I guess what gets me is that I am in the military and have been deployed and the
(expletive) United States Air Force doesn't give me as much for school, as
the schools are giving to athletes right now. Paying players? The schools are
already giving them boatloads of money by paying for their educations, meanwhile
inflating their grades.Living stipend? the players already get money for
housing (or free housing) food and clothing. So much so they wouldn't even
have enough room in their closets to fit all the clothing if they actually chose
to spend it on that.So what these college kids are poor? 99% of college
kids are poor, myself included.
3Grandslams, BYU Covert et al,There is really nothing new in terms
of upper echelon teams separating themselves from the bottom half. The five big
conferences represent about 62 schools. Back in the day before SCOTUS broke it
up the College Football Association (CFA) had 64 members, most of them the same
schools as currently in the Big 5 and they as a group negotiated their own TV
deals as a group. The CFA was created in 1977. So you see, things don't
change much. The size of the group is about the same as in 1977. Back then
Utah and BYU were included in the CFA. The goal was the same, separation from
the lower half. The CFA disbanded when the SEC left and created its own TV deal
with CBS. Everyone else followed suit. So to disparage the Big 5 now is a
little disingenuous. Cutting the group size down to 32 or so in the future will
be difficult to do because all these teams are contractually tied to their
conferences and in most cases have given up their own TV rights to the
conference. To unwind those agreements would be very difficult.
Lets even be more honest and stop listening to "equity" arguments, the
cost of living stipend is really a signing bonus. They will not be across the
board but will grow depending on the talent the school is trying to attract. In
essence is a nasty way the "greed" conferences are trying to recruit
players. It is disgusting and dishonest. Everyone can see it, no one
wants to admit it.
Obviously these 5 conf. don't like Obama and his idea of sharing the
wealth, they want all the wealth to themselves (I guess that is sort of like
Obama...anyhow), I wish the NCAA would cut them off, the them have college
athletics without the support of the NCAA and the NCAA take the remainder teams,
create a playoff and make billions!Suddenly these "greed"
conference would need to get their own contracts, tv rights etc. They have
become a cancer, cut them out.
Landon, I guess you forgot the first real BSC buster, it was BYU. Two games that
drove these conferences crazy, BYU 1984 National Champions and BYU 1996 Cotton
Bowl Champions, especially in 1996, that's when they discovered their
guidelines to keep smaller schools out weren't tough enough.Now
thanks to Utah, Boise etc. (these are the only real bsc busters, Boise has the
best tradition by far) they are freaking out again. Go Cougars!
The NFL never looked better.
RedRocks said:"If this happens look for another reduction in
5-10 years when the elite want to cut out the Vanderbilts, Washington States,
the Utahs etc."That will never happen especially on
Vanderbilt's account. If the $EC kicked out Vanderbilt--its most
academically prestigious institution who's athletes are actually book
smart--it would show that the $EC is interested in athletic dominance over
academic integrity. This would be damaging to the $EC's image especially
This was coming for some time now. From the "Sisters of the Poor"
comment by the former Ohio $tate president, to the arrogance combined with fear
displayed by the commissioners of the so-called "$elect Five"
conferences. In the end players go to the money-hungry schools for a ticket to
the NFL. That is their compensation, and they need no other. If the $elect
Five conferences insists on paying players, then there needs to be a risk
assessment done. For example, by breaking NCAA statutes to pay players you
either face VERY HARD sanctions by the NCAA until you are no longer paying your
players, or you leave the NCAA, but in doing so, you are not governed by a
tax-exempt organization, and any school who leaves the NCAA or NAIA or any other
organization that exists for the equity and integrity of sport and competition
should lose tax-exempt status. The multi-million dollar corporations of the
$EC, Big Tweleventeen, and the other three lesser of the $elect Five conferences
should be heavily taxed by the IRS. Schools exist to educate and create
upstanding citizens, not to sponsor sports franchises that make more money than
Fortune 500 companies.
Y Grad / Y DadRichland, WAWACPaddingOurSchedulepocatello,
IDGo back and re-read the statement. "Two football programs"
"22 athletic departments". One statement does not, necessarily,
invalidate the other.________Hello! Football drives a
majority of athletic departments financially. There is a difference between
revenue and profit. Seriously doubt that BYU generates more revenue and/or makes
more profit than TX, MI, AL, AU, FL, ND, Ohio St., NE, LSU.
motorbike"A lot of nervous and spiteful Coug fans on this
article."No need for "Coug" fans to be nervous or
spiteful. BYU isn't the program facing the prospect of perpetual losing,
conference basement finishes, with no bowl games.
Nothing to fear, none of your tax dollars goes to fund Utah athletics. The
entire $253 million state appropriation funds grad and under grad education at a
40 percent level.
WACPaddingOurSchedulepocatello, IDGo back and re-read the
statement. "Two football programs" "22 athletic departments".
One statement does not, necessarily, invalidate the other.
A lot of nervous and spiteful Coug fans on this article.
toosmartforyouFarmington, UTThose thinking BYU has financial
problems are not aware that a few years ago it was in the news that there were
TWO schools in the entire country that had football programs operating in the
black and ONE of them was BYU. And since it is a private institution they
don't need to tell anyone their business, do they?_______At last count there were 22 schools with profitable athletic
departments. That excludes student fees and government funds. Did not see BYU on
the list (private school). That does not mean they are not profitable, But there
are more than two schools.
Does anyone here really believe that the smaller conferences and schools are
looking out for the interests of power five conferences? Because the NCAA
is dominated by these smaller schools/conferences they have been able to
dictated how power conferences and schools should be run.What's fare about
that? Would you like someone else dictating how your life should be run? \There is no true equality in anything in life. Why should football be any
different? Why should the power five be subjected to the needs of the now power
five? Does a world class doctor or lawyer have the same needs or problems as a
dollar store clerk? The doctor and lawyer may want to help the clerk out but
they should not be forced to do so because there are more dollar store clerks.
All the power five want is to be able to run their conference or school the way
they want. Not as someone else decides or wants. Let the market decide! If you
don't like the power five then don't participate with them. You have a
choice, why shouldn't they?
If this happens look for another reduction in 5-10 years when the elite want to
cut out the Vanderbilts, Washington States, the Utahs etc.. ( the teams that
can't produce championships) that are going to be the bottom feeders.
They will be looking at what teams can produce the revenue needed to belong to
the elite club. Those who cant produce will be shown the door. Some of you
will think that this cant / wont happen. That is exactly what is happening
right now. This is just the next round of the football elite. They will cut it
down to about 32 teams. The big winners will be the attorneys and Lobbyists
that will emerge to influence the politicians on each side of this argument. The Bottom line is that the NCAA need to step up and put their big boy
pants on and make tough decisions (true football playoffs) for college football
Those thinking BYU has financial problems are not aware that a few years ago it
was in the news that there were TWO schools in the entire country that had
football programs operating in the black and ONE of them was BYU. And since it
is a private institution they don't need to tell anyone their business, do
they?For those who think Utah Taxpayers are going to sit still and
have their taxes go up to pay Utah football players a stipend, think again. It
ain't gonna happen.With respect to the "elite 5"
telling everyone they are so much better than the average team (some who have
been rewarded by going to BCS games) I only think of the US Congress and their
ego. Of course we see their current approval rating and perhaps these elite
programs would get the same sort of reputation. Egos are so hard to deflate;
not only do they have the magical and mythical Championship Game, they have all
the money. What they are missing is common sense. We see that frequently with
comments from fans of our own local variety of a bottom-feeder BcS member.
Continued...There are many, including myself, that believe CFB elite
programs will break from the ncaa and the rest for financial and exclusionary
reasons. This would include the elite money-making programs. If this happens,
and I firmly believe it will, Utah and BYU can kiss major CFB goodbye because
neither program is elite in terms of fanbase or income.
There's a few good points that posters have brought up and I agree with.
State legislatures that subsidize state schools will certainly have something to
say about paying players equal stipends. Thats why i dont feel paying players
has anything to do with the Power 5 wanting to break away. it has everythng to
do with them keeping the money they feel they "deserve"...its elitism at
its finiest. As for BYU, this really isn't a big deal to them.
They are a private school that fund themselves, and will pay the stipends and
slightly raise ticket prices, or whatever needs to be done. There are some
commentators that feel the brethren would get rid of BYU sports altogether, but
that is not accurate at all. The reason BYU fought for TV rights and
independence to begin with was the increased exposure it would provide for THE
LDS CHURCH. Why would they invest millions of dollars, only to cut it off now?
BYU will do what BYU needs to do...Utah on the other hand, will be in the hands
of the legislature....
The day this theory comes true will mark the end of football at the pro and
college level as we know it today. NCAA Basketball is super entertaining because
everybody has the same chance. Honestly I miss good old traditional football,
when money wasn't the reason for playing. It disgusts me that corruption
had to take over football. I guess the days are coming where sports won't
mean much to many anyways. The world will soon learn that there is more to life
Interesting comments as usual. I graduated from the U of U, and since their
greedy administration acted to join with the other greedy schools, it gives me
great joy to laugh out loud when I get the "donation requests" from my
AM. I encourage others to never give another red cent to this "institution
of hypocrisy."I as a voter would certainly get involved if the U ever
tried to stipend their players. Unless they can afford to do the same with the
other schools in the state, then no way it happens.
@Bleed Crimson: Do you think BYU voted itself #1 in 1984? I thought they just
played their games and won them all.
@Chris B: Why do you think AD Hill is holding back on upgrading the stadium?
It is because he can see the writing on the wall. If the so called "Big
5" conferences are organized, Hill is worried that Utah may not be included.
Hill does not want to have an albatross hanging around his neck - that of a
brand new 80,000 capacity stadium and minimal attendance at the games. He
already has one albatross - the Huntsman Center - doesn't want another.Rather than worrying about whether or not BYU is included in the
"Big 5", I would worry about Utah, if I were you - if you are a TRUE
As far as utah is concerned on this subject how is it that utah "fans"
think a program already subsidized 25% of its total revenue, and then still runs
a multi million dollar deficit, will be able to pay anyone anything?utah athletics is a money loser, a big fat money loser, and cannot afford
itself as is.
No need for institutions to pay athletes. Let them reap the profits from their
likeness as used in the video games from those private entities. That would be
fair and right. This is a pandora's box that might not just destroy
college football for many programs, it really threatens entire athletic
upinthenightIt's doubtful that the taxpayers of Utah will allow
the Utes to pay football players, if players at other state schools aren't
paid. The state may just have to cancel inter-collegiate athletics at the U to
rein in the out-of-control spending.
I shared my thoughts a few days ago about the potential for conferences to break
away. As some have said it is about the money. There is no way that these
schools could get away with paying football players only. Lawyers would have a
field day with all of the discrimination lawsuits. It's possible the big 5
would cut lesser sports programs all together to avoid paying players.Say what you want about Utah. BYU will be on the outside looking in. I
seriously doubt the administration and church would go along and join a big 5
conference if the breakaway happens.
"...A college scholarship for a football player is worth 40-70 thousand,
depending on the school. This is probably low...".A scholarship,
at USC or Stanford would probably be closer to $250,000 for a redshirt player
who stayed the full five years.
College athletes are given a great advantage right now. Food, lodging, and
education. True, most never graduate or have a real career after college, but
they still have been given a great gift. A college scholarship for a football
player is worth 40-70 thousand, depending on the school. This is probably low.
It is a pretty good give to a student that may not have gone to school
otherwise. I don't object to giving them plane tickets home or a small
amount of spending money. I do object to the fact that at the power schools
players don't have to go to class and they certainly don't do their
own homework. Most don't have to obey the law or hold to moral standards.
They have a pretty good deal right now. Besides, without the mid-major school,
who would be big schools play in September?
jbarr, If they start paying players in the big 5 conferences, the
good players will go to the teams that can afford to pay them more. Meaning, not
UTAH. It means you will have about 3 or 4 teams from each conference making it
to the top and the rest never having a chance.
Forget everything else, it's the money.
If they start paying the players in the big 5 conferences then Utah may finally
be a better program than BYU. They have already caught up to BYU. A player
will choose a school that pays him over one that doesn't almost every time.
Sounds worse than the NFL, where money grabs have basically spoiled my interest.
Dear Duckhunter, scholarships in the sense that you refer to in the
aforementioned article are not deemed income by the IRS. Therefore, they are not
getting paid and it is not a taxable event. However, it is debatable that if in
fact the power conferences pay their athletes, the likelihood of this being
taxed is fairly significant. Although not part of your post, its worth
mentioning, as for anti-trust laws, the way that they power conferences could
remove themselves from this discussion or scrutiny would be to create a seperate
conference with separate rules and regulations to join or be a part of. Lastly, what do you think the Bretheren would say as to your belittling
comment to dutchman?GO UTES!!
@ STuFOO"It still cracks me up that utah "fans" think
they "busted" something created because of BYU.u all need to
understand history, not just claim that u were history"It still
cracks me up that BYU fans feel they should be credited for Utah's success.
That's a sign of either jealousy or insecurity. Utah busted the BCS on
their own and BYU in no way shape or form helped Utah "bust" the BCS.
(Except maybe standing as a punching bag in Utah's regular season finale on
their way to the BCS). The only thing historical BYU should be credited for is
the creation of the BCS. Thanks to their flukey 1984 title! Thanks BYU for
ruining College Football's post season!
Hey Ute fans! The fourth paragraph on the second page is a reference to U.
It still cracks me up that utah "fans" think they "busted"
something created because of BYU.u all need to understand history,
not just claim that u were history.
(cont...)Essentially, there had been only 3 teams who'd struck
fear in the power brokers, and since 2 are now power conference members, that
leaves only Boise St. One single threat to the BCS system.
"Ever since the University of Utah broke through after the 2004 season, at
least one team in the mid-major world has been the thorn in the BCS's side
almost every year." -- Landon HemsleyI suppose that depends on
how one views a "thorn in the BCS's side". If by "thorn"
one means a non-AQ team taking a BCS bowl slot, than yes, Utah, Boise St,
Hawai'i, TCU, and No. Illinois had given the power brokers some degree of
heartburn. Nevertheless, I'm not sure that Hawai'i or NIU really hurt
the BCS that much. Those two non-AQ schools had provided substantial evidence,
via their lopsided scores, that they in fact did NOT belong in a BCS bowl, but
were rather "pretenders" gaming the system by backing in via weak SOS.
Neither team beat ANY ranked teams, and vs. teams from BCS leagues, they went
2-1...with UH beating Washington (4-9), and NIU taking down Kansas (1-11) --
both by a single TD. The sole loss was NIU dropping a virtual Home game to a
4-8 Iowa team.
I would have to agree with poyman and bluecoug. The litigation cost
would be staggering.If it cam down to paying a stipend to athletes,
I don't think the "brethren" would be required to give their
blessing.I really like Larry Scott's voice on the topic:
"I'm certainly aligned with what you heard from my colleagues this week
in terms of the need for transformative change, but I think it can be
evolutionary and not revolutionary."I don't think it will
be as confrontational and controversial a process as some of the reports I have
heard this week."Go Utes!!
For anyone beating their chests about BCS membership and how this little power
grab is going to change the face of football I got one word for you...Litigation.Stop and think for a second. Are there more
constituents (not fans) inside the power 5 or outside of the power 5?
Politicians don't care about fans, they care about getting re-elected. Although BYU is not particularly litigious, there are plenty of schools
who are. And, for those of you who don't understand case law, a precedent
exists that quashes this entire idea...its called the NCAA
basketball tournament. And the courts could be tied up for years.If
you don't think there would be lawsuits over this, you're crazy, what
with the money involved. You think "power" conferences are greedy, just
wait until politicians, states, and boosters get involved. Then
politicians and lawyers will get involved to restructure the entire college
football program, killing conferences, TV deals, and bowl affiliations.So good luck with all the chest beating ute "fans." As always, you put
your pride in the wrong institutions.I hope you don't hurt
Dutchman"Paying football players? That also means paying every
athlete in college that plays any sport."Says who?"The Brethren" don't pay for BYU athletics, fans and donors do,
so paying or not paying athletes is a non-issue as far as the long-term
viability of BYU athletics is concerned.BYU has been working to
endow athletic scholarships for years and well over half of all of BYU's
athletic scholarships are already endowed. Adding an additional stipend onto
those scholarships is not a big deal; it'll just take a little more fund
@Christy,And where would byu be during this time?Division II.LOL!
If this isn't collusion in restraint of trade what is? Time to dust of the
antitrust lawsuit again. Eventually someone is going to have to teach these
power drunk commissioners in the big conferences a lesson in the courtroom.
Regardless of the specifics of how it plays out, there will be a few
constants:1. Utah will be IN2. byu will be OUT3. usu
will be OUTI love my prestigious Pac 12 membership!We
EARNED it just in the nick of time. College football is about to chance
permanently. And I'm IN!
Really, though, this would be the nail in the coffin for about 30 or so schools
within those five leagues, including schools like TCU and Utah, who made the
jump. It would mean that unless a school pull in a ton of money outside of what
it gets from being in an elite conference, that school is just going to be a
doormat (this would probably include BYU if they were to join a power
conference). The smaller schools within those conferences should be joining some
of these 'mid-major' and lesser schools in the fight against this.
When superconferences form, which conference do byu fans think will
"save" them from permanently being excluded from the ranks of the big
boys?Pac 12? Oh no we wontSEC? LOLBig 10? Not a
chanceACC? Keep dreamingBig 12? You had your chance and burned
that bridge long ago. And the Big 12 chose to go east. There is
exactly a 0% chance that a big conference will come to byu's rescue as the
big 5 are solidified as the only legitimate teams in the country.All
other programs can make up their own "national championship" if they
want between the MWC, Conference USA.... and other little teamsBut
the hope of moving to play with the big boys will be OVER
Paying football players? That also means paying every athlete in college that
plays any sport. Will the trustees (the brethren) who run BYU allow this? I
doubt it. BYU is getting boxed in, not only by being an independent on the
outside looking in but the pay issue is going to be a real challenge for them
Not gonna happen... Any Division 1 Colleges left out would file a class action
Anti-Trust Suit and win going away.
This will be the final nail in the coffin for "Non-BCS" schools who wish
they were with the big boys.The 5 power conferences will soon make
up the entirety of the highest division in football, and only they will be
eligible for the national championship.The days are not far off from
byu and usu being division II ProgramsYes!
If a stipend ends up happening than the athletes better keep the grades up and
get to practices on time and not get in trouble. I believe if any of these 3
things are not met than the stipend gets taken away. No matter how anyone tries
to spin this education comes FIRST period, even though I question some of the
programs who I believe want this more for the money than the educational aspect.
Utah and other lower tier schools of the five conferences would still have
programs, but never be competitive again as the top talent goes to their
competition. We have already seen how Utah compares with the PAC in recruiting,
and it hasn't been good. They are barely treading water. At
least with the status quo, Utah has a chance at bowl eligibility with being able
to schedule Idaho State, SUU and Weber state as a "guaranteed win" each
year. If they must replace those games with away games at bigger programs to
offset the cost of paying players, they aren't going to win games.BYU might have to join a conference. I love independence as it has so far
been fantastic. 2012 had BYU face 5 teams ranked at the end of the season.
2013 has the most bowl eligible programs BYU has faced from the previous year.
2014 has the makings of being as good as this year for playing winning teams as
the programs we will face have a better overall record than the ones we face in
2013. I would hate being locked into having to play the same teams every year
Why are the so called power conferences so worried? they still rake in millions
of dollars every year and they are still the "power conferences."
whatever happened to the idea of open competition? This isnt about football
anymore, this is all about money and how the rich guys in the good ol' boy
club can stay rich and hoard everything for themselves. Sad times for college