CPrice said it well.That is all I was saying.Why the
I believe the true issue is that a reason given for the switch was General
Conference. The Republican party in Utah cannot allege that our rights and
liberties are being destroyed by the Democrats in DC when they are not
considering the rights and liberties of the non LDS population within the state
of Utah. While I am aware of the large LDS population, as I belong to the faith,
it is no reason to change a political event. Allowing this switch would open the
doors for any religion to ask that election dates be changed for religious
purposes. It goes beyond numbers, if the state legislature is willing to move an
election for the LDS church then according to the rights given all other
churches' congregations under the constitution they would essentially have
to move the election for another church because their congregation would not be
Interesting that it's mainly the GOP that's concerned about their
convention conflicting with General Conference. Does that say something about
the religious makeup of the two parties in Utah?
Those who are interested in voting will find a way to learn about who they want
to vote for no matter when the date is. I would prefer the dates stay as they
@ A Scientist,You are missing the point. The LDS Church is not
making a request and, frankly, this has nothing to do with church headquarters.
It is simply an issue of whether or not to hold the convention at a time when a
large number of people have other committments. If you want greater
participation in the political process, you should make an effort to hold you
events when the largest number of people can participate.If your kid
has a birthday on Christmas, you probably won't schedule his party on
Christmas Day since participation would be quite low (and my guess is that Santa
won't move the date for him). Whether or not you like it personally, the
fact is that conference weekend is very similar to a holiday weekend in this
state in that a large number of people have specific plans and it's
probably not a good idea to try holding other major events.
Last year, during the primary season in Idaho, the LDS Church made sure that no
activities or meetings were held to conflict with the caucus of either party so
that members would not have a conflict with participation in the political
process. One caucus was on a Tuesday night. It may have happened in other
locations, but I am not aware.
re:A Scientist 10:24am "Keep the party schedule as it is and
make General Conference move."1:53pm "Nobody said the
government should tell any church how and when they should worship."
Maybe what we need to do is remove the primary altogether and let the Parties
determine and also pay the cost of determining who will represent them. We as
tax payers spend way to much of our tax dollars for this process. The names are
provided 45 days prior to the election and then we have the election. End of
story. While we are at it maybe we limit the number of days that the whole
process for the election cycle can include so that the people we elected last
year can at least spend some time doing the job they were elected for instead of
going directly to campaigning three months after they are sworn into office. I
can’t help but wonder how effective the mayor of Saratoga Springs is when
the search for money is already at hand.
"That was not a very smart comment. Make the government tell the church (any
church) how they should worship and what days."That is an
unintelligent comment. Nobody said the government should tell any church how and
when they should worship. I simply stated that the Utah GOP should keep their
schedule, and if it conflicts with LDS General Conference, then let the Church
decide what it wants to do about it. Don't change the schedule for the sake
of a Church - ANY Church!Please refrain from misrepresenting my
The GOP State Convention will take place 4 weeks after Caucus Night but
Candidates will NOT have 4 weeks to campaign. Under the current
Republican Party Constitution, the GOP leadership may taka up to 2 weeks to
deliver the COMPLETE list of delegates to Candidates running for office. This
reduces the campaigning time from 4 weeks to 2 weeks. This constitution cannot
be amended for 2 more years and the GOP has NEVER provided the list of delegates
in less than two weeks. Add to the mix General Conference week,
Easter and 29 County Conventions that have to take place within those 4 weeks
and you a recipe for disaster, no real vetting of candidates, delegates unable
to do the jobs they were elected to do and one more reason to get rid of the
Caucus System. It is impossible for a Candidate to mount a campaign
or visit 1000-4000 delegates within a 2 week window. Something has
to happen here; either caucus night is moved up, primary election is pushed back
or the caucus system has to go. Take a pick!
"Keep the party schedule as it is and make General Conference move."That was not a very smart comment. Make the government tell the church
(any church) how they should worship and what days. Yeah, lets "demonstrate
that politics, government, and economics are not ruled from the Church Office
building" and violate everyone's right to freedom of religion.
In the battle between Church and State, Church too often takes priority in the
State of Utah.Keep the party schedule as it is and make General
Conference move.This is an opportunity for Utah to demonstrate that
politics, government, and economics are not ruled from the Church Office
RanchHand, perhaps in the US Pres. races, we do have too much time. For local
races, no.Bypassing the caucus/convention system will not create
more participation. There are 4,000 state delegates and many more county
delegates that spend countless hours vetting candidates to be on the ballot.
They are selected by those that attend the neighborhood election caucus meeting.
The current one-on-one candidate vetting by delegates cannot be done well any
other way.When people realize this Count My Vote initiative will
give them less of a chance to participate but give media and power brokers more
power, they will not sign any initiative. This is a power grab and it isn't
by the neighbors you elect as delegates.If you are going to run as a
Democratic candidate, you have to comply with their rules. If you are going to
run as a Republican, you have to comply with their rules. If you don't like
those rules, you can run as unaffiliated, independent or as a third-party
candidate. Count My Vote is attempting to change all party rules by changing
state laws by initiative, thus bypassing the political parties and the
JWB"In the case of the last election it might have given the citizens
more time to know about John Swallow and Sean Reyes to elect the right person,
if they had gone to a primary."Actually, the Swallow/Reyes race
did go to a primary. Moving the primary 3 weeks to the 3rd Tues. in July would
give delegates 3 more weeks to one on one vet candidates which may have helped.
I am not sure Reyes was the perfect candidate, and the democratic
candidate had ties to Ogden's apparent abuse of power by the police force.
Looking back, Reyes would have been a better candidate, but that wasn't
obvious in the month to vet him. Again, more time may have helped.
When they moved it from September to June years ago, that was a dumb move then
for those that wanted to vote. There was a rationale for that move and it was
probably for the incumbents to stay in power due to the proximity to the caucus
or convention and not very much time for some that were new to the process and
name recognition.It never made sense for the numbers that went to
the polls in June, even though you could get an absentee ballot. It appeared
that Utah wanted to be in the limelight and to be as other states as the
children of Israel wanted to have kings like other countries.In the
case of the last election it might have given the citizens more time to know
about John Swallow and Sean Reyes to elect the right person, if they had gone to
a primary. When you walk out of the convention and a handful of people vote in
the Primary of the right group you end up with elected officials that might not
be the best for the citizens. Delegates were persuaded avoid a
primary and publicity about GOP candidates for the general election.
The whole argument is ridiculous. We already have way too much time spent
politicing in this state/country.
The caucus & convention system in Utah is the best way to make sure a
grassroots process can win over large amounts of money. It is the only way
someone with $100,000 can go against someone with $2 million in election
funds.We have a system that that does NOT favor the incumbent,
wealthy or famous. This is a good thing.Our problem with voter
turnout is it has not kept up with the population increase. The voter turnout
keeps going up but not as fast as the population. Some of that is the younger
voters, where Utah has a larger percentage of them and they aren't, as a
group, as involved. Also those moving in and not understanding our system.We already have a "bypass" system, filing as an unaffiliated
candidate. You go straight to the general. Someone doesn't think they can
win if vetted by average citizens asking one on one questions, can run and spend
the money. Why should they be a party nominee if they are going to bypass the
party?If you change the way our Utah primary's work, you could
have two republicans in the general election ballot (or two democrats).
I think our best chance to change what we have now, is to change the primary to
the 3rd Tues. in July. It is only 3 weeks, but 3 weeks could make the difference
in making it work or not. It won't hurt a candidate walking a district, as
prior to July 24th, isn't as effective. It seems to stay away from July 4th
and the 24th. No one likes the idea of county conventions on General
Conf. weekend or state conventions on Easter weekend. I think James Evans did a
good job of getting both the GOP in the House and in the Senate to understand.
People need to call their Rep. or Senator to have them vote to move the primary
to July. I know Thomas Wright tried in 2011, but the talk then was moving it to
the fall, which is hard for the winner of a primary to still have time to win in
November. 3 weeks is about the time we lost for the MOVE Act.Utah GOP can pick the US President nominee on the neighborhood caucus
night in March 2016 like the Utah Democratic party did in 2012.