Robertson Daniel is a good pick up. He was team MVP and a JC All American in
2011 before sitting out last year.
"byu's gone 0-2 against UTAH."No one outside of Salt
Lake really counts Utah as a power conference team. Perhaps that's the
reason for the discrepancy.
AZUTE:For the last time. I am using the only apples to apples argument
available and that is what the coaches did when they were in the same boat. I do
realize that playing these opponents every week vs once in awhile is different,
so I used the period of time when both coaches played them once in awhile.
Bronco 7-4, KW 4-3. What part of that logic are you not understanding...or are
you simply avoiding it by saying pre 2011 doesn't count? As I said,
logically the time that was the same for both coaches is the only fair
comparison. FACT- BYU/Bronco vs the PAC10 7-4, Utah/KW vs the PAC10 4-3.
That's the only logical and fair comparison, and the fact that Bronco had a
better record can't be disputed despite all your spin and desperation at
changing the discussion/argument (Wiscougar was talking about records against
the PAC...not defense, not offense, not 54-10...records against the PAC).
@couglifer--Huh? I stated our key-injuries as fact, nothing more.
Why would I feel the need to make excuses when my team won the game?Regarding games played in years past, I've made clear my stance on it in
the context within which I posted my previous comments.Regarding
byu's D, I've equally made my stance on it clear within my previous
comments on this website. Football is multi-faceted, not limited to rushing the
football/Rush-D. Within your comment you hit upon JWIV not playing, one of
PAC-12's top RBs, and you referenced other key-injuries. These included
QB, across our O-Line, WRs, etc. Yet, what is perceived to be the byu rush-D
"prowess" is entirely irrelevant here, since UTAH won the game.
Confusing regarding what point you're attempting to make here? Are you
laying claim to some sort of moral victory, since UTAH didn't need lots of
rushing-yards, in order to end-up victorious? The point is to end the game with
the most points, correct? Please explain to me what your point is, because what
I know is exclusively relevant is the following --FINAL--UTAH 24 byu
@cougsndawgs--Any explanation in refutation to any byu fan making
vain attempt to elevate his team above mine becoming misinterpreted as somehow
constituting, "crying"/making "excuses", couldn't be
further from the truth! It's a necessary part of the obvious refutation in
pointing-out the difference between playing PAC-12 teams randomly, with the
likes of the Weber States/NMSUs/Hawaiis/Idahos of the College Football world
mixed into it as breathers in-between, as opposed to facing them back-to-back in
a week-in, week-out capacity! Posting records which have a 4-game disparity
between them in total-games played is inherently incomparable! Why not go the
next step in posting their head-to-head record, as well?It's
quite curious never seeing byu's performance against these 5 PAC-12 schools
directly addressed by DesNews' posters! If this is all TDS can manage to
"accomplish", just imagine how they'd fare facing UTAH's
annual PAC-12 slate!bm's incapable of ever winning big
games/taking byu to the extent nationally which Coach KW has taken UTAH! Sure,
he avoids the choke-jobs pretty consistently, but any byu fan being honest would
trade places in a heartbeat!
cont.Know body was challenging the outcome of the game what was
being talked about was BYU’s defense. Yes Utah won the game but
can’t you and you other BYU hater fans agree that BYU had a solid defense
@AZUTE1So what you are saying is what happened before 2011 is now
irrelevant your own words. So the next time you start yapping about the 2008 and
2004 season it is in your own words irrelevant right. Or am I missing something
here?Also you and navel vet keep saying that all BYU fans keep giving
excuses for losing what I would like to know is why all the excuses for BYU
defense holding your pacwhatever rushing attack under average if BYU is so
wac-ish then why this commentUTAH was significantly more disadvantaged by
key-injuries/suspension in last year's game, by miles and miles, yet still
won the game, yet again.JWIV took nearly 1/2 the season to recover and
shouldn't have even seen the field against ASU down here, either.All
I ever hear are excuses made by byu fan as to why they registered their annual
loss against UTAH in 2012.Why would we as the winning school ever need to
make excuses, ever? Huh?
wiscougarfan--The logic is flying overhead. First of all, what took
place back in 2005 in now way impacts what the teams are today. Furthermore,
given byu's lackluster performance against The PAC-12 today by virtue of
these 5 games, just imagine how they'd fare playing against UTAH's
PAC-12 slate! This is why it's utterly ridiculous to point-finger! You
can point to one, single irrelevant game against CU, which is in fact an
entirely different conversation, but this unrelated game in no way, whatsoever,
mitigates what I can point to in easily topping you people, namely--54-10 on byu's homefield during the same, exact season! Not to mention,
byu's significantly weaker SOS! It's a no-win debate for you! 2011
CU is not only 100% irrelevant/unrelated to UTAH/byu, it amounts to a
poor-man's distraction-tactic you people employ in avoiding reality out of
utter desperation to cope, nothing more! I guarantee you, you'd trade
places in a heartbeat, and you know it!
AZUTE:"I compared what byu has done against The PAC-12 during this
same 2-year period. Spin it all you want, but while byu fan points his finger at
UTAH while playing against this legitimate weekly-grind, byu's played a
total of 5 PAC-12 schools, in between their steady-diet of cupcakes, yet can
produce merely the following in going 2-3, overall--"LOL..U can
make all the excuses you want about weekly grind, and cry about how tough your
conference is (as NV pointed out...it's because you're a WAC school in
a major conference). Bottom line: BYU under Mendenhall has a winning record
against teams in your conference while Kyle doesnt. Stop trying to make up
excuses for that very simple FACT. If you're worried about apples and
oranges, lets look at what Bronco and Whit did against the PAC before U
went...Bronco 7-4, Whitt 4-3...advantage BYU/Bronco. And as you said comparing
your "weekly grind" is apples and oranges...so why did you only use the
last 2 years? Your frantic and desperate attempts at trying to disprove BYUs
superiority against your conference is what's "truly
RE: AZUTE1"LOL....You predate UTAH's PAC-12 membership for
byu, yet don't state it accurately for UTAH. Their time in the conference
is an entirely different deal, when they're playing these schools, week-in,
week-out. Before becoming a member, these games were played every once in a
while. Apples-to-Oranges. Nice try....LOL."Yep, I do predate
Utah's PAC-12 membership. I was talking about the Mendenhall era... YOU
are the one that changed the subject--because you had no favorable response.
That's what trolls do, so you're holding up your end. Concerned about the easy wins BYU has had vs PAC 10/12 in the Mendenhall era?
Don't be, BYU has a better winning percentage against winning PAC teams
(.333 to .143). BYU beat three teams with winning records, and their two losses
were to 6-7 UCLA and 5-7 Utah. Utah beat two winning teams and lost to 3-10
Colorado. Now in all fairness, Utah's overall SOS vs. PAC 10/12
teams is slightly higher (.485 to .465). As far as your "week-in,
week-out" grind? Let's talk after you beat a team with a winning
"Oops, you're right, caught me on a technicality. Let me rectify my
wrong. In the PAC 10+2 during the Mendenhall era BYU has a winning record, while
Utah does not."More of the same, Apples-to-Oranges, with
UTAH's PAC-12 membership rendering this comparison no longer possible.
LOLBut showing what byu has done during same 2 years against smaller
sample, although not having to endure PAC-12 back-to-back weekly-grind, but
rather playing them separated by the typical cupcakes featured on byu's
annual-schedule, yet they still manage to produce utter-futility, beating only 2
cupcakes, getting annihilated at home by the lone 2 teams finishing above .500
and going 0-2 against UTAH!
RE: AZUTE1"BYU has a winning record against the PAC12 in the
Mendenhall era."This is incorrect--byu is 2-3
against The PAC-12."Oops, you're right, caught me on a
technicality. Let me rectify my wrong. In the PAC 10+2 during the Mendenhall
era BYU has a winning record, while Utah does not. BYU vs. PAC10+2
teams (2005-present): 9-8 (.529)Utah vs. PAC 10+2 teams (2005-present):
ImaCaMan"Re: down underWith that schedule of yours
most any team would have the same results. Look out! Here comes SJSU!"What's truly priceless, is that we all know SJSU was originally
scheduled to add yet another cupcake to byu's schedule, in order to assist
in ensuring bowl-eligibility! Then it freaking blew-up in byu's face when
SJSU, to byu's utter surprise, happened to be good, which of course is
precisely the type of team byu never beats, unless it's against usu by
3-PTS at home!SJSU didn't behave and just simply lay-down as
expected to do when they were initially scheduled! I absolutely love it!
"BYU has a winning record (9-7) against the PAC10/12, while Utah in the
Whittingham era does not (11-14). Satisfied? This display of straw grasping
reaks of desperation. Face it...BYU is better against your conference than U
are."LOL....You predate UTAH's PAC-12 membership for byu,
yet don't state it accurately for UTAH. Their time in the conference is an
entirely different deal, when they're playing these schools, week-in,
week-out. Before becoming a member, these games were played every once in a
while. Apples-to-Oranges. Nice try....LOLI compared what byu has
done against The PAC-12 during this same 2-year period. Spin it all you want,
but while byu fan points his finger at UTAH while playing against this
legitimate weekly-grind, byu's played a total of 5 PAC-12 schools, in
between their steady-diet of cupcakes, yet can produce merely the following in
going 2-3, overall--Beating only 2 bottom-feeders, getting utterly
destroyed at home by the only 2 schools finishing the season above .500, to the
tune of 96-34 combined, and going 0-2 against UTAH!
AZUTE:"byu is 2-3 against The PAC-12. They beat 2 schools, at '11
OSU and '12 WAZZU at home"Seriously? You're going to
get hung up on a technicality? Ok, in the Mendenhall era (as Wiscoug said) BYU
has a winning record (9-7) against the PAC10/12, while Utah in the Whittingham
era does not (11-14). Satisfied? This display of straw grasping reaks of
desperation. Face it...BYU is better against your conference than U are.
Note on my previous comment--"Spin away, but only the loser, by
definition, is qualified to make excuses!"Yet, it in no way
means these excuses even remotely are valid, particularly the excuses byu
fan's become notoriously infamous for making over the decades!I've yet to witness, during my entire lifetime, byu fan acknowledge byu
lost the game, ANY game lost, because the other school was actually better than
them and just simply outplayed them!
UTAH was significantly more disadvantaged by key-injuries/suspension in last
year's game, by miles and miles, yet still won the game, yet again.JWIV took nearly 1/2 the season to recover and shouldn't have even
seen the field against ASU down here, either.All I ever hear are
excuses made by byu fan as to why they registered their annual loss against UTAH
in 2012.Why would we as the winning school ever need to make
excuses, ever? Huh?No, we point-out all of our key-injuries merely
to punctuate the fact we were playing at significantly less than 100%, easily
more so than byu, yet we still beat byu. Spin away, but only the loser, by
definition, is qualified to make excuses!This is an annual tradition
for byu as the annual loser!
wiscougarfan--"BYU has a winning record against the PAC12 in the
Mendenhall era."This is incorrect--byu is 2-3
against The PAC-12. They beat 2 schools, at '11 OSU and '12 WAZZU at
home, which both finished at the bottom of conference standings. They played
against 2 schools which finished the season with a winning record, '11 UTAH
and '12 OSU, and got absolutely brutally curb-stomped by both schools at
home, combined to the tune of 96-34! Their 5th game was yet another loss
against UTAH, this time at '12 UTAH.byu's gone 0-2 against
Koloss,Really? Pretty weak. BYU's qb played the game with a
broken back. Utah wasn't the only team in that game with injuries. Nice try
Koloss:"Utah didn't have John White that game. The year before
JW4 had 176 yards alone against BYU".John White didn't have
a great season last year. His best games came against the weaker defenses on
Utah's schedule. I doubt he would have had much success against BYU had he
been healthy. Comparing stats from 2011 is apples and oranges...BYUs defense was
ranked much higher, and was much better in 2012. Also, you're above
statement is exactly the problem with Utah in the PAC12. If someone goes down
you have to have depth to recover...Utah obviously didn't/doesn't.
BYUs starting RB also went down with a broken arm last year. We had a freshman
stud that filled his shoes and then some. Where were all your 4 star athletes to
fill for White? We also had multiple injuries on the offensive line, and an
injured starting DE going into the Utah game, but we choose not to make excuses.
@CougsndawgsUtah didn't have John White that game. The year
before JW4 had 176 yards alone against BYU. Utah was also without Blechen, Rowe
and Wynn. BYU couldn't even beat a depleted Utah team.
RE: Naval Vet"It's not amazing at all. Your defense was
stifling the weakest teams in the WAC while Utah's was going up against a
slew of much more prolific Pac-12 Offenses."Then, in the same
discussion thread..."No, no, no, no! Final Score! THAT's
the only "stat" that really matters."Your credibility is
shot when you make contradictory statements. But here's some FACTS...BYU had one of the best defenses in the country last year. BYU had a top 5
pick in the NFL draft from their defense. BYU's defense is projected to
have another first rounder this year. BYU has a winning record against the
PAC12 in the Mendenhall era. Can your team claim any of these things? NOPE.
CougsndawgsWest Point , UTNaval Vet:"It's not amazing
at all. Your defense was stifling the weakest teams in the WAC..."BYU vs Utah stat line: first downs- BYU 25, Utah 14, total offense- BYU 312,
Utah 245, rushing BYU 106, Utah 49, passing BYU 206, Utah 196. There were only 2
teams that held Utah to less yardage in their "big boy" schedule ute
fans always brag about, ASU & Washington. Just goes to show you,
U can take the team out of the WAC, but you can't take the WAC out of the
team (or some of its nv-ous fans).Or maybe more to the point,
it's easier to put the team in the PAC than it is to put the PAC into the
Re: down underWith that schedule of yours most any team would have
the same results. Look out! Here comes SJSU!
"No, no, no, no! Final Score! THAT's the only "stat" that
really matters."So, the year UNLV(2-10) shut out Utah, they were
clearly the better team? By a long shot! I'm ok admitting that Utah was the
better team last year, as long as you admit that UNLV was better than Utah that
year; and not just in that game, but for the whole year because they won the
head to head.
Naval Vet: You missed the point of my post. I'm saying BYU held Utah
to less yards rushing and less total yards (except ASU & Washington) than
anyone else on Utah's so-called "big boy" schedule. So if BYUs
defense was only ranked high as a result of "stifling the weakest teams in
the WAC", yet BYU stifled Utah...what does that say about U? Utah= weak WAC
team masquerading in a "big boy" conference...you nailed it NV! Lol
Cougsndawgs:BYU vs Utah stat line?No, no, no, no! Final
Score! THAT's the only "stat" that really matters.Utah
was simply the better team. Period. Just like we've been in at least 8 of
the last 11 meetings. Now go wipe your tears.
Naval Vet:"It's not amazing at all. Your defense was stifling the
weakest teams in the WAC..."BYU vs Utah stat line: first downs-
BYU 25, Utah 14, total offense- BYU 312, Utah 245, rushing BYU 106, Utah 49,
passing BYU 206, Utah 196. There were only 2 teams that held Utah to less
yardage in their "big boy" schedule ute fans always brag about, ASU
& Washington. There was NO ONE in said "big boy" schedule that held
them to less yards rushing than BYU. Considering these facts and the
"stifling" the Cougars did on the Utes, if one were to evaluate Naval
Vets quote above, they would agree that he just made the best argument for how
Utah is a "WACish" program masquerading in a "big boy"
For once Chris B might be right. The BYU secondary has been suspect for a while
now. The biggest problem is finding athletes who can qualify academically. As
you may or may not know, BYU doesn't take partial academic qualifiers.
It's true that allot of great athletes cannot take the academic pressure
put on by schools like Notre Dame, BYU and the Ivy league schools. If the
academic standards were relaxed these schools would probably have a little more
success in recruiting the elite athletes. Schools that will accept poorer
academic proformers(like Utah fore instance) will always have a better shot at a
larger pool of athletes. That's just a fact of life.
Naval Vet"Your defense was stifling the weakest teams in the WAC
while Utah's was going up against a slew of much more prolific Pac-12
Offenses."LOL at your constant whiny excuse making.Georgia Tech (playing in a "big boy" conference) finished 2012 as the
#2-ranked rushing offense in the country with 311 rushing ypg.On
October 12th, BYU visited Georgia Tech and completely shut down Georgia
Tech's offense, holding the Yellow Jackets to 117 yards rushing and 157
yards total.On December 31st, USC played Georgia Tech in the Sun
Bowl. Georgia Tech ran all over the mighty Trojans racking up 294 yards rushing
and 369 yards total offense in a 21-7 win.BYU Opponent Rushing
YardsWash St -5Weber St 115Utah 49Boise St 116Hawaii 41Utah St 41Oregon St 118Notre Dame 270Ga Tech
117Idaho 61SJ St 59NM St 29SDSU 119BYU's run defense was stout against everybody they played, including FIVE
Top 25 teams.Even Notre Dame, which had the most success, spent most
of their time chewing up yardage between the 20's, while only managing to
score 17 points.
Name calling, rankings and "it must be the coaches" doesn't get you
a win on the field vs the Utes. lolGo Utes.
Naval Vet is a star watcher. You should come out to the sundance film festival,
hang out with Robert Redford. Come on, get out of philidelphia once in a while.
Naval Lint, and other BYU haters,Since BYU can be a national leader in
defense with your so called 0 and 2 star recruits it must mean that the BYU
coaches can get more out their players than the Utah coaches with their 5 star
Naval,Agree with the Tator. BYU coaches do more with less. Utah ranked
much lower in all defensive stats. Must be the coaches.
Tators:It's not amazing at all. Your defense was stifling the
weakest teams in the WAC while Utah's was going up against a slew of much
more prolific Pac-12 Offenses.It's also not amazing that the
Utes beat our Indy-WACey little brother in 8 of the last meetings, while
simultaneously recruiting better classes in 9 of the last 12. The teams with
the most "star" recruits win the majority of the time. It's only
amazing when those teams with the most "stars" lose.
Naval lint,OUCH. Tators took it to you.
@Chris B: Maybe there is a conspiracy to discourage all good cornerbacks from
signing with BYU so as all of their opponents will be able to pass on BYU. lol
Seriously, Chris B, what is your take on your question? We would like your
thoughts on the subject. Please don't spew the usual diatribe. We would
like to hear your honest thoughts on the subject without you being
political(Utah is in the PAC 12 and BYU is independent. We already know that.
Tell us something we do not know! If you can.
To Naval Vet:Isn't it amazing how BYU, with it's low-star
defense athletes (that you like touting about), were nationally ranked so much
better than Utah's defense. In fact BYU's was a top 5 defense while
Utah wasn't even ranked in the top 50. Sounds like you are the one that
should be worried about adding some more depth.There comes a time when you
should be a bit more careful with the can of worms you open so often. It usually
comes right back at you... and with a thud!
@CougsndawgsToo late...Chris already felt that tug on his line.
lol.@Thats what I thoughtThe cougs were strong on the
defensive line and at linebackers...thanks to bronco...that's where their
pass defense came from. They're always hurting for more athleticism at
corners and to some extent at safeties.Go Utes.
"Junior college transfers Sam Lee and Robertson Daniel are set to arrive on
campus next week and could both add significantly to the overall depth of
BYU's defensive backfield." -- Brandon GurneyThat they
COULD. Rivals lists both athletes as having received no other offers, and as a
2-star athlete, Daniel is JUST the sort of player our midmajorey little brother
looks for. As a 0-star, Lee also possesses the sort of pedigree that's
necessary to attract Indy-WACey coaches' attentions.Ya gotta
love it when a 0- and 2-star athletes are being touted for to "add...overall
StevenSJarvis:Actually, Utah needs to first focus on beating Utah
State this year.Because the MWC Aggies are definitely better than
the PAC-12 Utes and will likely make it two in a row, and since the Utes
haven't been able to beat a BCS team with a pulse since 2009 they are going
to need every non-conference win they can get.This game will be
relatively easy for USU, because not only do they return most of their starters
and have more talent overall, Utah will once again be looking past them to the
BYU game -- which is the only game Ute fans care about anyway.
Welcome news! Hope the kid will be a great asset to the team and have a great
career as a cougar! Here's hoping he'll also continue to keep his
academics status on the up and up.I'm a huge Cougar fan but I
also like the Utes and root for them when they're not playing BYU.
I'm anxious to see what happens come September when the two teams meet.
I'm hoping this year the outcome will be different if for nothing else just
to silence the incessant and hateful vitriol from the haters. For this reason
I'm pleading with all of you my fellow Cougar fans who are predicting a BYU
win to please stop. Of course I'm hoping you're right but
there's no guarantee that we will so please don't keep making the same
mistake of underestimating C. Whit and the Utes! They have proven over and over
that they are a formidable opponent to us. Let's stay classy and not make
silly predictions that keeps hurting us when they don't come true. Go Cougars! And good luck to the Utes too!
Another great addition to a top 5 defense. If our offense can get us 14 points a
game, we go undefeated.
With these guys and the ESPN contract we could have a huge year. Hard to beat
when we're always on ESPN.
The utes took some bruising in the wood shed last year. Look for some big time
licks this year starting with Utah State. Maybe a bowl game in a few years will
be possible, but not this year.
I think even ute fans have disowned Chris B. I won't bite on his typical
ridiculous commentary.It will be nice to get these two going in fall
camp and see what they can do. Losing Trammel was a big blow to BYU...our
secondary may have been the best it's ever been if trammel were healthy.
Hopefully these two guys (Lee especially is supposed to be pretty good) can make
up the difference. And I agree with other posters...they'll easily be
enough to beat Utah's powder puff offense.
Chris,Utah State was the only team wearing big boy pants last year
in football in this state. They took your little boy team from the big boy
conference and taught them a lesson. Utah won't be all grown up till they
win their division, or end the season ranked five years running. That
won't happen anytime soon. They need to first work towards being bowl
eligible. A true Ute fan would not hinge their entire year on
whether or not they in the BYU game.
What did U's offense do against BYU last year? Basically nothing. The D is
great. This is a great addition. Add to that a quarterback on offense and
it's time for B to eat some crow. Yes you have won the most recent games,
but not this season. Taking from your old posts "Mark it down." Oh yeah,
I forgot, LOL.
If I had an extra 500 people on the field for the last couple of plays in a
close game, I could win a whole bunch of games too.
If I had an extra 3000 bodies on the field for the last couple plays of a close
game I could win any game.
@Chris B. In case you forgot, BYU was ranked #10 nationally in passing defense
last year. The U? 64th. Rushing defense? Why- that would be BYU at #2 and the U
at #22. Total defense? BYU #3, U at #36. BYU ranked higher in the nation in
defense that the U ranked in the Pac-12.
Chris B commenting first on a BYU article ? That couldn't be possible.
Why is it Chris that the rest of ute nation has supposedly moved on from the BYU
rivalry but you seem to be stuck in neutral ?Good luck Robertson !
Glad to have you on the team. Go BYU !
I like Daniels comments on education and what he has learned through an
experience in life. I wish him success both off and on the field for BYU this
Nice additions to the program. Should be enough to beat Utah this year.
byu, thin in secondary?That couldn't be possible.Why is it byu fans that you are always thin in talent at secondary?