'The funny thing about all the "good intentions" of those campaigns
was that in the end Jabari himself thought it was "too much" and it
actually pushed him further from BYU rather than closer. Fans / Boosters need to
leave the recruiting up to the coaches.'Oh, so he was headed to
BYU until he thought it was or would be "too much"? Thanks for
clarifying, I was under the delusion that he had decided he wanted to play for
Poyman: Good points but Pitta is a TE. He may play roles similar
to Vernon Davis of the 9ers or other TE in the league, he is still a TE. I like
how they create mismatches with the use of Pitta. Most LBs are too slow and DB
are too small. He is a heckuva player. Truthfully, I hope that
Collie doesn't get picked up by a team. His view of life is very
shortsighted. Ask Jim McMann (sp?) what he thinks about concussions. Go UTES!!
@wookie...While Pitta is listed as a TE and appears as the starting
TE on the the teams depth chart, J. Harbaugh will also use him as a mid-range
Receiver (10 to 20 yards) and bring Dickson in at the TE position and often line
them up on the same side of the ball... If you watched the Super Bowl last year
you saw several plays where this occured... Dickson lines up on the line of
scrimmage and Pitta will line up in a wing or slot position... The guys who
broadcasted the game even spent a few minutes talking about the fact that the
Ravens considered Pitta a "Hybrid TE/Receiver...Not that any of
this makes any difference in this conversation, but when a remark is made that
there are no BYU Receivers in the League... It deserves mentioning... And, I
fully expect Collie to be back on the field this year for somebody... In fact, I
would not be surprised if P. Manning lobbies for him and he ends up a Bronco.
I'm a huge BYU fan who spends half the year in Texas... Believe it or not,
Techville is a popular place for young Texans... The term
"College Town" takes on a whole new meaning in Lubbock and to be honest
with you, I have never talked with or met a former Red Raider that didn't
absolutely love his or her former school... The Alumni following for this school
is almost cultish... Saturdays in the fall for Red Raider Alumni are considered
holy days and these people fill up stadiums, local sports bars, and fellow Red
Raider Alumni Living Rooms with big screen surround sound TV/Entertainment
systems like no other school alumnis that I've ever seen... And the world
stops for them while the game is being played.If you're a young
recruit it can be easy to get caught up in all of that ... SO DON'T
UNDERESTIMATE their ability to excite and sign potential players (particularly
QBs and Receivers)
RBB, you made me laugh. I have driven through Lubbock. Wow. People really live
Wouldn't those BYU fans tweeting the recruit be guilty of the same offense
as Welker? Just another reason to stay off twitter and facebook with recruits.
Welker was a fool for doing what he did. Because of his high profile, and his
experience with the system, he should have known better.That being
said, what he did was no different than what many byu boosters did that same
day. All of the boosters that tweeted this kid in response to Welker's
tweet are guilty, just the same as Welker. Don't wish for penalties on
Texas Tech, it might come back to bite. But it most likely will have zero
consequences one way or the other, because every program has boosters that tweet
recruits.I doesn't take much for you to be considered a
"booster" by the NCAA. If you are a donor to the school or if you have
season tickets, for example, you are a booster.Regardless, I hope
the kid goes anywhere but Texas Tech, even if it means byu.Go Utes!
Seriously Welker - spend 10 days in Provo , look at the scenery - campus and
chat up people on campus and tell me you'd tell someone to spend their
college career in Lubbock at TT. Good grief ! Guns Down !
Your not to smart if you dis BYU.
True story, "its on the internet" but supposedly U boosters have been
contacting Y recruits seeking to have them play for Utah State in an effort to
place blame on Boise State because they are pretending to be Southern Utah
University Professional NFL players. Crazy but true.GO UTES!!
It was just a tweet. Give me a break.
Dumb thing to do, but it's true.
SportsFan - Try again. Go read up on the rules and trust something other than
Cougarboard for your information. The Chicago to Provo campaign broke all kinds
of rules and BYU had to register it as a minor infraction. BYU also asked Ryan
Shupe (sp?) to take down his song about Jabari because it was a violation. The
funny thing about all the "good intentions" of those campaigns was that
in the end Jabari himself thought it was "too much" and it actually
pushed him further from BYU rather than closer. Fans / Boosters need to leave
the recruiting up to the coaches. U25 - exactly right. More
infractions followed the Welker comments than the Welker comment itself.
The other issue is that a lot of the people who jumped on Welker's case are
also considered donors and any of the tweet's encouraging that he come to
BYU are also violations.
All the y fans that jumped on the Welker and Kurtz twitter feed, and bashed
Welker and and tried to convince Kurtz that provo was the place for him. Broke
the same rules as Welker and could put the y under ncaa investigation. Being
most of the fans are considered boosters.
@I-am-I" There are worse schools to go to than BYU, but if you have
the option of going and playing for a successful team with a heisman trophy
quarterback on the roster"You're thinking of Texas A&M
not Texas Tech.
Are there no BYU alums on the Denver Broncos that could "educate" Mr.
Lubbock, Texas is, after all, the hometown of the great Buddy Holly!
I'd have to agree with Welker. I can think up several reasons. There are
worse schools to go to than BYU, but if you have the option of going and playing
for a successful team with a heisman trophy quarterback on the roster or the
option to play for a mediocre team struggling to find an identity that
hasn't been able to put a quarterback on the field for 3+ years which one
would you choose especially if going pro is your priority. It's a no
brainer. This kid should go to Texas Tech barring one variable--he won't
Cougsndawgs Lol, and I agree completely. Who knows what his stats
would have looked like had he had a true Y QB that can throw the ball out of the
stadium. As for experts, well they didn't have Ziggy even listed this
early last year and Star was their number 1 and look how that turned out. A lot
can happen between now and then is all I am saying.ThanksGo UTES!
My understanding of how recruiting violations are determined is the type of
person (if money is not involved) doing the "recruiting". So, a
faceless/nameless person such as myself could try to get someone to go to BYU,
as could thousands of other generic fans, without incurring the wrath of the
NCAA. But a former player with a recognizable profile, or another person of
similar influence, would run afoul of the NCAA for the same attempts at
persuasion. That said, BYU has indeed said people need to be careful about what
they say on social networking sites to potential recruits, to be on the safe
I drove through Lubbock once. Longest week of my life.
Wookie:I agree with most of what you said, but the Hoffman draft
predictions are from Kiper and McShay who have him projected in the 2nd round.
Also if you look at Hoffmans stats his best games have come against the better
teams on BYUs schedule...he's torched the utes twice. I mean the fact he
had 100 receptions and over 1200 yards with Riley Nelson at QB should be telling
UU32"I could go on Twitter right now and find 1000 BYU
violations of a similar kind. Maybe not high profile guys like Welker, but there
are boosters who use Twitter to reach out to players and "persuade" them
all the time. Anyone remember Chicago to Provo? How about the 'we've
got everything we need in this town but Parker Style.'"Nice
try, but you obviously don't understand the NCAA rules regarding boosters
contacting recruits. The "Chicago to Provo" campaign was carefully
examined by BYU's compliance office to ensure that it did not break ANY
NCAA recruiting rules.
Welker's comments...phooey. As for the Y and their receivers, his comments
are not completely unfounded. Collie is a good slot receiver but unfortunatley
his health will likely force him to retirment, thus there will not be any Y
receivers (more than likely) in the NFL. Pitta is awesome, love watching him
play, but he is a TE and not a WR, thus Welker's comments gain more
traction. As for predicting that Hoffman is a 1st or 2nd round receiver, that
is a very bold statement at this time. Let's see how he fares this year
before making that prediction. He is a skilled WR with great hands and speed,
but unfortunately scouts look at big programs first and since the Y will be
playing some big programs this year, his exposure will be greater and then a
good measuring stick will help determine his NFL future. Go UTES!!
I could go on Twitter right now and find 1000 BYU violations of a similar kind.
Maybe not high profile guys like Welker, but there are boosters who use Twitter
to reach out to players and "persuade" them all the time. Anyone
remember Chicago to Provo? How about the "we've got everything we need
in this town but Parker Style." Go on any big recruit's twitter feed
and you'll see thousands of violations likes this. It doesn't make
what Welker did right at all, but how does the NCAA plan to police all of the
illegal activity on Twitter?
CO ute:Btw the point is what Texas Tech can do for Kurtz' career. Wes
Welker was undrafted, and the only decent WR drafted from TT the last couple
decades is Crabtree. So the point is Welker is making a weak argument about BYU
when TT isn't a shining example of how to get receivers into the NFL.
Welkers comment was dumb to begin with, but when analyzed and put into
perspective regarding TT's history of NFL receivers it's just
Great athletes almost always find their way to top (i.e. Fischer, Central
Michigan, #1 NFL pick). Kurtz ability to play in the NFL will be based on 1.)
his ability, 2.) the system (does he get enough opportunities to shine), and 3.)
exposure.We know enough about Anae, to know that the WR will have
plenty of opportunities. We know less about Kingsbury and what type of offense
he'll run.We know BYU is getting plenty of exposure with their
new deal with ESPN, much more than TT.I'm betting BYU will have
more WR drafted in the NFL next year than TT.As a Texan, I can also
tell you, I'd much rather live in Provo than Lubbick.
@CO Ute,How do you know Collie wouldn't have had the same
success (or better) and put up the same numbers if he wasn't hurt, have ten
years in the league, and have a quarterback that throws to him for as many times
as Welker had? You can't honestly sit there and ridiculed the kid for not
having the same opportunity, can you? I think Collie is just as talented, and
given the same opportunity without the unfortunate injuries he had, he
would've excelled or may have even done better. Cut the kid some slacks
dude! Don't just hate on him just because he went to BYU. Go
Cougs! And good luck to the Utes too!
CO Ute:"Yes, cougsanddawgs, he is a star. 10 years in the league, 5
times with more than 100 catches, 18 games with 10 or more catches, a very
talented punt returner, and a salary over $9MM a year. If Collie put up the same
numbers you would have him in the Hall of Fame".I realize you
are probably a Bronco fan and want to give Welker as much praise as you can, but
he is a system WR that put up a lot of numbers having one of the best QBs in
history throwing to him. He will probably be successful with Peyton Manning for
the same reason. I can't imagine someone asking "who are the star
receivers in the NFL" and Welkers name being widely brought up, unless
you're talking fantasy league where numbers are all that matter. Without
Tom Brady, Welker would be a returner and 4/5 WR. And no, I wouldn't have
Collie in the Hall of Fame because I realize a lot of his success was due to
Manning...but nice to know that you know my opinions and thoughts on the matter.
It isn't ridiculous to punish a program for the actions of a booster.
PLEASE think back to the "glory" days of SMU. They were a very small
school that had the best team money could buy. The program USED the boosters
intentionally to provide cars, cushy jobs, parties, and countless other
"enticements" to go to SMU. How did it get started? I'm sure it
was just "harmless" conversations to "encourage" recruits. The
NCAA rules are the reaction to years and years of cheating----universities MUST
rein in their boosters or be subject to penalty. This is a fact of life for all
NCAA-sanctioned programs and Texas Tech is no exception.
Actually, this is a slap at BYU from Welker. Very unfortunate. How could the
NCAA sanction TT? I guess that in a world where a school was sanctioned for
allowing a female athlete to "wash her car" on campus puts everything in
BYU is a great school. I hope he comes, if BYU wants him that is.
Thank you, Wes!Kurtz will some day thank you, too, for pushing him
over the edge to BYU history!
As a Ute, I'd pick Provo over Lubbock - 365 reasons.
Recruiting should be fair and I agree that booster should not recruit, but how
do you stop it? We had a young lady in my ward who was being recruited for track
at a number of PAC 10 schools. Everyone in the ward wanted her to go to BYU. She
is a sprinter and her mother was on the Olympic team for the Philippines. She
choose to go to Washington State. She didn't want to be any farther from
home than that.A major problem we have in this country is we hold
one person or entity accountable for something that somebody else did. A young
lady gets off of a bus, and a drunk driver hits and kills her, we sue the bus
company when we discover that the drunk driver had no money. They use the excuse
that the bus was not perfect to go after them. (What bus or person is perfect
for that matter?)We should only hold people accountable for what
they do, not for what others do.
Welker drops another one.
It's actually kinda nice that Welker sent the Austin Collie article. A
great example of a WR who tore it up at BYU and then had some success in the
NFL. If Kurtz read the article, it would probably push him MORE towards than
Dumb move by Welker. If the young man is smart enough to get into BYU, he is
smart enough to know how many receivers the program puts in the NFL or if that
even matters to him.What I do find ironic is some of the posts above
trashing Welker as a receiver. Just because he made a poor choice in his tweets
doesn't have anything to do with his NFL skills. Yes, cougsanddawgs, he is
a star. 10 years in the league, 5 times with more than 100 catches, 18 games
with 10 or more catches, a very talented punt returner, and a salary over $9MM a
year. If Collie put up the same numbers you would have him in the Hall of Fame.
It almost sounds to me like Kurtz kind of blew Welker off. If I were a WR I
would look at the here and now in terms of programs. I'm sure Cody Hoffman
talked with Kurtz and showed him what it's like to put up big numbers as
the go-to-guy at BYU. I also agree with poyman...Hoffman is a 2nd round pick at
least, and possibly 1st round whereas TT has not had a great NFL type receiver
since Crabtree and honestly don't have a real strong history themselves in
draft picks at the WR position. And who does Welker think he is anyway?
It's not like he's a star, and he wouldn't be the receiver he is
without Tom Brady. I hope Kurtz will take what he sees and follow his heart on
this one, and not some 5'7 system receiver.
Someone hurry and defend BYU. Hurry.
I am guessing that both Collie and Pitta (who often plays as a reciever in
addition to his TE duties) would take issue with Welker's statement, but
they also know the rules and won't pull a Welker stunt...Furthermore,Kurtz will be replacing Cody Hoffman from BYU who will be a first
rounder next year... So what happened with Tech's big Reciever
in the 2013 draft??? His name is Darrin Moore and he wasn't selected... He
signed with Dallas after the draft was over and is a long shot to even make the
team. Who does Tech have for their future? great question, Since
Kurtz will already be busy leading the Receiving attack for the Cougars... Nuff said.
I totally agree with hamaca. That's the nature of the NCAA and its rules.
I agree that it is inherently unfair to punish Texas Tech for Welker's
actions. Problem is, there is no other way to address it--no other approach
would have any teeth. It's the threat of disciplinary action against the
school that keeps boosters under control and compliant.
I am just anxious to know about Welker's 50 other reasons. Somebody needs
to do an interview and get those on paper.
As a die-hard BYU fan I don't have any problems with Welker's
comments. He's just trying to recruit a kid to his alma mater and saying
the same things to the kid anybody else would. That said, rules are rules and
Welker is a booster and therefore limited in what he can say.
Boosters and alumni "encouraging" athletes to participate in a certain
university's program MUST be controlled by the university. If they
can't control them, you end up with an old-school SMU. Welker has been
through the system himself---he knows better.
RE: AZ Blue & RedI agree that Texas Tech could not have stopped
this from happening. But that is the nature of NCAA rules.He may
have a good point about BYU not putting a lot of receivers into the NFL, but he
chose the wrong forum to share his opinion and may end up costing his alma
mater.Of course, the reason BYU doesn't put impact receivers
into the NFL is because they rarely have athletes of Collie's caliber.
Plus, when BYU's offense has been really good, they usually lean heavily on
the Tight End position. And BYU has sent some pretty good TEs to the NFL.
Wes Welker < Zach Thomas
AZ Blue & Red - great comment, very balanced. I applaud your comment.I take it you don't spend much time on the boards at sltrib.com, I
probably would have noticed. Not as much blue-red balance over there.
AZ Blue & RedThis is exactly the type of illegal recruiting
activity NCAA rules are supposed to prevent. It may only be a minor violation,
but it's a slippery slope when boosters start recruiting players.
Dumb comment from someone that should know better. Not a fan of his anymore.Not sure how Texas Tech could have stopped this. Can't see
punishing the school for a dumb comment from someone that matches his own
omment. If TT did this I can see an issue but do not punish the school and the
players for someone elses mistake that really they have no control over. Let the kid decide where he wants to play football.