Spin Machine:"What is Utah's record against ranked bowl
opponents, especially Top 15 bowl opponents?"Against ranked
opponents Utah is 3-2 (.600). Against Top-15, we are 1-2 (.333).Meanwhile, the Indy-WACers are 2-13-1 (.125) vs. ranked bowl opponents, and
0-9-1 (.000) vs. the Top-15.So either way...Edge: Utah.Looks like you shouldn't have went there.
@Beck to HarlineUp on the hill...ya,it's been rough...for the
@ekuteYes, come to think of it, the process does apply to the Utes.
It has been rough up on the hill these past few years. Hopefully that will be
short-lived, that way when the rivalry starts up again, both teams have
something to play for more than the Beehive Boot.Clearly, I'm
trying to convince all the Utah fans on this article that independence
wasn't a mistake...obviously UCONN is no Fresno State or Michigan, but you
can't dismiss them as an irrelevant mid-major WAC-esque team that just
happens to be in a BCS conference. Where does a ring begin? The
chicken or the egg? Who's to say one way or the other. That's
irrelevant in this discussion. Keep holiness out of the Holy War...Finally- I'm not spinning any stats or numbers..because there are
obviously stats that favor each side. Head-to-head, stats overwhelmingly favor
the U. Nationally, stats overwhelmingly favor the Y. Just how it is.When one doesn't have a legitimate argument, one resorts to bashing the
opposition's credibility. Please try to avoid this...
The Utah Utes have played in 17 officially NCAA sanctioned bowl games...against mostly mediocre, unranked teams.Which is why so few
of Utah's 13 bowl winning teams finished in the Top 25 - including only 3
of 7 for Kyle.What is Utah's record against ranked bowl
opponents, especially Top 15 bowl opponents?What percentage of Utah
bowl winners finished in the Top 25?
A great pick up schedule wise. UConn is on the rise as a program and we see more
of them every season. Congrats Coogs.
Of Note....In addition to UTAH, BSU and TCU all having played in multiple BCS
Bowl Games, what also magnifies byu's inability to ever produce on the
level such an honor requires, is that Hawaii and Northern Illinois have proven
themselves to be significantly more capable than their fellow non-BCS member,
byu, in doing precisely this, consequently earning the right to play on the
national stage in a BCS Bowl Game.Playing in bowl games is a great
subject to discuss....Thanks to the byu fans above.
"The Utah Utes have played in 17 officially NCAA sanctioned bowl games.
Their 13-4 record gives them a winning percentage of .765, which is the highest
in the Football Bowl Subdivision among teams with at least ten bowl
It's interesting to see byu fans referencing UTAH's first missed bowl
game since '02.Here's what's actually occurred during
this current BCS Era, spanning 15 years from '98-Current--Bowl
Games played in: Both with 11Bowl Game record: byu is 6-5 and UTAH
is 10-1BCS Bowl Game record....byu is 0-0 UTAH is 2-0All-time bowl game record....byu is 13-17-1 UTAH is 13-4
@WON84Please see my response above to @Jealous U. What makes it a
byu comment section? It's an article about byu followed by an open forum.
We troll each others articles. Reasons obvious. Like I said...luck
to the Y...but...I Still Stand By All My Comments. As Always,Go
ekute, I'm not sure who's desperately trying to convince when it is
Ute fans on a BYU comment section?
@Jealous UWe could go around and around forever.In the long
run...I'll always be interested in byu athletics. Reasons obvious. My
concerns about their future as an independent are real. Good Luck...and Go Utes.
2011 #25/#26/#34 BYU(10-3) > unranked/#39 Utah(8-5)2012 unranked/#26
BYU(8-5) bowl winner > unranked/#61 Utah(5-7) no bowlNo spinning
needed; the end results/rankings say it all.Go Cougs!
mussingaround:"Without that expansion, it's guaranteed, the
PAC will be on the outside looking in at many championship playoffs."Uh..."guaranteed"? What a 'feel good' frantic and
emotional thing to say. The Pac-12's inevitable access to the new playoff
system has seriously effected you. I can see that you're in a lot of pain
right now. You know full well that even IF Utah and/or the Pac-12's access
to the playoff IS limited, it's still a far greater access point than what
your mid-majorness will afford you. You're also most likely
very aware of the fact that with schools like USC and "Phil Knight U" in
the conference, the Pac-12 will be well represented. Haha! You may wipe your
@Beck to Harline"It's a process not an instant
transformation" Does that not apply to the Utes and the Pac12? "Don't pretend that PAC 12 = more relevant. Not true.Finally, to say that BYU's independence was a mistake is simply
unfounded"Who are you trying to convince?Who called out
who first? who's doing the name calling? Who's spinning the stats and
numbers? I stand by all my comments. Go Utes
@ekuteU've got two different arguments going on. One of
national relevance, and two, of head-to-head domination. Yes, Utah owns
the head-to-head series with BYU (in football), and even more so the past few
years, despite a few extremely close games. Attribute these wins to recruiting
advantages, the participation award U (somehow) get for being in the prestigious
PAC 12, or whatever U want. Congratulations- head-to-head, U have had a huge
edge over the past 10 years. I concede defeat. It would be ignorant and naive to
say that BYU is better than Utah (HEAD-TO-HEAD). However, national
relevance is an entirely different discussion. U've seen all the rankings
from national sources. I need not remind U of the difference between 54-10 (one
game) and the final poll rankings (whole season). Don't pretend that PAC 12
= more relevant. Not true. Finally, to say that BYU's independence
was a mistake is simply unfounded. The teams BYU has filling their schedules out
for the next 10+ years look promising so far. Far more promising than before.
Less WAC's every year. It's a process not an instant transformation.
Allow it. Go Cougs!
@Snack PACGo back to the first page off the comments. Who's
fans start calling out Utah and the Pac12 by name? Every time a BYU article as
mundane as the announcement of a future BYU opponent you guys immediately start
comparing it to Utah and the PAC12. Why?...you're desperately trying to
convince yourselves that going independent was not a mistake. 5 pages of
spinning stats and numbers trying to convince yourselves that byu is a better
program than who? Utah. So I stand by my comment that "Utah owns you on the
field". The Utes and their fans are secure and delighted with their position
in the Pac12. Tis the byu fans who are jealous and insecure. Worried???
ekuteNo need to try convince ourselves that going Independent
wasn't a mistake. Every time a BYU article as mundane as the
announcement of a future BYU opponent is inundated with jealous sniping from the
hill crowd, it's further confirmation of just how jealous you are that BYU
is proving to be more successful as an Independent than you've been as a
big boy conference tag-along.
@TrueBlueNationally fans see Utah kickin' byu's butt every
year and playing in a prestigious major conference. Your stats and
numbers do prove that you're desperately trying to convince yourselves that
going independent was not a mistake.
ekute"Your stats and numbers don't change the fact the Utes
own you on the field."Actually, the stats prove that despite the
one-game successes the Utes have had during the Bronco/Kyle era, BYU has owned U
in overall success - more Top 25 finishes, more Top 15 finishes, more conference
championships, more bowl games, more total wins, and no ugly losses to 10-loss
teams.Nationally, fans see BYU playing teams from throughout the
country and finishing in the Top 25, and Utah playing west coast teams and
finishing in the conference basement.
@ SLCWatchHow do you know what my interests are? I actually do have
an interest in BYU based on the fact that I am interested in local sports and
because have friends and family who attend school/play there. I am not allowed
to post on a public forum just because BYU isn't my team? My opinions are
not invalid just because I see things from a different perspective.I'm sure you'll have fun traveling. You'll have the best
experiences in South Bend and Camp Randall, imo.I think you might be
flattering yourself a little bit towards the end of your post. Most of the old
WAC schools see BYU as a rival due to the history. I guarantee you that MTSU
and GT do not see BYU as a rival.
Why is naval vet still so obsessed with "bcs" bowls? The
playoffs will supersede the "bcs" championship in 2014 and the old
"bcs" bowls will revert back to being well-paid football vacations, but
completely meaningless as far as the national championship picture is concerned.
When the playoffs expand to 8 teams, inevitable, most of the
"bcs" bowl winners won't even finish in the Top 10.With
proposals already being introduced to tie bowl payouts to bowl attendance, the
payouts for future "bcs" bowls could shrink dramatically.In
other words, "bcs" bowls will generate much less money and even less
prestige.The most important non-playing day in college football will
no longer be national LOI signing day, but national college football playoff
byu fans,Your stats and numbers don't change the fact the Utes own
you on the field. Your stats and numbers do prove that you're desperately
trying to convince yourselves that going independent was not a mistake.
@naval"Any team in the Pac-12 and BigTen IS in the mix for a
Rose Bowl."Being in the mix doesn't mean anything until you
actually get there; Arizona has been waiting since 1979 and still hasn't
made it to the Rose Bowl.Controlling the Rose Bowl is
M-E-A-N-I-N-G-L-E-S-S when it comes to the playoffs.The only thing
the PAC can do is use its limited influence to have the playoffs expanded to 8
teams as soon as possible to give the PAC a better chance of having a regular
berth in the playoffs. Without that expansion, it's guaranteed, the PAC
will be on the outside looking in at many championship playoffs.
MUSSing with U:Any team in the Pac-12 and BigTen IS in the mix for a
Rose Bowl. Period. Nevermind the fact that I never said "Utah will be
playing in the Rose Bowl." I said, "Don't forget that the Pac-12
(and the BigTen) are keeping the Rose Bowl. That's a lot of
leverage."You're mid-majors forever. I can't say I
know what that feels like, but it must hurt really bad.
navelvet"If "conference champion" becomes
mandatory..."You can stop right there because the SEC will NEVER
go along with "conference champion" being mandatory, and without the
SEC's participation, there's no point in even having a playoff.As TheSportsAuthority said:BCS bowls are destined to become
nothing more than the new NIT - a nice place to spend the post season when
you're not good enough to be invited to the playoff.A team that
has never beaten a single conference foe with a winning record has no business
even talking about playing in the Rose Bowl, let alone thinking that
they're "in the mix" for a possible playoff berth.
TheSportsAuthority:"...it's very likely that until the
field is expanded to 8 teams, the PAC 10.2 could be shut out of the playoffs
more often than not."What a frantic and emotional thing to say.
At present, there is no agreement on the criteria for who would play in those
games. If "conference champion" becomes mandatory, the Pac-12 is in.
Don't forget that the Pac-12 (and the BigTen) are keeping the Rose Bowl.
That's a lot of leverage.The cougars have zero leverage.
skywalker:"Michigan 1984 would have cleaned Pittsburgh
2004's clock, and that's not just hyperbole!"Actually,
that was. You provided no evidence to support a 6-6 Michigan team down to
playing their 4th string QB would have dropped the '04 Panthers. How
frantic and emotional of you.
skywalker"BYU 1984 didn't beat a ranked team, but they
didn't beat a Top 25 team, #24 Air Force."Probably just a
typo.BYU 1984 didn't beat a ranked team, but they DID beat a
Top 25 team, #24 Air Force.Air Force was a very good team; the
Falcons STOMPED Va Tech in the 1984 Independence Bowl.
navelvetIronically, Utah, as a member of the PAC 10.2, is no closer
to qualifying for the new Big Dance (the major college football national
championship playoff), than Independent BYU.In fact, it's very
likely that until the field is expanded to 8 teams, the PAC 10.2 could be shut
out of the playoffs more often than not.Two SEC teams, a B1G, a Big
12, an ACC, and/or a Notre Dame or other conference or Independent team, could
easily occupy the four available berths, leaving the PAC 10.2 on the outside
looking in.There's no guarantee that Utah would be invited to
the new Big Dance, even with a PAC 10.2 championship.BCS bowls will
become nothing more than the new NIT - a nice place to spend the post season
when you're not good enough to be invited to the Big Dance.
Lightening Lad:"There is no reason why BYU can't pull a
Notre Dame-ACC tie-in for entry into the new BCS bowls, using the former Big
East teams."Actually there is. For one, Notre Dame is a
relevant school that relevant conferences would like to align themselves with.
The cougars are not. Secondly, after the BCS' final season (2013), the Big
[L]East will be demoted down to the "mid-major" ranks. Sportswriters
are already dubbing the "Big Five" as the 5 conferences outside who will
be on the outside looking in. And those 5 conferences are the MWC, C-USA, MAC,
Sun Belt, and Big East. The MWC won't take you, but C-USA
might. And if C-USA would, that would make more sense than aligning yourself
with another mid-major conference like the Big East with even worse travel.
2ferObviously, BYU CAN beat Utah - they've done so 3 of the
last 7 times the two teams have met.It's funny how uptight Utah
fans get when their own arguments are used to contradict them.
Uteology"The '84 team is the least deserving NC in the
history of college football, one can argue your '83 team was
better."Better isn't the criteria; earning the respect of
the voters is the criteria.BYU 1984 was selected by the majority of
voters by all five major college football national championship selecting
organizations as being THE MOST DESERVING team to be awarded the 1984 Major
College Football National Championship.BYU 1984 didn't beat a
ranked team, but they didn't beat a Top 25 team, #24 Air Force.Utah 2004 only beat #25 Pittsburgh and Utah fans still claim that Utah
deserved to be the 2004 national champion.Despite the records, the
Michigan team that BYU played in the 1984 Holiday Bowl was BETTER than the
Pittsburgh team Utah played in the Fiesta Bowl.Michigan 1984 would
have cleaned Pittsburgh 2004's clock, and that's not just hyperbole!
@TwoforOf course you didn't have mean spirited comments to
make. You came on to an article totally unrelated to any of your interests only
to enlighten the darkened masses who don't know better. I am glad you took
the time to set us right on what you percieved were our short comings. Perhaps
you were unware that there already is a whole slew of diligent writers who lurk
on their computers for every article so they can shed light on our unenlightened
natures.I will however continue to be happy in my benighted darkness to
travel around the country enjoying our trivial pursuits with fans of other
schools who for the most part welcome visitors as guests.I will look
forward to the Y's games with people who enjoy the sport no the hate.I will continue to enjoy each season's growth and challenges too.I
will enjoy the fall weather of Conn. I will be welcomed at Notre Dame,
Wisconsin, West Virginia and other unvisited places.I enjoy that everyone
that plays the Y thinks they are a rival.Everyone wants to face the
schools that have traditional programs.Thats why ESPN came calling?
@ Riddles in the DarkThere was never a "narrow loss"
argument. His point was whether or not Utah can beat Utah St. Obviously Utah
can. Even the numbers you provided prove that. Try to keep up.
There is no reason why BYU can't pull a Notre Dame-ACC tie-in for entry
into the new BCS bowls, using the former Big East teams.. After botching any
chance to gain membership in the B12, this might do good things for both the
Aloha League (best new name for the former Big East football "powers",
as in a greeting for Welcome as well as saying Goodbye)
@Rockwell: "SOS and records are already calculated into rankings, as seen in
Sagarin's final 2012 rankings."2-3 vs PAC-12 teams4-6
vs BCS teams5-14 vs teams with winning recordUnder Bronco 12-13 vs
BCS teams14-1 vs others@Y's little brother: "Saying
that BYU didn't beat any Top 25 teams in 1984 is a lie."True, so lets try again:"BYU's title was notable for
being the only time since the inception of the AP poll that a team was awarded
the national title without beating" a SINGLE final ranked team. Even Utah's #5 2004 team beat a ranked team, see AP #25 Pitt. Also, that
2004 Ute team didn't struggle like the 1984 BYU team. The '84 team is
the least deserving NC in the history of college football, one can argue your
'83 team was better.
navelvet"Utah had only lost to the Aggies ONE TIME since 1998.
That's about the same number of losses to USU [that BYU] had, only YOUR
loss was a blow out loss, whereas ours was a narrow OT loss."It's laughable that U don't apply that same "narrow loss"
argument to:2003 BYU 0 Utah 32005 BYU 34 Utah 41 (OT)2010 BYU 16 Utah 172012 BYU 21 Utah 24FOUR of Utah's 8
wins in that 8-of-11 Utah fans are constantly beating their chests about are of
the "narrow loss" variety.------2010 was
BYU's ONLY loss to Utah State since 1993. BYU is 22-2 versus
the Aggies since 1982. Utah is 19-5 versus the Aggies since 1982,
including that 7-point loss to a team BYU beat in 2012.------The fundamental flaw in your BYU-recruiting obsession:U only
play BYU TWICE in the next four years. U play PAC 10.2 teams 36
times.According to ESPN, UCLA, USC, Wash, Ore, Cal, Ariz, Stan, ASU
and OSU all had BETTER recruiting classes than U in 2013. How do you expect to
compete in PAC if U finish 10th in recruiting?
Naval VetIt's funny how your little in-house UteZone rating
service gives 4 stars to every Utah recruit, while Scout ranks many of them much
lower.K. York - 2 stars C. Poutasi - 4 starsL. Heimuli -
4 starsK. Scott - 3 starsA. Lewis - unrankedJ. Murphy - 3
starsK. McGill - 3 starsJ. Thomas - 3 starsT. Reese - 2
starsV.J. Fehoko - 3 starsV. Salt - 3 starsC. Hansen - 3
starsNice try though.
Uteanymous:"It's laughable that you claim that you're
signing Top 50 recruiting classes, yet you can't beat Utah
State,..."Utah had only lost to the Aggies ONE TIME since 1998.
That's about the same number of losses to USU the Indy-WACers had, only
YOUR loss was a blow out loss, whereas ours was a narrow OT loss. I'd
hardly consider losing one time in 15 yrs proof positive that we "can't
beat Utah State". And furthermore, Utah's recruiting classes being
consistently ranked in the Top-50 isn't just something I "claim".
It's something that can be verified by the very objective and independent
recruit rating index from Rivals. Go ahead...go see it for yourself. But if
you do, and you want to also find out how well the Indy-WACers had been doing
since leaving the MWC, you're gonna have to scroll way down. Haha!
Uteanymous:"Now you're just making stuff up...Name
them!"K. York, C. Poutasi, L. Heimuli, K. Scott, A. Lewis, J.
Murphy, K. McGill J. Thomas, T. Reese, V.J. Fehoko, V. Salt, C. Hansen.Whoops! Looks like I overstated that factoid. We don't have over a
dozen. We have ONLY a dozen. Losing R. Dunn, and D. Kruger to graduation, and
B. Kemoeatu to grades -- and offset only by adding A. Lewis -- dropped us down
from 14 to 12.
UConn is desperate to play anyone. They are kind of in the same situation as
BYU, no conference will take them.
@ SLCWatch and Marked it DownUtah had it's worst season in a
decade and missed a bowl. Obviously the program isn't where we want it to
be right now. Hopefully in the next few seasons Utah can pick itself up get
into the upper third of the conf. Go ahead and pat yourself on the back and
pretend like you 'got' me, but I have no delusions about where Utah is
right now. As for Fresno, no they are not a rival. Nobody is
trying to make them a rival. Utah is playing Fresno in a non-conference game.
It is not more complicated than that.
The U has really embarassed the entire state with the mediocre performance in
the PAC. If they had done better then it would tend to reflect well on the
other teams in Utah and in the Mountain West because most college football fans
know that the Utes and BYU have been competitive for a long time. The attacks
on BYU by Ute fans are expressions of bitterness and desperation over the
obvious failure of the Ute program. If things don't improve soon, expect
the program following to implode. Nobody likes to watch a loser. That's
the reason they would back off the rivalry to schedule a team such as Fresno
State. Just as Washington State and Washington canceled future games with BYU
after suffering losses.
Always have to chuckle when, on their 5th comment on the same BYU article,
someone tries to argue BYU isn't relevant...certainly relevant enough to
them...but maybe they mean not relevant on the national stage. Interestingly, according to SI Vault, since its inception there have been 159
articles in SI regarding BYU and, shockingly, only 8 regarding the University of
Utah. Looks like there may indeed be only one school in Utah with
naval vet"We also have over a dozen 4-stars on our roster as
well."Now you're just making stuff up.Name
them!UCLA signed SEVENTEEN 4-star recruits THIS YEAR, so the
Ute's obviously don't stand a chance of beating the Bruins ever
again.It's laughable that you claim that you're signing
Top 50 recruiting classes, yet you can't beat Utah State, have split with
lowly 10-loss Colorado, and you're still finishing behind BYU in the
rankings.When was the last time U beat a PAC 10.2 foe with a winning
record?Being a bottom dweller in a big boy conference doesn't
make U special, it just makes you a convenient whipping boy for the real big
boys of the conference. Get used to it.
Y's little brother:"Really? Since when are 3-star recruits
considered 'elite'?"Since they started ranking 3-star
talents. That's why Utah keeps hauling in Top-50 recruiting classes. We
also have over a dozen 4-stars on our roster as well. Waaaay more than little
brother. Now go wipe your tears.
naval vet"Actually, you'll notice that Utah's SOS was
22 spots higher than the Y's, and that this separation is NOT fairly
close."If 22 spots higher for Utah in SOS isn't
"fairly" close, then obviously, 35 spots lower for Utah in ranking must
be a significant difference.You'll notice that SOS is included
in the rankings, so your desperate attempt to double-dip on SOS isn't going
to fool anybody not living on the hill.BYU's SOS (63) was
nearly identical to Ohio State's SOS (61) yet Ohio State was ranked 13
places higher than BYU because the Cougars finished 8-5, while the Buckeyes were
12-0.Your whole SOS argument is based on the premise that playing a
tougher SOS somehow makes U better, even if you a worse record.Sorry, but an 8-5 record with a 63 SOS is BETTER than a 5-7 record with a 41
These threads always turn into the same old debate, by the same old Haters.
Really pretty pathetic. Actually, I don't see signing U Conn to
a home and home series such a bad thing. It gives BYU some East Coast exposure
and helps balance out the schedule. Pretty nice little home and home series. IMO
Regardless of how our little brothers try to spin it:#1 will ALWAYS
be > #2/#4/#5If Utah 2004 or Utah 2008 were even half as good as
Utah fans pretend U were, the Utes would have finished #1. Obviously, the poll
voters disagreed with your over-inflated opinion of the Utes.Either
you have a Crystal Football National Championship Trophy in your trophy case or
U don't.BYU does.Utah doesn't.It's as simple as that.btw, the Utes have never finished
higher than FOURTH in the Coaches Poll, the organization that awards the Crystal
Football National Championship Trophy.Remember that!
Naval Vet"being in an elite conference DOES get one more elite
recruits."Really? Since when are 3-star recruits considered
"elite"?Once again you're wandering off into abstracts,
instead of comparing actual results.The U has finished behind the Y
in records and in rankings every year since U sneaked into the PAC 10.2.How embarrassing was it to lose to the only WAC team you faced in 2012
or to lose to a 10-loss team in 2011?Mighty weak U PAC 10.2 bottom
dweller indeed. Call us when U beat your first conference foe with a winning
record - 7-11 so far, and trending downward.
Don't you guys just "Hate Utah And Every They Stand For."? Beer...
Rockwell:"You'll notice that the SOS for BYU and Utah was
fairly close,..."Actually, you'll notice that Utah's
SOS was 22 spots higher than the Y's, and that this separation is NOT
fairly close. You'll also notice that when comparing the 3 Utah schools,
the lower the SOS, the more W's on the season. Coincidence?Nope."Utah was simply lucky to win the last three; it could
have easily been BYU winning two of the last three, and five of the last
eight."More likely, it was the Y who had been lucky to win those
3 games back in '06, '07, and '09, and that it could have easily
been UTAH winning all 11 of those aforementioned games. But that's
football. The scoreboard says 8 of the last 11 for your big brother who was the
better team this past quarter century. And now that our recruiting had only
gotten better, while yours had only gotten worse, Utah looks to put even more
distance from our frantic and emotional neighbors to the south in the coming
years. Good luck to you with all your 2-star recruit talent.
Chewbacca"Beating ZERO teams that finish in the final top 25
doesn't win you anything." - FALSE-----U 90"There were no ranked teams on BYU's schedule in 1984 as there
was only a Top 20 back in those days (no Top 25)." - TRUE (as far as final
rankings)------Mark it Down"BYU beat Air
Force(8-4), which finished #24 in the final AP poll." - TRUEFinal AP Poll#1 BYU 1160#2 Wash 1140#3 Fla 1092#4 Neb
1017#5 BC 932#6 Okla 883#7 Ok St 864#8 SMU 761#9
UCLA 613#10 USC 596#20 Va 119#21 W Va 109#22 Ga
67#23 Army 44#24 AFA 26#24 ND 26Air Force
wasn't ranked, but the Falcons did indeed finish in the Top 25 in the Final
AP Poll for 1984.Saying that BYU didn't beat any Top 25 teams
in 1984 is a lie.
No really. It was magic, cause we did the right things on and off the field.
bacWACn:"Laughing hilariously at your schedule smack."Doubtful. More like "crying a river" per your inferiority
complex. If Y fans are truely "excited" about playing UConn, UCF,
Southern Miss, UNLV, Middle Tennessee, et al, they're either admitting
they're not capable of competing with the big boys and PREFER weak SOS -
thus attributing to your perpetual mid-majoreyness -- or they're
disingenuously trying to cheer themselves up.Whew! Glad I'm
not an Indy-WACer. That would have been so embarrassing.
@RockwellOh,now it was luck. I thought it was the refs.
backWACn:"What you've cluelessly failed to understand is
that simply being in an "elite" conference, doesn't make U
elite."No, but being in an elite conference DOES get one more
elite recruits. And since the Pac-10 invited Utah, our recruiting had only
gotten better. Conversely, since leaving the MWC, yours only got worse. With
our better recruits, we will produce a more elite team. With your worse
recruits, you're going to have to schedule down to a more
"WAC"-worthy lineup in order to win enough games to dupe your fans into
believing there was anything noteworthy about your program."BYU's Independence has FAR exceeded your PAC 10.2-edness."Nope. The Y lost all their games vs. their big brother since the
conference change, and by an average of 23.5 pts. When you're -23.5, it is
YOU who had been "FAR exceded"; not the other way around."Utah's peak doesn't even come close to matching BYU's
peak."Wrong again. When was the last time the Y beat 4 ranked
teams in the same season?Answer: NEVER!We've done
it twice...just like we've hoisted BCS bowl trophies twice.Utah
U 90 / ekute"Perhaps illusions of overall success can be
explained by SOS."Perhaps they aren't illusions of better
overall success.SOS and records are already calculated into
rankings, as seen in Sagarin's final 2012 rankings:#12
Oklahoma(10-3) #5 (SOS)#13 Ohio State(12-0) #60#18 Baylor(8-5) #7#19 Utah State(11-2) #97#26 BYU(8-5) #63#61 Utah(5-7) #41You'll notice that the SOS for BYU and Utah was fairly close, while the
ranking difference was much greater.Utah fans look silly trying to
argue that one head-to-head game in a 12-game season proves something. Of
course, even Utah fans laugh at the "logic" when it comes to comparisons
that don't involve BYU versus Utah.For example, does any Utah
fan really believe that Colorado(3-10) was better than Utah in 2011 or that
UNLV(2-10) was better than Utah in 2007?Utah was simply lucky to win
the last three; it could have easily been BYU winning two of the last three, and
five of the last eight.You've already exposed your hypocrisy by
claiming that Pittsburgh was better than UConn in 2004.
@BlueCougouch ;)We beat ya 54-10 2 years ago,and 3 times
last year. Wha-da-think?
Snack Pac, Perhaps illusions of overall success can be explained by SOS.
Neither program has been very good over the last 2 seasons. Sure BYU has had a
better record but the schedule was WAC heavy, right. Every attempt to paint a
different picture just makes you look silly. If BYU was so much better than
Utah, why can't they beat the Utes? Again, consider SOS when considering
overall success.Marked it Down, Don't attempt to make 1984
sound more impressive than it really was. There were no ranked teams on
BYU's schedule in 1984 as there was only a Top 20 back in those days (no
Top 25). You're making yourself look bad by stretching the truth. I
actually pull for BYU when they're not playing Utah, but I'm
embarrassed for guys like you who try to make something appear more than it
really was. I'll freely admit, BYU has an NC and Utah doesn't. Are
you willing to admit that it was the weakest NC schedule of all time?
ekuteLast 41 years head to head BYU(26) > Utah(15)Largest margin of victory in the series: BYU 56 > Utah 6AP Top
25 FinishesBYU(17) > Utah(5)Head-to-headBronco(3)
< Kyle(5)Top 25Bronco(5) > Kyle(3)Top
15Bronco(3) > Kyle(1)Conference ChampionshipsBronco(2) > Kyle(1)Bowl GamesBronco(8) > Kyle(7)Losing SeasonsBronco(0) > Kyle(1)Losses to 10-loss
teamsBronco(0) > Kyle(2)OverallBronco > Kyle
Wait,I'm not done...Pac12,Pac12 Network>independence,byu
tvUtah on Espn=byu on ESPN
@Snack PACAll time head to head Utah>byuLast 20 years
head to head Utah>byuLast 15 years Head to head Utah>byuLast
10 years head to head Utah>byuLast 5 years head to head
Utah>byucoaches Head to head Kyle>bronco
navel vetLaughing hilariously at your schedule smack.Not
surprising, since you've been a miserable failure in overall
accomplishments on the football field since sneaking into the PAC 10.2What you've cluelessly failed to understand is that simply being in an
"elite" conference, doesn't make U elite. All you've proven so
far is that you're a convenient punching bag for the big boys of the PAC
10.2 to pad their conference records."And lastly, your
independence had NOT been a success. For starters, you lost your conference
affiliation with the WAC due to it collapsing under the weight of its own
mid-majoreyness."What a frantic and emotional statement, even
for U.BYU's Independence has FAR exceeded your PAC
10.2-edness.2011 BYU(10-3) #25/#26/#34 > Utah(8-5)
UNRANKED!/#392012 BYU(8-5) #26 bowl WINNER > Utah(5-7) #61 couch
potato bowlYou've been in steady decline since your peak in
2008, and Utah's peak doesn't even come close to matching BYU's
peak.Call us the first time U finish a 24-game winning streak with
back-to-back Top 7 finishes and a CONSENSUS National Championship!
Chewbacca"BYU hasn't ever "won" a national
championship. They were AWARDED a national championship."LOL at
the jealous spin.BYU won its 1984 National Championship in EXACTLY
the same every other team has won its national championship(s) since 1936, by
being voted #1 in the final polls.BYU beat Air Force(8-4), which
finished #24 in the final AP poll.
Cool. Another state to dominate recruiting in.
Snack Pac- BYU hasn't ever "won" a national championship. They
were AWARDED a national championship. There's a big difference. You would
have to beat SOMEBODY to win a national championship. Beating ZERO teams that
finish in the final top 25 doesn't win you anything.
Snack WAC:"Jealous? Nope. That would YOUR fanbase. (a) We're now in an elite conference...and not just ANY elite
conference. We're in the one you guys fantasized about joining for the
better part of the last 3 decades. You weren't wanted by any relevant
conferences, and had to align yourselves with the now-defunct WAC.(b) We've played in (and won) 2 BCS bowls, and own the nation's
best postseason winning percentage. You "Quest"-ed for BCS bowl,
prematurely threw Tostitos tortillas out onto your field before the opening
kickoff of your season opener in another, and own one of the worst postseason
winning records in the nation.(c) We now get Home-&-Home
schduling arrangements with teams like Michigan. You get one-offs.(d) We don't have a generation gap in the all time series, don't
sign a majority of our classes from the "2-star" back pages of the
"who's who in football recruiting" manual, and hadn't lost
nearly 75% of our most recent matchups these past 11 yrs.The truth
is, the envy sits on your side of the fence.
WON84:"Thanks for your assessment of the schedule and undying
support and attention to all things BYU. It really is appreciated...Thanks again
for your help in making independence a success."I have to laugh
at how desperate your fans have become for warm fuzzy endorsements. So hopeless
have you been, that you've had to pretend me calling you
"mid-majorey" as some sort of compliment. I believe Duckhunter would
have called that "too funny", and maybe even "LOL"-ed at that
frantic and emotional notion. And lastly, your independence had NOT
been a success. For starters, you lost your conference affiliation with the WAC
due to it collapsing under the weight of its own mid-majoreyness. And finally,
your schedules and bowl tie-is have not improved over the MWC's. It's
Jazzsmack:"Exactly what did you expect to happen when BYU went
independent?"We expected that you would play incredibly weak
SOS. We're just here to rub it in a bit after your fans' continual
boasts of how the top teams in the country would be lining up to play in
Provostan now that you're no longer playing MWC ball. We were right. You
The real reason that the Utah trolls have to comment on BYU articles is that
nobody cares about what Utah is doing, therefore no Utah arrticles to comment
on. Maybe when Utah climbs out of the cellar that may get some media attention.
It's laughable that Utah fans spend so much effort trying to minimize the
only decent team they've beaten the last two seasons.
ekuteoverall success for entire season > one game successoverall success over more seasons > overall success over fewer
seasonsFIVE Top 25 finishes (63%) > three (38%)THREE
Top 15 finishes (38%) > one (13%)TWO conference championships
> oneHigher rankings in FIVE seasons during the Bronco/Kyle era
2b"both the utes and huskies have been to a BCS bowl more
recently than the Y who has never been."Which proves what?That previous BCS bowl participation doesn't mean anything when
evaluating future opponents.#26 BYU(8-5) bowl winner > #61
Utah(5-7) couch potato bowlbtw,BYU has won a National
Championship more recently than U, who has never even come close.If
you're going to make comparisons, you should do so with superlatives, not
I can't resist. lol.@Snack PACHow about head to
@mixed up the facts "and the Huskies have been to a BCS bowl more recently
than the Utes."True statement and both the utes and huskies have
been to a BCS bowl more recently than the Y who has never been.
Jazzsmack"I do not understand the Utah fans constant criticism
of BYU and their schedule."I do.Utah fans are green
with jealousy that despite Utah's "better" schedules, the Utes
still lag behind BYU in overall accomplishments the last two years.Our little friends on the hill talk schedule smack, because they can't
talk rankings smack when the Utes constantly finish behind the Cougars in the
I do not understand the Utah fans constant criticism of BYU and their
schedule.Schedules are made years in advanced.Exactly
what did you expect to happen when BYU went independent?It was
always going to take years to to get a consistantly good schedule.And probably longer with all the shake up that has been going on in division 1
football lately.Why not just enjoy your team, BYU will not even be
on your schedule for a couple of years.And when they do again, would
you not rather want to have a good team to play? What pride is there in beating
When I lived in Connecticut the only way to see BYU play was to stay up late at
night, and go over to the local church with satellite hook-up. Occasionally
ESPN would broadcast a game and many of the church members would go over to
Bristol to watch it in ESPN's auditorium... there are several members who
work for the world's broadcasting leader. I'm happy for my friends in
New England that they'll be able to finally see the Cougars live, and watch
the away game on ESPN. Life has definitely improved for the cougar faithful.
Naval Vet - Thanks for your assessment of the schedule and undying support and
attention to all things BYU. It really is appreciated. Given you spend this
much time on comment boards to articles about BYU, one can rest assured you turn
on the TV each Saturday to watch them play. Thanks again for your help in
making independence a success.
twofer"...you don't know which game will be more attractive
to the media."Actually, it's a given that BYU at UConn will
draw far more media attention in the media heavy northeast, than Fresno State at
2fer"I don't care at all about the five-year average of
UCONN. What happened last year is the best barometer of where their football
program currently is."So, obviously, last year is the best
barometer of where Utah's football program currently is:Unranked, 5-7, conference bottom dwelling losing team with no bowl - just like
UConn.Thanks for clarifying Utah's current status.Final Sagarin Ratings for 2012#26 BYU(8-5) bowl winner#61
Utah(5-7) no bowl
Looks like a pretty mid-majorey schedule to me. I see 9 mid-major opponents out
of the 11 (or 81.8%) scheduled for 2014. Even if the Y can get one more elite
school to round out their season, only 3 out of 12 would still be so very
mid-majorey.So let's look ahead to 2015.Whoops!
Only 2 schools from elite conferences scheduled there too. Out of the 8 games
scheduled, the cougars are still struggling to put together a competitive
schedule.Now on the ONE hand, playing a very mid-majorey schedule
has been part of that oft cited "brand" for our little brothers, but on
the OTHER hand, the cougars had really been "brand"-ed playing a very
"WAC-ish" and mid-majorey schedule. And there IS no more WAC. Looks
like little brother is going to have to tweak their legacy a bit.
Okay, I understand your position "two for".Recent rating=UConn went from 76 in 2011 to 89 in 2012 Yes, I see they are getting
worse.BYU went from 34 in 2011 to 26 in 2012 I see they are getting
better.Utah went from 39 to 61 in 2012Yes, I see how it shows the
current state of teams. You are correct. I stand corrected.Oh, by
the way Chris Hill, the Athletic director gave up their only rivalry game
for...Fresno?I guess he for one is trying to make Fresno the new rival.
Or he must not be a single Ute fan. He's married. I get it. Silly me.Recruiting California is a given. Maybe they want to recruit the East
too. More media and all that maybe. Could be they want to recruit nationally.
@ SLCWatchI don't care at all about the five-year average of
UCONN. What happened last year is the best barometer of where their football
program currently is. Last year, UCONN was not a good team. I also don't
care if you like Fresno or not. The fact remains that it is a better climate,
and is much better for recruiting. It's also easier to get to from SLC.
As for Fresno being a rival, I don't know why they would be. I don't
know a single Ute fan who would consider Fresno a rival either...@
Y's little brotherJust because I cheer for a different team
than you doesn't make me a troll. The points I made were not mean in
spirit and were on topic. I agree with you that we don't know how good or
bad UCONN will be in 2014. Likewise you don't know which game will be more
attractive to the media.
2fer and other BYU-obsessed Utah trollsWho could have predicted last
August that pre-season #1 national championship contender USC would finish
unranked with a blowout bowl loss to a team BYU easily handled on the road,
while Utah State and San Jose State would both finish the season ranked in the
Top 25.Bottom line, NOBODY knows for sure which teams will be very
good and which teams will be very mediocre in any given year.One
thing is a given, however, the BYU at UConn game in 2014 will attract far more
media attention in the media heavy northeast, than the Fresno State at Utah
game, which will barely be noticed.
@TwoforAs I noted, it's an average (five year). And now you too are
wrong, I've been to Fresno...It's not a destination at all. I'd
rather watch a game in Provo but we know some teams won't because they
think Fresno is a rival. I will look forward to going to Conn. thank you very
much. Have fun in the Raisin capitol. By the way, are they now "The"
Poor Howie... busted. LOLI'm sure the Cougar fans in New
England are very happy about seeing BYU come to town. I sure would be if I lived
out there.Great scheduling Tom!
@ CougFaninTXWhy? Fresno is a better team and is a far better
travel destination. On top of that the San Joaquin Valley is much better than
Storrs, CT from a recruiting perspective.@ Y's little
brotherGetting to a BCS bowl and then getting blown out is not
impressive. When you get to the big stage you have to win for people to notice
you.@ SLCWatchThis year's final rankings: Eastern
Washington 88, UCONN 89, Montana St. 90.
@HowardYou made a simple error. Oversight I'm sure. You meant
Washington not Eastern Washington. You remember Washington...Beat Utah 34-15,
ugly game. Check the average Sagerin ratings in the previous post. UConn has
been better than Washington (Not Eastern Washington). Like I said simple error
I am sure.Besides traveling to Hartford Conn. is better than Cheney
Washington (or Pullman Washington) for that matter.
Only in the delusional bubble of the Cougar Nation is a h/h with the Sagarin
equivalent of Eastern Washington a cause for celebration.
UConn is located in the media heavy NYC market, so this is a great move for
exposure. And UConn is a worthy opponent. They have beaten Notre
Dame--something that Utah has never done.
RE: U 90"Could you please provide sagarin ratings for the bottom
half of the pac12 and UConn."A reasonable request... here's
the bottom six from last year and their rankings over the last five seasons. Arizona (44, 64, 30, 37, 24) average = 40Washington (52, 44, 28,
52, 129) average = 61Utah (61, 39, 26, 24. 5) average = 31California
(78, 38, 33, 46, 16) average = 42Connecticut (89, 76, 56, 28, 40) average
= 54Washington State (104, 83, 79, 126, 138) = 106Colorado (156,
107, 68, 91, 72) = 99And because I was curious…BYU (26,
34, 45, 15, 32) average = 30 Conclusions based solely on Sagarin
ratings: Uconn would have been a cellar dweller if they were in the PAC 12 (just
ahead of Washington, WSU, and Colorado), Utah belongs in the top half of the
PAC, and Utah and BYU are pretty much neck and neck over the last five years.
Does any of this really matter? No. But it is interesting. Go cougs!
So what have we learned.UConn would have been an elite team in 2004
if they'd won the 4-way tie-breaker for the Big East conference
championship and played Utah in the Fiesta Bowl (instead of Pittsburgh).UConn was an elite team when they played in the 2011 Fiesta Bowl just a
couple of years ago.But, now, without changing conferences, UConn is
suddenly not an "elite" program simply because a bunch of non-AQ
interlopers moved into their conference.Of course, the same thing
happened to the PAC 10.2 when Utah moved into the conference, the only
difference being that the PAC 10.2 was strong enough to absorb the hit.
To the Ute Fans,Leave them alone and watch them compare everything they do
to the Utes and the Pac12. lol.
2014 / 2015 Schedule NoteBYU replaces Utah with UConn.Utah replaces BYU with Fresno St.UConn may not be Alabama, but
I'd rather play UConn than Fresno St.2014 is shaping up nicely
with Texas, UConn, Virginia, Houston, Boise St, Utah St, Nevada, UNLV and a
couple more games to add. It may not have the panache of 2013 or 2015, but
it's way ahead of our first couple of years of Indy and our MWC schedule.
I like it!
DuckhunterCould you please provide sagarin ratings for the bottom
half of the pac12 and UConn.
Good games.We will work UConn twice.
@DuckhunterAnd who said anything about the Pac12?
@Just the FAX and @TrueBlueWho said anything about Utah? Jealous????
I like it, another good opponent and a chance to travel somewhere new for a
game. UConn is easily as good as half the pac 12, probably better, so that make
it a good opponent. Can't wait!
KVN/Hoff are gonna dominate U"Why not try and schedule Duke and
Kentucky so you can try and claim powerhouse SEC and ACC wins?"Why would BYU want to replace PAC 10.2 bottom dweller Utah with a couple of
bottom dwellers from other "big boy" conferences?
As a resident of Connecticut I am excited to see the Cougars play here!
I'll wear blue and white and leave it that.
Excited for the series. This is one of the benefits of being independent.
its OK. But 2014's schedule has a lot of mid-major or low quality bcs-type
teams in it. I think 10 or 11 slots are filled and the Cougs need some big-time
games for the last spot or two. Otherwise 2014's schedule will be a big
step back from 2013. 2015 already looks tough though with @ michigan and @
“We are very excited to bring another nationally prominent opponent to
Rentschler Field,” said UConn athletic director Warde Manuel. UConn head coach Paul Pasqualoni is entering his third year as head coach and
has led teams to nine bowl games. “The series with BYU is a great
opportunity and challenge for our football program,” said Pasqualoni.
“Everyone in college football knows about the proud heritage of BYU
football.”Perhaps the word from an underpass in Salt Lake City
has not reached the east coast yet because those statements defy everything the
local know-it-all fans have ever preached.Nevertheless, way to go
Tom for taking the football program to a good location and opponent for the BYU
fans and team.
Why not try and schedule duke and kentucky so you can try and claim powerhouse
SEC and ACC wins?
The scheduling just keeps getting better and better. True that UCONN is not a
football powerhouse, but they are a well respected program and playing in
Connecticut is certainly better than playing in New Mexico. These kinds of
games are perfect for balancing out a very difficult schedule against top teams
like Wisconsin, Notre Dame, and Texas. Good work Holmoe. Go Cougs!
frightened sparrow"Congrats...that's a great schedule
addition for the basketball team.Oh, wait..."Wait
for what?UConn BEAT Pittsburgh and tied for the Big East
Championship with the 2004 Panthers.UConn played in the 2011 Fiesta
Bowl.So, the Huskies BEAT Utah's 2004 Fiesta Bowl opponent, the
Ute's most "formidable" foe during Utah's 2nd best season
ever, and the Huskies have been to a BCS bowl more recently than the Utes.
Congrats...that's a great schedule addition for the basketball team.Oh, wait...
Sounds like a fun home and home. I don't believe BYU has ever played UConn.