@worfWhat gets me is the crowd that blames the bank for lending them the
money and charging interest.They don't understand how the world
works, but gov't is making it easy for them. Under the HARP program you
can qualify for a loan with 60% of your income going to housing costs. THAT is
a disaster waiting to happen.And refi goes on like it was 2006 again.
Many people buy a house, furniture, or car, not thinking they may lose their
income in five years. Much of it is poor planning. I paid off my ordinary
house, and car in four years. I than sold my house for a good profit, and
bought a nicer one with cash. Those five years of mortgage payments was the
only time I've had debt.It's not fair being robbed of my
hard eared money.
Lets see, we already know that intergeneraltional poverty is due in part to the
benefits that the government hands out, without little to no effort on the part
of the recipiant.One study showed that a single mother making
$36000, would have to earn at least $70,000 before she could provide a better
lifstyle for her family than she can on welfare.Another nice study
has its results summarized in "Welfare Pays Better Than Work, Study Finds:
$36,000 a Year in Hawaii" in the weekly standard.Why work, when
welfare will pay you more?
@Dave DAs I recall the Savior was not too impressed with the people who
followed him around the lake for a second free meal.Providing in the
Lord's way has always taught work and self-reliance, not subsidies. In
practice, we end up with some who have no motivation to provide for themselves.
I'm old enough to remember when LDS did not participate in government
programs. Once you lose moral accountability and church-leader supervision, it
is easy for a program to get away from you. Throw in a weak economy and you
have people gravitating to the entitlements. (See the FDR years for an
example.)There is a need to teach the importance of work to the rising
generation; hence the title of the commission. But I don't have much hope
that this group can think outside the bureaucratic box.
@Say No to BO,Nobody is saying the committee is Church approved, though
with one of the four-fold missions of the Church being to "care for the poor
and needy" one would think that aiming to get rid of intergenerational
poverty would be a good pursuit. As long as another human being is poor or
suffering, it is my job to try and alleviate those problems, Perhaps Bishop
Burton said it best in April, 2011: "No matter how positively we are
perceived in the eyes of the world—should we fail in this great core
commandment to “succor the weak, lift up the hands which hang down, and
strengthen the feeble knees,” or turn our hearts from those who suffer and
mourn, we are under condemnation and cannot please the Lord and the jubilant
hope of our hearts will ever be distant."
@Dave DI'm so sorry. I take it all back. If the former PB is
involved it must be Church-approved.Please forgive me for my negative
attitude. I should wear a smiley face at all times.
Poverty can also be those who purchased real estate during the good years, then
lost a job. Then lost the home. Maybe they were able to find new employment
and keep the home, only to be stuck with too high of payments to cover even the
basics. The income of this household does not qualify them for all the welfare
freebies in the community. Then, they may have a baby that isn't covered
by the new jobs insurance. Even with insurance, the copay and expenses are
high. They also have school loans to pay back. Where do these people go for
help? They aren't in the so called poverty group because of income
qualifications. I use my charity money to help my neighbors and family in
situations like this. The low income poverty people have more usable income
than my neighbors and family. The low income poverty have very little incentive
to rise above welfare. They have already figured out what a sweet deal they
Wow, it's tough to see this kind of grinding teeth at the poor from people
who likely share my faith. We should let Bishop Burton know you guys have all
the answers so he need not bother being involved with such a pointless
I suppose the first question is, What is poverty? This is the wrong group to
discuss the question since many of them exist to help the poor. Without poverty
they have no job.The book Crimes Against Logic discusses the issue.
Poverty is measured by INCOME, or lack of it. But lets look beyond that to the
VALUE of their benefits received. For example, subsidized housing. Their
apartment, for which they paid $120, looks very much like the apartment across
the hall where his neighbor is paying $900 a month.The "poor"
family gets Medicaid. The family next door can't afford to go to the
doctor for a backache. Add health insurance premiums and copay and deductibles
and the "poor" family has a fair amount of VALUE of benefits.School lunch, fee waivers, free coats/shoes/gloves/backpacks/school
supplies/physicals...add it all up and there are very few families in Utah who
live in real poverty.
Let me save the committee some walking and valuable time. Here is the
solution:1. Don't buy stuff you cannot afford, and probably
don't actually need. 2. Stay in school and work hard and
graduate.3. Don't have children until you are married.4.
Don't have children until you can afford them.5. Obey the laws so
parents stay out of jail.6. Don't do drugs, or hang around with
those who do.7. Go to church (your choice, there are many to choose
from).8. Get a job- any job, and maybe more than one job.9. Take
pride in supporting your self and your family, and feel shame if you do not do
so.10. Reject welfare in any form.11. Stay married- for better or
worse.12. Obey the laws- that included immigration laws so people
don't have to "live in shadows."13. Don't borrow
money.14. Learn to cook.15. Learn to read, write and speak
"proper" English.Okay, do that and 95% of poverty will be
eliminated.Hard work and personal responsibility are the cure, but
expanding the government welfare plantation guarantees perpetual poverty to
those enslaved on it.
Michelle Obama has just completed an all expense vacation to Iceland using a
private jet, and our money.Soon, her, and Barack will spent more
than twice on an African vacation, than the IRS did for their lavish
conference.Our president is looking for solutions to poverty? I
don't think so.
"In the final phase of a large-scale, randomized, controlled study of nearly
5,000 children from low-income families, researchers found that the positive
effects on literacy and language development demonstrated by children who
entered Head Start at age 4 had dissipated by the end of 3rd grade, and that
they were, on average, academically indistinguishable from their peers who had
not been in Head Start." June 17, 2013 Education Week dot org
Wow!In 1964, liberals declared war on poverty, and trillions were
spent on education, and poverty solutions.If the money spent, were
to be divided equally to every American family, they would all be
millionaires.So why has poverty increased, and the same questions
keep popping up?Our national debt equals $580,000 for every second
in a year, and the crazy thing about this, is some people want our political
leaders doing surveillance on us, and taxing us more.