience from it. It's been a suggestion
(including the Jews and Romans that crucified him) that Christ was a zealot
caught up in an era of zealots. One theory on why Judas Iscariot betrayed Christ
is that Judas was a zealot who wanted to see Christ rise as Messiah and
literally take charge of a government and a new holy state. That
these pressures were present in Christ's time provide us with an
opportunity to appreciate just how "radical" Christ's teachings
were, when he said to ignore the temporal and attend to the Spiritual. We, as Christians, could learn something from His teachings, living in an era
of politically charged unrest. It's time to stop rising to outrage, and
confidently turn the other cheek.
Simply put he is wrong in many of his assertions about Jesus but where he is
wrong, the most is that he does not believe Christ is the Son of God, the
Atoning one. Without that belief it does not matter what he says of Christ, let
him preach on, as did the Sadducees and the Pharisees of old. Christ is the Son
of God and our Savior that is all that matters. Jesus loves us and wants us to
return home with him to live as a family for eternity.
I'm not too impressed by the author. He came across as very defensive and
extremely caught up in the fact that he has a PhD. Big deal! A lot of
people have PhDs, and a lot of these people are very opinionated. The
assumption that scholars aren't incredibly biased is false.
At least Aslan can be comfortable in the fact that whatever he says about Jesus,
and really whatever he says, no matter how controversial, he does not have to
worry about assassination attempts on his life. Unfortunately the same cannot
be said if writing about the senior leader of Aslan's own faith,
recognizing Aslan himself would never engage in such activities.
@LRenayHawk,I totally agree Aslan can research or write whatever he
likes. But is he writing this work as a Fiction writer or Historian? How do you
"source" the Bible? The most you can do is cite someone's
"opinion" of historicity.
This book is nothing new in terms of the Muslim POV vs. Christainity. The Dome
of the Rock has writing in Arabic proclaiming that "Jesus is not the son of
God". Walking up the street in Nazareth to the Church of the Nativity is a
banner in English and Arabic saying the same. Aside from Muslims, there are
millions the world over eager for any "scholarly" work saying Jesus is
not the Son of God. I don't care if Aslan has 10 PhD's or
reams of footnotes. The Bible is not the kind of book that can be
"sourced". You either believe it or you don't. For me, the most
tangible evidence is that the teachings really do have the power to change
individuals and change the world. We've tried hate and revenge. Forgiveness
and unconditional love are the only answers to what troubles the world.
Speaking of my savior in these types of books makes me sad. Not mad. But sad.
It's a shock value world these days.
Any religion or man that could be fully and scientifically described by mortal
man would make me very hesitant to become involved in such a belief system. The
whole point of God and Jesus Christ and religion is that it is higher than we
are. When we try to apply our own opinions and scholarship to such a subject as
religion, we will ultimately always fall short. If Jesus Christ has the power to
overcome death, how possibly could we believe that he somehow is petty and
simple enough for anyone, Christian, Muslim, Jew, complete hater, disenchanted
pagan, scientist.....to depict fully in a book?
I have not read 'Zealot: The Life and Times of Jesus of Nazareth' but
I now do want to read this fascinating book. As for Dr. Aslan's
creds: he did receive a Doctor of Philosophy in Sociology of Religion from the
University of California, Santa Barbara as well as a Bachelor of Arts degree in
Religious Studies from Santa Clara University, a Master of Theological Studies
degree from Harvard Divinity School, and a Master of Fine Arts degree from the
University of Iowa's Writers' Workshop, where he was named the Truman
Capote Fellow in Fiction. Now, what some people may or may not know is
that History as well as Sociology, although not the same, however, are both a
social science and humanities - academically speaking.Regardless,
Dr. Aslan has the right to research, study and even write about Christianity as
a Christian can research, study and write about Islam or Paganism or Harry
This is all just way overblown. Jewish. Christian, and atheist scholars write
about Islam. No problem with it going the other way.
Love skiing: Without God there is no respect and love. It is clever to state
that you can be an atheist that understands love and respect, but without God
there is only man's standard for 'love and respect', a sorry
condition if there ever was one. Without God, the world is replete with
man's definition of what constitutes love and respect, every one from
Hitler to Karl Marx were concerned with 'love and respect', and stated
so, only to use the power gained from such bogus propaganda to destroy millions
of laws. All it takes is enough people to believe in man's definition of
'love and respect' to begin the march toward Gomorrah and destruction
of unalienable rights.
It is impossible to "prove" the divinity of Christ solely from the
records that we have. Fortunately, we have access through the witness of the
Holy Spirit to know of the divinity of Jesus Christ. Since I have that witness,
some of these different positions might be interesting but most of it is
"straining at gnats" and tediously boring.
I believe in Christ, as my posting hopefully indicated. But I hope I am not
being overbearing. Yes, people are free to disagree, to not believe as I do.
That is the greatness of our constitution, one of the few governing documents in
the world to guarantee that right.But what's more than the
constitution, there is the idea of agency, in which all are free to choose their
beliefs and actions. I believe we are not just animals. We actually have a
will to use as we see fit. We hopefully quickly learn that our beliefs and
(because beliefs usually lead to actions as night follows day) actions have
consequences. Yes, you and I are free to believe and act as we like.
Not so much how things turn out after we have acted, but indeed still free.
to: very concernedThat is easy. It is a hoax.
to Philosopher... Your thought remind od the following attributed
Pope Leo X, "It has served us well, this myth of Christ."re:
Tekakaromatagi "why then did he dodge the question when asked if
it was lawful to give tribute to Ceasar?"Matt 22:21 isn't
dodging it. "The Sanhedrin were pretty convinced that he said he
was the Messiah in Matthew. "Confirmation and/or hindsight bias,
re: HutteriteI heard that Aslan pretty much stymied & perplexed
the Fox reporter. That would have been priceless to see after all the
belligerence and Springer like tactics used by O'reilly and the lot.
The PhD degree is based on a dissertation, coursework and, needless to say,
many exams. The coursework is usually focused on one academic discipline.
However, the dissertation can focus on academic topics that defy traditional
academic departments. Therefore, it may not make sense to pin a scholar to one
conventional discipline, especially if his or her publications form a tapestry -
such as good scholarship connects a range of topics into a whole. Historians,
for example, write about scientists, politicians, military conflicts and a whole
host of topics.I like to remind folks of the ancient Jain parable of
the blind men and the elephant. There is only one elephant. Your viewpoint
should not matter.
The bible was written 100 years after Jesus and it was inline with what they
believe then. We are way smarter today with all the information and research
that has been done. The bible was also written by man, the most corrupt and
ruthless creature on this planet. I choose to believe in science and not a
deity. If someone believe in him, more power to you. We just need to respect
each and every belief system and don't knock other about it. If it's
not for you or me, it's for someone else. Love and respect for each other
goes a long way.
Wow...I think I will write a book about Muhammad as written by a Christian and
ex-toll that he was nothing more than a mere man, not even a prophet! And then
cash in with a Liberal radio station tour!The problem with my theory
is that, No one that can afford a book listens to NPR or watches a liberal TV
station, it wasn't until she went on Fox news, that anyone shelled out
money to buy her ludicrous assertion!
Can you accept that nobody is required to believe as you do?
If Christ was a jewish nationalist why then did he dodge the question when asked
if it was lawful to give tribute to Ceasar? He could have said a lot about not
paying tribute, but he didn't. He also could have taken a more hardline
stance when interrogated by Pilate.I saw a youtube video where a
speaker said that jesus only claimed toi be the Messiah in John and therefore,
it was not really Christ who claimed to be the Messiah, rather it was John who
made it up. Then I opened up Matthew and looked at his trial by the Sanherdrin
in Matthew. The Sanhedrin were pretty convinced that he said he was the Messiah
in Matthew. I haven't seen the interview, but sometimes people
claim to make new discoveries about Christ or the Bible based on made-up facts
that don't stand up to examination.
Either Jesus is who He said he is, the Son of God, or the grandest of all
hoaxes. The scriptures are replete with the claims he made to be the Messiah,
the Son of God. One cannot separate his spiritual nature (Son of God) from his
teachings. To say he was anything but the Savior would make Him a consummate
liar. I don't believe He was a liar, but that he WAS, and is, the Word of
truth. I for one believe He was who he said He was. The literal
offspring of God the Father and mortal Mary. He taught revolutionary doctrine,
it is true. It was revolutionary to teach us to seek for peace, to love our
enemies, and treat others as we would like to be treated. It was also
revolutionary that He gave His life freely for our good. His teachings about
human nature are transcendent. His teachings about spirituality, spiritual
growth, & consequences are also above anything that has ever been
written.He is the creator of this earth and, through His crowning
atonement, the father of our salvation. In other words without Him there would
be not hope for us. None.
I believe underlying anger of the interviewer might stem from a Christian
outraged at the thought of the Savior being turned into a mere man...applauded
for his contribution to society, but still described as only a mere man in
'Controversial' interview? Not really. The reporter was kind of dense
about it and hung up on one point but the author managed to move the process
forward in spite of her.