@Rationallet me revise your entries...Lakers traded for
Kobe...there even rumors that he won't play for any team but the
lakers...Bulls traded for Pippen....Spurs getting duncan
was luck...but it paved way for their rebuilding project@joe5you have a point that 2014 free agency class is not that deep...especially if
the guys won't use their eto...but there are a few names...mostly guys from
Hayward and Favors' draft class...like monroe...cousins...paul
george...besides them...im not really sure who the targets would be...
In other words, there is nothing to back up the claim.The reason I
said to convince me is because I don't believe it. Just because Brad Rock
says it doesn't make it so. The 8-figure guys from next year aren't
going to be Jazz recruits any more than the 8-figure guys from this year. The
rest of the field is about the same as this year.If there is
arrogance, it is with someone who butts into a conversation between two others
with nothing more than a smart aleck remark. Please grow up before you join a
conversation between adults.
joe5,I have three words for you: Google. Try it.Because you are in GREAT need of an NBA education. Asking others to
"convince [you]" is either lazy, ignorant, egotistical, or all three.
SG: So tell me what players are coming up next year that are significantly
better than this year's crop of guys like Mayo, Redick, Corey Brewer,
Hickson, Landry, Pekovic, Calderon, Martin et al. I haven't even mentioned
the $10M+ guys like Smith, Iguodala, West, and West. And, of course, that
doesn't include the big two: CPE and Howard.So convince me that
next year's crop of free agents is significantly more talented than this
* "aren't coming" should be "are coming" . . . my bad.
@ joe5No, of course none of those players aren't coming to
Utah, just like neither Dwight Howard nor CP3 came to Utah.The thing
is, the 2014 free agent class is very deep in terms of talent, much deeper than
this year's free agent class. Rather than locking in mediocrity for the
medium to long term, the Jazz have surrounded their young core with bench scrubs
(with the possible exception of Brandon Rush, if he has fully recovered from his
ACL injury), guaranteeing their young core significant playing time (one or more
of them is very likely to have a breakout season), while simultaneously
positioning themselves for "Tankapalooza 2014"Is this a
gamble? Absolutely! But sometimes the two birds in the bush (the chance to
become contenders, coupled with risk) are preferable to the one bird in the hand
(no significant decline, coupled with mediocrity). I say, let's roll the
dice . . . hopefully we get a franchise (or at least all-star caliber) player in
the draft, some solid journeyman depth through free agency, and we are back in
the hunt in 3-4 years.
@joe5Like you said, we won't get those guys, so what do you
want the jazz to do? Sign some worse end draft picks and magically make it to
the 6th seed (and that would take a lot of magic) just to lose in the first
round? I'd rather blow up a team and rebuild than stuck in mediocrity.
Let me say this again. If any of you believe that next year's premium free
agents (LeBron, Wade, Bosh, Melo) are coming to Utah, you should re-think it
with a dose of reality. In truth, the Jazz will be fighting for the second tier
of free agents exactly like they were supposed to do this year. So why is the
summer of 2014 going to be any different that the summer of 2013?
I think this is the best deal Utah could have done too. I would have liked to
have seen the Jazz get Bogut in this deal too, or in place of Rush or Biedrins,
as Bogut would probably have resigned with the Jazz once his contract was up and
would be great to play with Hayword and the other "core 4". This is
still a great deal for Utah as now when the better FA's come off the books
of other teams next off season, Utah can go out and get that impact player or
two to go with the "core 4" that will finally get this team back to the
playoffs and not just an early 1st round exit either.One would have
to think that Jerry Sloan, Ty Corbin and others like Malone were brought in for
their thoughts on this trade too as they will be the 3 leading this team via
coaching and advisory positions.We have to be patient as Jazz fans
now, let the younger players develop now, and know that the Jazz will be back to
a great team once again in a year or two at most.
Every legit NBA fan knows the 2014 draft is a once-in-a-decade draft. Teams that have built through the draft:OKC. If you don't
know that, move on.Chicago drafted one Michael Jordan #3 and Scotty
Pippen. Miami drafted Wade, traded for Shaq. Second time around, signed
Lebron, but no Wade, no Lebron. That simple.Houston draft Hakeem, then
drafted, traded and acquired free agents around him.Celtics drafted
McHale, then Bird, then surround with trades (Chief, DJ) and other drafts
(Ainge).Celtics drafted Pierce, Rondo, acquired around them.Lakers
drafted Magic, and Worthy. Acquired the Magic pick from the Jazz years
before.San Antonio drafted Robinson, waited, drafted Duncan then Parker
and Ginobli.Lakers drafted Kobe, acquired Shaq, traded for Gasol.The
Jazz drafted Stockton and Malone. Aiming for the 2014 Tankapalooza
draft is a good move.
CottageCheeseIf simply making the playoffs is good enough for you
then I don't know what to tell you. Jefferson, Rush, Biedrins, Favors,
Kanter, Hayward - these guys will never bring a championship here. They may make
the playoffs though, if that is what you are after.
@joe5i understand your frustration...even if we do sign...we
won't win em all anyway...so why not take it as it is...a clear slate with
5 young guys to work with...if this pans out...well then we are screwed...but
till that day happens...im willing to give it a shot...heck we almost made
playoffs with washed up guys like Danny Manning...Tom Gugliota...Donyell
Marshall...and Jon Starks...so i guess having 5-6 young guys...and some washed
up players will do better...this coming year and the next...will test the young
core's heart...we will know who these kids are...Kevin Durant and OKC
failed the first two years...2007-2008 and 2008 - 2009 seasons...they got
westbrook during 08 and harden on 09...i understand that you pay hard earned
money to watch them play...but sometimes...to break the cycle of
medicority...you need to blow up and reinvent yourself...i just hope they could
pull this off...just remember...this will take a while...
So Jazz are taking a year off then going to do something...OK got it.
Good job Jazz, playing their cards very smart.
For all you Demarre Carrol fans, he's gone signing with the Hawks along
Like this move a lot! Play the young guys and see if they sink or swim. They
will get the experience they need and be that much better for next year. They
then will have two 1st round picks next year in a loaded draft and probably a
high lottery pick as one of those. Future looking great for the Jazz.
This was the year the Jazz promised to use their cap flexibility to really help
the team. Instead of keeping faith with the fans, they postponed it a year. What
exactly makes next year any different?
Brandon Rush could pan out to be someone the Jazz may want to keep.41.5% from 3 point range and a decent perimeter defender. His contract
expires after next season and if things are looking up with our core he may want
to stay and be part of it.This is a sweet deal for the Jazz. The
young guys will be playing and Biedrins and Jefferson are filler to get all
those draft picks.Lindsey and O'Conner are proving to be a
decent team.Get to work Favors, Kanter, Burkes, Hayward, and Burke.
Your time to prove yourselves begins in a few short months!This is a new approach by the Jazz, that is to truly rebuild vs limping along
and winning 40-50 games every year.You have to go down to get top
talent in the draft and next years draft is deep unlike this years. We got the
best there was this year though.It will be a long season next year
but at least we will get to see whether we have any real prospects that can
consistently carry the load every night. If not lots of cash to spend on
I fall on the side of those that like this deal. I've been belly-aching all
the time that Corbin needed to develop the young guns but he kept holding them
back to try and win with the veterans that already proved they couldn't
take us anywhere. Now Corbin will be forced to go young. Sure, we won't be
real contenders for awhile but the Jazz will have a chance over the next several
years to change their makeup. You have to agree it will be interesting to see
how the core 5 will do and at the very least these young players will have a
real chance now to see how good they can become.
The Jazz still need a quality pass first point guard, even if they are stocking
up picks and space. I doubt a rookie will help the Jazz youth develop. I'd
like to see another deal before their done.
"I know we need to play the young guys but couldn't we at least add
some GOOD players? these guys are awful."It depends on what you
want to accomplish this season and next. You wanted to add "GOOD"
players? Ok. How good? Good enough to start? Good enough to demand 30
minutes a game at the expense of developing the young guys? Good enough to
demand a longer-term contract so we can't afford to sign our young guys
next year to longer-term contracts?
Wow, we lose 32 points 16 rebounds and get 3 points 4 rebounds and pay a ton.
What a deal. I know we need to play the young guys but
couldn't we at least add some GOOD players? these guys are awful.
This is an awesome move!!!!! Any good basketball person can see this, and those
who can't need to wake up. The Jazz would have had to sign players they
didn't want just to get to the league minimum salary. This way they get all
the cap flexibility next year, and Curry is an inevitable injury waiting to
happen. As long as the pick isn't protected, there's a good chance the
Jazz may have 2 lottery picks. Play the young guys, win 25 games, and then add J
Parker in the draft. (Fingers crossed)
Go ahead and look at San Antonio, who has been their biggest free agent
acquisition in the tim duncan dynasty/era...horry, kerr, jefferson. All role
players, not stars. They have built amazingly well through the draft.Another example is OKC. In seattle, they were awful, and scored durant(2nd
overall). Still awful, drafted westbrook(4th overall), still awful, drafted
harden(3rd overall) and then traded and signed role players along the way. And
that got them all the way to the finals (we'll ignore the dumb harden trade
for now).And now we have dennis lindsey, who is trying to get young,
get good picks, and surround them with veteran role players. It's a great
move for a small market team, lets just hope we draft and develop as well as OKC
and SA.One last nugget of knowledge. Sam Presti (OKC GM) and Dennis
Lindsey (UTA GM) both learned under RC Buford...the GM for the Spurs. We are in
good hands, so have some faith.
How many times has Utah looked toward a strong draft only to get burned. I
don't care for this deal, it defiantly sends Millsap packing, and I think
he is a much better player than anyone of these three. Rush is soft and
inconsistent, Jefferson can shoot but he too is soft also. Biedrins is so slow
that he looks like he is running in mud. Everyone's been talking about this
being the big year for free agents, now their taking GS bench players for anther
look into the crystal ball of the draft. Hey Americanvet, all bets are off on
Corbin doing anything with this bunch, maybe it's the Millers way to can
Corbin to get Jerry back.
It amazes me how few some people know about basketball on here. Please go read
up on some other sites (not sure I can post them on desnews, so I'll let
you figure out where to read about the nba, maybe their own site, or the site of
a world wide leader in sports).@There you go again:Like rjhman
said, there is a league minimum, and the jazz needed to meet it. The smart thing
they did was meet it only for this year, and not take on 2-4 year contracts of
aging veterans.Also, I believe cottagecheese really knows his/her
stuff.@Joe5: The jazz haven't been rebuilding for a while,
they'be been stuck in limbo. Not good enough to win it all, not bad enough
to get any good picks. And yes, most teams win by rebuilding.I know
the NBA has recently been about building superteams, but that only works in big
markets or guys that already have great picks. Like you said, we can't get
the lebron's, melo's etc. of the world. If you are a small market
team, you have to build through the draft.
So where do the Jazz fit in the West now? The young guys will be playing no
doubt and they will have room to sign those players over the next couple years
if they pan out this year. Denver is falling apart. Golden State got better.
The Lakers are not any better and will likely fall apart if they do not make
moves now. Houston is better as are I believe the T wolves.In their
own division they have a very real shot at finishing 2nd behind OKC and ahead of
Denver, Portland, and T-wolves. San Antonio, Memphis, Houston, Clippers, GS,
OKC all finish ahead of the Jazz this year but the last 2 playoffs spots will be
up for grabs with the Jazz in the mix with Dallas and the Lakers. Other teams
have to many holes and to much building to do while the Jazz have been building
for 3 years will playing mid-level veterans.Kanter and Favors will
avg 30/20 between them and be better defenders.We improved at PG and
Hayward is a year better.SG is still a potetnial hole but with draft
picks we can fill it next year.
Great trade for Jazz. The NBA has a minimum amount that teams must spend - this
trade gets them closer to the amount without forcing them into overpaying for a
bunch of mid-tier veterans (aka Millsap, Jefferson, Mo Williams) that will bring
us to the 8th seed in the playoffs or the lower lottery picks. This
allows them to develop the young guys, get draft picks, and tank for
Wiggins/Jabari Parker/About 3 other guys in the best in 10 years 2014 draft.
"...the Jazz have sacrificed their financial flexibility (approximately a
combined $24 million) in three players who saw their minutes decline...".Approx. $24,000,000 for one year for three players who saw their minutes
decline...Great.There IS a BELIEVABLE/COHERENT plan
behind this madness?
@joe5this is officially a rebuild...after failing to perform the
past two years with sub-par good players like Jefferson and Mo
Williams...clearly...this is the start...we made the playoffs but a first round
exit...2 years ago...and this is what? second time the Jazz actually been
rebuilt...the last time we got Deron Boozer Memo and AK...went to western
conference finals...this year...we get Burke Burks Hayward Kanter Favors and a
possible lottery next season...who may turn out to be as good...i may be
blind...and people can call me foolish...but i will believe in Lindsey's
plan...and i will give it at least 5 years...and i am well prepared for a rough
5 years ahead...at least i know that somewhere within that 5 years..we will get
back into the thick of things in the playoffs...i am sure of it...unlike the
perennial bottom feeder teams....i trust this franchise's track record for
the past few decades...
On mature reflection I see what they're doing now. They are letting all the
other teams spend like drunken sailors this year while putting themselves in a
position to clean up on Free Agency and the Draft next year. Meanwhile, the
coming doesn't have to be dreadful if the three new guys stay healthy and
fill some holes. No question, the young guys will be playing just like everybody
wanted. You said you wanted to start Trey. Get ready kid, here it comes.
Jefferson and Biedrins are a couple of lumps. Brandon Rush is the only legit
player in the group, but who knows how he's going to perform after major
knew surgery. I guess the Jazz had to spend their cap money on someone.
I'm not impressed!
Rebuilding teams don't win championships.First we were
rebuilding with Kirilenko and we surrounded him with Boozer and Memo.Then we were rebuilding with Deron and Millsap.We've been
rebuilding for 3 years with this core of players (starting with Hayward).Now you want 3-4 more years of rebuilding but in 3-4 years, Hayward will
be playing for his college coach in Boston and Favors will be playing for the
Lakers.So then it will be 3-4 more years of rebuilding. By then
Kanter and Burke will be leaving.When exactly do we stop re-building
and have a competitive team again.
Now sign Aaron Brooks or make a move for Jeremy Linn.
@joe5clearly...we really cant win this season...you should have
known that...the team would be rebuilding...and i think it would take 2-3
years...have faith...we won't be able to be competitive in the long run by
just signing just good players...you need a franchise player...maybe we win the
lottery next year...even if we dont...that draft class is supposed to be
stacked...and we can get Dario Saric with the golden state pick...
Brandon Rush can be a solid player who can either play for the future or be a
good trade asset. I think they were thinking this all along. Jefferson &
Beidrins are on their way out, but Rush was a steal for Kevin Murphy. Way to go.
@Brahmabullyou have no idea...how great this trade is...first of
all...you get three players that has expiring contracts next year...second you
get 2 first round picks...1 for 2014 the other on 2017...the key here is Brandon
Rush...which i think...would be a good young backup...if he recovers from
injury...they can let go of Jefferson and Biedrins next year...this means...the
Jazz can get young...and is in rebuilding mode...why would you get an aging
Andre Igoudala when you core players are under the age of 23?...doesn't
make sense...i think this is a complete rebuilding project...but got the pieces
when KOC grabbed Hayward and traded deron for Favors and got Kanter and Burks
out of the draft...continued by Lindsey grabbing Trey Burke...this forces Corbin
to go young with his team
I'm waiting for the other shoe to drop. Is the big plan to be as bad as
humanly possible because next year's draft is supposed to be so good? Yes
we need a shot blocker, but I can shoot BLINDFOLDED better than Biedrins does
with both eyes allegedly wide open.This may be a genius move, but I
don't quite see it yet.
Next year the Jazz signe LeBron and Kobe
Don't know much about the three players. Rush is from Kansas and was
injured. They will all be gone at the end of the year. It would appear that
they are being brought in for mentoring. Let's see what happens.
@BrahmaExcuse me? The Jazz have made it to the playoffs, including
a Western Conference Finals appearance, the majority of the seasons since
Stockton and Malone.There aren't a lot of other teams that have
experienced consistent winning and playoff appearances in the past 25 years.
The Jazz are one of those teams.Look at all of our accomplishments
over the past 25 years and stack it up to the rest of the league. We'll be
top 10 EASY.
I can`t make any sense out of this trade! Why not use the 24 million to try to
get a pretty good player? I don`t see how any of these players are going to help
CottageCheese: Do you really think LeBron, Wade, Melo, or Bosh will come to
Utah? Seriously, you need to re-think that argument. We're going to end up
next summer like this summer. All the top free agents will go somewhere else and
the Jazz will be left with the dregs to choose from. This year, there are some
pretty decent dregs with Calderon, Corey Brewer, Landry, and JJ Hickson. We
could have offered a toxic front-loaded offer to Pekovic which would have forced
Minn to make a very tough decision. Lots of options that are still fairly young,
would not threaten the playing time of the young guys and could provide enough
talented depth to really compete.No team will ever be champions is
they only build through the draft. No matter how talented a player is, he still
needs seasoning. How many years was it before Jordan won a championship? How
about LeBron? The only rookies that win championships are those that come onto
teams that are already contenders. The Jazz have lots of youth. Draft choices
are a waste for this team if they ever want to get out of the rebuilding mode.
Keep in mind that the Jazz will need money next summer to re-sign Hayward and
Favors... Failed to include that in my post.
To those who don't understand whats going on this will look like a bad move
but to me it's great news since now it's for sure they are going with
the youth movement and not trying to fill in with a bunch of re-treads that
might help you win a few extra games. Basically they picked up a
7' backup center who can rebound, a veteran small forward who is older but
solid for a backup and the key to this deal Branden Rush, one of the best 3
point shooters in the NBA if he recovers from his knee injury and a 1st round
pick in 2014 and 2017 and they get all of this for taking on their $24 million
in salaries which expire next year along with Williams $7.5 million when they
will seriously need the money to re-sign Favors and Hayward and have some money
to compete in a much better free agent market and put together a much better
team than they could have this year. They also now have 2 1st round draft picks
in the best draft in years. I love this move.
Yea ever since Malone and Stockton it is always next year... Well a decade has
passed and still... nothing. Next year, next year, next year.
This was the perfect option for the Jazz. Three expiring contracts?There are NO other FA's out there that would make sense for the Jazz. So
they are able to sign some back ups and let their young guns play (something
that everyone has been begging for).Not only that, they pick up a
draft pick for 2014 - a draft slated to be as strong as the 2003 draft with
Lebron/Wade/Bosh/Melo etc. So they get the Warriors 2014 first rounder that
will go along with their own 2014 first rounder WHICH may be a lottery pick.They get expiring contracts - big money expiring contracts - which puts
them in an excellent position next off season when some more big name FA's
come on the board.If you think about it, this is a brilliant move.
Trust Dennis Lindsey. He is smart and he is steering this ship in a
good course. It will just take a year or two to develop.
This is a move for the future. They're not trying to pay a lot of money to
get semi-good players in the free agency market for 2013-14. Grow the young
ones this year, get a lottery pick in the loaded draft for next year plus an
additional pick from GS, and wipe the three GS players' contracts off of
the books at the end of the season.
hey, it's 2013. Jazz are looking at the 2014 off-season. Next year,
they'll again show a lack of commitment to winning and look forward to the
2015 off-season. By the time they figure it out, Hayward and Favors will be
nearing retirement. Worse, they are smart enough to see the Jazz don't
intend to "play to win" so they'll be gone in a couple of years.I just hope the Jazz FO has some other things in mind. Maybe they plan
future moves with one or more of these players. But this can't be the bill
of goods they think will get them in the game.
OK, did something at least. Got 3 scrubs and 2 draft picks for nothing. Not bad,
at least their contracts are done next year. They will be playing the Fab 5
looks like and maybe will be in the draft lottery sweepstakes. DeMarre is still
waiting.......SIGN HIM before he bolts
As a Golden State Warriors fan for many years as I am a native of Northern
California living in Utah; I love this trade to dump these players and their
contracts to the Jazz. I can't quite root for the Jazz until they
get a new Coach and Center.Was never a Jazz fan even with Sloan but at
least I could respect him.
Nice move. This team is so in rebuilding mode now. So many fans wanted the
younger players to start and now when they have a chance they want the Jazz to
go get veterans. This sets the Jazz up for several years. They get to see the
young core start with some veterans on expiring contracts. If the core (favors,
kantor, burks, hayward, Burke) come through this year and show promise the
expiring contracts fall off the books and they can sign the core to long term
contracts next year. If they do not pan out then they gain some draft picks and
have a ton of cap space next year. This move sets them up for the next 6-8
years though if the younger core forms into a solid base though. Good move Jazz
and I'm looking forward to seeing the new Jazz look next year.
Great move by the Jazz as it shows they are serious about the young guys. Rather
than spending money on some vets for multiple years they take on these three for
one year and pick up some draft picks as well. We can now play the core young
guys all year, lose a bunch of games, and hit the great draft and free agents
next year. This is much better than patchworking to try and just make the
playoffs which is what has gone on for years. Rebuilding is what this is!
of Richard Jefferson, Andris Biedrins and Brandon Rush to the Utah Jazz,
according to the San Jose Mercury News. Yahoo! Sports reported multiple draft
picks, including Golden State's 2014 first-rounder, are also included in
Bahahahahaha. Nice move jazz. Instead of going after a quality player like
Iguadala themselves they make it possible for the Warriors to get him by taking
on two terrible salaries of 2 average players? Great move front office, great
Now look what's happening.. scramble mode just to get to min salary level.
Should have worked with Al to shop him around to get something like this (sign
and trade)..too late. Teams will target one of the core memebers now in a trade.
In the draft, I think they just got lucky to get Burke. Otherwise, Jazz
management is dropping the ball. Corbin is still here, Horny got away, got a
'0' in return for Al. Don't let DeMarre get away or trade away a
Kanter/Burks or the fans will really be on you..sign the guy TODAY PLEASE.
Why the jazz would want to pay an always injured center 14million dollars is
beyond me. Go sign Monta Ellis or Andre Iguadala.
@AFCoug Yes GS can just give Bogut to the Jazz without getting a player back
because the Jazz are so far under the cap.
It is GS in the need here.So Jazz should not have to give up any picks and
especially not Kanter. NO ! NO ! Make them take Marvin Williams contract Murph
for Bogut Barnes. TPE might work here also..
Would not mind Bogut on the Jazz at all; However, if the Jazz trade anyone of
their young players it would be plain stupid. With GS desperately needing to
unload salary to try and sign Dwight Howard the Jazz should be able to land him
cheap. The Jazz need to eat up that 24 million in cap space without
jeopardizing their future with stupid contracts that wont allow them to keep
these young guys as they come into their own and demand larger salaries. Makes
sense to me.
Do it and throw in one of our young bigs but only if we can get Curry or
Thompson. Not sure how the money works out but it would likely have to include
some other players or picks. GS can't simply give the Jazz Bogut in order
to get under the cap.
Yes!This would be incredible. Bogus is a class act and top 5 big
guy in the league when he can stay healthy. If we're comfortable with his
health issues, make this deal happen!
Please, please do not trade Kanter or Favors for Bogut. Please do not trade
away the future of the Jazz for an injury prone center regardless of his Utah
heritage. Bogut is a great guy and rates among the Ute's greatest players.
But, his NBA record is marred with injury, especially the last 2 years.Try to get him, yes! absolutely! But not at the expense of one of tej
young Jazz bigs!!
The Warriors are not getting anything back in this or any other Bogut deal. Not
sure the author really followed through on this... The Warriors are going to
have to give up Bogut and either a pick or a young player to get cap space. No
way the Jazz are stupid enough to give up Kanter for Bogut. However,
this trade would be good for the Jazz if they could get a future pick (even 2nd
round) and have a 1 year cap filler before the 'core 4' get their
GS is in a position where they are more desperate than the Jazz. They must clear
the cap space to have any chance for Dwight Howard. So a good negotiator will
make them pay for their desperation. Hold out for Klay Thompson or Harrison
Barnes to be included in the deal.