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Comments about ‘Taking inventory of Utah's first two seasons in the Pac-12’

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Published: Tuesday, June 4 2013 6:09 p.m. MDT

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Uteology
East Salt Lake City, Utah

AZ Ute
Scottsdale, AZ

Sorry to be of little faith, but to me it's pretty simple. Before, we got the leftovers from CA recruiting but competed in the MWC and did well. Now we still get the leftovers but have to compete with the teams that passed on them.

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A Ute fan using BYU logic?

Why don't you go do some "research". The data to gather is football class rankings in the last 10 years. What the data shows is Utah has improved it's talent level, class rankings went from around 60s to around 30s.

Now talent alone can't guarantee wins (see USC and Notre Dame) you need great coaching. Hopefully, Coach K will is the solution in basketball and Dennis Erickson in football.

Go UTES!!

GoRed
WEST VALLEY CITY, UT

sammy duck

Why are you so concerned about Utah's adjustment to the PAC 12? What does it have to do with your team? And, yes, we knew it would be an adjustment in terms of improving our facilities, recruiting, etc. Why does that bother you?

As far as your personal prediction/hope of 3-9 for the Utes football team, just remember, if that is the case, then your team from Provo will be lucky to go 2-10.

Uteology
East Salt Lake City, Utah

@Duckhunter

They don't have any advantages over any other school in the conference with the possible exception of wsu, that's it.

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According to Rivals, Utah with 3 years of BCS play the class rankings are (National/PAC-12):

2014: #35/#1 (I know, to early even for BYU fans)
2013: #44/#9
2012: #28/#7
2011: #37/#6

Average: #36/#7

So it seems Utah has the talent to compete against teams like Wazzu and BYU, we just need to build talent to compete against the UPPER half of the PAC-12.

killarney
Lincoln Park, IL

U 90

"most college fans couldn't care less about any sport outside of football and basketball"

Utah is a whopping 15-39 (28%) combined in conference in football and basketball for 2011 and 2012, with 8th and 9th place finishes in football and 10th and 11th place finishes in basketball.

U 90
Corona, CA

duck,

I've been to all PAC12 cities and "no" they are not all nicer and have better whether than SLC. Where do you come up with this stuff? Do you travel much other than your annual trip to Tulsa?

Naval Vet
Philadelphia, PA

Uteanymous:

"As far as bowl payouts go, anybody who is so clueless as to compare the payout for a 1974 bowl with the payout for a 2012 bowl has obviously never had a class in economics or finance."

First of all I HAD taken classes in Economics and Finance. In fact, my DEGREE is in Finance, and my MBA was heavily Finance & Economics weighted. If you wanted to gauge the TVM of your $201K payout in '74, and factored in the average rate of inflation over those past 38-yrs (3.412164%), then you'll find an equivalent 2011 value of $605K...which is 19.3% less than USU's Potato Bowl take. So does making 19.3% LESS than the modern day Potato Bowl support that the Fiesta was a "major" bowl back in 1974?

I fail to see how your 6:16 pm post refutes that the Fiesta Bowl of 1974 took an unranked WAC champion, and paired them up with a 6-5 team. Because anytime an unranked WAC champion plays a 6-5 team in a bowl game, that IS an irrelevant bowl.

Duckhunter
Highland, UT

@u90

I didn't say "they are all nicer". Major failure on your part. I said they are all preferable to the majority of recruits although I did exempt wsu and spokane from that so once again you fail.

You see it doesn't matter if you and I think this is a great place to be what matters is what the kids that play the sports think and nothing about slc is more attractive to most kids than los angeles is. And I personally think slc is a vastly nicer city then los angeles. Most kids would prefer phoenix, tuscon, the bay area, seattle, denver/boulder, and probably either oregon city to slc as well.

They don't care about salt lakes "transit system", that has never netted utah a single recruit. They don't care about national parks 4-5 hours away either. Most of them do not care about ski resorts either since most don't ski and none of them are allowed to ski.

So I'm still waiting for someone to list just one advantage utah has over the rest of the conference, just one.

Duckhunter
Highland, UT

@uteology

I'm still waiting for one of you to give me a list of the advantages utah has that are going to make them consistently competitive with the rest of the pac12. Thus far no one has given me even one. Someone tried to tell me the salt lake city transit system was the difference maker but for some reason I really doubt that has ever been a factor with even one recruit.

But I'm not even just talking about recruits, I'm talking about the overall athletic program. What is it utah has that gives them an advantage over the rest of the pac 12? What is going to make utah consistently competitive with everyone else in the pac12?

So far no one has given me a single answer to that.

Reno Cougs Fan 68
Reno, NV

Navel Vet

I have not looked it up, but what was BYU record in 1974? What was Utah's record that year and what bowl game did they play in? I think that the bowl committee is the ones that chooses who plays not the schools so how can you blame BYU for their opponent in 74 or 84 or any time they accept a bowl invitation?

Uteology
East Salt Lake City, Utah

@Duckhunter
Highland, UT

I'm still waiting for one of you to give me a list of the advantages utah has that are going to make them consistently competitive with the rest of the pac12. Thus far no one has given me even one.

But I'm not even just talking about recruits, I'm talking about the overall athletic program. What is it utah has that gives them an advantage over the rest of the pac 12? What is going to make utah consistently competitive with everyone else in the pac12?

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Huh?!? LOL

New York is a great place, yet San Antonio has 4 NBA titles.

In order to be competitive ANYWHERE you need:

1. Talent
2. Great Coaching

We don't need to give U a list. Whatever the list the Ute staff is giving to the recruits is working. As pointed out the data shows Utah's recruiting is improving.

Uteology
East Salt Lake City, Utah

@Duck
You see it doesn't matter if you and I think this is a great place to be what matters is what the kids that play the sports think and nothing about slc is more attractive to most kids than los angeles is.

---------------

Here's some research, hope it helps ease your anxiety:

"An overwhelming 94 percent ranked academics first. Of those, three-quarters placed tradition second. Facilities, while important to many of the prospects, ranked a clear third...Fifty-six percent said location is not important." -- What recruits really want (Mitch Sherman, ESPN)

I would think playing time and coaching staff are also important to recruits.

Marked it Down
Park City, UT

Uteology

"anytime an unranked WAC champion plays a 6-5 team in a bowl game, that IS an irrelevant bowl."

I guess that makes an unranked WAC/MWC/PAC also ran playing another unranked conference also ran even less relevant - a fitting description of most of Utah's bowl history.

On the other hand, considering there were only 11 bowls in 1974, just getting to a bowl was much more meaningful than it is today, where, with 35 bowls, you don't even have to have a winning record to play in a bowl.

VegasUte
Las Vegas, NV

I can't believe the trollers are now going back to 1974 to talk smack!! This is getting better and better!!

Great to be a Ute and living in the 21st century!!

Go Utes!!

Uteanymous
Salt Lake City, Utah

VegasUte

"I can't believe the trollers are now going back to 1974 to talk smack!!"

LOL at your hypocrisy!

Utah fans don't hesitate to go all the way back to the beginning of time, but only when it suits their purpose.

The usual line of demarcation for the kids on the hill is interesting.

For basketball, nothing after 2005 counts.

For football, nothing before 2004 counts (except for overall head-to-head with BYU).

AZUTE1
Mesa, AZ

@Marked it Down--

Thank goodness byu had the slew of patsies on their schedule last season, in order to ensure bowl eligibility, huh? Because we sure as heck know byu can't ever count on beating UTAH, nor virtually any other good team on their schedule, excepting solely USU at home in utah county, BARELY.

Weber State, Hawaii, Idaho, NMSU, etc. Not to mention, SJSU [OOPS]. Although SJSU was improved last season, it most certainly wasn't expected to be the case when byu scheduled them.

"Schedule another patsy, Tom, understood? How about SJSU? We must continue our 'LEGACY' of padding our win-total with these bottom-feeders, in order to become bowl-eligible and fool East coast voters into believing we're actually good when they see 10 wins at season's end!"

"SOS? What's SOS? Who cares how utterly weak our schedule is, annually, we have a 'LEGACY' to uphold! Get Idaho State back onto the schedule in 2013. Arguably worst FCS program ever! We can't risk scheduling a good FCS-opponent like UTAH did 2 years ago with MSU! UNCO was funny last season, 'til they beat WSU in Ogden. We looked like complete idiots for 'mocking' UTAH!"

Duckhunter
Highland, UT

@uteology

You do realize utah is a LOSING team with a LOSING record don't you? You also realize utah's recruting is still in the BOTTOM half of the pac12 don't you? So if you are putting all your eggs in the "better recruiting" basket you are in for some major disappointment. We aren't talking about how utah stacks up to BYU here, we are talking about how utah stacks up to the rest of the pac12 and frankly they are falling even farther behind.

You cannot give me one advantage that utah has, not one. You claim recruiting and coaching but I can't see how their coaching is any better than the rest of the conference and their recruiting is demonstrably not better than most of the teams in the conference. And of course we are talking about all sports here, not jsut football.

You realize this article is about how utah stacks up to the rest of the pac12 in ALL sports and aspects don't you?

Well they do not stack up well and none of you can show us how they are ever going to be any more than they currently are.

Naval Vet
Philadelphia, PA

Reno Cougs Fan 68:

"I have not looked it up, but what was BYU record in 1974?"

Is it really easier to ask me than do your own research? Granted, I am a Utah alumnus, so "research" isn't as foreign to me as it is to a typical Indy-WACer, but I'd think it'd been a lot faster for your to get the answers to your question had you tried "Google" than to wait for the moderators to approve your post, and for me to see it later.

Anyway...

Thanks to a narrow 12-10 escape at Air Force (2-9), in 1974, the Y was able to finish a mediocre 7-4-1, losing to Hawai'i (6-5), Utah St. (8-3), Iowa St. (4-7), and Okla. St. (7-5), and tying with Colo. St. (4-6-1). Utah was irrelevant from 1974-1977, so we did not make the postseason.

Rockwell
Baltimore, MD

Uteology

"New York is a great place, yet San Antonio has 4 NBA titles."

LOL at your frantic and emotional spin.

Comparing the NBA, where players are drafted and traded and signed according to cap space, to college sports, where every player is essentially a free-agent, free to choose any school that wants him, is a stretch, even for U.

As Duckhunter has already stated, Utah's incremental "advantage" in recruiting over other PAC 12 schools is non-existent, especially the big boys of the conference - USC, UCLA, Stanford, California, Oregon, Washington, and ASU. That leaves U fighting with Colorado, WSU, OSU and Arizona for the leftovers.

Naval Vet
Philadelphia, PA

Marked it Down:

"'anytime an unranked WAC champion plays a 6-5 team in a bowl game, that IS an irrelevant bowl.'...considering there were only 11 bowls in 1974, just getting to a bowl was much more meaningful than it is today."

First of all, that was ME you were quoting; not Uteology. Second, how can you infer that the Fiesta Bowl was relevant back in the early 70s? All one had to do to play there was win the weak WAC. That's pretty much all one had to do to get into the Potato Bowl.

If you Indy-WACers want to make a case for the '74 Fiesta Bowl as "relevant", you'll have to first dispel the following push-back:

(1) The (weak) WAC champion finished 7-3-1.

Would that be described as "prestigious", or "mediocre"?

(2) The opponent was a 6-5 Big 8 team who hadn't been to a bowl game since 1958, who got to 6-wins by beating Wichita St. (1-9-1), and only made a bowl because Neb. went to the Sugar, and Okla. was on probation.

Would that opponent be described as "prestigious", or "mediocre"?

Duckhunter
Highland, UT

@uteology

""An overwhelming 94 percent ranked academics first. Of those, three-quarters placed tradition second. Facilities, while important to many of the prospects, ranked a clear third...Fifty-six percent said location is not important." -- What recruits really want (Mitch Sherman, ESPN)"

Well I don't have any anxiety over it but that should just give you even more anxiety and it proves my point so thanks for posting it.

I said utah is at a disadvantage in almost all aspect from most of the rest of the conference. So if academics are that important utah fails again in comparison to the rest of the pac12 as utah is in the bottom 3rd in academics. utah fails once again in the 2nd most imporatant aspect of "tradition". The utah fails again in facilities and they fail again in location. In every single one of those aspects utah is at, or near, the bottom of the pac12 which is exactly the point I have been making.

So tell us what exactly are the advantages utah has that are going to make them consistently competitive in the pac12?

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