San Francisco sues Utah's Crossroads of the West Gun Shows


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  • Lobotech Grantsville, UT
    June 15, 2013 2:25 p.m.

    Looks like the People's Republick of Kalifornia is trying to run the entire nation....again.

  • Redshirt1701 Deep Space 9, Ut
    June 14, 2013 8:15 a.m.

    To "mark" wrong. Even if you banned them at a federal level, repair kits will still be legal because if you owned one before the ban was put in place you still can have one. Plus, it won't keep them out of the hands of criminals.

    Thanks to technology, you can print a high capacity magazine. See "Gunsmiths 3D-Print High Capacity Ammo Clips To Thwart Proposed Gun Laws" in Forbes. So, you can buy time on high quality 3D printers and print out parts. Yes the cost goes from $20 to $100 for the same part, but if I am a criminal intent on causing as much harm as I can, what is $100?

  • mark Salt Lake City, UT
    June 14, 2013 6:53 a.m.

    Actually, I was talking about banning them on a national. And banning them all, not grandfathering existing magazine like California has done. And absolutely they could all be banned including existing ones.

  • RBB Sandy, UT
    June 14, 2013 6:14 a.m.

    They are suing for "unfair competition." Apparently San Francisco realizes that it will be more difficult for its gang bangers to loot, steal and kill if the intended victims can shoot back and "compete" with the criminals. Oh, the joys of leftist ideology.

  • mark Salt Lake City, UT
    June 13, 2013 11:28 p.m.

    Well, RedShirt, I was talking about on a federal level. And absolutely they could ban them, even the ones already in exsistance.

  • owlmaster2 Kaysville, UT
    June 13, 2013 10:40 p.m.

    Good!!!! Glad action is finally being taken to stop the sale of parts that can be used to make illegal clips... now we need background checks at these gun shows.

  • NO TAX Draper, UT
    June 13, 2013 11:50 a.m.

    It's all about money, San Fran sues and all they get is Money to cover "their cost" and some additional money. The only ones that make out are the lawyers

  • Redshirt1701 Deep Space 9, Ut
    June 13, 2013 9:58 a.m.

    To "mark" had you read the article, you would see that high capacity magazines are banned, however, since they were once legal they can't ban the ones that currently exist. Just like car emissions. The laws can require higher standards, but that does not mean that older cars must be retrofit to meet the new standards.

    The state of california cannot ban the manufacture and sale of repair parts for high capacity magazines any more than they can ban the manufacture and sale of car parts for older cars.

  • Sparafucile San Francisco, CA
    June 13, 2013 9:22 a.m.

    It's too bad Mr Herrera is too smug to feel the same of embarrassment when the Court instantaneously throws out his preposterous suit for lack of venue and lack of standing.

    There is no business activity conducted by ANY of the defendants within the City and County of San Francisco, making the City Attorney's civil suit facially invalid.

  • mark Salt Lake City, UT
    June 12, 2013 4:45 p.m.

    "So the next time that the gun accessory manufacturers go to the gun show, they will now sell 2 (or more) kits that a person can potentially assemble into a high capacity clip. Duh...."

    Duh? Wow, haven't heard that word since the 7th grade.

    But you are right about the "repair" kits. So ALL high capacity magazines should be banned. All "repair" kits banned. Anyone caught with any high capacity magazines receives five years per magazine in the pen.

    There you go, no more problem with any loophole.

  • I-am-I South Jordan, UT
    June 12, 2013 1:07 p.m.

    Seems like to me that this only shows how ridiculous and poorly written most of the gun control laws are. In this situation it apparently would be okay to buy/sell rebuild kits if they came one piece at a time or missing a piece or something. In substance all you would have to do to be legal is buy pieces separately. If this is what every day citizens are doing in the light of day to get high capacity magazines, how much more creative will the actual criminals be to get them in the shadows? Besides does this law make Californians safer? If you could prove to me that a high capacity magazine caused (not were involved with,they're different) more deaths then I might go a long with this law, but you can't. The question really is then how many gun deaths/crimes in California required the assailant to shoot more than 7 rounds without reloading? And was the magazine he used purchased legally before this ban? When we ask the right questions we expose how silly this law really is.

  • RedShirt USS Enterprise, UT
    June 12, 2013 11:55 a.m.

    So the next time that the gun accessory manufacturers go to the gun show, they will now sell 2 (or more) kits that a person can potentially assemble into a high capacity clip. Duh....it doesn't take a rocket surgeon to figure out that the parts will be made, and can be sold as individual repair parts to build a clip. You can do the same thing with car engines, and all sorts of other things.

    Once againg, the liberals are showing their ignorance of the loopholes that they put into their laws, then scream when anybody finds them first.

    What you anti-gun advocates should look at are the maps of gun violence and voting patterns. For some reason, in areas that vote Democrat there tends to be more gun violence. Maybe we need to just restrict Democrats from owning guns, then the violence will go down.

  • Sneaky Jimmy Bay Area, CA
    June 12, 2013 8:53 a.m.

    Trust your government to protect you. It's always easier to prosecute law abiding citizens for breaking contrived laws then it is to go after the dangerous criminals, of which there is no shortage in SF.

  • dave4197 Redding, CA
    June 12, 2013 8:31 a.m.

    All I can say, the most clearly I can say it. Good for SF CA this time, not any other time though.

  • mark Salt Lake City, UT
    June 12, 2013 8:20 a.m.

    Well "Captain" Green, what real life incident is that video portraying? I would assume the film maker might have mentioned if it was anything other then fiction.

    In your fictional video the homeowner fires seven shots before running out of ammo. Proposed federal law would limit magazines to ten rounds. So this homeowner chose to limit himself to seven rounds. Why is the filmmaker, and by extension you, trying to blame the government?

    I can tell you a real life story. The shooter of Gabby Giffords was stopped from killing more people when he fumbled a magazine change. Very likely people are alive today because that murderer did not have high capacity magazines.

    The Aurora Colorado mass shooting where the murderer killed 12 and injured 58, he used a hundred round magazine. Yes, it jammed. After 40 rounds were fired from it. 40 rounds before having to reload or switch weapons.

    That should be your public service announcment. And it's real.

    Me? I have a .45 (locked up securely) (no four year old coming over to my house finding it and shooting his dad) and two loaded 9 round magazines. And I feel safe as can be.

  • Happy Valley Heretic Orem, UT
    June 12, 2013 8:20 a.m.

    So all you patriots out there would be OK with a CO. WA. NV. CA. Etc… company selling "Incense kits" that contained Marijuana which is OK in those states to folks in Utah? (The original drafts of the Constitution were on "Hemp Paper" so I'll take that as an approval of the plant and its many gifts, from our founding fathers.)

    You guys think each state should have whatever laws they can pass, and this is what you'll get.
    The Law is the Law as the neocons point out daily! (well when it comes to immigration or religiously based laws)

  • Midwest Mom Soldiers Grove, WI
    June 12, 2013 7:19 a.m.

    For Bass and all the other petrified "patriots," your willingness to flaunt laws you dislike proves the reason why many of us want more emphasis on our freedom to have the right to bear arms "well-regulated."

    As for liberals protecting freedom, it was Senator Russ Feingold (D) of our great state that was the only person to vote against the Patriot Act. He is a true patriot. Now as we see the far reach of the NSA, and other government violations of our constitutional rights, it is clearly evident that those on the right who spoke of protecting our freedom were really out to take it. Sadly, many of you were too busy buying guns and bashing liberals to notice.

    It takes more than arming yourself and yelling at your t.v. to make you brave.

  • Interloper Portland, OR
    June 12, 2013 6:15 a.m.

    I commend San Francisco's city attorney for pursuing these grounds to end sales of 'repair kits' that get around limiting the capacity of gun magazines. With Congress afraid to act to rein in gun violence, local and state's attorneys need to step into the breach. Hopefully, California Attorney General Kamala Harris will make the case statewide.

    It is wonderful this is occurring in California. Because of the sheer size of its consumer market, the state often sets the standards for manufactured goods, ranging from children's pajamas to automobiles, nationwide. It is time to add guns and ammunition to the list.

  • Captain Green Heber City, UT
    June 11, 2013 11:37 p.m.

    Anyone who thinks limiting magazine capacity is a good idea, needs to watch this video. You can find it by searching for: MB Studio Productions High Capacity Magazine PSA on YouTube.
    This clearly demonstrates the absurdity of idiotic laws that have been passed in some parts of the country. It boggles the mind that people really believe by forcing these limitations on their citizens that it will make them safer. There will actually be more good people die BECAUSE of the magazine capacity bans. Thank Heaven the federal government did pass such a stupid restriction! Captain Jim Green

  • Truthseeker SLO, CA
    June 11, 2013 9:54 p.m.

    This is precisely why we need federal gun laws.

    Yeah, I know many on here love to talk trash about CA.
    CA is doing fine--better, now that we have a Democratic Gov. and no more gridlock in the legislature. The housing market is recovering, more people back to work, state revenues increasing, and Moody's recently increased CA's bond rating.

    Perhaps you should withhold judgement to something you know about--Cedar Hills perhaps?

    And, Apple recently announced plans for a new building complex with an anticipated increase in their workforce in CA by 50%.

  • tabuno Clearfield, UT
    June 11, 2013 9:19 p.m.

    Let's not export Utah's pro-gun culture to other states whose residents have used their own Ninth and Tenth Amendments rights to the U.S. Constitution to regulate guns as permitted by the U.S. Supreme Court holding and ruling on the Second Amendment to the U.S. Constitution.

  • uncommonsense CENTERVILLE, UT
    June 11, 2013 5:35 p.m.

    In Hayward Ca. an elementary school principle is organizing a toy gun buy back. Toy Guns! Toys! Because you know, so many have been killed by toy guns. This is standard procedure for California. Toss out common sense and throw away logic and make sure you vote the correct way.

  • JayTee Sandy, UT
    June 11, 2013 5:04 p.m.

    Those who use the legal system to prey upon others are a lot like certain types of cancer. After it destroys the organ where it started, it can metastasize and start to invade other organs. No good targets left in California, the then try some out-of-state victims.

    June 11, 2013 5:02 p.m.

    “There is science, logic, reason; there is thought verified by experience.
    And then there is California.”
    - Edward Abbey

  • sanpaco Sandy, UT
    June 11, 2013 4:50 p.m.

    California don't you have anything better to do?

  • Shane333 Cedar Hills, UT
    June 11, 2013 4:33 p.m.

    Ernest T. Bass,
    Freedom, personal responsibility and accountability can be terrifying to some people. Fear of those things is one of the primary reason why socialism and statism in general have gained so much popularity.

  • DN Subscriber Cottonwood Heights, UT
    June 11, 2013 4:31 p.m.

    It is a bankrupt (both morally and fiscally) city in an equally bankrupt state, but San Francisco does have lots of lawyers on their payroll. So they can file frivolous lawsuits against whomever they please. Their lawyers still get paid, but the defendants now have to hire high priced lawyers to defend themselves.

    Ignored is the fact that they (Crossroads) were not selling anything. The dealers being sued were selling "magazine rebuild kits" and they have a California Department of Justice letter several years ago advising them that such sales were legal. These are simply kits of parts for repair of magazines which are already legally owned ("grandfathered") by some people in that state. Of course it is illegal to use such parts for any other purpose, but that is a violation by the purchaser, not the seller.

    I stay out of California at every opportunity, and advise the people living there to flee to freedom while they still can, before ALL their property is confiscated and given away.

  • GiuseppeG Murray, Utah
    June 11, 2013 4:31 p.m.

    re: FatherOfFour

    What would you think in your scenario if Boise City was prosecuting the Colorado company for selling product X in Salt Lake City? In this case, it appears S.F. (see okeesmokee's post) is filing a lawsuit for an action that took place outside of its jurisdiction. Does it matter how far outside of its jurisdiction?

  • snowman Provo, UT
    June 11, 2013 4:28 p.m.

    Meadow Lark Mark: guns don't kill people kill people. A gun can not kill on its own. The Constitution of the United States says we can own guns. The gangs and criminals would still get guns if normal people didn't have them.

  • Ernest T. Bass Bountiful, UT
    June 11, 2013 4:00 p.m.

    Those California liberals just hate freedom.

    June 11, 2013 3:58 p.m.

    The law is still the law. Put it this way: Product X is illegal in California, but legal in Utah. A Utah company is selling Product X in California where it is illegal. That company is breaking the law, and everyone in Utah is defending them. In this case, Product X is high capacity magazines.

    Product X is illegal in Utah, but legal in Colorado. A Colorado company is selling Product X in Utah where it is illegal. That company is breaking the law. In this case, Product X is marijuana. Would you still defend the company selling it?

    By the way, they are both inanimate objects that can't hurt you.

  • okeesmokee SALT LAKE CITY, UT
    June 11, 2013 3:28 p.m.

    I was curious to understand what, "is in San Francisco's backyard" meant. It means that the Cow Palace is in Daly City, which isn't in San Francisco. Although the limitation is a State Law, I don't see why the City of San Francisco gets to file a law suit on behalf of the entire state. Won't this just get thrown out?

  • Meadow Lark Mark IDAHO FALLS, ID
    June 11, 2013 3:18 p.m.

    Patriot you have it right on! I say we need to ban all guns, for certainly it is those awful guns that kill. There is never any human involved who shoots the guns. Let's ban all guns so only the bad guys have them who get them through illegal means. That sounds like the best course of action to me.

  • RockOn Spanish Fork, UT
    June 11, 2013 3:14 p.m.

    Well done, Cali. You've solidified your claim to the crazy state filled with reactionaries who make up laws to deter other people yet refuse to pass laws actually stopping real crime. I'm glad I was born there -- it was beautiful and a wonderful state at one time. Now, I'm glad I moved to Utah. A sane state.

  • Republicantthinkstraigh Anywhere but, Utah, Utah
    June 11, 2013 2:34 p.m.

    This is the top story on the D-News? Imagine that. Great, go ahead and feed the crazies, "Gubmint comin to take er gunz" Looks like they broke the law folks. Good for you San Fran. Crooked gun manufacturers, always pushing the envelop. Better hurry and go buy another 10 guns to fight the gubmint. Don't forget your 30 round clip with armor piercing bullets. I for one couldn't imagine living with so much hate and fear. How can life be enjoyed when living with so much hate?

  • one old man Ogden, UT
    June 11, 2013 2:31 p.m.


  • patriot Cedar Hills, UT
    June 11, 2013 2:16 p.m.


    Yes - turn yourself in. I'm certain Nancy Pelosi and Jerry Brown will give you a pass. Honestly the only people in California who know anything about guns are the gang members and they get their guns illegally. Most don't know the difference between and AR 15 and M1A1 tank.

  • Hank Saint George, UT
    June 11, 2013 1:42 p.m.

    I drove thru California last week with 50 rounds of 22 lr crammed in a 10 round .223 magazine. Is that against the law? Should I turn myself in?

  • patriot Cedar Hills, UT
    June 11, 2013 1:39 p.m.

    just don't hold any shows in California. California is dying from super high taxes and all the insane liberal regulations. Let them sink in the sand or ocean - which ever suits them. Honestly - I would NEVER do business in California going forward with Jerry Brown, Nancy Pelosi and the rest of the Communist - leftest - crazies out there. The state is already hopelessly bankrupt and continues to have companies leaving the state - not moving to the state. The LA area infrastructure is in shambles .....all the product of decades of progressive thinking. A once beautiful state is turning into another Detroit MI.

  • procuradorfiscal Tooele, UT
    June 11, 2013 1:31 p.m.

    Re: "According to his office, the law . . . is meant to ban the use of the accessory 'favored … among mass murderers.'"

    So, why doesn't this political hack, posing as a public servant and prosecutor, go after duct-tape manufacturers and sellers, or windowless-van manufacturers and sellers, or pressure-cooker manufacturers and sellers?

    This is nothing more than an unethical perversion of the justice system, cynically using it for political purposes by persecuting innocent bystanders, in order to pander to mindless, liberal low-information voters.

    Mr. Herrera should be disbarred.

  • Ifel Of'a-sofa Alpine, Utah
    June 11, 2013 1:15 p.m.

    thank goodness I was shot with a 10 round magazine and not a 12 round!

  • Shane333 Cedar Hills, UT
    June 11, 2013 1:08 p.m.

    It is sad that San Francisco apparently has an irrational fear of inanimate objects such as magazines or magazine parts.