The article fails to make clear just what percentage the "nones" are.
It states they grew by 1.1% over each of the last two years and by 22% over the
last few years but still doesn't state what percentage they are over all.
I'm glad Utah is up there. I'm surprised we're not number one.
The color coding on the map included in this article has no relation to the
article itself. Gallop provided a much more sensible map, why wasn't it
So people want to share there lack of beleif now? More shared doubt. I have no
doubt to share. Truth is independent of what people choose to beleive. What
will a beleif against gravity do? And how do people prove there lack of beleif?
Religion for the most part makes people better people than they
This DN story doesn't portray the full picture of the poll regarding Utah.
While Utahns are ranked second in the "very religious" category, once
"moderately religious" is factored in, Utah drops well out of the top
ten regarding positive religious attitudes. There appears to be a growing
polarization regarding religious attitudes in Utah, with no other state having a
lower "moderately religious" figure. In my opinion, this demographic
split reflects a bigger story than simply proclaiming Utah as #2 religiously.
Red states, economically depressed as a whole, less educated, and a whole host
of other issues. Does Utah want to be part of the deep South? Just a question.
LDS families are sending their teens out just as soon and as fast as possible to
thrash the nations with the power of the spirit. 1st Corinthians 1:27
@ Esquire. Blue states are far more likely to have economic problems, more drug
and alcohol problems, more welfare demands and higher taxes. Could there be a
@Esquire"Red states, economically depressed as a whole,"The
south in general has grown inversely to the rust belt's decline.
California is losing population and jobs to Texas at an increasing rate. Utah
has one of the least depressed economies in the US.The basic condescension
towards red sates, and by extension, religion, is both incorrect and
Utah excepted, at first glance it seems like the most backward areas of the
country are the most religious areas.
Higv - Religion isn't truth. It is belief. Gravity is a fact, neither a
belief or a truth but a fact. You can't compare something you believe in to
something that is a fact. They aren't the same. And the terms truth and
belief are not interchangeable. Furthermore, just as people not believing
something doesn't make it false; believing in something you consider truth
doesn't make it true. Religion makes people better then they are? Tell that
to Warren Jeffs followers. And no, he isn't the only one. Religion can make
people do terrible things because of percieved power.
Mountanman – “Blue states are far more likely to have economic
problems, more drug and alcohol problems, more welfare demands and higher taxes.
Could there be a correlation?”Painting with a pretty broad
(and inaccurate) brush this morning, Mountanman?OK, I’ll play
– show of hands, how many here would rather live in the most atheistic
country in the world (Sweden) vs. the most religious (Pakistan)?Admittedly, there’s a lot more going on here than just religion (both at
State and Country levels), but I don’t think the point you’re trying
to make will hold up under such sweeping generalizations.
Utah - backward. I always thought that was a given...
The deep racist south and Utah. Curious bedfellows
Mississippi & Utah: Most religious. Least money for education.
Alcohol dependence: Number 1, Montana - Red state.Worst economic
problems, Number 1, Mississippi - Red stateMost marijuana use, Number 1,
Alaska, Red stateDefinitely would like to know the source of
As a liberal American non-believer I see this story in a different light. To me, religion is simply a seller of Hope. People buy into
religion as a crutch against the rigors of life. And like the environmental
temperature sells more air conditioners in Texas than in Alaska, the quality of
life may be the cause of the better market for hope/religion in different
places. It might be interesting to see if there is correlation
between this study and conservatism, republicanism, employment or education.
We're not in good company.
Alaska is a red state, but one of the most nonreligious. You can't have it
Neither the definitions of non-religiousness and religiosity seem particularly
strict -- so what this seems to find is that even the most religious areas of
the nation are not really that religious, and only a few of the states seem
truly irreligious. So it is not no much blakc or white or red or blue but
Does religiosity correlate to how "good" a state is?If it
does correlate, is the relationship causal?What metrics do you apply
to determine what is and is not a "good" state? What counts as a
positive?If because of its high religiosity your state is less
likely to teach your kids sex education basics in school, less likely to teach
biological evolution in its science classes, less likely to provide public
family planning and reproductive health services, and less likely to embrace
divirsity and equality under the law for its citizens, then I would argue that
you have little to be proud of in that state.
@higv"What will a beleif against gravity do? And how do people prove
there lack of beleif? "*shrugs* Ask the people who don't
believe the earth is warming. @MountanmanMississippi has the
highest rates of obesity, infant mortality, people in the 47% not paying income
taxes, and poverty. That's not a blue state. Basically the best thing
Alabama has (well, other than football) is that it's not Mississippi.
Funny that Vermont is last. Joseph Smith left there as quick as he could!
Wow, lot's of generalities here from both right and left. Stop trying to
understand the world in oversimplified ways, people!
If because of its low religiosity your state is more likely to impose amoral
secular sexual values in school, less likely to teach that scientific theory is
truly theory in science classes, more likely to force others to pay for abortion
and abortofacient drugs under the phony guise of being pro-choice when NO is
never tolerated as an actual choice, and less likely to tolerate diversity of
thought and substitute equality of outcome for equality of opportunity for it
citizens, then I would argue that you have little to be proud of in that state.
@Blue,Well said. The consensus here is usually the more religious
the more worthy. From reading comments for a couple years it seems to mean the
more judgmental and elitist.
@LValfreAKA "I judge you to be judgemental"Point
@Counter Intelligence and @BlueEnjoyed reading both of your
counter-point comments as good demonstrations of the fact that no one political
side has a monopoly on the truth. In my experience most conservative and
liberals I know are decent people, they simply emphasis different issues and
concerns.What’s troubling though (and what the media does
constantly) is that the two sides talk past each other, and rather than honestly
discussing each other’s fair points and criticisms, they instead engage in
this silly “yeah, but what about…” back and forth, and then
often move on to questioning the other’s motives, character and even
patriotism.Alright, enough of the “nice guy” stuff
– Counter Intelligence, are you seriously suggesting that the theory of
evolution (which is a “theory” in the same manner as the theory of
gravity) and the theory of Creationism (which is a “theory” in the
same manner as the theory of Santa Claus) are on equal scientific footing?
Science is about teaching facts supported by evidence… nothing more.Tossing that in didn’t help your case…
56% very religious in Utah, which is probably around 50% are Mormons and maybe
5% Christian(Catholic Protestant. While Vermont is 19% very religious, which
maybe 15% are Christian.Utah with 5% Christians could be the least
Christian state in the U.S..
Let's look at Oregon #46) and Texas (#11). Why? No other reason than I
have lived a large part of my adult life in both.Oregon is more
conservative than its reputation would suggest, and Texas is more liberal than
it's would suggest.However, in Oregon, Sunday was just another
Saturday, as all the stores were open and all activities were equally schedules
on Sunday as on Saturday.Frankly, it is much easier to observe the
Sabbath in Texas, where there are still lots of businesses that close on Sunday,
and there are churches on every other corner. I like it that way. If you
don't, go to Vermont. (Brrrr)
Gee Blue, why are you so hung up on public reproductive planning? Why are you
so anxious to embrace diversity and equality when some of it breaks the laws of
nature and God? What is so great about the THEORY of evolution versus
creationism? Actually, I believe that evolution does not deny the Creator but
rather shows His infinite intelligence. But both evolution and creationism
should be taught in schools in all fairness. I would argue that our state has
more opportunities for happiness, less confusion, less evil than the ones who
don't believe in a higher power or even religion. Condemning a generally
good, healthy, and moral population because you don't agree with their
beliefs and calling them backward shows a lot of bias in your part
II thought Nebraska would be higher but not higher than Utah. Being raised in
Nebraska one of the things I remember the most were friends parents who would go
to church on Saturday night and stop for a few belts at the bar before going
home. I love Nebraska in many ways but Wish we weren't such a minority back
here and that people weren't So intolerant of religions beliefs.
I would be very concerned about being lumped with the least educated and most
backward place in the US in Mississippi. It's a state with the highest rate
of teen pregnancy, and lowest high school graduation rate . It's the
spirituality rather than religious that matters most, that should be our goal,
one that must be done in the privacy of each one heart and head, not in the
congregation of any church.
The bias against religion and the bias against the South are both interesting.
As a Southerner and a graduate of Brigham Young University, I can state that the
South is no more racist than any other part of the nation. I do enjoy being
with church-going people. The majority of my closest friends are LDS because I
spend more time with them and we share so many core beliefs. But I still have
many, many non-LDS friends and as a general rule I feel closer to those who
regularly attend church. I can tell a real benefit to the average person when
he or she attends church.
Utah and some of these states in the south also have the worst education in the
Reading many of these comments gives me hope for our beautiful state. We might
be (tied with) number 2, but we're nothing like number 1. Now if we could
get people to quit voting these yahoos we have into office, I will really start
to believe things are changing for the better in Utah!
Esquire,Spend some time in Provo. Feel free to meet very well
educated people who are religious.You might spend some time in the
south too. Not having the same level of education as other parts of the country
doesn't make anyone stupid. One may not have an education, yet still be
wise. I'm sure many people in Mississippi are very wise. As many
Utahn's revere Joseph Smith as being very wise, despite being uneducated...
your question is very ironic.
Tyler D. "Counter Intelligence, are you seriously suggesting
that the theory of evolution (which is a “theory” in the same manner
as the theory of gravity) "The theory of evolution is not equal
to the Theory of gravity. The Theory of gravity is consistent. The theory of
evolution hits roadblocks occasionally when a skull or bone fragment is found
that does not fit in the current model, it is based on our best guesses given
the information we know so far. (CI's point)Santa is a
tradition. God is a belief. I'm not sure how the word "theory"
applies here. Stay nice, you had good things to say.
As a New Yorker, I'd like to point out that you can be widely diverse and
not arch-conservative and still be a "most religious area." From the
"didyouknow" website:"83% of New Yorkers are affiliated
to some organized religion. This is a rate of adherents larger than that of the
state ... one of the highest in the entire United States."Christians comprise about 70% of the population; 40% of whom are Catholic
and 30% Protestant. They attend approximately ... 6000 churches. New York City
also boasts the world’s largest cathedral, the Episcopal Church of St John
the Divine."12% of New Yorker claim Jewish decent. There are
more Jews in New York City than there are in the Jerusalem city limits. They
have more than 1000 synagogues..."There are almost a million
Muslims in New York City. ...There are more than 100 mosques in the city, plus
an unknown number of small mosques that worshipers set up in their apartments or
places that are not visible from the street."
Given the propensity of schools to discriminate or even suspend or expel
students who don't agree with common liberals ideas, I don't think
looking at publically recorded "education" is terribly useful in
determining a populace's quality. Especially since, despite low
expenditure, Utah's youth perform quite well-and quite a few of them are
homeschooled, gaining reliable one-on-one learning while cutting required costs
to public school funding.I can also say that after spending some
time in Mississippi, Texas, Oklahoma, Utah, and red center-Arizona and comparing
it to California, Colorodo, and blue-south Arizona, that the mannerism and
quality of the former are of a quality lacking in the latter.Finally, it is in "religiosity" that one is admonished to love their
brothers and sisters as God's children, and from which our very inalianable
rights are derived. Without it we're left with cold, egotistical, cynical,
hypocritical, misrepresenting social alternatives...
Ahhhh...Isn't it fun to listen to ignorance? My guess is that most of
you from Utah have never even visited the south, let alone spent any extended
period of time down there. I grew up in Utah, graduated HS in Mississippi,
went to BYU, spent a decade in the Northeast, and now I'm in the Midwest.
NEWSFLASH! There are backward people everywhere! There are also highly educated
people everywhere. Most people regardless of where they live are completely
ignorant about the rest of the country and the world. Utah does not hold a
monopoly on living in a bubble. Just be careful making generalizations
about groups of people you've never actually met. Some southerners think
all Utahns still practice polygamy and sacrifice virgins in the SL temple and
toss the bodies out the window into the Great Salt Lake. Sounds ridiculous,
right? You people trashing the south don't sound all that different right
Religious is not synonymous with spirituality. One can be spiritual without
being a member of a religion.
The correlations that some of the known and self-proclaimed political liberals
(who often comment on DN articles) try to make regarding religiosity to other
non-related statistics in both Utah and/or to the South are both humorous and
sad. Humorous because such non-related demographic correlations are
so silly and pretentious. Sad because those statements seem to be made in at
least semi-seriousness... proving quite poignantly that there exists no lack of
modern day ignorance.
@ A Quaker:You gave no source for your numbers, but they seem quite
questionable. Recent statistical demographics from Wiki state there are only
650,000 Muslims in the entire state of New York, of which about 550,000 live in
NYC... which is about half of what you quote. @ lixercat:You are coming across as the ultimate authority on how people around the
country think, act and live. Some of your statements are rather obvious (some
backward and some highly educated people everywhere one goes).But to
claim that most people live in complete ignorance about the rest of our country
and of the world is very questionable and obviously a subjective, hard-to-prove
statement and one I can't agree with. It makes me wonder what uneducated
pockets of those regions you claim to have lived in. I too have
traveled quite extensively, lived in multiple regions and currently have
children living in states from Washington to Tennessee. I don't find the
same generalizations you assert about others... and that you yourself ironically
warn others not to make.
@Objectified: I did cite my source. As you know, we can't post links here
at DN, otherwise I would, but if you google the name of the site I cited,
you'll find it. I, too, would quibble with the numbers. I
find it impossible to believe there are only 100 formal mosques in NYC, since
I've seen perhaps a dozen with my own eyes, and it's a very big city
of which I only frequent a tiny part.To that end, I'd also like
to point out that there are at least 3 Buddhist temples and a Hindu temple in
easy walking distance from our house, but that website doesn't even mention
the number of those religions at all. And, all the oriental grocery stores
I've been in sell the paraphernalia required for the religious practice
known as "ancestor worship." We even have a Mormon temple or three.
Claiming to be religious or attending religious services regularly really means
nothing. It's how one lives and acts that is the true barometer of ones
character. Anything else is lip service. More and more people today can see
through the thin veil of the self proclaimed religious.
In other news: Ice was discovered at the North Pole, Mars is red, The Sun
actually does not orbit the earth, and It was discovered that we need oxygen.@Donn. What definition of Christian do Mormons not follow? We follow
the Dictionary.com definition of Christians. We Believe in God the Father,
Jesus Christ, and the Holy Ghost. We Proclaim ourselves as Christian, we are
baptized by Immersion (The SAME way Christ was baptized), and teach Christian
Doctrines and qualities. So we aren't Christian because we interpreted
some parts of the bible differently than the rest of Christians did 325 years
AFTER Christ? We simply interpreted the Christian trinity to be 3 divine beings
instead of one triune god. Trinity does mean 3 doesn't it? Of course there
would be no error in 325 years without modern technology.And who is to say
that you have to be Christian to be good people. Quit judging people just
because they aren't Christian. Did you realize that only about 6% of
Muslims are terrorist, and WAY less than 1% of Muslims are terrorists. They
don't all hate Christians or Americans
@Hutterite: Have you visited Mississippi? Its a beautiful state.
For the second straight year, Mississippi is the most religious state in the
U.S., and has the MOST Poverty, Obesity, Ignorance....unwanted pregnancies, baby
mamas....childhood poverty.....hmm, what other bad things does America have?
Just look up MS......Tells you alot, now don't it!!!