Comments about ‘Following Tom Holmoe comments on Big 12, a look at the issues keeping BYU out’

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Published: Thursday, Feb. 21 2013 10:30 a.m. MST

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sammyg
Springville, UT

As a BYU fan I am happy to watch the Cougars almost every day they play. Independence keeps getting better and better in my book.

I'm watching a great basketball game right now. These WCC teams are a great fit for BYU. Put BYU anywhere and they will compete.

I just don't get what's so great about being in a big boy conference and losing over 50% of your games. If I were a Ute fan I'd be furious at how this failed Pac10.2 experiment has gone.

I certainly understand why so many Ute fans get their kicks out of trying to find some joy in BYU's losses, no conference affiliation, a few football victories, etc...

...as there is no joy in Uteville and all the Ute losses, no post seasons, dismal conference showings and so forth.

I love my Cougars and independence.

Thanks Tom for delivering on your promise. I enjoy it so much.

Two For Flinching
Salt Lake City, UT

@ Bluto

Nobody is trying to claim that Utah would have a tv deal like BYU has. The U is not sponsored by a church and as a result does not have a built-in fan base that is spread out across the country. Of course Utah can't equal BYU's situation. BYU can't equal Utah's situation either. The schools are very different, which is why they are in the situations they are currently in.

The beauty of it all is that Utah doesn't have to equal BYU. Utah got the better deal out of the two teams. If the PAC or Big XII came calling BYU would jump into either league immediately.

sammyg
Springville, UT

WAC (USU) paddled my Utes

Still smarting from the couch potato bowl I see.

With or without a conference affiliation BYU trumps U on the national stage, on TV, fanbase numbers and so forth. You poor jealous temper tantrum types just humor me to no end.

Please educate us as to what is so great about losing over 50% of your games in a big boy conference. Is it the money that won't buy one 4 or 5 star recruit over USC, Oregon or Stanford? Is it the empty seats at the HC? Or is it the pride of being associated to something big when U are not?

After two years and as fickle as Ute fans are I'm surprised you and several others are still here.

Is it just the glory of one rivalry game per season and dismissing the rest...

Or is it a diminishing group of wishful thinkers hoping that the Utes will rise again?

LOL

sammyg
Springville, UT

2fer

What is exactly "Utah's situation"? After two seasons in the Pac10.2 I'm really curious about this 'situation' you're crowing about.

I'm dying to know how 'moral victories' and staying home for the holidays makes for a great tradition that fans clamor to see.

Two For Flinching
Salt Lake City, UT

@ sammyg

Utah's situation is that they are a member of the Pac-12. That alone opens up amazing possibilities for the University. On top of that Utah has earned a revenue increase that is allowing Utah to invest in, and expand, the athletics department like never before. We all know that the Utes have struggled in the first couple of seasons, but that does not mean Utah is forever doomed in conf. play.

Jake2010
bountiful, ut

Yes, I'll bet nothing quite beats being a bottom feeder in a not so stacked with talent conference. You have 2-3 teams in everywhere but SEC and the rest are just the embryonic sisters of the 'elite'. Just look at the storied history of the far too overhyped bcs championship series... It is very clear that for BYU to be envious Utah would have to be somewhere that not even they would EVER get an invite to... The S E C ! ! ! It is them and then everyone else all vying to be the top of the embryonic chain of overhyped hoopla!

Two For Flinching
Salt Lake City, UT

@ Jake2010

Answer honestly. If the PAC-12 had extended an invitation to BYU would Holmoe have accepted the offer or would he have declined and taken BYU into independence?

The answer will tell you who landed the better deal.

poyman
Lincoln City, OR

Holmoe says that we never got an invite which may be true, but the AD from TX said at the time that BYU doesn't appear to be too anxious to get an invite to the conference which tells me there is alot more to this than what Holmoe has said. (i.e. the rumor that we wanted to make sure that Oklahoma and Texas weren't going to run off and join the PAC10; the rumor that we wanted replay rights for BYUtv and maybe even home game control in the event that a BYU game wouldn't be picked up by a Network; and finally the rumor that we didn't want the Conference to look at the Athletic Financials to see how much of the Programs were funded by the Church and Tithe Payers).

poyman
Lincoln City, OR

I believe Holmoe was simply a pawn that was caught in the middle and a pawn that wasn't very effective in converting Decision Makers to the thought that we needed to agressively pursue the invite... I also strongly believe that our feeble effort was directed by Lawyers and Members of the Board of Trustees out of SLC who simply don't understand the value of being in the Big 12 (probably U Grads or USU Grads).

This is not a defense of Holmoe... I think that a strong AD would have been able to convince his side of the table that they needed to do everything except Sunday play in order to get the invite... Holmoe does not have that capability.

DC
Alexandria, VA

BYU isn't going to the Big 12. They will go to the B1G. Or maybe the SEC.

Mildred in Fillmore
Salt Lake City, UT

Big 12 doesn't want BYU because they know that BYU would dominate that conference.

LEDSFW
Las Vegas, NV

Dutchman:

You make some assumptions about Florida State and Clemson without considering how the fan bases and trustees of those fine institutions might feel about the Big-12. The fact WVa was denied entrance into the ACC had a lot to do with how FSU and Clemson felt about the lower academic standards at WVa. I think you're mistaken to believe that the Big-12 need only ask and FSU and Clemson would leave the ACC. They have little incentive to do so. The hyperbol over that scenario was started by a few out-of-place media people inside the BIG-12 before they ever considered the strong position those school have within the ACC. There is nothing about a move 1500 miles west that makes sense for them. WVa only accepted Big-12 invitations because it was turned down by the Big-10, SEC and ACC.

truecoug1
Provo, UT

@TwoForFlinching "Utah's situation is that they are a member of the Pac-12. That alone opens up amazing possibilities for the University."

Kansas, Washington St, Duke, Indiana, Iowa St, Colorado, Minnesota, etc are all members of BCS conferences. Those 'amazing possibilities' haven't really turned out for them, and I most certainly am not envious of any of those teams or their situation.

Utah is quickly becoming another one of those teams: U have a spot at the "big boys" table, but are stuck in the high chair. In this case, that involves playing in obscurity on the PAC 12 network, losing seasons, and staying home for the bowl season.

However, Ute fans are happy where they're at and I would say the majority of BYU fans are happy with independence. I certainly am.

Looking forward to a great 2013 season.

Go Cougars!

gdog3finally
West Jordan, Utah

Many don't get it, but I think the majority of BYU fans do. Holmoe is doing the best job any Cougar fan could expect.

I wish Holmoe would have dropped the ball and scheduled a game the week before the my Utes roll into town next year. That extra week preparing makes it tougher for the red.

The schedule next year is solid for BYU. They play some lesser foes but not as many. The top heavy opponents are great to have on the schedule and the November line up is way better except Idaho State. The weaker teams except Idaho State (again) are far better than the bottom four the last two years. Nevada and Middle Tennessee State are not gimmes either.

Two For Flinching
Salt Lake City, UT

@ truecoug1

You know there are other sports besides football don't you? Many of those schools you mentioned are legitimate contenders in men's basketball. Others are strong at LAX, track and field, or wrestling. The point is, Utah is in the process of growing its athletic profile and will the increased revenue has the opportunity to improve all of its sports, not just football.

btw a couple of those teams you mentioned have already appeared in, and won BCS bowls. If they can compete why can't Utah?

Jake2010
bountiful, ut

Not gonna stir the pot by answering 'what if' questions. For they are of ZERO relevance. It is nice for conversational fodder, but only good to be chewed on and then spat out. :)

Snack PAC
Olympus Cove, Utah

2fer

"You know there are other sports besides football don't you?"

Actually, BYU has known about sports like Track & Field, Golf, Rugby, Cross Country, and Volleyball for decades, but it's nice to know that the kids on the hill have finally discovered them.

btw, without PAC 12 money, BYU was able to win NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIPS in every one of the above mentioned sports.

Thanks for playing.

WACPaddingOurSchedule
pocatello, ID

truecoug1
Provo, UT
@TwoForFlinching "Utah's situation is that they are a member of the Pac-12. That alone opens up amazing possibilities for the University."

Kansas, Washington St, Duke, Indiana, Iowa St, Colorado, Minnesota, etc are all members of BCS conferences. Those 'amazing possibilities' haven't really turned out for them, and I most certainly am not envious of any of those teams or their situation.

Utah is quickly becoming another one of those teams: U have a spot at the "big boys" table, but are stuck in the high chair. In this case, that involves playing in obscurity on the PAC 12 network, losing seasons, and staying home for the bowl season.
__________________

Right! Who would want to be in the situation of Kansas, Duke or Indiana? You know, the elite of college basketball with multiple NCAA basketball championships. The other schools you mentioned have won titles in other sports as well.

Meanwhile BYU is eating scraps on the floor under the "big boys" table.

Obscurity = lame ESPN ratings for BYU football. And BYU might as well stayed home from their bowl. Who watched?

Two For Flinching
Salt Lake City, UT

@ Jake2010

You don't have to answer because we all know the answer. BYU would take the PAC-12 offer as soon as it was offered.

@ Snack PAC

BYU doesn't need PAC-12 money. We all know the Y is extremely well funded. Like I said, now that Utah has a seat at the 'big boy table', and the advantages that come with it, I hope to see an improvement in the quality of our athletic teams across the board over the next 3-5 years. Also, (just to stir the pot) despite Utah's past disadvantages to BYU, the Utes have 21 national titles while BYU only has 8. (The Y claims 14, but 2 are from the N.I.T and the other four are from non NCAA tournaments)

Y Grad / Y Dad
Richland, WA

Two For Flinching

You ask a reasonable question in an honest tone, so here's my best shot. Of course it is unreasonable to assume that just because the drum and feather is down now that it will always be down. Indeed, the basketball team is times better than last year, insert obligatory smack talk here.

So why isn't it eaqually unreasonable to assume that BYU's position in Independence, and the stock of their football team, won't rise. I beleive it is frightened wishful Ute thinking that BYU's best days are behind us.

Here's my attempt at some other fair and honest commentary. Of course, if BYU had been offered a seat at the PAC whatever table, they would have jumped too (as long as Sunday play was off the table). Independence is not better than a position in a power conference, but as also stated in recent articles, that isn't too likely. Independence IS a better option than the MWC. Perhaps even better than the deal that Boise got.

And Independence COULD continue to get even better. If Anae can restore the offense, even the predictability, Independence WILL continue to get better.

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