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Mormon Democrats announce new national, state organizations

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  • I-am-I South Jordan, UT
    April 9, 2013 10:48 a.m.

    I also think the all or nothing argument that has shown up in here is important. I think it is really unhealthy (as a country or specifically as LDS Church members) to become so aligned with political parties. Each situation is different. Each situation needs to have some measure of variability in how we approach its resolution. Aligning so strongly with parties limits our ability as a nation to resolve problems.

    Aside from it limiting our ability to solve problems it also makes us hate each other. From this hate stems some pretty outlandish stereotypes. If you don't believe me just read the comments on this article(some of them are pretty good though). God is not a republican, nor is he a democrat. He's also not a (*insert any other political affiliation or non-affiliation).

  • I-am-I South Jordan, UT
    April 9, 2013 9:53 a.m.

    What I don't understand is why it is that where the Church is crazy neutral on most political things why it is that a political group would come together and try to compromise that stance by associating their political group with the Church.

    I can understand how you people can jump to believing the teachings of Jesus Christ fall in line with the democratic party. I don't consider myself a republican but I prefer to associate with their political ideas. As conservatives we often overlook the fact that we tend to stifle personal liberties as well they just happen to be different personal liberties. Both sides of the political spectrum just tend to think their personal liberty stifling is justified.

    I share a common hate for all political parties. I really wish we could get rid of them. I also really wish organizations such as this one that try to associate with something that is not associated with them would go away.

  • LoveLife Riverton, UT
    April 9, 2013 12:44 a.m.

    Obama can say, “I think when you spread the wealth around, it’s good for everybody” and “I do think at a certain point you've made enough money”. He can win elections by promising other people’s money.

    Am I supposed to lie to myself and say that my money is going to a good cause when there is absolutely no evidence of that? This man who promised to fight for the poor with the money of “the rich” yet goes on $8 million vacations? Or I go to jail?

    I have done several things you mentioned. I now have less disposable income to contribute to political causes. Convenient, isn’t it?

    Elder Oaks (same talk): “We ought to focus on the legality or wisdom of a proposed restriction of our freedom.”

    So I still don’t take Elder Oaks’ words to mean we just lay down with a “good attitude” when government takes away our freedoms. I’ll keep fighting the good fight, but I will not leave my birth country whose Constitution protects my inalienable rights.

  • Truthseeker2 SAN LUIS OBISPO, CA
    April 8, 2013 3:40 p.m.

    Re:LoveLife

    You have choices. You simply don't like the consequences of all the choices. You could choose to not pay taxes, and risk being put in prison. You could choose to move to another country with a tax system more to your liking. You could choose to vote for different leaders. You can choose to become involved in fighting fraud. You could choose to become more involved with charitable organizations etc. Finally, you can choose to look at the issue differently.

    Every American pays for things they don't use or agree with. Childless couples pay taxes to educate children. Pacificists pay for the big military complex and the wars we wage--(one of the biggest sources of fraud and waste in our economy). The list goes on. We live in a democracy, are free to donate to political campaigns and exercise our choices via the ballot box.

  • LoveLife Riverton, UT
    April 8, 2013 12:30 p.m.

    Truthseeker, which best describes a “free agent” in sports?

    One who is free to decide which team he’d like to pursue and try out for?
    One who has been traded to another team, with no input, even if he likes the new team?

    Doctrine & Covenants 134:2 says “We believe that no government can exist in peace, except such laws are framed and held inviolate as will secure to each individual the free exercise of conscience, the right and control of property, and the protection of life.”

    How can I be judged on my works if I am forced to pay higher taxes for “welfare”, especially knowing that the money is being mishandled (i.e. green energy companies)?

    You want to exercise your free agency after you’ve given up your freedom. Your interpretation of Elder Oaks' talk could justify communism. I want to keep my freedom (complete with consequences and laws that preserve individual rights, as Elder Oaks said, “some government limitations) and exercise my free agency accordingly.

    Another good read would be Marion G. Romney “Is Socialism the United Order?” from April 1966.

  • Truthseeker2 SAN LUIS OBISPO, CA
    April 8, 2013 9:05 a.m.

    Re:Lovelife

    I recommend you read Dallin H. Oak, "Free Agency and Freedom" where he states;

    "First, because free agency is a God-given precondition to the purpose of mortal life, no person or organization can take away our free agency in mortality.

    Second, what can be taken away or reduced by the conditions of mortality is our freedom, the power to act upon our choices. Free agency is absolute, but in the circumstances of mortality freedom is always qualified.

    Freedom may be qualified or taken away (1) by physical laws, including the physical limitations with which we are born, (2) by our own action, and (3) by the action of others, including governments........Interferences with our freedom do not deprive us of our free agency. When Pharaoh put Joseph in prison, he restricted Joseph's freedom, but he did not take away his free agency. "

  • LoveLife Riverton, UT
    April 7, 2013 10:05 p.m.

    Truthseeker,

    I'm sorry, but you have a distorted view of "agency". The definition of agency is "the state of being in action or exerting power". I can't say I have agency if I don't have the power to give my own, hard-earned money freely to the charity or cause of my choice, no matter how hard I try to justify it. The government is taking enough of my income now that I am limited in my own personal cash donations. If I choose to be stingy and not give anything, then that is what I am judged on.

    Free agency is not a state of mind-either you are able to make your own choices or you are not. Just because you "agree" with the big government spending mentality doesn't mean I "choose" it, and I really can't convince myself otherwise like you can.

    Government wastes an exorbitant amount of money with a lot of fraud involved. Poverty, unemployment, food stamp use, etc. is very high. You should look into it. We are a welfare state.

  • Truthseeker SLO, CA
    April 7, 2013 4:05 p.m.

    Re:GreggWeber

    Agency gives us all the ability to choose our thoughts, attitudes, feelings no matter the circumstances in which we live.

    You live in a democracy and get to vote your conscience, though there may be policies and laws enacted which you don't agree with. Left or right, we all experience frustration when things don't go our way.

    You have the choice to view the taxes you pay designated to help the poor, elderly, disabled and children as forced charity.
    I choose differently. If the taxes i pay are used to feed a child, give an elderly or disabled person a measure of dignity it is well spent and i am glad for a system that requires everybody to "chip-in" because a totally volunteer system would result in much suffering and death. I also believe that paying taxes isn't enough--volunteer charity is essential as well.

    That said, we ought to remain vigilant to make sure our taxes are used for good purposes and not for fraudulent purposes.

  • Gregg Weber SEATTLE, WA
    April 7, 2013 1:46 p.m.

    There are Democrats in my ward (in Seattle) and I try to understand them, but can't. One said that he followed what King Benjamin said but I see a difference between individual charity and government enforced charity just as there is a difference between freely doing good and being forced to do good (so that none shall be lost). I won't say IMHO who wants the honor.

  • Claudio Springville, Ut
    April 7, 2013 12:03 p.m.

    Tahoe

    It is disingenuous to state that the Church instructed its members to vote on a specific issue in a particular way. If you are thinking of Prop 8, Elder Clayton of the Presidency of the 70, the leader specifically tasked with dealing with that issue, explicitly stated that members in CA should feel free to vote on the issue as they wish and would be temple-worthy, members in full fellowship regardless of how they voted.

  • Tahoemormon70 Bountiful, UT
    April 7, 2013 11:20 a.m.

    @Clifton Brown, So you came home off of your mission being as hard-core conservative as you probably ever were. Through your life's experiences, you slowly swung your personal pendulum over to the liberal(maybe, demo) side. Were those experiences due to a desire to be more like the Savior or where they because you didn't want seem affiliated with the typical conservative Republican member of the Church? Also, the Church in an official sense states political neutrality although when it comes to questions of moral matters, it will pick a side(same-sex attraction and marriage, abortion, cloning, etc...). Can you tell me, did your internal paradigm shift have anything to do with those matters that the Church has told its members to vote for or against? If yes, how can you reconcile personal choice with the Church's stance on socio-political issues? That is the thing I have with my mission president is, is yes, he does have his right to choose his political views, but being a liberal democrat, he can only venture so far before his views start to polarize greatly with that of the Church's.

  • Beaver Native Garland, UT
    April 7, 2013 10:12 a.m.

    There are conflicts with gospel principles within both parties. In my opinion, the Democratic party has gone way too far left on basic moral issues. The Republicans have gone too far to the right. I see distortions and downright lies from both parties. Therefore, I vote for the person based on his values, rather than the party's values. Most often, this has led me to vote Republican or third party, with three or four local and state-level Democrats over the last 35 years. Occasionally, I have written in a name when no acceptable candidate could be found.

    While it is probably true that more of the apostles are registered Republicans than registered Democrats, I know of a few in recent history that have been Democrats. President Faust was an example, proving that you can be a good member of the Church and a Democrat. The evidence indicates that party affiliation doesn't matter as much as whether or not you stand up for the things you value the most. Instead of condemning your fellowmen because of party affiliation, we should praise them for working within the party of their choice to change the party for the better.

  • one vote Salt Lake City, UT
    April 7, 2013 9:37 a.m.

    Can they escape extreme, dogmatic, emotional nineteen fifty based mentality? Can they turn off Hannity and Limbaugh?

  • 1aggie SALT LAKE CITY, UT
    April 6, 2013 11:05 p.m.

    "It would also contradict the intent and purpose of the Church, which acknowledges and protects the moral agency of each of God's children, President Uchtdorf added. "As disciples of Jesus Christ, we are united in our testimony of the restored gospel and our commitment to keep God's commandments. But we are diverse in our cultural, social and political preferences.""The Church thrives when members take advantage of this diversity and encourage each other to develop and use talents to strengthen one another, he said."

    @Krista Cook - See above. I hope you're paying attention to General Conference.

  • Truthseeker SLO, CA
    April 6, 2013 8:54 p.m.

    Well, I'm convinced after reading all the comments that to be Democrat and LDS is not compatible. I'll have to change one of them.

    DN promotes Republican candidates, stances and parties further bolstering the idea that the Republican platform aligns more closely with the LDS church.

    re:KristaCook

    Feedback to your blog

    Democrats believe in a strong military for defensive purposes.
    Democrats believe in personal responsibility recognizing that few people in life never need assistance from outside sources. Luck plays a large role in determining success in life.
    Democrats believe religion and charity, in addition to the govt. can and should play a role in providing/helping the disadvantaged. The Catholic Church, which does a tremendous amt of charity work, also believes govt. have a role to play in relieving suffering.

    Was King Benjamin talking about all taxes being evil OR was he talking about taxes that are imposed to personally enrich those in power as evil?

    Were the key words "lawyers and judges" or were the key words "unrighteous?" It seems you are suggesting a majority of lawyers and judges are unrighteous, hence the reason many donate to Democrats.

    Your conclusions reveal quite a leap of "reasoning."

  • Jens J SEATTLE, WA
    April 6, 2013 8:47 p.m.

    So LDS folk support the Republican Party because they think the Republican party shares their values?

    Really? I just don't think it's congruent with Mormon values to support a party that launched a war with bogus claims that Iraq possessed weapons of mass destruction. This ill-advised war has cost the U.S. over $800 billion dollars. Add the war that the Republicans started in Afghanistan, and you have war costs racking up to over $1.4 trillion.

    Remember too that Bill Clinton, a Democrat, gave the country a balanced budget. The Republicans took over, promptly cut taxes for the rich, started two wars and ran the economy into the ground. These are not Mormon values.

  • Iver Salt Lake City, UT
    April 6, 2013 5:01 p.m.

    You mean moderates, right?

  • HBZion Salt Lake City, UT
    April 6, 2013 2:03 p.m.

    I was raised to be a good member of the LDS church and democratic party. My grandparents and parents have shown me the way. I will continue in our independent and thoughtful traditions.

  • Clifton Brown Sequim, WA
    April 5, 2013 9:40 p.m.

    @Tahoemormon70: keep pondering and wrestling with that question...it might take a few years, but you might eventually have an earth-shattering revelation and realize that a lot of what you "knew" to be true is actually not true at all. You might have an experience or two that makes suddenly makes it all very clear to you how a mission president and patriarch can be a liberal as well. Even if you never come around to accepting his political beliefs, you might at least have a deeper appreciation for why good people can have significantly different points of view.

    I know of what I speak here. As a young return missionary, I was about as conservative as they came. But time and experience has changed my perspectives considerably and I now identify as a pretty liberal Democrat - a change that would have shocked me to my core had I known 20 years ago that this is where I would be today.

  • Tahoemormon70 Bountiful, UT
    April 5, 2013 9:17 p.m.

    This article has a lot of pomp and circumstance trying to gain support but it lacks credible evidence as to how the democratic party is good for Latter-day Saints and what LDS members can gain by being a part of its empty handed endeavors. When I was on my mission, I found out that my mission president was in fact a demo and my jaw just dropped and shattered into a gazillion pieces. I thought how can somebody who has been entrusted to be an example to missionaries and members subscribe to such liberal views that contradict church principles and doctrines? When he came home and became a stake patriarch, I again thought how can someone who dances with the political and oftentimes religious/spiritual adversary be entrusted to give members one of the most sacred blessings in their lives? He seems to agree in small amounts with conservative views but I wonder how willing to cross the line he remains.

  • kargirl Sacramento, CA
    April 5, 2013 7:38 p.m.

    I read that list and no one really knows who the General Authorities, their wives, or families, vote for, even if their voter affiliation is known. And, frankly, it is nobody's business. That's what is meant by a secret ballot. One may, if one wishes, share that information. But even declaring support for a candidate doesn't guarantee the actual vote, does it? For all we know, the entire Bush family voted for Ron Paul in '08, or maybe even for President Obama...or Alfred E. Newman! My point is, there is a place in time when an individual's contribution to democracy is truly personal. And none of yours, mine, or anyone's business.

  • sashabill Morgan Hill, CA
    April 5, 2013 7:03 p.m.

    With the majority of the world's Mormons now living outside the United States, it would be difficult, if not impossible, to make a uniform judgment as to where Mormons would (or should) fit into their respective political systems. I have my political and moral perspective (and reasons why I personally do not feel welcome in the Democratic Party). Nonetheless, I would not presume to make across-the-board political judgments for Mormons in Great Britain, India, Germany, Ukraine, the Congo, South Africa, Brazil, Japan, Indonesia, or New Caledonia. Being in the "hip pocket" of one political party in the US will not do us much good when it comes to going forth "boldly, nobly and independent," and witnessing for Christ and the Gospel in the far corners and reaches of the earth

  • JoeBlow Far East USA, SC
    April 5, 2013 6:29 p.m.

    Krista,

    You have obviously gone to great lengths to show that the LDS church leaders are not "democrats".

    Does that prove your point?

    From a religious standpoint, you may be obsessing with things that don't matter.

    Me? I think it is best to leave religion out of politics. And vice versa

  • kargirl Sacramento, CA
    April 5, 2013 6:20 p.m.

    PAC, if it seems to you that members of the church are being divided, it isn't the Democrats (or the Republicans, for that matter) who are doing it. It is the choice being made by the individuals themselves. It's called "agency". Now, the reason I choose the party I do is not because it "pushes" this or that thing certain belief groups don't like. It is that I, or you, do not have the right to tell others not of our faith or belief system what they should think is right or wrong. Nor can we say with certainty if certain things are or are not so, what will or will not be necessary in someone else's life, and who does or does not have the last word on what God does or doesn't want besides Him. Until we get a giant helping of humility in not only our leaders, but in the rest of us, there will be these unfortunate divisions. The parties are simply convenient scapegoats.

  • Starbug Alpine, UT
    April 5, 2013 6:05 p.m.

    Actually I did look at it, I wouldn't call it a scholarly analysis, at least not compared to others that I've read. There are a lot of statements in there that don't seem to be backed up. It is an opinion piece, it is broken into about ten different categories so it is easy to read. The LDS Church is a worldwide organization. There are members in countries that have a variety of different political systems. You can be an active faithful LDS person and be a Democrat at the same time. The Liberal perspective can be justified with scripture and doctrine as easily as the conservative perspective can be. You can easily find both on line on numerous blogs if you look. Also, to the commenter who said that the Democratic party is built on abortion, not true. Most LDS Dems view on the subject is the same as the LDS Church's. Late term, is only done in emergency situations, the SCOTUS ruled on this years ago. It is only done to save a life and even then it is still the Mother's choice. There are other choices btw, like adoption!

  • Jeff Temple City, CA
    April 5, 2013 5:58 p.m.

    I hold a PhD in literature and languages, am a registered Democrat, and am an active, believing Mormon.

    Principles of the Gospel exist in the party platforms of both major US parties. For those of us who have lived outside the United States for any amount of time, we understand that in the global sense, the US political parties have inconsequential differences between each other, and our adherence to them is more an expression of nuance than any serious philosophical differences. We also understand that principles of the Gospel exist in a vast array of political traditions throughout the world.

    I knew an elder on my mission who was from Europe. In a guarded, private conversation, he confessed that he was a member of the Socialist Party in his country, but he could never tell a Utah Republican that because the Utah Republican would have acted in a very un-Christian manner toward him.

    Let us, by all means, seek the nuance we're most comfortable with, and preserve our adherence to the Gospel even in the midst of political disagreements. Besides, political diversity is good for the Church, and politically diverse Mormons are good for their respective countries.

  • Krista Cook Marion, IN
    April 5, 2013 5:34 p.m.

    I checked my blog and the series has had no hits since I posted on this forum. So, none of you are criticizing my actual ideas.

    Since I wrote my blog the Salt Lake Tribune published an article in December 2012 entitled, "Top Mormon church posts dominated by registered Republicans."

    Here are some quotes:

    Eleven of the 15 apostles of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints — including LDS President Thomas S. Monson — are registered Republicans, according to public records obtained by The Salt Lake Tribune.

    The other four did not affiliate with any political party when they registered to vote and none of them voted in this year's Democratic primary. All 15 voted this November. . . .The four politically unaffiliated apostles are the governing First Presidency's second counselor, Dieter F. Uchtdorf; and David A. Bednar, Quentin L. Cook and D. Todd Christofferson, of the Quorum of Twelve Apostles...Uchtdorf — who was born in the Czech Republic and only recently became a U.S. citizen — did, however, register as a Republican to vote in the primary this year and then changed his registration back to unaffiliated.

  • Krista Cook Marion, IN
    April 5, 2013 5:12 p.m.

    It is evident to me that people making comments about my comment have not read my blog series. I've already addressed their points in my blog and won't address them in this forum.

    People claim to be of one party or another but when you analyze their ideology it is often different than the label they claim for themselves. This often results from family tradition.

    Looking at voting records of Mormon Democrats usually reveals they vote more Republican than most Republicans.

  • Starbug Alpine, UT
    April 5, 2013 4:56 p.m.

    Interesting Krista Cook, there are LDS Democrats in the leadership of the Church. Leadership on all levels including General Authorities, there always have been also. I think that the Lord knows that they are Democrats but still called them to serve in the highest offices of his Church. I guess that you know more about it then they do right?

    Just because your blog contains "reasoned analysis" and "no partisan, emotional rhetoric" doesn't mean that you are correct or not mistaken, or that you aren't writing with a specific agenda.

  • jmason San Diego, CA
    April 5, 2013 4:46 p.m.

    In the context of this article and comments, the following Hugh Nibley quote is interesting:

    "Nothing is easier than to identify one’s own favorite political...convictions with the gospel.... If my ideas are the true ones...to oppose them is to play the role of Satan. This is simply insisting that our way is God’s way, and therefore the only way. It is the height of impertinence." - Hugh Nibley

  • Rick2009 MESA, AZ
    April 5, 2013 4:44 p.m.

    Maybe its time we dump both parties since they are basically the same now.

  • jmason San Diego, CA
    April 5, 2013 4:39 p.m.

    Hi, Krista Cook,

    There are other people (Hugh Nibley, for example, a well know Democrat), just as qualified as you, who have looked at the question and come up with a different answer. My wife (though she is an artist and not a political scientist or anything like that) was born into a European socialist democracy, and would probably today identify as a socialist (she votes Dem). We sometimes return to her country or origin so she can get healthcare that is available to her there that is not here. She is mostly amused at the penchant of some of her LDS brothers and sisters who tell her it is not possible to be a Dem and good Mormon (She will usually say something like, "Well, I am proof you are wrong," and then smile). I say she is amused, but sometimes--for example, during the 2008 election--it was alarming to her.

  • Krista Cook Marion, IN
    April 5, 2013 4:26 p.m.

    As I explain in my blog series entitled, Why Mormons are Conservative Republicans, I do not think it is possible to be a Democrat and a Mormon in this day and age.

    I'm a 7th generation Utah Mormon, although I do not currently live in Utah. Also, I hold a Ph.D. in government and taught as a professor, in political science departments, for about ten years. (My health does not currently allow me to work full-time.)

    My blog series is a reasoned analysis. There is no partisan, emotional rhetoric in it. Just Google my name and blog title and you will find my series.

  • jmason San Diego, CA
    April 5, 2013 3:53 p.m.

    To LDS who challenge me with, "How do you reconcile being a Dem with being a Mormon also"...well, I generally do not answer. I might just as easily flip the question and turn it back on my interlocutor. But what would be the point? Of course, to any who are genuinely interested in dialogue and understanding, I am happy to open up with.

  • jmason San Diego, CA
    April 5, 2013 3:34 p.m.

    I'm active LDS, a temple rec holder, and I am a registered Dem. I accept that being a Democrat and a Mormon occasionally presents problems for a believer, but so does being a Republican and a Mormon (pre-emptive war, tax cuts for the rich, reverence for wealth, lack of charity for immigrants, etc., etc.).

    For me, it's not a question of which party aligns with the Gospel, because neither do. I would guess that both the Repub and Dem parties are an offense to God, and far from the Zion ideal. So for me, it's a question of which party is LESS offensive--to me, not to you. It's a choice between two evils. And for me--as a believing Mormon and descendant of Hyrum Smith on one side of my family, and pioneers and church leaders on the other--that party is the Democratic party. But I'm perfectly fine and happy that a majority of the people I sit with, say, in High Priests Group meeting on Sunday have come to a different conclusion. It's okay.

  • Liberal Ted Salt Lake City, UT
    April 5, 2013 3:30 p.m.

    It's offensive that they would use their religion label to push politics. Could you imagine the uproar, especially in Utah if LDS Republicans did the same thing. "I'm a Mormon and Republican" or "LDS Republican".

    Typical do as I say and not as I do.

  • Baccus0902 Leesburg, VA
    April 5, 2013 2:52 p.m.

    @ Redwing:

    You wrote;
    "Eternal life is far more important than winning some petty, temporal, political arguments."

    I agree 100 % with you. However, I say is not important (at least for me) to win or loose an argument. But being able to express yourself and learn from others how you/they perceive God in ourlife.

    The problem, from my point of view is that our religious and political lives don't need be inconsistents . Yet we see inconsistencies. I'm reminded of the words by John.
    1 john 4:20 "Whoever claims to love God yet hates a brother or sister is a liar. For whoever does not love their brother and sister, whom they have seen, cannot love God, whom they have not seen".

    When in our self righteouness we condemn other brothers or sisters because they don't live our same life style, or don't believe what we believe. We consider them not good LDS or whatever....it just shows how human and weak we are.

    If we are Democrats, Republicans,or whatever, we should be able to put that sectarianism notion aside for the well being of our country.

  • Nanook of the North Phoenix, AZ
    April 5, 2013 2:12 p.m.

    I'm actually very disappointed that so many Mormons in the western US (it isn't like this everywhere, honest!) are so automatically knee-jerk Republicans. For the last 30 years, the Republican party has been all about Mammon, not God; and when they DO invoke God on "moral issues" (which seem always only to be abortion and homosexuality, never, for example, the immorality of poverty), it's a God I don't want any part of. No, the Dems are far from perfect; but I wish Mormon Republicans would step back, and take a serious hard look at what elected Republicans have ACTUALLY DONE in the last decade or so. Like starting two wars and cutting taxes at the same time, which is now responsible for at least half of the US total debt. Like making it harder for people to vote. Like bringing in laws of dubious constitutionality that infringe on our freedoms (e.g. the PATRIOT Act). Honestly, that one Jon McNaughton painting should have shown W. holding the burning constitution, not Obama.

  • athena salt lake, UT
    April 5, 2013 1:46 p.m.

    Like many here I am no fan of today's GOP. However, after skimming many of the comments here from democrat mormons I am amazed at the powers of self delusion we humans possess. In the ward I grew up in we had a very sweet elderly sister of German decent. She spoke to us on a few occasions of her and her first husbands membership in the Nazi party and told us of how her husband was killed in action fighting for Germany. Mind you, they did not agree with rounding up Jews and murdering them. They never did that themselves. They just liked how Hitler was going to fix their economy and make them proud to be German again. That is what I see now here. "If your against abortion don't have one", or "I don't personally support gay marriage and abortion, but... " It seems to me that when you support and give power to people who will do these things it is as good as. What truly frightens me is that these statements are just a hop, skip and jump from "I was just following orders."

  • RedWings CLEARFIELD, UT
    April 5, 2013 1:24 p.m.

    @Rick for Truth:

    I pray for all people equally.

    We are all children of a loving Heavenly Father.

    Jesus Christ atoned for the sins of everyone.

  • RedWings CLEARFIELD, UT
    April 5, 2013 1:22 p.m.

    SouthernPalm:

    Thank you for your comments. I truly hope that our fellow brothers and sisters will read them with an open heart and mind.

    Republicanism does not equal Mormonism. Until we as Latter-Day Saints rise above the world and live as disciples of Christ in all we do, we will not be seen as a "light upon the hill".

    Eternal life is far more important than winning some petty, temporal, political arguments.

  • RedWings CLEARFIELD, UT
    April 5, 2013 1:18 p.m.

    Why I am not a Republican: materialism, greed, disregard for the poor, corruption, hypocrisy (no welfare for the poor but plenty for big business)

    Why I am not a Democrat: hatred of religion, moral relativism, "tolerance" only for those they agree with, destruction of moral values our country was founded on

    As a lifelong democrat, I cannot honestly call myself one anymore. My party has left me. But I cannot honestly align with the republicans either.

    Solution: Study the issues by looking at both sides, prayerfully vote my conscience based on the issues most important to me, and follow Christ (who does not affiliate with a political party either).....

  • Baccus0902 Leesburg, VA
    April 5, 2013 1:15 p.m.

    @ SouthernPalm

    Thank you for bringing some perspective into this debate.

    But I can assure you you that they started it :)

    Peace and love to all!!

  • Rick for Truth Provo, UT
    April 5, 2013 1:08 p.m.

    Dear SouthernPalm'

    I hope you can pray just as hard for those who support abortion, nationalized socialism of our health care, loss of the first and second amendments, and destruction of the financial stability of our nations with never increasing debt, immorality and debauchery..... and the list goes on and on and on ….

  • patriot Cedar Hills, UT
    April 5, 2013 1:05 p.m.

    You don't have to be a member of the GOP to be a Mormon but I honestly don't see how you could be a Democrat and be a Mormon seeing that the party platform is built on abortion - even late term abortion as well as homosexual marriage. If you find yourself not wanting to be a member of the GOP and you can't tolerate the out right anti Christian culture of the Democrat party then choose to be an Independent!!

  • SouthernPalm Birmingham, AL
    April 5, 2013 12:07 p.m.

    I am profoundly saddened by the realization who some of those who call themselves my brothers and sisters in Christ really are. Most of the comments above are by Mormon Republicans (although Democrats are certainly not immune) who are spewing such negativity and condemnation, standing in self-righteous judgment of fellow Saints who happen to support the other major political party in this country. I have a hard time believing that these comments are prompted and inspired by the Holy Spirit of Promise or that the One we serve would approve of the animosity and intolerance displayed by your claims. As an African American Mormon convert, I understand all too well why the Church is having such difficulty attracting and retaining minority converts--the challenge is harder when members vocally condemn and view as less worthy any brothers and sisters who do not share their Republican ideology. During election years I always feel like I need to stop coming to church until the election is over to avoid losing my respect for many of the brethren and my testimony that the Church is true. I certainly pray that nonmember friends don't hear this unChristianlike vitriol.

  • Nanook of the North Phoenix, AZ
    April 5, 2013 11:36 a.m.

    I'm left enough that even the Dems are too far right for me. But I'd rather vote Dem than GOP, because even though they are both beholden to the plutocrats and bigwigs who think they should be allowed to run the country just because they have more money than the rest of us, the Dems at least make an effort to make government help all Americans. Policies that the GOP has offered up and implemented seem designed only to help the rich, and to heck with everyone else. As for things like abortion and same-sex marriage, "banning" them doesn't work. Most people nowadays don't remember what things were like before Roe v. Wade. I'd rather women had safe legal abortions than unsafe illegal ones that killed and maimed them. And I'd rather gay and lesbian people were encouraged to have long-term monogamous relationships than for them to have more promiscuous lifestyles.

  • SethK Memphis, TN
    April 5, 2013 11:18 a.m.

    Never have I felt so marginalized and ashamed of our people. All that is we are missing is a rameumptom from which we can hurl our superior views towards those dreadful Democrats.

  • Baccus0902 Leesburg, VA
    April 5, 2013 10:54 a.m.

    @ SCfan
    clearfield, UT
    You wrote:
    "@ Baccus0902

    Gee, it's sure sad to hear you think that the two major political parties in this great country are both "evil". Maybe you should try somewhere else to live."

    Is that a broken record of limited minded conservatives?

    On the contrary my dear SCfan, Capitalism is inherently corrupted by greed, interest groups, etc. But it doesn't mean we shouldn't challenge the status quo. Actually, as a Christian I think is our obligation to be a light to the world and work for social justice.

    To live in another country? Is there any country where its political parties are not corrupt? In more or less degree wherever men look for power there is always corruption.

    Besides, I don't believe in running away. I believe in democracy and change. Therefore, I always try to do my part as a force for change.

    SCfan, as the nation moves to a more fair and equal society you may feel uncomfortable. Please don't leave. We always need an open discourse with a variety of ideas.

  • William Gronberg Payson, UT
    April 5, 2013 10:30 a.m.

    The honoring of Pol Pot and Mao are alleged to be a common idea that unite Democrats. This absurd assertion is found in the MOST popular post to this article. I will take the liberty of changing one word in the title of another DN article in the Friday Deseret News.

    Can the cycle of "ignorance" be broken?

  • Walt Nicholes Orem, UT
    April 5, 2013 10:20 a.m.

    I would really like to see a large number of LDS voters join the Democratic Party in Utah. Of course, it would create a shift in the local party values, and ultimately a schism between the true Democrats and the true LDS. The only way this could be beneficial to the Utah Democratic Party would be if many LDS joined the party and at the same time adopted the values of the state party leaders.

    It parallels the old expression: "You can take the boy out of the country, but you can't take the country out of the boy."

    In this case: You can take the LDS out of the Republican Party, but you can't take the Republican Party out of the LDS.

  • tesuji Cedar City, UT
    April 5, 2013 10:05 a.m.

    I have learned you have to have a balance. I voted for Bush both times, because I could not support gay marriage or abortion. What I got was 8 years of absolute disaster - huge debts, two terrible wars of questionable benefit, a Supreme Court that has made disastrous decisions, etc.

    Obamacare: Jesus said take care of the poor and needy. That doesn't mean you just give them a blank check. However, with one sixth of Americans without health care, and about the same number too poor to get all the food they need, you have to have balance. Obamacare will not be perfect, but we need to give it a try. Health insurance costs continue to rise - we need to get poor people out of emergency rooms and into much cheaper preventative care.

    Climate change. There is overwhelming evidence that we are causing climate change. Also destroying and polluting our planet. God said to be stewards of his earth, not to trash it and greedily exploit it. D&C 49:20: "But it is not given that one man should possess that which is above another, wherefore the world lieth in sin."

  • JoeBlow Far East USA, SC
    April 5, 2013 9:57 a.m.

    Dante,

    I agree that Harry Reid was pathetic in saying that he had a "source" that claims that Romney had not paid taxes in 10 years. Those types of bombshells should be backed up.

    But, keep your eyes open. You will find that sort of dishonesty almost daily on both sides of the political spectrum.

  • Dante Salt Lake City, UT
    April 5, 2013 9:49 a.m.

    I found Harry Reid's attacks on Mitt Romney (e.g., tax cheat) anything but honest or honorable.

  • JayTee Sandy, UT
    April 5, 2013 9:20 a.m.

    I just love it how people continue to equate forced confiscation of earnings and property, and subsequent redistribution by the government. Oh yeah, I remember the Savior advocating that the Roman government should pillage "the rich" and then redistribute all their goods to "the poor" so that people wouldn't have to be bothered with making voluntary choices themselves. Yeah, and he also advocated that all the civilized populations go out and absorb all other populations into theirs so they'd make sure those other peoples were cared for in the style to which they'd like to become accustomed. Uh huh. And the Tooth Fairy is asking the Easter Bunny to the spring ball this year.

  • tesuji Cedar City, UT
    April 5, 2013 9:05 a.m.

    I'm mostly a left-leaning Mormon, so I'm glad to see Utah politics may be getting more balance. It's dangerous when all you hear are the same ideas all the time, like being in an echo chamber. Especially when those ideas tend to be so extreme and so ideological, which is where I think the center of the Republican party is these days. I absolutely do not think God is a Republican - that's absurd.

    I hope, however, we can all move beyond political ideology, and start listening to each other and compromise to find practical solutions. That's how democracy works, and why it isn't working very well in America these days.

  • RFLASH Salt Lake City, UT
    April 5, 2013 8:33 a.m.

    I have a hard time swallowing the idea that the Republican party is the party of God. They always use abortion and gay rights as a way to bash anyone who dares belong to the Democratic Party. Being a Democrat does not mean that you automatically accept gay marriage or abortion. Some of us do believe, however, that this country should be a place where a person has a right to choose for himself or herself. As a gay person, I know what it can feel like being out of place and I think that sometimes a person who is a democrat is often treated the same way. that is why it is probably not a good idea to talk politics at church. I don't say a lot in my own family because it gets too heated. Seriously, we need both parties. It just wouldn't work with only one. I believe that there are good people and ideas on both sides. If Huntsman would have ran for President, i probably would have voted for him. Who says that I have to be one or the other

  • Truthseeker SLO, CA
    April 5, 2013 7:37 a.m.

    Re:Atwin

    The sad truth is that Congress members spend more time fundraising than in doing their jobs. Campaign financing has gotten way out of control. The functioning of the legislature has changed dramatically over the past 20 yrs. Legislators spend very little time legislating and debating the merits of bills.

    Democrats in Congress are open to changing campaign fundraising, instituting limits and more transparency. Republicans are not.

    Govt waste is a problem--front and center is the Dept of Defense whose accounts are in such disarray, it can't properly account for a trillion in spending. Where is the outrage from Republicans? Democrats?

  • Gail Fitches Layton, UT
    April 5, 2013 7:08 a.m.

    Our country has been taken over evil, i.e., by bankster thieves that own and control everything. Both parties have proven to be corrupt, if you keep track on how they vote. They look out for the big coporations and banksters, and not the people. These corporations that buy off most of our politicians are destroying our country, our health, and our environment. I hope some day people realize that both parties are ruled by the same globalist, and that lobbyist from these big corporations hold the highest paying jobs within our government, both Democratic and Republican positions. I am fed up with both political parties, because they do NOT look out for what is best for the people, and they buy into technologies that are destroying our health. I may be a registered Republican, but after doing some research, they are not any more prolife when it comes to allowing our foods, medications, water, etc., to be literally poisoned with ingredients that will destroy our health. If you are prolife, you would ensure the safety and the health of the people.

  • JoeBlow Far East USA, SC
    April 5, 2013 6:37 a.m.

    @A1994

    "Mormons believe in God. The Democrats had to vote THREE times at their convention to include 'God' in their platform."

    Cant one believe in God without having God in the party platform? There are plenty of people who
    believe that religion and government should be separated. Why does that make them bad?

    "Mormons believe in staying out of debt. The nation is $16 Trillion in debt and the Democrats want to spend even more."

    Hate to break it to you but Republicans have added significant amounts to our debt. Maybe more, or maybe less, but you would be hard pressed to show a huge disparity.

    "Mormons believe in the law of the harvest, you reap what you sow. The Democrats believe in redistribution of wealth."

    A good Fox news talking point but the GOP is just as apt to "redistribute the wealth"

    "Mormons believe in supporting the poor by voluntary donations to a well-run welfare program. "

    And that may work somewhat in utah. But I can assure you that voluntary donations do not cover everyone.

    If you take the blinders off, you will find that the parties are not that different in how they govern.

  • JoeBlow Far East USA, SC
    April 5, 2013 6:24 a.m.

    Why is it all or nothing?

    Cant one be fiscally conservative and socially moderate?

    Cant a good Republican think that the Iraq war was a huge mistake without being blackballed by the party?

    Cant someone believe that we need smaller government but that universal background checks are reasonable? Cant one believe that we need to cut spending while insuring that the poorest Americans have food and health care?

    I want two strong, reasonable political parties that act in good faith to enact legislation that is best for all.

    We need the parties to provide a check and balance to the extremes of the other party.

    There was a time when peoples party affiliation was driven by their ideology. More and more, peoples ideology is driven by their party.

    People have become so enamored with their party that they begin to accept every party ideology.

    I see good and bad in both parties. And I believe that the country is worse off when one party has complete control.

    I find that these ideas get me branded as a liberal.

  • doingmybest upland, CA
    April 4, 2013 11:42 p.m.

    I've been a lifelong democrat and a faithful member of the church since I was a teenager...served a mission, married in the temple, all my children have served missions...I have never found it hard to be an active democrat and a member of the church...I think the democratic party has more things in common with the teachings of Christ than what the republicans preach and practice...Yes, I don't agree with some of the platform of the democrats but I find even more objectionable behavior and intolerance in the republican party.
    Count me as LDS and a Democrat!

  • happy2bhere clearfield, UT
    April 4, 2013 11:02 p.m.

    @alt134

    Thanks for informing me that only 9% of my fellow Mormons are liberal. I was beginning to worry that a trend was beginning.

  • Lilljemalm Gilbert, AZ
    April 4, 2013 10:55 p.m.

    Though the Democratic party, especially on the national level, supports things contrary to LDS teachings, I have found that the Republican party to be equally as guilty. Outside of the LDS corridor of the mountain west, the tea party is very anti-mormon, even more so than the far left. And as for taxes, it's time to raise them on everyone. The bill has come due and we have to pay the debt off; raising taxes is required. To insist on not raising them is dishonest - we have to pay our bills.

  • SCfan clearfield, UT
    April 4, 2013 10:48 p.m.

    @ 2 many hats

    Agency can be taken away in more than one way. People get enslaved with too much government assistance giving them everything to live. That takes away peoples ambition to achieve and accomplish something in life. They become enslaved to the governments welfare state. The LDS Church knows this and has known it for a long time. That's why the LDS Church welfare program always expects something in return for assistance. The government programs only ask for the vote.

  • Truthseeker SLO, CA
    April 4, 2013 10:30 p.m.

    Re:JayTee

    Democrats believe we--as all Americans, citizens of the world, should take care to preserve and protect the earth. One would think that God believing Republicans would also think it important to preserve and protect the earth, hence the focus on energy conservation. CONSERVatives no?

    Democrats are not pro-abortion.

    The Democratic 2012 platform states:

    "Abortion is an intensely personal decision between a woman, her family, her doctor, and her clergy; there is no place for politicians or government to get in the way. We also recognize that health care and education help reduce the number of unintended pregnancies and thereby also reduce the need for abortions. We strongly and unequivocally support a woman's decision to have a child by providing affordable health care and ensuring the availability of and access to programs that help women during pregnancy and after the birth of a child, including caring adoption programs."

  • JayTee Sandy, UT
    April 4, 2013 9:55 p.m.

    The Democratic platform is becoming increasingly non-freedom of choice. They're pro-choice on only one thing: abortion. When it comes to energy, vehicles, light bulbs, toilets, guns, schools, etc., etc., they're definitely against any rights of the individual to choose. Their platform is basically, "We'll figure out what's best for you, and then we'll tell you what to do." It doesn't take a particularly observant person to see this. Yet they claim to be aligned with the principles of Christianity? Better go back and read the scriptures again.

  • ATwin RIVERSIDE, CA
    April 4, 2013 9:50 p.m.

    as a 30 year government official I can attest to the massive fraud and waste in government. I have earnestly tried to be a good steward with the $100 million budget that I oversee...sadly most ALL of the politicians I have worked with are simply obsessed with power and taking care of their friends. it is not about helping or serving the public good. it is time for good people to get involved or we will continue to be ruled by selfish fools.

  • namfan Layton, UT
    April 4, 2013 9:29 p.m.

    Last election I decided to abandon talking heads and to read each party platform. I went into this with an open mind. I wanted to see for myself if I could be a Democrat.

    I disagreed with almost every major tenet of the Democratic party platform.

  • Starbug Alpine, UT
    April 4, 2013 9:02 p.m.

    Anyone who genuinely wants to know how an LDS individual can be a Democrat, or a Liberal can go to a number of face book groups that are out there and find out. There are many LDS people who identify as Liberal and Democrat that you will find are more than willing to have a civil discussion where they will share with you why and how. I've met many and they are not only friendly they are quite well educated, well educated in general as well as in Church doctrine. IF you just want a fight, and to try to turn them away from their chosen political field then don't go there. But if you really wonder and just want to see the other side of the coin then that is a great place. In fact there are Republicans in some of those groups that just chose to support the President for re election, they aren't even Democrats. There are current General Authorities and past that are Democrats, so please don't ever say that you can't be a faithful member and be both, it is possible and many of us are!

  • A1994 Centerville, UT
    April 4, 2013 8:32 p.m.

    I don't love the GOP, but I can't understand why these people believe the Democratic party has anything to offer a member of the church. Here are just a few contradictions that I see:

    Mormons believe in God. The Democrats had to vote THREE times at their convention to include 'God' in their platform. And even then there was still doubt in the convention.

    Mormons believe in staying out of debt. The nation is $16 Trillion in debt and the Democrats want to spend even more.

    Mormons believe in the law of the harvest, you reap what you sow. The Democrats believe in redistribution of wealth.

    Mormons believe in supporting the poor by voluntary donations to a well-run welfare program. Democrats believe in supporting the poor by confiscating tax dollars and sending them to a horribly run, monstrous federal bureaucracy.

    The National Democratic party is an irreparably damaged brand for Mormons. I like Jim Matheson, but I don't like his friends. Please tell me how I would possibly reconcile this gap. I don't think it can be done.

  • fangflyer LAKE WALES, FL
    April 4, 2013 8:30 p.m.

    To state that one is a member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, and also a Democrat is to be a total hypocrite! To my limited knowledge, there is not one issue that the Democratic Party supports that is compliant with policies and standards found in The LDS Church. I imagine that in the population of The Book of Mormon, there were Gadiations who claimed to be members of the Church at that time.

  • NeilT Clearfield, UT
    April 4, 2013 7:55 p.m.

    I visited the ward I grew up in Logan. Someone attacked Obama in Sunday School. I did not vote for Obamaa, however I felt compelled to defend him. Big mistake. I thought some guy was coming across the room and assault me. In the singles ward I attend a lady brought up the petition to succeed. I said no way and she called Obama a Marxist. The concern I have is that many in the church have become uncivil. I ought to be able to attend church , support Democrats if I want to and feel safe. Right now I don't. Politics has become toxic. Many view Republicans as being anti-Obma and not stand for anything. That is one reason Mitt lost. Not all Dems support abortion, gay marriage or a socialist welfare state. I am not Dem, more of a moderate republican. Talk radio has to much influence on people. Start thinking for yourself and taking everything Beck and others say as gospel.

  • BYU Alum Cedar Hills, UT
    April 4, 2013 7:55 p.m.

    A life-long family of Democrats, we have all dumped the party for "Unaffiliated". The tail end of the bell curve has taken over the party. We are not socialists, never have been, and never will be. The present Democratic power structure and policies are damaging to the country.

  • JRJ Pocatello, ID
    April 4, 2013 7:25 p.m.

    I saw an interesting comment on the back of a car some years ago..."A GOOD Catholic cannot also be a GOOD Democrat" It struck me pretty forcibly as I think a GOOD Latter-day Saint also cannot be a GOOD Democrat for the exact same reason - the acceptance of abortion, socialized medicine, dependence on government, and gay marriage. The Lord has not told us to judge anyone, but to make a righteous judgment of ideas. I can see no bridge between the things I have listed and our pathway to heaven. How can you stand and defend the murders of 56,000,000 little children. And if you're going to ream me out about this, I will already admit the line between Demos and Republicans is very thin. It's time for us to look into our own lives and find the truth. If a politicians mouth is moving, he/she is probably lying. We are caught in the midst of evil.

  • wear2manyhatz Holladay, UT
    April 4, 2013 7:12 p.m.

    I am a proud LDS Democrat. I was a Democrat LONG before I joined the LDS Church. While some of the attitudes of some of the members do not coincide with my values and principles, it's important to remember that the Church was organized in a Socialist manner! Distinctly Democrat!

    As to questions such as women's rights; gay rights, etc...the LDS Church has the very best answer...

    AGENCY!

    I try to change the world by following Jesus' example. If all of us did, there would be no need for government intervention.

    Can't have it both ways, Republican friends...

  • SCfan clearfield, UT
    April 4, 2013 7:07 p.m.

    @ Baccus0902

    Gee, it's sure sad to hear you think that the two major political parties in this great country are both "evil". Maybe you should try somewhere else to live.

  • Baccus0902 Leesburg, VA
    April 4, 2013 6:46 p.m.

    It would be quite interesting to make a parallel between the teachings of the gospel and the political parties. I have done it and I move more and more to the left. To the point of not being able to understand how a sincere Christian can be a Republican.

    The Republican party and their obsession with attempting to force us to do what they think is right, instead of letting our free agency govern our lives, looks more and more like the plan of you know who.

    Democrats and Republicans are very close in their political and socio-economic agenda. If we wanted real difference we would have more political parties i.e. Communist, Socialist, Social Democrats, Libertarians, etc. etc.

    I declare myself a Democrat, not because I consider it the best party. But, because I think of it as the lesser of the two evil.

  • m.g. scott clearfield, UT
    April 4, 2013 6:44 p.m.

    Do you LDS Democrats want the Party to continue as it is going? Namely, going total secular huminist liberal? Or would you like to influence it to become more moderate like it used to be? I'd like to know before questioning your choice.

  • Starbug Alpine, UT
    April 4, 2013 6:37 p.m.

    I think that its a positive thing that LDS Dems are organizing and getting involved in the political process. In fact all LDS people should be glad that other LDS people are contributing. After reading the comments I realized how mis informed many are about LDS Dems. You can be an LDS Dem and you don't have to agree with every issue. In fact most LDS Dems view in abortion is the exact same as the LDS Church's official stance. On SS marriage it is a civil issue, LDS people have the proclamation and that doesn't change, even if ss people can unite under the law. If anything is strengthens our families as it causes us to teach tolerance and non judgement. Those two issues are always brought up when there are so MANY others. B4 you start judging LDS Dems find out how they really think, you might be surprised that you agree on more than you disagree on, I am sure that commenters will go off on what I've said. This disconnect, not finding any common ground is indicative of our current politics, find common ground and make compromises rather than just bicker!

  • CJS Sykesville, MD
    April 4, 2013 6:38 p.m.

    "Latter-day Saints as citizens are to seek out and then uphold leaders who will act with integrity and are wise, good, and honest. Principles compatible with the gospel may be found in various political parties."

    It's awesome how LDS Republicans assume this is said tongue in cheek, and that they know what the prophets REALLY mean when they say the church is politically neutral.

    TL;DR: I became a Mormon Democrat by serving a mission, attending BYU, and when I voted Democrat, they let me keep my temple recommend.

  • morganh Orem, Utah
    April 4, 2013 6:34 p.m.

    The LDS Church is against same-sex marriage, against abortion on demand, teaches their members to be self reliant and fiscally responsible. Our current administration supports same-sex marriage, and abortion on demand. They are not fiscally responsible since the Democratic Senate has not passed a budget in more than 4 years. Obama's version of self reliance is for the government to take care of you. All of this goes against my LDS beliefs, so I won't be switching to the Democratic Party anytime soon.

  • Rick for Truth Provo, UT
    April 4, 2013 6:37 p.m.

    Forget about the contrasting and polarizing issues of morality, sodomy, drugs, guns, freedom of religion, freedom of speech, or blaming conservatives of wanting dirty air or outright destruction of the environment, in the past 40 years, I cannot remember a single Democrat who ever sought, professed, accomplished, or even pursued a single real tax cut. I have a hard time finding a single occurrence of a real spending reduction. 17 Trillion in debt is an Obabanation beyond any belief to assume a fancy button or slogan could ever ever make me consider becoming a Democrat.

    There were two plans presented to God in the beginning, Obama's policies and actions mirrors the plan rejected by 1/3 of the hosts of heaven, the Democrat party appears to provide evidence for the hypothesis that some of them may have slipped through into this, the second estate.

  • RCS Orem, UT
    April 4, 2013 6:30 p.m.

    My hope is that their efforts can help radically reform the Democrat Party away from such radical positions as supporting abortion including late term and partial birth killing, same sex marriage, expanded government, spending out of control, and so on. Good luck. I'd say that those who voted for Obama can see what that has brought America (or perhaps they still can't see it).

  • CJS Sykesville, MD
    April 4, 2013 6:19 p.m.

    Its awesome that LDS Republicans append an imaginary asterisk every time the LDS Church emphasizes that it does not endorse political parties or candidates. The First Presidency says every election that "Latter-day Saints as citizens are to seek out and then uphold leaders who will act with integrity and are wise, good, and honest. Principles compatible with the gospel may be found in various political parties." LDS republicans seem to think this is said tongue in cheek and that Ol' Prez Monson elbows Eyring and they have a hearty laugh afterwards.

    Mormons are instructed to vote on issues and people. The democratic party is about more than abortion and gay marriage. Republicans are about more than tax cuts and big guns.

    TL;DR, I'm a Mormon Democrat and I still hold a temple recommend.

  • wYo8 Rock Springs, WY
    April 4, 2013 6:14 p.m.

    They should make dingy harry their honory leader. He can tell them how to lie and say anything to get elected. How to evolve with his principals by which way the political wind is blowing.

  • viejogeezer CARLSBAD, CA
    April 4, 2013 6:04 p.m.

    Why am I a Democrat? Because of the teachings of Isaiah, Jeremiah, Nephi, Mormon, King Benjamin, Moroni, Jesus, Joseph Smith, Brigham Young, John Taylor, Spencer Kimball, Bruce Mckonkie, Boyd Packer, Ezra Taft Benson, and James Faust.
    Why am I not a Republican? Because Republicans treat people who are black, brown,red, yellow, poor, female or disabled as somwhow less than they are.

  • Ophelia Bountiful, UT
    April 4, 2013 5:57 p.m.

    I'm an active LDS member and also a Democrat. The people I confide in most are also Democrats. We visit together, share ideas, and find comfort knowing we're not alone. However, I must agree, it's lonely and often downright depressing to be held in such low esteem amid Mormon congregations. I do believe, however, that there are more closeted Mormon Democrats than most realize.

    Regarding abortion and gay marriage, if you don't believe in abortion, don't have one. The Republican's platform of no abortion even in the cases of incest and rape is unconscionable. And if you don't believe in gay marriage, don't marry someone gay. Simple as that. Do we believe in free agency or not?

  • A voice of Reason Salt Lake City, UT
    April 4, 2013 5:35 p.m.

    All this focus on how much other members accept some member's political views is reminiscent of seeking the praise of men.

    We aren't judged by our political party, nor should it matter what other members think. The ONLY thing that matters is whether our political views are calculated to build up the Kingdom of God or not. I've learned that the more committed I am in keeping the commandments, the less I care about what people think of my doing so.

    Republican
    Democrat
    Conservative
    Liberal
    Etc, etc, etc...

    None of those mean very much. What's important is our willingness to follow our Lord and our prophets.

    Free exercize of religion
    Marriage
    Family

    While not popular, these things are the most fundamental for us to remain a free people yet so many members of the church are being lead away by false doctrines of the world. Why are people lead away? I suspect a great deal is because so many are concerned with how they are viewed. Well, isn't that what these organizations are all about?

    Start worrying about whether you're promoting the Lord's commandments, not whether it's accepted to do so!

  • Rick2009 MESA, AZ
    April 4, 2013 5:31 p.m.

    I don't vote republican nor do I vote democrat. Both parties leave much to be desired when it comes to gospel principles of following the constitution, being self reliant, less government intervention and electing righteous non communist leaders.

  • gee-en Salt Lake City, UT
    April 4, 2013 5:25 p.m.

    William Gronberg,

    You did not really specify what exactly you think is ignorant about whom, but reading between the lines I think you are confused why conservatives are upset at liberals for praising such "mass murderer" leaders. If you do some research, you will easily find many in the current administration that have indeed praised such "leaders" as Mao, having praised him in public and written glowing papers on him. Also, there are stories about a Christmas ornament on the white house tree with Mao's likeness...
    Exactly who is ignorant about what?

  • Wonder Provo, UT
    April 4, 2013 5:13 p.m.

    PAC -- you may not be aware of it, but there actually are LDS members who are currently Democrats. And as one, I for one, am tired of know-nothing members who try to impose their political beliefs on me by implying that the Republican Party is some holy, devinely inspired political party. The day the church publishes something that tells me I must become a member of the Republican Party (instead of their current statements that say there is good to be found in both political parties) will be the day I think you are something other than out to lunch.

  • bw00ds Tucson, AZ
    April 4, 2013 4:41 p.m.

    @FairchildIV I would issue a challenge to you to tell me how "an active mormon can agree 98% with democrats." If I could agree 98% with Democrats, then I should be a Democrat instead of a registered Republican. And I say "registered" Republican because I do not even agree with the Republicans 98% of the time, so how could I as an active Mormon possibly agree with the Democrats 98% of the time?

    I guess here's the (apparent) 2% that I don't agree with the Dems:

    *Gay marriage *abortion *controlling people's lives (does this ring a bell?) *taking away moral agency, like found in Obamacare (does this ring a bell?) *hostility to religion *more taxes *more regulations *gun control *name-calling *supporting and allying with dictators *cutting national defense *wanting open borders *welfare in all of its forms *etc. etc. etc.

    So please tell me, what exactly is the 98% of the Dems policies that I as an active Mormon agree with?

    BTW, I've asked the Utah LDS Dem caucus president to please tell me how their views align with the church's doctrine and how I as a faithful Mormon could join them. He never answered me.

  • William Gronberg Payson, UT
    April 4, 2013 4:43 p.m.

    I find it beyond comprehension that the most liked posting contains the following statement.

    " ..., honors (albeit quietly) Pol Pot, Mao Tse Tung and other mass murderers as somehow enlightened and worthy of our praise--..."

    The ignorance approaches infinity.

  • Web Geek Lehi, UT
    April 4, 2013 4:32 p.m.

    @FairchildIV,
    I listed fiscal concerns as well as social. Democrats haven't passed a budget in 4 years and Obamacare is the worst fiscal policy. I don't agree with democrats or republicans on immigration, I support the Utah Compact. But there are some issues that I cannot just turn a blind eye to - namely abortion, gay marriage, and gun control. If democrats really want me to join their party, then they have a long way to go.

  • Bridger Midway, UT
    April 4, 2013 4:29 p.m.

    FairchildIV- This issue is not about minor policy disagreements. The LDS faith views elective abortion (which accounts for 87-92% of abortions) as murder and an absolute moral wrong. Gay marriage for the LDS faith denies those caught up in its practice some of the most fundamental reasons why we live on this planet. Homosexuality deeply and eternally injures the practitioner and influences others to fall down the same rabbit hole. The Democrat war on religion (all over the nation religion is being pushed out of public discourse) stifles wholesome morals (yes a single-minded statement, but we're taking about one group's beliefs). Governance by force is again disharmonious to LDS doctrine ("teach them correct principles and let them govern themselves" is laughable to the Liberal mindset of complete regulation and forced tolerance/acceptance).

    Again, these are not minor policy disagreements. Liberalism, which has become synonymous with Democrat, is a whole philosophy that does not agree at its core with LDS doctrine or principle.

  • PAC Phoenix, AZ
    April 4, 2013 4:30 p.m.

    So now the Demo's want to try to divide the members of the church? Man these people can,t keep their hands out of anything. I for one am tired of it...

  • RG Buena Vista, VA
    April 4, 2013 4:17 p.m.

    Most Mormon democrats that I have talk with are dems because of dem's goals of giving govt money to the poor. Helping the poor is a noble goal. But the gospel doesn't ask govt to give money, it asks us to give. When the govt does things, it invariably involves fraud, waste, and abuse. And, govt antipoverty programs promote unwed parenthood, and have caused more damage to the family than almost anything else.

  • Counter Intelligence Salt Lake City, UT
    April 4, 2013 4:15 p.m.

    I am not LDS

    I used to be registered as a Democrat and traditionally would vote pretty split party
    Yet, whatever flaws the Republican may have; The Democratic Party has completely alienated me with their extremism and intolerance and just plain weird passive/aggressive “I am tolerant because I hate for all the fashionable reasons” vibe.

    I don’t see how anyone can be a good Mormon and Democrat - but that’s merely because I don’t see why anyone at all would be a Democrat as the party is currently constituted.

    Maybe if they dump Reid, Pelosi, Obama, Boxer, Waters, Schumer, etc and tell Matthews, Maddow and O'Donnell to go away - I will re-consider: But I suspect ice-skating in Hades will happen first

  • atl134 Salt Lake City, UT
    April 4, 2013 4:06 p.m.

    @utcyclist
    "I question whether many Democrats would really embrace Mormons into their party."

    Harry Reid? Tom Udall? Jon Huntsman Jr.? Democrats are fine with Mormons as long as they aren't trying to impose their religious rules on others (with regards to things like abortion, or same-sex marriage). Their skepticism of LDS candidates that they aren't familiar with is based on concern about that type of matter and the fact that statistically the LDS church is 9% liberal based on a gallup poll, the lowest of any faith in America, so they sorta assume an LDS candidate they don't know much about is either conservative or a bluedog.

  • sashabill Morgan Hill, CA
    April 4, 2013 3:58 p.m.

    I have been LDS for 40-plus years and an active Republican for longer than that. I have never presumed, however, to tell anybody which party they must (or must not) belong to in order to be an LDS Church member. Incidentally, the conservative, Republican "group think" which I have observed among Mormons is not any worse than the liberal Democratic group think which I encountered previously among Unitarians.

  • andyjaggy American Fork, UT
    April 4, 2013 3:49 p.m.

    I'm a Mormon and a registered Democrat, I know that's an extremely rare thing around here. I don't like everything about the Democratic party, but overall I shared more beliefs with it than I did the Republican party. Truth be told that actually makes me an independent more than anything, my political beliefs range all over the place, but I chose to register as a Democrat so that I could be more involved. It could very well change in the future as the political parties continue to flux and transition. If the Republican party chooses to change a few key things (which I won't go into here) I would consider going back, until then I am lost in political no mans land.

  • FairchildIV Salt Lake City, UT
    April 4, 2013 3:45 p.m.

    Come on people, just because you consider yourself democrat or republican doesn't mean you have to agree 100% with everything on that party's platform. You can agree with democrats on immigration and fiscal policy yet disagree on social issues such as abortion and gay marriage and still consider yourself a democrat. Why does everyone assume that all democrats are pro abortion or support same sex marriage? There are thousands of issues on which the political parties differ, yet we always boil it down to these two. An active mormon can agree 98% with democrats without supporting full fledged gay marriage or abortion.

  • jeanie orem, UT
    April 4, 2013 3:34 p.m.

    The Republicans seem to feel the need to be more "inclusive" and are trying to figure out what that means. Maybe the Democrate party would attract more Mormons if the party's platform were more inclusive of the general LDS values, like other posters have listed.

    Hey, maybe if both parties became perfectly inclusive of everyone they could implode, standing for nothing, or rather both standing for everything at the same time, making them irrelevant - which seems to be the direction they are headed anyway.

    In the end we vote for the individual that best represents our views. It really doesn't matter what party we belong to.

  • Buzzards LEHI, UT
    April 4, 2013 3:26 p.m.

    Well, if we can have Log Cabin Republicans, I suppose we can allow for Mormon Democrats. Big tent and all that, you know...

  • carabaoU Moab, UT
    April 4, 2013 3:14 p.m.

    I almost became a Democract 5 years ago. After Obama became elected and they passed that health care act, I quickly realized that party is not for me. I don't like any other party, so I am an independent.

    My ideals are these:

    Small government
    No taxes (ok, maybe a small amount for certain things like DEFENSE)
    All moral issues are decided by the churches you attend.

  • The Rock Federal Way, WA
    April 4, 2013 3:02 p.m.

    LDS = Liberal Deficiency Syndrome

    I have no idea how a person could follow the precepts of the modern Democrat party and abide by the teachings of the LDS church.

    D&C 42:42 ..."The Idler shall not eat the bread nor wear the garments of the laborer..."
    Abortion
    Same sex marriage

    The church teaches to avoid debt. Democrats can't seem to speed fast enough.
    "Thou Shalt Not Steel" But Democrats just vote for a government official to do it for them.
    The Constitution is inspired by God. To Democrats it is a "living document", which is one way of saying that it does not mean what it says, it means anything I can twist it into meaning; which means it is meaningless.

    I could go on and on and on. LDS and Democrat are mutually exclusive terms.

  • toosmartforyou Farmington, UT
    April 4, 2013 3:04 p.m.

    Where are they going to meet---in someone's home while the other party meets at the high school? They'll have better luck on a national scale than a local one.

  • utcyclist Draper, UT
    April 4, 2013 2:43 p.m.

    In addition to issues like abortion and gay marriage that contradict LDS doctrine, there is also a palpable hostility toward Mormons and religion in general by many core Democrats. I question whether many Democrats would really embrace Mormons into their party.

  • Go 273 river miles Draper, UT
    April 4, 2013 2:37 p.m.

    This is great! All 10 of us can get together and meet in someone's living room. Maybe Harry Ried can come and give a talk. I'll bring Rice Crispy marshmellow treats.

  • Web Geek Lehi, UT
    April 4, 2013 2:21 p.m.

    Why I'm not a democrat:
    -Abortion
    -Gay Marriage
    -Gun Control
    -Higher Taxes (or what Obama calls "fair share")
    -Obamacare
    -No budget in 4 years

    As long as democrats continue to push for those issues, I will never be a democrat.

  • Stgeorgebyu St. Georg, UT
    April 4, 2013 2:20 p.m.

    That about sums up the problem with politics, and society in general. LABELS! Why does anyone have to be a label. It boxes you in and does not allow you to be something rather then someone. If we were just people who really cared, we would take care of the pore and needy around us. We would love our neighbor as ourselves. Label only divide a society and we worry to much what someone is rather then who they are.

  • Bridger Midway, UT
    April 4, 2013 2:19 p.m.

    I support everyone's right to believe what they will, but I'm having a difficult time swallowing "the Democrat party's principles are in line with LDS doctrine" claim. I'm not a big fan of the Republican party, but to suggest to LDS's that the party that has pushed abortion and gay marriage, pushed religion into the shadows in favor of secularism and atheism, proposed dependency on the federal government (in lieu of offering a hand up, not a hand-out), constantly seeks to curb individual liberties in favor of government absolutism, produced Jim Crow throughout the South, honors (albeit quietly) Pol Pot, Mao Tse Tung and other mass murderers as somehow enlightened and worthy of our praise-- I just can't buy it.

    Again, I'm not saying the Republicans epitomize LDS values, but to sell the Democrat Party as a viable alternative... really? Try Independent, Libertarian (though there are problems there as well) or another alternative that allows you to get at the cream without swallowing a bucket of manure along with it.

  • Shimlau SAINT GEORGE, UT
    April 4, 2013 2:04 p.m.

    oh yes, i forgot 'good'.

  • Shimlau SAINT GEORGE, UT
    April 4, 2013 2:07 p.m.

    This is encouraging, and I like the last line, something like honest and wise. BOTH parties need that kind of influence.

  • Chris B Salt Lake City, UT
    April 4, 2013 1:22 p.m.

    and I'm a Proud Non Mormon and Proud Conservative