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Comments about ‘Lesson from Waco: Religion matters when dealing with the nonconventional’

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Published: Thursday, April 18 2013 10:05 p.m. MDT

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Lightening Lad
Austin , TX

It's almost a recipe that so many charismatic religious leaders follow. You mix in guns, lots of money from the threat that if you don't pay you won't get into heaven, sexual dominance over the group, add in isolation, a we versus the evil them attitude and there is no end to the harm you can cause.

Pete1215
Lafayette, IN

"He said investigators need to sort out fact from fiction before taking action." In these cases, waiting until all fact is separated from all fiction means doing nothing, ever.

donn
layton, UT

Many Christian Scholars like: Anthony Hoekema, J.K. Van Baalen, John Gerstner classify the Seventh-day Adventist Church as Protestant, mainstream, and conservative. In 1993, the Church was linked to ex-Seventh-day Adventist David Koresh and the Branch Davidian compound in Waco, Texas, a link that many consider unfair and unfortunate.
Adventists believe with other Christians( Roman Catholic, Orthodox, Protestants)in the Triune God—Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.

KDave
Moab, UT

HBO did a pretty good documentary on the Waco event. If you can find it, it is worth watching, then you can make up your own mind.

lost in DC
West Jordan, UT

KDave,
if Horribly Base and Obscene did a documentary on it, you know it was slanted and biased, intended to paint the picture Bill Maher's network wants you to believe.

Craig Clark
Boulder, CO

donn,

"Many Christian Scholars like: Anthony Hoekema, J.K. Van Baalen, John Gerstner classify the Seventh-day Adventist Church as Protestant, mainstream, and conservative. In 1993, the Church was linked to ex-Seventh-day Adventist David Koresh and the Branch Davidian compound in Waco, Texas, a link that many consider unfair and unfortunate."
______________________________

Seventh Day Adventism rose from the ashes of the Millerites of Joseph Smith’s time. Like the early LDS Church, it began as a religion of apocalyptic millennialism. Both churches have since grown to transcend those beginnings.

It’s no more fair to use Koresh and the Branch Dividians to assess current Adventism than it is to use Warren Jeffs’ FLDS as a measure of current Mormonism. But Koresh was a Seveth Day Adventist for a time and the Davidians which he joined also grew out of Adventism.

I know it. I Live it. I Love it.
Salt Lake City, UT

When speaking to someone claiming to speak with deity, we have to always keep that in mind. But to simply get "scholarly" advice isn't all that wise. Some 'scholars' lie to advance their agenda. I'd even argue that entire communities of scholars have pushed their agenda against the truth, whether they realized it or not.

Some "scholars" lie to fight the LDS Church, even when they've been proven wrong. It's never enough to look at someone's title, we must always look at their works and see if they work to do good or not. I'd trust a good person without an education before an educated man who has the wrong agenda in his hands.

A man could be an expert on religion, politics, money, law, health, or even explosives. It doesn't mean his advice is honest or good. It might seem like I'm picking a small point in this article apart, that's because I am. But it is in this small detail that so many people err and so many problems are caused.

Craig Clark
Boulder, CO

Picture a religious community that believes they’ve been blessed by God with knowledge of truths that the world finds odd. They attract news coverage that they think misrepresents their beliefs. It feels like persecution. They come to see the outside world as inhospitable to them. They instinctively react by becoming more insular, protective, distrustful, exclusive, and socially impenetrable. To the outside world, they seem menacing, a force to be feared. I’m describing the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints in the 1830s and 40s.

Tyler D
Meridian, ID

Can anyone explain why the Book of Revelations was even included in the Bible? Seems like this book, which many associate with end times, Armageddon and prophecy, is the smoking gun in all these cults-gone-bad scenarios.

Since virtually everything Jesus actually said was about the here and now (change your heart, love your neighbor, etc), I cannot think of a good reason why the Council of Nicaea would have included a book (one of many apocalyptic writings in circulation at that time) that was the 1st century equivalent of Star Wars – which is ironic considering most reputable scholars think the entire book was about the early Christian’s relation to Rome (i.e., persecutions, etc…).

So apparently it really is a story about a long time ago in a place far far away…

Craig Clark
Boulder, CO

Tyler D,

"Can anyone explain why the Book of Revelations was even included in the Bible?...."
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The Book of Revelation is located dead last in the New Testament because it was the final book to be accepted in the canon due to opposition to its inclusion by some bishops of the early church. With its violent and macabre imagery, it’s wildly out of temper with the rest of the New Testament canon. Thomas Jefferson called Revelation "the ravings of a madman."

I don’t share the view that Revelation prophecy’s events that are yet to happen. Some Christians believe it’s speaking directly of our times. David Koresh was one of them.

sharrona
layton, UT

@Tyler D,Can anyone explain why the Book of Revelations.

Above all, you must understand that in the last days scoffers will come, scoffing and following their own But the day of the Lord will come like a thief. The heavens will disappear with a roar; the elements will be destroyed by fire, and the earth and everything done in it will be laid bare. Since everything will be destroyed in this way, what kind of people ought you to be? You ought to live holy and godly lives as you look forward to the day of God and speed its coming.] That day will bring about the destruction of the heavens by fire, and the elements will melt in the heat. But in keeping with his promise we are looking forward to a new heaven and a new earth, where righteousness dwells.(2 Peter 3:9-13)

Tzadikim
Bakersfield, CA

Exactly what do you think inspired the events of the MMM in 1857?

Really and truly, you can't see any direct parallels to "non-mainstream" Mormonism, which promoted polygamy, polytheism, and pagan Masonic rituals? Then JS doubled-down on the 'God was man and man can become a God' in his King Follett sermon...

And what exactly were Joseph Smith, Jr's dying words? The Masonic brother's call, "Is there no help for the widow's son?" Not exactly the last mantra from a mainstream, Biblically-based leader...

John C. C.
Payson, UT

I love the insight of this article. All law enforcement agencies, our entire military, our entire diplomatic effort from the President down--all would be perform much better if they understood how other people think. No matter what you believe personally, it doesn't hurt you to see things from another person's perspective. In many cases we would find allies instead of enemies. If some group truly is dangerous, it would still help if we could avoid ham-fisted actions like some that now haunt our memories.

Even in our personal contacts with other cultures, are we aware of whom we might offend by:

-touching with the left hand?
-showing the soles of our shoes?
-speaking to the wife first?
-making direct eye contact?
-not making direct eye contact?
-not touching the person we talk to?
-touching a child on the head?
-taking a photo?
-calling a person by name?

A little information avoids unnecessary strife.

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