@one voteSalt Lake City, UTWhy not just start a civil war and
try to take over the tanks and drones?1:19 p.m. July 27, 2013====== It's possible in the land of make-believe
Tea-Partiers seem to live in.Look at how many gun-toting traitors signed
petitions to secede after Mitt Romney lost?
Why not just start a civil war and try to take over the tanks and drones?
I applaud Sen. Lee.Obamacare is unfortunately, unworkable.If the young people decide to "opt out" and just pay the penalty; it
is going to collapse on its own weight.Thats why you are seeing
Obama trying to get the young "rock stars" trying to promote it.There's simply no way it will work the way it is written without a
large infusion of taxpayer (our) funds.We're wasting billions on the
implementation of something that unworkable.
I hope you Utahns manage to back off Mike Lee and his friends who want to defund
Obamacare and/or shut down the government. Does he not understand what a
Republican loss of the House of Representatives in 2014 would mean for the
country? Catastrophic -- Obama and Pelosi and Reid running roughshod over what
is left of our economy and our liberties.
@Joe - The Constitution doesn't require us to amend it to take all its
provisions seriously. It establishes in its first sentence "the general
welfare" as a primary goal of the government. After the preamble, the
Constitution is almost entirely an organizational development memo - here's
how and how frequently you choose members, who is eligible to be a member, and
who in the organization is authorized to make which decisions and how do the
various parts fit together to do the work of governing. Civil liberties are
addressed almost entirely in the amendments.The Framers intended it
to a work in progress - providing a general governing structure with the
flexibility to adopt new policies as circumstances demanded, not a document
limiting the ability of government to act as needed. The principle
of government providing for health care for citizens is well established -
it's known as Medicare. Just as it doesn't require an amendment to
legalize an airforce ("provide for the common defence") it doesn't
require one to establish a regulatory structure to provide health care.
glendenbg: It is true that the Constitution was not written in stone. There is
an amendment process that allows we the people to grant more powers to the
government if enough of us decide that the additional powers are good.But unlike most liberals who think the Constitution is just a
"guideline" that can be ignored anytime someone like Obama decides that
government should grow and tackle a whole new aspect of our lives; most
conservatives believe like Mike Richards that the government should not be
allowed to do that without a constitutional amendment.I find it
interesting that many Obamacare supporters call GOP efforts to kill this law
rammed through Congress as "Dirty Tricks", yet have been fully
supportive of all the tactics of gay marriage advocates to pull an end run
around valid votes by the people who support traditional marriage.Get a judge to nullify the California vote on Prop 8 - Good.Don't
fund the Obamacare law - Bad.Is logic involved here at all??
@Mike Richards - I would summarize your view of US the Constitution as
"Anything which is not explicitly permitted is prohibited."That's a valid perspective, but not the only valid perspective. The
Constitution empowers the national government to provide for the general
welfare. The Constitution permitted slavery, denied women the right to vote -
both things that were wrong and had to be changed. The people who wrote the
Constitution weren't all knowing. They played politics. They made
mistakes. They compromised on some things, they debated and argued. We face problems and circumstances the peope who wrote the Constitution could
never have imagined. Their writings can provide us with insights and values but
not a roadmap for today's problems.
I want to say that no, the GOP should not shut down the government to end
Obamacare, they should shut down Obamacare.The Republicans and
Democrats should work together to repeal Obamacare. If they can't repeal
Obamacare, they should pass a budget that allows the government to operate for
the next year but does not include funding for Obamacare.Since its
passage, its estimated cost has doubled, the things insurance covers has
decreased, and the cost of insurance has increased. Very little good has been
coming out of the ACA since its implementation.
It's all about the constitution until you don't get what you want. You
don't have the constitutional right to shutdown the government.
Mike... your statement "Nothing is "free" - especially government
"services"."... is very true. If we kill Obamacare, the cost of
dealing with the uninsured doesn't go away. This is one of those cases
where there is a bill someone needs to pay... we just need to decide who pays
it. killing Obamacare doesn't make the bill for healthcare go away.The option right now is to keep the status quo and have our emergency
rooms turned into community clinics... where hospitals try to use outlandish
wait times to discourage the use of Emergency services for basic care. But
that is what we have now.No one will argue Obamacare is a faulted
program... but no one has come forward with a solution. Torte law reform
doesn't extend services to people who can't afford coverage.... it
just indemnifies doctors from mistakes or malpractice.We stand here
yelling from ideological cliffs partisan rantings where there seems to be little
to no effort to invest in dialog that would result in real answers.Lee has no answers and has invested no political collateral. He is simply
trying to find the best bully pulpit near the edge of the cliff.
Seniors need to keep in mind that the Republicans/Tea Party will not stop with
Obamacare rather Medicare is slated for destruction in their plans. The
instilling of fear in seniors by this bunch of yahoos passes all understanding.
So seniors, while you still have some strength you need to rise up and threaten
the Tea Party gang, including Senator Lee.
What is Lee's solution?You can't complain if you
don't have solutions
Only if they can propose a better approach that is affordable, provides some
level of universal coverage and addresses the disastrous unintended consequences
of the ACA.
Some people continue to tell us that the Federal Government can do anything that
a State government can do. That is false. The Federal Government is limited by
the Constitution. The Constitution is the Supreme Law of the Land. Supreme Law
means that no other law can be used to modify the Constitution. If the
Constitution does not allow something, then the Federal Government CANNOT do
that "something". ObamaCare is one of those "somethings". It
is not authorized by the people; therefore it is something that must be left to
the States or to the people. Massachusetts is not the Federal Government. It
can do whatever its Constitution allows. If the people of Massachusetts allow
the government of Massachusetts to force them to buy health insurance, then a
state version of ObamaCare would be legal in Massachusetts.The
Supreme Court said that ObamaCare is a TAX. It did not rule on the legallity of
that TAX because ObamaCare had not been implemented; therefore "damages"
could not be proven. After ObamaCare is implemented, the Court will have to
rule on the legality of that TAX.Nothing is "free" -
especially government "services".
I might understand the Republicants' flaming desire to repeal Obamacare if
they had any alternative besides simply denying a good portion of society access
to medical care because the market won't cater to them. Their solution is
to let the 50 million without insurance swell to 100 million. And for those
whose medical bills force them into bankruptcy, what do the Republicants say?
"Too bad. You're just part of the 47 percent. You're takers. If
you were makers, you'd be rich enough to afford decent health
insurance." Wake up, Utah. GOP does not stand for God's
What happens next time Republicans are on top and the Democrats start using
Republican tactics?Mike Lee, have you given up your gold plated
Congressional health care plan yet? What goes around, comes around (Karma).
Just a reminder for republicans: This healthcare plan was the republican's
plan when Clinton first attempted to give us a national healthcare plan in the
90s. This plan was created by republicans. It was enacted by Romney in his
state.This is your plan republicans and it doesn't go far enough. It
should be a single payer system.Just think of how many uninsured kids
could get healthcare if money was spent on this instead of bigger, better bombs.
For a political philosophy so enamored with morals, why do you oppose healthcare
but encourage military spending?
Heavens no.How about an actual solution? Is that really too much to
ask for? C'mon mike, one solid plan. You can do it!
Shutting down the government to make a point would be catastrophic for the
Republicans. If they had a plan of their own to replace Obamacare, they might
have a leg to stand on. But generally, people do not like chaos and uncertainty,
and for good reason. Technically they could do this, but I think it would be
Problems with Obamacare are a result of Republican sabotage and obstruction.
Regardless of how accurate that statement is, it's a lot more believable if
Republicans so blatantly openly try and block the law like Lee suggests and then
tout it as an accomplishment. Still though, despite the electoral advantage for
Democrats that historically comes with Republican gov't shutdown
obstruction, I'd rather Lee and friends not harm the economy during their
temper tantrum.Just remember, while a majority oppose Obamacare in
polling, those polls also show that a majority either support Obamacare or
oppose it because it's not liberal enough (that group is hardly fond of
Hint to all Republicnas...Hostage takers NEVER win.In
fact - IMHO - The should be considered Domestic Terrorists and traitors to our Nation.
Mike Lee can read. He has read the Constitution. He has taken an oath to
defend the Constitution. He will defend the Constitution even when Obama has
paid off States to get ObamaCare passed (Louisianna, Nebraska). Obama knows that ObamaCare is not what he told us it was. He knows that
funding it will either bankrupt the Country or it will bankrupt the individual.
It costs many times more than he said it would cost. It won't cover many
of the people that he said it would cover. It will not provide beter health
care, like he said it would.What it will do is to transfer 18% to
24% of all money in the private sector to the government where that money will
be mixed into the general fund, just like Social Security revenues. That money
will not be kept in a "locked box" to be used only for health care. It
will be used to pay for "pork". It will be used to buy votes.Anyone who can read can clearly see that the Constitution does not allow the
government to administer health care nor does it allow the government to tax us
Does shut down the government me furlough everyone at HAFB? Put up or shut up
If President Obama talked about the importance of breathing to good health Mike
Lee would advocate suffocation.Utah, Mike Lee is what you get when
you knee-jerk vote for someone because he's got the magic "R" by
his name and when the doctrinaire fringe of that party determines its
candidates.Lee an embarrassment to our state. I take that back...
he's an embarrassment to this nation.