RE: Uteology"The tournament is the ONLY thing that
matters."I'll agree to disagree on this point."FYI Utah basketball has been horrible over the last 10 years. Why are you
comparing your success with our programs low point? Instead, why don't you
compare your success to Utah's good years and then tell us why you prefer
being a "one and done" team over deep tournament runs."You're kidding, right? That's like saying to Utah fans... 2004 and
2008 don't really matter, instead compare the last few years of Utah
football with BYU's dynasty of 1979-1985. That makes no sense. Of course I
would prefer deep runs to one-and-done, but the fact that we haven't been
"one-and-done" in three of the last four years is certainly reason for
optimism. I was going to refute your claim that 2000 to 2005 was
"average" for Utah, but looking at your history in the post-season,
it's actually really impressive. Congrats, I wish BYU had the same track
record. Instead I'll have to be content knowing that we're a program
on the rise and things look very promising for the foreseeable future.
@WiscougarfanMost Utah fans will tell you that from 2000 to 2013
we've been average at best and horrible most of the time (except for
2005).Average Utah basketball teams are 4-5 in the tournament, from
2000 to 2005 (one sweet 16).Great BYU basketball teams are 4-9, from
2005 to 2013 (one sweet 16)"NBA draft picks: 2, with another
likely this year and at least six other players who are getting paid to play
overseas.Soon to be at least 7 other players overseas, I think
Jimmer is most likely on his way. That is unless, anohter NBA team give him a
shot and he shines.No NBA draft picks drafted? We you just went one
more year in your analysis you would see Utah the #1 draft pick in 2005.
WiscougarfanRiver Falls, WI(continued)I can tell you why
you are bitter (aside from little brother syndrome) and feel the only thing BYU
basketball has accomplished since 2005-06 is one sweet 16 appearance). ----------The tournament is the ONLY thing that matters. Why?
Because in basketball you don't need judges to tell you how good your are
in polls, you have a chance to prove it on the court. What BYU has proved is
that they lack size to go deep in the tournament.FYI Utah basketball
has been horrible over the last 10 years. Why are you comparing your success
with our programs low point? Instead, why don't you compare your success
to Utah's good years and then tell us why you prefer being a "one and
done" team over deep tournament runs. For example, just compare the average
Utah teams from 2000-2005 to post 2005 BYU teams and let me know what you find.
(continued)I can tell you why you are bitter (aside from little brother
syndrome) and feel the only thing BYU basketball has accomplished since 2005-06
is one sweet 16 appearance). Utah’s accomplishments since 2005-06NCAA tournament appearances: 1 (one and done as a 5 seed in 2009)Ranked
in polls: 1, 2009 (#25)Conference titles: 1 (2009)Conference player
of year: 1 (2009)NBA draft picks: zero 20 win seasons: 1, (and six
losing seasons)While 2009 was a pretty nice season (despite the
tourney upset), really the only thing Utah has accomplished since 2005-06 is the
staggering number of players who have transferred out of the program. Go Cougs!
RE: Uteology"In basketball even with BYU dominating recruiting
and on the court the only thing you have to show for it is ONE sweet 16."Downplay BYU's basketball's accomplishments all you want but
we all know what you said is not true. Here’s a short list of BYU’s
accomplishment since Dave Rose took the helm in 2005-06. Number of
NCAA tournament appearances: 6 of 8 (one sweet 16, two other first round wins),
other two years were NIT appearancesRanked in the final polls: 2006 (#24),
2009 (#17), 2010 (#10), and just missed it in 2007 and 2008Conference
titles: 2007, 2008, 2009, 2011Conference player of the year: 2007, 2008,
2011 (National player of the year 2011)NBA draft picks: 2, with another
likely this year and at least six other players who are getting paid to play
overseas20 win seasons: all eight(continued)
Marked it DownPark City, UTUteologyYou also forgot
to include the viewership numbers for Utah's bowl games from 1965, the year
after Utah's Liberty Bowl win, to 1991.The numbers will be
identical to Utah's 2012 bowl.------------Yes they
would. So what?Utah's football program today is light years
ahead of where it was in 1991. Back then BYU used to get all the top in-state
recruits, you no longer do today, regardless of ESPN TV ratings, stadium size,
and attendance. Utah is the flagship football program of the State,
according to majority of top in-state recruits. This is not an opinion but a
fact.In basketball even with BYU dominating recruiting and on the
court the only thing you have to show for it is ONE sweet 16. Will Lone Peak
grads take you deep into the tournament? No idea. But I also remember similar
national championship talk at Iggys from a 5 star QB in a top 25 class who know
plays in Kansas.
UteologyYou also forgot to include the viewership numbers for
Utah's bowl games from 1965, the year after Utah's Liberty Bowl win,
to 1991, the year before Utah's Copper Bowl loss. Let me guess.
The numbers will be identical to Utah's 2012 bowl.1965 to 1991Utah - 27 Couch Potato Bowls 0.0
Marked it DownAfter all of his exhaustive research, he didn't
even post any viewership numbers for Utah's 2012 bowl game. Must have been
an oversight.2012Utah - Couch Potato Bowl 0.0---------I also didn't include the viewership numbers for
Utah's 2008 bowl game.2008Utah - BYU's Quest Bowl
7.8BYU - BYU's Reality Bowl 2.5
@Wiscougarfan@deductive reasoningI stand corrected, my bad!
The medical schools numbers ARE pretty impressive.Again, my bad!!
Wiscougarfan / deductive reasoningGood job baffling our hill troll
with facts. The kids on the hill excel at hyperbole, but when it comes to
"research", not so much.After all of his exhaustive
research, he didn't even post any viewership numbers for Utah's 2012
bowl game. Must have been an oversight.2012Utah - Couch Potato
The acceptance rate of BYU undergraduates into medical and dental schools is
unfailingly above the national norm. Over the last 25 years acceptance rates for
BYU students have been 82 percent (dental) and 60 percent (medical); national
averages for the same period have been 56 percent (dental) and 47 percent
@deductive reasoning: "BYU undergrads have very high acceptance rates in
medical, dental, and other research intense graduate program."@Uteology: "Really? Provide us the source to confirm your numbers. Take
your time if you need to do some "research".BYU Medical
School Applicant Statistics 2012Category - Total Applicants - Total
Accepted - %Applied to Both MD and DO - 148 - 124 - 84%Applied to DO
only - 58 - 35 - 60%Applied to MD only - 221 - 133 - 60%Total
Applicants - 427 - 292 - 68%Source: Association of American Medical
CollegesDO = Dental SchoolMD = Medical SchoolFor
comparison, feel free to "research" UofU undergraduate acceptance rates
to Medical and Dental School
(continued)BYU vs. Baylor (ESPN2), 12/21/12, 407kBYU vs. Va.
Tech (ESPNU), 12/29, 107kBYU vs. St. Mary’s (ESPNU), 1/16/13,
223kBYU vs. Gonzaga (ESPN2), 1/24, 535kBYU vs. Portland (ESPNU),
1/26, 106k BYU vs. St. Mary’s (ESPN2), 2/21, 270kBYU vs.
Gonzaga, (ESPN2), 2/28, 789kBYU vs. Loyola Marymount (ESPNU), 3/2, 185kBYU vs. San Diego (ESPNU), 3/8/13, 206kBYU vs. Washington (ESPN),
3/19/13, 1.1mBYU vs. Southern Miss (ESPNU), 3/27, 129kBYU vs. Baylor
(ESPN2), 4/2, 473kNielsen only tracks games that are played on
national t.v. so the sample size for Utah and USU is rather small (four games
and one game). However, common sense dictates that games shown on national
television will get more eyeballs than those broadcast on regional television.
Utah regular season ave: 79k, post-season ave: 917kUSU regular
season ave: 114kBYU regular season ave: 314k regular season, 567k
post-season Go ahead and draw your own conclusion as to which team
had more people watching. Go Cougs!
RE: Uteology“@Wiscougarfan: There are also more people who
watch the BYU games on television than the other two in-state schools (thanks
ESPN).Really? Please provide a link to support your claim. If
it's any thing like your bowl games I disagree… NOTE: the higher the
number the better the rating.”No need to be condescending
Uteology. Ask a straightforward question (like you did), and I’m happy to
give a straightforward answer. Here’s the data I found by going to the
same source you did (Nielson)Utah vs. Cal (ESPNU), 2/28, 36kUtah vs. Washington (ESPNU) 1/19, 171kUtah vs. Oregon St (ESPNU), 3/7,
31kUtah vs. Oregon (ESPN, Pac12-semi), 3/15, 917kUtah State
vs. New Mexico St. (ESPNU), 2/16, 114k(continued)
@Snack PAC: "Unfortunately for U, the one WCC team that has consistently
outdrawn U for most of the last 40 years, is BYU."That's
awesome bro! How did your basketball team do on the court over the same 40 year
period? Again, thanks for the attendance smack.@deductive reasoning: "BYU undergrads have very high acceptance rates in
medical, dental, and other research intense graduate program."Really? Provide us the source to confirm your numbers. Take your time if you
need to do some "research".@Wiscougarfan: There are also
more people who watch the BYU games on television than the other two in-state
schools (thanks ESPN).Really? Please provide a link to support your
claim. If it's any thing like your bowl games I disagree:2012Utah Sate - Potato 1.9BYU - Poinsettia 1.52011Utah - Sun 2.71 (#13 in ratings)BYU - Armed Forces 1.43 (#33 of #35)2010Utah - Vegas 3.27 (#12th in rating)BYU - New Mexico 1.82
(#26)2009Utah - Poinsettia 2.81BYU #12 vs #16 OSU -
Vegas 2.59Source: Nielson Media ResearchNOTE: the higher
the number the better the rating.
RE: VegasUte"Tators, although you made total sense, and you were
on point for most of your post, you lost me with "will be a part of some
deep runs into the NCAA playoffs". byU and deep runs into the NCAA playoffs
just don't go together in the same sentence, they never have. But,
byU's definition of "deep run" does mean a totally different thing
than it does to other schools."Touche. BYU hasn't had much
success going deep into the tourney in the past. However, there are at least
three good reasons to believe that will change in the next few years. They are
Emery, Mika, and Haws. BYU has never had this much recruiting success in the
past AND they have been making positive improvement each year under coach Rose.
BYU has never been a consistent NCAA tourney going team until recently and they
made it to the sweet sixteen just two years ago. With the direction the program
is headed it is totally conceivable that BYU makes a "deep run" in the
next 3-4 years (deep being elite eight or better). Go cougs!
Ryan, what ever you do choose blue.
I'm sure that byU had trouble in attendance during it's really down
years (including 1996-1997 when they went winless in a diluted 16 team WAC, and
only won one game all year). The only thing that will bring back the attendance
is getting the team back to our winning heritage.Tators, although
you made total sense, and you were on point for most of your post, you lost me
with "will be a part of some deep runs into the NCAA playoffs". byU and
deep runs into the NCAA playoffs just don't go together in the same
sentence, they never have. But, byU's definition of "deep run"
does mean a totally different thing than it does to other schools.Good luck to you, Andrus, wherever you end up. Enjoy your senior year, all
your accolades, and especially your mission.Go Utes!!
Uteology"So at our lowest point in history our attendance was
better than Utah State and EVERY team in the WCC except for BYU."Unfortunately for U, the one WCC team that has consistently outdrawn U for
most of the last 40 years, is BYU.In a typical season, BYU will play
16 to 18 home games in the 21,000-seat MC, 7 or 8 road games in smaller WCC
arenas, and a handful of games in other arenas.During BYU's
worst season ever, 1997, BYU still averaged 16,895. The following year
attendance dropped to 8,430, but it quickly rebounded to 9,809 in 1999, and was
back over 10,000 by 2000 at 10,794. The Utes haven't averaged
10,794 in any season since Majerus left.Long-time Utah season ticket
holders who have been keeping "paid attendance" over 8,000, even though
actual attendance has been much lower, are losing patience. If Utah doesn't
soon improve its product, the Utes could see their paid attendance plummet as
season ticket holders decide its just not worth paying hundreds every year for
tickets they don't use.
UteologyActually BYU does an excellent job teaching research skills.
The post at 9:40 am shows basic research flaws. 1) How the numbers
are produced is often more important than the numbers themselves. To whit, the
vastly inflated attendance numbers from the Huntsman Center. I took a quick
look at the pictures from the DesNews article March 9 a Saturday game between
Utah and Oregon ranked #19 at the time. So, Saturday game, ranked conference
"rival" (he,he), so best chance for the Utah fan base to turn out. The
empty seats in the lower section outnumbered the people. I checked out other
games, same thing.
Please don't get all excited to think that over 8,000 people were in
attendance at the BBall games. That was the # of tickets sold not the number in
attendance. Utah ACTUAL attendance is weel below the PAC average.
CHEEKS IN SEATS ARE WHAT COUNTS. The number of people who paid for season
tickets and the number of people who actually show up are two different stories.
There were over 3,000 people who bought tickets that didn't attend the
games. It will be interesting to see if they buy again this year or save their
money to buy gymnastic tickets instead.
The reason he has not accepted offers from Utah, USU, or Weber is that he was
waiting to see if BYU would offer. Now that they have offered the choice is
clear. He will be wearing Cougar Blue.
Interesting! If the facts are correct, the ute are above the PAC12 average
Uteology"One thing Utah offers is the ability to develop
research skills, if he's thinking of a medical career he'll need to
develop those skills."I have a good friend who got his undergrad
degree from BYU and his Doctorate at U Va. He's now one of the world's
leading DNA experts with several patents and over a hundred articles published
in peer-reviewed scientific journals.BYU undergrads have very high
acceptance rates in medical, dental, and other research intense graduate
program.For someone who needs to refine those research skills, see
mirror.btw, Utah 8,406 reported paid attendance, doesn't even
come close to the actual number of warm bodies that showed up for most games in
2012 and 2011. Most photos of games in the HC the last couple of years show a
vast sea of empty red chairs. Actual number of fans in attendance was closer to
5,000 for most games.
Tators, great post. I think you hit the advantages of each program right on.
RE: UteologyThanks for posting the numbers on attendance. Sure
enough, they verify that more people attend BYU games than games Utah or USU
(despite being in a smaller conference). There are also more people who watch
the BYU games on television than the other two in-state schools (thanks ESPN).
#12 in the country for attendance, that's pretty good and just one of many
things that makes BYU basketball attractive. Also interesting that
Uteology brings up research since undergraduates don't typically do
research. However, BYU places more students in medical school than any other
school in the country, so if he is interested in med school than again, BYU
would be a great fit. He can do as many of us BYU alumn do and attend BYU for
our undergraduate degrees and then go elsewhere for graduate school. Most
companies frown on getting your bachelors and advanced degrees at the same
institution so playing bball for BYU and then going to the U for medical school
(they really do have a great medical school) might work out really nicely for
him. Go BYU and Utah!
Facts that are hard to dispute:Utah seems to be going in the right
direction... from bad to hopefully good.Advantage: lots of playing time
right away.USU is a good, very stable program that seldom has less
than 20-win seasons. Great coach.Advantage: Logan is an awesome place to
live with some of the most avid fans anywhere nationally. Coach Stu M usually
brings out the full potential of his players.BYU is a good program
that will probably soon be very, very good with a lot of national recognition
when the core of the best high school team in the nation becomes BYU's
core.Advantage: Though playing time will be harder to get, a player will
be a part of some deep runs into the NCAA playoffs.
"So at our lowest point in history our attendance was better than Utah State
and EVERY team in the WCC except for BYU."So, if we cannot
compete with Pac 12 schools do we now compete with non-BYU schools in the
@Lightening LadAttendance smack with NO numbers to back it from a
BYU fan? How original!!One thing Utah offers is the ability to
develop research skills, if he's thinking of a medical career he'll
need to develop those skills. By the looks of it BYU isn't the place for
research. Research shows the following attendance numbers for 2012
(average per game):Team:#12 BYU 15,424#55 Utah
State 8,406#57 Utah 8,394Conference:#7 PAC-12 7,143#12 WCC 4,284So at our lowest point in history our attendance was
better than Utah State and EVERY team in the WCC except for BYU.
The advantage Utah offers is two fold, first off you don't have to deal
with all the pesky fans attending the games and all the noise they make.
Personally I love the sound the crickets make echoing thru Utah's bandbox
during a game, the cobwebs mess up your clothes a little you just have to
remember to bring a little brush with you. Secondly with a 10% grad rate, Utah
won't put any pressure on you to take lots of hours or keep your grades up.
Wookie:You're just a class act my friend, great comment and
perspective. I think the best place for Andrus is where he is
inspired to go. He obviously has his priorities straight and will go on a
mission, and every program in the state of Utah will support that. If he wants
to play on the best program at least at present, he will go to BYU, if he wants
to play in a great atmosphere for a respected and successful coach, USU would be
good. If he wants to play in a major conference against storied programs like
UCLA, he should go to Utah. In the end it's going to be about what he wants
and where he feels he can thrive the most. Sounds like a great kid on and off
the floor, best of luck in making a tough decision.
Lone Peak-BYU! Why go anywhere else but the best?
Re: WookieWe are on opposite sides of the BYU vs. Utah rivalry.However, I stand by your side with the comments you made, and say amen
Playing in a big arena and playing in a full arena are two different things. So
are doing well in a big conference and passing out nachos for other teams to
utah round ballers can only hope to be mentioned in the same breath with the
Cougars. Real arena?? You mean the Marriott Center??? Or the HC, which we know
holds about 5,000 - er, oh wait.
Good to see this young man receive much-deserved recognition. Seems as if he
has his head on straight!Hope he stays healthy and has a great
senior year. Basketball in the state will benefit with young men like Andrus.
If he wants to play a large role with a good team then USU is his place. If he
wants to compete for playing time on a great team then BYU is his place. If he
was to play for a team worse than UVU's then UTAH is where he should go.
Utah football is ok (has ranked lower than BYU multiple years in a row
now--including this year) but Utah basketball is a joke. Losing to division II
I wish Ryan the best of luck to wherever he chooses.I saw him live a
few times this year and wasn't extrememly impressed. HOWEVER, he was just a
Junior and has some upside.
One thing most of you probably don't know about Ryan is how athletic he is.
He was an excellent baseball pitcher before he deicded to quit basbeall and
focus on basketball exclusively. He was a really good hitter as well which
always surprised me because of how tall he was, and he ran well also, not super
speedy but very coordinated and just moved well and effciently. I think if he
had kept playing baseball he might have been the difference this yea in helping
American Fork repeat as state champions since they really needed one more top
pitcher and he was that good. Regardless of where he goes he'll
be a good player for them, he's got a great family and a good background.
Of course I'm hoping he'll be a Cougar. We'll put a little
rpessure on him when we see him around town :)
Met Ryan a couple times now. Really great kid with good potential on the court.
He's above all of the immature rivalry talk above and will make the best
choice for him and for that I wish him the best wherever he ends up. I got the
impression that he would've already verbally committed to Utah if he
didn't feel an offer from BYU was imminent. I think USU would be a surprise
team for him to pick. BYU has a better supporting cast at the moment, but he may
see only limited minutes, where he could step in and be a higher impact player
at Utah (or USU). I'd love to see him wear red, but would be happy for him
wherever he chooses.
Ryan Andrus is going on a mission. . . looks like 2 years of being recruited by
BYU, unless he signs a LOI before he leaves on his mission. Not sure if that
would even prevent blue recruiting.
RE: ImaCa ManWho will place a big man in the NBA this year? Hint:
it's the team that OWNs the red team on the hardwood (seven in a row, 11 of
last 12, NCAA tourney 5 of last six seasons).
Love to see you on the hill playing UCLA, Arizona,Stanford,et al. Best of luck
wherever you choose.Go Utes!
Who has the best record of placing big men in the NBA? Hint: it's red and
plays in a major conference in real arenas.
Go where you have the best chance to succeed in life. Serve your mission
though, and serve it first. Your priority is your Lord first, basketball can
wait.Good Luck!GO UTES!!
The only team loaded with recruiting classes that will go deep into the NCAA is
BYU. Ryan has played against Lone Peak and he knows how lethal BYU is going to
be...for years. Time to get on ESPN, into the tourney, into the national
picture...every recruit in the state knows it...it's BYU.
Choose Choose ChooseThe The TheRed
Runnin' Utes Right program...Utah!!!!Go Ute.
CTR Ryan.Go Big Blue!!!